00:00Did Tennessee do Browns fans a favor?
00:03I think the Tennessee Titans did us all a favor.
00:06I think the Tennessee Titans did Spencer Fano a favor.
00:11I can't be more thankful to the Tennessee Titans than I ever have been
00:16that they took Carnell Tate number four overall.
00:19You have an article there from a Jory Epstein.
00:21Yes, she had unfettered access to the war room.
00:25Complete access to what was going on in the Browns draft room.
00:28And read the excerpt that you had had there.
00:30So when Tennessee selects Ohio State receiver Carnell Tate fourth overall,
00:35a chorus of woes breaks out.
00:38Do you want to practice?
00:40Whoa!
00:41We did that.
00:42Do you think they played the music?
00:44No.
00:44Is that an homage to us?
00:46I hope somebody in that room thought of it.
00:50I think there's like 30 dudes in that room.
00:52Andrew hears it.
00:52So when that breaks out, Browns executive vice president and partner J.W.
01:00Johnson recognizes, quote, that probably helps us, right?
01:04And Barry nods.
01:05And leading everybody, that's the only excerpt that really goes into detail about that
01:10because I asked flat out yesterday, what would have happened if Tennessee does not
01:15take Carnell Tate and he's there right there when we had a chance to draft number six.
01:22And it's only one sentence.
01:24But if J.W. is asking others in the room, including Andrew Barry, like that probably helps us, right?
01:32The general thought is that, no, the Browns were not going to take Carnell Tate.
01:38And I know everybody said afterwards, oh, they clearly weren't going to take him.
01:40But now we actually have a discussion in the war room.
01:43I think it's best for everything because I think about both sides.
01:46I think about helping the Browns and then I think about how the fans would react
01:49because I think there were a lot of fans just going, guys, don't overthink it.
01:52Take Carnell Tate and then at number six and then find another lineman a little bit later on
01:59and do it like that.
02:00Now, when Carnell Tate was off the board, now I did not feel this way.
02:05I know that some people did.
02:06I know that the guys in the afternoon felt this way about Jordan Tyson.
02:09They were passionate about Jordan Tyson.
02:10I was not nearly as passionate about Jordan Tyson as I was Carnell Tate.
02:14When that happened and then the Browns moved back to nine,
02:17I think you just have to change your thinking and go, okay,
02:19if they're thinking about an offensive lineman, how do we not take Caden Proctor this high
02:24because I still thought it was that too high?
02:26And how do we not take Monroe Freeling this high because I thought that was too high.
02:30When you take Spencer Fano, I thought that that ended up being great.
02:33And what ends up working out for you is that you traded out of that spot
02:36and I don't have to hear and you don't have to hear and we don't have to say it
02:39for the rest of our careers that Carnell Tate was there at number six.
02:43No matter what.
02:44No matter what.
02:45Like, I don't have to sit there and do the whole Phil Taylor, Julio Jones thing.
02:48He was taken.
02:49He was gone.
02:50Now, if Jordan Tyson ends up being the next Jerry Rice,
02:54maybe there's a conversation except you traded back to nine.
02:57Now, you could have taken Jordan Tyson at six,
02:58but if I wasn't that passionate about it, I'm not going to make that argument.
03:01Now, am I?
03:02Other people may.
03:03You may hear that from the afternoon or you may hear that from midday.
03:06Oh, I do think people will.
03:08I think that's an inflection point in the draft.
03:10If they felt that way.
03:11But you and I have to be on record about these things.
03:14So, if I sit here and say Spencer Fano is just okay
03:18and Jordan Tyson ends up being one of the greatest wide receivers ever,
03:22I can't sit there and yell and scream and pout and moan
03:26when I didn't want to take Jordan Tyson there.
03:28You can't, but just in terms of, you know how all these things.
03:32If they felt that way, fine.
03:33But it's not even about that.
03:34It's just, you know how this is.
03:36It's a very reductive way that we look at these drafts
03:40and we say, who was available when you took a bust?
03:43Who was available?
03:44I understand.
03:45And that's all it is.
03:46It's not which host said this or what.
03:48Nobody remembers that five years from now.
03:49To me, I bring up the Phil Taylor situation
03:51because Phil Taylor wasn't a bust.
03:53Phil Taylor, he got his career shortened by injury.
03:55Yeah.
03:55But he was a good player.
03:56He just wasn't Julio Jones.
03:57And Phil Taylor would even say that to you.
03:59There were a lot of people in that draft years ago
04:01who wanted Julio Jones with the Cleveland Browns.
04:04Aren't we still on that draft tree?
04:06Aren't we still on branches of that draft tree?
04:08The tree never ends.
04:09It's a redwood.
04:10We've taken 5,342 players with that trade down.
04:13But that I can believe with fans
04:15because they really wanted Julio Jones.
04:16Yeah.
04:17In this sense, I can look back on it.
04:20Like when we do the Baker stuff,
04:21let me bring up another example.
04:22Go, whoa, whoa, whoa.
04:24There's a lot of you that are revisionist
04:26and we can go back to where it was.
04:28Like when I brought up the one guy
04:29who was writing on my Facebook
04:30about how bad he thought Baker was.
04:33And then years later, wait, we could have kept.
04:35But no, I got written record here, sir.
04:37Documented record.
04:38You said Baker Mayfield bleeping sucks.
04:40You wrote that on my Facebook.
04:42This is right here for you to see.
04:44And this is from back in the day.
04:46So if fans can do that,
04:47you and I can go back to our memory and go,
04:48no, you guys, there were a couple of people
04:50who liked Jordan Tyson,
04:51but you weren't pounding the table for Jordan Tyson.
04:53You weren't doing that.
04:54So if they want to go ahead and do that, fine.
04:55But I think it takes a lot of pressure off them
04:57and it takes a lot of pressure off a guy
04:58like Spencer Fano
04:59because we're not going to be making
05:01that direct one-on-one correlation.
05:03You can't.
05:03They don't play the same position,
05:04but you can't make that direct one-on-one comparison.
05:07I think it's so much better
05:08because I think it's easier.
05:09If Carnell Tate isn't there,
05:11I think it's so much easier
05:13for a general fan
05:15to look at a guy like Spencer Fano,
05:18great personality,
05:20hell of a work ethic,
05:21and go, I get behind this guy.
05:22I like this guy.
05:23I think I can really, really enjoy him.
05:25And I think over the weekend,
05:27he's a lineman.
05:27Not a lot of people know.
05:28I'll say this quick.
05:29I think a lot of people
05:29really fell in love with his personality
05:31over the weekend.
05:31Of course.
05:32Well, and this brings us to
05:34the Orange Dot conversation.
05:36So the Orange Dot,
05:39according to this article,
05:40and I had heard that, you know,
05:42every team has their way
05:43of basically saying,
05:44he's a good guy.
05:46That's a bad guy.
05:48The bad guy is more talented
05:50than the good guy.
05:51What do we do there?
05:51And come on, we're the Browns,
05:53front and center, right?
05:53Like this, this is what's
05:55so interesting to me.
05:56So in this report,
05:59at 848,
06:00the Saints select Arizona
06:02wide receiver Jordan Tice
06:03with the eighth overall pick,
06:04making official the Browns
06:05chance to begin the run
06:06on offensive tackles.
06:07Barry turns to National Scout
06:09Zach Ayers
06:10and says, quote,
06:11this was your Orange Dot, buddy.
06:13Tell us what we like
06:14about Spencer.
06:15And for the two rows
06:16of scout chairs
06:16near the entrance
06:17of the draft room,
06:18Ayers begins to explain
06:19why he designated
06:20the Utah offensive tackle
06:21a, quote,
06:22Orange Dot,
06:23which in Browns'
06:24scouting parlance
06:25means Fano has elite
06:27character and makeup.
06:29And the Rees,
06:31obviously,
06:31I find this fascinating
06:32because they go on
06:33to say he fits us
06:34beautifully with
06:35the Orange Dot.
06:37What has the Browns'
06:39front office
06:39had a proclivity
06:40to do
06:42really since Andrew
06:43Berry has been here?
06:44And I mean,
06:44you could go through
06:45years earlier
06:46than just Andrew Berry,
06:47but they have been
06:47willing to take chances
06:49on guys that had
06:50questionable character.
06:52And we've seen that
06:53time and time again.
06:55Do you think
06:56this is almost,
06:57when we say
06:58overcompensation,
06:59that typically has
07:00a bad connotation,
07:01right?
07:02That almost means
07:02you're going so far
07:03to the other side
07:04that you're making mistakes.
07:05I don't mean it that way.
07:06I mean,
07:07do you think they are
07:07now prioritizing
07:08the good character stuff?
07:10Because they have
07:11been bitten.
07:12And they've been bitten
07:13in ways that other teams
07:14have not.
07:15It depends.
07:16Their bad character guys
07:17have not worked out
07:17while other teams'
07:18bad character guys have.
07:19I think at the top
07:20of the draft,
07:21I think that that matters.
07:22I do.
07:22I think later on,
07:24maybe you're going,
07:24hey, if this guy
07:25doesn't,
07:25like,
07:27we made a big deal.
07:28Remember years ago,
07:29we made a big deal
07:29about Antonio Callaway.
07:30Antonio Callaway,
07:31at the end of it,
07:31was a fourth-round pick.
07:33Yeah.
07:33Okay?
07:33Now,
07:34you could still expect
07:35something out of a
07:36fourth-round pick.
07:36I think it was a
07:37fourth-round pick.
07:38But if he's a fourth-round
07:39pick and it doesn't
07:39wash out and he didn't
07:40wash out,
07:41like,
07:41that's okay.
07:42That's on him.
07:42That's the way it goes.
07:44You just have to make
07:45sure your other picks
07:46are good and sturdy
07:46players.
07:47And I think last year,
07:49you go back to
07:50Mason Graham,
07:51you go back to
07:51Carson Swessinger,
07:52I understand that there
07:53was obviously the
07:54incident with
07:55Quinshawn Judkins,
07:56which scares the hell
07:57out of a lot of
07:57people there.
07:58Would Judkins have
07:59had the orange dot?
08:00I don't,
08:00I don't,
08:02as far as I know
08:03that there was
08:03nothing before that
08:04that would have
08:05ever said anything,
08:05that's as far as I
08:06know.
08:07So,
08:07I don't know if he
08:07would have had the
08:08orange dot,
08:09but I didn't see
08:10anything beforehand.
08:11Okay?
08:13So,
08:13that I don't know,
08:14but when it comes to
08:16Spencer Fano,
08:17yeah,
08:18like,
08:18that's an orange dot
08:19guy,
08:20I guess.
08:20Michael Hall,
08:20like,
08:21you know,
08:21obviously later on,
08:22Perry on Winfrey,
08:24and,
08:24you know,
08:24they wouldn't have
08:25had orange dots.
08:26And they famously,
08:27now the Deshaun Watson
08:28thing is very interesting
08:30because for his first
08:31three or four years
08:32of the NFL,
08:33he was considered
08:34an orange dot guy.
08:36Like the way we're
08:37talking about it now.
08:38And now,
08:39you know what people
08:40would say about
08:41whether or not he
08:41would deserve the
08:42orange dot.
08:42I also think there's
08:43certain positions
08:44where that does
08:45matter more.
08:46I mean,
08:46a guy in an
08:46offensive line,
08:48you know,
08:48they call him the
08:49Mushroom Society
08:50for a reason.
08:51They're kept in the
08:51dark,
08:52and you're not
08:52really supposed to
08:53hear much out of
08:53them.
08:54I mean,
08:54they're offensive
08:55linemen.
08:55They're not really
08:56supposed to be
08:57problems for anybody.
08:59Right.
09:00And Spencer Fano,
09:01when you talk about
09:02character,
09:03okay,
09:03is he going to put
09:03in the work?
09:04Is he going to take
09:04being a professional
09:05seriously,
09:07or is this going to
09:08be based on just
09:09his talent,
09:09and we're going to be
09:10wondering what he
09:10could have
09:11accomplished?
09:11Like,
09:11again,
09:12I go back to
09:12Jed Wills.
09:13Jed Wills was a
09:14very talented
09:15athlete.
09:16It just didn't
09:17materialize because I
09:18think he didn't want
09:18to put the work in
09:19after a while,
09:20and I think he got
09:21down on things,
09:21and I don't know if
09:22he knew how to
09:23respond to a
09:24challenge.
09:24Spencer Fano is
09:25going to have to
09:26respond to a
09:26challenge.
09:27This is a team that
09:28is better than what
09:29they were last
09:29Thursday morning.
09:30They are.
09:31They have to be,
09:31but they're still
09:32going to struggle at
09:33times because this is
09:34the NFL.
09:35It's just very
09:35interesting.
09:36Are you going to
09:36respond to that?
09:37One of the themes,
09:38I think,
09:38not only of this
09:39show and of this
09:40since this station
09:41launched,
09:42are the debates
09:43that we would get
09:44about players with
09:45questionable character
09:46that had either
09:48incidents or
09:48accusations or
09:50whatever over the
09:50years,
09:50and so many fans
09:52would go,
09:52shut up,
09:53who cares,
09:53just win football
09:54games.
09:54We would get that
09:55all the time.
09:56But when they're not
09:56and you're looking
09:57for common
09:57denominators,
09:58why?
09:58I just laugh because
10:00clearly this was a
10:01big deal to them
10:02to get the guy
10:03that didn't have
10:04any of that and
10:05have him drafted
10:06very high and feel
10:07good about him,
10:08bringing him into
10:09the ecosystem and
10:10represent the
10:11Cleveland Browns.
10:12And they are
10:12telling you that
10:13this is something
10:14very important to
10:15them,
10:15so we'll remember
10:16this next time
10:17and ask,
10:19hey,
10:19that player had
10:20the orange dot
10:20that you were
10:21mulling over.
10:23Very,
10:23very sharp
10:24mentally.
10:24He has an
10:26advanced understanding
10:26of football.
10:27I think that he'll
10:30feel more like a
10:31veteran when he
10:32gets here from
10:32the football
10:34intelligence aspect,
10:35which gives him
10:36a chance to play
10:37early.
10:37That's Andrew
10:38Berry from the
10:38draft review show
10:39last night.
10:40Let me just point
10:40this out and then
10:41I want to get to
10:42this of this fan who
10:43took this baseball
10:44away from this
10:44little girl.
10:47You can't take all
10:48orange dot guys,
10:49quote unquote,
10:50but I think in a
10:50draft like this,
10:52again,
10:52if there was such
10:53crazy top end
10:55talent quarterback,
10:56I think you have to
10:56have high character
10:57guys.
10:57I really do.
10:59They have to leave
11:00the locker room.
11:01They're set to make
11:02the most money.
11:02You got to trust
11:03them.
11:04You've basically
11:04picked a new
11:05president of your
11:06organization when you
11:07get a new
11:07quarterback and
11:09that that's a
11:10different animal.
11:11But when it comes
11:12to a lot of other
11:13positions, you know,
11:15you can take risks
11:15on guys if you have
11:17the right people
11:17already in the
11:18locker room.
11:18So Spencer Fano and
11:20I bring up, I keep
11:21bringing up Carson
11:22Swessinger, are those
11:24guys going to be
11:25setting the tone in
11:26three, four years when
11:27you bring in other
11:27guys who might have
11:29some question marks
11:30and go, we're not
11:32doing it like you did
11:33it wherever you're
11:33from, but this is
11:34different now.
11:35We're doing it this
11:36way.
11:36Like you're hoping
11:37in three to four
11:38years, this team has
11:38made the playoffs.
11:40They have the right
11:41guys who are, who
11:41they're paying long
11:42term, lifetime
11:43Cleveland Browns
11:44quote unquote, and
11:45that, and that you
11:46can trust that they
11:48will police your
11:48locker room.
11:49It's not always
11:49going to be sunshine
11:50and roses.
11:51There's always going
11:52to be ups and
11:52downs, things like
11:53that.
11:53But if you can keep
11:54the right proper
11:55mindset with that and
11:57then continue to
11:58bring in guys like
11:58that, that helps.
12:00So what, what this
12:01did for me is that
12:02shows that this is a
12:03building block and
12:04that character in a
12:05draft like that,
12:06which is not going
12:07to be great on the
12:07talent spectrum,
12:09character is really
12:10going to matter for
12:11those type of guys,
12:11especially for an
12:12offensive lineman,
12:13especially for a guy
12:14like Spencer Fano.
12:14So I I'm encouraged
12:16by that orange dot
12:17conversation.
12:18We'll get back to
12:18that coming up here
12:18in a bit because
12:19there is another
12:20thing that while
12:21it's really, really
12:22good for this year,
12:23it might not be good
12:23for the future.
12:24Some people are
12:24making it very clear
12:25to me.
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