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00:03:11Welcome to Beyond the Tape.
00:03:20I'm your host, Mark Bessant.
00:03:22Welcome to Trinidad and Tobago.
00:03:24Welcome to our viewers across the globe and our brothers in the Isles of Grenada.
00:03:30And today is Wednesday.
00:03:32It's legally speaking, Wednesdays.
00:03:34And of course, last week, we missed him.
00:03:36But he's here this week.
00:03:38A little birdie told me they spotted him in the sister isles.
00:03:42I don't know if it's true, but I want to welcome Acting Sergeant Zaheer Ali,
00:03:47attorney at law with the Trinidad and Tobago Police Service.
00:03:50Welcome.
00:03:51Well, good evening to you, Mark.
00:03:52You know, Mark, your sources, you know, on this occasion, you know,
00:03:56I may have to give you an A15 with your sources.
00:03:58And yes, indeed, you know, I had the opportunity and privilege to visit this style.
00:04:02And, you know, may I say, Mark, immediately in visiting this style that the persons in the Tobago Division,
00:04:12like persons in the Trinidad and Tobago jurisdiction, you know, was, you know, very approachable.
00:04:18And, you know, as a matter of fact, they indicated that they have been paying very close attention to Beyond the Tape.
00:04:23And they have expressed, you know, their best wishes to serve Beyond the Tape.
00:04:29And they have also indicated that if you can give some consideration for the voice of the people that come from the Tobago Islands.
00:04:36So I just want to just communicate that to you.
00:04:38But it was indeed a time well spent.
00:04:42And, you know, thank you very much for the accommodation and Beyond the Tape, TTPS, for allowing me to do so.
00:04:48But good evening to Trinidad and Tobago, the citizens of Trinidad and Tobago, as always.
00:04:52I missed you as well.
00:04:54You know, not only Mark missing me, but I missed you as well.
00:04:56The citizens here of Trinidad and Tobago, Jackie, and other family members of Beyond the Tape.
00:05:00My colleagues in the law enforcement agencies, Mark, who continue to persevere and persist with law enforcement activities during this time.
00:05:10You know, good afternoon to you as well.
00:05:12But it's a pleasure as always to be here, Mark.
00:05:13And, you know, I'll see how best I can assist as we go forward.
00:05:16Well, you know, one of the major topics over the last couple of days, I would have written about it and covered it, of course,
00:05:23is the threats to various government ministers, of course, that we cannot take lightly.
00:05:31You know, how serious they are based on intelligence reports compiled and reported in the media over the last few days.
00:05:39I mean, just your input into that, your introspection, you know, just your opinion.
00:05:47Well, you know, Mark, when you have intelligence that's suggesting that the very high office holders, you know,
00:05:55persons who are entrusted with the governance of Trinidad and Tobago, there's threat, very serious threat, is due to those individuals.
00:06:03It must be of concern to every single citizen of Trinidad and Tobago.
00:06:07And what is expected is swift, swift investigations and inquiries to uncover and to gather the necessary evidence to be able to prosecute those persons.
00:06:20It must not be a situation where we are speaking about threats from an intelligence context, and it remains an intelligence context, in my respectful view.
00:06:28It must be probed.
00:06:30It must be probed with the hope and expectation that we are going to uncover, we are going to gather, put in evidence to be able to prosecute persons.
00:06:36Because what you want to send to Trinidad and Tobago, that persons who are bent on issuing threats, causing mayhem, causing disruption, causing persons to be aggrieved, worried, and basically put in a level of fear,
00:06:50especially persons who have to govern Trinidad and Tobago.
00:06:52It's important for the law enforcement agencies and support agencies to send a very clear message.
00:06:57So, you know, one would expect to be, and as a citizen of Trinidad and Tobago, I'm sure as well these citizens are anticipating, to be seen, swift actions, and to see, or identify who are those persons.
00:07:11And, you know, perhaps to take those persons before the courts of Trinidad and Tobago.
00:07:14And, you know, last but not least, Mark, when you're speaking about public officials, in a way the intelligence is coming across, you are not just looking at simple criminal activities.
00:07:23You are looking, and sometime I go ahead and mention, you are looking at the potential to enter the Anti-Terrorism Act.
00:07:30And I promise that on an occasion, on beyond the tape, I will go a little deeper in that particular legislation.
00:07:36And I basically urge the citizens of Trinidad and Tobago as well, to have a look at that Anti-Terrorism Act.
00:07:42It's a very dangerous piece of legislation.
00:07:44And when we've seen what we are seeing in terms of some of the intelligence that is coming to par.
00:07:50And may I just go back to the emergency regulations as well?
00:07:53We saw a recent amendment, Mark, to the emergency powers regulations.
00:07:56And they have now defined weapon as defined in the Anti-Terrorism Act.
00:08:01That's a very significant thing.
00:08:03So where you had fire, ammunition, explosive, now they are taking the definition out of the Anti-Terrorism to give you nuclear weapons,
00:08:12weapons of mass destruction, chemical weapons.
00:08:15So it really emphasizes significance of the church that you are speaking about.
00:08:20And, you know, I want to emphasize swift investigative actions.
00:08:24Yeah, and more in a general sense, with the ongoing state of emergency,
00:08:29we know that the commissioner had indicated sometime ago that some of the threats were neutralized.
00:08:34But there are still active threats out there, as indicated by other officers.
00:08:40And, you know, some said to me, you know, based on our inquiries and investigations, it's serious.
00:08:46And if people know half of what we have uncovered, not to alarm anybody,
00:08:51but they're working very, you know, very diligently, of course, over the last couple of weeks to ensure that, you know,
00:08:59if the state of emergency was not in some way called, the spillover and the bloodletting on the streets would have been far worse.
00:09:08Well, you know, Mark, we must put it into context.
00:09:10And, you know, to be fair to all parties, the initial declaration basically came from a state of affairs
00:09:18where organized syndicates or gangs were coming together.
00:09:21Yes.
00:09:22And, you know, the use of neutralizing the threat, let's look at it from an intelligence context.
00:09:28So from an intelligence, from an information context, the disruption or the neutralizing that particular threat
00:09:33may have been attributed to the movement of persons, limiting their ability to communicate and organize
00:09:39or to further what the intelligence may have suggested.
00:09:44But if we look at the present context, we have seen additional things enter in the public domain.
00:09:49So it will be important when we are speaking about to neutralize, disrupt, and dismantle.
00:09:54What we'll want, and that's the point I was making a short while ago, to move it from an intelligence information context
00:10:00and perhaps let the citizenry of Trinidad and Tobago see that there's a conversion of the intelligence
00:10:05or information that we have to evidence, to prosecute people, prosecute persons who are responsible
00:10:10so that you do not have persons believing that they can come together to conspire, to destabilize or to inflict harm
00:10:18or, you know, just to disrupt the peace of Trinidad and Tobago and not feel the full brunt of the law.
00:10:25So I think that we have to look at it in context in terms of when the term neutralize may have been used
00:10:30in terms of a disruption from an intelligence context, from an operational context.
00:10:34But disruption and dismantle can also be looked at from a situation where there's sufficient evidence to prosecute persons
00:10:40which can also neutralize, the word neutralize can also be attributed when you are seeing people
00:10:46taken before the courts of Trinidad and Tobago.
00:10:48Yeah, well said.
00:10:50All right, another note, of course, you know, over the last 24 to 36 hours, we had three root fatalities.
00:10:58Yes.
00:10:59Right?
00:11:00Now, we actually had a fourth last night, I believe it was.
00:11:05Yes, last night, on Tuesday night, unfortunately, this young man losing his life near the Bitham Water Main
00:11:15along the Bitham Highway around 10 p.m. last night.
00:11:20The victim was 19-year-old Kavish Fida Passad.
00:11:24And, you know, what is so heart-wrenching about this Sergeant Ali was that just a couple days ago,
00:11:30his father congratulated him on how well he did in the CXC examinations.
00:11:37You know, I think he got five grade ones and a two or something.
00:11:42And then to learn that his son, just after, you know, over the weekend or Friday or whatever,
00:11:47would have gotten these great results.
00:11:49Yes.
00:11:50You know, lost control, vehicle crashed into this water main, and he died last night around 10 o'clock.
00:11:57Well, very sad news, Mark.
00:11:58And, you know, let me join with you and the national community to express our deep condolences
00:12:04to the family of this young man.
00:12:08And, you know, may I also extend it to the bus driver and the, I think, the SWAT officer.
00:12:15Yes.
00:12:15Who, you know.
00:12:16And also the gentleman who died in Canoopia earlier in the morning.
00:12:20His car crashed into a maxi taxi and he died on his spot.
00:12:23I think it was, I think it was Jamie Morton, if I remember.
00:12:27This is the accident here from yesterday that claimed the life of the bus driver,
00:12:33Mustafa Khan.
00:12:34And the security person that you would have spoken about, that's trying to remember her name at this point.
00:12:42But really, really sad.
00:12:44Well, you know, to extend it to that incident in Canoopia as well.
00:12:47Mark, as I said before, very sad news and, you know, condolences to the family.
00:12:54Mark, I'd like to respond strongly to this and to respond to it in this context where
00:12:58I want to pattern it with the citizenry of Trinidad and Tobago have been called or summoned
00:13:05to participate in a Stonyagrong legislation consultation or consultation, sorry,
00:13:11on the Stonyagrong legislation.
00:13:13You know, I want to respectfully, you know, suggest to the authorities
00:13:17to let us take a look and have, we have been advocating
00:13:21with reference to the laws that governs our nation road.
00:13:24I think the time has come for us to exercise a similar approach to engage the communities,
00:13:30the national community, in relation to looking at reform where our motor vehicle
00:13:33and our road traffic act is concerned.
00:13:35And specifically, the issues of dangerous driving, driving without due care and attention,
00:13:40careless driving, these offenses, we need to look at it and look at it in more detail,
00:13:45make it, you know, more stringent, at least to start as a deterrent.
00:13:50But we definitely need to involve the national community.
00:13:52And our discussion is very disheartening and very sad to see a young man, God knows,
00:13:57you know, if he may have been, you know, the next leader in Trinidad and Tobago and by extension.
00:14:02You know, Mark, when you spoke about the achievement of this young man,
00:14:05you know, it was reported to me that the bus driver sometime ago received a certificate.
00:14:10Yes, he did. Musar Khan, and he was one of the safest and the best at PTSC.
00:14:17And his relatives showing the certificates at his home in, I believe it's south of Avocad village,
00:14:26Faisabad, yesterday.
00:14:27So, as you know, that accident is still being investigated by the authorities to find out what might have happened.
00:14:36Well, definitely. So, while the investigation is ongoing, or the investigations are ongoing in reference to the others,
00:14:42the point I'm bringing across, Mark, is that you have seen persons who, based on the evidence,
00:14:46based on the record, you know, persons who appear to have been, you know,
00:14:50good-standing citizens of Trinidad and Tobago, both from an educational context and both from a public service context.
00:14:55And, you know, it's important for us to really, you know, stir up this discussion to engage the national community,
00:15:02and I want to re-emphasize, to engage the national community on this issue of road safety.
00:15:07I think we have spoken about it, Mark, but I'm not seeing a national voice there.
00:15:11I'm seeing, you know, little cells speaking about the issue of the road, you know, maybe on beyond the tape,
00:15:16maybe from a TTPS context, maybe some NGOs speaking about it.
00:15:19But I would like to hear it as a national voice, and we cannot continue to be operating in this manner,
00:15:25where we are seeing young, middle-aged, and all our public service individuals, you know,
00:15:30the circumstances in which we are seeing the loss of lives.
00:15:36So, you know, I just want to ask the national community and ask the decision-makers to, you know,
00:15:40place us high on the agenda, but condolences to the family, and, you know,
00:15:45may God give you the necessary patience at this time.
00:15:48Yes, and we also want to extend deeper sympathies to the family of Roxanne Phillip,
00:15:54the security officer who was also killed in an accident in the bus,
00:15:58as well as Jamie Morton, as I indicated to you,
00:16:01who died in a head-on collision in the Canupia area yesterday morning,
00:16:06a couple hours before the second accident.
00:16:09And then we had this young man who passed as well.
00:16:11All right, so we're hopeful that persons out there pleased.
00:16:15We have 73 rude fatalities for the year thus far, and that's a very high figure,
00:16:23and I think we have had a lot over the last couple of weeks that would have pushed that figure past what it was last year.
00:16:29Well, definitely, Mark, and, you know, I don't want to attribute a time of the year or any other factors,
00:16:37but hence why I'm saying that because there may be a number of factors that may be contributing to what we are seeing on the nation road,
00:16:43and both from an individual, from an infrastructure, and, you know, many other aspects.
00:16:48And hence why I'm calling for a national discussion so that you can have all the input from all the relevant stakeholders with reference to this matter.
00:16:56But again, very unfortunate situation, and I want to advise the listening and viewing public.
00:17:02Let us exercise care.
00:17:05Let us exercise due diligence on the nation roads, whether we're in a motorist context, whether as a pedestrian.
00:17:10Let us take that, make that effort to when we go on to the nation road, that we are exercising due diligence and care,
00:17:19not only for ourselves, but for the person that we are going to come into contact with.
00:17:23And Mark, you saw the weather conditions.
00:17:26So let us, again, aggravated circumstances.
00:17:28So I'm begging you all this afternoon, let us continue to uphold and comply with the rule of laws that relates to the nation road.
00:17:36Yes, certainly.
00:17:36All right, you know, the Prime Minister had spoken a couple of weeks ago about raising the drinking age in this country,
00:17:45as well as, you know, going out, consuming even alcohol as well as marijuana.
00:17:52Yes.
00:17:53And we captured a video, we were told, this video of some young men allegedly went into a store,
00:18:01and when they refused alcohol, this is what happened.
00:18:06So based on the information we got was that they had come to consume alcohol,
00:18:21and there was some kind of discussion in which, of course, I believe they might have been asked to produce idea of some,
00:18:30in some form or fashion.
00:18:32And the shopkeeper is having a conversation with them.
00:18:37We see another man enter in a shoot there.
00:18:41We are not sure what is his, you know, his argument or what he's referencing,
00:18:45but the men continue to speak, and then they go out of frame.
00:18:51You see this guy here, he walked to the counter area,
00:18:54took off a bottle of alcohol, the shopkeeper obviously is trying to get it back from him, right?
00:19:04And he actually gets the first bottle of alcohol, and then there is a struggle.
00:19:09There is a struggle here between both men, right?
00:19:16Between the shopkeeper and one of the men who went to the counter, over the counter rather, and grabbed the bottles.
00:19:25Well, Mark, while you introduce this topic, because, you know, a statement that relates to looking at alcohol
00:19:30and looking at raising the age limit and so forth.
00:19:32So, I mean, when you look at this particular fact pattern, I know it probably is subject to an inquiry,
00:19:36but this is beyond, beyond the issue of, you know, persons who may be under the age and looking to purchase alcohol.
00:19:44This is a clear situation based on what I have seen, what I have observed.
00:19:48This goes into the realm of the offensive robbery.
00:19:50Because you are seeing that what appears to be property belonging to the shopkeeper.
00:19:56Yeah.
00:19:56Being taken, key here, being taken by force.
00:19:59And he is distracted, when we look back to the video, by the other guy in blue.
00:20:04And he was on the phone, and then he walked to the counter, out of the camera, and took up these bottles.
00:20:11I don't even know if you had any intentions, as you said, of paying for it.
00:20:14Well, exactly.
00:20:15And what you are seeing there, and hence why I am using the word robbery,
00:20:18but it can also go into robbery with violence, robbery with aggravation.
00:20:21So, I am just saying that these are very significant issues.
00:20:23And critically here, we have been talking about organized crime.
00:20:26You are seeing two or more persons involved.
00:20:28And if you look at what's happening here, you are seeing that the individuals that are present are,
00:20:33if not in a formal gang setting, they are aiding, abetting, procuring, or counseling the offense,
00:20:39based on what we are seeing.
00:20:40So, again, very, very serious matter.
00:20:43Mark, if you have any information as to where this video may have been.
00:20:46Well, we are hopeful that, I know that it was sent in a couple of police groups,
00:20:52and that is why somebody sent it to me.
00:20:54Okay.
00:20:54And, of course, it will have a clear picture, so what I can do is obviously send it to you.
00:21:00And I am sure, between you and some other officers, you can ascertain the location.
00:21:04And perhaps, if the owners of this establishment is looking at me on the table at this time,
00:21:10or anybody knows where this is, please do not hesitate to contact the nearest police station.
00:21:15Even Sergeant Ali might be very interested in this,
00:21:19because, you see, he is wrestling the shopkeeper on the floor.
00:21:22Luckily, the shopkeeper was not hurt.
00:21:25He got the two bottles of alcohol, and it seems that, as you said,
00:21:28these are young men intent on creating havoc and trying to steal alcohol somewhere in Trinidad and Tobago.
00:21:36Yeah, very serious issue.
00:21:37And, again, Mark, you know, just not to digress,
00:21:40but when we are speaking about independence,
00:21:42and I know independence has occupied the headline for some days now,
00:21:46when we are speaking about independence,
00:21:48and I'll just use this situation,
00:21:50you know what is independence, Mark?
00:21:52The preamble to the Constitution,
00:21:54and for the young ones who may be listening,
00:21:55the preamble to our Constitution in Trinidad and Tobago
00:21:57clearly emphasize that men and institutions would be free
00:22:03when there is respect for the rule of law.
00:22:06So, if we are really looking at independence as a nation,
00:22:08as an individual, as a society, as a community,
00:22:11what we are seeing there,
00:22:13we are seeing not what one would want to see
00:22:16when we are speaking about independence,
00:22:18because people should be respecting what?
00:22:20The rule of law.
00:22:20And what does the rule of law apply there?
00:22:22That the alcohol or whatever product that they may have gone for,
00:22:26it's the property of someone.
00:22:28And if you have to get that property,
00:22:30you have to engage in legal transactions.
00:22:34Or if you yourself are not at the age to be able to engage in a transaction,
00:22:38you have to respect the law.
00:22:39So, that is a clear case of not respecting the rule of law.
00:22:43And if we are speaking independence,
00:22:45for those who are listening,
00:22:46look at that part of the preamble to the Constitution.
00:22:49We are only free men and institutions
00:22:51if we respect the rule of law.
00:22:54Otherwise, we cannot be advocating and championing
00:22:56true independence if we are not respecting the rule of law.
00:22:59All right.
00:23:00Okay, let's take a look at our state of emergency figures.
00:23:04It's day 34.
00:23:06Number of operations, 2485.
00:23:10Target priority offenders, 1002.
00:23:13Searches conducted, 15,772.
00:23:16Traffic operations, 1,538.
00:23:18Total persons arrested, 1,045.
00:23:21Traffic offenses detected, 8,683.
00:23:25Firearms recovered, 40 pistols, 21 revolvers, 10 shotguns, 10 rifles, and 3 air rifles.
00:23:32Ammunition recovered, 595 wrongs of 9mm, 71 wrongs of 12 gauge, 23 wrongs of 0.380, 275 wrongs of 5.56,
00:23:4367 wrongs of 0.38, 28 wrongs of 0.40, 7 wrongs of 0.357, 26 wrongs of 0.45, and 48 wrongs of 7.62.
00:23:53Dangerous drugs seized, 199,051.34 grams of marijuana, 6,514.33 grams of cocaine, 1,032 STC pills, and 15 grams of molly.
00:24:07So, well, Mark, let me commend the officers for, you know, giving you the opportunity to read the statistics this afternoon, you know,
00:24:16and also in conjunction with members of the public who may have provided very critical information to be able to account for the statistics.
00:24:22Mark, may I just say that the two columns that I'll comment on to the city's reaction at Arden-Tobago,
00:24:27and sometime I go, I had an interview with TV6.
00:24:30There are several preventative detention orders that have been issued thus far,
00:24:35and significantly, and I think just up until today,
00:24:38we saw the issue and execution of a preventative detention order for a female.
00:24:46A second female associated with alleged gang leader.
00:24:50That's correct. That's correct, Mark.
00:24:52Yes, I remember.
00:24:53So, I just made that point to emphasize that when we are looking at a state of emergency,
00:24:57you know, it's easy to be looking in the masculine direction,
00:25:00but we are also seeing the feminine also stepping in.
00:25:03And when we are speaking about organized crime,
00:25:05this is a perfect example where it is, you know,
00:25:10it is very wide as to who are involved in criminal activities.
00:25:13And secondly, you know, just last week, you know,
00:25:16I gave some directions to charge persons for possession of ammunition
00:25:21in the Eastern Division under the state of emergency regulation.
00:25:24So, I just wanted to, you know, further populate that particular chart
00:25:27where persons are being charged under the state of emergency regulations.
00:25:30They are being detained under the preventative detention order
00:25:32issued by the Honorable Minister of Homeland Security,
00:25:35in addition to what we are seeing on that particular platform.
00:25:37So, members of the public, I salute you this afternoon.
00:25:40I commend you and ask you all to continue to provide information, intelligence,
00:25:45in whatever format that you feel comfortable,
00:25:47whether calling directly a police station or police officer
00:25:50or the anonymous processes to be able to bring forward this information.
00:25:55This time of the state of emergency is very critical for law enforcement.
00:25:59Law enforcement has the teeth and we want to be able to give them the food
00:26:03so that they can chew on that food.
00:26:06All right. Let's take a quick look now at our headlines.
00:26:09We'll see you next time.
00:26:39So, those were the headlines over the last 24 hours.
00:26:47We're going to take a short break and when we get back,
00:26:49we'll take more of your quotes.
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00:29:06Welcome back.
00:29:14It's Legally Speaking Wendy's.
00:29:16I'm your host, Mark Bessant,
00:29:17and I'm joined today by Acting Sergeant Zaheer Ali of the Trinidad and Tobago Police Service.
00:29:23And we just wanted to update you, of course, on the pan and powder parade that is happening in and around Port of Spain.
00:29:31That starts, I believe, at 6, but the traffic restrictions went into effect from 4 o'clock.
00:29:38That would have been over the last hour until 12 tonight.
00:29:42The three stationary bands will be positioned in front of the city hall located at Knox Street.
00:29:47Port of Spain commencing from 4 p.m.
00:29:48And the parade will depart at 6 p.m.
00:29:51The proposed route is as follows.
00:29:53The parade will proceed west along Knox Street towards Pembroke Street,
00:29:56then proceed north along Pembroke Street upon reaching Keith Street,
00:30:00then proceed east along Keith Street upon reaching Frederick Street,
00:30:04then proceed north along Frederick Street to conclude inside the Queen's Park Savannah.
00:30:08And, of course, there are temporary traffic restrictions of the roadway
00:30:11with use of no parking signs in several areas along Hart Street, Abercrombie Street, Knox Street,
00:30:17in the vicinity of Woodford Square, Frederick Street, Duke Street, Hart Street from 1 to 7 p.m., etc., etc.
00:30:26So we are urging all persons that in and around the Port of Spain area,
00:30:32at least the heart of Port of Spain, no parking is allowed,
00:30:35because there's going to be a parade of ban as we celebrate the whole steel ban day.
00:30:42Well, thank you very much, Mark, you know, for, you know, bringing the members of the public up to date
00:30:47with reference to the traffic restrictions.
00:30:50And, you know, just to emphasize, the purpose of these traffic restrictions
00:30:53is always geared to a component of public safety and security.
00:30:57Otherwise, you would not have restrictions.
00:30:59It is geared towards public safety and security and to ensure that there's some level of convenience
00:31:03for the activities to ensure there's a balance.
00:31:05So please adhere to the instructions.
00:31:09I am certain that there are going to be police officers on site to be able to guide persons.
00:31:13But please exercise due care and diligence, again, because there are restrictions.
00:31:19So what you may have been accustomed to may not be available to you.
00:31:22So please exercise due diligence.
00:31:24But thank you very much, Mark.
00:31:25All right, great.
00:31:27We have our first caller on the line.
00:31:28Caller, good evening.
00:31:30Good evening, Mr. Mark Bassan and Sergeant Ali.
00:31:35Good evening to you, sir.
00:31:36I want to offer my condolences to all the persons who recently died with respect to road accident,
00:31:45but particularly to Kavish Prasad.
00:31:51And what I'm reading on the newspaper is that one of the bystanders who went to assist him was robbed.
00:32:03And that is so sad.
00:32:05And what I'm saying, what I believe from my vantage, they say the resident apparently went to assist him.
00:32:15But deep down, I have a question, Mark, for that sort of guest here from the resident.
00:32:22Did they go to pray on him or to rob him?
00:32:27That is how serious I think about it.
00:32:29Because if a bystander stops his vehicle to help and you rob it, tells me.
00:32:34So I'm making an appeal to those people who rob that bystander.
00:32:38And by extension to the MP for that area, Karim Marcel, to ask his constituent to give back the valuables to the person who they rob.
00:32:51My second issue is what I am seeing.
00:32:56Mark, you are a tremendous advocate with respect to the leadership of the Army personnel and the Defense Force, etc.
00:33:05And I think you've put into my mind the complicit leadership of the Defense Force, Coast Guard, etc.
00:33:16And I'm going to mirror that with the TGPS.
00:33:21But more importantly, on another newspaper article, they took a deep dive into the 28,000 ammunition that has been misplaced.
00:33:34And we haven't come to terms, if it's lost, if it's still there.
00:33:40I am saying that is a deep hole with respect to the Defense Force's ability to respond to a 1990 scenario.
00:33:52And I want to juxtapose that 28,000 ammunition, 35,000 guns.
00:34:03The intelligence of the police has said it's circulating within Trinidad and Tobago.
00:34:09You need ammunition for those weapons to be effective.
00:34:16Ammunition is a very expensive thing.
00:34:19And for criminals to be shooting it off in the night, ratatata, like fireworks, tells me that something is wrong with it or they're having it free willy-nilly.
00:34:37All right, Kola, thanks so much.
00:34:39Sarge?
00:34:40Yeah, well, thank you very much, Kola.
00:34:42Some very serious issues, Mark.
00:34:44You know, let me deal with the fact that he has pointed out, you know, some excellent reporting on your path.
00:34:48We are members of the public, you know, they are following the stories, you know, they are seeing the media, you know, promoting accountability and transparency.
00:34:56And I want to acknowledge that as well, you know, with you, you know, touching distance from me and also all other media houses who are, you know, endeavoring to, you know, uphold the sacred responsibility and duty of the media.
00:35:09But Mark, all that he has said, you know, I will copy it to what I said just before, that free men and free institution is only achieved when there is respect for the rule of law.
00:35:20And I'm not only looking for respect of the rule of law, only from a criminal jurisdiction.
00:35:25I'm looking at it from a simple, as even the process of where there is, what we know as due process, where a right to be heard, even from a civil context.
00:35:33So as a society, we must appreciate that understanding the rule of law, wherever that rule of law may find itself, we must appreciate it right on this platform.
00:35:43What the rule of law will instruct, Mark, that you and I do not be what? Derogatory.
00:35:49We do not defame.
00:35:50Because we have to be responsible in our reporting.
00:35:54As a member of the media, you have to be responsible in your journalism.
00:35:57As a member of law enforcement, I have to ensure that what?
00:36:00There is what? Impartiality in terms of the execution of my duties.
00:36:04All that is governed by a particular rule.
00:36:06So just to cop what he called has said, I just want to re-emphasize.
00:36:09Free men, and there is a reason why I am saying that.
00:36:12We are in a state of emergency because a group of individuals came together to destabilize or to threaten Trinidad and Tobago.
00:36:18And now we are seeing that public officials are threatened.
00:36:21Threat is also amounting to a breach of the rule of law.
00:36:25So free men, free institution, let us respect the rule of law.
00:36:29Only then we can be truly independent or really put our hands in the air for true independence.
00:36:35Well said, Sergeant Ali.
00:36:37Now, the Trinidad and Tobago Police Service is celebrating the 70th anniversary of women in the Trinidad and Tobago Police all month long, of course.
00:36:47A number of activities, but we actually have a video from one of the long-standing survivors from the 1955,
00:36:57the first batch of women inducted into the Trinidad and Tobago Police Service.
00:37:0391-year-old Merle Bertrand sending a message all the way from Maryland.
00:37:09She's a retired superintendent of police.
00:37:11Let's take a listen in.
00:37:12Good day to the Women's Police of Trinidad and Tobago Police Service.
00:37:25My name is Merle Bertrand, retired superintendent of police, regimental number number 5210.
00:37:34I was enlisted in the Trinidad and Tobago Police Service on the 29th of August, 1955, together with 11 other women police.
00:37:50I retired in January of 1988.
00:37:56We were the first batch of women police officers.
00:37:59We were trained at the police training college, which is now the police academy.
00:38:06After passing out, we were posted to various stations in the northwestern division.
00:38:12During the early years, women police were promoted on the strength of the women police branch.
00:38:21But in 1980 and onwards, women police have been promoted on the strength of the police service.
00:38:31This was a relief to women police officers.
00:38:34Although I am all the way in Maryland, I have been watching the progress of the women police.
00:38:43And I am proud to say that I have seen women in the executive, first division, in charge of the division and branches.
00:38:55Today, I must congratulate all the women police officers, both present and retirees, on this 70th anniversary.
00:39:08I wish you all continued success.
00:39:11God bless the Trinidad and Tobago Police Service and the nation.
00:39:25A message there from retired superintendent, Merle Bertrand, all the way from Maryland.
00:39:32We're sitting in a very proud moment that she's still here with us.
00:39:35And I hope you can look so at 91.
00:39:37Well, Mark, you know, this is very emotional for me.
00:39:40And I'll tell you why it's emotional.
00:39:41You know, just listening to the retired superintendent speak and the age that you're speaking about.
00:39:46Yeah.
00:39:47You know, very inspiring in terms of her composure, the respect.
00:39:52And you could see the,
00:39:54serious approach, even in an interview where it's supposed to be, you know, at that age, one would not be expecting that firmness from her.
00:40:04And I think that the attributes that we are seeing in retired, and I want to urge every single police officer, whether male or female, just to look at the way that she came across in terms of reporting her history and her wishes to the Trinidad and Tobago Police Service.
00:40:29Now, Mark, I just want to say a couple of people.
00:40:30Now, Mark, I just want to say a couple of things on this.
00:40:34Notably there, one of 12 persons were the first batch of police officers.
00:40:39So that's the first significant thing in 1955, 29th of August, to be more precise.
00:40:46The second thing I want to identify with reference to this particular recognition is that, and by way of history, that these 12 individuals, the justification was to bring women police to deal with juvenile and to deal with women offenders.
00:41:03And I want to make a point out of this, that their recognition coming into the service was by extension of a success for women on the whole.
00:41:16Because what that brought is that it basically promoted gender equality and fairness.
00:41:23So that what we have, you have a situation, and as we speak in the SOE, let me relate it, legally speaking, in the SOE regulations, you have, Mark, that if you have to search a female, it emphasizes a female officer should be searching a female.
00:41:38So for the women in Trinidad and Tobago, not only the women police, the citizenry, this is the importance back on the 29th of August, 1955, to deal with juvenile, and again, dealing with juvenile, Mark, is taking what?
00:41:53A mother approach.
00:41:54You have delinquent children coming into the attention of the police, or coming to the attention of the police, sorry, and you need that responsible individual who could care for that individual.
00:42:04So very significant development when we are speaking about women police.
00:42:09And, you know, Ms. Bertrand, you know, would have shared a little bit of history.
00:42:14One of 12, and the only surviving individual, Mark.
00:42:17Wow.
00:42:18And she did talk about prior to 1980, they were promoted on the strength of...
00:42:23That's correct.
00:42:24What she said, I can't recall, but I know it's only after 1980 they were promoted on the strength through the TTPS.
00:42:29That's correct, through the holistic TTPS.
00:42:31Right.
00:42:31So they formed part of the ranks.
00:42:33Prior to that, they were not.
00:42:35Yeah, they were treated special.
00:42:37Right.
00:42:37Right, but again, I want to take this opportunity.
00:42:40I want to join with Merle.
00:42:41If she's listening to me, Mark, you know, can we just raise our hands and salute, you know, this 91-year-old who have represented the Trinidad and Tobago Police Service,
00:42:50a pioneer history we are seeing, you know, unfolding this afternoon.
00:42:53And, you know, I want to urge the citizenry of Trinidad and Tobago and, most importantly, the Trinidad and Tobago Police Service to take a page out of Ms. Bertrand's testimony.
00:43:05And, you know, I want to wish all women police officers in the Trinidad and Tobago Police Service, you know, best of luck.
00:43:11We have seen many of you occupying in very significant positions in the TTPS.
00:43:16And I want to urge you, my fellow colleagues, my fellow seniors in the police service, that, you know, you have a mammoth responsibility.
00:43:25You have a very serious responsibility and it's beyond dealing with juvenile and woman offenders.
00:43:32You are now placed in very serious administrative position to be able to administer and operationalize the Trinidad and Tobago Police Service to ensure that we protect and serve, Mark, with pride, which is what?
00:43:45Professionalism, we saw that in Ms. Bertrand.
00:43:48Respect, we saw that.
00:43:50Integrity, it is reflecting there.
00:43:52Dignity, we saw it.
00:43:53And, most importantly, to ground it up this afternoon, we saw excellence in Ms. Bertrand.
00:43:59Ms. Bertrand, I salute you and I thank you very much for your service to the people of Trinidad and Tobago.
00:44:03Thank you so much for that passionate speech to Sergeant Ali.
00:44:08And we're going to take a short break and we'll be back.
00:44:10Stay with us.
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00:47:27Welcome back to Beyond the Tape.
00:47:28I'm your host, Mark Bussan, joined today by Sergeant Zahir Ali
00:47:31of the Trinidad and Tobago Police Service and Attorney at Law.
00:47:34And now that we've gotten the Kleenex that I gave you at the break,
00:47:38I know that was very emotional for you.
00:47:40We're going to move on to one of your favorite segments,
00:47:43Voice of the People.
00:47:45Let's go.
00:47:45Shiguanas.
00:47:46This is a correlation between poverty
00:48:15and poverty.
00:48:16In a way, yeah.
00:48:20The thing is, you see, when you look at the people that are doing the robbery or putting
00:48:28down the crime, when you look at the bathroom, if, for example, if I have a wife and two children
00:48:35and me and I have no income, just say I was working with people and you take it from me
00:48:40and the next thing I acquire is illegal fire.
00:48:42Yeah.
00:48:43What is my next intention?
00:48:44When you have a nagging wife, that's it.
00:48:46Breathing down and you're actually ready to feed.
00:48:48I especially wanted a newborn baby.
00:48:50That is the line you will be thinking.
00:48:53Yeah.
00:48:54Um, what are your thoughts on school violence?
00:48:59No, against that hundred percent.
00:49:02That is something need to be controlled.
00:49:05And with police presence in school, I for that.
00:49:10You think school should then also play a bigger role in crime prevention?
00:49:14Yeah.
00:49:15Yeah.
00:49:16Yeah.
00:49:17School should play a bigger role in crime prevention because you see social media with
00:49:22children in school.
00:49:23As I say, I was working, watching a documentary with China.
00:49:27Yes, you come with your phone, but you lock it in a bag and you leave it by the gate.
00:49:30You have a code for that.
00:49:32Leave your phone there.
00:49:33Your phone is for emergency.
00:49:35If you need it more than that, then you go to the principal office.
00:49:38Mm-hmm.
00:49:39Yeah.
00:49:40Yeah.
00:49:41Agreed.
00:49:42How can communities work together to reduce crime in this country?
00:49:47Long time.
00:49:49If you was a neighbor's keeper or a brother's keeper, you cannot leave your door open.
00:49:54And you have a put on your fire and you tell the neighbor.
00:49:57Well, check that for me.
00:49:58I'm not going to go.
00:49:59I don't come back.
00:50:00But unity is what we do have.
00:50:01It takes a village to graduate.
00:50:06That's a whole school again.
00:50:08If we could maintain back that, that one love and unity and stop separating each other,
00:50:14we have a...
00:50:15You feel safer at home, in general, walking the streets?
00:50:20I feel comfortable because I don't really look to attract anything.
00:50:26But you have to be on the lookout for anything.
00:50:30You have to be late.
00:50:31That's it.
00:50:32Last question.
00:50:33What do you think makes persons gravitate to a life of crime?
00:50:37Fast money.
00:50:38Nice thing.
00:50:39When you do have lack of education.
00:50:41Well said.
00:50:42Voice of the people in Chagones.
00:50:43We're going to take a short break.
00:50:44And when we get back, we'll comment and take your calls.
00:50:45Stay with us.
00:50:46Stay with us.
00:50:47Voice of the people in Chagones.
00:50:48We're going to take a short break.
00:50:49And when we get back, we'll comment and take your calls.
00:50:50Stay with us.
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00:50:58Voice of the people in Chagones, we're going to take a short break.
00:51:03And when we get back, we'll comment and take your calls.
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00:52:51welcome back to be on the tape i'm your host mark busan joined today by acting sergeant zaheer ali of
00:53:06the trinidad and tobago police service and attorney at law before the break we heard from a resident in
00:53:11the shagwana syria voice of the people sergeant ali well mark always interesting always interesting to
00:53:17hear the perspectives of the of the um citizenry of trinidad and to be gone in this case in shagwan
00:53:22is and um you know mark there's a scene that you know that has become you know obvious to everyone
00:53:27that our village um should be involved in raising a child you know if you look at it critically
00:53:32sometimes the village is there is any child but the question is who in the village is raising the child
00:53:37and that's something that you know i want us to be critical with so it's not that it's absent but what
00:53:41we are doing we are allowing other persons who are not suitable to step in and interact with our
00:53:46children are so the first point i want to make in relation to you know what the the um citizen has
00:53:51indicated and secondly the issue mark with reference to what should say the suggestion for the education
00:53:58system to have cell phones be locked away and only be accessed if there's a case of emergency i think
00:54:04that's a very interesting development and you know we need to start somewhere if we really want to
00:54:08control because what you have and we have known this too well social media brings our children closer
00:54:14to the world to the people and people who are not um well intended so that they're exposed to a lot of
00:54:23different things that are influenced in a particular way so i think that during that period that you know
00:54:28children are going to school now the argument may be unless they are utilizing their phone
00:54:32to be able to store files access the internet and that sort of thing but it's something that we should
00:54:37really sit down and think carefully about um to be able to really regulate and yes a case in point if
00:54:43there's a let's figure an incident in school what we find children doing taking out phones and
00:54:47recording and then that going on social media and then it creates a a big commotion um and we know the
00:54:54effects of that so i think that's a very interesting position in terms of really regulating that and mark
00:54:59i heard some time ago drastic actions required and if we are speaking about curb in school violence and
00:55:07regulating the discipline in our nation schools if we realize that device may be assisting and promoting it
00:55:12then we should try to regulate it to some extent so i think very interesting coming out of that video
00:55:16but as always um you know i i look forward to this oh one final thing in that video and this is without
00:55:23prejudice to anybody we need to look at it the the municipal police in particular and the national
00:55:28police i'm continuing to see mark on the main road in shagonas the pavement just by way of observation
00:55:36they'll they are summary offenses that governs the pavement that's the free movement of persons and
00:55:42when persons are now occupying it illegally you're of course now venturing out into the roadway and next
00:55:47thing you know there's a fatal accident so i'm just saying that when we are looking at crime and criminality
00:55:52we need to look at crime and criminality with a with a um through the wind the broken windows theory
00:55:59because if they feel that they can now um step on the pavement cover the pavement of you know obstruct the
00:56:04passageway then what else they'll do create a structure that now um um basically projects out
00:56:11into the to the onto the in the the the the passageway then what you're gonna have next coming
00:56:17with a fireman selling narcotics so it's something that we need to look at and this is without prejudice
00:56:21the person who may be trying to make a living but the municipal cooperation the borough please look at
00:56:26these persons and see if you could facilitate them give them a stall educate them let them understand the
00:56:32risk that is associated by being on the pavement so again excellent video mark and i just use it today
00:56:37just to show a different perspective but you know these are the things that we need to look at all
00:56:41right we have another caller on the line caller good evening welcome to be on the tape hi good afternoon
00:56:46mark good good evening to the sergeant good evening good evening to you sir sergeant i'd like to pose a
00:56:50question to you given that you are a legal-minded individual slash officer of the ttps my question to you
00:56:59this afternoon is how come a right thinking commissioner of police could deny a businessman or a group of
00:57:11businessmen or a businessman the right to own a firearm and one of that reason you know when they give you
00:57:19the eight by ten paper they will outline the reasons one of the reasons are you do not deal in large sums of
00:57:27cash which which which is very very concerning to me right i'd like to i'd like to hear your views and
00:57:49opinion on that okay thank you very much cola um thanks for your confidence in in in posing that
00:57:56question to me because i think that you believe i may have a response state but um you know that
00:58:00that reasoning that has been given you know by the police commissioner i don't know whether it is the
00:58:04present commissioner or previous commissioner but um the the the conclusion to deny an applicant you
00:58:12know it's it's it is something that we need to look at and you know just hearing what you are saying
00:58:16and just relying on what you are saying there are other circumstances to look at as opposed to just
00:58:21looking at the issue of money so um that is an interesting um position but what i want to assure
00:58:25you is that if you feel aggrieved and now i'm wearing my legal hat the commissioner has made a decision
00:58:31whether the current or the previous so i'm not going to be um in in subordinate to adverse to it but
00:58:37what i can advise you under the laws of chernadar and tobago you can now make uh an application or
00:58:44what we call go to the appeals board and lodge your complaint and let the appeals board have a look at that
00:58:50particular application so that you'll be exhausting your due process so it's not the end of the matter
00:58:54if there's a decision on the application that does not go in your favor and if you feel strong seek
00:58:59advice engage the appeals board and let's see what another tribunal may say with reference to your matter
00:59:04but just looking at the issue of monies you know i have not i do have the the privilege of seeing the
00:59:10application what was placed in the application and i'm not in the mind of the police commissioner as to
00:59:14what may be some of the things he has considered perhaps your reasoning is probably um um
00:59:21restricted to the issue of monies but i'm sure um there may be other circumstances but again
00:59:27i want to leave you by knowing your avenue for redress in that matter mark before i go forward
00:59:32this issue okay all right sorry we have a call on the line quickly caller good evening welcome to be on
00:59:37the tip good evening how are you all real well good evening ma'am good evening good evening officer and
00:59:44ma i'm so happy that you all started with that um video because i looked at that on another program
00:59:51and what i was going to call to ask if the rule if the rule has already been passed and i think that
00:59:56the person should have been um held first thought because he's assaulted it i've gotten retirement strong
01:00:02and he didn't really let go that bottle so i was calling to really ask you but you have already
01:00:06answered that question because i was wondering if it has passed that's my first point my second point is
01:00:11officer if somebody is being beaten on a beach like i'm sure you all have seen it a few people beat
01:00:18up this person i don't know what was the reason and if after that if nobody go and complain so nothing
01:00:25will happen to that person that that person somebody has to go and complain and say that person got beaten
01:00:30and whoever beaten otherwise nothing will happen to that that's my second point my third point is in
01:00:36this office officer now they continue on facebook to to make all sorts of things and you all have
01:00:44said this so many times on this program did people getting set up come and buy this and come and buy that
01:00:50and come and buy it and when they go is because somebody's waiting for them waiting for them another
01:00:56thing too is especially ph sometimes somebody call and say i want a cat of x y and z and when they
01:01:02wear somebody and they just set them up so we have to be careful of what we do how we do it and when we
01:01:07do it but i'm so happy officer tkr have a blessed evening all of you
01:01:16quickly sergeant ali you have about two minutes a little bit yeah thank you very much thank you very
01:01:20much cola and um you know i'll take the last you know when she respond to tkr and um you know i wish
01:01:26that every single citizen you know treat trinidad and tobago that we know how we attribute tkr you
01:01:32know we see that pride and joy i you know my hope and expectation for trinidad and tobago every single
01:01:37citizen will feel the same way about trinidad and tobago you know and especially where we are
01:01:41approaching our independence but again very very significant issues and mark the point i wanted to make you
01:01:46know um with reference to the previous scholar in terms of while i've directed him to the appeals
01:01:51board if he so desire as an option you know i also want to also indicate that an individual has a right
01:01:58to apply but there's no right to get the firearm there's a difference you have a right to apply so that
01:02:06the commissioner can give you consideration but if you consider the commissioner in his discussion
01:02:10believe that you are not entitled for whatever circumstances then he has that authority in law
01:02:15based on the firearms act to deny you but the farms have also give you what an avenue to appeal the
01:02:20commissioner's decision um that can go either way so i just wanted to make that um you know
01:02:26lucidly clear this afternoon but um again is is is you know things happen and you know we have to
01:02:33exhaust our due process to ensure that there is justice in the process but uh mark i know that we are
01:02:38approaching we have just about a minute left i know she the caller spoke about persons going and purchasing
01:02:44stuff uh through facebook marketplace and all these these things uh she talked about the the video with
01:02:51the the shopkeeper and of course uh also with the beating on the beach and i understand that apparently
01:02:57that person was actually a bully because there was a follow-up story in the express and uh senior
01:03:03superintendent uh guy allen who was here yesterday would have uh you know she would have uh also
01:03:09articulated some of the things that happened in regard to that particular incident about 20 seconds
01:03:15anything you want to say in parting yeah well mark i just want to you know take this opportunity you
01:03:19know to wish um trinidad and tobago you know a safe week um you know we have thursday friday saturday
01:03:26sunday you know we are heading into the independence period um you know and let us truly sit down and
01:03:31reflect as to what independence should be all right and uh we wish tkr tonight all the best as they play their
01:03:37second game remember repeat tonight at 11 30 we run tomorrow at 11 o'clock beyond the tape is on at 4 45
01:03:45tomorrow the tv6 news is up next stay with us
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