00:00I guess we can get to Todd Munkin's press conference today.
00:03I mentioned Shador Sanders had a good day today, and then kind of, oh, and also Deshaun, too.
00:11JP's heard it. I've heard it.
00:12We've heard that Shador looked better than Deshaun today.
00:15Can you confirm that that is what you saw at OTAs today?
00:20Well, Shador certainly did more than Deshaun today.
00:23And in the three OTA practices we've been out here, this is really the first one where,
00:28I mean, I think Shador worked with the ones basically all day.
00:32I can't think of a period where he didn't lead them off that was a full speed period.
00:37So I also think he had the throw of the day, that go ball to Isaiah Bond in the final
00:45like two minutes sort of period that they did.
00:48So, I mean, all of that was really good.
00:50I think he had the better day today, but I do think overall this was still a fairly sloppy practice.
00:57A lot of things that Todd Munkin's going to want to get cleaned up, delays of games, some bad snaps,
01:04those sort of things.
01:05So it was by no means a perfect practice, but this was undeniably the practice where we just saw Shador
01:11Sanders getting more opportunity with the ones
01:15as opposed to the two prior practices in OTAs that we've seen.
01:19When you watch Deshaun, what specifically do you see that maybe he just didn't do as well today?
01:25Yeah, I mean, he was just not connecting with receivers in the same way.
01:29I mean, the final period, he had four straight incompletions.
01:34I mean, one was a diving catch that Casey Concepcion tried to make.
01:39I didn't think it was a very well-placed ball.
01:42So I think that was, to me, the biggest issue.
01:46It just felt like guys weren't connecting out there.
01:50He wasn't completing these passes the way that, quite honestly, he had made look easy in the two prior practices,
01:58I thought.
01:59So that was the biggest difference to me.
02:01Ashley, some people took Todd Munkin's comments today about Jared Verse being available, being at OTAs despite just being traded
02:10for,
02:11and then also his comment on, I don't really have to talk about Miles anymore because he's not here.
02:15People have taken this as maybe some slight towards or some shade towards Miles.
02:20Is that how you saw it?
02:22Well, I didn't quite necessarily see it like that, but I do think Todd Munkin is a guy who loves
02:28the guys who want to be here, right?
02:30Like, I always thought it was interesting that he was very pointed talking about that before the Miles-Garrett trade.
02:36And, you know, he would go out of his way to say, like, this is voluntary.
02:39We're really making a too big of a deal out of this.
02:42Of course, Andrew Berry said Miles' attendance had nothing to do with this trade when we had a chance to
02:48talk to him on Tuesday.
02:50But I do think it's, like, less of a slight against Miles and more of a, hey, Todd Munkin really
02:57just resonates with guys who are going to be here and show up for this voluntary stuff.
03:02And, you know, Miles-Garrett didn't do that.
03:04So I think that kind of – it kind of tells you just where he stood all along, I think.
03:09And I think he does really, really take it into account when guys show up for this voluntary stuff in
03:16a way that a coach like Kevin Stefanski just didn't do in the same way.
03:20But, again, we talked about it last week.
03:21Todd Munkin is a guy who footballs his whole life.
03:23He always talks about it.
03:24His whole family is in football.
03:25He dressed as a football player for Halloween as a kid every single year.
03:29So he, I think, appreciates that more than most coaches.
03:33What was your first impression of Jared Verse, both on the field and then behind the mic?
03:38Yeah, on the field, big and fast.
03:41I mean, you see that quickness that he plays with right away.
03:45And that's even in just doing individual drills.
03:48So he did a lot of get-off drills today, sled work.
03:51You know, it sounds like they're going to wait and let him get up to speed before they throw him
03:55in team drills.
03:56So we still had Isaiah McGuire and Alex Wright working as your two primary edge rushers.
04:02But I think that sort of speed and quickness is backed up by his words today.
04:08And I think he was a great interview.
04:10I'm really excited to get to know him more in that setting.
04:15Very big personality and a guy who's not afraid to make big proclamations.
04:21So I think he's not unlike Miles Garrett in that way,
04:24talking about how his plan is to be the best defensive player on the best defense in the NFL.
04:31And, again, big words from a guy when you're replacing Miles Garrett to get up there and say that.
04:36So I love the confidence.
04:37I love the speed.
04:39I love the fact that he described his game as violent and almost like his words were,
04:44why are you in my way?
04:46So I think all of that, the first impression, was about as good as you can get.
04:51Ashley, Mike Florio earlier today on the station said it's a red flag that the Rams were willing to give
04:58up Jared Verse.
05:00Basically, it's a sign they don't think he'll ever be a player the caliber of Miles Garrett.
05:05JP and I disagree.
05:07A beige flag that maybe we thought was he is switching defenses.
05:11And though he has played some with his hand in the dirt and lined up over the center at times,
05:18that's not something he's done consistently.
05:19He has been an outside linebacker.
05:22I think that is something to watch for.
05:24Do you see any beige flags when it comes to Jared Verse?
05:28You know, I think I definitely agree more with you guys.
05:32Like the 3-4, 2-4-3 part of it is interesting to me because it is different.
05:37But I will say some of my concerns were a little bit assuaged today.
05:42Hearing him talk, hearing Todd Munkin talk, I believe Todd Munkin was the one who mentioned
05:47it's a lot easier to make that change instead of having a guy go from, you know,
05:53playing down on the line to going to a linebacker and asking him to still rush the passer.
05:58That he thinks that Jared Verse's skill set is actually more well-suited to what the Browns do.
06:04And when Jared Verse talked, I thought his answer when I asked him about playing with Carson Schlesinger
06:10was really interesting because, first of all, obviously very complimentary of him.
06:14But he said it's perfect for his playing style in this scheme to know, hey, I can just play downhill
06:21and whatever I miss, a guy like Carson Schlesinger is going to be behind me to clean it up.
06:27And we know that part of this defense really isn't changing much.
06:31It still is going to be very much read and react for these linebackers.
06:34So that part of it to me was encouraging to hear him sort of talk about that transition in that
06:41way.
06:41And Ashley, I mean, Verse is good, but Miles is one of one when it comes to drawing attention
06:45and getting the focus on him and game plans just meant just for Miles.
06:50What Browns player do you think is going to be hurt the most with Miles leaving?
06:55Which Browns player will be hurt the most with Miles Garrett leaving?
07:00I don't know because I didn't think that's where you were going to go with the question, honestly.
07:04My thought was that it's going to be a little bit easier, I think, maybe for other guys to get
07:09sacks,
07:10which is not, I think, the conventional take in this.
07:13But I do think here's why.
07:15There were so many times last year where you sort of saw guys pull up or sacks were taken from
07:21them
07:21because Miles Garrett is a freak of nature and he's the only one that is going to beat you there
07:28to that play.
07:29And, you know, I think a lot about the Josh Allen sack that originally was given to Mason Graham
07:36and then the stats came back and said, nope, we're giving it to Miles Garrett, actually.
07:41So I do think there are so many guys on this D-line that are going to have more opportunity
07:48to actually get those sack numbers.
07:50I don't really envision this hurting anyone necessarily.
07:54I do really think it's going to give guys like Isaiah McGuire and Alex Wright in particular more opportunities.
08:02I guess I would be curious to see how Malik Collins does now without Miles Garrett there drawing that attention
08:08because I do think Malik really benefited in terms of his sack production.
08:12He had a career-high six sacks last year.
08:15But I do think something just sort of unlocked for him here.
08:18So that's the best answer I can give to that.
08:21But I'm not even fully confident that, like, his production would necessarily take a dip because of that.
08:26Ashley, Todd Munkin today commented about all the talent still on this roster.
08:31He was mentioning guys by name.
08:32And at the end, he said, we have a very talented roster on either side of the ball.
08:37And this and a couple other things led us to having the conversation of how long until we can expect
08:43the Browns to be good again.
08:45How would you answer that question?
08:48How are we defining good?
08:49Are we defining good as, like, a playoff team?
08:53Or what's, like, kind of your guys' vision for that?
08:56We did a lot of it around when should we expect to be winning again.
08:58So I guess winning is a way, winning record is 9-8, right?
09:01So if we start there, is that fair?
09:03Yeah.
09:04I mean, I think, in theory, that could be something that's achievable this year, 9-8.
09:10Especially just given the fact, like, we know they have one of the, quote-unquote, easier schedules.
09:15They don't have these West Coast trips this year.
09:18I mean, we played the schedule game when the schedule came out.
09:21So, I mean, I do think that it's feasible to expect winning in the next year.
09:25All right, scratch that, Ashley.
09:26It's not what I meant.
09:27It's not what we meant in the conversation.
09:28I guess we really meant being actual legitimately winning, but also, if not a contender, a fringe contender type team.
09:37One of those that you are talking about with, you know, not only being one of the best in your
09:42division, one of the best in the conference.
09:44I would say two to three years at the soonest, right?
09:47Like, there's going to be growing pains this year.
09:49And I think you have to give these two rookie classes time to gel.
09:55And you have to find an answer at quarterback.
09:57So, I don't know if they'll do that this year.
09:59I don't know if they'll do that next year.
10:01But I would say you're talking about, for that kind of winning, a two- to three-year timeline, if
10:06this has all gone according to their plan.
10:09Just because, like, we do know how much they value that 2025 rookie class, which, you know, has proven itself,
10:16I think, to some extent.
10:17Those guys still have to prove themselves in year two now that the league has more film on them.
10:22And then these rookies from the 2026 class have to produce in the way everyone sort of expects.
10:27So, I'd say two to three years would be my rough estimate before that window really, truly sort of starts.
10:35Ashley, you had that in-depth piece with Jim Schwartz.
10:38I thought you were a prime position for if he became the head coach to go ahead and be his
10:43right-hand journalist.
10:44You know what I mean?
10:45But, obviously, it didn't happen.
10:47I know you heard his comments on Ripken's Kids podcast.
10:51What did you make of him speaking out and taking this long to speak out?
10:55Yeah, you know, I thought Jim Schwartz, the clip that I saw, that he was right on the money in
11:01the assessment of the situation.
11:03Like, in terms of it would have been very difficult to come in after you lose out on that job,
11:10right?
11:11You lose out on that promotion, but then to, like, potentially have a division in the locker room, right?
11:17If you hire Todd Munkin as head coach, Jim Schwartz stays on.
11:20And there are defensive guys who were advocating for him to become head coach.
11:24I think the second there's any issues or losing starts, guys are going to be like, well, why didn't we
11:29just hire Schwartz?
11:30So, I think it could have been a messy situation.
11:32And I think the thing that Jim Schwartz, just having been around the league for decades, is so good at
11:37recognizing is that nothing exists in a vacuum in the NFL.
11:42And I do think sometimes in Cleveland, there's this hope that, oh, we can get past anything, it's not going
11:49to matter, all that matters is the football, the winning, and that's just not the case.
11:52Things don't exist in a vacuum.
11:53There are personalities and egos and feelings and all these sort of intangible things that do have tangible impact when
12:02it comes to creating a culture and the X's and O's of a game plan, even.
12:06So, I thought his read on the situation was very honest.
12:10I'm not surprised.
12:10I think we've seen Jim do that before.
12:14So, that was sort of my take on it.
12:16And quite honestly, I think he was right.
12:18I think how he described it, his reasons for not sticking around, they made sense to me.
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