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00:00On today's show, how long were you with Anne for?
00:03I was married to her for about four years.
00:06You're a bloody fool, you liar!
00:07There is a chance that this Tony, 41, could be your daughter.
00:12Yes.
00:14Talk about Sylvia.
00:15Yeah.
00:16Your daughter.
00:16I don't want to talk about her.
00:17That you don't want to call her.
00:18She's evil.
00:19Look at her.
00:19She looks like she's out of 117.
00:21Ha ha ha!
00:27You're a bull liar!
00:28You always said, you can stand a thief, but not a liar.
00:32But we will prove today what a liar you are.
00:34Did you beat her up?
00:35No, did I act.
00:36You what?
00:37I didn't beat you up.
00:42Yeah, because I'd have stuck it in you.
00:43Did you tell my dad that the wrong brother died?
00:45Yes.
00:45Yes.
00:46Because you should have died.
00:48Yeah, so you can't.
00:50You can't get out that way.
00:51Look, nowhere to go.
00:53The walk of shame.
00:55Get out.
00:56Get out.
01:03This young man has been out of prison three weeks.
01:06He's already causing trouble.
01:07He's already held someone at knife point.
01:09Yeah, that's what he went through for.
01:11He had nowhere to go.
01:12He couldn't go and live with his mother.
01:14Is she scared of him?
01:15Definitely.
01:16Big take.
01:16You all love that boy.
01:17Right?
01:18You all turn on.
01:18I love that boy a bit.
01:19Right?
01:19Then you all on it.
01:40Thank you very much for being good morning and a big, big welcome to the show now.
01:43My first guest today, Tony, is here to find out if he is indeed the father to his ex-wife's
01:48youngest daughter, Tony.
01:49Now, Tony says that Ex-Anne was a terrible parent who callously abandoned their children
01:54on more than one occasion.
01:55And he was always the one left to pick up the pieces.
01:58He said he has been all the support his kids have ever needed, even to daughter Tony, who
02:03he has always known might not be his.
02:05It's a big, big day for this guy.
02:07And brave him to be here.
02:08Tony's on the Jeremy Carr show that way.
02:21How are you, sir?
02:21You all right?
02:22Fine, thank you.
02:23Everything all right?
02:24Yes.
02:24That is smart in your tie.
02:26Welcome to the show, Tony.
02:27As clearly as you can.
02:29Very simple.
02:30You and ex-Anne, you actually haven't been together for 40 years, but you were together
02:35for a while.
02:38Today, you're doing a DNA test on her youngest daughter, Tony, 41.
02:44It's a bit of a complicated story, really.
02:47How long were you with Anne for?
02:49I was married to her for about four years.
02:51Bloody for you, liar!
02:53Right, brilliant.
02:54I married Anne on the rebound.
02:56She was not very domesticated at all.
02:58I'd have to tell her where to clean herself and where to clean the house.
03:01She didn't have great hygiene.
03:03So you don't believe that you're Tony's father?
03:05That's my question.
03:06I'm 50-50.
03:08Why are you 50-50?
03:09Because I used to...
03:09So you were still sleeping with her?
03:10No, I used to go down and see her and give her the maintenance money.
03:14You're 50-50.
03:14But you must have given her a lot more than maintenance.
03:16I'll do this.
03:18You must have given her a lot more than just the maintenance money.
03:20Maybe I did.
03:21There is a chance that this Tony, 41, could be your daughter.
03:26You're not all you appear to be, though, are you?
03:28Yes, I am.
03:29Are you?
03:29Yes.
03:30Yes.
03:31You've been quite difficult with my team, haven't you?
03:34I've been difficult in many ways.
03:36And the reason you know that...
03:37Let's talk about Sylvia.
03:38Yeah.
03:39Your daughter.
03:39I don't want to talk about her.
03:40That you don't want to call her.
03:41She's evil.
03:42Is she?
03:42Yes.
03:43Evil.
03:44So your daughter, Sylvia, has an awful lot to say.
03:47And you and your son, Mark, who's also been a pain, sat there in the audience, you went
03:51from wanting to be involved in this to doing a late-night runner last night to, I'll come
03:56back to, I'm not doing this to, now I'm going to sit in the audience and not have a microphone
04:01on, yeah?
04:02It's nothing to do with me, is it?
04:03Of course it's to do with your 79-year-old father.
04:05I thought you didn't want to talk, pal.
04:07Well, you know what, your 79-year-old father could do with a bit of support, so instead
04:12of being a pain in the backside like you've been for the last 24 hours, why don't you man
04:16up and sit next to him, for God's sake?
04:20Whatever.
04:21Whatever.
04:22So, Tony, 79.
04:24Tell me about Sylvia.
04:25Why have you got such a problem with Sylvia?
04:27Because she's evil.
04:29She's your daughter.
04:29She tells lies.
04:30You told my team?
04:31She's a...
04:32My team.
04:33You told my team, and I quote, there's no way I'm coming on that show if she's
04:37anywhere near Manchester.
04:39No, I'm not.
04:41I wouldn't be here now.
04:42Why?
04:42Because she's dangerous.
04:44Maybe she's got the truth about you, Tony.
04:46I don't want her.
04:46I don't want her anywhere near...
04:47So you're all about deciding who comes on the Jeremy Kyle show, are you?
04:50No, I'm contented.
04:52She rang the show.
04:53I'm content.
04:54I know she rang the show.
04:55Because she thinks she's been an appalling example of a father.
04:58Yeah, she will do, won't she?
05:00Shall we get your ex-wife out?
05:01Because she tells a very different tale than you do.
05:03Let's get Anne on the Jeremy Kyle show, your ex-wife, don't we?
05:17You are a born liar.
05:19You always said, you can stand the feet but not a liar.
05:23But we will prove today what a liar you are.
05:25So let's just say, when the welfare brought all the children back from Birmingham, why
05:30did they tell me that you were on the game?
05:32Er, not you.
05:34That was...
05:34That was the welfare.
05:37I wanted to see that in writing.
05:39I'll go to welfare.
05:40They'll tell you.
05:40Tony was 12 years older than me.
05:41I married him because I needed an escape from home.
05:43I went from beatings growing up to beatings from my partner.
05:47Four days in.
05:48Did you beat her up?
05:48No, did I, actually.
05:49You know what?
05:50I didn't beat you up.
05:54Now, let me just explain something, just so you're aware.
05:57You're 79 and I have to do this in a respectful way, right?
06:01Let me tell you something.
06:02Anybody else that made a comment like that, that is disgraceful.
06:05You've just said you should have beaten her up.
06:07Just leave that.
06:12Tony was conceived after you and Tony Sr. split up.
06:17Is he Tony's father?
06:18Yes, he is.
06:18And how has he treated her?
06:21He hasn't treated her at all.
06:23Oh, well, let's let...
06:24He's always said, she's not mine.
06:27And then when it suits him, yes, I know Tony's mine.
06:32But I had to deny her because I was seeing another person.
06:39He says, now we're coming down to you as well.
06:41He had three of us on the go, Jeremy.
06:44Isn't it a fact?
06:45Isn't it true that the reason you've denied Tony, right?
06:49I haven't denied her.
06:50Yes, you have.
06:50Yes, you have.
06:51Tony herself said.
06:52Your daughter or potential daughter says you've done nothing.
06:55You've ostracised her for years.
06:56Why didn't you stand up and find out whether the kid was yours?
07:00Why did you use to throw me bus control pills in fire and turn around and...
07:04Yes, I did when I went to the family planning.
07:07He said, you and I...
07:08About to throw him in the fire.
07:10You told my team, I spent years being scared of this guy.
07:14As I was.
07:15I was petrified of him.
07:17But not anymore.
07:18Not anymore.
07:19No.
07:20Hi, bro.
07:23Hi, bro.
07:24He's always...
07:33He's always called the shots.
07:36Guess what?
07:37This is the Jeremy Kyle show and I call the shots.
07:40You know, Sylvia.
07:41No, no, no, no, no, no.
07:42You know, you know, Sylvia that you didn't want in the studio.
07:45Yeah.
07:46Well, you see, she phoned the Jeremy Kyle show and it's my show.
07:49So, what I thought I'd do was, I wouldn't have her in the studio.
07:52After this break, I've got a camera outside the studio.
07:57Sylvia's next.
07:58Don't go anywhere.
07:59Wait, wait.
08:02Why are you?
08:03You are.
08:03Why are you?
08:04Your wife brought us up, Dad.
08:06And who we're looking at?
08:08That's all you like.
08:09That's all.
08:11You and that.
08:12Could you have done more?
08:14Yes.
08:14Do you apologise for that?
08:16Yes, I do.
08:17Have you got an Oscar?
08:19It makes me hurting all inside.
08:22It's like I'm losing my son.
08:24I'm going to find him in the gutter.
08:35Thank you very much for being welcome back to the break.
08:37Tony and XY for 40 years.
08:38And you came here today and you said,
08:40I want to find out if this child, Tony, the female, is mine.
08:43I did not.
08:43You don't want to find out if she's yours.
08:45She came to me.
08:46You're not all that you appear to be, though, are you?
08:48This is your daughter, Sylvia.
08:49Why didn't you want to see Sylvia?
08:51Because look at her.
08:52She looks like she's out of Ward 17.
08:54Hi, you ****.
08:58Sylvia.
09:00She'll tell you things to her name.
09:02No, no, no.
09:03No, no, no.
09:03Yes, she does.
09:04She tells the truth more than you've ever done.
09:06You wouldn't know what the word truth meant.
09:08Well, if it were wrong, then Andrew wouldn't know what it was.
09:13Wait.
09:15You can see the violence coming, eh?
09:17She's not violent at all.
09:18She won't go near you.
09:19She's a liar.
09:21Sit down.
09:21Everybody, I'm a liar.
09:24No, you didn't bring us up. Your wife brought us up, Dad.
09:27And who we're working all the time.
09:29I'm not sure you're lying, son of a...
09:32You and that.
09:33Hey, hey, you're off wrong show.
09:35That's exactly how she is.
09:36Yeah, you should be on kill.
09:38You'll have to excuse me, Dad.
09:39Yeah, domestic violence.
09:40Sit down.
09:41Excuse me, I said I would not.
09:42Sit down.
09:43You're not demanding this show.
09:44I want to do the...
09:45You don't want to know if Tony's your daughter.
09:46You're running away because you don't like the truth.
09:48No, I'm not running away, Jerry.
09:49Sit down, I'll deal with it.
09:50I will deal with it.
09:51And I'll bring up the fact that she deserted her four kids
09:53and I brought them up.
09:54Then let's have this.
09:55Sit down, tell me.
09:56Just be quiet a minute.
09:57I want to hear this.
09:58Say that again.
09:59Be quiet.
09:59Say that again, Tony.
10:01Shush.
10:02Go on.
10:02She put all the children in care.
10:04Who did?
10:05Yes, she did.
10:06Yes, she did.
10:06Let him speak.
10:08I was in care.
10:09I was in care, though.
10:10I was in care.
10:11Isn't it true that you went to get the children out of care?
10:14Let's turn this round a minute.
10:15You did...
10:16Hold on.
10:17You did put the kids in care, didn't you?
10:19In voluntary care.
10:20Yes, because you couldn't cope.
10:21You were one of them.
10:22No, not that I can't help, Jeremy.
10:24He was in prison.
10:26Sorry.
10:26Your four children were in voluntary care, right?
10:30OK, go on.
10:31Your kids were in voluntary care.
10:32Yeah.
10:33You got them out of voluntary care, didn't you?
10:35Yes.
10:36Yes or no?
10:36Yes.
10:37And you brought them up for how long, Tony?
10:39Until they were going into the team.
10:41Why was he allowed to have four children?
10:44So, so services like...
10:45Well, then why didn't you have them back?
10:47They come down to Midlands, down to Birmingham to me.
10:52You've got to understand where I'm coming from.
10:53And they didn't like it.
10:54You've got to understand one thing.
10:55And they went back home.
10:56He obviously passed a lot of controls and a lot of tests.
10:59But here's the thing that I want to get from you, Tony.
11:03When you went, where are you going now?
11:06See, I'm telling you, that's right.
11:07Dan, are you starting no argument?
11:08That's right.
11:09That's right.
11:10I didn't want her anywhere near you.
11:11Back of a pub?
11:12Four years ago.
11:13Yeah, because I'd have stuck it in you.
11:15Can you tell my dad that the wrong brother died?
11:16Yes.
11:16Yes.
11:17Because you should have died.
11:18What's the...
11:19You haven't got a microphone.
11:21Then get lost.
11:22I don't want you.
11:22You should have died.
11:23Not the rest.
11:23You should have died.
11:24What are you doing?
11:25The class of...
11:26Yeah.
11:26Brother.
11:27Well, maybe she's angry.
11:28I never said, Leslie.
11:30Can you sit down and be quiet, please?
11:33Can you answer the question?
11:36When you went after you came out of prison to get your four kids,
11:39this is the thing for me, okay?
11:41You went and got them out of voluntary care.
11:44Yes or no?
11:45Yes.
11:45But you left Tony, the daughter, there, didn't you?
11:48Yes.
11:48She was in Birmingham.
11:50She wasn't.
11:50The one that you never wanted to admit to because it was,
11:54don't take this the wrong way,
11:56created whilst you were with another woman,
11:58that poor woman was left in care.
12:01She's been denied for 41 years and she still doesn't know the truth.
12:05She was not in care.
12:06This one was ignored by you.
12:08She was in care.
12:09She was not in care.
12:10Why am I being ignored?
12:11Tony's on the Jeremy Kyle show.
12:13It's about her today.
12:20You don't even know when my birthday is.
12:23You don't even know when my birthday is.
12:24I know it's me.
12:25It's not in me.
12:26It's not me.
12:28My birthday's not in May.
12:29It's in August.
12:29All right, you told me that you wanted me to be in your life.
12:32Yeah, and I do,
12:33but I don't want all the lies that come with it.
12:35Don't tell lies.
12:36She tells lies.
12:37Why did you tell her?
12:37She is a birthday liar.
12:39Why have I lied?
12:41Why have I lied?
12:42Why have I lied?
12:43Did you?
12:44Why does everybody call her the poison dwarf?
12:46Because I tell it as it is.
12:48Did you say to me last week,
12:49you would pay for a DNA test on the paternity of my children?
12:53No.
12:53Yes, I did.
12:55Yes, I did.
12:56Yes, I did.
12:56I apologise.
12:57I apologise.
12:58Yes, you did.
12:59Why?
12:59Because I had one night stand when I was 23,
13:02and you're going round town saying that that man's my son's dad.
13:05I've not been round town.
13:06The only time I've ever spoke to her was you.
13:08You told her.
13:09You told her.
13:09You told her five years ago.
13:10You told me four years ago.
13:11That's a liar.
13:11You're a liar.
13:12What is your name?
13:17What is your problem with Sylvia?
13:20I want you to just please don't anybody say anything,
13:22and then we'll talk to Tony.
13:23What is your problem with Sylvia so much?
13:25Because of her violence,
13:27of the lies that she tells.
13:29Who's she been violent to?
13:30She's been violent.
13:30She pulled a knife out of her.
13:32Can I just say a word?
13:33Can I just say something?
13:34Is that not...
13:35I mean, you know, I have to be respectful.
13:36That's a bit rich.
13:38It's not rich.
13:40Excuse me, Jeremy.
13:42He's not better.
13:43He's done nothing but bully and beat me up.
13:46Sorry for swearing lies.
13:47Yeah, she's swearing again.
13:48That's the right type of...
13:49But, mate, what sort of upbringing has she had?
13:53She's...
13:53Yeah, that's her language again.
13:55Yeah, but he's been effing and jeffing, hasn't he?
13:59Let's talk about Tony.
14:00Tony, welcome to the show.
14:02Apparently, you were conceived after they split up.
14:05That's all I know.
14:06According to your mother,
14:08you were always pushed out, ostracised, whatever,
14:11because he didn't want to admit to you
14:14because he was in a new relationship.
14:15I don't want anybody else to speak.
14:16Is that how you felt growing up?
14:18Well, yeah.
14:19I was...
14:20My mum's got five kids.
14:22He took four of them out of care.
14:24So he left you in care?
14:26Because she was in Bernadette.
14:26You're not...
14:27It doesn't matter whether she was in the Alfa Hebrides,
14:29she left her.
14:30She was a big one with a faster mother.
14:33Who was?
14:34The truth is, she...
14:36Wasn't she, Mark?
14:37No, she wasn't.
14:38And...
14:40Tony, be quiet.
14:41I want to speak to this, Tony, with an eye.
14:43You felt always like the black sheep,
14:45is what you told me.
14:46Yeah, because my eldest brother isn't even his.
14:48And he brought him on.
14:49And he took him out of care.
14:50She told my team,
14:51this lady has been a mother and a father.
14:53You have completely and utterly ignored her
14:55and treated her so badly for years
14:58because of your own guilt.
15:00And you never wanted your new family to know
15:02about, please don't get offended,
15:04your dirty little secret.
15:06That's how she's felt for years, Tony.
15:08You're all right.
15:08It's the wrong story, anyway.
15:10No, but...
15:11You won't let me get a word.
15:12Explain what I just said.
15:14I'll explain that I wasn't married
15:17when I was going to see her.
15:20But you were in another relationship.
15:22I was in another relationship.
15:23And if you knew there was a chance
15:24you had another kid,
15:25why did you...
15:26But she booted off to Birmingham
15:27and took the child with her.
15:28Can you remember me
15:30running you to London Roadster?
15:32No, you did not.
15:33Well, you're a liar.
15:34You've never taken me to...
15:35I took you to London Roadster.
15:38And I got in the car with you
15:39was when you come
15:40and said,
15:41I've paid you some maintenance
15:43down at the courts.
15:45Come on, I'll take you for it.
15:46I know.
15:47I took me down for it
15:48and then took the £5 off me
15:50as we come out of court.
15:52Yeah, I'll tell you the truth.
15:53Do you care about this?
15:55Do you care about this?
15:55You've never told me your word.
15:56I'll still be a father.
15:58Because the social services
15:59don't turn down to me.
16:01Do you think you've been
16:01any sort of father?
16:02Seriously, I...
16:03Excuse me,
16:04have you been any sort of father
16:05to Tony with an I?
16:06No.
16:07Because I've had four
16:08or five children to bring up.
16:10You've got to bring up
16:12what you've never brought up.
16:13What's it got to do with you
16:14how many kids I've got?
16:15Well, because you should look
16:16after all of them,
16:17shouldn't you?
16:18Yeah.
16:19And I've done.
16:20And I have done.
16:21And I have done.
16:22The really interesting thing
16:24about your story is
16:26is that you did go
16:27and you did get
16:28the four out of care,
16:29which says a lot about you,
16:30but this story
16:31is not about you
16:32and Anne arguing.
16:33It's not really about
16:34Sylvie having a chip.
16:36It's about this girl
16:37at 41...
16:38I haven't got a chip.
16:39...who has been ostracised
16:40and pushed aside.
16:42Because it's my sister.
16:44I think you don't like Sylvie
16:45because she absolutely
16:46sussed you out.
16:47No, she didn't.
16:48No, he doesn't like me
16:49because I say it as it is.
16:50Yeah, and everybody knows
16:51you say it like it is.
16:52Because I don't tell lies,
16:53do I?
16:54And your mother...
16:55Where did she got that from?
16:56You or her mother?
16:57My children.
16:57Really?
16:58I should think she got that.
16:59Hang on a minute.
17:00I didn't live with her, Jeremy.
17:01What did you say
17:01in front of Tony's children?
17:03Whose children?
17:04My daughter.
17:05What did he say?
17:06He said,
17:07I never thought you was mine
17:09because me and your mum
17:09weren't together.
17:11And then he said,
17:11but I did use school
17:12and give your mum
17:12one every now and then.
17:15So that in front
17:15of your grandchild,
17:16potentially, did you?
17:17He's a liar.
17:18No, I didn't.
17:18It's disgusting, isn't he?
17:19No, I didn't.
17:20So he can't do...
17:22Are you not responsible
17:23for anything?
17:23You're just like
17:24the best behaved person ever.
17:25I brought the children...
17:27I brought the children up.
17:29Do you not think
17:30it's wrong at 41
17:31to not know who your dad is?
17:33She knows who her dad is.
17:34No, she doesn't.
17:35Who is it?
17:35Why are we here then?
17:36Why are we here then?
17:38Because whether she's mine
17:39or not,
17:40she'll always be mine.
17:40Then why are you
17:42on a mission?
17:43Why are you on a mission?
17:43She was living in Birmingham
17:45and I was bringing...
17:46I came back from Birmingham.
17:47Well, I didn't even live in Birmingham.
17:48I lived in Overhampton
17:49and I came back
17:50just before my seventh birthday.
17:52Neighbours.
17:53Could you have done more
17:54for Tony with an I?
17:55A few years ago.
17:56No.
17:57I did my best.
17:58No, you liar.
17:59He did his best
18:00because he did nothing.
18:02And I brought you up.
18:03And I'll tell you what,
18:04there's one thing about it.
18:06She's never wanted for nothing,
18:08hasn't my daughter?
18:09No, no, no.
18:11Only a mother.
18:13Only a mother that I'd look after her kids.
18:15What did she say?
18:16My mum probably did her through thick and thin.
18:19And you didn't bring us up
18:20because your wife did.
18:22And where were I
18:23whilst you were bringing her up?
18:23In booze of light,
18:24you always were.
18:25Oh, that's a lie.
18:26I worked for the same firm
18:27for 15 years.
18:28So you weren't in pub every single night?
18:30No.
18:30We saw you sober on a Sunday night.
18:32I worked for the same person
18:34for 15 years.
18:36Cashing hand while you were diddling.
18:37No.
18:38No, I wasn't.
18:40Why did we get grants
18:41for welfare for school uniform then?
18:43You only get that
18:44if you're on benefits.
18:45I wasn't on benefits.
18:46All right.
18:47You're a woman beater
18:49and you're a cantankerous.
18:51Tell the truth.
18:52You're 80 points.
18:5480 points.
19:00You were in care
19:01and then you were fostered?
19:02I was being fostered, yeah.
19:04What's your relationship
19:05like with your mum?
19:07It was brilliant.
19:08Were you fostered, Tony?
19:10I was fostered with him.
19:12She lived with him up there
19:13for a bit
19:14before she lived with him.
19:16Did she live with you?
19:17Yeah.
19:20You don't have to tell her.
19:21I'm sorry, but no,
19:22he's lying.
19:23He's a liar.
19:23I'm not lying at all.
19:25You're a liar.
19:26That's right.
19:26Tony, you're a liar.
19:27You will never go to heaven.
19:28You are a liar, Tony.
19:30I want to speak to Tony
19:31with an eye.
19:31What did you come here for today
19:32to discover the truth?
19:34Yeah.
19:34And if he is,
19:35if Tony is your dad,
19:36cutting aside what Sylvia
19:38and your mum naturally think,
19:40what do you want from Tony?
19:41I don't want nothing from him.
19:42I've not had nothing for 40 years.
19:43I don't need nothing now.
19:45Why the doubts?
19:46You say he's the father.
19:47I know for a fact, Jeremy,
19:48because I could never have
19:49another relationship.
19:51See, the thing is,
19:51when you first came out,
19:52because I never knew
19:53when he was coming to my aunt.
19:54You said it was 50-50
19:55because she was playing around.
19:57She was.
19:58Well, who is?
19:59Who is?
20:00You was,
20:01I caught you in the house
20:02when I looked at her.
20:03And went for her.
20:05And he went to the back door.
20:07He was somebody
20:08who lived on the middle.
20:09But you then said you were on.
20:10He was having a cup of coffee
20:12and you give him a belt.
20:13And that's why you were laid on Saturday.
20:17Excuse me.
20:18Now, you said you're absolutely
20:20sure she is your daughter.
20:21Well, she is.
20:22So you're not 50-50, then?
20:24I'm 100%.
20:25Oh!
20:27Now, when it comes out,
20:28I'm not.
20:28Well, I'll tell you what.
20:29If you are 100% and you are,
20:31the way you've treated that child
20:33is disgusting.
20:34Fair enough.
20:38And what about the other four?
20:41The early test results show
20:42that Tony, EY,
20:44is.
20:45He is your biological father.
20:48Thank you, Jeremy.
20:50Thank you very much.
20:52You won!
20:54She's there.
20:55Yes, you!
20:56Get six foot under.
20:59Same here.
21:01Did you see that?
21:02Yeah, I did see that.
21:03You're about to elbow
21:05your daughter in the face,
21:06weren't you?
21:0714, what would you like to just...
21:08Would you just like to have a look
21:10at that camera and replay it?
21:11She stabbed my son.
21:13I didn't stab him.
21:15Yeah, I did.
21:16Yeah, I did.
21:16He beat my...
21:19...me shush.
21:20He beat my...
21:22...you tried to...
21:24...you tried to...
21:24Sylvia.
21:25Yeah, you did.
21:26Sylvia.
21:26Yeah, you did.
21:27Sylvia.
21:27Yeah, you did.
21:28Sylvia, listen.
21:28Do you need to have to come here?
21:29Listen.
21:29Go and sit in there.
21:30I want Dad.
21:31Just go and sit in.
21:32Be quiet.
21:32Yeah, Dad, but I didn't...
21:33Do you know what?
21:35Why?
21:35Ah, you can't get out that way.
21:37Look, nowhere to go.
21:38Sit down.
21:39Right.
21:39Get him.
21:40Seriously.
21:41He's hiding now because he thinks he's being clever.
21:44I created this.
21:44Get him, and I'm not taking any of you down.
21:47Get him out of my building.
21:48He's a waste of space.
21:50Tony, sit down next to your daughter.
21:54And not a word.
21:57The Walker shame.
21:58I'll be here, Dad, as long as you are.
22:00Get out.
22:01Get out.
22:02Get out.
22:04I also have to call you.
22:05Because I've asked you.
22:06I also have to call you.
22:07I also have to call you.
22:07You've got your own voice, don't you?
22:08Sorry?
22:09I've got the sound of your own voice.
22:10See you.
22:17OK, listen.
22:19I want to try, if I can.
22:21Now finding out that she's your daughter, Tony, what does that mean?
22:24It means that she's my daughter, and I love her, and I always will.
22:27And if it had come out the other way, I'd have still said I were a dad.
22:30Could you have done more?
22:31Yes.
22:32Do you apologise for that?
22:33Yes, I do.
22:36Yes, I do.
22:38Well, I've not, I've not, it's not, I've not, the way they're...
22:41Have you got an Oscar?
22:42The way they're facing me to be.
22:48Have you got an Oscar?
22:49Yes, they're right there.
22:51I see you absolutely.
22:52I haven't got, I haven't got any awards at all.
22:55I never win them.
22:56Philip Schofield wins them, or why?
22:58Can you find one for him?
23:00Because he's playing a good one.
23:02Well, she's, yeah, but she, no, it's not me.
23:04It's not about me.
23:05I'll tell you what I believe, you wouldn't believe it.
23:07Shut up and listen, it's about your sister.
23:09Of course it is.
23:09Well, then let her just...
23:10I don't want to listen to his lies.
23:11If she wants to, and she doesn't, I know, but Sylve, it's not for you and me or your mum
23:16to tell her what to do with her dad.
23:18No, I know it's not.
23:19Then, well, except...
23:20But he needs to stop telling lies.
23:21But she should, she...
23:22It's an act, all this is an act.
23:23But you think that, she doesn't.
23:25It's about what this girl believes.
23:28That's it.
23:29About my daughter.
23:31That's what I am.
23:33About my daughter.
23:35How do you feel about the fact that you and Sylvia have no relationship?
23:38I don't want a relationship.
23:39You know why he doesn't want a relationship, Mr Kyle?
23:42I think it's sad.
23:43You know why I don't want a relationship?
23:44Because I've brought him here because he was questioning the parentage of my children.
23:50Because Sylvia's the only girl in the world that's had a one-night stand.
23:54You've had loads of them.
23:56So have you.
23:57You have one, you.
23:57I know, but I've paid for an old man.
23:59But did you not?
24:00There's obviously beef between you and Anna and you and Sylvia and that's not my business.
24:03Gentlemen, there wasn't any beef.
24:05There wasn't until his life came out.
24:07My business is doing that and Tony and the other Tony have to suss out their relationship.
24:11I'm going to put you two backstage with Graham.
24:13As long as my daughter's got closure now, I'm as happy as Larry.
24:16And that is the end of the part.
24:18You're right.
24:18You two go that way.
24:19You two go that way.
24:20Thank you so much for coming in.
24:23Thanks very much.
24:24Thanks, darling.
24:25See you later.
24:28There's not always an answer, but the point with that story is Tony with an I gets to know
24:33who her father is.
24:34If they have a relationship, good.
24:35If not, I'm sure they'll deal with it after the break on this stage.
24:37We meet a family at breaking point and a man, really, on his last chance.
24:42We're right back.
24:42Don't go anywhere.
24:43Because he's with you.
24:44Can we get angrily for us?
24:45No, because he's got angrily for us.
24:47Be with you.
24:48You were coaching him.
24:49Don't let me be myself.
24:50What do you say to the person who held the knife up to their throat?
24:53I was taught him I needed money for girls.
24:59Have you been accused of cheating?
25:01Do you need to prove your innocence with a lie detector?
25:05If you're 18 or over and you want to be considered for the show, text the word TALK TODAY
25:08plus your name to 63334.
25:10Text costs 25 pence plus one standard rate message.
25:13You can call my team today.
25:14It's 090111.
25:16It's 123456.
25:18Text calls cost 25 pence plus your network access charge.
25:21Or email talk at ITV.com to get in touch with one of my team.
25:34The next guest today, Dorian, is here to give his nephew, Sean, a kick up the backside and
25:39set his girlfriend, Leah, to stop leading him astray.
25:41Dorian says his distraught sister, Margaret, begged him to take Sean in.
25:45Three days after his relief from prisoners, she was scared of her own son.
25:48Dorian says that Sean's anger problem is so out of control.
25:52And actually, since he's met Leah, things have got steadily worse.
25:55He says she's a bad influence.
25:56And a wild child who just adds fuel to the fire, he wants Sean to leave Leah, open his
26:00eyes and basically say, you know what, mate?
26:02Get your head in gear before it's too late and you go back to jail or worse.
26:06Uncle Dorian is on the Jeremy Kyle show that way.
26:10APPLAUSE
26:20Welcome to the show.
26:21How are you?
26:22I'm not too bad.
26:23Everybody said that you're an amazing guy.
26:24Your sister, Margaret, has had, well, has had loads of problems with her son, Sean.
26:29Oh, definitely.
26:30And you stepped in, really.
26:32Always been angry, always gone off the rails.
26:35On a run from the police.
26:37I phoned the police up.
26:39This young man has been out of prison three weeks.
26:42He's already causing trouble.
26:43He's already held someone at knife point.
26:45Yeah, that's what he went to jail for.
26:47What he went to jail for?
26:48He was on a run.
26:49Holding somebody at knife point.
26:50Yeah.
26:51He was on a run.
26:53And when I got on my partner and I started to speak to Sean again, then I phoned the police,
27:00to be honest with you.
27:02You say I put a roof over his head, but his temper has led him to punch my walls.
27:05It has, but when he came out of jail, he was on a recall.
27:09He went back on a recall.
27:11And when he came out of jail, after doing the two years, he had nowhere to go.
27:17He couldn't go and live with his mother.
27:19Is she scared of him?
27:21Definitely.
27:21Big time.
27:22A new relationship as well.
27:24Leah, you say that she...
27:25Oh.
27:28It's not a great testament, is it?
27:31Don't go there.
27:31Why?
27:32What's wrong with Leah?
27:33She's a wild child.
27:35And what you're saying is at this moment in his life, that's the wrong influence?
27:38Yes, definitely at the moment.
27:39He needs to be told straight he's wasting his life and he's ruining ours.
27:43Yep.
27:44He causes problems all over for me.
27:46He needs to kick up the backside.
27:47Obviously, she speaks for him as well.
27:49Let's get her out.
27:50Leah's on the Jeremy Kyle Show.
27:59Are you a bad influence?
28:00No.
28:01Yes.
28:01I'm good influence.
28:02You're not.
28:03Good influence on Sean.
28:04You're not.
28:05He went to jail for holding a knife to a man's throat.
28:09Yeah.
28:09Why would you be in a relationship with a thug like that?
28:12Because I believe he can change his life around.
28:15He's there.
28:16I knew nothing about Sean for a bar from the last three weeks.
28:20So you've only known him in three weeks?
28:21Three weeks, yeah.
28:22Why on earth are you talking for him after three weeks?
28:24I ain't going to do the talking for him.
28:26He's a big man.
28:27Tell her what you think.
28:28He's punching walls.
28:30He's punching doors.
28:31Why is that airful?
28:32He's kicking off.
28:33Why is that airful?
28:33You are encouraging him.
28:35I'm encouraging him.
28:36You are really encouraging him.
28:38Yes, you are.
28:38No chance.
28:39How am I encouraging him?
28:40Because you don't care.
28:41How am I encouraging him about?
28:42If you will love that boy, right, you will turn down and say to him.
28:44I love that boy to bits.
28:45Right.
28:46Then you will leave him alone.
28:47Leave him alone.
28:48Leave him for his own head out.
28:49Right?
28:50I'll leave the pile on.
28:50Right.
28:51Fine.
28:51Walk away.
28:52Who rang this show?
28:54I did.
28:55Why didn't you if you love him so much and you know he needs help?
28:58Because he's already organised.
28:59Because he's causing trouble.
29:01He's causing trouble in the street, right?
29:03He's causing trouble between my neighbours.
29:05Right?
29:05He's causing trouble in a local shop.
29:07Why?
29:08Because he's with you.
29:09Because he's going angry.
29:09Take him off all the hell does.
29:10No, because he's going angry.
29:12Yeah, being with you.
29:13You will coger him.
29:14Right?
29:14So, I don't mean.
29:15If you love him or you say you love him.
29:17I love that.
29:17Can you do me a favour and can you do me a favour and calm down?
29:23No, you don't.
29:24I know.
29:25Hey, listen.
29:26Do you know what's really weird?
29:27Look at me.
29:29Do you know what I know?
29:30You're not going to get on great.
29:31Do you know why?
29:32I'm going to change my life, Jack.
29:34And do you know what?
29:34Do you know what none of them know?
29:39Do you know what none of them know?
29:40They don't listen to you, do they?
29:41Still shout off.
29:43Shut up, all of you.
29:45Be...
29:45Yeah, listen to me.
29:46They don't let me be myself.
29:47I know.
29:48I knew it straight away when I read.
29:49Shut up, both of you.
29:50I want to talk to them and I mean shut up.
29:53You all right?
29:54Oi.
29:55Look at me.
29:57You watch this show?
29:58Every day.
29:59So, you know I'm straight.
30:00What you've done is wrong.
30:01I know it is.
30:02But what I know about you, desperate to change.
30:06But I don't know how to.
30:07Still lash it all to me.
30:09It's not your girlfriend's responsibility.
30:10It's not your uncle's responsibility.
30:11It's yours.
30:12Do you know the worst thing you heard today?
30:13Bet you any money it makes you upset.
30:16Your mum's scared of you.
30:18I heard that the other day.
30:19That's why I phoned the show.
30:20That's horrible, isn't it?
30:21That's why I told them to get in touch with the show.
30:23I knew that.
30:24Since age 11, started taking drugs.
30:26Went down the wrong road.
30:27Age 11, cannabis.
30:2914, Valium.
30:3115, MCAT.
30:32And then 16, bit of cocaine.
30:33And they just spiralled out of control.
30:35How many times to prison?
30:37First time when I was 18.
30:39In January 2014.
30:41I come out in September.
30:43And I went back in October.
30:44What's jail like?
30:46I knew people in there, do you know what I mean?
30:47But I was hoping to change my life.
30:50But I come out and I got back in with the wrong crowd of boys.
30:53They offered you anger management in jail, weren't you?
30:55I talked to him, but he didn't help me.
30:57I had six or seven sessions and didn't help me.
31:01So you say the light came on because maybe when you had the anger management in jail,
31:06you weren't ready.
31:06Now you say you're ready.
31:07And the point at which you're ready is when you heard that your own mum's scared of you.
31:11Yeah, and because I don't want to let my uncle Dorian, do you mean?
31:13He's put a roof over my head.
31:16He's a good man, Dorian.
31:17He's like a father to me.
31:18Do you want me a favour?
31:20Because they all think you're a thug.
31:22And I'm getting softer, me older age.
31:24So you're going to come out there?
31:24You're going to shake.
31:25You're going to put your elbow.
31:26You're going to talk.
31:27You're going to do it calmly.
31:28You're going to get some positive help.
31:30But you know the score.
31:32Involved in that is putting your hands in the air and saying,
31:34well, you've gone wrong.
31:34I know.
31:35I've gone wrong.
31:36Good.
31:36Go.
31:37You'll be fine.
31:38And me.
31:39Go on.
31:39Good luck.
31:52It's not her fault.
31:54You're a good man.
31:55It's not her fault.
31:56But he is right.
31:57You need to be as firm with him as everybody else needs to be.
32:01And I've changed my life.
32:03You can't go out drinking and doing drugs.
32:04It's sent me down the wrong path.
32:06What do you want to do with your life?
32:08I want to be a rapper.
32:10I want to continue my rapping career.
32:12I want to sort my life out.
32:13I want to be a better man.
32:20They're going to say to me, you're mad to ask him this.
32:24What do you say to the person who held the knife up to their throat?
32:27I just told them I needed money for drugs.
32:29What do you tell them now?
32:31Now I feel like a disgrace for doing it.
32:35I look at myself in the mirror and I see a mistake.
32:39You're not a mistake.
32:41You're not a mistake.
32:43Listen.
32:52Can I tell you something?
32:54Do you know how much of a man it takes to go and do that and admit that,
32:58make that mistake, but sit there and admit that in front of these people?
33:11Today's about...
33:13Put your hands in the air.
33:15The one thing that you said to me that I understood was when you said to me, like,
33:19I didn't really care about anybody or anything.
33:21And then I heard my mum was scared and that's why I ran the show.
33:25I'm going to get her out of here.
33:27She's the reason you have to change, not just for her, but one of them, yeah?
33:30What's she called?
33:31Margaret.
33:32Margaret's on the Jeremy Kyle show.
33:33Give her a round of applause.
33:54Margaret, it's part of the deal here.
33:56You've got to pin back the luggles, right?
33:58Tell him how it makes you feel, truthfully.
34:00Sean, look at me.
34:02It makes me hurting all inside.
34:05It's like I'm losing my son.
34:06I'm going to find him in the gutter.
34:09Right, listen.
34:09Even what Leah said, she will leave you alone just for you to get help.
34:13I am absolutely scared...
34:15In all my...
34:16...of my own son.
34:17Even your sisters are scared of you.
34:20But I can't control it.
34:21You will.
34:22You will control it.
34:23Breathe.
34:24You will.
34:24Come on.
34:25Sort it.
34:26I promise you will sort it.
34:27You can do it.
34:29You can do it.
34:30Leah said she will leave you alone.
34:33It's my life.
34:34I love it.
34:34The best one.
34:35Leah said she will leave you alone when you get help, Sean.
34:39Look at me.
34:40Look at me.
34:41Come on.
34:42You're going to be with her?
34:44Yeah?
34:45You can't be with her.
34:46Sometimes in life you need to take a couple of steps back.
34:48Because all we're saying is...
34:49When you get the help, you have to concentrate on that for a while.
34:52Not drinking, not smoking dope, not hanging out with your bird and criticising people.
34:56Getting your nut down.
34:58Do you know what's really interesting about...
34:59I'm getting the same person before anything else.
35:00Do you know what's really interesting about this show?
35:02You know Graeme, yeah?
35:04The first thing he said to me this morning.
35:06This kid can be saved.
35:07As long as he understands what he's done wrong.
35:10Absolutely said to me this kid.
35:11I put my family for help.
35:13But I don't want to do it no more.
35:14I know that.
35:15I believe it.
35:15I wouldn't be talking to you the way I'm talking to you, would I?
35:18See, the hardest thing about doing this job is that...
35:21It's not about having a go at everybody.
35:23But there are some people like you, not like you actually, that will come out and they blame everybody.
35:28Be all about everybody else.
35:30That's not my fault.
35:31You didn't do that.
35:33I saw you there on the thing.
35:35Like that.
35:36You like that all the time.
35:37You go into the town and you're pinching walls.
35:40You cause the problems in shops and...
35:41Yeah, I drink too much.
35:44I've known him three weeks.
35:45I like a drink.
35:47Since I've known him.
35:49Since he's known you, right?
35:52You've got worse.
35:53But I've never ever seen it.
35:54I think he...
35:55I think he...
35:56You have even punched walls in my doors.
35:58But I have never seen...
35:59I think he has all of this going on.
36:01Yeah.
36:02You know what Graeme thinks he's coming and saying.
36:03And I think he has everybody there.
36:05And I think it's just pressure.
36:06Yeah, but I have never ever seen anyone punch himself.
36:08Literally punch himself.
36:10Let's get the man out who hopefully can shed some light.
36:13Graeme's on the Jeremy Carr show.
36:23You always say that whether you can help somebody or not, the first part is them...
36:29Shh, shh, shh, shh, shh.
36:30You don't?
36:31The first part is them acknowledging.
36:33Why would you say that?
36:34Because I see them as a little me.
36:36Well, you're not a little class.
36:38You've changed your life.
36:39It was my turn to try and change mine.
36:40But can you really change your life?
36:43You're all talking at him already.
36:45He doesn't know, does he?
36:46Do it, Sean.
36:47I change mine.
36:48You can do it as well.
36:49Graeme?
36:50Well, I just...
36:50You know, that surprises me, really, that comment.
36:54Do you realise how unhelpful that is?
36:57Yeah, I do.
36:58But it's trying to...
36:59To say that this is a fixed behaviour.
37:02When it really isn't.
37:03Not for him, anyway.
37:05And I can sense his frustrations because he feels he can't manage his anger.
37:11And anger is quite a healthy emotion.
37:14It's just the way he expresses it.
37:30I don't mean...
37:34I mean, he's like a dad to me, but he's full of my head.
37:36No, no, no, no.
37:37Because we were a bit surprised that he said that.
37:39Graeme, this is a very tormented young man by anybody's standards, I think.
37:43Yeah, I mean, we don't know what the root of the anger is.
37:45And that's something that we need to find out, okay?
37:48We can identify that you're an angry young man, but we don't know what the root cause of that is.
37:52And we will learn about that in due course.
37:55What I have to say is that when I read your paperwork a couple of days ago, what I read
38:01is that you had already done anger management.
38:03Yeah, and in jail, but it didn't help me.
38:05Yeah, that's one of the...
38:05My question, though, is why did that not help you?
38:09I wasn't ready.
38:10You wasn't ready?
38:11No.
38:12Okay.
38:12I didn't sign myself up for that.
38:14They gave it to me because they could see how angry I was.
38:17You're ready now?
38:18Okay.
38:18That's what I performed the show for, because I know I'm ready.
38:21I need to do it now before it's been there.
38:27Kind of like, we can repeat that process.
38:31And for me, anyway, the way that I work is I would rather put somebody into anger management so they
38:36can recognize the triggers for their anger and so they can start to manage their anger.
38:40Before I look at the root, okay?
38:43Because I need to know that when we look at the root cause of your anger, you can cope with
38:47your anger.
38:48And that's how we start.
38:49Okay.
38:52So, this is a perfect opportunity because now what you're saying is I want to focus on my anger, okay?
38:58I want to learn how to manage my anger, but never forget, you've got to look at what the root
39:03cause is.
39:03Is it a long process, G?
39:05Yes, it is.
39:06It really is.
39:06And when you look at this boy, I mean, you're right, you're always right.
39:11So annoying.
39:13Well, it is annoying, isn't it?
39:14When you look at this young man at 20, you're right, we don't know the root causes, but is it
39:18not what I said when you came out?
39:20He obviously has a family who love him.
39:23Probably a lot of the time they're at him because they want him to get changes back.
39:26I sense their frustration.
39:28Absolutely, but from his point of view, is not the acknowledgement today?
39:33Coming out here, and the catalyst was his mother being scared.
39:36That's very powerful as a starting tool, isn't it?
39:40Sometimes, you know, he's now been put in a position where he can hear from everybody about how his behaviour
39:47affects them.
39:48And I'm pretty sure you don't want your mother to be terrified of you.
39:53And if that's a motivator, let it be a motivator.
39:56I genuinely want it to be a bigger motivator for you to be, I want to change.
40:00Can I say something to you, young man, right?
40:02And we'll let you start this process and we'll ask you all to support him.
40:05I know I say this a lot.
40:08It's sort of one of those moments in your life where you're at a crossroads.
40:10I know I take the mickey out of this man, but what he does is exceptional.
40:14And what he does is he'll work with you and he'll find you the right help.
40:19And he won't abandon you.
40:21But he will abandon you if you throw it back in his face.
40:24So make sure.
40:25No, no.
40:25But make sure, because plenty say it to me, and it's what really riles me,
40:28because of how much he and his team do.
40:30Many people do throw it back.
40:31Oh, it didn't work.
40:32It didn't work in show.
40:33You weren't ready.
40:34You say you're ready now, you get your nut done, you make this work.
40:37Because do you know what's interesting about you?
40:39When all that anger goes, you're probably a nice young man.
40:41You've got a mum that loves you, an uncle that wants you to make something of your life.
40:45And you've done quite well on the woman front, haven't you, to be honest.
40:48You know what I'm saying?
40:49Yeah, I know.
40:50You've done better than she has right now.
40:51Let's be honest with you.
40:52You know what I'm saying?
40:53You know what I'm saying?
40:54I just want to make my family proud of me, do you mean?
40:56It's all I want.
40:56Start by making myself proud of yourself.
40:58All right?
40:59We're going to ask you to start that process.
41:01And listen, guys.
41:02And listen, I'm going to ask you all to leave with Graeme.
41:05He's going to start this.
41:05You have to be strong.
41:07You have to believe, you have to support, you have to understand.
41:09Is that right?
41:10I do believe in him, Jeremy.
41:11Good.
41:12He's got to believe in himself.
41:13He will do, we hope, with the right help.
41:15Listen, young man.
41:16Take the chance, all right?
41:18I mean it.
41:18Nice to meet you, Mum.
41:19Thank you, G.
41:20Go that way, all of you.
41:21Thank you very much indeed.
41:22Thanks a lot.
41:23Thanks a lot.
41:27Well, after the break on this stage, a woman desperate to save her relationship after seven long years and two
41:32kids.
41:32We're right back.
41:33Don't go anywhere.
41:35I tell him I love him, but he says I don't because I'm going to push him away with us.
41:39Because of what you went through, you've judged him, and you haven't even given him the benefit of the doubt.
41:45I'll never leave you.
41:56Thank you very much indeed.
41:57Welcome back.
41:58My next guest today, Suzanne, claims that every day she is utterly convinced that a partner of seven years and
42:03the father to their two children is going to up and leave her.
42:06And she claims that this is understandably destroying their relationship.
42:08She says she's been through some very difficult times and has struggled to let go of the past.
42:12And now she understands that she's sort of pushing the love of her life away.
42:17I like this story because I think a lot of people can relate to it.
42:20Suzanne's on the Jeremy Carl Show.
42:21Give her a round of applause.
42:29That's it.
42:29We're going to go and find her.
42:30Sorry.
42:35All right, mate.
42:36Sorry.
42:37I know.
42:37I know.
42:40First of all, I mean, I can imagine only how hard this is, but I also know that when somebody
42:45is as brave as you that makes the effort to come to the studio, that it would be a sad
42:50loss if you didn't go through with it.
42:51Happy to sit here, happy to sit outside, whatever you want.
42:54I'm happy to go outside.
42:55You sure?
42:56Yeah.
42:57Yeah?
42:58Yeah?
42:58Yeah?
42:59Yeah?
43:00Yeah?
43:00Yeah?
43:01Yeah.
43:02Yeah.
43:03Yeah.
43:04Yeah.
43:06Yeah.
43:08Thank you so much for coming.
43:09I'm Suzanne, 25.
43:11I've been in a relationship with Joe for seven years.
43:14Yeah.
43:17A traumatic experience.
43:19You've never recovered from it.
43:21No, I never have.
43:22Did you get help?
43:23No, I've never had help.
43:26This man, I guess you're going to tell me, is...
43:29The only help that I've had is Joe.
43:30That's the only person that I've had is Joe.
43:32And you're going to tell me that he is, without any shadow of a doubt, the love of your life...
43:37Yeah, he is.
43:37The best man you've ever met.
43:40And yet, because just a little switch is heading in the wrong direction, you push him away.
43:47Yeah, I do.
43:49I think you're amazing to be here.
43:51Do you tell him?
43:53I tell him I love him, but he says I don't, because I'm pushing away.
43:58What does that tell you?
43:59It shows that he is there for me.
44:01He will stay.
44:02Can I tell you something?
44:04And this sounds really harsh, and it is not in any way meant to be harsh.
44:08Because of what you went through, you've judged him, and you haven't even given him the benefit of the doubt.
44:14You haven't even given him the chance to walk away.
44:16I get entirely why you would feel like that.
44:20Try and tell him how you feel, babe.
44:21Seriously.
44:22Joe's on the Jeremy Kyle show that way.
44:24Are you all right?
44:43You're saying to her, Joe.
44:45I'll never leave you.
44:46Never.
44:47Never.
44:48You've given me two beautiful children.
44:50You've given me a life that I couldn't get nowhere else.
44:55I'm just scared, Joe.
44:57I don't, Suzanne, yeah, I don't care what's happened in your past.
45:00Yeah, what's happened.
45:01Do you know?
45:02Little bits.
45:03I know little bits, but I couldn't care.
45:08In a way, and Graham would know a lot more than me, but I think you're doing him a disservice,
45:12because if you've been with somebody that long, somebody that you love, somebody that you trust,
45:17maybe you should give him the benefit of the doubt.
45:19Not on this stage, but maybe you should tell him, because I think he'd be an absolute rock for you.
45:23I really do.
45:24Can I get Graham, actually?
45:25Is that all right?
45:25Can I get Graham on the show?
45:26Give me a round of applause, those gentlemen.
45:35Gee, these are always slightly difficult in that, because of the legalities of television,
45:39and I've always been really honest with people on this show.
45:41There are certain things that we can't talk about, because people who aren't here have
45:44to give their side, whatever.
45:45We know she's been through a traumatic experience.
45:49And it's not just about what we can talk about, it's about what you want to talk about,
45:53and you should only talk about what you feel comfortable about talking about.
45:57I pick up on what Joe said.
45:59Can I just say this to you, because I love this line.
46:01Neither of us had the best start in life, but we found each other, and we've got a great family
46:06now.
46:06And my point for bringing this was, surely we need to do all we can to make that family stay
46:11together.
46:12That's my point, really.
46:13It absolutely is, but then, when you have a child that's being traumatised, they can bring that into their adult
46:20life.
46:20It's not something that you just erase from your memory.
46:23And you bring that into your adult life, and then you find the love of your life,
46:29and then you bring it into the relationship.
46:31So it's massively important, as a couple, that you're open and honest with each other,
46:37and you share whatever you need to share with him, but only when you're ready.
46:44Can I ask you a question, Joe?
46:45Absolutely.
46:46Absolutely.
46:50Tell her how you feel.
46:53There's nothing to tell you.
46:55There's no word to tell you how much you mean to me.
46:57What do you want for the future?
46:59Just to be happy.
47:01To bring up our kids.
47:05And what he's saying to you is he loves you so much, he will be patient, OK?
47:11But you just can't believe your luck, can you?
47:14Well, why not?
47:15You're amazing.
47:15Why would you not get somebody like that?
47:18And Joe told my team, he said, our boy is starting to understand things,
47:20and it's not nice to see his mother cry so much.
47:22He asks his job all the time, Daddy, why mummy cry?
47:26You know when things bad happen to you in childhood?
47:29You may well believe about yourself that you're not lovable.
47:32OK?
47:33But that's a message you receive in childhood.
47:35It doesn't mean it's true, and that's something you have to work with sometimes.
47:39You shouldn't want your kids to be blighted by what was so badly done to you.
47:43That's why I think it absolutely has to be done right now.
47:46Don't you, Joe?
47:46Yeah.
47:47And you know what?
47:48It's because you deserve to be happy.
47:50Yeah, absolutely.
47:51OK?
47:54OK?
47:57And don't let something that happened in childhood come into your adult life and then infect your relationship.
48:04OK?
48:05You're a nice couple and you deserve to be happy.
48:06I'm going to ask all three of you to stay on the stage, but I promise you this show with
48:10Graham and his team will give you every bit of help.
48:12Give him a round of applause.
48:13Go there.
48:13All right?
48:15Good luck to them.
48:16We'll let you know I'm out of time as ever.
48:18If you'd like to be here, you need my help.
48:20Visit my website.
48:21The details are on screen now.
48:22To the guests, to the audience, and to you four.
48:24Washington at home.
48:24You know who you are.
48:25I'll see you very soon.
48:26Take care.
48:26Bye-bye.
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