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00:00as he is with the New York Post, MLB Network, Bleacher Report.
00:04He's one of the top baseball voices out there,
00:07and he joins us now live on the River Islands guest line.
00:10John Heyman with us on Willard and Dibs here on 95.7 The Game.
00:14Hey, John, what's going on today?
00:16How are you guys doing?
00:18Sorry, I'm a bad planner, so it's always either right now or not at all.
00:22Well, so are we.
00:23I appreciate, hey, the power of now, right, John?
00:28That's the way I look at it.
00:29And I just, you know, I might forget.
00:32Even if it's 20 minutes later or something like that this way,
00:35I know I'm not going to forget.
00:36I can remember for two minutes in a row.
00:39So this works better.
00:41All right, so let's freaking do this.
00:42What are the Giants and their fan base looking at here with Bryce Eldridge at age 21?
00:47What do we got?
00:49I mean, I think he's a potential star.
00:51I mean, I'm looking at him from a distance, obviously,
00:54but he seems like a very mature kid.
00:56He obviously has big-time power.
00:59He's very young.
01:00He's still 21.
01:02I mean, he came through in a very clutch moment yesterday.
01:06That was a great sign, I think.
01:09I mean, it's not just a fluke.
01:10It's not an easy thing to do.
01:12Tough ballpark, but big power.
01:14And I think they just got to play him every day and let it ride out and see what they
01:18got for now.
01:19I mean, eventually, I think he's going to be really good.
01:22But, you know, I wouldn't guarantee it immediately, but I do think they have a very good player on their
01:28hands.
01:29You mentioned tough ballpark.
01:30And while we're there, do you think they need to move in right center to make it a little less
01:34of a tough ballpark?
01:37Well, their pitchers are having trouble already, so I don't know if we need to move anything in.
01:44You know, they've played it this way for a long time.
01:46It certainly has been a detriment, I think, in maybe attracting players to sign hitters.
01:54So, look, you know, it's a beautiful ballpark, so I don't think I want to be the one to tell
02:00them how to reconfigure anything.
02:01It really is a fantastic experience, certainly from the fan perspective,
02:06and should be a better experience from the pitching perspective, but has not so far for the Giants this year.
02:12Well, John, if you're not going to reconfigure the stadium, what about the roster?
02:17Does it make sense over the long haul to have Rafi Devers and Bryce Eldridge on the same team?
02:25Yeah, I think Devers is probably, well, we've got to see how Eldridge plays, but Devers might be a tough
02:32fit.
02:32The issue now, of course, is that they were willing to give up players for him and pay that contract.
02:39I don't know that they're going to find many teams lining up at this point.
02:44Devers has done okay there, but he hasn't hit like he did in Boston.
02:49He hasn't been willing to play first base.
02:51He isn't absolutely terrible at it, but that's a lot of money for anyone to take on now, particularly with
02:57the CBA hanging over their heads.
02:59My impression from talking to others is that it would be difficult to trade in without paying down that deal.
03:05And is that a big part of what we might see at the deadline, John, the idea of the looming
03:09CBA?
03:10Whether or not it's a contract like Rafi Devers or other contracts,
03:14are teams going to be more conservative heading into this deadline, knowing what might loom?
03:20I think perhaps a little bit.
03:22I mean, normally the players that get traded are, for the most part, guys with expiring contracts,
03:29not guys with really long deals anyway.
03:31So I don't know if it's really going to really hurt the deadline,
03:36but I do think that the CBA consideration will be taken into account by most of the teams.
03:45But generally, as I said, it's going to be guys who are free agents after the year,
03:51you know, guys like certainly Scoble, Peralta, and obviously the Giants have a few guys like that as well.
04:00Right. Robbie Ray, Louisa Rice, we get that.
04:04Because things have gone so poorly, John, the idea of where the Giants are right now
04:11and what that means for Logan Webb has certainly been brought up.
04:15So this is a little bit of, I think, a couple of pieces to address.
04:19A, what do you think the Giants' willingness would be to listen on offers for Logan Webb?
04:26And with two more years on his deal, what kind of a haul could they get back?
04:32I mean, I think they'd get a good haul, right?
04:34I mean, was it 90 for five, something like that, right?
04:37That's obviously a good team-friendly deal, even with him not having one of his better years right now.
04:44I think people believe in him.
04:46You know, did the WBC affect him a little bit?
04:49I'm not sure.
04:50But I do think you should be able to get quite a bit if you do entertain offers.
04:55And I'm in the position they're in now.
04:57They probably should at least entertain offers.
05:00Tough to trade a top-of-the-rotation starter under any circumstance, though,
05:05particularly with years to go.
05:06We don't see those kind of pitchers traded very often.
05:10But I would say, listen, yes, definitely.
05:14The deadline still is almost two months away,
05:17yet the Giants are in a spot where they might want to trade early as opposed to waiting until then.
05:22And do you see a market earlier in the season right now based on how many teams that are still
05:27competitive?
05:30Yeah, I mean, we always talk about that.
05:32But it's very rare that you see star players traded in June at any time.
05:38And then we've still got almost three weeks to go in June.
05:41So, you know, in the end, 90% of the trades are done that last week, probably even more than
05:50that.
05:51And, you know, probably 80% of them are done the last three days.
05:55And that's just the way it generally is.
05:57Teams want to wait and see where they stand.
06:00I mean, there are only a couple teams that I think are clear sellers at this point.
06:05The Rockies might be one of them.
06:06I wouldn't put the Giants in that category yet.
06:09So, you know, if I'm them, I still got to wait at least another three, four weeks
06:14before really seriously considering selling anyone.
06:19That's just my thought on that.
06:21But, you know, you never know.
06:24The trade deadline with somebody might come up with.
06:26But I would wait if I'm them.
06:29I know it's a very disappointing season, but things turn around, you know.
06:34I mean, look, the Braves had a losing record in August in 2021 and ended up winning the World Series.
06:41So, you know, it's still, you know, still got 58% of the season to go.
06:47So that's a lot.
06:49John Heyman is with us here on Withered and Dibs 95-7, the game.
06:53John, what is the inside baseball kind of word on the street with regard to the Tony Vitello
07:00experiment that the Giants are doing?
07:02What are people saying?
07:05Yeah, I think experiment is a good word.
07:07You know, we'll see.
07:09It's probably too early to judge.
07:10And I am at a distance, so it's a little unfair.
07:14I mean, I didn't love right at the beginning where he was first day of spring training upset
07:21that somebody had written that he was going to take the job before he officially took the job.
07:26Well, you know what?
07:26They were right in that story.
07:28So, you know, maybe he hadn't told his friends yet.
07:32I don't know.
07:32I thought that was silly.
07:35You know, but that's, you know, you're going to get a couple of things that you wouldn't
07:40see from an experienced manager.
07:43But I think generally that's the way it's going these days, right?
07:46The guys who were hired, Stammen in San Diego, but even the guys who were hired, maybe Albernaz
07:55and others who were in Baltimore, they were not major league managers.
08:00They don't have major league experience.
08:01So, he's in the majority of guys who were hired, and that's the way things are going.
08:07Now, obviously, he was a great college coach.
08:11That's a little bit more of a gamble than some of the others.
08:15They were maybe major league managers.
08:18So, I'm going to give it more time.
08:21Obviously, they haven't won a lot.
08:23And, you know, I see a couple of funky things here and there, but I can't necessarily say
08:28they're bad things.
08:29It's a little different.
08:30I'll say that from a distance anyway.
08:32Is it less of a risk now based on what managers are?
08:36It seemed like back in the day, you know, our day, managers had much more of an impact
08:40on what goes on, and now it's analytics and more voices.
08:43Does that kind of mitigate the risk a little bit for the Giants?
08:48Yeah, I think so.
08:49I think it does.
08:50The manager is still really the face of the franchise and really the spokesman for the
08:56franchise at most times.
08:58And, you know, that I think is a key role for managers now.
09:03It certainly has changed.
09:04I do think that the front office has generally, in most places, has a much bigger role, as you
09:10said, than in the past.
09:12So, yeah, it certainly is different, and I'm normally not opposed to outside the box, and
09:20this is too early to judge, so I'm not going to judge on 60, 70 games.
09:25We're going to at least give it a full year to see how things play out.
09:28But, you know, it is a gamble to take a guy out of college, even a great college coach that
09:36really is quite outside the box, which is why it's really never been done before.
09:43I mean, we had guys come out of college, but they had professional experience as well.
09:47So, John, if it's, you know, half a season is too early on, Tony, what about a season
09:52and a half on Buster?
09:54And obviously, the headlines are Adamus, the Devers trade, and then, you know, the handling
10:00of bringing up Bryce Eldridge.
10:03And certainly, people are looking at it right now going, man, you did not have a closer.
10:07You did not have this bullpen ready.
10:09He's also a Bay Area legend.
10:11We get that.
10:12So, what's kind of the thought process in the way you view Buster Posey and the job he's
10:17doing right now?
10:20You know, I'll say this, though, all the guys who were GMs or who are now baseball presidents,
10:25they get more than a year and a half.
10:27You know, nobody only gets a year and a half.
10:30He obviously took a few big hits there.
10:35He tried with Devers.
10:37And, you know, at the time, I certainly liked it from the Boston perspective.
10:41And I said to myself, well, you know what, they've had trouble getting the big stars.
10:45I don't need to go over the litany of big stars that they try to get.
10:49They were hitters who didn't go there.
10:51And, you know, and they have been able to convince him to play first base.
10:57But, you know, I thought that was a lot of money for what was going on in Boston with
11:03him not being willing to play first base there.
11:06You know, I mean, I wouldn't judge a guy on two or three moves, particularly a legend,
11:12as you said, and obviously a very smart guy.
11:15So I think we've got to give him more time to see how things go.
11:20But, you know, obviously the pitching overall seems to be short.
11:23I know that it went points to the bullpen, but overall the rotation has not been great either.
11:30I don't think – I mean, I'm not there.
11:32You guys are there.
11:32But, you know, he tried guys who are, you know, not the top-of-the-line guys.
11:38Malley has been a good pitcher, but a guy who's had some injuries in the past.
11:43Hauser had a good year last year, but before that was kind of a fringy Major League starter.
11:51But they obviously didn't spend big, and it's hard to build a great rotation on the dime.
11:59It really is.
11:59So I give him more time, see how it goes.
12:03You know, I don't think there's been any real disastrous moves,
12:08but I would say that the Devers move is looking like a negative at this point overall.
12:13John Heyman here on 95.7 The Game.
12:14You nailed the pitching synopsis from afar.
12:17That was awesome.
12:18One thing that Buster seemed to have done right is Luis Arise, yet with an expiring deal,
12:24he might be somebody who gets dealt at the deadline.
12:26What kind of a market is there for Luis Arise?
12:30Yeah, Arise has been great defensively, and I don't know if it's from Washington or whatever,
12:37but he's obviously turned himself into a very good second baseman.
12:41And personally, I think he's valuable as a guy who puts his bat on the ball consistently.
12:47There aren't guys like that, and I think it's a big value to a team to have somebody like that,
12:54rather than just have a bunch of all-or-nothing guys.
12:56And I think he should have good value.
13:00Now, he's proven himself at second base.
13:02I don't know that he's proven at the other positions,
13:06but you're going to need to find teams that need a second baseman,
13:10which is a particular, specific thing.
13:14And there probably will be a few other second basemen on the market.
13:18Gleyber Torres could be out there.
13:20I think there are a couple others that might hit the trade market as well.
13:23That could affect things.
13:24So I'm not looking windfall for that.
13:27I do think that Logan Webb would be the big one for the Giants if they did that trade.
13:33And I think you'd get something for Ray, although Ray's salary is high.
13:37I would say a rise in Ray.
13:40You could get something okay, but nothing to really make over the team,
13:45which is part of the reason I think they wait and see what goes on with the team.
13:49I don't think they're getting anything great for anybody other than Webb.
13:54John, if you had to bet on next season starting on time or not, what's your bet?
14:01Not on time, but I do think it'll be starting.
14:04I don't think they're going to wipe out the season.
14:06That's just a guess.
14:07The lockout seems to be a fait accompli at this point.
14:10Does that mean we're going to miss games?
14:12No, not necessarily.
14:14I do think the way things have started out, you know, a delay is probably likely.
14:21You know, things are really slow.
14:23Neither side made a good offer, quote-unquote good offer.
14:27I mean, you know, and the players' side, whatever they talked about their offer,
14:33they talked about how great it was for the players.
14:35Well, I mean, do they have to convince their own players that these are good offers?
14:39I guess maybe they do because last time, you know, their executive council,
14:46whatever they call the eight-lead-based player negotiators, said,
14:50don't do this deal, and the rank-and-file did do the deal.
14:53So maybe they feel like they have to tell their own players whether it's a good deal
14:57or not for the players.
14:58But, I mean, obviously that's their goal is to get a good deal for the players.
15:02And it really is a ridiculously good deal, not even worth considering if you're the owners.
15:09And the same thing for the owners.
15:11You've got a team with a $400 million payroll, and you're suggesting that $245 million be the cap.
15:17I mean, from the players' perspective, and I get it, they don't think there should be a cap at all.
15:22The things are going well in baseball.
15:25Revenues are up.
15:27The World Series was great.
15:29The WBC was great.
15:31The attendance is good.
15:33So I get it.
15:34And if you're going to have a cap, it's got to be something closer to reality
15:38that a $150 million cut for the big and spending team is no way, no how.
15:45The union is touching anything close to that, if they even consider a cap,
15:50which they've said they won't.
15:52John, the power of now.
15:54So glad that you had some time to hop on with us.
15:57Thank you very much for doing it.
16:00All right.
16:00Great talking to you guys.
16:02Good luck.
16:03Yep.
16:03Thanks so much.
16:04John Heyman.
16:05Let's see if I have that all right.
16:06New York Post.
16:07Yep.
16:08Bleacher Report.
16:09MLB Network.
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