- 6 months ago
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00:00I wanted to get to this before we leave today, and I'm sure it'll come up throughout the rest
00:06of the week and, quite frankly, throughout the rest of the summer. But you and I had some very
00:12healthy debates last week with regard to simply the idea of whether or not it's smart to have
00:20Jonathan Kaminga on the Warriors this year. Not meaning like what you think of Jonathan
00:26as a player, but based on where we've arrived, which is Jonathan clearly doesn't want to be on
00:32the team, and the team has openly had trade discussions and sign and trade things, and he
00:37wants playing time, and they're not going to give it to him, and starting spots, all of the dynamics
00:42you know. Like, is it recoverable to have him be on the team and be a productive member of the team
00:50and not cause problems and make waves and all of that? So, very relevant to us that Tim
00:56Kawakami reported yesterday morning that the plan is for Jonathan to be on the team.
01:04Sign and trade talks are off, and Jonathan will be on the team. And so I have two things
01:10to say about it, and the first one is a question. Do you buy that? Sign and trade talks are off.
01:17For now, sure. For now. Right. How long is now? Now is until Sacramento calls and says,
01:26Malik Monk and an unprotected first. How you feel now, Mike Dunleavy? And he says,
01:32hold on, let me call the third team that I need to get involved. Hey, you guys still want
01:37Buddy Heald for a couple of seconds to Sacramento? Cool. All right.
01:41Now, Tim and also Sam Amick, who has been writing about this a lot, point out that what you just said
01:50is actually also part of the holdup. It's not just about making that first rounder unprotected.
01:56The Warriors state they do not want to give up Buddy Heald or Moses Moody. They don't want to do that.
02:02Well, I don't know how they go about doing that unless Sacramento wants to sign him to a bigger number
02:08than what they have reportedly been interested in signing.
02:12Maybe the Warriors would like an unprotected first, but they're actually not that interested
02:16in Malik Monk. That's possible.
02:18Maybe they would actually like a lesser player and a better pick and then keep their guys.
02:25It sounds to me like that's what the Warriors want.
02:28And that's fair. And so you asked me if I think that a sign and trade is off the table.
02:33I do for now, because what I've said all along seems to be the way that they're approaching it,
02:39which is we're not just going to take pennies on the dollar.
02:42We're only going to take an offer that we really, really like.
02:46And all the reports have been that offer that they really, really like involves an unprotected
02:50first round pick. And like you're saying, something that can help them.
02:55So I think that they've reached a point with Sacramento.
02:59I don't think Phoenix is even in the conversation because they don't have any picks.
03:02So if the Kings aren't willing to, you know, oblige, which is Keegan Murray,
03:09or Keon Ellis, or, you know, who knows what the Warriors would really want.
03:14No, I think they don't. These are all, those players are all too, I mean,
03:17I know those are lower priced players.
03:18Keegan is, yeah.
03:19Yeah.
03:20But you'd have to pay him because he's in the final year of his deal.
03:23Yeah.
03:24Yeah.
03:24So I think that for now, the sign and trade is off the table because I think that the
03:30Warriors and Kings have reached a point where they probably aren't getting any closer
03:35and the Warriors are using this as leverage to Kaminga.
03:38It's so funny. I think that's a fair assessment of it. I don't think that the sign and trade
03:44is off the table. I always look at these things one of two ways. One of two ways. First of
03:48all, you know this because I bring it up all the time. Why are we being told that? Why
03:55do we need to know that the sign and trade is off the table? Why are Sam Amick and Tim
03:58Kawakami being told that by the Warriors?
04:00Because the Warriors want to send a message to Kaminga that it's either you take the qualifying
04:06offer or you take our deal. And if not, then we're chilling.
04:11So, A, that's the one that I think everybody gathers. This is a leverage situation. It's
04:16part of a negotiation. So, no, I do not think a sign and trade is off the table.
04:21Here's the other thing that I always look at, though. When a report comes out and then the
04:26team does something that's the exact opposite, how embarrassing is that? Are they able to
04:32talk their way out of the paper bag? Look, Jordan Poole, he's going to be on this team for
04:37a long time. And, poof, now he's a wizard. Well, why'd that happen? And can you have a
04:43press conference and not sound like a fool? Now, first of all, with this particular report,
04:48the Warriors have not said anything out loud themselves. They're having other people do the
04:53talking for them. So, that helps. But, even if they were to own the statement, yeah, we said
04:58sign and trade talks are off, but then suddenly we pulled off a sign and trade. Would that be
05:04embarrassing? Would Dunleavy be able to have that press conference? What would he say? I would argue
05:09he would be like, well, yeah, we love Jonathan. We wanted Jonathan on this team. But, it arrived at a
05:17spot where somebody was finally able to do, offer us something that we believe really helps this team
05:23in the future. And, we also wanted to, of course, you know, hear Jonathan's needs. And, we really feel
05:32strongly that Jonathan feels strongly about this. And, so, you know, it's almost kind of against our
05:39wishes. But, we're going to do it. Yeah. For Johnny. For Johnny. We're doing it for Johnny. We're doing it for Johnny.
05:45And, they never did say, to their point, that it was off the table. No. That's just reported. Right.
05:50So, it's not a full backtrack, a full backpedal. And, that's where, you know, Kaminga has never
05:56said, I won't play for the Warriors. Correct. He's made it clear that he'd rather not. I mean,
06:03do you want to play somewhere else? I do. No, no, I do. I do. I do. Yeah. I mean. Would you play for the Warriors?
06:09Like, how would you feel? Yeah. I would. Here's the other thing, though. The third maybe reason
06:17that I really can't see sign and trade talks as off the table. And, you know, I feel this. And,
06:22I know you disagree with me. But, I just think you're playing with tremendous fire having Jonathan
06:27on the team this year. I don't think that you can navigate that. I don't think that that's going
06:32to go well. I think that he's going to be very upset. And, I think that you are, in that scenario,
06:39treating him like such an asset. Where the whole world knows that you signed him literally to still
06:44not keep him. Like, you're trying to sign him so that you can trade him later. And, maximize his
06:50value. And, the world will view that. And, they already do. They will view the Warriors as messing
06:56with Jonathan's future. Messing with his career. It's a terrible look. And, I think sets the locker
07:04room dynamic off in a very bad space. And, if you're of the opinion that it's like, yeah,
07:08but, Mark, you're going to need him this year. Yeah, but, will you have him? I know that it
07:12quote-unquote worked against Minnesota in the playoffs. But, at what point does Jonathan just go,
07:19no. I'm not your wind-up 30-minute doll that you just get to use three times a month. Like,
07:28when does he do that? I think you're playing with tremendous fire. And, I would, with every
07:33fiber of my being, suggest against it, if at all possible. Yeah, if at all possible. Yes.
07:39But, it doesn't mean that you're going to take a crap deal just because you're afraid of the
07:44nuclear option. There will be a deal. This is where you and I disagree about the ability to make it work
07:52between the two sides. Because, I do believe, if Kaminga gets to a spot where there is no sign
07:59and trade, and he doesn't want to play on the qualifying offer, or maybe he does. He's going
08:03to bet on himself. He realizes that the best way for him to get what he wants, which is to play
08:10elsewhere, he can control that, and to get a lot of money, that is harder to control. But, the best
08:16way for him to go about that would be to play with the right attitude, the right effort, and be a good
08:23soldier one more time, and try to make it so that in the off-season next year, when more teams have
08:30more money, his value would be higher than if he goes into sulk, pout, or meme mode. Oh, and it's not,
08:36I'm not even just looking at him. I'm looking at the Warriors, too. It's not just about sulking,
08:40or meme mode, or whatever. But, I think that they need him. They need him. They need somebody to play
08:45minutes. I know you think that they do. I know you think that they do, and I know a lot of people
08:49agree with you, and even if I agreed with you that you need him, I don't think that the person you
08:55actually need is not him. Like, he clearly doesn't do what you, whoever that human is that you want to
09:02play those minutes, you want them to play a certain way, and he's not doing that, and he wants to play
09:07a certain way, and you're not letting him do that, and all those things that we already know.
09:11And here's the biggest concern. It's not even necessarily about those minutes.
09:15It's about the whole framework of the locker room, the time they spend together. I want to play for
09:22you something from our show a few weeks ago. Do you remember when Monty Poole, and actually,
09:28was Dibs out that day? No, he was driving to Tahoe. You were here. That's right. It was right before
09:32you left, right? Okay. Monty Poole's driving to Tahoe, and he had what we thought was an interesting
09:40point as to why the Warriors did not sign DeAndre Ayton as an available big man, because they need
09:47a big man. But they didn't sign him, and Monty's read on why they didn't sign Ayton was different.
09:56Take a listen.
09:57So I asked around Sunday and Monday, and talked to three people that I talked to, one other person
10:04I talked to indirectly, and my question was, did the Warriors show any interest in DeAndre Ayton,
10:09because he takes a lot of boxes? And they all said, no. And I thought, I mean, I would make
10:14him something he knows. He's seven feet tall. He can shoot it. Does he come with red flags?
10:18He does. But the Warriors have never been afraid of that. Remember? I mean, they brought in
10:22Jabail McGee when nobody else wanted him. He didn't sign with the Warriors until, I think,
10:26September of that year. They brought in a guy like Nick Young, who was considered a certified
10:32slacker. They brought in Nick Young. Everybody's like, why would they do that? Well, they won two
10:35championships with Jabail McGee. They won a championship with Nick Young. They brought in
10:38DeMarcus Cousins. When people were saying, oh, he's a headache. He's this, he's that.
10:42They made it to the finals with DeMarcus Cousins on the roster, knowing he would miss out the year,
10:46made it to the finals, and probably would win, if not for the injuries to Kevin Durant and
10:50Klay Thompson. Even Andrew Wiggins. There were some questions about that move. And the Warriors
10:54have always been firm in saying that we trust our culture. We trust our culture. So DeAndre Ayton,
10:59I don't understand why they wouldn't at least, as they say, kick the tires.
11:02So Monty is suggesting that the Warriors might be questioning the current status of their own
11:08culture. And that's why they wouldn't go after DeAndre Ayton. And if you are questioning,
11:13I don't know that Monty's right, but it's an interesting thought. And if there's anything
11:17to it, and you are questioning the current status of your own culture and its effectiveness in this
11:23moment, you're going to do this? You're going to literally take the lead story of the entire NBA
11:29offseason as it moves into August and September, and have Jonathan Kaminga, who's flying reporters
11:35to Cleveland, to tell him how badly he wants to get the hell away from this organization.
11:41You're just going to have him on your team. And everything's going to work out because
11:46we're the Warriors. Well, I don't know if... I don't see it. I didn't hear him making reference
11:52to the Kaminga situation about culture. No, not at all. Just culture. And DeAndre Ayton's an outsider,
11:56and Kaminga's somebody that they know. They've had him here for four years. And I would just rely
12:02on Kaminga's professionalism and his need to be professional. And also, what you have here in
12:09Steph Curry and Draymond and Jimmy to a lesser extent, because he's relatively new, but Steve Kerr.
12:14And if you get to a spot where Dunleavy knocks on Kerr's door in late September and says,
12:20you know, we're at the end here. And, you know, JK, he's coming back. And I just looked,
12:26and it's the end of September when teams will report. And so, you've got about seven more
12:30weeks to resolve this, most likely. And if it comes down to that, I think that they can
12:36make it, maybe not thrive and be the best thing ever, but they can make it work. I have
12:40no doubt.
12:41Monty wrote a whole article about it the next day, as it turns out. Wrote a whole article
12:46about it. About the idea that he, and again, this is just Monty's perspective, though very
12:52tapped in, that he kind of got the sense the Warriors had less confidence in their culture
12:59than they have in the past. So I find it to be an odd time to then take on this project
13:05if Monty's on to something. So this is, you know, just another perspective. But, wow, I
13:13am so skeptical of the idea that this, and it's not even about Jonathan being on the team. I've
13:20never had an issue with Jonathan being on the team. But where we've arrived now, the idea that
13:25this is going to play out well, I mean, I hear you. I really do. You got more faith in it than I do.
13:33That's for sure.
13:33Yep. And I think about the lesser of two evils. And if I'm in the front office for the Warriors,
13:38and the owner reportedly really, really likes Kaminga. So I think that that's a piece of
13:44it where, you know, if the owner doesn't want to part with Kaminga, then the edict might
13:49be to Dunleavy and Kerr, hey guys, we're keeping him, make it work. And then it becomes, you
13:55know, maybe another divide in the front office.
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