Massimo Bossetti | Belve Crime 2025 [HQ] - Video Dailymotion

DivinumCrime

L'intervista di Francesca Fagnani a Massimo Bossetti, detenuto nel carcere di Bollate per scontare l'ergastolo per l'omicidio di Yara Gambirasio  #BelveCrime #Bossetti #YaraGambirasio #Belve #Crime #TrueCrime #Delitti #Misteri #Killer #SerialKiller #ColdCase #Cronaca #CronacaNera #Mistero #Delitto #Documentari #Documentario #Docu #Doc #DivinumCrime

Transcript

00:00:00The next guest is at the center of one of the most dramatic and media-heavy cases ever, the murder of Iara

00:00:07Gambirasio.

00:00:08It is the unknown one who after years of investigation has been given a face and a name, Massimo Bossetti.

00:00:15And we went to interview him in the Bollate prison, but first we retraced the events with Stefano Nazzi.

00:00:23Brembat is upstairs, November 26, 2010. A 13-year-old girl, Iara Gambirasio, leaves her house to go to the

00:00:32sports center, where she does rhythmic gymnastics.

00:00:36He arrives at the center, stays there for about an hour and ten minutes, then leaves and disappears.

00:00:43It was found exactly three months later on February 26, 2011.

00:00:48His body is in a field in Chignolo d'Isola, not far from Brembate.

00:00:55He has stab wounds to his neck and other parts of his body.

00:01:00She died of cold and weakness resulting from the attack.

00:01:06Male DNA was found on the girl's clothes.

00:01:11It is found as DNA from an unknown person.

00:01:15DNA is being sampled from thousands of people living in the area.

00:01:21This is a scientific investigation of enormous proportions.

00:01:25Eventually, the DNA of a person is found that matches the DNA of an unknown person.

00:01:32But it is a partial correspondence.

00:01:35Neither that man nor his two brothers are unknown to one another.

00:01:39The investigators' supposition is that the father of those men, Giuseppe Guerinoni, who had been dead for some time,

00:01:48had a child out of wedlock.

00:01:51After much research, this is how we arrived at Massimo Bossetti.

00:01:57He has always maintained his innocence.

00:02:08Massimo Giuseppe Bossetti, good evening and thank you for accepting this interview.

00:02:14Thank you.

00:02:15On October 12, 2018, at the third level of judgment, the Court of Cassation confirmed his life sentence.

00:02:24So you've been in prison for 11 years?

00:02:26June 16th yes.

00:02:27How are you?

00:02:30I survive.

00:02:31I survive the injustice I am forced to experience.

00:02:36After the sentence, Chiara's parents, who, it must be said, remained silent almost the whole time,

00:02:43They said no one will give us Chiara back, but at least now we know who did it.

00:02:48Can she understand them?

00:02:50Yes, a parent's pain at the loss of a child is unquantifiable, it is tremendous.

00:02:56They are destined to drag it along until the end of their days.

00:03:02I mean, when you hear that justice is done, you understand that, right?

00:03:07The justice they deserve is not being done, as it should have been, in my opinion,

00:03:17retrace different paths.

00:03:20You have always professed your innocence and now, let's say, we'll go over all the points again during the interview.

00:03:26A few years ago, Libero wrote about her

00:03:30Bossetti is a model prisoner, an invisible man who doesn't want trouble and doesn't give his trust.

00:03:34If he has a hell inside him, he hides it well.

00:03:39To hell within himself?

00:03:40Absolutely not.

00:03:42No, why? Don't you feel like hell?

00:03:44No, because I don't feel it's being attributed to me. Since I didn't commit it, I don't feel it's being attributed to me.

00:03:49So, is she okay inside?

00:03:51I'm calm.

00:03:53Fiorenza Sarzanini, in the Corriere della Sera, wrote

00:03:55In this investigation, a monster was not created, a person was not taken and then they looked for

00:04:01the evidence.

00:04:02The opposite happened, meaning that we didn't start from her, but we ended up there, right?

00:04:08Despite this, do you feel labeled a monster?

00:04:12Absolutely yes, even if I were to be acquitted, I hope so, one fine day,

00:04:17if I have always labeled him for this defamatory and shameful accusation.

00:04:21It's normal, it's like it's a tattoo printed on your head that you drag around until the end of your days.

00:04:29days.

00:04:29During the trial in court you said I'm an ignoramus, I'm not a murderer, what did you mean?

00:04:37The judges can define me as they like, but what is certain is that I don't think so.

00:04:44he is a murderer.

00:04:45So, did she mean, maybe I'm a simple person?

00:04:48I am a person of habit, simple, normal.

00:04:51Without any worries?

00:04:53No, the classic ordinary, normal person, who has always gone about his or her daily life.

00:04:57Which are two things that, let's say, can go together even if you want, that is, in the sense that it's not a no.

00:05:02No.

00:05:03The investigators who arrested her described her as cold, impassive, at times icy.

00:05:09They're right, she's a bit cold, glacial?

00:05:12It depends on the topics.

00:05:15Do you recognize the fact that you were impassive, cold?

00:05:18I don't think so, no. I'm an open man with everyone. I have nothing to hide, nothing to fear, nothing,

00:05:23No.

00:05:24They said I'm evil, satanic, with a split personality.

00:05:28All accusations that anyone who knows me knows are far-fetched.

00:05:31I was, exactly, I was described like that, by the investigators, by just about everyone, but...

00:05:38Evil, satirical.

00:05:39No, they don't belong to any of them, absolutely not.

00:05:42In the Corriere they wrote about the alleged monster and the normal man, the murderer for the prosecution and the neighbor of

00:05:49home with calluses on his hands, wife and children.

00:05:51Massimo Bossetti is an enigma, because he is so close and yet so distant from everyone.

00:05:57Are they somewhat right, are you still perceived as an enigma?

00:06:02Yes, yes, I feel that too.

00:06:07But why is it?

00:06:09No, the problem is that we are perceived that way.

00:06:13Always on this point, on the fact that he is perceived as an enigmatic man, Luca Telese, in Libero, wrote:

00:06:20Massimo Bossetti has once again given substance to his enigma, to the two irreconcilable characters,

00:06:26that inhabit his body like ghosts.

00:06:28On one side Massi, loving father, faithful husband, upright, on the other the fable, drawn by the prosecution,

00:06:35a troubled fifty-year-old who is frustrated, sexually perverse, violent and a liar.

00:06:40Of course, I can't ask you who the real Bossetti is, but I want to ask you if you find it understandable

00:06:48that a certain duplicity is perceived about her, let's say?

00:06:53No.

00:06:54But is there a perceived duplicity?

00:06:56It is perceived, it is normal, yes.

00:06:57Why does it say normal?

00:06:59But it's normal because when you are judged for this shameful, defamatory accusation, it's normal that you are judged this way.

00:07:09What is your relationship with the truth?

00:07:14Normal.

00:07:15What does normal mean?

00:07:17I have always defended myself, fighting, struggling, energetically, with my only weapon, the truth.

00:07:23Okay, but there is no truth possible for those who don't want to listen.

00:07:27But look, this is a question that was independent, let's say, of the crime he is accused of, right?

00:07:32That is, what I want to ask you is whether you, generally, regardless of the crime for which you are here,

00:07:37Is he a man who has always been sincere or has he also been a bit of a liar?

00:07:43No, half and half.

00:07:45Ah, here it is.

00:07:45Who doesn't tell lies.

00:07:48Because on the construction site he was even nicknamed Favola.

00:07:51Yes.

00:07:52Precisely because of a certain trend.

00:07:54But for what reason?

00:07:55To lie or to exaggerate things a little?

00:07:59No, then, in the construction site where I found myself, precisely, in Seriate, I was called that.

00:08:06Why?

00:08:07Because I often missed that construction site, I admit, saying I had brain tumors.

00:08:16Ok, but why did I make up this terrible lie?

00:08:20Because, unfortunately, I hadn't paid them for four months.

00:08:25So she had to go work somewhere else.

00:08:28But, well, beyond the reasons, right?

00:08:31It was the only plausible excuse I could come up with to take time off so I wouldn't get stuck with a contract.

00:08:36Besides, if he was right, he could have been absent without being paid.

00:08:39But beyond that, saying you have a brain tumor is not a lie.

00:08:44light, it's a very heavy thing.

00:08:45No, it's very heavy, yes.

00:08:47But at that moment that thing came to mind.

00:08:50Then, during the investigations, it emerges that a couple of times a week, she went to do some

00:08:57lamps,

00:08:58and then it emerges because, let's say, this static sector was close to the Gambirasio house,

00:09:02she against all evidence, why did she then deny it, and why did she hide it from her wife?

00:09:08Why had he hidden such a trivial fact?

00:09:10Absolutely yes, it's true.

00:09:12It was two or three times a month, yes or no.

00:09:15But because it didn't seem right to me to reiterate to my wife,

00:09:19since there were already economic problems to manage a bit of everything.

00:09:23And then, to do so, to not spread that thing, to not bring it to my wife's attention,

00:09:31I always denied it for her.

00:09:33But then when the truth came out, right?

00:09:36And that therefore, let's say, could also become a clue against him,

00:09:40why did she insist on denying it?

00:09:43In a sense, it seemed he was more afraid of his wife than of the idea the investigators would form.

00:09:48And the castle that maybe they could have built on top of it.

00:09:52Well, but, I mean, at that point it was clear, you understood what I mean, I mean, she was going against the evidence,

00:09:57because she went there.

00:09:59Yes, I've always denied it to my wife, that's true, I stand by it.

00:10:02But do you think that, let's say, overall, right?

00:10:04Then, obviously, there are many other elements against him.

00:10:06But overall, a certain tendency to say,

00:10:08Lies, did they have any weight in his conviction?

00:10:12Yes, it had an influence.

00:10:14Huh?

00:10:15Yes.

00:10:16Have you always been very careful about your appearance and physique?

00:10:21Has he always cared, has he always taken great care of himself?

00:10:24I like to hold on.

00:10:25Even now, does it continue?

00:10:26Yes, absolutely yes.

00:10:27Look, listen, it's obvious, it's known that there is a procedural truth about you, established by three levels of judgment,

00:10:38and yet there is a whole section of public opinion that thinks differently, right?

00:10:42Do you still receive many letters in prison?

00:10:45Yes.

00:10:45Or less?

00:10:46Letters, emails, everything and more, yes.

00:10:49Still like before, like at the beginning?

00:10:50Eh, they've increased.

00:10:51Yes?

00:10:53After the release of Neffi's docu-series, they have increased significantly.

00:10:56And what do they write to her?

00:10:59Encouragement, above all, support, support, be strong.

00:11:04And what does she answer?

00:11:06I answer the...

00:11:08Does she... answer that much?

00:11:10Yes, yes.

00:11:12What I'm interested in answering is yes.

00:11:15Listen, a significant part of the press also intervened in your favor, right?

00:11:18But in the end, only the sentences count, right?

00:11:22And not public opinion, nor the newspapers,

00:11:24Do you think that, let's say, this hype has had a positive or negative impact?

00:11:33Assuming that the...

00:11:34I believe that sentences should be respected, but they can also be questioned.

00:11:38Did it have an impact?

00:11:39Half-half, let's say.

00:11:40But is the hype about him positive or negative?

00:11:43Positive.

00:11:45Well, but they gave him three gassers, there.

00:11:47Positive for her?

00:11:48Positive to see the...

00:11:52But she had hoped inwardly that public opinion and the media,

00:11:59the part that, let's say, were supporting his innocence,

00:12:03did they influence the judges in any way?

00:12:05Did you hope for it?

00:12:06Absolutely yes.

00:12:08But it would be quite dangerous if the judges were influenced, wouldn't it?

00:12:13Well, unfortunately it's unpleasant to say, but public opinion greatly influences the judgment of lay judges and the President.

00:12:23But that was evidently not the case with him.

00:12:25That wasn't my case.

00:12:26Eh.

00:12:27Anyway, always a good thing in general, I say that they don't let themselves be influenced.

00:12:30She said, an innocent person is not allowed to break down, it will still be hard for me.

00:12:36It's been eleven years, so how are you holding up?

00:12:42My anger turned into strength.

00:12:45And the strength is fueled daily by the love of my family, my children,

00:12:50the people who are close to me, who have never abandoned me,

00:12:53and there I manage to survive my daily injustice.

00:12:57But what if someone is innocent, right? And they're convicted, right?

00:13:00And sometimes in prison, don't you go crazy?

00:13:03You go crazy, yes.

00:13:04Well, but not to her, I mean, she resists.

00:13:06We must not get caught up in the context, in the bars that call us daily,

00:13:14but to find all the possible opportunities that the context offers us to not think.

00:13:20After the verdict, his wife and husband cried desperately, right?

00:13:25Tears just burst out.

00:13:27Because he didn't expect it or because he thought inside himself that she was guilty?

00:13:32No, because he didn't expect it.

00:13:35I remember I was down in isolation,

00:13:39in solitary confinement, 15 hours in the Council Chamber.

00:13:42I mean, I immediately thought, those 15 hours here,

00:13:45there must have been one...

00:13:49something happened in the Council Chamber,

00:13:51in the sense that all the judges were not in favor,

00:13:54but in the end the opposite happened, what we expected, what we expected.

00:14:02It's obvious that you've always maintained your innocence, despite heavy evidence against you, right?

00:14:08We'll talk about it later, we'll go into detail, but above all the DNA found on Iara.

00:14:14But before I go back, can I ask you if it's possible that it was triggered,

00:14:22If it's likely that a process of repression of what he did has been triggered, do you understand what I mean?

00:14:30Absolutely not.

00:14:31Of an event that is unacceptable even to itself?

00:14:33No, no, no, no, in my case no, the person that I am is impossible, it just doesn't exist.

00:14:40But then excuse me for a moment...

00:14:42No, I'm asking, if you know...

00:14:43That is, have there been such cases?

00:14:44What could a forty-year-old possibly have with a teenager?

00:14:50A little girl, a 3 year old girl, could very well have been my daughter,

00:14:53daughter of anyone, of all of us.

00:14:55Well, I know, but unfortunately certain real individuals exist...

00:14:58But why should we attack a poor little girl?

00:15:00The reason, the why.

00:15:02No, in my case it absolutely doesn't apply, absolutely not.

00:15:05No.

00:15:06So, let's go back a bit, shall we?

00:15:08Were you born in Clusone?

00:15:09Yes.

00:15:09Which is a small town in the province of Bergamo?

00:15:12Of the Vasseriana.

00:15:13How would you define your childhood?

00:15:18A little tormented.

00:15:20Yes?

00:15:21Yes.

00:15:21From what?

00:15:22The moods of the family, of the parents.

00:15:27I mean, were we arguing or something?

00:15:29But they often fought over us children, yes, they often fought over us children.

00:15:36My father was quite strict, a trivial episode.

00:15:41My sister, who are twins, and I would come home from school later, maybe later.

00:15:48It happened that they remained locked in their rooms for two days without eating.

00:15:54My father was quite strict, he didn't accept, yes, it happened.

00:15:58He never accepted anything.

00:16:00So let's say, couldn't you define your childhood as a happy childhood?

00:16:05Happy, happy no.

00:16:07Friends describe him like this: Massimo, as a child, was attached to his family and, above all, was a mummy's boy.

00:16:14Especially mom.

00:16:15Was he very close to his mother?

00:16:17Yes.

00:16:17Does he have a somewhat unhealthy relationship with his mother?

00:16:19Very.

00:16:21Very.

00:16:24When he passed away, it was a heartbreak, a suffering, it is an immense suffering.

00:16:32His mother said that as a teenager he was a normal boy.

00:16:35The only girl he introduced me to was Marita, who later became his wife.

00:16:38She met her wife when she was 22, she was very young.

00:16:42At 21 years old.

00:16:43At 21 years old.

00:16:43Was it his only love, did he have other significant relationships?

00:16:47Love, love, until we got married, yes, but there were other stories of other

00:16:55girls that I never brought home to introduce my parents because they were not

00:16:59serious things.

00:17:00They were passing things, of the moment.

00:17:03So, anyway, in '99 you married Marita?

00:17:07October 16, 99, exactly.

00:17:09She was a bricklayer, his wife is a housewife.

00:17:14Was your marriage a happy one?

00:17:16Absolutely yes.

00:17:17Would you call that a happy marriage?

00:17:20It was happy until I came to know things that I never could have

00:17:28to think that they could happen.

00:17:30She, I imagine, then we come to him from the betrayals of his wife, which he learned about.

00:17:35only in prison, never before?

00:17:36Infidelity, yes.

00:17:37What did you learn about in prison? Did you have any suspicions before?

00:17:42Absolutely, I never had any suspicion and it was brought to the attention of the public

00:17:50ministry, in the classroom, which squandered the 4 winds, Marita's possible escapades.

00:18:01Well, let's say that in that phase his whole private life was investigated and it was also quite

00:18:06necessary, in the sense that with the accusation that...

00:18:08Before it was bad, there was nothing, no, there never was anything, never.

00:18:12From the analysis of his computer, it emerged, let's say, contacts, navigations on numerous porn sites, right?

00:18:21Did you and your wife both state that these were visits you made together?

00:18:26Yes, often in the evening, at 9 o'clock, when the children were put to bed, we retreated to the sofa,

00:18:35because today I am absolutely hopeless with computers, and I asked my wife if I could come in

00:18:41on certain sites to keep the issue alive a little, it's normal, but I think they are the banal things,

00:18:46normal, that every couple seeks intimacy, right?

00:18:50And always exclusively when the children were in bed, at 9.

00:18:53Have there also been traces of, say, visits to sadomasochistic and dating sites?

00:19:01Can be.

00:19:03That too, let's say, was a visit you made together on those sites, or was it more her?

00:19:09I mean, she was more the one doing the research, but we looked at each other together.

00:19:14All of these Sadomasos?

00:19:15No, all of us, my wife and I, I mean.

00:19:17No, not all the sites, let's say the children, of course.

00:19:20Well, what she clicked, back then, now I don't remember what it looks like now,

00:19:23first I remember that if you clicked, I don't know, boots, a string came out, a string,

00:19:29I don't know how to define it, sorry, a string came out and all the words with the letter S came out,

00:19:35string, scop, that is with all the S's, and out of curiosity you went inside and clicked there,

00:19:41It's not that he was looking for them, they just came out automatically.

00:19:45Well, one had to go there, otherwise they wouldn't force you to see it.

00:19:48Evidently we would have seen them too.

00:19:50His wife took a lot of interest, let's say, she attributed herself to navigation,

00:19:56In your opinion, did you do this a little to protect others?

00:19:59No, she put it on, she put it on because honestly you don't use them anymore, she came in and she must have looked at them

00:20:06even when I was maybe on the construction site, out of curiosity and everything.

00:20:10Because there is an environmental interception in prison, no, between you and your wife,

00:20:14in which she says, that it seemed a bit like she was putting you two in agreement,

00:20:18because she said, then I said we're open, we go to YouPorn every now and then,

00:20:23and those things there, but it's all together with my wife, they are things that I did together with my wife.

00:20:27That is, she told her husband that she should know, that she should have known,

00:20:31so it seemed like you guys were kind of on the same page, you know?

00:20:34No.

00:20:34That was the feeling.

00:20:35It was a banal, normal thing.

00:20:38Listen, though...

00:20:38We were watching together...

00:20:40Porn sites, okay.

00:20:41But, let's say, in addition to these porn sites, but you know, research has emerged

00:20:46that with some key words, I'll only read you two, girls with shaved heads,

00:20:52red virgin girls.

00:20:54Who was looking for this type of material?

00:20:56Nobody.

00:20:57Nobody, neither me nor my wives.

00:20:59Absolutely not, we never went in looking for those things.

00:21:02We are not that kind of people.

00:21:03But, as it turned out...

00:21:04It turned out to be a trial.

00:21:05I mean, if it wasn't her, if it wasn't his wife, was it his 13-year-old son?

00:21:08So, as I said earlier, my consultant Giovanni Bassetti, an IT consultant,

00:21:14he admitted that these are automatically produced searches.

00:21:19That if you press something they automatically come out of the strings.

00:21:23Well, look...

00:21:24But neither my wife nor I ever went in to click.

00:21:27Attention, I repeat, the computer...

00:21:28But there are several...

00:21:29She knows that, right?

00:21:30That is, several times these searches turn out.

00:21:33Yes, but I reiterate that neither my wife nor I have ever done any research in that direction.

00:21:38And then, what I mean, the home computer...

00:21:41I owned two computers.

00:21:43Both were free.

00:21:45Everyone could...

00:21:46Log in, but in fact there she was, his wife...

00:21:48There was no, what's the name, password that you put in to lock it.

00:21:51No, no, he was free.

00:21:51In fact, let's say, they are not...

00:21:52Free.

00:21:53In fact, they were unable to attribute them to her in vivo.

00:21:56These searches, if not one, at 9.55 am on May 29, 2014,

00:22:02which he had given about two weeks, before, let's say, his arrest,

00:22:06because at that moment she was at home,

00:22:09His wife came back later, the children were at school

00:22:12and the search was for girls with shaved vaginas.

00:22:15That time she was there, I mean, in the sense,

00:22:17it's the only one they've managed to attribute to her.

00:22:19I repeat, even if I had been at home,

00:22:21I've never done that kind of research.

00:22:24Never.

00:22:25Listen, in 2016, when you were already here, right?

00:22:28That is, he was already in prison,

00:22:29she begins a long correspondence with an inmate named Gina

00:22:34and you exchange a few letters, about forty letters.

00:22:38How did you get in touch?

00:22:40I'll say it right away.

00:22:41Being a media personality, of course,

00:22:43There's a lot of letters arriving, right?

00:22:46And this prisoner wrote to me, another prisoner too.

00:22:49Alright.

00:22:50An epistolary correspondence was born there.

00:22:57An epistolary flert, let's say.

00:22:58Yes, but they are the classic segmental ones

00:23:01what two people do when locked up in a prison context

00:23:04to live everyday life.

00:23:06But no more, no less, nothing.

00:23:08Which then, over time, as time passed, was redone.

00:23:13And five, let's say, of these...

00:23:14Yes, because they have plotted the letters so much.

00:23:17Some have been put on record.

00:23:19They were requisitioned.

00:23:20Let's just say some of them had explicitly sexual content, right?

00:23:26Yes.

00:23:26But there is one that says,

00:23:27that she wrote to her, to Gina.

00:23:30I like that you leave...

00:23:31There are one hundred letters.

00:23:33Ah, well, I'll read part of it to him.

00:23:35A.

00:23:36I reported them all, do you know why?

00:23:38Yes.

00:23:38Because I could see it when they were seized

00:23:41the ones I was missing.

00:23:43I like that it leaves a little stripe just on top.

00:23:46Yes.

00:23:46Because it's hornier that way.

00:23:48Without anything is how I like it.

00:23:50which in some way manifests, let's say, that predilection.

00:23:53That morbidity, let's say.

00:23:54What kind of research predilection is this?

00:23:57That's why I'm reading it to you.

00:23:59But not bad, because after that certain things are highlighted,

00:24:03they are attributed to all of that.

00:24:06But you'll admit that at least this is a strange coincidence, right?

00:24:08That is, of a predilection of his that...

00:24:10No, I repeat, those things there...

00:24:11Of course, I wrote those, but I repeat,

00:24:13it was only for certain moments...

00:24:18But look, that's completely understandable.

00:24:20and I don't even ask him why, it's obvious.

00:24:22So I'm just not getting into that.

00:24:24In prison, everything is missing, right?

00:24:26But I...

00:24:26So it's natural that...

00:24:28But it's very natural, in fact that's not the fact.

00:24:30But I wish I could make people understand...

00:24:32It's precisely the predilection for...

00:24:34Yes, because afterwards it is compared...

00:24:37You get it, that's how I like it...

00:24:39That is, he seized the opportunity to highlight...

00:24:41Without anything it's like...

00:24:43Well, it's a coincidence, you know?

00:24:45It's not just a ball...

00:24:46No.

00:24:49Listen, did your wife know about this cousin correspondence?

00:24:53Did you know?

00:24:53Did she say that in conversations?

00:24:55No, it's not that I said that, obviously.

00:24:56It came out when she found out.

00:24:59But also because...

00:25:02Well, let's look at it this way...

00:25:03It's a question, a...

00:25:05Like a...

00:25:06It's bad to say.

00:25:08A revenge against...

00:25:10Because she had already known about the infidelity.

00:25:11Yes, because he had already known about the infidelity.

00:25:13And then I couldn't do anything else...

00:25:17I was attached to this inmate until...

00:25:20But look, I can tell you honestly...

00:25:22The problem isn't that you wrote what you thought you could write...

00:25:26The problem is just...

00:25:27The problem is that at the right moment in the beating process certain things are emitted...

00:25:30But if she writes, I like it, she leaves a little strip just above,

00:25:33I'm just like that, without anything, just the way I like it,

00:25:36it's just...

00:25:37It corresponds to that kind of research, you understand?

00:25:39That's what I was asking for, otherwise...

00:25:40Afterwards they compare themselves to everything.

00:25:42I don't allow myself.

00:25:44Anyway...

00:25:44But I admit it, yes, I did it because...

00:25:46He was there at that moment...

00:25:48You were then arrested on June 16th, right?

00:25:50From 2014, while working on the Seriate construction site.

00:25:54The Carabinieri entered in plain clothes

00:25:56under the pretext of carrying out an audit on undeclared work

00:26:00and his colleagues...

00:26:02In short, his colleagues all remained calm,

00:26:04she instead panicked

00:26:06and instinctively tried to escape.

00:26:09Obviously it was impossible because...

00:26:11I saw the video and she said too...

00:26:14Ok, shall I tell you from start to finish?

00:26:15Sure, but she also, I mean, admitted that she was scared, right?

00:26:20I felt, I tried...

00:26:22I'd like to see when 30-40 people descend on you.

00:26:25between the State Police and the Carabinieri,

00:26:27they don't give you an explanation,

00:26:29I urge you to shut up, lower your gaze,

00:26:31he even kneeled down,

00:26:32when you try to have a simple due explanation

00:26:35and it is not given to you.

00:26:36Ok, what happened?

00:26:38I'll tell you right away.

00:26:39I hear Piero, the company's construction site manager,

00:26:42who called me twice.

00:26:44Massi, come down, come down!

00:26:45I get up, I look down, I lower,

00:26:47I see an army.

00:26:48What do I do then?

00:26:50I get up,

00:26:52I head towards the scaffolding,

00:26:54towards the trapdoor to go down to the lower floor,

00:26:56I don't have time,

00:26:58and I point out that my boots

00:26:59they were immersed 20 cm in the jet,

00:27:02okay?

00:27:02I don't have time to get close to the scaffolding

00:27:05nor come down from the trapdoor

00:27:06that I see from the end of the scaffolding

00:27:08to grab a big beast, a policeman,

00:27:10okay?

00:27:11Which immediately intimates me

00:27:13to throw the iron on the ground,

00:27:16the iron is the trowel,

00:27:17okay?

00:27:18Throw the iron on the ground,

00:27:19get closer,

00:27:21lower your gaze,

00:27:23kneel.

00:27:24At the moment,

00:27:24he came at me

00:27:26a tremendous fear,

00:27:28so much so that I asked again

00:27:30to give me an explanation,

00:27:31shut up,

00:27:32look down,

00:27:33Don't worry,

00:27:34relax.

00:27:34What's happening?

00:27:36I feel a hand tightening around my neck,

00:27:38the arms that hold me here

00:27:40they prevented me from moving,

00:27:41I just have to shut up.

00:27:42So, but this,

00:27:42I want to read them

00:27:44what he said

00:27:45one of the carabinieri

00:27:47who participated

00:27:48to the arrest

00:27:51Richard Ponzoni

00:27:52in the classroom.

00:27:53Canzanella testified

00:27:54for the other too

00:27:55saying that

00:27:56Major Ponzone

00:27:57he climbed onto the scaffolding

00:27:59and reached Bossetti

00:28:00who was working

00:28:01on a raised platform,

00:28:03he told him

00:28:03to stop,

00:28:04after which Bossetti

00:28:05with a repetitive action

00:28:06he was running away.

00:28:07He chased after him

00:28:08and blocked it.

00:28:09Absolutely not.

00:28:09But I can tell you one thing,

00:28:11that she

00:28:12have

00:28:13instinctively

00:28:14tried to escape,

00:28:15it can be seen clearly,

00:28:17he even asked for the keys

00:28:18Attention,

00:28:19it depends on that

00:28:19what do you want to see?

00:28:20everyone.

00:28:20No,

00:28:21Already,

00:28:23even if I had been

00:28:24on a floor

00:28:25normal,

00:28:26not these values

00:28:27imprinted in the jet,

00:28:29it couldn't be done

00:28:30run,

00:28:31because these are worth it

00:28:31stronger than running.

00:28:32No, but in fact,

00:28:32let's say that beyond

00:28:33who couldn't run,

00:28:34the construction site was surrounded,

00:28:35she wouldn't be anyway

00:28:36could have escaped.

00:28:37In fact she did...

00:28:38Yes, but be careful,

00:28:38I had to run away from things,

00:28:40throw me down

00:28:40from a high scaffolding

00:28:416 or 7 meters

00:28:41with the risk

00:28:42to be impaled

00:28:43on calls

00:28:43of the pillars down below.

00:28:44No, be careful,

00:28:45those three steps

00:28:46what do you see,

00:28:47that they have taken up again

00:28:48as a gesture of escape,

00:28:50instinctive to escape,

00:28:51Attention,

00:28:51No,

00:28:52it's not three steps,

00:28:52I was alone

00:28:53approaching the scaffolding

00:28:55to go down to the trapdoor.

00:28:56But I wasn't that scared

00:28:57hearing the machines

00:28:58and the carabinieri,

00:28:58I was scared

00:28:59in the moment

00:28:59who surrounded me,

00:29:01ok,

00:29:01without giving me an explanation

00:29:02and telling me

00:29:03to keep quiet.

00:29:04But I ask you,

00:29:05because his colleagues

00:29:06they all remained calm

00:29:07and only her

00:29:08did he get so agitated?

00:29:10Eh, I'd like to see you

00:29:11and in a situation like that...

00:29:13No, no, be careful,

00:29:15in that deep state

00:29:16of piping

00:29:17what I said earlier,

00:29:18they bring me

00:29:19towards the car

00:29:20of the carabinieri,

00:29:21okay?

00:29:22A hand on the head

00:29:23they let me in

00:29:24in the car

00:29:24of the carabinieri

00:29:24and what do they tell me?

00:29:27Bring your torso forward,

00:29:29after you,

00:29:29the head bowed

00:29:30forward

00:29:31up to the barracks.

00:29:33In your opinion

00:29:33why such an attitude?

00:29:35Obviously

00:29:36because they had to

00:29:37highlight me

00:29:38from outside people

00:29:40that at that moment

00:29:41they saw me

00:29:41that I was aware

00:29:44why they came...

00:29:45No, maybe even

00:29:46to keep her from taking pictures

00:29:47upon arrival,

00:29:48even for, let's say,

00:29:49do not allow

00:29:50to take pictures

00:29:52trivially.

00:29:53Breast,

00:29:53I don't understand the reason

00:29:54Why...

00:29:54She will have seen it again

00:29:55that video,

00:29:56I guess, right?

00:29:57I keep seeing it again

00:29:57and I keep dreaming about it

00:29:58every night.

00:30:00When she sees him again,

00:30:02you can see it a little

00:30:02that she is looking for

00:30:03to escape,

00:30:03what does he say to himself?

00:30:06They were unharmed,

00:30:08inhuman,

00:30:09shameful.

00:30:10I was expecting

00:30:12a simple one,

00:30:13trivial explanation.

00:30:14If they had been smarter,

00:30:16I can stop,

00:30:17if I had been smarter,

00:30:19they would have called me

00:30:21in a barracks

00:30:21of accent to the construction site,

00:30:23using a fake

00:30:24to escape,

00:30:24meaning of...

00:30:25Alright,

00:30:25but I can tell you

00:30:25it's not that we can

00:30:26enter the modes

00:30:29of the action,

00:30:30of the arrest.

00:30:31But when ever

00:30:31a case happens

00:30:32like that,

00:30:33about forty people

00:30:35he comes to arrest

00:30:35a person

00:30:36to your work environment?

00:30:37The charge was murder.

00:30:39towards

00:30:39of a little girl

00:30:4013 years old,

00:30:40understands that it is not

00:30:41who were talking

00:30:42of undeclared work,

00:30:43It took 40 people

00:30:43to arrest

00:30:44a person

00:30:45in their own work environment.

00:30:46And instead

00:30:46his wife and children

00:30:47how did they know

00:30:48that she had been arrested?

00:30:51I assume they knew about it.

00:30:53live on television

00:30:55at 6.30

00:30:56during open study.

00:30:58That is, he assumes because...

00:30:58Because then

00:30:59they arrived to him

00:30:59inside the carabinieri

00:31:00and police

00:31:00inside the house.

00:31:03And his wife

00:31:03how did he react?

00:31:04She collapsed to the ground

00:31:05crying

00:31:06and so much so that the carabinieri

00:31:07they were looking for a little

00:31:09to reassure her.

00:31:11Listen,

00:31:12when they then asked her

00:31:13where it was

00:31:16in those hours

00:31:17where she had disappeared

00:31:19Iara

00:31:19of that November 26th

00:31:20of 2010,

00:31:22She says she doesn't remember,

00:31:24No?

00:31:24She says exactly

00:31:24of not remembering.

00:31:25She wasn't at work

00:31:26because he hadn't worked,

00:31:27he wasn't at home,

00:31:28he had returned home

00:31:29a little later

00:31:30than usual

00:31:31and says he doesn't remember.

00:31:33No, then

00:31:34I have always supported

00:31:35that that day there

00:31:36it was the normal one

00:31:37common day

00:31:38where I always have

00:31:39did the usual things.

00:31:40Then

00:31:41come to know

00:31:42that that day there

00:31:44it was raining

00:31:44or maybe it was snowing,

00:31:46okay?

00:31:47evidently

00:31:48if the weather conditions

00:31:50of the moment

00:31:50they stopped me

00:31:51to carry out

00:31:52certain jobs

00:31:54outdoor

00:31:54in the construction site

00:31:56I thought

00:31:57of not having worked

00:31:58and not having worked

00:31:59I used

00:32:00the weather

00:32:00to carry out

00:32:01the usual commissions

00:32:02how to get there

00:32:03of the accountant

00:32:04but they didn't find them

00:32:05a feedback

00:32:06the mechanic said it

00:32:07the accountant

00:32:07but in reality

00:32:08he didn't remember well

00:32:09in fact even when

00:32:10his wife

00:32:11he even told him

00:32:12how can you not remember?

00:32:14In fact

00:32:15I remember

00:32:16it was right

00:32:17Why

00:32:18on file

00:32:19it turns out

00:32:20a payment

00:32:22F24

00:32:22a delegation

00:32:23upon payment

00:32:24of taxes

00:32:25that on that very day

00:32:26but I understood

00:32:28there's that hole

00:32:28of those hours

00:32:30in fact too

00:32:31his wife

00:32:32remains

00:32:33No, my wife

00:32:34he has always reiterated

00:32:35in court

00:32:36he doesn't remember

00:32:37that now I arrived home

00:32:38don't be late

00:32:39but always

00:32:40we had dinner

00:32:41always together

00:32:41every evening

00:32:42Surely

00:32:437, 7 and a half

00:32:44it was my time

00:32:45Why

00:32:45which was later

00:32:46No?

00:32:47she came back later

00:32:47that day

00:32:48in an interception

00:32:49environmental

00:32:50in prison

00:32:51she says

00:32:53I'm sure

00:32:54that the phone

00:32:55it was empty

00:32:56the safe one

00:32:57she says

00:32:57and marries

00:32:58how do you remember

00:32:59that

00:32:59that the phone was out of battery

00:33:00and you don't remember

00:33:01where were you

00:33:02and she says

00:33:03you never told me

00:33:04what did you do

00:33:04that evening

00:33:05that day

00:33:05and that evening

00:33:06because she arrived

00:33:07late

00:33:07I'm just saying this

00:33:08because she

00:33:09he remembered

00:33:09that the phone was out of battery

00:33:10he remembered

00:33:11that there was sleet

00:33:12he also remembered

00:33:13who made the horn

00:33:14to a person

00:33:15that he met

00:33:16to greet her

00:33:16maybe on someone

00:33:17maybe on someone

00:33:18but then

00:33:20let's say that she

00:33:22when they asked her

00:33:23where was it

00:33:23he didn't have any adipose tissue

00:33:25ninth

00:33:25Attention

00:33:25the phone

00:33:26Unfortunately

00:33:27it was a telephone

00:33:28obsolete

00:33:29an old battery

00:33:30era

00:33:32it was normal

00:33:33that was coming

00:33:34he always came

00:33:35to unload

00:33:36No

00:33:36it was going out

00:33:37it turned off automatically

00:33:38I always had to

00:33:39load it

00:33:40in the framework

00:33:41from the construction site

00:33:41when I arrived

00:33:42in the morning

00:33:43Attention

00:33:43I have always said

00:33:44I have done

00:33:46determined

00:33:48commissions

00:33:49OK

00:33:50even praying to me

00:33:51from my brother

00:33:52from my brother

00:33:53the accountant

00:33:55and also the hairdresser

00:33:58but that

00:33:59in those hours

00:33:59Understood

00:34:00I am trying to say

00:34:01right in those hours

00:34:02of Chiara's disappearance

00:34:03his cell phone

00:34:03it worked

00:34:04until shortly before

00:34:05in fact it had been

00:34:06Also

00:34:06let's say

00:34:07the cell

00:34:08of his phone

00:34:09had been hooked

00:34:10in those parts

00:34:11then it went out

00:34:12and among other things

00:34:13he doesn't even have it anymore

00:34:13loaded

00:34:14that is, she

00:34:14he turned it back on

00:34:15the morning after

00:34:16a strange thing

00:34:17no because

00:34:17evidently

00:34:18I arrived home

00:34:19until half past seven

00:34:20that when I didn't come in

00:34:21under construction

00:34:21I didn't turn it on anymore

00:34:22to avoid a breakdown

00:34:23of boxes

00:34:24from customers

00:34:25or from others

00:34:25but who called her

00:34:26in the evening

00:34:27let's say

00:34:28it's not that he did

00:34:29the CEO

00:34:30of a company

00:34:30that he called her

00:34:31when it was unloaded

00:34:32not having

00:34:33the adapter

00:34:34Meaning what

00:34:36I had to go home

00:34:37OK

00:34:37he went home

00:34:38I wasn't attacking him

00:34:39immediately under charge

00:34:40I arrived at the construction site

00:34:41in the morning

00:34:42I turned it on inside

00:34:44Marita too

00:34:45he said

00:34:45then it was understood

00:34:46what do we say?

00:34:46in those days

00:34:47you were

00:34:47how do you say

00:34:48you had argued

00:34:49in the sense that

00:34:49you were a little

00:34:50in dispute

00:34:51so when he came back

00:34:52a little later

00:34:52she didn't ask him

00:34:54Yes

00:34:54not even to do the post office

00:34:55I think there were

00:34:56of moments

00:34:57That

00:34:57those were days

00:34:58that you were a little

00:34:59in dispute

00:34:59you didn't feel like it

00:35:00so much so that when he returned

00:35:01a little later

00:35:02than usual

00:35:03Marita didn't even have them

00:35:04of arguments

00:35:05classic arguments

00:35:06between husband and wife

00:35:07he didn't even ask her

00:35:08because he was late

00:35:10precisely because it was there

00:35:10this climate at home

00:35:11so she doesn't have it

00:35:13his wife says

00:35:14I never knew

00:35:15that is, that she

00:35:16she was struck

00:35:17from this

00:35:18ninth

00:35:18I repeat that

00:35:19apart from the fact that after many years

00:35:20remember an event

00:35:21then if there is maybe

00:35:22it was a special event

00:35:23to be able to

00:35:26to be able to stay ahead

00:35:27and remember

00:35:28then if

00:35:28or have

00:35:29an agenda

00:35:30a construction site book

00:35:31to mark

00:35:32a certain day

00:35:33what could I have done?

00:35:34to have done

00:35:35Surely

00:35:36I would have given

00:35:36an official one

00:35:37an explanation

00:35:39but yes but definitely

00:35:40but since I think

00:35:41that that day there

00:35:42for me

00:35:43it has always been

00:35:44a very normal day

00:35:45which I have always carried out

00:35:46the usual things

00:35:47but you know why I ask you

00:35:48because then

00:35:48when they happen

00:35:49something sensational

00:35:52No

00:35:54especially in a small municipality

00:35:55No

00:35:55what Bremate was like

00:35:56but also in the neighboring

00:35:57then everyone remembers

00:35:59so much so that she then gets married

00:36:00always talking to her

00:36:02he says do you remember

00:36:03Excuse me

00:36:03then we have in one evening

00:36:04dinner with friends

00:36:05with my brother-in-law

00:36:07with his brother-in-law

00:36:08everyone said

00:36:09where was it

00:36:09No

00:36:09how is it done?

00:36:10when something happens

00:36:11of imported

00:36:12but where were you?

00:36:12do you remember it

00:36:13where were you?

00:36:14and the only one

00:36:15that he didn't say

00:36:15where was she was

00:36:16and she said

00:36:17you were the only one

00:36:18that not

00:36:18No

00:36:18there was this

00:36:19explanation here

00:36:20which I reiterated

00:36:21a little while ago

00:36:22listen, I imagine

00:36:23that she in these years

00:36:24really have

00:36:25appealed

00:36:27to all its resources

00:36:28mental

00:36:29to lead back

00:36:31in memory

00:36:32No

00:36:33something

00:36:33that could have

00:36:35save her

00:36:36I thought about it

00:36:38and well I guess

00:36:39it is possible

00:36:40that in these eleven years

00:36:41it didn't occur to her

00:36:43nothing more

00:36:44that is, there is a void

00:36:45it's not that there's a void

00:36:47How much

00:36:47there is

00:36:49as always done

00:36:50as always

00:36:51it's a day

00:36:52very normal

00:36:52and all the other days

00:36:53there is no void

00:36:54Understood

00:36:54in those hours

00:36:55but there is no void

00:36:56I could have been an accountant

00:36:58I could have been a hairdresser

00:36:59from my brother

00:36:59but it's not like there's a void

00:37:00but there's nothing either

00:37:02precisely and confirmed

00:37:03oh no

00:37:04but as I said

00:37:06on file

00:37:07there is this model

00:37:08payment

00:37:09there is a 24 that she paid

00:37:10but it doesn't mean

00:37:10that then where was it

00:37:11then in that

00:37:12I understand what I want to tell you

00:37:13No

00:37:15my memory was clear

00:37:16I couldn't remember anything else

00:37:18she always said

00:37:19I do not know

00:37:20he said

00:37:21I do not know

00:37:21I have always reiterated

00:37:22the usual things

00:37:23that I've always done

00:37:24no bossetti

00:37:26in the following days

00:37:27on the disappearance of Iara

00:37:29they organized

00:37:30in Brembate

00:37:31and in the surrounding municipalities

00:37:32a large torchlight procession

00:37:34No?

00:37:34do you remember her?

00:37:36that torchlight procession

00:37:37Why

00:37:37they didn't talk about it much

00:37:39she participated

00:37:40with his wife?

00:37:42No

00:37:42no why?

00:37:45he didn't feel like

00:37:48No

00:37:48because we were taken

00:37:49of others

00:37:51jobs

00:37:52apart from the fact that I was

00:37:53always under construction

00:37:54always tied to work

00:37:55at work

00:37:56listen

00:37:57then of that fact

00:37:58of course everyone was talking about it

00:37:59No?

00:38:00Iara in that period

00:38:01she was sought everywhere

00:38:03and maybe because also

00:38:04I want to say

00:38:05we were there

00:38:07we found ourselves living

00:38:09in Terno d'Isola

00:38:108-10 km

00:38:12from Brembate above

00:38:14maybe if we were

00:38:15the same municipality

00:38:16she would have gone there

00:38:17then yes

00:38:17Yes

00:38:17my wife would have gone

00:38:19Surely

00:38:19but I was on site

00:38:20well it was the evening

00:38:22it was the evening

00:38:23but it's okay

00:38:24anyway it's okay

00:38:26Iara at that point

00:38:28after his disappearance

00:38:29she was searched for everywhere

00:38:30with a deployment

00:38:31of huge men

00:38:33of law enforcement

00:38:34volunteers

00:38:34with the cameras

00:38:36everywhere

00:38:36etc.

00:38:37and so there was so much talk about it

00:38:38what an idea

00:38:39was it done?

00:38:40I tell you sincerely

00:38:41what was being whispered

00:38:42OK

00:38:44the disappearance immediately

00:38:45by Iara

00:38:47it was whispered

00:38:49without having to accuse

00:38:51and slander anyone

00:38:52it was whispered

00:38:53and then you don't slander anyone

00:38:54it was whispered

00:38:56That

00:38:58it seems that

00:38:59Mr.

00:39:01Fulvio Gambirasio

00:39:02had had

00:39:03some disagreements

00:39:04with certain people

00:39:05yes yes

00:39:06this is a story

00:39:07emerged

00:39:07but I'm not the one saying it

00:39:08they were whispering about it

00:39:09people walking around

00:39:10no but over there

00:39:10of those who were murmuring

00:39:12there was an investigation

00:39:13on this

00:39:14when we went down

00:39:14at noon

00:39:15to eat in a restaurant

00:39:16there in Palazzago

00:39:16Obviously

00:39:1712.25

00:39:18open studio

00:39:19and the part goes

00:39:20mechanization

00:39:21research by poor Iara

00:39:22civil protection

00:39:23Carabinieri

00:39:24and all that

00:39:25that was felt

00:39:25in the context

00:39:26in that place

00:39:27Here you are

00:39:28they made him purge it

00:39:29as if someone

00:39:30knew

00:39:30they made him pay for it

00:39:31why do we say

00:39:32I do not know

00:39:32these are things

00:39:34I'll say it

00:39:35because you feel it

00:39:36because there was a company

00:39:37for which he

00:39:37officially

00:39:38there is nothing

00:39:39that's what was being whispered

00:39:41the entrepreneur

00:39:42let's say he was tied up

00:39:43to drug trafficking

00:39:44but this whole part

00:39:45it was deeply

00:39:45under investigation

00:39:46so beyond that

00:39:47that was whispered

00:39:47she was investigated

00:39:49have not been traveled

00:39:51all alternative routes

00:39:52that they could travel

00:39:53they were not taken

00:39:54under consideration

00:39:54many people

00:39:55but excuse me

00:39:55if I say so

00:39:56in such a way

00:39:57unfriendly

00:39:58but there was his

00:39:59of DNA

00:39:59on slip

00:40:00of the macaws

00:40:00it's not that there was

00:40:01that

00:40:01who says it's mine

00:40:02they attributed it

00:40:03the APM

00:40:04but today

00:40:05I have never had

00:40:06I have never had

00:40:06an objective finding

00:40:08oh no

00:40:08of course

00:40:09look

00:40:09but now we're getting there

00:40:11to DNA

00:40:12we'll get there

00:40:13for the degrees

00:40:13since we entered

00:40:14in this regard

00:40:14of the construction site

00:40:15that they were looking for

00:40:17everyone

00:40:17OK

00:40:19what to me

00:40:19it has always amazed me

00:40:22it's just that I can't

00:40:23to digest

00:40:24that when she disappeared

00:40:25poor Iara

00:40:27Obviously

00:40:27it starts moving

00:40:28the mechanization

00:40:29the research

00:40:30of poor Iara

00:40:30civil protection

00:40:31volunteers

00:40:32Carabinieri

00:40:32whoever

00:40:33OK

00:40:35that I see myself

00:40:36arrive

00:40:37under construction

00:40:39I didn't even know

00:40:39who he was

00:40:41Iara's father

00:40:42OK

00:40:42in Palazzago

00:40:43where I was building

00:40:44the billets

00:40:45my brother-in-law makes me

00:40:46I was maneuvering

00:40:47with the remote control

00:40:48the crane

00:40:49my brother-in-law makes me

00:40:50it comes to me there

00:40:51he beats me

00:40:51intro the elbow

00:40:52oh but yes

00:40:52you know who that one is

00:40:53ago

00:40:53but who is he

00:40:54he is Iara's father

00:40:55and a moment

00:40:56I got stuck

00:40:57with the remote control

00:40:57and I said

00:40:57but what is Iara's dad like?

00:40:59yes, Iara's dad

00:41:01and I told him

00:41:02but

00:41:04but is it possible Iara's father

00:41:05hey I'll tell you Iara's dad

00:41:06I know him

00:41:07and he goes there

00:41:07eh because there was something strange

00:41:09and he's joking

00:41:10what was strange about it?

00:41:12eh

00:41:12but excuse me for a moment

00:41:14I have a parent

00:41:15which just disappeared from him

00:41:16the daughter

00:41:17he is more in a hurry

00:41:17to rush

00:41:18on a construction site

00:41:18to watch

00:41:19how many meters of sheath

00:41:20it is necessary

00:41:20or he goes around

00:41:21with research

00:41:23word of Iara

00:41:24I can tell you

00:41:25what do we say?

00:41:26what's strange

00:41:27everything strange

00:41:27which is wrong

00:41:29not to say worse

00:41:31comment

00:41:32Also

00:41:33nor possibly

00:41:35nor possibly

00:41:35any attitude

00:41:36that he had

00:41:37a parent

00:41:38who lost

00:41:39the daughter

00:41:40and that they had

00:41:41a behavior

00:41:42a little dignified

00:41:43I share this

00:41:44very dignified

00:41:45but I can't find it

00:41:46and in silence

00:41:46for everything

00:41:47so if he

00:41:48he went to the construction site

00:41:50even though she had disappeared

00:41:51the daughter

00:41:52After

00:41:53oh no

00:41:53can't do

00:41:53not even that face

00:41:54I can tell you

00:41:55this is the same answer

00:41:56that gave me me

00:41:57the PM

00:41:57and according to her

00:41:59what's strange

00:42:00like what's strange about it

00:42:00but he's joking

00:42:01but how does she do it?

00:42:02to put yourself

00:42:02but if it had disappeared

00:42:03Excuse me

00:42:04I say it

00:42:05I recommend it

00:42:05also out of respect

00:42:06given the reason too

00:42:07that's why she's in here

00:42:08how does he do it?

00:42:09let's say

00:42:09to interpret

00:42:11what is right

00:42:11or not right

00:42:12for a parent

00:42:13who lost a daughter

00:42:13so I this

00:42:14I don't recommend it to him

00:42:15just to travel

00:42:16his way

00:42:16ok but excuse me for a moment

00:42:17if it had disappeared from me

00:42:18a daughter

00:42:19which I reiterated to the PM

00:42:20if it had been

00:42:21my case

00:42:22a daughter disappeared

00:42:23oh damn

00:42:24that you threw me

00:42:24under construction

00:42:25go and see

00:42:25what was needed

00:42:26a

00:42:27No

00:42:27I would have gone

00:42:30at the end of the world

00:42:31and I wouldn't have come home

00:42:32until I had news

00:42:33to my peer or son

00:42:34but she realizes

00:42:34then it's true

00:42:35this is an attitude

00:42:36excuse me Bossetti

00:42:37but she realizes

00:42:38the reason why he is here

00:42:39what he's saying

00:42:39with respect to the faults

00:42:40of a parent

00:42:41which maybe goes to construction site

00:42:43even just

00:42:43even if it was just to distract yourself

00:42:44a moment

00:42:45or out of need

00:42:45I wouldn't be able to

00:42:47but how can she say

00:42:48something like that

00:42:49all the more so

00:42:49with the reason

00:42:50that's why it's here

00:42:50but I respect

00:42:52his personality

00:42:52but I don't respect

00:42:53the behavior

00:42:54of that moment

00:42:55I can't accept it

00:42:57we are different

00:42:59Yes

00:43:00we are different

00:43:01listen

00:43:02Iara's body

00:43:03then he is found again

00:43:04after three months

00:43:05from the disappearance

00:43:06in the ground

00:43:07from Chignolo

00:43:08of Island

00:43:08let's say

00:43:09a few kilometers

00:43:11away

00:43:11from the gym

00:43:13and Iara

00:43:15he was wearing

00:43:16the same clothes

00:43:17of when she disappeared

00:43:18according to the coroner

00:43:19Cristina Cattaneo

00:43:20she would have died

00:43:21the same day

00:43:22of the disappearance

00:43:23hit in the head

00:43:25and had wounds

00:43:26of a cutting weapon

00:43:26around the neck

00:43:27on the body

00:43:27the unhooked bra

00:43:29and the cut panties

00:43:30that's what the exam says

00:43:31of the pathologist

00:43:34but yes

00:43:34they are professionals

00:43:36at the service

00:43:38of justice

00:43:39I mean, it's not like you can

00:43:40because she questions

00:43:41it cannot be questioned

00:43:43I'm not saying

00:43:43Understood

00:43:44breast

00:43:44then let's question it

00:43:45All

00:43:46we can also put everything

00:43:48under discussion

00:43:48Like this

00:43:50When

00:43:51let's say

00:43:51it was known

00:43:52that that little girl

00:43:53at 13 years old

00:43:54she was left to die

00:43:55she died of hypothermia

00:43:57hypothermia

00:43:57Exactly

00:43:58that's what they say

00:43:59that's how it was written

00:44:01No

00:44:02what did she think?

00:44:06that could have been saved

00:44:08what if they hadn't abandoned her there?

00:44:10absolutely yes

00:44:11seen like this they say

00:44:12in the toctic examination

00:44:13Yes

00:44:13absolutely yes

00:44:14I find that no one

00:44:16Nobody

00:44:18he had to vent

00:44:19on a body

00:44:20of a poor little girl

00:44:21it's the biggest reason

00:44:22she is left to die

00:44:23relaxing

00:44:23in a field

00:44:24if

00:44:25it has always remained there

00:44:28that she puts

00:44:29right under discussion

00:44:29All

00:44:30because there are

00:44:32diversity

00:44:33of my consultants

00:44:33That

00:44:34they don't share

00:44:35the thesis

00:44:36of the prosecution

00:44:38my pathologist

00:44:40Dalila Raneletta

00:44:41he claims

00:44:41completely the opposite

00:44:42he claims

00:44:43I imagine the body

00:44:44had been

00:44:45moved

00:44:46but

00:44:46let's say

00:44:46the truth

00:44:47Obviously

00:44:49someone brought her there

00:44:50it's not like it fell from the sky

00:44:51someone brought her there

00:44:52and what I want to point out

00:44:55Attention

00:44:56that field there

00:44:57the surrounding fields

00:44:59they had already been patrolled

00:45:00they had already been patrolled

00:45:02for civil protection

00:45:03Carabinieri

00:45:03helicopter pilots

00:45:04and they never found anything

00:45:05they didn't find anything

00:45:06but they also said

00:45:07which then

00:45:08when they found the body

00:45:09in advance

00:45:10decomposition

00:45:11they looked like clothes

00:45:13they also said

00:45:14that is, it was almost impossible

00:45:15recognize

00:45:16that it was

00:45:17a body

00:45:18it was a little pile

00:45:19it's also terrible to remember

00:45:21but it was tight

00:45:22in the hand

00:45:24the threads

00:45:26of grass

00:45:26that was not rooted

00:45:27in the field

00:45:28which corresponded exactly

00:45:30with herbs

00:45:31and to the flowers

00:45:31that there were

00:45:32in that field

00:45:33so you also look

00:45:33just a little bit

00:45:35this supports

00:45:35the pathologist

00:45:36Cristina Cattaneo

00:45:37but

00:45:38Anyway

00:45:39it would have no interest

00:45:41a professional

00:45:41of that level

00:45:42I read all the advice

00:45:43a professional

00:45:44a doctor

00:45:44legal

00:45:45of that level

00:45:45I read all the advice

00:45:48that is, there was no conspiracy

00:45:49also because

00:45:50it must always be remembered

00:45:52That

00:45:53this process

00:45:54it's a reverse process

00:45:55Meaning what

00:45:56we left

00:45:57from a track

00:45:58from a genetic profile

00:46:01and he went to look for it

00:46:02whose it was

00:46:03it's not that

00:46:03someone knew her

00:46:05to her first

00:46:06Understood

00:46:07that is, we got there

00:46:08after investigations

00:46:09lasted a long time

00:46:09I want to read them

00:46:12what he wrote

00:46:13a journalist

00:46:13his name is Marco Mariso

00:46:14on the Corriere della Sera

00:46:15OK

00:46:16Iara was killed

00:46:17for a sudden fit

00:46:18sexual

00:46:18for the imagination

00:46:19who knows how long

00:46:20a predator's brood

00:46:22that maybe

00:46:23he didn't even know

00:46:24he knew he was

00:46:27that's what he wrote

00:46:28it's a description

00:46:30which could

00:46:31to correspond

00:46:32this is free interpretation

00:46:33yes yes

00:46:34he is a journalist

00:46:35who wrote it

00:46:37on the sleeve

00:46:38of the jacket

00:46:39by Iara

00:46:40this comes

00:46:41the story

00:46:43he knows her better

00:46:43than anyone else

00:46:44but

00:46:45I have to repeat it

00:46:47on the sleeve

00:46:48of the jacket

00:46:48by Iara

00:46:49it was found

00:46:50DNA

00:46:51of his

00:46:52teacher

00:46:53of gymnastics

00:46:54Silvia Brena

00:46:54a circumstance

00:46:56which was obviously

00:46:56in-depth

00:46:57under investigation

00:46:58but what was it

00:46:59explained

00:46:59with the continuous

00:47:00attendance

00:47:00in the gym

00:47:01of the girl

00:47:01the two obviously

00:47:02they knew each other

00:47:02Very good

00:47:03and then

00:47:04but

00:47:05on the panties

00:47:06cut

00:47:06by Iara

00:47:07and on leggings

00:47:08it was found

00:47:09the genetic profile

00:47:11DNA

00:47:11of a man

00:47:12that from that moment on

00:47:13has become

00:47:14unknown 1

00:47:15and it became

00:47:16the prime suspect

00:47:17from that moment on

00:47:19onwards

00:47:19let's say

00:47:21we are looking for

00:47:22to reveal

00:47:22the identity

00:47:23of unknown 1

00:47:24and the State

00:47:24employs resources

00:47:25huge

00:47:26for this investigation

00:47:27also because

00:47:28in hand

00:47:28I had

00:47:29a genetic profile

00:47:31very clear

00:47:32they had something

00:47:34in hand

00:47:34breast

00:47:34they would not have spent

00:47:35all that money

00:47:36and they are heard

00:47:374,300 witnesses

00:47:39analyzed

00:47:39120,000

00:47:40telephone utilities

00:47:41analyzed

00:47:4226,000

00:47:43traces

00:47:43of DNA

00:47:44taken

00:47:45there

00:47:46between Brembate

00:47:47etc.

00:47:48among other things

00:47:49some inhabitants

00:47:50they went voluntarily

00:47:51to get profiled

00:47:53she knows

00:47:55people

00:47:55friends

00:47:56that they did it

00:47:56that have gone

00:47:57again

00:47:59I'll make a premise

00:48:00forgive me

00:48:01although

00:48:02she knows

00:48:02All

00:48:03at a certain point

00:48:05check

00:48:05the genetic profile

00:48:06of a boy

00:48:07what is called

00:48:08Damiano Guerinoni

00:48:09Exactly

00:48:10whose DNA

00:48:11had some elements

00:48:12compatible

00:48:13with this unknown 1

00:48:14haplotype

00:48:15icsion

00:48:15shares the same

00:48:16DNA

00:48:17they start from there

00:48:19complex

00:48:20reconstructions

00:48:20genealogical

00:48:22until you get there

00:48:23to give a paternity

00:48:24of unknown 1

00:48:25who is Giuseppe Guerinoni

00:48:26who was dead

00:48:27in 99

00:48:28and it even comes

00:48:28the body was exhumed

00:48:30then they are verified

00:48:31DNA immediately

00:48:32of the children

00:48:33but they are not found

00:48:35compatible

00:48:35at that point

00:48:36we are looking for a child

00:48:38unrecognized

00:48:39there is a long list

00:48:41of ladies

00:48:43that they could have

00:48:44have to deal with

00:48:45with Domenico Guerinoni

00:48:46they make a huge mistake

00:48:49in DNA analysis

00:48:51why is it compared

00:48:53the DNA of this gentleman

00:48:56with Chiara's profile

00:48:57with Chiara's profile

00:48:58they realize

00:48:59of this great mistake

00:49:00and they do it all again

00:49:01when they redo everything

00:49:02jump out

00:49:03his mother

00:49:04and his sister

00:49:06and his mother

00:49:07had one allele

00:49:08No?

00:49:09very rare

00:49:10which has been isolated

00:49:13even in the genetic profile

00:49:15of unknown 1

00:49:16so let's say

00:49:17which is established

00:49:19motherhood

00:49:20of unknown 1

00:49:22and among other things

00:49:24the investigation shows

00:49:26that his mother

00:49:26he knew very well

00:49:27Guerinoni

00:49:28for a few years

00:49:30they dated

00:49:31so let's say

00:49:32Esther

00:49:32it was his mother

00:49:34OK

00:49:35so during

00:49:37a check

00:49:38causal

00:49:38with the breathalyzer

00:49:40the policemen

00:49:41they stop her

00:49:42they give her a breathalyzer test

00:49:44then they take

00:49:44a saliva sample

00:49:45the day

00:49:46before the arrest

00:49:47and she's there too

00:49:48he was calm

00:49:49Meaning what

00:49:50he perceived it

00:49:51as a casual

00:49:52or it was done

00:49:52come

00:49:52it has never happened to me

00:49:53to do a check-up

00:49:54alcoholic

00:49:55but

00:49:55I was stopped

00:49:56and there I remember

00:49:57it was a Sunday

00:49:58there is a roadblock

00:49:59And

00:50:00I see that my brother-in-law

00:50:01move on

00:50:02and me

00:50:03a policeman advances

00:50:04shovel

00:50:05accosts

00:50:06driving license and registration document

00:50:08documents and everything

00:50:09I feel like it

00:50:10I'm going down for a moment

00:50:10I'm going down

00:50:12she drank

00:50:13no absolutely not

00:50:14in the meantime

00:50:15what do I see

00:50:15I see that

00:50:17the green display

00:50:19it's on standby

00:50:20it's on standby

00:50:21with all the asterisks

00:50:22this policeman

00:50:24he hits the car

00:50:24or colleague

00:50:25the machine doesn't work

00:50:26and what's the problem?

00:50:27get another mouthpiece

00:50:28and make another one

00:50:28they have two mouthpieces in their hands

00:50:29OK

00:50:31they take the exam

00:50:32two mouthpieces

00:50:33driving license and registration document

00:50:33now you can go

00:50:34Enough

00:50:35that's all there is to it

00:50:35and it didn't seem strange to her

00:50:37no it didn't seem strange to me

00:50:38I thought it was a thing

00:50:39normal routine

00:50:40it seemed strange

00:50:41he knows what

00:50:41having seen the carabinieri

00:50:43there in the village

00:50:44I've never seen any

00:50:45there have never been any

00:50:46but he thought about it

00:50:47there's something strange here

00:50:48or he didn't think about it anymore

00:50:49no I think it was

00:50:51a normal thing

00:50:51Anyway

00:50:52that evening

00:50:53they take his profile

00:50:54genetic

00:50:55and comes immediately

00:50:56compared

00:50:57with that of unknown 1

00:50:58and makes a match

00:51:00and therefore unknown 1

00:51:02it's her

00:51:02she why

00:51:04he says no

00:51:06because unknown 1

00:51:07it can't be Massimo Bossetti

00:51:08simple

00:51:09At that time

00:51:10I will only be able to note it

00:51:12when I can do it

00:51:13proper investigations

00:51:15then however

00:51:16I know why

00:51:17here is the defense

00:51:18he asked several times

00:51:20No

00:51:20to have access

00:51:22to the DNA test

00:51:23but

00:51:24the parties were not

00:51:26involved at the beginning

00:51:27because it was unknown

00:51:28unknown 1

00:51:29so it didn't exist

00:51:30let's say a suspect

00:51:31a name or surname

00:51:32and therefore even less

00:51:33there was no defense

00:51:34but it's also true

00:51:36if I may just say

00:51:37That

00:51:38nuclear DNA

00:51:40which then

00:51:41it's the only one

00:51:42DNA

00:51:43which has legal value

00:51:44nuclear DNA

00:51:45it was found

00:51:46in a way

00:51:47also quite copious

00:51:48in several places

00:51:49that is, it is not

00:51:49which was in doubt

00:51:50the analyses

00:51:51they were made

00:51:52several times

00:51:53and it is always

00:51:54emerged

00:51:54his DNA

00:51:55on the panties

00:51:56and on leggings

00:51:57by Yara

00:51:58it's all absurd

00:51:59the name is not understood

00:52:01not for science

00:52:03he understands

00:52:04not for science

00:52:05nor by law

00:52:05nuclear DNA

00:52:09what it highlights

00:52:10nuclear DNA

00:52:11highlights

00:52:12nuclear DNA

00:52:13highlights

00:52:14uniquely

00:52:15a person's identity

00:52:16OK

00:52:16nuclear DNA

00:52:17which normally

00:52:18it should be dispersed

00:52:19in a few weeks

00:52:20Instead

00:52:21was still present

00:52:22and not even a little

00:52:23mitochondrial DNA

00:52:25which is known by all

00:52:26that cannot be lost

00:52:27there is no

00:52:28but the legal value

00:52:30and forensic

00:52:31nuclear DNA

00:52:32that's what it establishes

00:52:33the identity

00:52:34of a person

00:52:35and unfortunately

00:52:35for her

00:52:36and also for Chiara

00:52:37there was

00:52:38his

00:52:39nucleus

00:52:39that is, nuclear

00:52:40mitochondrial

00:52:41it's normal

00:52:42that cannot be found

00:52:43on a body

00:52:44but sorry

00:52:44then there is a question

00:52:45very trivial to do

00:52:47but she

00:52:47his DNA

00:52:48how did it end up there

00:52:49on the panties

00:52:50by Yara

00:52:50that's what I'd like to understand

00:52:51Me too

00:52:51first of all

00:52:52that DNA there

00:52:54absolutely

00:52:54cannot represent me

00:52:56Attention

00:52:56it was also done

00:52:57of beautiful analyses

00:52:58on that DNA

00:52:58they were also repeated

00:52:59many times

00:53:00I of Yara

00:53:00I've never seen it

00:53:01I have never met her

00:53:03OK

00:53:04there has never been

00:53:04a hookup

00:53:05and then I can't

00:53:06what kind of

00:53:07this is why we talked about it

00:53:07of sudden rage

00:53:08did you understand?

00:53:09and what kind of hookup

00:53:10I could have

00:53:10a forty-year-old person

00:53:12forty-year-old

00:53:12with a

00:53:13thirteen year old

00:53:14unfortunately the pathology

00:53:15let's say

00:53:16of that type of crime

00:53:17look

00:53:18it's not my case

00:53:19she

00:53:20in prison

00:53:21at that point he discovers

00:53:23quite a few things

00:53:24No?

00:53:25of his life

00:53:25my life has turned upside down

00:53:26in prison

00:53:27also because

00:53:28first of all

00:53:29he discovers that he is not

00:53:30his father's son

00:53:31John Bossetti

00:53:32but rather of this

00:53:33Joseph Guerinoni

00:53:34and there it is all

00:53:36even a discussion

00:53:37his with his mother

00:53:38she

00:53:38yes I took it

00:53:40she took a lot

00:53:41he felt betrayed

00:53:43why in 44 years

00:53:44he hid me

00:53:45one thing

00:53:48tremendous

00:53:48I encouraged her

00:53:50I always asked

00:53:51mom

00:53:51look me in the eyes

00:53:53I have the right

00:53:54to know the truth

00:53:55I don't care about anything

00:53:56if in the 60s

00:53:5670 had a relationship

00:53:58no I don't care at all

00:53:59but it's me

00:54:00my brother

00:54:01and my sister

00:54:03we have the right

00:54:04to know the truth

00:54:05not for yes

00:54:06that I after

00:54:07with a proof of 9

00:54:08I discover the truth

00:54:09because you know that

00:54:09I don't stop at anything

00:54:10well more than her

00:54:11the proof of 9

00:54:11they did it

00:54:12let's say

00:54:12who did the investigation

00:54:14I can't believe it

00:54:15to what I'm told

00:54:16then there has already been

00:54:18The

00:54:19The

00:54:20what is his name

00:54:20the fake

00:54:24the fake

00:54:25what is called

00:54:25of the truck

00:54:27OK

00:54:27he is referring to her

00:54:28to a video

00:54:29which has been assembled

00:54:31in that case

00:54:32of a van

00:54:34which was

00:54:35let's say compatible

00:54:36with his

00:54:36that went around and around

00:54:37environment

00:54:37after those

00:54:39no if he wants

00:54:40I'll explain it

00:54:41around the gym

00:54:42and that video

00:54:44it didn't match

00:54:45Absolutely not

00:54:46to the truth

00:54:46it was assembled

00:54:47for communication needs

00:54:49for communication needs

00:54:50so it was objectively

00:54:51a big slip

00:54:52it also goes

00:54:53It must also be said

00:54:54but that

00:54:54that video

00:54:55he never entered

00:54:56it never became evidence

00:54:57that is, he did not enter the trial

00:54:59ninth

00:54:59he entered the debate

00:55:01but it has never constituted

00:55:02a test

00:55:03also because

00:55:03at the beginning yes

00:55:05Borsetti's video

00:55:07viewed 16-17 times

00:55:08walk around the cameras

00:55:09no no but in fact

00:55:10but look

00:55:10it weighed heavily

00:55:11no it didn't weigh

00:55:12why didn't he come in?

00:55:13in the process

00:55:14and it is not constituted evidence

00:55:15but it's obvious

00:55:16which was a slip-up

00:55:17after which

00:55:18his car

00:55:19his

00:55:21Iveco

00:55:21it was there

00:55:23his Iveco

00:55:24it's passed

00:55:25it wasn't

00:55:26I have never lied

00:55:27of not having passed

00:55:28me every day

00:55:28I passed by that road

00:55:29let's say that video

00:55:30but

00:55:30I passed by every day

00:55:31the fact takes it away

00:55:32which then

00:55:33there was

00:55:34let's say

00:55:34at a compatible time

00:55:35with the timetables

00:55:37which have concerned

00:55:38this story

00:55:38there was his Iveco

00:55:40Anyway

00:55:40the question

00:55:41returning to his father

00:55:43I wanted to ask

00:55:43if when

00:55:45she knew

00:55:46this news

00:55:46who was already in prison

00:55:47the fact

00:55:49that his father

00:55:49he wasn't his father

00:55:51it's a story

00:55:51that made her suffer

00:55:53Yes

00:55:54Very

00:55:55even if they are not

00:55:56Borsetti Giovanni's son

00:55:59for me he is the real father

00:56:00Why

00:56:00he is the only person

00:56:02who was by my side

00:56:02he raised me

00:56:03he always loved me

00:56:05regardless of everything

00:56:07and continued it

00:56:08to call

00:56:09Pope

00:56:10absolutely

00:56:11he came to visit her

00:56:12in prison

00:56:12he always came to visit her

00:56:13as long as he could

00:56:14and has always shown

00:56:15support

00:56:16towards him

00:56:16Always

00:56:17and he lived

00:56:18this absence

00:56:19no this absence

00:56:20let's say

00:56:21this discovery

00:56:22this lack

00:56:23of respect

00:56:23from his wife

00:56:24of my mother

00:56:25the other one too

00:56:27his brother

00:56:27it turned out

00:56:28in a son

00:56:28of his father

00:56:30Fabio no?

00:56:31Fabio is not a son

00:56:32nor of Guerinoni

00:56:32nor of John

00:56:34have you ever thought

00:56:37that his father

00:56:39knew

00:56:39that you were not

00:56:40his children?

00:56:42I wanted to expose you

00:56:43this question

00:56:44but it was no longer

00:56:45conscious lately

00:56:46because when it came out

00:56:47the discovery

00:56:49by Guerinoni

00:56:51unfortunately my father

00:56:52he was already affected

00:56:53from a tumor

00:56:55to the pancreas

00:56:56he could barely

00:56:57with the shepherd

00:56:57to enter prison

00:56:58but I didn't want to

00:56:59I didn't want to

00:57:01he didn't want to say

00:57:03amplify

00:57:04that suffering

00:57:04Absolutely not

00:57:05it would have been worse

00:57:07for him

00:57:08listen when it was

00:57:09made known

00:57:10that was sought

00:57:10an illegitimate child

00:57:12by Guerinoni

00:57:13No?

00:57:14and when

00:57:15let's say then

00:57:16they made the DNA

00:57:17to his mother

00:57:18Yes

00:57:18then his mother

00:57:19at that moment

00:57:21he could understand a little

00:57:23that the circle

00:57:24it was closing

00:57:26about his son

00:57:27that's where I pressed her

00:57:29but

00:57:29to her

00:57:30his mother

00:57:31he never made him understand anything

00:57:32he never told him anything

00:57:34never

00:57:35I encouraged her

00:57:37I told him

00:57:38tell me the truth

00:57:38that much earlier

00:57:39then the truth will come out

00:57:40he is forced to leave

00:57:42Tell me

00:57:42no Massimo

00:57:43insistently

00:57:44he told me

00:57:45no Massimo

00:57:45nor you

00:57:46nor Laura

00:57:47nor Fabio

00:57:47you are my children

00:57:49and by Bossetti Giovanni

00:57:50don't listen

00:57:51when everything comes to you

00:57:52then his mother

00:57:53he invented

00:57:54a little thing

00:57:55unlikely

00:57:55that there had been

00:57:56an insemination

00:57:56without

00:57:57without his knowledge

00:57:59let's say there

00:57:59I have a strong doubt

00:58:01alright

00:58:01At that time

00:58:03it's true that

00:58:04the sperm bank

00:58:05in the 60s and 70s

00:58:06it was not known

00:58:09legitimacy

00:58:10in Italy

00:58:13but what I don't understand

00:58:14is that a person

00:58:15a woman

00:58:15she goes to the gynecologist

00:58:16as

00:58:17yes because

00:58:17she told

00:58:18who went to the gynecologist

00:58:19to do

00:58:20and says

00:58:20I wonder if he has me

00:58:21inseminated

00:58:22he feels that it comes to him

00:58:22this unchosen one

00:58:23cold liquid

00:58:24and it does not arise

00:58:24certain questions

00:58:25to the gynecologist

00:58:26but she too

00:58:26but let's say

00:58:27which maybe wasn't true

00:58:28No?

00:58:28the most likely thing

00:58:29is that this story

00:58:30it was a bit

00:58:31but I know the reason

00:58:32why do I say so

00:58:32because Fabio too

00:58:33he is not a son

00:58:33OK

00:58:34Therefore

00:58:35that's why I asked her

00:58:37if in any way

00:58:39but it's one thing

00:58:40very private

00:58:41so of course

00:58:42if his father

00:58:44knew

00:58:44if in any way

00:58:45knows

00:58:45Perhaps

00:58:46you never gave me

00:58:47an evidence

00:58:47to be able to understand it

00:58:49listen to her

00:58:50he felt a lot of anger

00:58:51in the letter

00:58:52that she wrote

00:58:52and which he made public

00:58:54that is, you will touch your mother

00:58:55you knew

00:58:56you held me

00:58:56unaware of everything

00:58:57and you didn't give me

00:58:57not even the opportunity

00:58:58to be able to know

00:58:59our real father

00:59:01Well

00:59:01then I say thank you

00:59:02for the very strong pain

00:59:03and anger

00:59:03that you got me

00:59:04the anger has all gone away

00:59:06or does he still have it inside?

00:59:08I still have it inside me

00:59:09it doesn't pass

00:59:10because I'm sorry

00:59:11because I no longer had the chance

00:59:12to encourage her

00:59:15as I would have liked

00:59:15to talk to her sincerely

00:59:17When

00:59:18when she

00:59:19before she died

00:59:21you've made yourselves clear

00:59:22or your relationship

00:59:23did it remain a bit like this resolved?

00:59:25No

00:59:25we are never clear

00:59:26she has always supported

00:59:29that we children

00:59:30if we were children

00:59:32of young bosses

00:59:33in Zufiesta

00:59:34that's all there is to it

00:59:35it's always

00:59:36look

00:59:37she brought herself

00:59:37in the tomb

00:59:38that undenominational secret

00:59:39feel in prison

00:59:41she also came

00:59:42aware

00:59:42we mentioned before

00:59:44to infidelities

00:59:45of his wife

00:59:46can I ask you?

00:59:47how did he react

00:59:48at the moment

00:59:49when did he find out?

00:59:52look

00:59:52when to me

00:59:53I was told

00:59:53something like that

00:59:54from public prosecutor

00:59:56he was talking to me

00:59:58from the

01:00:00of the case in question

01:00:01Like this

01:00:01How much

01:00:02he stands up

01:00:04and squanders

01:00:04the 420

01:00:05And

01:00:05Mr. President

01:00:06I have here

01:00:06a document

01:00:08That

01:00:09attests

01:00:10that the

01:00:10the lady

01:00:12she marries

01:00:14has stories

01:00:15it was marital

01:00:16I froze

01:00:19because first of all

01:00:21Why

01:00:22I'll explain it to you right away

01:00:23the reason

01:00:24because first of all

01:00:25I couldn't believe it

01:00:26in one thing

01:00:27put on by PM

01:00:28because I believe that

01:00:29but then

01:00:31what did they have to do with it?

01:00:32intimate things

01:00:33private

01:00:33family members

01:00:34related to the case

01:00:35OK

01:00:35he wanted

01:00:36Unfortunately

01:00:37let's say that

01:00:37during an event

01:00:38she's already looking for it

01:00:39in private life

01:00:40of the family

01:00:40and you can find a bit of everything

01:00:42psychologically

01:00:43try to bring me down

01:00:45given that

01:00:45he couldn't do it

01:00:46what did I do then

01:00:47the similarity

01:00:48he continued to tell me

01:00:49to ask

01:00:50the APM

01:00:50question me

01:00:51the president

01:00:51the lawyers

01:00:53participate

01:00:53my head

01:00:54it was no longer there

01:00:54my head

01:00:55it was addressed

01:00:56at that event

01:00:58to that one

01:00:58to marry

01:00:59to my wife

01:01:00that was behind

01:01:01to the lawyers

01:01:02OK

01:01:03to see the attitudes

01:01:04Like this

01:01:04I could understand

01:01:06when I noticed

01:01:08lower your head

01:01:09and the lawyer

01:01:10Camporini

01:01:11OK

01:01:12to put a hand on it

01:01:13on the head

01:01:14how to say

01:01:15I have already perceived

01:01:16how to say

01:01:17cabbage

01:01:18Massimo came

01:01:19knowledge of this

01:01:20I read this

01:01:20in them

01:01:21the attitudes

01:01:21I understood it

01:01:22from the attitudes

01:01:23of his wife

01:01:23what happened

01:01:24it was a Friday

01:01:24I remember

01:01:25because I remember

01:01:26this event

01:01:27why Saturday

01:01:28I had an interview

01:01:29with my wife

01:01:31it was a mess for him

01:01:33I didn't sleep

01:01:34all night long

01:01:36until

01:01:37in the morning

01:01:38Obviously

01:01:38I do the interviews

01:01:39Always

01:01:40alone

01:01:41in salt

01:01:42without noise

01:01:43underlying

01:01:44because I was

01:01:44intercepted

01:01:46and I asked

01:01:47to my wife

01:01:47he knew that everything

01:01:49that he said

01:01:50it was always

01:01:50absolutely

01:01:51Yes

01:01:51I knew it

01:01:51Why

01:01:52how did I understand it?

01:01:53Obviously

01:01:54it's not that they tell me

01:01:55obviously it is understood

01:01:56from the attitudes

01:01:58when a person

01:01:59enters a classroom

01:01:59this means

01:02:00that she was also careful

01:02:01he measured his words

01:02:01No

01:02:02No

01:02:03I have always been

01:02:04Calm

01:02:05it's not that I thought the words

01:02:06even though I knew

01:02:07that I was being intercepted

01:02:08No

01:02:08Attention

01:02:09because that's what it means

01:02:09to see it below

01:02:11another aspect

01:02:11No

01:02:12it's not in that case

01:02:13That

01:02:13No

01:02:13Attention

01:02:15I asked my wife

01:02:16tell me the truth

01:02:18is it true or is it not true

01:02:18what I heard yesterday

01:02:19is it true or is it not true

01:02:21and when she then

01:02:22he put it

01:02:23and there

01:02:23I left

01:02:24in a rage

01:02:25in the sense

01:02:28enough go away

01:02:29he doesn't want anything more

01:02:30Enough

01:02:31and there

01:02:31Unfortunately

01:02:33the head is gone

01:02:34when he closed me

01:02:35in the cell

01:02:37And

01:02:37I tried

01:02:39what

01:02:39we wouldn't have wanted to

01:02:41arrive

01:02:41Meaning what

01:02:42he attempted suicide

01:02:44Exactly

01:02:44or where

01:02:44and what did he do

01:02:46how he attempted it

01:02:47suicide

01:02:48Unfortunately

01:02:49it happened to me

01:02:50that the head

01:02:51she had left

01:02:51And

01:02:53and I was found

01:02:54they found me

01:02:55with the head

01:02:56immersed in the sink

01:02:57with a

01:02:58neck belt

01:02:59I do not know

01:02:59I can't understand

01:03:00how could I

01:03:02put this belt around my neck

01:03:04And

01:03:06it happened

01:03:07That

01:03:08that they found her like this

01:03:09they managed to run

01:03:10And

01:03:11take me

01:03:12in the infirmary

01:03:13of the prison

01:03:14and save me

01:03:16I do not know

01:03:17how did it happen

01:03:18I do not know

01:03:18must

01:03:19be there at that moment

01:03:20I don't understand either

01:03:22Meaning what

01:03:22faced with a strong drama

01:03:23I didn't think about the drama

01:03:25of my poor children

01:03:26after what they were already experiencing

01:03:28that they did not see

01:03:28At that time

01:03:29who don't wait for the moment

01:03:30and be able to hug me again

01:03:31and unfortunately

01:03:31you have to be

01:03:32but if I ask him

01:03:33that is, she somehow

01:03:34he found himself

01:03:36she said

01:03:36with his head in the sink

01:03:38this belt

01:03:38I don't know how it happened

01:03:39Exactly

01:03:40but if she doesn't know how it happened

01:03:41and he lived this moment of trance

01:03:43and there is this void

01:03:44it is not thought

01:03:45I was told

01:03:46because it was found on

01:03:47I had the evidence

01:03:48but she

01:03:49he did something

01:03:50he made a gesture

01:03:51because I didn't want anything anymore

01:03:53that I didn't have

01:03:54but a gesture that removed

01:03:55do you understand where I'm going with this?

01:03:58a gesture that removed

01:03:59she didn't even realize

01:04:01how it got there

01:04:02to put the belt around your neck

01:04:03he didn't remember

01:04:04you have to be in those situations

01:04:05of percappi

01:04:06but I don't look

01:04:06I'm not saying how it got there

01:04:07because then in a situation

01:04:09of constraint

01:04:10in prison

01:04:10he felt abandoned

01:04:11the reasons can be X

01:04:14but she didn't remember

01:04:15he didn't realize

01:04:16that what he was doing

01:04:18maybe even on another occasion

01:04:19it happened

01:04:20No

01:04:21let's not compare

01:04:22this situation here

01:04:23but he understood

01:04:24that initial question of mine

01:04:25what was it?

01:04:26No

01:04:26the ability to remove

01:04:28so does it exist?

01:04:29No

01:04:30alright

01:04:30hear your wife

01:04:31is he still by her side?

01:04:33he's always by my side

01:04:35Obviously

01:04:36not sharing

01:04:38the same space

01:04:39the family dress

01:04:40Obviously

01:04:41materially

01:04:43physically

01:04:44No

01:04:45but

01:04:46but he feels it

01:04:47at his side

01:04:48her honestly?

01:04:50Yes

01:04:50we always hear from each other

01:04:51we are close

01:04:52we are united

01:04:53do you feel his support?

01:04:55I feel his support

01:04:56his support

01:04:57he always reiterated to me

01:04:59to stay strong

01:05:00that I have always been there

01:05:02listen but

01:05:03sorry to ask

01:05:04she thinks to herself

01:05:05that his wife

01:05:06she stayed by her side

01:05:08because she is convinced

01:05:08of his innocence

01:05:09or because she is his wife

01:05:10and mother of his children?

01:05:12which could also be

01:05:13which does not mean

01:05:14That

01:05:14absolutely yes

01:05:15then no

01:05:16because she is convinced

01:05:17of my

01:05:17absolute innocence

01:05:20he knows me

01:05:21he knows who I am

01:05:24who loves her

01:05:25even today

01:05:26aside

01:05:26his wife

01:05:29the people who know me

01:05:31who write to me

01:05:31they always wrote to me

01:05:32All right

01:05:33you know when I speak

01:05:34of affection

01:05:34friends

01:05:35the affection

01:05:35love

01:05:36I didn't miss it

01:05:36the people

01:05:37that I always had

01:05:38Neighbor

01:05:39how often

01:05:40he sees his children

01:05:41Instead?

01:05:41every week

01:05:42I saw this morning

01:05:43my son

01:05:43Nicholas

01:05:44you know what I have left

01:05:45imprinted dad?

01:05:47the slamming

01:05:48of those doors there

01:05:49when they locked you up

01:05:51Mom never told you

01:05:52but

01:05:54I was in tears

01:05:55to the eyes

01:05:58me now

01:05:58I ask you a question

01:05:59what do we say?

01:06:00she

01:06:01his

01:06:02it's the premise

01:06:03constant

01:06:03is that she

01:06:04Yes

01:06:04let's say

01:06:05professes innocence

01:06:06No?

01:06:06Therefore

01:06:07let's ask a question

01:06:08That

01:06:08put it in your eyes

01:06:10and in the gaze

01:06:12of the others

01:06:13she

01:06:15could ever

01:06:15confess

01:06:16let's say

01:06:17having

01:06:18three children

01:06:19and knowing

01:06:19what it would entail

01:06:22Understood?

01:06:22what do I mean?

01:06:24look

01:06:24if I had been

01:06:25the author

01:06:26the creator

01:06:26of this horrendous crime

01:06:27I wouldn't have hesitated

01:06:28not even ten seconds

01:06:29during that arrest

01:06:30there

01:06:30No

01:06:30because I was

01:06:31aware

01:06:32that even by dint of fury

01:06:33to investigate

01:06:34the truth would have emerged

01:06:35No

01:06:35it's not my case

01:06:37I don't know how else to say it

01:06:38ninth

01:06:39but she

01:06:40his position

01:06:41it hasn't changed for eleven years

01:06:42so it's not that

01:06:43I was expecting

01:06:43that he said something else

01:06:44but I understood

01:06:44the question was that

01:06:45we want to have the courage

01:06:46to throw down

01:06:47this scientific result

01:06:48I repeat

01:06:48before the eyes

01:06:49of the whole world

01:06:50to affirm

01:06:51maybe that one

01:06:52which is supported

01:06:53but it is a scientific result

01:06:54very serious

01:06:54and I didn't see it

01:06:56I didn't do my due diligence

01:06:58it has not been done

01:06:58a contradictory incident

01:06:59in the 50 hearings

01:07:00and I have the right

01:07:01to be able to repeat it

01:07:03right

01:07:03let's say that the test

01:07:05of DNA

01:07:05it is usually repeatable

01:07:07the defense

01:07:07the request

01:07:08and they could have

01:07:09I can't be sure

01:07:10to accept

01:07:11a result

01:07:12never performed

01:07:13but she

01:07:14he didn't do it

01:07:15personally

01:07:16his expert

01:07:16but they did it

01:07:17people

01:07:19professionals

01:07:19at the service

01:07:20of justice

01:07:21which they repeated

01:07:22over and over again

01:07:22he always gave

01:07:23the same outcome

01:07:24even in a way

01:07:25Safe

01:07:25how many workers

01:07:27they did it

01:07:27but I can tell you

01:07:28one thing

01:07:29she arrived

01:07:30to the third degree

01:07:31of judgment

01:07:33unfortunately for her

01:07:34always with the same outcome

01:07:36that is, she

01:07:37has always had

01:07:38convictions

01:07:39there were no

01:07:41fluctuating results

01:07:43between a process

01:07:43and another

01:07:44it has always been

01:07:45leaded

01:07:46but I understood

01:07:47it's not that

01:07:48you can think

01:07:50to a conspiracy

01:07:50against a person

01:07:51of which none

01:07:52possessed the DNA

01:07:53that is, they arrived

01:07:54to his DNA

01:07:55why was he there

01:07:56and then they tried

01:07:57who was she

01:07:57not vice versa

01:07:59it's not that the era

01:08:00suspected

01:08:00and then they checked

01:08:01if there was DNA

01:08:02Here you are

01:08:04the only laboratory

01:08:05which he carried out

01:08:06the analysis

01:08:06it's the rice of Parma

01:08:07OK

01:08:07the secret rooms

01:08:09Then

01:08:10in the form of paper

01:08:11sent to third parties

01:08:12it's normal

01:08:13that I send

01:08:14a table

01:08:15a numerical table

01:08:16if I do

01:08:17my analyses

01:08:18I'm sending to the lab

01:08:19a table

01:08:19she will see

01:08:19I can say one thing

01:08:20it's just DNA

01:08:22it's improvised

01:08:23or it is invented

01:08:24or it is created

01:08:25or you can find it again

01:08:26if there is, there is

01:08:27and if that's it

01:08:28it is univocal

01:08:28so unfortunately

01:08:29there was

01:08:29it's not just a coincidence

01:08:32they build

01:08:32a laboratory

01:08:33a DNA

01:08:33and look at that

01:08:34he lives right there

01:08:35they didn't have it

01:08:36I don't understand

01:08:36but why get fixated?

01:08:38on a given

01:08:39we want to do it again

01:08:41we want to do it again

01:08:42the analyses

01:08:45objectively

01:08:45make it official

01:08:47of belonging

01:08:48of this table

01:08:48Unfortunately

01:08:49when she says

01:08:49the official

01:08:50the official

01:08:50there is

01:08:51on this

01:08:51I tell her

01:08:52Understood

01:08:52if she were

01:08:52in my place

01:08:53back to the question

01:08:54since he left me

01:08:55she would have been satisfied

01:08:57from the outcome

01:08:58from the outcome

01:08:59provided

01:09:00on the part of the prosecution

01:09:02or he would have asked

01:09:03insistently

01:09:04to be able to acquire

01:09:05the champions

01:09:06to analyze them

01:09:07to see

01:09:08an outcome

01:09:09probably

01:09:10it would have been

01:09:10the same

01:09:11or nothing

01:09:11because maybe

01:09:12they were

01:09:12normality

01:09:13of any citizen

01:09:14requires a right

01:09:15of defense

01:09:16it's always been said

01:09:18that DNA

01:09:18it's a lot

01:09:19for other times

01:09:20consecutive

01:09:20I am told

01:09:21it was found

01:09:21on many points

01:09:22after which

01:09:23every time

01:09:23which is analyzed

01:09:24the track

01:09:25it is deteriorated

01:09:26is consumed

01:09:27that's why

01:09:27that the proof

01:09:29of DNA

01:09:29is considered

01:09:30unrepeatable

01:09:30it was done

01:09:31without defense

01:09:32Why

01:09:33when it was made

01:09:34was unknown 1

01:09:35it wasn't Massimo Bossetti

01:09:37it's understood

01:09:38the request

01:09:39to be able to analyze

01:09:40I always have it

01:09:41requested

01:09:42look

01:09:42we know what the suspect is

01:09:43I'm saying it now

01:09:44that is, in my opinion

01:09:45it was necessary to allow

01:09:46to the defense

01:09:47to have access

01:09:47to the tests

01:09:48after which

01:09:48probably the defense

01:09:49knowing well

01:09:50which was consumed

01:09:50there would have been

01:09:51a null outcome

01:09:52Why

01:09:52if it was consumed

01:09:53Perhaps

01:09:53and it would have been used

01:09:55let's say

01:09:55the result

01:09:57the second degree

01:09:57but what has been done

01:09:59the analyses that have been done

01:10:00they found

01:10:00a DNA

01:10:01that cannot be invented

01:10:03on the panties

01:10:03of Tietigliara

01:10:05but I can't be satisfied

01:10:06of a judgment

01:10:07not given to the defense

01:10:08for you to accept

01:10:09and accept

01:10:09what they say

01:10:10it's not that they say it

01:10:11it was found

01:10:12it has been analyzed

01:10:13he doesn't soak up

01:10:15from them

01:10:15but he's not talking

01:10:16my defense

01:10:17he didn't analyze it

01:10:17it's not that there can be

01:10:18a conspiracy

01:10:19it's the opposite

01:10:20they found a DNA

01:10:21and they came to her

01:10:22why DNA

01:10:23it is the unique signature

01:10:24we want to have the courage

01:10:25repeat it and watch

01:10:26who does it belong to?

01:10:27to her

01:10:28why DNA

01:10:29a book with the signature

01:10:30that's it

01:10:30they say it

01:10:31she from 2017

01:10:33years ago he said

01:10:34I have never changed

01:10:35my good way of being

01:10:36it hasn't really changed

01:10:38in nothing

01:10:38she in here

01:10:39he didn't understand things about her

01:10:41of any kind

01:10:42which he had not previously understood

01:10:43he didn't let me open it

01:10:44the eyes

01:10:44justice

01:10:47but about her

01:10:48no personally

01:10:50intimately

01:10:50he understood something

01:10:52more than himself

01:10:53he also took a path

01:10:54psychological

01:10:55on my path

01:10:57about my personality

01:10:58No

01:10:58he understood

01:10:58on his personality

01:10:59No

01:10:59her

01:11:00on his character

01:11:01No

01:11:01I became

01:11:02No

01:11:02why the anger

01:11:03as I said earlier

01:11:04acquires me

01:11:06strength to move forward

01:11:08hear how it goes

01:11:09with the other inmates

01:11:10Everything is OK

01:11:11Everything OK

01:11:11he found friends

01:11:13or he's more on his own

01:11:14she

01:11:16friends in prison

01:11:17companions

01:11:18difficult

01:11:19companions

01:11:20companions of

01:11:20of misfortune

01:11:21And

01:11:22it is shared

01:11:24everyday life

01:11:25as always

01:11:26and lived

01:11:28episodes of hostility

01:11:29towards him

01:11:30by the inmates

01:11:31when he arrived

01:11:31at the beginning yes

01:11:31a lot

01:11:32negative way

01:11:34try to think for yourself

01:11:35that when you come

01:11:36pointed out on television

01:11:37of everything that came out

01:11:39and that when you are accused

01:11:40of certain types of crimes

01:11:41they told you to end it

01:11:43which was better

01:11:43because there is excrement

01:11:44for the company

01:11:45It was hard at first

01:11:46but I think it's hard

01:11:47like this for everyone

01:11:48when he is accused

01:11:49from a horrendous crime

01:11:50and now he found

01:11:51a way of life

01:11:52I found

01:11:53more respect

01:11:54more humanity

01:11:56she

01:11:57immediately after

01:11:58the arrest

01:11:59one year after the arrest

01:12:00let's say

01:12:00he told Yara

01:12:01I have a thought for you

01:12:02everyday

01:12:03I always

01:12:04in my prayers

01:12:04evenings

01:12:05there is always inside her

01:12:06Why

01:12:08I was singled out

01:12:09several times

01:12:10by journalists

01:12:10saying

01:12:11alright

01:12:11Bossetti

01:12:11can write

01:12:12to journalists

01:12:12can say everything

01:12:13whatever he wants

01:12:14but stop it

01:12:15to mention the name Yara

01:12:16No

01:12:17I Yara

01:12:18I always throw it in the balm

01:12:19but why the reason

01:12:19but out of respect

01:12:20of the parents too

01:12:21I know it's annoying

01:12:22to speak

01:12:23the problem

01:12:24that I and the Arabs

01:12:25we had

01:12:26deserved justice

01:12:27that's why

01:12:27that I will always quote her

01:12:30what day is it

01:12:32of his life

01:12:32what would you like to relive?

01:12:39the day that

01:12:42I got married

01:12:44and every day

01:12:45that my wife

01:12:46he gave me

01:12:49a son

01:12:52what day is it

01:12:53what would change instead?

01:12:55it's the day

01:12:55of the arrest

01:12:57that I would change

01:12:59the day of the arrest

01:13:00it was awful

01:13:01what is his scar

01:13:03in life

01:13:05deep

01:13:05Not

01:13:05before the arrest

01:13:10that of having known

01:13:11of infidelity

01:13:12of my wife

01:13:12and that remains

01:13:14his scar

01:13:15bigger?

01:13:16Yes

01:13:16do you think?

01:13:18I have always believed

01:13:19I have always believed

01:13:22in God

01:13:23I have always believed

01:13:24are you praying?

01:13:25I always pray

01:13:26and asks

01:13:27is he asking for forgiveness?

01:13:28it's not that I'm asking for forgiveness

01:13:29I ask for help

01:13:30and never asks

01:13:33is he just asking for help?

01:13:35I have nothing

01:13:36I have to forgive

01:13:37What forgiveness should I ask for?

01:13:39I have nothing to forgive

01:13:41what do you expect?

01:13:42when will it come out

01:13:44to find out there?

01:13:46I can't

01:13:49I can't

01:13:50see my future

01:13:50I live with strength

01:13:52everyday

01:13:53every step of my life

01:13:54I live in the present today

01:13:56then fate

01:13:57will take me

01:13:57who knows where

01:13:58I do not know

01:13:59Unfortunately, life is unpredictable.

01:14:00by nature

01:14:01And

01:14:02until you're out

01:14:04from prison

01:14:05you can't expect anything

01:14:07I can't imagine the future

01:14:10Thank you

01:14:12to you

01:14:13thank you all

Massimo Bossetti | Belve Crime 2025 [HQ]

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