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00:00Ooh, hello there, and good morning to everybody out there.
00:03It is the morning roast on this fabulous Friday, April 24th.
00:09Sam Lundman in for Joe Spadoni alongside Joe Shasky
00:13as the 49ers were on the clock last night
00:15in the first round of the NFL draft.
00:18And then they traded back from 27 to 30.
00:21And then they were on the clock again at number 30.
00:23And then they traded back again to number 33.
00:27So they will have the first pick of the second round of the NFL draft,
00:32which, of course, continues this evening.
00:34Good morning again to everybody out there.
00:36Joe Shasky, how are you doing this morning?
00:37Good morning.
00:38I think the simple question is 888-957-9570.
00:42Did you like their strategy?
00:44Did you think they got enough?
00:46And I look at this in a variety of ways.
00:49As the 49ers tell me on one end,
00:52hey, we don't think we have any glaring holes.
00:55Hmm.
00:57Interesting.
00:58Then why are you trading down?
01:00I think that they acknowledged rightfully, properly,
01:04that they do have a lot of holes in the sense of
01:07they need to fill out a variety of positions
01:10and create depth on this team.
01:12And though they've done some really nice things this offseason,
01:15they are not done.
01:16You know, I was listening to, you know,
01:18Evan Giddings and Grandy,
01:20and they were doing kind of the breakdown.
01:22And I just disagree with Evan.
01:25And I think he was trying to make a point
01:26that their offseason,
01:27they were trying to acquire things
01:29and that the draft is less valuable.
01:30No, no, no, no.
01:31I actually think it's the reverse.
01:32I think that they saw this and they go,
01:34no, no, we don't need one player at 27
01:36and then wait again until the 50s.
01:38No, no, what we need is we need to have
01:40two or three players
01:43between whenever we thought we were going to pick at 27
01:46and whenever our next pick is close to 58.
01:48And so I love the strategy from the Niners.
01:52Now, we can debate about the second trade back.
01:55They did a first trade back
01:56and they got themselves essentially the 90th overall pick.
02:00Correct.
02:00Yeah.
02:00So the trades, by the way,
02:03that the Niners did last night against,
02:04they were starting at 27.
02:06The first trade they did was with the Miami Dolphins.
02:08They 49ers sent their 27th pick
02:10and one of their fourth round compensatory picks,
02:13pick number 138 to Miami.
02:15Miami sent back their first rounder
02:17that they had at number 30,
02:19as well as number 90,
02:21which will be at the back of the third round.
02:23Niners then flipped that 30th pick
02:25over towards the Jets,
02:28got that 33rd pick,
02:30which is the first of the second round tonight,
02:31as well as 179,
02:33which will come in the fifth round.
02:35I've said for a long time
02:36that the draft itself
02:38isn't just about picking the right players.
02:40Ultimately, is that what you're judged by?
02:43Absolutely.
02:43Part of it, yeah.
02:44It's also, to a degree,
02:47an exercise in value,
02:49almost like an economic one, if you will.
02:51It's an exercise almost in market,
02:54like you would be buying a house.
02:56And so, who you take
02:58and where you take them
02:59on draft day, to me, does matter.
03:02Now, ultimately, if those guys hit,
03:04it doesn't matter where you took them
03:05as long as they hit.
03:06Now, you find George Kittle in the fifth round,
03:08we're doing cartwheels.
03:10You draft Mike McGlinchey 10th overall
03:12and you don't re-sign them
03:14and you let them walk,
03:15it doesn't look as good.
03:17Right?
03:17And so, I look at this as,
03:20I like that they traded down.
03:22The second trade down.
03:24Didn't love the compensation
03:26as much as I liked the first one.
03:28Now, why can I kind of sell myself
03:32on the 33rd overall pick
03:34from what the Niners have now,
03:35which means that'll be the first pick today.
03:38Every team in the NFL
03:41has to sleep
03:42on looking at that big board
03:45and go,
03:47this guy we like is right there.
03:50What is this team gonna do at 34,
03:53at 35,
03:54at 36?
03:55Could we jump up?
03:56Should we get aggressive?
03:57And I think,
03:59the more and more I've thought about it,
04:00I don't think there's a big difference now
04:02on the fifth year option
04:03that there used to be.
04:04When you have a first round pick,
04:05you get a fifth year option.
04:08When you have a first round pick,
04:09there's a label to that.
04:12There is.
04:13If I would have told you
04:14there was only like six picks
04:15separating Ricky Pearsall and Debo,
04:18yet the way we talk about Pearsall
04:19and the way we talk about Debo,
04:21we're very, very dramatically different.
04:23The perception of a first rounder
04:25is that if you are going in that top three,
04:27two,
04:28you're a game-changing type of player,
04:30an instant impact type of player.
04:32Exactly.
04:33Your entirety of your career,
04:34you're going to be expected
04:35to be playing at that level.
04:37Because if you're in the first round,
04:38you're, in theory, Shasky,
04:40an all-pro Hall of Fame level town.
04:43Not that those don't exist later
04:44in the draft, obviously,
04:45but that is the expectation
04:47that comes with it.
04:48So a guy like a Ricky Pearsall,
04:50when you get production
04:52that's basically second, third,
04:53fourth round quality
04:54from a guy you take in the first round,
04:56as you say,
04:56you talk about value in the draft,
04:58that's where that value gets lost.
04:59A hundred percent.
05:00And so I sit here today
05:01and I'm thinking to myself,
05:02if I'm the Niners,
05:03you're making every team in the league
05:05look at that draft board overnight
05:07and just kind of get uneasy.
05:09And I think they're going to trade down
05:10one more time.
05:11I think Niner fans should be ready for it.
05:12I think they're going to trade
05:13one more time
05:14right here to start the day at 33.
05:16And then, you know,
05:18we will see if they nail the picks.
05:20Like, ultimately,
05:21Sam,
05:21I could love the strategy
05:23of trading down.
05:24They need players.
05:26Yes.
05:26And they need to hit
05:27on a couple of these picks.
05:29So I asked Niner fans,
05:31do you want one bite
05:32at the apple at 27?
05:34Knowing their draft history?
05:36Or do you want multiple bites
05:37in that second and third round
05:39to be able to nail
05:41some of these picks?
05:41I think I would prefer
05:43the multiple bites.
05:44No, I agree with you, Shasky.
05:45Basically,
05:45what the Niners did
05:46is they took their first round pick
05:47at 27
05:48and basically added
05:49a couple more picks.
05:50So they had six.
05:51Now they're up to seven picks
05:53now in this draft
05:54with this first one coming today.
05:56First things first,
05:56we are coming to you live
05:57from the Laughing Monk Studios.
05:58Laughing Monk,
05:59righteously brewed in San Francisco.
06:00The Morning Rose
06:00is also presented by
06:01the San Francisco Fire Credit Union
06:02banking for heroes
06:03and anyone who wants
06:04to be treated like one.
06:05Joe, you mentioned off the rip
06:06about the glaring holes
06:08that John Lynch said
06:09maybe were not there
06:10for this roster.
06:11And I don't know,
06:12maybe if I'm going to do
06:12a little bit of detective work here
06:14and do some deductive reasoning
06:15like Sherlock Holmes,
06:16I don't think he was being honest
06:18when he said that.
06:19No, I don't think so either.
06:20That might have just...
06:21Yeah, exactly.
06:22And I don't know,
06:23I'm sure every other GM
06:24probably rolled their eyes
06:24like, come on, John,
06:25we know you're smart enough
06:26to know this.
06:27We made kind of a hoopla about it.
06:29Are the Niners aware of their needs?
06:30How could they say
06:30they don't have any glaring holes?
06:32To your point,
06:33you don't make a move like this
06:34unless you do have glaring holes.
06:36We all had a feeling yesterday
06:38they were going to make
06:38a pick back,
06:40a trade to move back from 27.
06:43Because again,
06:43I think some of the other things
06:44that Lynch was saying this week
06:45kind of set the stage for that.
06:47They did not have
06:48a ton of first round grades
06:49that they had for this draft.
06:51And when he's saying
06:53we don't have glaring holes,
06:54you treat that as,
06:55well, I'm going to take
06:56the opposite meaning
06:57of what you're saying there.
06:58You do have glaring holes.
07:00You needed more players.
07:02All of your draft picks
07:03were sequestered
07:04at the back of the fourth round.
07:05It's not that they needed
07:06more picks, Chaski.
07:07They also need to spread out
07:08where those picks were at.
07:10Now they're in the third round too.
07:11They have two picks
07:12in the second round as well.
07:13So not only do you have more picks,
07:15but the way they're distributed
07:17throughout the draft,
07:18I think,
07:18enables you to find
07:20more options
07:21that could fill
07:21some of these needs
07:22that they have to fill here.
07:23I think that's well said.
07:26Back to the first round thing.
07:27Yes.
07:28Do you hold first rounders
07:29in high regard?
07:30Oh, yes.
07:31Will you acknowledge
07:32that the fourth pick
07:33is not equivalent
07:34to the 28th pick?
07:35Exactly.
07:35That was going to be
07:36the next thing I was to say.
07:36I would say that the top 16
07:38in the draft
07:39versus 17 through 32,
07:41do they get that first round cachet?
07:44Absolutely.
07:45To your point, though,
07:46there's different levels
07:47of cachet in that first round.
07:49So when I bring up
07:50a couple of players,
07:51if I bring up Lamar Jackson,
07:53what round was he taking in?
07:54He was in the 32nd pick,
07:57so at the end of the first round.
07:58Okay.
07:59But do people call him
08:00a first rounder?
08:01Yes.
08:01Yeah, yeah.
08:02What about Drew Brees?
08:04Drew Brees,
08:05he was drafted in the top 10.
08:06No, he was not.
08:07Was he?
08:07No, he was not.
08:08No, he was his second round pick.
08:09I'm confusing Rivers
08:10and me.
08:11Yeah, yeah, you are.
08:12That's okay.
08:12He was a second round pick.
08:14He was also drafted 32 overall.
08:17That was before the Texans showed up.
08:18Oh, that was back.
08:19There was only 31 teams.
08:20All right.
08:20But the way we talked about
08:21Drew Brees forever
08:22was like, oh, this plucky guy.
08:23They found him late in the draft.
08:25And the way we talked about
08:26Lamar Jackson,
08:27they just feel dramatically different.
08:28That's a good point.
08:29And they're the same exact pick.
08:31And so, ultimately,
08:33you need to nail the pick.
08:35It doesn't matter
08:35where you take him.
08:36It does matter
08:37how you can create value
08:38for your team, right?
08:39That is definitely a real thing.
08:41I wonder,
08:42trading down,
08:43is that a Kyle strategy?
08:45Is that a Lynch strategy?
08:47Is that them in concert together?
08:50Is Parag Marate
08:52a part of discussing value
08:56and working the board?
08:57I'm asking out loud.
08:59Well, why would Parag Marate
09:01be part?
09:03He's a numbers guy.
09:04He's really smart.
09:05Well, so is it as simple as
09:07we're trying to find value here?
09:08He's the salary cap guy.
09:10Is it as simple as
09:11this second rounder
09:12is going to give us
09:13first round value
09:14at a second round price?
09:15Is it that simple?
09:16Well, there's a combination.
09:17There's the finances, right?
09:18There's the finances
09:19of how you build your team.
09:20So, you know,
09:22the first round is completely slotted.
09:23And the second round
09:24is kind of slotted,
09:25but not really,
09:26but kind of.
09:26Yeah, and so you do need to know
09:29like how much you're budgeting
09:30for your team.
09:31If you trade up
09:31into the first round,
09:32this will cost me this price tag.
09:34For example,
09:36Jeremiah Love was taken
09:36third overall.
09:38It's an expensive price tag
09:39for a running back
09:40right off the rip.
09:41Yep.
09:42Right?
09:42Because it's slotted.
09:45I also think that there is
09:46a value chart
09:48attached to every single position.
09:50Bill Walsh did a board like this.
09:52Andy Reid's updated it.
09:53Bill Belichick had his own board.
09:55I think that there's
09:57a numerical value
09:58that each team assigns
09:59to each pick
10:00in the entire draft
10:01and future drafts.
10:02And I do think
10:03that there's some math
10:04that you need to work out.
10:05I do.
10:06Now, that's why I go
10:08like the second trade down
10:09where you only got 179
10:11as a compensation
10:12to drop down three slots.
10:14To me, that tells me,
10:15A, there weren't a lot of teams
10:17looking to trade
10:18into that 30 spot.
10:19And B,
10:20I think that they're due
10:22for another trade down
10:24to kind of get a little more.
10:26Yeah.
10:27Because I think they see
10:28five, six, seven different guys
10:29that they could take
10:30with that first pick.
10:32Mm-hmm.
10:32And while I did, you know,
10:33I didn't mind the decision
10:34to trade down,
10:35I do kind of wonder
10:36if maybe they got the value back
10:37for their first round
10:38or overall
10:39that they were kind of hoping to get.
10:41Because there was a lot
10:41of other trades
10:42in this first round, Joe,
10:43last night.
10:43The Texans, they traded,
10:45they had a trade with the Bills
10:47to move up to,
10:48what was it, I guess,
10:4927 here, or sorry, 26.
10:51They got three picks
10:52in return for that one.
10:53A lot of these first round picks
10:55were going for,
10:56they would swap first rounders,
10:57and then you get two picks
10:58later in the draft.
10:59So the Chiefs,
11:00they moved up
11:01to take the Dolphins slot
11:03at, or sorry,
11:05Cleveland slot at six
11:06and sent 974 and 141 to Cleveland.
11:10Basically, a lot of these
11:11first rounders were netting you
11:13two picks later in the draft,
11:15whereas the Niners
11:15only got one.
11:16So I do wonder
11:17if maybe the Niners
11:18were hoping to have gotten
11:19a second pick later on,
11:21or sorry,
11:22another pick later on
11:23in this draft
11:23and weren't able to,
11:24which I think feeds
11:25into your theory
11:26as to why they would
11:27want to trade back again today.
11:28Because maybe seven picks
11:30is not something
11:30they think is enough.
11:31Maybe they feel they need
11:31eight or nine picks
11:32here in this draft
11:33to truly fill out the holes
11:34they have in their roster.
11:35Well, I mean,
11:35if you're just writing down
11:37all their needs,
11:38tight end,
11:39and no order,
11:39tight end,
11:41offensive line,
11:42and you can go tackle
11:42or guard,
11:43center,
11:44I would throw in there,
11:45safety.
11:46How about wide receiver?
11:47Wide receiver's in there
11:48as well, yeah.
11:49What about
11:50cornerback is in there
11:51as well?
11:51Edge rusher.
11:52And edge rusher.
11:53That's the perpetual need.
11:54Now that brings me
11:55to my maybe
11:57final big niner tot,
11:59and we'll get to
11:59the NFC West
12:00and whatnot.
12:01I'm looking at teams
12:02like the New York Giants.
12:03They just took
12:04another edge rusher.
12:05They've got Brian Burns,
12:07Kayvon Thibodeau,
12:08they traded away
12:09one of their D linemen
12:10already this offseason.
12:11Dexter Lawrence.
12:12They have Abdul Carter,
12:13and now they just
12:14drafted a kid today.
12:16Arvell Reese.
12:16So they've got
12:17four edge rushers.
12:18Are we sure
12:19they're not in the
12:20mode of trading
12:21one of those guys away?
12:22Would you take
12:23Kayvon Thibodeau
12:24on this team
12:24for a mid-round pick?
12:26Would you take
12:27Brian Burns
12:28for,
12:29I'm just throwing out,
12:30that 33rd overall pick?
12:32You've got about
12:33$40 million
12:33in salary cap.
12:34I think the Niners
12:36are going to be
12:36executing some sort
12:38of a trade.
12:38I think today
12:39is the day
12:39they're going to
12:40either make a decision
12:41on Renardo Green,
12:42Ricky Pearsall,
12:43and whoever else
12:45might be out there.
12:46Greenyard from
12:47the Minnesota Vikings,
12:49Brian Burns.
12:50I think that there
12:51is an opportunity
12:52for the Niners
12:52to find a way
12:54to move a middle-round pick,
12:56be it this year
12:57or next,
12:58to go get themselves
12:58an established edge rusher
13:00who's already in the league.
13:01That would be
13:02an interesting strategy,
13:03though.
13:03I wouldn't hate it there
13:04because instead of
13:06going out and maybe
13:06drafting an edge rusher
13:07that may or may not
13:08be a hit,
13:09that may or may not
13:09be a project,
13:11that may or may not
13:11fit in,
13:12I do like the idea
13:13of going out
13:14and nailing an established
13:16player right away
13:17because essentially
13:18if you're using the draft pick
13:19on the edge rusher,
13:20if you're using it
13:21to acquire the edge rusher
13:22from another team,
13:24it's more or less
13:25the same as using it
13:26on a player in the draft.
13:27You could work it out
13:28that way,
13:29but you're getting
13:30something that's
13:31more established,
13:31more promised,
13:32more of a,
13:33I guess,
13:33quote-unquote
13:34sure thing
13:35at a position
13:36that they've just
13:37not been able
13:37to figure out,
13:38which is that
13:38opposite end
13:39of Nick Bosa
13:39edge rusher.
13:40And this is a team
13:41that back in the day
13:42did that with D-Ford.
13:43They traded a second-round pick,
13:45got D-Ford,
13:46and extended it.
13:47We could argue about
13:48whether that was
13:48the right decision,
13:49but they've established
13:50that they're willing
13:51to do that.
13:51Exactly.
13:52So the Niners,
13:52again,
13:52they have the 33rd pick
13:54right now.
13:54You mentioned the Giants.
13:55Also,
13:55the Giants are picking
13:56at 37 as well,
13:57so maybe there's
13:58a way you swap picks
13:59there and include
14:00some players as well.
14:01I don't know how much
14:02of a jump you can get there.
14:04Cardinals at 34,
14:05Bills at 35.
14:05Bills traded back
14:06a lot last night as well.
14:08And then the Raiders at 36.
14:09Any one of those teams
14:10I could see
14:11wanting to jump up
14:12and take that 33rd.
14:13I mean,
14:13it's essentially,
14:14the Niners got the first
14:15overall pick in the draft
14:16part two.
14:17Yes.
14:17Essentially,
14:18by having this 33rd
14:19to start off
14:20the second round.
14:20And I think it forces
14:23all the other teams
14:24in the league
14:24to look at the board
14:25and go,
14:26is there a guy
14:26that we really want
14:27to reach for right now
14:29and we're willing
14:29to surrender something else
14:31to go up and get?
14:32I think it's actually
14:33a brilliant strategy
14:33by the 49ers.
14:35Yeah,
14:35we'll see if it works.
14:35Again,
14:35the Cardinals,
14:36I mean,
14:37we'll see what the Cardinals do.
14:38I did not like their pick
14:39at number three,
14:40Jeremiah Love.
14:41Jeremiah Love,
14:42great player at running back.
14:43I just absolutely hate it.
14:45Who's their quarterback?
14:46Exactly.
14:46Who's their offensive line?
14:48What?
14:50Jacoby Brissette
14:51is their quarterback.
14:53What did I just say?
14:54Who's their quarterback?
14:55Oh,
14:55I thought you knew
14:55it was Jacoby Brissette
14:56and that was like
14:57your way of saying
14:57Jacoby Brissette
14:58is their quarterback.
14:59Are we serious?
14:59No,
14:59I think they're like
15:00planning on going
15:01into the season with him.
15:01Yeah,
15:01it's called insanity.
15:03It is ridiculous.
15:04Of course the Cardinals are.
15:06888-957-9570
15:07is the number to call.
15:09You can also text us as well.
15:10Did you like what the Niners did?
15:12Trading back out
15:12of the first round.
15:13Did you like the trade?
15:14And also,
15:15with the first pick
15:16of the second round today,
15:17what do you want
15:18the 49ers to do
15:19at that position?
15:21I watched Kyle Shanahan
15:22and John Lynch afterwards.
15:24They were doing
15:25a variety of little interviews.
15:26Boy,
15:27Kyle had a suit on.
15:28I don't know if you guys saw.
15:29He was looking dapper.
15:30Very dapper.
15:31They seemed very,
15:33very happy
15:34and relaxed
15:35and confident
15:36and I think this was
15:37their strategy all along
15:38and I think when Ty Simpson
15:40went off the board early,
15:41I think they were like,
15:42uh-oh,
15:42got a little worried
15:43and somehow,
15:45some way,
15:45they figured out a way
15:46to thread the needle
15:47and trade out of the first round
15:48which is what I believe
15:49their intention was
15:50the entire time.
15:51I agree.
15:52I think,
15:52again,
15:52it's,
15:53I think they were kind of
15:54laying the tea leaves
15:55throughout the week here
15:56and I think that's probably
15:57why they were so happy
15:58is they had a strategy.
15:59They were able to stick to it.
16:00They didn't feel fortunate
16:00making any of these picks here.
16:03And again,
16:03we saw Adam Schefter
16:04tweet it out.
16:05I think as pick 26
16:07was coming in,
16:07Niners are looking
16:08to move off
16:08of this pick here.
16:09The only thing
16:10that kind of surprised me,
16:11Joe,
16:11maybe we can get into this
16:12a little bit more
16:13on the other side
16:14was we can agree
16:15that one of their big needs
16:16on this team
16:17is the offensive line.
16:18And one of the guys
16:19who was still there
16:20at 27
16:20when they moved off
16:21him was Caleb Lomu
16:22who was one of their last
16:24draft prospects
16:25to visit their facility
16:27in the last week or two.
16:28Clearly,
16:29I don't know what that means.
16:30They just didn't like
16:31Caleb Lomu
16:31or if they just
16:32are at a position
16:33where they just think,
16:34you know what?
16:35Of all the holes
16:36we need to fill right now,
16:37offensive line
16:37is not the number one
16:38priority hole
16:39that we need to fill right now,
16:40especially with Trent Williams
16:41locked in for the next year,
16:42possibly two.
16:43That's the only thing
16:44where it's just like
16:45if you're going to have an issue,
16:46I think,
16:46with them trading back,
16:47the fact that a guy
16:48who could have fit
16:49a very important need
16:51was sitting right there
16:52that they passed on,
16:53that's the one,
16:54I think,
16:55if you want to have an issue
16:56with that move,
16:57I think that's where
16:58that issue starts to arise.
16:59I think they're going to have
17:00an opportunity to take
17:01three or four different guards
17:02and three or four different tackles
17:04if they choose
17:05with these next two picks.
17:07Absolutely.
17:08Again,
17:08there's going to be,
17:08I do think offensive line
17:10as a pick you can find
17:11also later in the draft
17:13as well.
17:14I mean,
17:14like Carter and I,
17:15we were kind of talking
17:15before the draft,
17:16like how many like good guards
17:18do you see drafted
17:19in the first or second round
17:20usually in any given year?
17:22I mean,
17:22the Ravens.
17:23Quentin Nelson's going to come to mind
17:24he's a top 10 pick.
17:25I know,
17:27I know,
17:27but that's a,
17:27they're very far,
17:28few and far between.
17:29I would agree.
17:30He was an outlier.
17:31Exactly.
17:31You could find,
17:32again,
17:32we're talking about
17:33great value here.
17:34If you could find an elite,
17:35you know,
17:36guard in the top 10,
17:37awesome.
17:37But if you could also find
17:38a guard in the third
17:39or fourth round
17:40who can block just as well
17:42from Dominic Pune,
17:43he was a third round pick,
17:44you know,
17:44and you're,
17:45you're feeling just as good
17:46as him as you would have
17:46been with the first round pick.
17:48So I'm not going to,
17:49you know,
17:50kind of clench my fist
17:52over them,
17:52not going after interior
17:53linemen in the first round.
17:54And maybe this is a draft
17:55why they want to load up
17:56on picks is to give them
17:57more optionality
17:58later in the draft
17:59to find those offensive linemen
18:01that can help them out.
18:03God,
18:03man,
18:03it's fun watching the NFL draft,
18:05isn't it?
18:05A lot of pomp and circumstance
18:06on the,
18:07on the draft.
18:07She had 320,000 people
18:09in Pittsburgh last night
18:10on hand to watch the draft.
18:11So all of Pittsburgh
18:12was there,
18:12huh?
18:13That's insane.
18:13Would you ever go to the draft
18:14if it came here?
18:17Yeah,
18:17I don't think I want to do it.
18:18I feel like the draft
18:19is like the,
18:20the highest ratio
18:21of like fun to watch on TV
18:23versus like not fun to attend.
18:25We need to talk about the draft
18:27in terms of how it's presented
18:29on TV.
18:29All right,
18:29let's get into that
18:30on the other side.
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