- 10 hours ago
Category
đŸ¥‡
SportsTranscript
00:00We've been excited to have this conversation, Sirius XM MLB radio, although the clips we just
00:08played a short time ago were from an appearance on Foul Territory. Former MLB GM, Jim Bowden,
00:15topped in, locked in, joining us here, Withered and Tibbs, on the River Islands guest line. Jim,
00:21how you doing? Thanks for coming on. I'm doing great, Mark and Dan. Thanks for having me back
00:25on your show. Yeah, great to have you again. Listen, we've been kind of playing through the
00:32audio that we got from your appearance there on Foul Territory for most of the week, and I want
00:38to remind everybody that this happened basically before the Giants-Padres series even started. This
00:44was kind of in reaction to after the Giants and Yankees, which clearly, rough start, tough series
00:50for the Giants. But a bunch of questions into some of the things that you said about Tony Vitello,
00:56and I have to start with the main one, where you said that your take is that right now he's
01:02embarrassing the Giants. What do you find embarrassing so far? Yeah, so the way I viewed it
01:11is on opening day, I felt like you don't have Logan Webb give up seven runs. I don't think he's
01:19ever
01:20a starter in there on opening day to give up those seven runs. I thought he should have been
01:25taken out earlier and taken care of. Not that I don't think he could have pitched out of it,
01:29because we all know Logan Webb is the ace and will finish top five in Cy Young, but I thought
01:34that was
01:34a little concerning. And then on Saturday's game, I felt like with Ryan Berecki on the mound,
01:42you don't pitch to Aaron Judge there when you have two left-hand hitters behind him, Cody
01:47Ballinger hitting directly behind him with first base open there. I felt like, no, you have to kind
01:52of walk him there. And then, of course, Judge hit the home run to left field. So there were just
01:58a few
01:58moves there that I just kind of scratched my head. And then the comments that were made, you know,
02:04after the game, blaming it on his fire and brimstone speech. And then you had Robbie Ray and Pat Bailey
02:11kind of pushed back after the game, players doing that. And I just kind of pointed out that, you know,
02:16when you're coaching in college, you know, you can say whatever you want, and the players are going
02:22to respect it. If the media is just going to report what you say, they're not going to go back
02:26to the
02:26players and get their take on it. So you're not going to get that pushback. But in the big leagues,
02:31you are going to. And just pointed out that, look, he's got no professional experience. You know,
02:35sitting there in the Giants dugout, and he has less experience than everybody in that dugout.
02:41Every single coach, every single player, the trainers, the equipment guys, he just doesn't
02:45have any, not his fault, but he just doesn't have any experience. So, you know, I was just pointing
02:49out between some of his comments after the game, a couple of moves that he made in the first weekend,
02:55you know, I just suggested that, you know, for me, and I like him a lot, and I'm rooting for
03:00him.
03:00I think he's going to be a good manager. I think he's a great guy. I think he's very positive.
03:04I think he brings a high energy. I think he's very refreshing. But just my first take on that
03:10first weekend of games was that he was a little bit over his head and don't like the fact that
03:16players are contradicting you in the media, like already in the first weekend. And so,
03:20you know, I just suggested when you have a couple of Hall of Fame managers that are on your payroll,
03:25like Bruce Bochy and Dusty Baker, both are going to go to the Hall of Fame, in my view,
03:30that it might make sense to have them kind of share the duties of helping him before the games
03:36and talking about after the games and what the plan is going forward and talk to him before the
03:41press conferences and after the press conferences to try to expedite the development. You know,
03:45it's pretty hard when you've never professionally been in the game as a player coach or anything
03:50to all of a sudden get into this game. So that's all I was pointing out.
03:54So I think that's a fair perspective. But Jim, like, I mean, don't you think the word embarrassing
04:00is a little strong?
04:04Look, if that's all you can take out of the interview, then that's your take.
04:07No, not at all.
04:08No, that's fine if that's your take. I mean, look, I think you have to watch the whole interview.
04:13But if you're going to take out one particular word and emphasize that you can.
04:18All I'm saying is when I was a GM and I had rookie managers as well, you know, I think
04:23it would be
04:23embarrassing if I'm going to sit there after the game and I'm going to blame that we lost the game
04:28because my speech was too intense and that the players were trying too hard. That's a college.
04:36That's a college comment. That's not a comment a major league manager makes about the team.
04:40I felt that was embarrassing to me. That's my take. Right or wrong. I'm not saying I'm right.
04:46I'm just giving you guys what my take was on it.
04:48No, I appreciate that. And also, you know, you said in the piece that it's only been three games
04:53and now it's been six. Is there a certain amount of, I guess, grace that you would grant a rookie
04:59manager in this spot, knowing that it is the first time he's been in the bigs and it is only
05:03six games
05:04into the year? Yeah. And look, I think it's going to take a while to develop at this level.
05:11The game is faster than the college game. You know, he's never managed this many games.
05:15He's never had to manage a game every single night. You know, he's doing a lot of things for
05:19the first time. It's not easy. It's not even easy for minor league managers who've done it for years
05:26and they get to the big leagues. You know, there's growing pains there. And, you know,
05:29when you have a situation like the Giants, who I view as a team that will win between 82 and
05:3485 games,
05:35maybe more, you know, you don't want to end up losing the season by losing some games in April
05:41that you should win. And so, yeah, you know, my, my whole point is you got a lot of really
05:45good
05:46minds. Buster Posey and, and Zach Manazzi have a lot of good former managers that can sit there
05:52and help his development quicker, but I don't think you let things go. I don't think you let
05:57them snowball. I think when you get little mistakes like this, if you have Hall of Fame guys around that
06:04can talk to you before and after games, I think it would be helpful.
06:06Uh, and obviously you referred to Dusty Baker and Bruce Bochy. I wonder Jim, from your perspective,
06:12is that, is that realistic to think that Bochy and Dusty will, will sit with Tony after games,
06:20before games? And, and it sounded like kind of hold his hand through this process.
06:26No, I don't think holding hand is what I meant. I mean, just there to help and advise. It doesn't
06:31have to be every game. Maybe it's once a week, but I mean, look, uh, Bruce Bochy, um, as you
06:38saw him
06:38win three world championships in San Francisco, uh, slow heartbeat, very transparent, honest with
06:44everybody, um, has a really good approach. I think Tony could learn from him. Dusty Baker's style is
06:51completely different. He's a tremendous motivator. Um, and Dusty Baker's phenomenal with the media.
06:57He builds great relationships with the media. And I think, you know, Tony Bitello has all the
07:02qualities that should end up being a successful manager, but I'm trying to expedite the learning
07:09curve. I'm trying to do it. I feel like if you give him help early on, we won't get these
07:15early
07:16mistakes. That's just my opinion.
07:18Former GM Jim Bowden here on Willard and dibs 95, seven, the game. Would this be somewhat
07:23unprecedented to have some mentorship for a manager? Who's just a rookie manager?
07:30Well, I don't know what you guys have done in your careers, but I think most successful people I
07:36ever met in my life always had mentors. Doesn't matter if it's a baseball manager, a general manager,
07:42uh, somebody that's working at Apple, uh, you know, whatever business you're in, you know,
07:48this isn't just textbook. This isn't just living experience. You need people around you to learn
07:53from. And most successful people I've ever been around in the game, uh, can point to people that
07:59they've learned from period. I mean, I know when I was a young GM, I reached out to John Sherholds
08:04of
08:04the Atlanta Braves. I reached out to Pat Gillick of the Toronto Blue Jays. I was always trying to learn
08:10from the best. Why? Because it expedites your development. You make less mistakes that way.
08:15Otherwise it's, you're going to succeed or fail based on trial and error. Uh, why go through some
08:21of that? If you can be around wise people that can help you through that process.
08:25Jim, I, this is all super interesting to me because I think in, in listening to you talk on,
08:31on foul territory, you said a couple of times, you've even said it here today. You think Tony's
08:35going to be a good manager, but at the same time, when, when you, the critique you have
08:41coming out of the gate, I think for a fan, they hear that and they go, okay, that's great. If
08:48he's
08:48going to be a good manager, but this is the giants and they're trying to win this year. We're not
08:53sitting around and waiting for some sort of a lengthy process. So I guess I I'm trying to figure
08:58out if you think that this was a good hire or if you think this was a mistake.
09:04Well, first of all, it's too early for anyone to tell. I love the fact that they did an out
09:10of the
09:10box hire. It's a high risk kind of hire, but if you're going to do a high risk, you hire
09:16great
09:16people. Uh, I, I know I learned for many, many years that the best hire is when you're hired the
09:21great people with a high IQ, because those are the guys that are going to figure it out and succeed
09:27in the long run. And certainly I think Tony Vitello checks those boxes. You know, he's got
09:32the personality. He's got the baseball IQ. He just doesn't have the experience. And so that's
09:37what I was saying is like the fans, I don't want a long drawn out process here in developing. Let's
09:43so my whole idea was let's kind of fast track it. You got enough minds around you to help them
09:49make
09:49less mistakes. I don't think, you know, it's, it's, I have no problem with his reasoning for opening
09:55day when he left web in, right? He's trying to show his veteran. He has trust in them. He knows
10:00he can pitch out of it, but maybe the discussion after the game was, you know, we need web pitching
10:05great in September and hopefully October. So do we really want to keep the pitch count up on opening
10:10day when he's given up seven runs? Is that, you know, have that conversation because I know where
10:15he was coming from, but maybe Bruce Bochy or Dusty Baker or Ron Washington or Buster Posey himself
10:22can kind of have that conversation and a little bit of a pushback there to try at least have that
10:27conversation, which they, they might've behind the scenes anyway. You know, none of us really
10:31know. So, you know, look, there's going to be a learning curve. It's not just him. It's
10:36Craig Stammen with the Padres. Anytime you hire a manager that's never done it before, there
10:41is going to be growing pains. The question is how quick can they adjust? How quick can they
10:45get better?
10:46In this era of analytics and so much, you know, tape and homework and all the rest of it, what's
10:51the most important characteristic in a manager? And do you think that Tony possesses that?
10:56Yeah, I think he's got the leadership qualities. I think he has the communication skills. I think
11:01he has the motivation skills. You know, I don't think he has the experience yet of dealing with
11:06major league players, which is a lot different than college players. It's night and day. You know,
11:11a lot of these players are making more money than he does. A lot of these players are going to
11:16know
11:16more parts of the game than he does just because of lack of experience. So, you know, I think you
11:21have to kind of acknowledge that. But again, I'm a fan of Tony Vitello. I love the out of the
11:26box
11:26hire by Buster Posey. I trust Buster Posey knows what he's doing here. So at the end of the day,
11:34you know, look, he's going to be under a magnifying glass. He's going to be under a microscope. It is
11:38what
11:38it is because of the type of hire it is. I want it to succeed. I want it to work.
11:42So to do that,
11:43we've got to call out, you know, mistakes early so they don't continue.
11:48Jim Bowden, Sirius XM MLB Radio with us, Willard and Dibbs, 95.7 The Game. Jim, I don't know if
11:54you can put an exact number on this, but what is the right amount of time for Giants fans and
12:01the
12:01organization to say, OK, you have this amount of time to kind of grow into the role?
12:07I don't think you could put time on it, right? It's just like a player. You remember Aaron Judge's
12:12rookie year, he struck out 50% of the time. Can we put a timetable on it? And not until
12:17he figures
12:18it out. Now he's the best sitter in baseball, right? So, you know, managers the same way. I do
12:24think that, you know, I think Tony's going to work because he's a great person and great people
12:29normally succeed. So I think that's kind of where it's at. How quickly does he learn? How many
12:34mistakes? Who knows? Could be two weeks, could be a month. It could be half a season. It could be
12:38next
12:39year. But, you know, you're going to sit there. He's going to be the guy. You're not going to make
12:43a change. You know, when you commit to this, you can't all of a sudden two or three months later
12:47say,
12:48well, it didn't work out. I'm going to replace him. So he's going to be the guy. So let's watch
12:52him develop. I think that's going to be fun to watch him develop. It's just like watching a young
12:56player develop at the big league, big league level. It doesn't happen overnight. It takes time.
13:00And the same thing with a manager. Jim, you got real quick, you got any issue with Matt Chapman
13:05saying to Casey Schmidt at the mound, catch the bleep and ball.
13:13I mean, obviously, I don't like the comment. It is what it is. You know, it's one of those
13:18starts to the year. You know, yeah, I don't like I don't like these firestorms. I don't like these
13:24things. I didn't like the Tony Vitello pushback. I don't like these comments. You know, win or lose
13:29on the field. Let's not talk about it. That's that's my opinion. I don't like side stories. I don't like
13:34that we're on the radio talking about Vitello and talking about Matt Chapman as a former
13:39GM. I want the players to win or lose on the field and have that be the conversation. So
13:44yeah, no, I didn't like it. Yeah. OK, fair enough. I mean, you may not like talking about
13:49it, but we we like that you did come on and talk about it. So thank you, Jim. Of course.
13:53Always appreciate it. All right. Jim Bowden, Jim Bowden, Sirius XM MLB radio.
Comments