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00:00Yesterday, not yesterday, I guess it was on Friday, I went to lunch with a couple of buddies of mine,
00:04and one of the guys that I had lunch with is, he's 72 years old, takes Tai Chi, you never
00:09know it, right?
00:09He'll beat your ass. There's no question.
00:12He would absolutely, probably, remember, I mean, you probably don't because you weren't a Seinfeld fan,
00:17but he's like the Mandelbaums in Seinfeld, right? He's 72 years old, he's ripped, he could probably take anybody in
00:22this town, right?
00:23Hell yeah.
00:23Huge baseball fan, right?
00:25And so we're sitting there having lunch the other day, and he looks at me and he goes,
00:28do you realize George Brett would not be a Hall of Famer if Matt Quattrero was his manager?
00:32And I started to think a little bit about that, and I'm like, you know what? You're probably not wrong.
00:37And it's really not if Matt Quattrero was his manager, it's if this organization was in charge when George Brett
00:45was coming up,
00:46the way that they do business right now, George Brett would not have been a Hall of Famer.
00:50Because as everybody knows the story, when George Brett first came up to the big leagues, he struggled.
00:55His first year, he struggled, right? He struggled mightily in that first year.
00:59And instead of platooning him and saying he can't hit lefties and all that kind of stuff, they figured it
01:05out, right?
01:06They got Charlie Lau, who George credits with turning his entire career around, the hitting coach at the time of
01:11the Kansas City Royals,
01:13took George's swing, broke it all the way down, started from scratch, and built it back up to where it
01:19is today.
01:19That's called investing in the player and making sure that you're doing everything you possibly can to give that player
01:26an opportunity.
01:27And so he played his first year, you know, obviously here in Kansas City, and had a cup of coffee
01:33his first year.
01:33Nothing spectacular in 1973.
01:351974, he comes up and finally has his first full year and faces left-handed hitting or left-handed pitching
01:42and has 156 at-bats against them and hits 295 against left-handed pitching, which is pretty impressive.
01:50They gave him that opportunity to kind of fail and learn and fail and learn.
01:54Because in 1973 against lefties, George Brett had just four plate appearances and was 0 for 4.
01:59So they didn't let him face lefties that first year in 1973.
02:03Not that he had a lot of plate appearances that year.
02:05He only had like 40.
02:06They didn't really give him that much of an opportunity against lefties his first year.
02:10His second year struggled a little bit against lefties and then obviously found a way to turn it around.
02:15But the moral of the story is we're not letting Jack Caglione have the same type of experiences in learning
02:21how to play baseball at the big league level that George Brett had when he came up to the big
02:27leagues.
02:27And if they were to take George Brett and platoon him against lefties because they would have said he couldn't
02:32hit lefties, which would have been probably a little bit of a misnomer at the time.
02:36Hit 295 that first year against lefties.
02:39Which is great.
02:39Which is great.
02:40But if they never gave him the opportunity to hit against lefties because of analytics and the way that they
02:45do business right now, George Brett would have finished right around 2,100 hits because he had 983 hits against
02:53lefties.
02:54Imagine if this organization was in charge when George Brett was coming up through the ranks.
02:58He never would have been a Hall of Famer.
03:01He never would have been a guy that we talk about in such glowing terms because if this organization was
03:09in charge when he came up, he never would have been provided the opportunity to see if he could hit
03:14lefties, to see if he could fail against lefties, and then to see how he could ultimately do against lefties
03:21when you gave him that opportunity and the belief in him to go up there and hit lefties.
03:26He ended up hitting 280, 280 against lefties with 88 home runs.
03:32There are not many left-handed hitters in the history of the game that have more hits off a lefty
03:38pitching than George Brett.
03:39I want to say he's top five, top seven in all of baseball.
03:43If this organization was in charge when George Brett was playing, he never would have reached those milestones, and he
03:49never would have been a Hall of Fame player.
03:51That's what I think is happening right now with Jack Haglione.
03:55This guy's the sixth overall pick in the draft, right?
03:59Sixth overall pick.
04:00How many millions of dollars, six, seven, eight million, whatever it was you paid this kid to play.
04:05You gave him that money.
04:06You believed in him.
04:07You paid him all of that cash as the sixth overall pick, and then he comes up to the big
04:12league level where he hasn't had much time in the minors, and you're platooning him.
04:17So what you're telling us by doing that, and yesterday, not playing against the righties, is the most insane thing
04:25ever.
04:26We'll tell you what we heard.
04:27Reverse platoon.
04:28Whatever that means.
04:29I've never heard of a reverse platoon, man.
04:31I've never heard of a reverse platoon in all of my life.
04:34You've got to watch out for it.
04:35Your record is indicative of the way that this organization is being run right now.
04:38It really is.
04:39Your record is indicative of the way that the organization is being run right now.
04:43And that's what I want to talk about, I guess, a little bit, because I agree.
04:46I mean, that is, first off, I mean, Jim, hats off.
04:50Great point, because he's right.
04:51Yeah.
04:52They literally would have kept George Brett from breaking.
04:55One of the best baseball players of all time.
04:57George Brett would have been a platoon player if J.J. Piccolo and Matt Quattaro were in charge of the
05:01Royals in 1974.
05:02It's a really good way to look at it, because we can only see so far with Cags and Jensen.
05:07We know it's wrong, but we don't know what else is left.
05:10We never could.
05:10But to know that it's a possibility that there is now, obviously, we're not saying Cags or Jensen's, but we
05:16don't know when we'll know.
05:17And you don't know anything.
05:18You don't know how good a guy is against a lefty with 29 at bats, which is what Cags has
05:23right now.
05:2329 at bats, I believe, this year against a lefty.
05:26That's not a big enough sample size.
05:27Last year, we were preaching and preaching.
05:30At least a lot of people were that he didn't have enough sample size in general last season to judge
05:34who he was.
05:34And now this year, we're seeing him against at least a righties to say, OK, this guy's a big leader.
05:38Big leaguer, went two for four with a homer on Saturday with an RBI and then two RBIs and then
05:44doesn't play against a righty on Sunday.
05:46And obviously, they win the game.
05:47Salvador Perez has his first good game in a long time.
05:50They won the game because of Salvi.
05:52Legitimately, that was awesome.
05:54Homer, RBI in the first inning, like really, really good to see him have a moment.
06:00And my question, I guess, is, is this because you mentioned it's not Cotrero could be any manager.
06:05It's the franchise.
06:06And I guess, was this not was this the way it was with Matheny?
06:09Was this?
06:10No, this did this.
06:11This is a thing.
06:12This has been here for a long time.
06:15And that's a really good point because it surprises me because this wasn't how JJ was kind of brought up
06:19in baseball.
06:20He was brought up in the Atlanta Brave system, right?
06:21They developed a lot of great prospects down there, give them the time in the minor leagues, develop those prospects,
06:27make sure they get up to the big league level and they're ready to go.
06:29And then he comes to Kansas City and we did a great job of developing prospects down in the minor
06:34leagues and bringing up to the big league level and making sure they're ready to go.
06:38This philosophy really did not start until John Sherman took over the team.
06:43And then you move Dayton out and now you have JJ in.
06:46And this philosophy I'm looking at, I'm like, where is this philosophy coming from?
06:50Because it wasn't the Braves philosophy and it wasn't the philosophy that the Royals had when Dayton Moore was running
06:57the organization.
06:57And both of those organizations, the Braves and when Dayton was here, they did something pretty special.
07:03They both won world championships.
07:05And so you would think you would continue that process forward with Matheny.
07:10No, no, it was not.
07:11It didn't really happen until Dayton was fired and this kind of new regime came in.
07:15I think this is what the organization wanted, a more analytical approach to what is going on.
07:21It wasn't Matheny with Dayton, was he?
07:23Yeah, he was Dayton's last manager.
07:25Yeah, when they fired Dayton, they fired Matheny the week after.
07:28Because I said you can't fire Dayton and keep Matheny around as the manager of that ball club.
07:32Just like the same thing goes with Q.
07:34This is not a Q thing.
07:35This is an organizational thing, right?
07:37This is everybody in the front office that is culpable of what's going on right now.
07:42Culpable of the lineups and culpable of underdeveloping talent in this organization.
07:46And I say that.
07:47You underdevelop Brent Rooker.
07:48You underdeveloped MJ Melendez.
07:50We don't know if any of these guys could play.
07:52Ryan O'Hearn.
07:52So much beat left on the bone.
07:54It's crazy.
07:55Drew Waters is another guy.
07:57We don't know if any of these guys could play because they haven't been given that opportunity.
08:02And I know we want our young guys to come up to the big league level right away.
08:06But you've got to make sure that they're ready to come up to the big league level.
08:10And that's where I am with Jack Caglione.
08:12By platooning him, you are telling us he is not an everyday big league player.
08:17And if that's the case, and you're not letting him become an everyday big league player.
08:22You have told us he is a platoon player because you're not playing him against lefties or some righties or
08:28reverse splits or whatever else number you want to pull from the sky and make up to fit the narrative.
08:33This is what you're telling us.
08:34I don't know if Jack Caglione is a major league baseball player because he hasn't been given the opportunity to
08:41show me he's a major league baseball player at best.
08:45I think it's worse than that.
08:46Well, at best right now, Mac, he's a platoon player and you've invested six or seven million dollars in the
08:51sixth overall pick into a platoon player.
08:53That's a bad draft pick.
08:55And that's what it looks like right now.
08:56And it's not against Cags.
08:58I don't know if he can play Cags only had three hundred and eighty minor league at bats before he
09:04came up to the big league level.
09:05He had less than eight hundred at bats in college and the minors combined before he came up to the
09:12big league level and he raked and he did and he raked and he was given that opportunity to put
09:17that in comparison.
09:18George Brett, eleven hundred minor league at bats, Carlos Beltran, two thousand minor league at bats, Moustakas, eighteen hundred, Hosmer,
09:26fourteen hundred, Perez, seventeen hundred.
09:28Most of those guys, Moustakas, Hosmer, Salvi were developed when JJ was part of the system.
09:33Those minor league at bats and getting these guys comfortable, teaching them how to fail and how to recover from
09:40fail is important.
09:41And then Jack Caglione, who you spent six or seven million dollars on in a signing bonus of the sixth
09:45overall pick, has three hundred and eighty minor league at bats.
09:49You call him up here and then you make him a part time player.
09:51I don't know if Jack Caglione can play at the big league level, but they have told us right now
09:56he's nothing more than a platoon player back.
09:59I mean, I think we know he can play at the big league level, and that's what I think makes
10:04it worse, is that he's already proven that.
10:06Yes, you're right. With the minimal at bats in the minor leagues and then now just a short 40 games
10:11here and then whatever he played last year, which wasn't a lot.
10:14I think he's already shown us that at least against righties.
10:16Yeah, he is a part time major league. He's a big leaguer.
10:19He's whether he's a role player, whether he's a starter, he's shown he's got elite power.
10:24He's he's shown that he can play first base. He's shown that he can play right field.
10:28He's shown defensively that he can be versatile.
10:30He's he's he's learned so much in such a short time.
10:32So he is he is definitely a major league baseball player.
10:35And that's what I think this is such more an indictment on the Kansas City Royals management of their sixth
10:40overall pick,
10:41because he has shown that so quickly and they still haven't completely let off the reins.
10:45And it's not like they're winning against lefties. That's the big part of this, too.
10:49We always talk about lefties, lefties, platoon, platoon.
10:51Here's all these strategies, all the analytics. Where are the wins then?
10:54You're two and nine. You're two and nine against lefties.
10:57Cags has two homers, one of which was at the end of the game, I believe, to kind of seal
11:02a win against a lefty.
11:04If I remember correctly, this season, one of those two wins is because Cags had a homer.
11:09So at some point, yeah, I think he's a major league baseball player.
11:12I think he's shown that I think he's a big leaguer.
11:14I think he's actually a stud. And that's what makes this more of an indictment that he is not playing.
11:19You cannot judge someone off of 29 at bats, to your point, against lefties.
11:23Right. You cannot know. And still, six of 29, it's over 200. It's not great. It's not abysmal.
11:28Right. So I'm, yeah, I'm confused again. Good win yesterday to point out the positive.
11:34Steven Kolick, awesome. Shoved again. Out of his eight starts for the Royals, Bob, seven quality starts out of his
11:40eight appearances now for the Royals.
11:41He's gone. He averages over six innings pitched for when he appears.
11:45So really like what I've seen from Kolick.
11:47They may have to make a decision here in the future in the next couple of weeks about Kolick or
11:51Noah Cameron.
11:51And that's next week, really, with Cole Reagan's going to be back up from the aisle.
11:56Yeah. So George Brett, when you look at what he did in 1974 against left-handed pitchers, his first full
12:03Major League Baseball season hit 208.
12:05I was wrong on that. 22 of 106.
12:07Imagine if they just stopped it right there and they said, well, George Brett can't hit left-handed pitchers.
12:11Against left-handed pitchers, what George Brett did in the history of the game for him,
12:15he ended up with 3,500 at-bats, 983 hits, a 280 average, 190 doubles, 35 triples, 88 home runs,
12:24332 on-base percentage, and a 429 slugging percentage.
12:28And this is from Gemini, right?
12:30I've been doing a lot of talking to Gemini about this Royals team to find out where they are.
12:34It's serving as my therapist, and we'll get into this a little bit later on.
12:37To put those 983 hits into perspective, if a manager had chosen to platoon him throughout his career based on
12:43that ugly rookie season,
12:45Brett would have finished with around 2,170 career hits, meaning the franchise would have missed out on nearly 1
12:51,000 hits
12:51from a guy who went on to become one of the greatest pure baseball players of all time.
12:56This is what you're risking right now by doing this to Jack Caglione.
13:01You're not making him a better baseball player.
13:03You're preventing him from potentially reaching greatness.
13:06And you're not allowing him to go out there and make the mistakes and learn.
13:12You're coddling him.
13:13And the coddling isn't even working right now.
13:16This kid needs to be in the lineup every single day.
13:20You're, what, eight games under .500.
13:23You're a non-factor in the standings right now.
13:26Everybody in this city has moved on and is ready for football season.
13:30And you're still trying to tell us that Jack Caglione can't play against lefties.
13:34And then you don't play him against a righty yesterday either.
13:37And that's where everybody lost their mind.
13:39No, that was indefensible.
13:40When I saw the lineup, I just kind of threw my hands up.
13:42Just what are we doing?
13:43Against a righty?
13:45Yeah, seven games under .500.
13:47Five and a half games back in the division.
13:49Right.
13:50And this is an opportunity now that you're losing games.
13:52You need to embrace what's happening on the field and change things up.
13:56This is the perfect time to allow Jack Caglione to play every single day.
14:00There's zero pressure on him right now.
14:02Now, you've already made your bed for the season.
14:04You're already in last place.
14:06Your organization has been passed by the White Sox.
14:09You don't have much in the minor leagues.
14:11I still disagree with that, by the way.
14:12Well, no, that's fine.
14:13The team is better.
14:14That is different.
14:15Yeah.
14:16Organization, franchise.
14:17The organization.
14:18I will say the White Sox are a better organization than the Royals right now.
14:21And I will stand on that based on their minor league system, based on where they're headed,
14:24based on what they have at the big league level versus what we have at the big league level right
14:28now.
14:28They are doing better than where the Kansas City Royals are right now as an organization.
14:34And so what we're looking at right now is a team that is not playing good baseball, a team that
14:39needs a major change somewhere, some way, somehow,
14:42and a team that needs to let its best player that they paid money to, that they took sixth overall,
14:47to have the opportunity to play every single day and fail.
14:51You're not doing anything in the standings now.
14:53Now, let this kid play and let's see what he can do, because if you don't play Jack Caglione, there's
15:00a chance you could be passing up on a great talent.
15:04Think back to what happened in 1974, a 208 hitting George Brett against lefties, got his confidence built up by
15:11a hitting coach by Charlie Lau.
15:13They allowed him to play every single day, and he became the greatest player in franchise history.
15:17What they're doing to Jack Caglione right now is preventing him from becoming and having an opportunity to become a
15:26great player at the big league level, and that needs to change.
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