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03:12Welcome to Beyond the Tape.
03:27I'm your host, Mark Boussaint.
03:29Welcome to our viewers across Trinidad and Tobago, and of course, our global viewers.
03:34It's Wednesday, and you know what day that is.
03:36It's Legally Speaking Wednesdays, and of course, today with us, Acting Sergeant Zaheer Ali of the Trinidad and Tobago Police Service, and Atenia Toa.
03:46Welcome.
03:47Pleasant good evening to you, Mark.
03:48And, you know, thanks for your always, you know, kind welcome on Beyond the Tape TV6 platform.
03:57To the family on Beyond the Tape, my colleagues in the law enforcement agencies, and most importantly, you know, to meet with you, the citizens of Trinidad and Tobago, again, through this platform.
04:10Mark very, very, what I should say, interesting times.
04:14But times that are testing the offices, very high offices in Trinidad and Tobago, and in some instances, revealing some of the office and office holders, as the case may be.
04:31I know from Saturday to today, a lot has happened, Mark.
04:34And I know you, yourself, and, you know, all media houses have been very busy, you know, over the last couple of days, especially with the debacle surrounding Ms. Erla Hayward-Christopher and related matters.
04:49Mark, I will be very frank this afternoon that it was not my intention to even comment on this matter.
04:55But I think that, with legally speaking, and with the obligation and the duty and responsibility that I have to the citizenry of Trinidad and Tobago, and, you know, wearing two hats, you know, my obligation under the legal profession, and also my obligation under the Trinidad and Tobago Police Service.
05:11I think it will be remiss of me if I don't make some very brief comments, and comments geared towards, you know, perhaps guiding the commentators, the citizenry of Trinidad and Tobago, the media, and all interested parties.
05:27We know that a lot has been placed in the public domain, and I think it's important, you know, just to share some brief remarks.
05:33But permit me, Mark, this afternoon, you know, just to begin, and I just was quickly jotting down just to make sure that I'm on point.
05:41I was just making some brief notes, and while Miss Erla here with Christopher would have been vindicated, and, you know, we welcome that, I think I want to look at it, you know, in a broader sense, and for the people of Trinidad and Tobago, I think, Mark, the rule of law was vindicated.
05:58And when we speak about the rule of law being vindicated, it means that there was the enforcement of the law and respect for the principles of the law and ensuring that no individual or no office is above the rule of law or exempted from a criminal investigation.
06:15And I think that's something important I want to identify to the members of the public this afternoon.
06:21Secondly, the rights, for example, the protection of the law, due process and respecting due process was very much alive during this process.
06:32The right and access to a high court for redress was very much alive, and we have seen it in the judgment of Justice Siewiczon on Monday, the 12th.
06:47And last but not least, the Trinidad and Tobago Police Service upheld their constitutional and legal mandate in the public interest to investigate very serious allegations, even if it would have involved high office holders.
07:04And I think it was important to highlight those additional matters this afternoon, to look at this particular matter in a very balanced way, Mark, when we are looking at good governance and promoting the rule of law in the public's interest.
07:19So I thought it was important to begin with that.
07:21And, you know, as we go along, I may have one or two short things to say in reference to, again, guiding the citizens, where there are two particular, one are released and the judgment.
07:31I'd like to say some brief things in relation to those two matters as we go along, but I just wanted to open this afternoon and asking the members of the public, the commentators and the interested parties to let us look at this matter in a mature way, responsible in terms of how we comment.
07:47And, you know, as we go on, I'll be able to see a little more with reference to where do I think we should be looking at in order to be properly guided in relation to the facts and evidence of this matter.
07:57Well, I think just to update that situation and what you have touched on is that the Ministry of National Security, Homeland Security, sent out a release a couple hours ago, not too long ago, actually, about within the last two hours or so, indicating that acting commissioner of police, Junior Benjamin, will continue to act as commissioner as the commissioner,
08:22Euler here with Christopher, was asked to proceed on 66 days of leave.
08:27Yes.
08:27Right? And in essence, the Homeland Security indicated that then a decision will then be made later on after Mr. Benjamin finishes his acting, you know, stint as to what is the next step that the police service commissioner will have to determine such.
08:45Because we know that there was a procedure that a number of officers went through over the last couple of months.
08:51Yes.
08:52And I don't know in terms of whether or not, is that process going to be honoured?
08:59Or rather, is it going to be, you know, re-examined and looked at from a perspective that perhaps they needed to start the process all over?
09:11I'm not certain.
09:12Well, I guess, Mark, we are in the same boat.
09:13And, you know, those are matters that are within the domain of the Police Service Commission and, by extension, the, I should say, the Cabinet of Trinidad and Tobago.
09:22And, you know, when the Parliament is open, you know, within the jurisdiction of the Parliament.
09:26So, you know, we are in the same boat.
09:27But, again, let us, you know, look on and see what decisions is or are being made for the best interests of the people of Trinidad and Tobago.
09:35Most certainly.
09:36All right, we're going to take a quick look now at our headlines.
09:39So, those are some of the headlines within the last few minutes.
10:09And, of course, one of the most, you know, troubling series that I've made you over the last few hours, of course, is this incident at Long Circular Mall.
10:21Just up before 1 o'clock today, you know, a lady is going about her business in the car park area.
10:29And what we were told was that her screams were heard and this person who was lying on the floor now apparently was armed with a firearm and attempted to assault the woman and also take her motor vehicle.
10:46A security guard who was nearby, of course, and, of course, the police arrived on the scene.
10:54And what we understand was that the individual shot at the police.
11:01They took cover, returned fire, and he was shot and killed.
11:07He's from the Bonds Road area.
11:11Of course, his relatives came onto the kampong a short while after.
11:14They said that he runs a mini-mart from his gallery.
11:17But police confirmed that he was well-known to the authorities and he had several matters before the courts.
11:24It is unfortunate it happens at a time, you know, in the mall.
11:29It's a very busy mall, I can tell you.
11:31And at that time, you know, there are a lot of vehicles, there are a lot of people, and that's a very commonly traversed area along Long Circular Road.
11:40Yes.
11:41And the adjoining road there.
11:43So it created quite a lot of traffic all around the St. James area.
11:48And people had to find alternative routes.
11:50But certainly, you know, there was a shooting at Long Circular a couple of months ago.
11:55Yes.
11:56Last year, if you remember.
11:57Yes.
11:57Underneath the car park, somebody was shot and injured and had to leave the country there.
12:03They were shot in their face, luckily surviving.
12:05Yes.
12:06So it brings to question a couple of things, you know.
12:08And this is a trend we are seeing that these Tida motor cars, obviously, are one of those preferred choices of criminals right now
12:17because they wanted to do a number of things, a number of nefarious activities with these vehicles.
12:23Well, Mark, thank you very much for, you know, bringing to the attention of the public this particular incident.
12:29And, you know, while this incident will be subject to an inquiry, and I have to be careful in terms of how I navigate,
12:35I think what it shows, Mark, it shows based on what you have reported, we are within the Long Circular Mall.
12:42It's an area that is prone to business activity, commercial activities, recreation, and what have you.
12:49And here it is that we have seen, again, the prevalence of, or I should say the possession of firearm,
12:54and even the discharging based on the reports, the discharging of firearm within 40 meters of a road on a public place.
12:59So, again, very serious, serious matters, and this issue of crime, Mark, continues to be a nagging issue.
13:06And, you know, we have to continue to recognize that we are at a time where we need to push back,
13:13and we need to push back, you know, aggressively, but within the rule of law,
13:16because the elections came and gone.
13:20But what's still prevailing is acts of very serious violence in Trinidad and Tobago.
13:25So, you know, I want to make a call to the entire law enforcement agencies and, by extension,
13:30to the high authorities to continue to let this particular issue of crime and criminality
13:35occupy the number one focus as we go forward in Trinidad and Tobago.
13:39Yes, and we certainly want to commend the police officers who responded rather quickly to that incident.
13:44And, you know, that car park, it's a huge area to cover,
13:48but I think maybe perhaps they need to look at the perimeter of more security in the car park area.
13:55Maybe that's something for the mall management to look at going forward.
13:58Just a suggestion, of course, but I think it's important,
14:01because people want to feel safe when they're coming to the compound rather than to shop.
14:05There's true value there and other stores inside that mall that a lot of people like to visit.
14:11So it's important that they feel a sense of safety and security,
14:14not only inside the mall, but also outside the mall.
14:17Well, Mark, you know, we always, you know, advocate for more security,
14:20more CCTV cameras, you know, which will always be an advantage.
14:24But I think that, you know, every time I respond to this matter,
14:28you know, I always like to reverse it.
14:29The criminal element should not be even inclined to even think about committing a criminal offence.
14:35So it's not a situation where you are saying,
14:37OK, you're going to put, beef up the security or, you know, expect, you know, frequent police patrols.
14:43No, it should be a situation where our policing, our strategies,
14:46our responses to society is going to tell the criminal element that,
14:49listen, do not even think about trespassing for us to commit an act of robbery, you know.
14:56Yes.
14:56Or to be affecting the rights of the citizens for freedom of movement,
15:00enjoyment of property, and those sort of things.
15:02So, you know, I want to look at it from that context,
15:04where the criminal element has in their mind hesitation to put down the guns.
15:09And let's take the line of law-abiding citizens of Trinidad and Tobago.
15:13Yes, certainly.
15:15And we have some good news, of course.
15:17You know, there was a young lady profile in our program over the last few days,
15:22Aaliyah Ali.
15:23We are happy to say that she was located just a short while ago
15:28by police officers of the Four Roads Police Station.
15:32So we certainly want to thank the public for all the information that they would have assisted
15:36and their assistance, of course,
15:38in securing Aaliyah and, of course, police finding her and taking her back safely to the home.
15:46Well, Mark, always excellent news.
15:49When you're speaking about a human being,
15:50always excellent news to see the return or the individual being found.
15:54But I would like to, you know, cautiously advise members of the public
15:58that notwithstanding that the person has returned or found as the case may be,
16:04any person who has any information or any intelligence,
16:08we reference that this particular matter or any matter involving,
16:12especially where we have minors, Mark,
16:13it is important to bring that information to the police
16:17so that we can investigate it properly
16:19so that you don't have a reoccurrence
16:21or if it's a situation that we don't know the facts yet,
16:25but if it's a situation where it may have been,
16:27let's say, bordering down matters of breaches of the Children's Act,
16:31breaches of the Trafficking in Persons Act,
16:33you know, even the Sexual Offenses Act,
16:34these are very serious matters.
16:35So those who have information still bring it to the police
16:38so that we can investigate it
16:40and we can ensure that there's safety and security
16:42not only to that individual but other persons
16:44who may be likely to be affected by the group
16:48or the individuals who may have been engaged in these activities.
16:52All right, we're going to take a short break
16:53and we'll be back with your calls and much more.
16:56Stay with us.
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18:50Welcome back to Beyond the Tape.
19:06I'm your host, Mark Bessant.
19:08It's Legally Speaking Wednesdays.
19:09And of course, I'm joined today by Acting Sergeant
19:12Zaheer Ali of the Trinidad and Tobago Police Service
19:15and Attorney at Law.
19:17And I think we have our first caller on the line.
19:21Caller, good evening.
19:23Good evening.
19:23Good evening.
19:24Officer, good evening.
19:26Good evening to you, ma'am.
19:27Good evening.
19:28Officer, you remember the person I had spoken about
19:32and told you how the guy was behaving so terribly
19:34and he was planning what he would have done
19:37to the woman and everything?
19:38Yes.
19:38You know, I have seen where they have caught him.
19:40He was hiding in some place, some house,
19:44some abandoned house, and they have caught him.
19:47The police have caught him.
19:48So I'm happy for that.
19:48Because I remember you getting a lot of information
19:50from the questions I had spoken, you know,
19:52and that's very good.
19:54The second point is insulted in La Rameen.
19:57Somebody came and tried to harass somebody.
20:01The father said they wanted to kill her or something.
20:04He said this is not the first time
20:05that his relatives get into something like that.
20:08And I feel people, one thing with her, she's very brave
20:11and she did what she should have had to do in a proper way,
20:15otherwise she might have died if she didn't use her brain
20:18when she see this person come and bounce her car and all that.
20:21So I hope they really find that person.
20:23I think it's two persons.
20:25My third point is, I see where somebody,
20:28they have kidnapped somebody and they ask for $5,000
20:32or something like that.
20:33We try to say on this program,
20:35when you're going to do anything with money,
20:36be very careful where you are and everything.
20:38And something happened and they did not get through,
20:41so I don't know whether they spung that person or what.
20:43So all the best.
20:44Officer, you didn't take part in this sport.
20:46I know you're a cricket person,
20:48but I know you're a sport.
20:50You didn't take part in this sport.
20:51It was very, very nice from what I hear.
20:53All the best to all of you,
20:55and all of you be safe, including Ms. Jackie.
20:57Thank you very, very much.
20:59Most welcome.
21:00Thank you very much, Kola.
21:01Kola, let me reciprocate on behalf of Mark and myself
21:04and TV6 with the fact that you raised
21:06that issue in relation to that person
21:08who was behaving in a violent manner
21:09and seeing the headlines in the Express.
21:12Fugitive father caption in hideout.
21:14Yes, I'm happy to see that.
21:15And again, it goes to show members of the public mark,
21:18the voice of the people.
21:19When you table a matter,
21:22there are 1.3 million people odd
21:23who's listening, who's looking on.
21:25And you never know where that assistance can be triggered
21:28to be able to deal with a matter
21:30or to provide information to the police.
21:32So I'm happy that you have given that positive news.
21:35And the last issue, Mark, in terms of the sports,
21:38I was so swarmed with the professional business, Mark,
21:43with so many things happening from Saturday to present.
21:46I had to ensure that the public interest take its course.
21:48But I know my colleagues, my friends,
21:51they ensured that they represented me at the sports
21:53and those who participated in the sport.
21:55I hope that you had a good time
21:56and you continue to appreciate the importance of teamwork
22:00and the importance of that organization
22:02called the Trinidad and Tobago Police Service.
22:05All right, we have another caller on the line.
22:06Caller, good evening.
22:08Good evening, good evening, Mr. Mark Bassant
22:12and to the officer, actually, Mr. Ali.
22:18Good evening, sir.
22:18I have a vested interest in assisting the leadership of this country
22:27to mitigate crime.
22:30The prime minister said she would like to see it reduce in six months' time.
22:38She didn't quantify it.
22:40I believe all of us have a party play.
22:44But the TTPPS has to take the biggest role in this.
22:50And let me explain to you what I'm thinking.
22:57There is an old adage that says a few of the officers in the police service,
23:04basically, officers contribute to the big question mark
23:11with respect to the performance of the police service.
23:16I want to flesh out that few officers
23:19and I want to put into the public domain
23:23that I believe the current leadership
23:27has a party play with that next step.
23:31The few might be in the leadership
23:35because you have to understand
23:37and we have to be honest as a country, as a citizen.
23:41The hierarchy, you could count them
23:44and then you could go to judgment against them.
23:49The fact is, the police service itself
23:52hasn't done the corrective action
23:56with respect to those errant TTPPS officers.
24:02And the only way we will know if they're errant,
24:05if a proper internal investigation is done
24:09and actionable outcomes are in place.
24:14The other issue is,
24:16yesterday there was a judgment on the newspaper
24:20where a person was arrested
24:22and the judge basically dismissed the case
24:26and awarded him, I think, about $200,000.
24:30But what is alarming?
24:32This has happened to that officer,
24:34not officer, that victim four times.
24:37So four times he was arrested
24:39and he was freed.
24:42Something has to happen there.
24:44How can we have that action be repeated so many times?
24:49That tells me the management of the police service
24:53has a lot to answer.
24:56And I'm going to throw something that might be offensive
24:59and I apologize into the whole of the TTPPS.
25:03I want to know if there is collusion
25:05with those officers and the victim who was freed
25:10so that they will get an Asia food cutback.
25:17So I'm putting that into the domain
25:19so people don't understand how I'm thinking about it.
25:22Because there is a philosophy
25:24where it's a 10% kickback
25:26and they put a whole other name with it.
25:28The other issue I'm drawing to the TTPPS,
25:33this is a flying opportunity
25:36for the second division officers,
25:40the leadership to go and discuss
25:44with the leadership of this country
25:46how we could initiate amendment to the police service act.
25:53So as soon as we identify errant officers,
25:58we get them out of the pump of the TTPPS service.
26:02Because I believe the TTPPS second division
26:06not doing justice to me as a citizen,
26:09not the police officers themselves in the TTPPS.
26:14So I hope you understand where I'm going.
26:17Because we crime.
26:19You see the girl who was shot at
26:21in the river of I'm South?
26:24That is close to my heart.
26:26Because I can understand that as a parent
26:28how serious it is.
26:31So Mr. Ali, I hope you enjoy it.
26:33It wasn't a short ball.
26:35It was a beamer.
26:38All right, Kola.
26:39Thanks for those points.
26:40Of course,
26:42Mr. Aksand Sargent Ali will answer after the break.
26:44Stay with us.
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29:11I'll get to the next video.
29:13I'll be right back.
29:14All-in-all-in-all-in-all-in-all.
29:17All-in-all-in-all-in-all-in-all-in-all.
29:23Welcome back to Beyond the Tape.
29:46I'm your host, Mark Bassand.
29:47Of course, it's Legally Speaking Wednesdays,
29:50and joining me today is Acting Sergeant Zahira,
29:53of the Trinidad and Tomega Police Service and Attorney at Law.
29:56And please call us.
29:57We're just imploring that you keep your questions a bit short
29:59or your opinions or points,
30:01because there are others that also want to make calls
30:04and get in and express some kind of information or ask a question.
30:08All right?
30:09So, moving on to the caller's last questions.
30:11Yeah, well, quickly, Mark.
30:12Caller, thank you very much for your submission.
30:14Mark, you know, I'll groan it or coin it by just indicating
30:16that a very strong call, a very passionate call,
30:19for looking at transparency and accountability in the police service
30:22in terms of the conduct of the police officers.
30:25And that's a topic that I can go on for days
30:28in relation to looking at, you know, many different mechanisms
30:30to be able to treat without.
30:32And, you know, the last major issue that you raised is, again,
30:35looking at leadership in the police service.
30:37And, you know, the leadership of the police service
30:40and the discussions have been in the public domain.
30:41And, you know, I have no doubt that the decision-makers will be paying attention
30:46in the best interests of Trinidad and Tobago.
30:48So, thank you very much, Caller, for your strong submissions.
30:51And you did just also speak about corrective action,
30:54but I know that the professional standards,
30:56we will have that particular duty to perform when it comes to errant officers.
31:02We don't want to usurp that authority from them,
31:04but, of course, if other arms might have information,
31:08they usually would pass to them, yes?
31:09Yeah, of course. You know, internally, you have the professional standards bureau,
31:12and, you know, on the other hand, you have the police complaints authority.
31:15Or, in a situation that he explained,
31:17if you believe that there's allegations of corruption,
31:20that can, you know, engage the anti-corruption bureau.
31:22So, in my view, there are units that are set up.
31:24Yes, of course, these units need to be looked at,
31:26they need to be reviewed, you know, they need to be trained, in my view,
31:30and brought up to a level to ensure that you are holding not only the TTPS,
31:34but public officials, in a general sense,
31:36accountable for when they execute their duties,
31:39and in the manner in which they're executing their duties.
31:41Most certainly.
31:43All right, so, we headed to Arima over the last week or so,
31:47to get, you know, your opinion about crime,
31:51and the situation that we now face in Trinidad and Tobago.
31:53It's Voice of the People in Arima.
31:56Let's go.
31:56All right, so, let's go.
32:26First of all, what is your biggest concern about crime?
32:33Well, what I was about crime, you see,
32:35we like to point your fingers at people, at government.
32:38But crime is everybody's business.
32:41It's each and every one of us concerned.
32:43Understand?
32:43And so far, I see, the place wouldn't get better.
32:47It would just get worse.
32:49You know, I would take a scripture from the Bible.
32:522 Chronicles 7, 14 said,
32:54If my people who are called by my name
32:56shall humble themselves and pray,
32:57seek my face, turn away from their wicked ways,
33:00then I will hear from heaven,
33:02forgive their sin, and heal their land.
33:04So, there's no government you have to blame.
33:05Understand?
33:06That is really last days.
33:08So, that is what's going on.
33:09People have to humble themselves.
33:10People have to seek God for things to get better.
33:12But other than that,
33:13it will just get from bad to worse.
33:16Understand?
33:17Yeah, it came better last year.
33:19Do you feel crime is a growing or a lessening problem?
33:23Things, as I now say,
33:24things will get from bad to worse.
33:26Yeah, from bad to worse, nothing better.
33:28No matter who government come.
33:30No matter who government come,
33:31we just like to blame the government,
33:33we want to blame PNM, we want to blame UNC.
33:35It have nothing like the government.
33:37It's we.
33:38We, the people in this country,
33:40in the world, we have to seek God.
33:43We cannot do nothing of our own.
33:44Understand?
33:45Because, the next scripture,
33:47Matthew 6, verse 13, we say,
33:49Seek ye first the kingdom of heaven and righteousness,
33:51for all other things will be added unto you.
33:53So, when we seek God first,
33:54then everything will fall into line.
33:56Then everything will fall into line.
33:58So, you can't blame one another.
33:59How has crime affected your daily life?
34:02Well, well,
34:05with this crime,
34:06I don't really go much.
34:08I don't know who.
34:09More home.
34:10More home.
34:11If I do come out with my pay bills,
34:13let me go through and back inside.
34:16Because of what's going on in this place.
34:18Do you feel safe at home?
34:21Well, yes, I feel safe at home.
34:24I feel more safe at home than outside.
34:26Yeah.
34:27Because when it's,
34:27with this,
34:28what do you call it,
34:28when it's because of my house,
34:29what do you call it,
34:30information and all that.
34:31Yes.
34:32All right.
34:33Yeah, I feel safe at home.
34:34My line, yeah.
34:35What do you think is the root cause
34:37of the high crime rate
34:38in our country?
34:41Because, well,
34:42I will say,
34:44yeah, I'll say that I got jobs.
34:45That's a lot more jobs.
34:46You know?
34:47But other than that,
34:48I'll say,
34:49according to the Bible principle,
34:50things will get from bad tools.
34:52We have to seek God
34:53as a people in the country.
34:55We have to seek God first.
34:56Seek Him first
34:57for all other things.
34:58and He will put things
35:00in place for me.
35:01Where you live,
35:02is crime a serious problem?
35:06All right.
35:06No.
35:07No, crime, free place.
35:09Yeah, crime, free place in the country.
35:11Would you say that
35:12some people are naturally bad
35:15or does the upbringing
35:16and environment
35:17need them to commit crime?
35:19Well, I say they're mine,
35:20you know.
35:20You have a choice.
35:22You understand?
35:23You have a mind,
35:24but still,
35:25people can,
35:25people have,
35:26people have weak minds
35:27and can get influence.
35:29You understand?
35:29You have a bunch of
35:30I can do your bunch of it.
35:31You could get influence
35:32of the crime.
35:34You understand?
35:35How much should we blame
35:36society
35:37or how much should we blame
35:39the person
35:40for getting involved in crime?
35:42I would say the person.
35:43Yeah.
35:44I would say the person.
35:44Mine, mine.
35:46Choice.
35:48You make.
35:50And what age person
35:51should be fully responsible
35:52for their actions
35:53and what is the youngest age
35:54of the criminal
35:55should be punished
35:56as an adult?
35:5718 years.
36:0018 years.
36:01How is it 18?
36:05How do you feel
36:06about people
36:07that are driving
36:09under the influence?
36:11Oh,
36:11that's not good at all.
36:14That's not good.
36:16Do you think
36:17it's a proper punishment
36:18for someone
36:19found to be driving
36:19under the influence?
36:21Do you think
36:21it should be
36:22a punishable offense?
36:23Yes, of course, yeah.
36:25You charge them.
36:26Yeah.
36:26I don't want to take away
36:29the license too.
36:30Right.
36:31In your estimation,
36:32how can we reduce
36:33crime in this country?
36:35You know,
36:36harsher punishments
36:37or better education?
36:39I would say better education.
36:40Yeah.
36:42More, you know.
36:43Yeah, yeah, yeah.
36:43And through,
36:45you have to blame
36:45the parents too.
36:46You cannot train
36:47in the getting at home.
36:48You understand?
36:50Yeah, yeah.
36:51Because most of the time
36:52when children
36:52behave like that
36:54and you really
36:55check their background,
36:56the parents and them
36:57must list them.
36:58You understand?
36:59Monkey see, monkey do.
37:00According to my husband.
37:01Final question.
37:03In terms of this,
37:04we are not new government
37:05in the last few days
37:06and what are you
37:08looking forward to
37:10in terms of
37:10how they deal
37:11with crime?
37:12Well, I will look at
37:17for the time
37:19do take a lesson
37:20down the crime.
37:21Yeah, yes.
37:21But I will say
37:22it will get better.
37:23But we have to try
37:24with prayers.
37:25We have to do what
37:26we must seek God first.
37:29We have to seek God.
37:30We cannot do not
37:30met out God enough.
37:31I know it's not here
37:32saying that
37:33we cannot do not
37:33met out God.
37:34Seek He first
37:35the kingdom of heaven
37:36and righteousness
37:36for all other things
37:38we added unto us.
37:39Matthew 6, 33.
37:41Thank you so much.
37:41Yes.
37:42Appreciate your time.
37:43Yes.
37:44Have a good day.
37:48Voice of the people.
37:49Some really lovely people
37:50in Arima,
37:51I have to say,
37:52and they were
37:52some very, very
37:54educated views as well.
37:56Mark, you know,
37:57I want to, you know,
37:57endorse that.
37:58And, you know,
37:59just listening to
37:59that citizen of
38:01Trinidad and Tobago.
38:03You know,
38:03she basically spoke
38:04about a societal response
38:06to crime.
38:07You know,
38:08looking at
38:08for my economic,
38:09social,
38:10for my youth,
38:11even looking for
38:11my religious context,
38:13deep enforcement
38:13of the law,
38:14looking at policy positions,
38:15you know.
38:16So she touched basically
38:17on, you know,
38:18every aspect
38:18of what will be
38:20viewed as a societal response.
38:22And I think
38:22that's the way to go
38:24when we are speaking
38:25about dealing with crime.
38:26it's no one line of attack
38:29in relation to where
38:30crime is concerned.
38:31And that's why
38:31when you're looking
38:32at crime,
38:33you should not only
38:34be directing your efforts
38:35to the Ministry of Homeland Security
38:37or the Ministry of Defense.
38:38Yeah, they are
38:39the primary ministries,
38:42but you have
38:42the Ministry of Education,
38:43the Ministry of Youth Affairs,
38:44the Ministry of Social Development,
38:45and the people.
38:46So that there must be
38:47proper coordination
38:48among the ministries
38:49when you are going to deal
38:50with crime and criminality.
38:51So, excellent response.
38:52And I always enjoy
38:53to hear and listen
38:54to members of the public
38:56to see how best, you know,
38:57we can take that
38:59to the organization
39:00that we belong
39:01and try to foster change
39:02based on what the people
39:03is calling for.
39:05Yes, certainly.
39:06All right,
39:07we're going to take a short break
39:08and we'll be back.
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42:20Welcome back to Beyond the Tape.
42:32I'm your host, Mark Basant.
42:34Of course,
42:34joined today by
42:35Acting Sergeant
42:36Sahir Ali
42:37of the Trinidad and Tobago
42:39Police Service
42:39and Attorney at Law.
42:40It's legally speaking
42:41on Wednesdays.
42:42And I know that
42:43on come Saturday,
42:45it's a little milestone
42:47and you're hoping
42:48to achieve,
42:49but of course,
42:50I know you're one
42:51of the nominees
42:52for the position
42:53of the director
42:54of the Police Service
42:55Credit Union.
42:56Well, Mark,
42:57I want to thank you
42:57very much for,
42:58you know,
42:59making mention of that
43:00this afternoon.
43:01I think it's a very
43:01important juncture
43:04in my life
43:05and why it's important
43:07is that I'm seeing
43:08an opportunity
43:10that has been offered
43:10by the Police Service
43:11Credit Union
43:11and the membership
43:12to join hands
43:14with the membership
43:14to help shape
43:15the future
43:16of the Police Service
43:17Credit Union.
43:18And, you know,
43:19I issued a notice
43:20recently inviting
43:21the membership,
43:22you know,
43:23to give their support
43:24through voting
43:25on Saturday
43:26and, you know,
43:27there's a theme
43:28that I want to place
43:28in the minds
43:29of these individuals
43:29that your interests
43:31and your well-being
43:33matters.
43:33and that should
43:35be very important
43:36to you
43:36and, you know,
43:37I'm asking you kindly
43:38for your confidence
43:39and support
43:40to ensure that we
43:42shape the Police
43:43Service Credit Union
43:44to ensure that
43:44the membership
43:45and, Mark,
43:45may I say
43:45it's over 20,000 members
43:47so you've seen
43:48a very large percentage
43:51of the people
43:51of Trinidad and Tobago
43:52from different sections
43:53and different walks
43:54of life.
43:55You know,
43:55so I want to thank you
43:56in advance for your support
43:57and, Mark,
43:57thank you all very much
43:58for highlighting it
43:59this afternoon.
44:00Yes, and most certainly
44:00we all,
44:01and an equal footing
44:02we also want to wish
44:03the other nominees
44:04the best of luck
44:06come Saturday
44:07and hope for that
44:08the best person
44:10is chosen for the job
44:11and regardless
44:11whether you win,
44:13lose or draw,
44:15it's for the betterment
44:16of the credit union.
44:17And that's correct, Mark,
44:18and I'm happy that you
44:18concluded with that.
44:21Like anything else,
44:22it's a fair
44:22and free
44:23and let the democracy
44:25of the police service
44:25credit union
44:26also prevail
44:27at Saturday's
44:28AGM.
44:29So I want to thank you
44:30very much for that.
44:30Let a caller prevail
44:31right now.
44:32Caller, good evening.
44:34Good evening.
44:35Good evening, gentlemen.
44:36Mark, how are you doing?
44:37You good?
44:37I'm good, man.
44:38How are you doing?
44:39Nice.
44:40I'm cool, man.
44:40Good evening, Sarge.
44:41You good?
44:42Good evening to you.
44:44Nice.
44:44So, firstly,
44:45you know,
44:45I've always come into
44:46your new work
44:46you've always been doing
44:47as you do as me.
44:50But at the same time,
44:52I have to let you know
44:53that I'm a bit
44:53disappointed in you
44:54recently.
44:56I've called numerous times
44:58to the show,
44:59one of which,
45:00our last conversation,
45:01you would have assured me
45:03that some sort of
45:05investigation would have
45:05been done by you.
45:07And up till now,
45:09I still haven't gotten
45:10an image of this
45:11situation where I told you
45:13about the fire
45:13that was taken
45:15by the police service
45:20based on the incident
45:23that would have happened
45:23where the six
45:26assailants would have
45:27tried to stage a robbery
45:30which they won't,
45:32they were unsuccessful.
45:35One of them being
45:36shot in the incident.
45:38And after investigations,
45:42no discrepancies were
45:44found.
45:44and it's now
45:45two years
45:47plus
45:48that the fire
45:50hasn't been returned.
45:52All of which,
45:53we are still waiting
45:54to hear
45:55the other steps
45:58because it went
45:59through the forensic
45:59steps,
46:00everything was okay,
46:01everything was fine.
46:02it has been removed
46:05from forensics
46:06over to the CID
46:08who is supposed
46:09to return it,
46:10waiting on
46:11a correspondent
46:12from either
46:15the commissioner
46:16of police
46:17or a senior.
46:19That's all
46:19that has to happen
46:20now.
46:21And I know
46:22you told me
46:22you would have
46:23looked into it
46:23and no redress,
46:25so I still
46:27await humbly
46:28because on two
46:30other occasions
46:30within the two
46:31years,
46:33because of
46:34one of their
46:35counterparts
46:37being shot
46:38in the incident,
46:40they have been
46:40looking at me
46:41carefully.
46:41Now they don't
46:42know that
46:43they don't have
46:44a firearm,
46:45but who knows,
46:47maybe they just
46:48wait on the right
46:48moment,
46:49because they know
46:49how they're moving
46:50the pack of wolves.
46:53So I don't know,
46:54I'm still asking,
46:55can you assist?
46:58So,
46:59Kuala,
47:02go ahead.
47:03Kuala,
47:03let me again
47:04thank you
47:05for your persistence
47:06and let me
47:07indicate publicly
47:08that when matters
47:09are brought,
47:12actions are taken,
47:13we trigger the process.
47:14But let me also
47:15remind you that
47:15within the
47:16Firearms Act,
47:18the authority
47:18still resides
47:19with the police
47:20commissioner,
47:21regardless of
47:22if the investigation
47:22comes to an end.
47:23But I'm happy
47:23that you
47:24refresh the matter
47:25and I want to
47:26ask you again
47:27to leave your
47:28number and I
47:28will again look
47:29into the matter.
47:30But I want you
47:30to also appreciate
47:31that your matter
47:32is not the only
47:33matter that person
47:35is called for
47:35redress.
47:36Just last week
47:37I got four calls,
47:37so I'm asking
47:39you for your patience,
47:40I feel your pain,
47:41but leave your number
47:42and again I will
47:43intervene to see
47:44exactly what's the
47:45status of that matter.
47:46But I'm asking you
47:47to also be
47:48reasonable in terms
47:49of understanding
47:50that while we may
47:51trigger a process,
47:52while we may advise,
47:53while we may shine
47:54some light on a matter,
47:55the authority still
47:57resides with the
47:57police commissioner
47:58as to whether in fact
47:59that firearm should be
48:00returned.
48:00So please bear with me
48:01but I will intervene,
48:03leave a number so I
48:04can make a necessary
48:05intervention again
48:06for you.
48:06Yes, you know
48:08that's a matter
48:09I guess, you know
48:10we've spoken about
48:12this, you know
48:12I told you about
48:13a friend of mine
48:14happened about
48:15maybe about just
48:15under a year ago
48:16he shot a bandit
48:18that tried to
48:19come out to his
48:20compound,
48:20actually they tried
48:21to rob him
48:22in his car
48:22and you know
48:24there was some time
48:25before he took
48:25to get his firearm
48:26back and I know
48:27there's a process
48:28and I'm just wondering
48:29if that process,
48:30I mean it really
48:32defeats the purpose
48:33if you have a licensed
48:34firearm and then you
48:34have to use it
48:35at some point
48:36and then it takes
48:37you a year
48:38and in this gentleman's
48:39case two years
48:40before if everything
48:41is done accordingly
48:43as he indicated
48:44why you should not
48:45get your firearm
48:46back considering
48:47you are at risk.
48:48Well Mark, you know
48:49I want us to also
48:49appreciate and I think
48:50I have a golden
48:52opportunity now
48:53so over the campaign
48:55you would have heard
48:56the now government
48:57spoke about looking
48:58at reviewing
48:59and regulating
49:00that entire firearm
49:02user license process
49:04and I want to say
49:06as well that
49:07it has been
49:07a sore issue
49:08and I'll admit
49:09that publicly
49:10a lot of persons
49:11have spoken about
49:12it has been
49:13a sore issue
49:13in terms of
49:14the processes
49:14and the efficiency
49:15in handling
49:16that process
49:16even in a situation
49:18where the caller
49:18has just mentioned
49:19so it's a golden
49:21time to look
49:22at the reviewing
49:23of that entire process
49:24and I think
49:25the opportunities
49:26here now
49:27where it might
49:28be looked at
49:29even from
49:29a legislative context
49:30so again
49:31I'm happy
49:31that you brought
49:32for the matter
49:32so the decision makers
49:34are hearing clearly
49:35the issues
49:37and challenges
49:37that members
49:38of the public
49:39have
49:39and again Mark
49:40even within the TTPS
49:40you have divisions
49:42and divisions
49:44you have senior officers
49:45who are called upon
49:45to investigate
49:46these matters
49:46and to make
49:47recommendations
49:48and even matters
49:49that the caller
49:50spoke about
49:50so it's a whole
49:52retooling
49:52of that whole
49:54firearm industry
49:55that we need
49:55to look at
49:55so please bear with me
49:57as I said caller
49:58alright we have
49:59another call in line
49:59caller good evening
50:00quickly
50:02quickly
50:02okay
50:03basically
50:04the licensing
50:05of pubs
50:06or bars
50:07right
50:07the process
50:10in between
50:12that a pub
50:13was broken
50:14or a bar
50:14was broken
50:15recently
50:15in the back
50:17of me
50:17and inside
50:18of two houses
50:19and I cannot
50:21understand
50:21how a bar
50:23could get a license
50:23to operate
50:24in an area
50:25like this
50:25where people live
50:26it is open
50:28in a compound
50:29owned by
50:30from one
50:31but he rents it
50:32out to people
50:33so I really
50:34really need
50:35your help
50:35because this
50:36this thing
50:37is ridiculous
50:37right
50:38back at my
50:38house
50:39and for a
50:39resident
50:40for three
50:40four residents
50:41I need
50:42your assistance
50:42please
50:43caller what's
50:44area what area
50:44is this
50:45all right
50:47all right
50:48we'll respond
50:49after this short
50:50break so
50:51stay with us
50:51plumbing problems
51:06don't guess
51:08call plumbing
51:09solutions
51:10at 628-4646
51:12proud to be
51:14serving Trinidad and
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52:57welcome back to be on the
53:10tape
53:10i'm your host mark
53:11basand
53:11it's legally speaking
53:12wednesdays and with
53:13us today acting sergeant
53:14zikirali of the trinidad
53:16and tobago police service
53:17i know you have to respond
53:18to the caller
53:18quickly
53:19and thank you mark
53:20and again mark
53:21like the previous caller
53:22in relation to the
53:23farm use of license
53:24this issue in relation
53:25to the bar license
53:26you know that is also
53:27topical
53:28that the honorable
53:29prime minister
53:29have also indicated
53:30that part of the review
53:31is in relation to
53:32looking at
53:32the issue of bar license
53:34but it was coupled
53:35with looking at
53:36the issue of noise
53:37so
53:38and noise that is
53:39causing a public
53:40nuisance
53:41so caller
53:41i hope that you
53:42left your number
53:43so that we could
53:44take a look at it
53:45and see whether
53:45in fact that whole
53:46process in terms
53:47of the issuing
53:48of a license
53:48whether it was
53:49appropriate
53:50in the circumstances
53:50and whether there
53:51may be any remedies
53:52but mark i always
53:53you know
53:53when callers raise
53:55issues i always
53:56think about you know
53:57there should have
53:58been a public
53:58affairs department
53:59you know that i'm
54:00sharing so that i
54:01dedicate you know
54:03all my time and
54:03effort to deal with
54:04these issues you know
54:05once and for all
54:05but you know
54:06god is great and
54:07hopefully you don't
54:08know what the good
54:09lord has but
54:10thank you very much
54:11mark the opportunity
54:12to respond
54:12yes certainly and i
54:13i guess as as how
54:15we started the
54:15program we want
54:17to finish and i
54:17know you just had
54:19a very uh point
54:20or two just to
54:21touch on that
54:22uh situation with
54:23the yes acting
54:24commissioner and
54:25the commissioner
54:25yes mark i think
54:26that um you know
54:27i made some brief
54:28statements at the
54:29beginning in terms
54:29of looking at it
54:30you know with a
54:32broader lens i'm
54:33not looking at the
54:33as i said before
54:34the vindication of
54:35miss here with
54:36christopher alone but
54:37looking at some
54:37other issues in
54:38terms of the
54:39vindication of the
54:40rule of law and
54:40so forth but at
54:41this juncture mark i
54:42want to you know
54:43ask the citizenry of
54:44trinidad and tobago
54:45the media the
54:46commentators you
54:47know and the
54:48interested parties
54:48mark there are two
54:49important documents
54:51that are that
54:52presently in the
54:52public domain one
54:54is the the release
54:55from the honorable
54:56director of public
54:57prosecution senior
54:57counsel roger
54:58gaspert on the
54:5910th of may and
55:00the other most
55:01importantly the
55:02judgment of justice
55:03cv john in the
55:04high court of
55:05trinidad and tobago
55:06and the reason why
55:07i'm identifying those
55:08two documents it you
55:09know i saw you know a
55:10particular commentary i
55:13should say and i'm
55:14asking the citizens of
55:15trinidad to begin all
55:16those stakeholders be
55:17responsible and look at
55:19those two documents
55:20carefully if you look at
55:22those two documents
55:23carefully all the issues
55:25that you have it i if
55:27it's not ventilated in
55:28the judgment of justice
55:29cv john it is answered in
55:31the the release of the
55:33honorable director of
55:34public prosecution so i
55:35just want to make that
55:35point this afternoon
55:36because there are some
55:37very significant things
55:38there that supports what
55:40i said earlier in the
55:41beginning of the show
55:42to demonstrate that you
55:43need to look at this
55:44with a 360 lens to have
55:46a full appreciation on
55:48that judgment mark the it
55:49was a judgment that the
55:50evidence from both
55:53parties was led before
55:54court who had the
55:54opportunity to look at
55:55it so if you want to
55:56see a chronology of
55:57events and to answer
55:59your questions i want to
56:00advise you humbly look
56:02at those two documents i
56:03thought it was important
56:04to say that this
56:04afternoon yeah certainly i
56:05mean the judgment is
56:07approximately 28 to 29
56:09pages in length yes
56:10having of course read
56:11through it and
56:12obviously uh to kind of
56:14uh summarize so to speak
56:16um just a suture and
56:18spoke about the fact
56:19that um that the police
56:21service commissioner did
56:22no wrong in suspending
56:24uh commissioner of police
56:26earlier here with
56:27christopher when the
56:28investigation began why
56:31because um it would
56:33obviously um not allow
56:35her in any way to
56:36interfere with the
56:37investigation so to
56:38speak as well as not
56:40prejudice the
56:41investigation in any
56:42form or fashion just as
56:44a summary i know there
56:45were other points that
56:46he made but just to
56:47break it on in layman
56:48terms and um i think
56:50it's i guess if you read
56:53the judgment then you
56:53would better understand
56:55uh what the judge is
56:56saying and of course
56:57understand the situation
56:58for what it is and
57:00mark you know just
57:00quickly and i'm happy
57:02that you you know shed
57:03some light and you know
57:03some critical areas and
57:05last but not least this
57:06issue with reference to
57:07whether in fact an order
57:09was issued by the court
57:10for the reinstatement of
57:11the police commission it
57:12was automatic if you look
57:13if you look at the
57:14judgment i want to advise
57:16members of the public
57:16look at paragraph 93
57:18recent developments that
57:20is um um enshrined within
57:23that particular judgment and
57:24it is very clear the
57:26pronouncement of the high
57:27court through justice
57:28suture so that you can be
57:30guided properly and again
57:31this is all geared towards
57:33urging us to be
57:34responsible mark yes
57:36most certainly all right
57:38repeat tonight at 11 30
57:40we'll run tomorrow at 11
57:43o'clock the tv6 news is up
57:46next and we'll be back
57:47tomorrow at 6 p.m stay with
57:48us
57:48so
57:51you
57:54you
57:58you
58:00you
58:02you
58:04you
58:04you
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