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00:00What a great little show that was. I'm not sure how I feel about a robot dancing
00:05better than me but it was a good choreography to Bruno Mars. We're now
00:11going to go from robotics to achieving the impossible. Innovation, exploration
00:15and the power of mindset. Now our next guest comes from a family that does the
00:22impossible for a living basically. His grandfather flew higher into the
00:27stratosphere than anyone before him. His father dived deeper into the ocean than
00:33anyone ever has and he well he had a bit to live up to. Well he circled the earth
00:39twice. Yeah first in a balloon in 1999 and then in 2016 in a solar-powered aircraft
00:48that did not use one single drop of fuel. And he's still going. Now building a
00:56hydrogen plane to fly non-stop around the world once again with zero emissions.
01:03So what is powering Bernard Picard? Let's try and find out in his mindset. Please
01:09welcome him in conversation with Lise Pedersen.
01:42Maurice, take a seat. Hello everyone and welcome to this session. Hello, hello. Innovation often begins with a change in
01:52the world.
01:52With people willing to push beyond what others think is possible. Our first guest has spent his life doing that.
02:00So I'm delighted to be sitting here today with Bertrand Picard. Bertrand, welcome to VivaTech.
02:05Thank you very much. A place I love. It gives so much hope.
02:09Bertrand, throughout your life you have repeatedly taken on projects that many people consider completely impossible, sometimes crazy.
02:18You've circumnavigated the globe with your solar impulse plane and the first solar-powered circumnavigation that was.
02:26You also went around the globe before that in a balloon and you're now working on a new project that
02:32you're going to tell us about.
02:33How did the solar impulse project lead to your current project?
02:37You know, an explorer, a pioneer is someone who is profoundly unsatisfied with the status quo.
02:48And the status quo today, what is it? It's a world that is endangered by pollution, by climate change, by
02:59the depletion of biodiversity.
03:02And we cannot like that. So if you're an explorer, you want to improve it, you want to change it.
03:09And in the beginning, you have to show what is possible.
03:14So solar impulse, what was it? An aeroplane flying around the world with no fuel at all, only powered by
03:21the sun?
03:21I think it's a fantastic sign to disrupt this idea that the world needs fossil fuels.
03:30The world has needed fossil fuels until now, but maybe we can do that differently in the future.
03:36And that is disruption. Disruption is when you do and you think in another way that everything you have done
03:45and thought in the past.
03:46And once it's possible, suddenly it seems normal.
03:51You know, now we have aeroplanes built in composite materials because solar impulse gave the example.
03:57When I created the project, the photovoltaic energy was 40 times more expensive than it is today.
04:05So it's so important to demonstrate the feasibility of what seems impossible.
04:10And then you can go to the next one. And climate impulse is just the next step.
04:15So exactly. Tell us, for anyone in this room who might not know what climate impulse is about, can you
04:20tell us in a couple of sentences?
04:21Maybe we can see some pictures as well that we have of your project.
04:25Absolutely. Climate impulse is an aeroplane that is today under construction.
04:31The goal is to go around the world, non-stop, zero emission, with liquid green hydrogen.
04:40So it's a project of aeroplane. But it's also a project for our society.
04:45It's a project for the youth. It's a project for hope.
04:49Because there are so many people who believe there are no solutions.
04:53There are no future. Everything's lost.
04:58You have children who believe the world is going to disappear in a few years.
05:05Come on. Come on. Let's wake up.
05:08Let's speak about solutions more than problems.
05:11Let's speak about what we can do. Let's implement the solutions.
05:17Let's work together to make it happen.
05:21And climate impulse is one way. You know, for me, climate impulse is also an educational program to teach about
05:30pioneering spirit.
05:32Pioneering spirit is when you look at everything that has been done until now and you try something else.
05:38And you can never be hopeless if you are a pioneer because you know that it might be difficult, but
05:46you know that with perseverance you'll manage to do it.
05:50You talk about disruption. So you're clearly betting on disruption with this project.
05:56Why is this hydrogen worth pursuing when you have things like sustainable aviation fuel?
06:02I mean, that would appear easier to implement. So why hydrogen? Let's have a look at the pictures.
06:08Why hydrogen and not SAF?
06:11Well, if you use sustainable aviation fuel, you capture CO2 in any form.
06:19It can be biomass. It can be plastic. It can be cooking oil. It can be direct air capture, whatever.
06:26You have the CO2 in your hands. You have captured it. You could bury it. You can put it on
06:34the ground.
06:35You can sequestrate it. But instead of that, you put it back in the atmosphere as a fuel that is
06:40burned by an airplane.
06:42So it's true that it's neutral because it's the same CO2 in the cycle, but it could be negative.
06:51So we are still putting CO2 in the atmosphere. When you are using hydrogen, you are outside the cycle of
06:59carbon.
07:00So, of course, it's much more difficult. That's why people believe it's impossible to fly with a hydrogen or liquid
07:07hydrogen airplane.
07:09But I think it's the ultimate goal to reach if we really want to be completely clean.
07:15And for a pioneer, for an explorer, it's not the fact that it's easy or difficult. It's the fact that
07:21it is better or not.
07:23So you're talking about innovative technologies. So what would you say today?
07:26Which emerging technology today reminds you of solar 20 years ago when you set out with your crazy project?
07:32Well, electrification in the world and using hydrogen. This is the way to be clean.
07:40You electrify with renewable energies. You make the world efficient. And you can store this energy in hydrogen or batteries.
07:48Batteries for small vehicles. Hydrogen for heavy vehicles like airplanes, trains or boats.
07:54And what we have seen in the past shows that the future is very often accessible, much easier than we
08:03think.
08:04Remember when photovoltaic was 40 times more expensive than it is today and now it's the cheapest source of energy.
08:11Remember when the – but you are too young for that, most of you – but the mobile phone 40
08:17years ago was a suitcase costing 15,000 euros.
08:20And today we have one in the pocket for 100 bucks. So we see that what was always considered to
08:29be impossible just comes as soon as we reach what is called the critical mass.
08:36When you have enough offer and enough demand to drop the price and make it accessible to everyone.
08:42And this is what we want to do with Climate Impulse. That's the construction of the plane.
08:50That's important to show you the construction because it's better than the 3D design of the plane.
08:59You can think, oh, we've made the design and it doesn't exist. But this is really the construction of the
09:05plane itself with the wings, with the hydrogen tanks, with the fuselage.
09:11So we're looking at the manufacture here, the construction of the plane. Did I interrupt you, Bertrand?
09:16That's the construction. That's what we are, but this is what we want to achieve. So I'm coming to your
09:24question.
09:24That's a micro ecosystem of hydrogen. You produce hydrogen. You distribute it on the airport. You have an airplane using
09:36it. And you are independent, independent from fossil fuels, and you don't produce any CO2.
09:43And if you manage to do something like that in an ecosystem that is quite small, the goal is to
09:50make it bigger. And the goal is to reach this critical mass, to make the industry of hydrogen more desirable.
10:00Because today it's not so desirable. It's new. People are worried that it will not be possible. So just show
10:09that it's possible and continue and scale it up.
10:12You need pioneers and then you need the industry to scale it up.
10:15Exactly. So you're leading to my next question. So that's the tech, but you often say that technology alone isn't
10:21enough. So when you meet entrepreneurs, innovators, I'm sure there are some in the room here today.
10:26What separates those who change the world from those who simply build very impressive technology?
10:33The difference is who is making the world a better place or not. This is really important. You know, I'm
10:40not only an explorer. I'm also a medical doctor, a psychiatrist.
10:44And for me, the quality of life on this planet is the most important thing. How can we make a
10:51better quality of life?
10:52And for this, you need better technologies, of course, but not only. You need this pioneering spirit for a better
11:01education, better health, better governance.
11:05The governance on this planet is an absolute disaster. Just look at all the mentally sick people who are in
11:13power in a lot of countries. It's a disaster.
11:16So pioneering spirit is about changing what seems impossible to change and keeping pushing for using the doubts, using the
11:30question marks, using the unknown to stimulate our creativity.
11:34We will never be creative. We will never be innovative if we are not obliged to be innovative and creative
11:40by a crisis, by the problems.
11:43So today we have enough problems and enough crisis in order to really push us to do better. And this,
11:49this is what technology has to be.
11:52But with technology, if it doesn't improve quality of life, you can destroy more than what you create.
11:59You know, technology can destroy the world or it can save the world. And at the crossroad between the two,
12:06you have the human being.
12:09Is the human being using technology in the good way or not? And this depends on us. All of us.
12:16Doesn't depend on the technology.
12:19We hear a lot about reusable rockets these days, commercial space stations. Our next sessions are going to be all
12:25about space.
12:26We hear about orbital manufacturing and of course about human ambitions up in space. We often hear about the next
12:33frontier being in space.
12:35So from your perspective, where do the greatest explorations, the opportunities for exploration and progress still lie in that sector?
12:44You know, the next frontier in space. I'm sorry to say, but we have never done better than what has
12:53been done in 1969.
12:56Apollo 11 landed on the moon. And now we're not even able to put a rocket that lands on the
13:03moon again after 60 years.
13:06So what has been done in the past was brilliant. And today they are not able to do the same.
13:12So it's easy to say, OK, we'll go on Mars.
13:14Maybe we'll go on Mars sometimes. But this is an exploration feat. It's beautiful for exploration to go on Mars
13:22and show it's possible.
13:23But it will not change the daily life of people on Earth. What will change the daily life of people
13:29on Earth is to have an Earth planet where we live better.
13:33And when you hear that the Earth will be destroyed and we have to send millions of people on Mars
13:39to save humankind.
13:41Excuse me. I totally disagree. We will not save the humankind by going on Mars. We'll save humankind on protecting
13:51humankind against the destruction of this Earth, of this planet.
13:55And for this, we have to fight against the big challenges, climate change, poverty, social inequalities, gender inequalities, bad governance,
14:05health problems, education.
14:07This is where we really have to be pioneers and to do better. That's the challenge of exploration.
14:14So what would be your key message for the next generation of entrepreneurs?
14:19The entrepreneurs need a purpose. They need to do good for our world. They have to improve quality of life
14:32on Earth.
14:33What is only there to cultivate the spectacular technology is not enough. It's not enough.
14:42Now, I give you an example with AI. We speak a lot of AI. AI is exactly like a flight
14:51in a balloon.
14:53The atmosphere is made out of several different layers of wind, which all have a different direction.
15:00So if you want to move up or down, you will go left or right. You change altitude to change
15:07direction.
15:07With AI, it's exactly the same. You have an altitude where AI will take you to a world that is
15:15much more efficient.
15:17You will integrate intermittent renewable energies in the grid, giving the amount of energy people need in a very efficient
15:25way to store the excess to be given later when there is no wind or sun or whatever.
15:30You can divide by two the energy consumption of the world.
15:35But there is another altitude where AI can be used for things that are not really important.
15:42I'm sorry, but an autonomous car is not something really crucial for humankind.
15:47It can be used also to have faster streaming on your phone.
15:53But I'm sorry, today we have a good streaming velocity and I'm not sure it will change humankind to have
16:00a faster streaming.
16:02But if we do that, the direction in which we are pushed is going to increase the quantity of energy
16:10consumed.
16:11We will oblige us to make much more data center.
16:15And finally, the positive results of the first altitude will be completely destroyed by the negative output of the other
16:24altitude.
16:25So, you see, it's a big paradox because with the same thing you can do a lot of good or
16:33not.
16:33And the entrepreneurs today, they have to imagine how useful their technology will be for the survival of humankind and
16:43for the quality of life of humankind.
16:45Not for their personal success or the personal and independent success of their own technology.
16:52Same for robotics. Same for nuclear power.
16:55Nuclear power, you can make civilian nuclear power plants or you can make atomic bombs.
17:00So, the importance of human being is crucial. It's really at the center.
17:07It's the purpose in which we are doing things that is much more important than what we do.
17:12And this is a spirit that has gone through your entire family because, as we heard in the introduction, your
17:19grandfather explored the stratosphere,
17:21your father explored the deepest point in the ocean, and you explored the skies with solar energy and today with
17:28hydrogen.
17:28What frontier do you hope that the next generation is going to choose?
17:35Well, next generation, if you speak of my children or next generation, if you speak of all the children of
17:41the world, for me, the message is the same.
17:44I received an education that I want to transmit.
17:48I learned about curiosity because without curiosity, you try nothing new.
17:55I learned about perseverance because without perseverance, the new things you try will probably not be a success.
18:07And the third one is respect because without respect, your success has no value.
18:14So, if you have curiosity, perseverance and respect, you can be successful in a lot of things that you do.
18:23Very clear message. Thank you very much, Bertrand.
18:26A final message here for the people gathered in the room.
18:29We're going to move on to space shortly.
18:31We're going to look even further up above the stratosphere.
18:35A message for the people in the room here at VivaTech in 2026 in these very volatile geopolitical times.
18:43Do you still feel optimistic about the future, about what this young generation of innovators and explorers is going to
18:51be able to achieve?
18:53If you are optimistic, you do nothing because you believe that the problem will be solved by itself.
19:02If you are pessimistic, you do nothing because you believe that there is no solution and the problem will always
19:08remain.
19:09So, I prefer to be realistic. Realistic is when you are aiming at finding solutions independently from the ideology.
19:21And today, we have far too much ideology.
19:24You have the ideology that says that ecology is sacrificial, expensive and boring.
19:30You have the ideology that industry, of course, is polluting if it is profitable.
19:39And both are wrong.
19:41You need solutions from the industry to make the ecology profitable and the industry clean.
19:48You need everybody.
19:50You need the oil companies to make a diversification into hydrogen and electricity.
19:57And you need the green activists to speak about solutions more than problems.
20:03Alone, when we are in silos, we will never succeed.
20:07We can only succeed if we use all the good ideas, all the good solutions from everybody and we put
20:14all that together.
20:15I think this is really the message.
20:18So, you are a realist rather than an optimist.
20:20I am realistic.
20:22And I hope it will work.
20:24But realistic does not mean that you cannot dream.
20:28You know, what I believe climate impulse will bring after flying around the world non-stop, zero emission, is decarbonized
20:39aviation that will allow you something that you can never do with kerosene.
20:45You can take off in a commercial airplane starting like a rocket, burning liquid hydrogen and liquid oxygen like the
20:53Ariane rocket.
20:54And after 15 minutes, the pilot will shut down the engine at 100 kilometers altitude.
21:03And then you fly parabolic, without any engine.
21:07Parabolic, suborbital, at 100 kilometers altitude.
21:11And you can land in Australia two hours after taking off from Paris.
21:17And it's completely clean and it's completely decarbonized.
21:21And you fly two hours instead of 23 hours.
21:24And you think, wow, the past has allowed us to do this.
21:29And then we'll move on to New York.
21:31And then we'll head on to New York.
21:33After Australia, we'll head on to New York in another couple of hours.
21:36Absolutely. Absolutely.
21:38You can, you can, you can do.
21:40And that's, that's the message.
21:42If you are realistic and you use all the solutions from everywhere, you can do much better than what has
21:50been done until now.
21:51And you can have a future that is really desirable.
21:55Bertrand, a huge thank you.
21:57It has been wonderful talking with you today.
21:59With pleasure. Thank you.
22:02And have a good flight with hydrogen.
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