- 7 months ago
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MusicTranscript
00:00Hi, I'm Kai and Sian from NME, and I'm here with AJ Tracy.
00:09I'm on. My G.
00:10How are you?
00:11I'm chilling. I'm good. I can't wait to get on stage, I'll be honest. I'm raring to go.
00:16I'm excited.
00:16Is this like, I know you went on the not even a tour, but like, is this like your first big festival?
00:22You know what? I did Glassdoor the other day.
00:23Oh yeah?
00:24That was crazy. I can't lie. But usually my circuit is kind of like 10 big festivals in a row.
00:30And I started whittling it down a little bit and just being select more selective with them.
00:33So this is the other half of the big, so the Glassdoor was half of the big shows.
00:37This is the other half of the big shows. And that's it really.
00:39And then that tour, like you said, it's just a little tour to just give something back to the fans,
00:42get back into, shake the ring rust off. You know what I'm saying?
00:45Yeah, man. Yeah, man.
00:46Yeah. What is it that you get from like live performances?
00:49What do you get? Adrenaline, dopamine, all the good stuff.
00:53Yeah. Oh, I guess. Well, also like you could test out certain things.
00:56Yeah, yeah, yeah. You can, you can test songs.
00:57I personally think live is maybe the worst place to test a song.
01:00I'll be honest, because if you're a fan, I'm a fan of music also.
01:03I would love to go to someone's concert and listen to music.
01:05And I'd love to hear their unreleased music,
01:07but not really at a live show because I don't know the words.
01:10So I can't really vibe to it. Do I like this song? I don't know.
01:12I have to use to think in real time, like, do I like this?
01:14Do I know the words? Do I, you know what I'm saying?
01:16So I don't know. It's cool. It's cool. It's cool.
01:17I think it's good to test your combination of songs and your choreography,
01:21not like dancing, but like how you move around the stage is good to test
01:24rather than maybe not new songs. But that being said, I'm going to play a new song today.
01:28That being said, unreleased.
01:29Could you tell us a little bit about this song?
01:31Actually, I don't know if you can hear rumblings in the background behind me,
01:33but Finesce Kid's in there and that's, that's who I'm going to be performing with.
01:36Oh.
01:37Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's my guy, man.
01:38Okay. What was it about Finesce Kid that made you want to team up with him?
01:41He's just cold. He's cold.
01:42He's got South London energy, which I rock with. You know what I'm saying?
01:45I think that he's very witty the way he crafts his bars.
01:47I like his flow. His beat selection is good.
01:49And he's swaggy as well, man. He could dress. So that's, that's what we rock with.
01:52Yeah. If you don't mind me asking, like, I feel like you as a UK rap authority,
01:57like you've been around for a minute, for a minute.
02:00It's nearly, well, no, I'm pretty sure it's a decade.
02:02Yeah, 10 years. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Just about, just about.
02:04Yeah. Like, how do you feel about the rise and the growth of UK rap?
02:08Yeah. Happy, man. Very happy. I'm glad I could be a part of it. I'll be real.
02:11I'm glad I could be a part of it. I think if you look at the kind of music scene and UK rap,
02:15UK music, I'm kind of somewhere over on the edge. Like, you know what I'm saying?
02:18Just doing my own thing, which is how I like it. But it's also nice that I've done enough work that
02:22I can kind of like pass the baton a little bit and give people like a little leg up,
02:24you know what I'm saying? So whenever I can, if there's like a younger person who's doing well,
02:28or just sounds dope, I'll just, you know what I'm saying, throw the baton and just be like,
02:30yo, come, tap them in, you know what I'm saying? Yeah.
02:32Should be like that, because people weren't really doing that for me. So you got,
02:35you got to break cycles and change things, you know what I'm saying? So yeah, man, important.
02:38Of course you dropped in June. Don't, don't die before you die.
02:42Yes, yes, yes. Thanks. Exactly.
02:44You caught me. Exactly. I got you. I got you. I got you. Come on.
02:48When I read around it, as well as when I listen to the album, you have this almost different mindset.
02:53It's no longer full of just hunger and like this sort of like hedonistic need to hustle.
03:00It's like you're really looking into yourself, looking into life and trying to share your own
03:05exploration of that, right? And I wonder if with that growth is also like you wanting to reach back
03:11and help people find that. 100% it is. I think for me, I've got to a point where
03:17I'm still hungry, but I'm not hungry as in, you know, it's do or die. It was do or die.
03:22You know what I'm saying? We, we come from an impoverished area, like whatever anyone wants to
03:26think about Labra Grove. If you don't know, you don't know, just say that in it. But we come from
03:29an area where like, you know, it's rich mixed with the poor and we do things as a means, means to survive
03:33and a means to an end. And I don't need to do that anymore. Thank God. You know what I'm saying?
03:36I'm very blessed. I'm very grateful. And I feel like if I can now start giving back and uplifting young people,
03:41then I'm going to do that. And whether that's through music, tapping in people that finesse kid,
03:44you don't need my handout. It's not a handout you get me, but I'm just trying to reach out. I'm like,
03:48yo, let me accelerate it. Cause I think you're cold, bro. Let's accelerate the things you get.
03:52And then whether that's through, I have a, I have a, um, a scheme with Oxford where I have a grant
03:55every year. We give money to Oxford for, for black kids. And I think whether it's through that,
04:00whichever way it is, like I'm trying to do it, you know what I'm saying? So yeah, I agree with you.
04:03I think the new album's very introspective and very like reflective. And I'm thinking about my life
04:07and I'm thinking about, yo, can't believe I'm here. Like sometimes I wake up and I'm like, rah,
04:11I remember being in my little flat in Labrack Grove for my mum, my brother, and times are tough,
04:14man. And now it's not so tough. You know what I'm saying? So I'm very grateful,
04:17very happy to be here and soaking in every moment. You know what I'm saying? Like, yeah, man.
04:21Yeah. Real West Londoners know Labrack Grove is Grove.
04:24Yeah. But they don't know, you know what I'm saying? But you know, whenever I talk about
04:26Labrack Grove, you know what people say? Yeah, but High Street Kensington. Yeah, but you got the,
04:30I'm not from there though. Yeah. I'm from Grove. Like, do you get me? People know. Yeah,
04:33man. But I love my area. Like, like we said before that the camera started rolling.
04:36Yeah. You get me? Even if it's a bit of a show at times, it's our shows. Yeah. That's how it is.
04:40Yeah, man. West London, don't not be too tired. Yeah, man. Exactly. Exactly. I love West, man.
04:44Yeah. And I feel like, you know, with like Notting Hill Carnival coming up and stuff,
04:48and there's such a rich musical heritage in West that's not really explored this much. There is. Yeah, there is.
04:52There is. There is. I feel like you being, you know, West London rapper is kind of a representation
04:58for the area and kind of has like helped change some people's perspective on West London. I would agree.
05:03I would agree. I would definitely agree. Yeah. Do you, was it like important with songs like West
05:08Life and even West Heng and to show West London? If you look through my songs, there's like a million
05:14songs that I'm referencing West, West London, like Left, Lumber Grove, Grove, Notting Hill. There's
05:19just so many references, but yeah, it is important. It is important. I think letting people know where I'm
05:23from is really important to me. And I also think that like there's a negative connotation with when
05:29people say like where they're from and then people see it as like, it doesn't always have to be gang related.
05:33It ain't always got to be negative. And it's not about like, oh, I'm fighting against your area.
05:35It's not about that. It's I'm proud of where I'm from. I'm happy about where I'm from.
05:38I love the community. I love the people. You get me? And yeah, man, I just think it's nice to
05:42big up your things. You get me? Now people know me as Lumber Grove. Do you know what I'm saying?
05:45So when people see me, they see Lumber Grove and I think that the song name being Lumber Grove and
05:49being a positive song and just being as big as it was, it means that like when people think of it,
05:53they think positively. You get me? And that's, that's kind of my aim. I don't want it to be all doom and gloom.
05:56And it's not all that aggression and doom and gloom. Do you get me? Yeah. Yeah.
05:59Talk about doom and gloom. Go back to the album. I feel like it was definitely your most versatile
06:06as well as vulnerable. I wanted to know, one, why did you really want to like pour your heart
06:12out and show all these personal, like speak about all these personal moments in your life on
06:19Don't Die Before You're Dead? I think because whenever I listen to artists and I listen to new
06:23albums from artists and I follow their journey from wherever I first, I'm introduced to them,
06:28whatever album and then to the, to the end or not the end for me yet, hopefully, but you know,
06:32through the journey. Yeah. Touch wood. But, um, I like to learn something new about them and I need
06:36to be learning and growing with the person. I'm saying go through the journey. So when I listen
06:40to Skepta, I hear this new Skepta album. I'm like, oh, I learned something new about Skept. You know
06:44what I'm saying? Before I knew him, I was learning about him. Obviously now I have the pleasure of seeing
06:47him and whatnot, but before I didn't know him and I like to learn something new about my favorite rapper.
06:51Do you get me? So people who are listening to me, I want them to not just think, oh, all right, cool. We know he's got a big chain.
06:55Like he likes chains. All right, cool. Like he's got a car or whatever. All right, cool, cool. But we
06:58know that. Do you get me? But what don't we know? Do you know what I'm saying? What, what can I relate
07:02to? What makes me feel like this person I'm championing, listening to their music, putting my
07:06money in to go see like, what, what, what do I have in common with them and what can I learn from them?
07:09Do you see what I'm saying? So for me, me talking about my mom and my mom's struggles and what she went
07:12through was important because a lot of people go through that. Even if it's not directly in some sort of way you
07:16can relate, you know, we will have loved ones that we care about and we're scared of losing them. You know, we go through these
07:20struggles and I think me talking about it and being vulnerable shows people that, oh, you know what I'm
07:24saying? Like whoever, whatever you think is cool and is lit and there's whatever, like that those
07:27people still go through what you're going through and we're all just the same, man. You get me? Not
07:30to be a hippie, but it's true, isn't it? All it's the same. So that's it. I don't think it's being a hippie.
07:34I think there's being positive and like having a really positive outlook on that. Yeah, yeah. I wasn't,
07:40I can't, I wasn't always this positive. I'll be honest, man. But, but there was a time when I eventually
07:43realized like, yo, I'm in such a good position. I'm so grateful for where I am. I'm so lucky as well,
07:48because it could be way worse. I need to just be happy with like what's going on. Because you know
07:51that hunger of more and more like, especially materialistic things, it will never end. Because
07:55if you want a new car, you eventually, hopefully, if you're a granddaughter, you'll get the new car.
07:58Then you want the new, the newer car. Then you want the newer phone, the newer watch. And where does
08:02it end? It doesn't ever end. So if what you're seeking is just like feeling content and happiness,
08:06then you can have it and you can just have it perpetually, innit? And I'm a bit happier to be honest.
08:09Yeah, man. I see you smiling like a, like a proud mum. But yeah, no, I swear down. I feel like that. I actually feel like that.
08:16It's not for the cameras. I actually feel like that now. So every, everywhere I go and every interview
08:20I do now, I try to tell people like, yo, it's not so bad, man. You get it. You turn on the news,
08:23it just looks horrible, but it could be worse, innit? Everything could be worse. Yeah. AJ Tracy,
08:27the philosopher. Come on, man. Nah, allow me, man. Yeah, man. And I also wanted to talk about how this is
08:34your most rap adjacent. I feel like throughout most of your career, you have been branded as like, you know,
08:40the Grime Kid. Yeah. Bringing Grime to the mainstream, which I mean, great. It did need to come out of the
08:45shadows for how long, but is there? I wouldn't attribute that solely down to me, but definitely
08:49I had a part to play in it. Yeah, for sure. It was like a class of people, you know what I'm saying?
08:53And I was just lucky to be part of that class. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Being more rap adjacent
08:58and like bringing all other sounds into your music. Yeah, yeah. Was that like very conscious?
09:03Do you want to like move, not necessarily just like a Grime Kid, but like to a versatile overall
09:09rapper? Or is it like you're always Grime? It's a good question. I think the crazy thing is,
09:13I started off rapping, not even on Grime. I started off on rap, but no one obviously heard me on rap.
09:17Then when I started getting like some attention, I was spitting on Grime. So that's what people know
09:21me for. But a lot of people might have joined me at Rain. People might have joined me at Tiago Silva.
09:25Wherever you joined on the journey is what you think like is my main thing. Do you know what I'm saying?
09:28So like some people join me from dinner guests and they're like, oh, okay, he's just, he's on this
09:31rap thing. But I just like everything. And with the album, it wasn't really conscious. I kind of just made what I
09:35thought I needed to speak about and how I felt. And then it just happened to be
09:39rap, happened to be Grime, happened to be Jersey, whatever. Do you know what I'm saying? I don't
09:42kind of, I don't restrict it to like, oh, this one needs to be this genre. I don't really do that.
09:46Also, it wasn't an album that I thought, yo, let me try and sell as many units as I can. Obviously,
09:50I love to sell units. Everyone does, but I can't only be about that. Do you know what I'm saying?
09:53So like, I know obviously if I'm talking about my mom and her struggles, that's not going to sell
09:56Mad Unis, obviously, but that's not really the point. Do you know what I'm saying? That's actually not the
09:59point. So I can make another album, God willing, I'll be around to make another album. And then maybe we can run
10:04up some numbers and make some more, I don't know, man, West 10s and Labrador, maybe, who knows. But
10:08I needed to get a message across and I didn't want to like tap out music or God forbid anything
10:11happens and people don't listen to me anymore. And I haven't spoken about my actual life. Do you
10:15know what I'm saying? I feel like that's an injustice if I wasn't speaking about my life.
10:18Because people who know me personally, you know that I'm a lot deeper than like going to age all this.
10:21I love age all this, they're my guys, but it's not just about that and the cars and to get me.
10:25So yeah, man, I just thought I had to, I had to speak about these things and they just happened to
10:28fall into the genres that made sense. You know what I'm saying?
10:31You've been independent the whole time. I have. Yeah. I have, I have, I have.
10:34How, how come you maintained your independence? Like that must've been
10:41trifling at times. You know what? It wasn't, to be honest, it actually wasn't. It's actually
10:44the opposite. It was actually easier to be independent than being a label because I have
10:46full creative control. Like if I make a song today, I can just release it tomorrow. There's
10:50no one who can tell me like, oh, nah, we're not sure about it. There's no one can tell me anything.
10:54I'll just upload it. Do you know what I'm saying? Like, which I love because that's how I started. I started
10:57off by making a song in my friend's bedroom and uploading it on SoundCloud. So I started how I meant to continue.
11:01Do you know what I'm saying? And that's not that I've never had conversations with labels. I've
11:03had loads of conversations with labels, but they just never really say the right thing. I'll be
11:06honest. And it's just always going to be a thing where like, as a young black man, kind of young,
11:11still ish, they, they, I can tell that there's always a group of people. Yeah. Not justifying any
11:17group of people, but there's always a group of people who are powerful and want to utilize what you
11:20have until you don't have it. I'm not, I'm not a commodity for you to utilize and just throw me away,
11:24but that's, that's not what I am. Do you hear me? I'm building a legacy for my family, for my potential kids
11:28that I hope I have. Do you get me? I'm building a legacy for my area, for Trini people, for Walsh
11:32people, for everything. Do you get it? So it means a lot more to me than just signing away my life and
11:36then people own my masters and they got to tell me when to jump, man. I'm not on that. I'll be real.
11:39But if it was the right deal, I would be open to signing it, but it's just never been the right
11:44deal. So I'm on safety. Yeah, man. Yeah, man.
11:46Yeah. And I feel like with you and your cousin slash bestie, Big Z doing Rich Flavours, your TV
11:57show on Sky. That was fun, man. Yeah. It looked like fun. It was fun, proper fun. Yeah. It wasn't,
12:01that wasn't even work. That was usually from me, the alley-oop. He's just like, yo, Sky, what are you
12:05on? I'm like, yeah, come. Yeah, come, whatever. Come, let's do it, innit? Why not? Yeah, why not?
12:09Yeah. But I do wonder, is like, do you want to be a little bit more than just a rapper? Is that,
12:13what is like your next venture? It's a good question, man. Everyone asks me this. I don't
12:17really want to be like a TV personality or an actor. I will do TV. I'll definitely do it.
12:21I'll delve into it, but it's not my thing. You know what I'm saying? Zoom is good at that.
12:23That's his thing. I'll leave that to Zoom. Zoom's better than me at that. You know what I mean?
12:26My thing is music. But if I can also do a little bit of this, a little bit of that. Yeah,
12:30man. Have you seen, have you ever seen Recess when you was a kid? Recess. Recess.
12:34You ever seen Recess? TJ Detweiler, Spinelli, Gretchen. You don't know who that is? How old are you? 24. Okay. All right.
12:41See, we're reaching that age where I might have out-aged you there. I'm sorry. All right,
12:44cool. Well, basically, there was a show. Some people watching will know what I'm talking about.
12:47But there's a kid in it. There's loads of different kids in the playground.
12:49Are you talking about the cartoon? Yeah. Oh, yeah, yeah. All right, cool.
12:53Well, there's a guy called Hustler Kid. He opens his jacket and he has everything in it.
12:56Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. That's kind of like me. I'm good at music,
12:58but I'm a hustler. Do you get me? He's like, I open the jacket. I got some TV in there,
13:00some radio, some football. Do you get me? Yeah, man. That's it. I'll do everything.
13:04If it makes sense and it makes me happy, I'll do it in my life. So when people see me,
13:07they're like, oh, AJ's on Twitch. He's gaming. I didn't know he, what, AJ watches anime? I didn't
13:11know. AJ's at the football with the lads, like drinking pints. I do it all. I do it all, man.
13:15I do it all. We're multi-dimensional creatures. I'll do everything.
13:17Your purpose is just to be a multi-dimensional creature.
13:19Yeah, exactly, exactly. My purpose is to be happy and live, I'll be honest. And then if I can set an
13:23example like, yo, if AJ, well, he's not sticking to the rat box. Like, he could just do whatever. Then yeah,
13:27man, everyone can do that. I'll be real. And I've got bad haters also, so I just kind of want to like
13:31piss them off all the time by just doing something new, I'll be real. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. This is my
13:35last question. Smidge controversial. I've warmed you up. Okay. Okay. Let's see. Um, so the other day
13:41at Wireless, Drake said that UK rappers are some best spinners in the world, right? I heard that. I heard that.
13:48What do you think is so great about UK rappers that everybody needs to know? That's not controversial.
13:51You could have went so much more controversial. I'm trying to be nice. Oh, that's calm. That's calm.
13:56What do I think is great about UK rappers? There's a long list I can give you, man.
14:00Such a long list. Like for a start, we didn't invent rap. I'm going to start with that. Yeah.
14:03Americans invented rap. It's their genre. We do it also, but now it is, it is. I'll be real. Look,
14:08I'm going to show you like this. I argue Jamaicans created hip hop, but anyway.
14:12You're going to struggle with that one. I'll be honest, man. Cause, cause as I know it, yeah,
14:15hip hop originated from jazz. You know what I'm saying? Jazz and people being able to use spoken word
14:20on jazz and explain their struggles. Most predominantly black people. Yeah. That's, that's, as I know it,
14:25look, we can, we can debate it, but in my opinion. We'll debate it off camera. Cool. Fine. Fine. Now, in my opinion,
14:30grime comes from Jamaica. That's my opinion. Cause it's dancehall and sound clash. You get me?
14:34Yeah. I get it. I get it. For me, I would say grime comes from Jamaica. Yeah. Now with the rap thing,
14:39what I'm trying to say is we didn't invent it. Yeah. So not to say you can't be the best there
14:42because you didn't invent it, but it's also like, sometimes you have to understand that these
14:46lot have been doing this. Like sometimes it's not like puff up your chest. Yo, we're cold. We are
14:49cold and we don't need no one's validation. We're cold. We're doing arting, but you don't need to
14:53watch their thing all the time and compare it. Like it's something different. Do you know what I'm saying?
14:55That's my opinion. When you listen to pop from Sweden, they're the kings and queens of pop.
15:00Like our pop is not touching their pop. They do pop. You get me? So that's cool. That's cold.
15:05Doesn't mean that America's pop and England's pop and K-pop and J-pop ain't cold either. Cause it is.
15:11Do you get me? But I'm just saying they can all exist. And I think UK rap is the best. I'm always
15:14going to say it's the best. I love American rap. I listen to Drake all the time. I listen to whoever,
15:19man. Who do I actually listen to? Gunner, Drake. Struggling for Americans here.
15:27But then compare that to the UK rap as you listen to. It's different. It's different. It's different.
15:30Depends what mood I'm in. If I'm in the mood to listen to UK rap, I'm listening to Finesse Kid.
15:34I'm listening to Skep. I'm listening to Lancey. I'm listening to SD Kid. If I'm listening to American
15:40rap, then it's usually more commercial rap. You know what I'm saying? So I don't know. I think we've got
15:43something for everyone, man. I just think that the comparison was a little bit weird because
15:48Americans invented rap and we should kind of be not grateful, but we should respect
15:52that it was their thing originally and that we've received it. And yeah, man, I just think
15:56we're all different. I don't know how to describe it to you. I do think UK rap is better, but that's
15:59because I'm a UK rapper. I'm obviously going to say that. You know what I'm saying? Of course,
16:02I'm going to say that. And I think we've got bundles of talent here. I'll tell you one thing though.
16:05We set the trend though. We set the, we always set the trend. Americans, sorry, this is going to annoy them,
16:09but a lot of the time they look over here for inspiration. I'm not saying we don't look over there,
16:13but they also look over here. And people who say they don't, it's just like, that's when they get sour.
16:17Liars!
16:18That's when they get sour. Because rest in peace, my boy Pop Smoke, I was with him in the studio
16:21and he was loading up only UK beats. And that's when I knew, I said, okay, I see it. I see it.
16:26You get me? Yeah, man. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
16:28Yeah. Wow. Thanks for talking to me today.
16:30I appreciate it. I appreciate it.
16:30And now I'm going to tell you why Jamaica created hip hop and this, you know.
16:34Cool. Say no more. Say no more. Say no more.
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