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00:00Hello and welcome to Gangs All Here. My name is Ryan Sampson, the host and producer of the show.
00:03That's my guy Frankie Vitorini from U Stadium. Today is Thursday, January 22nd.
00:08The New York Jets are debating on what they're going to do at number two, and we're going to debate what they're going to do at number two.
00:13Now that Dante Moore is going back into the college football world, there's a lot of debate about David Bailey, Reuben Bain, Arvel Reese.
00:20We'll discuss those options for the Jets. Plus, we'll talk about Mel Kiper mocking Ty Simpson to 16 for the Jets.
00:26Is he worth the pick, Frankie?
00:27Well, listen, he might be worth the pick. I have a comp for you. Later on, I'm going to give you the comp on Ty Simpson, what his ceiling could be.
00:36So I'm waiting to do this, and this is going to be kind of explosive right there.
00:40Well, look, and then we'll also get into the defensive coordinator candidates that the Jets are currently interviewing.
00:45Kaz will give us the early favorite for the job, and much more on today's episode of Gangs All Here.
00:49And, of course, we're going to be joined by our Jets beat writer, Brian Costello, to join in on the discussion today.
01:03And, Kaz, the first thing I want to talk about for this now is we are officially a mock draft season.
01:08A lot of pundits and media types and content creators are talking about the Jets' options at number two.
01:14And we'll get into 16 in a little bit later, but I want to start with that number two pick.
01:19Now that we know that Dante Moore is not coming out, it's really limited in terms of the quarterback options for the Jets at two.
01:24We know they need a quarterback no matter what.
01:26But I want to start off with should they take a defensive player at two, considering there are some highly touted players at the top of this draft class.
01:36We hear Bailey's name, Reuben Bain, Arvel Reese.
01:40There's a lot of debate going on there.
01:42Before I get your opinion on the options there, I do want to play this clip from Jets GM Darren Mugey that resurfaced this week
01:49when he discussed a player's traits versus measurables and how they evaluate a player.
01:55One of the more important parts of the evaluation process is each player's measurables, being height, weight, speed, hand, arm, length, all those things.
02:03Each position has a threshold, you know, kind of a cutoff line.
02:06If his speed's below this, he's probably not going to make it, or we definitely have to downgrade him.
02:11You know, or if his size or length is below this, we're going to have to downgrade him.
02:16But with that being said, you don't want to weight it too much.
02:18Some of these kids have three years' good body of work on film, and they're good football players.
02:23How much do we want to ding them because they're a tenth of a second slower than another guy?
02:29And that may be subjective, but it's always going to take a role and play a part in it
02:32and have its weight.
02:34How much weight that is, I think it depends by player position.
02:41So look, for Gang Sounds Off, we hear that from Darren Mouji.
02:44What are your thoughts, Kaz, about what Mouji had said there when he was with the Denver Broncos?
02:49And do you think that carries over into how he's going to evaluate at number two who to pick?
02:53Yeah, I think that's a pretty good soundbite where you don't really say much.
02:59Like, you say a lot, but you don't say much.
03:01Like, he really didn't answer the question.
03:02If you pay attention to it, he basically says it comes down to each player, you know,
03:07and as it should.
03:08You shouldn't be locked into size, speed, you know, as that absolutely, you know,
03:14you can't break those rules.
03:15And if you want to look for an example, if you're Darren Mouji, you can look across the
03:20table at Aaron Glenn, right?
03:22He was the exception to the rule at cornerback at his size.
03:26You know, there's no way, I think, I can't remember what height Aaron Glenn is, but I
03:30think it's 5'9", 5'10", something like that.
03:33Yeah.
03:33You know, that's below the threshold at cornerback.
03:36So, and he ended up having a very good NFL career.
03:40Um, so yeah, so I, I think, you know, he, I get it.
03:44It's interesting to hear him say, talk about the draft, but he didn't really answer much
03:47with that, with that answer.
03:48He just kind of said, yeah, you consider both.
03:51You consider the measurables, but you can't, you know, make them absolutes.
03:54Well, I think that's, that goes into the part of the debate of Bailey versus Bain, right?
03:59If we take Arvel Reese out of this discussion at two, just for this part of the debate, using
04:03that clip cause the discussion right now, it feels like amongst Jets fans is Bailey versus
04:09Bain.
04:09You have a ton of production coming out of Bailey.
04:12You know, he looks like a, a true pass rusher.
04:15Uh, one of the leading nations in pressures sacks, like this is a guy who can get after
04:20the quarterback.
04:21And then you have a guy like Bain who just plays with relentless effort and energy has
04:26a high motor can play against the run really well, but his arms are really short compared
04:32to your standard edge rusher or edge player, I should say.
04:36And that has been dinging him in terms of evaluation, if he's worth that picket too.
04:42So how do you sense that could potentially play if Mugi plays it, pays attention to that?
04:49Yeah.
04:50I think they're both good players, right?
04:51You watch them play.
04:52So I think it's going to come down to the tape and watching the tape and not arm size
04:57and 40 times and that kind of stuff.
05:00I think it's watching the tape and deciding who you like better.
05:03I, you know, I remember hearing Melvin Ingram didn't have long enough arms back in the day
05:09and they took Quentin Coppels instead, right?
05:12We knew Melvin Ingram had a much better career than Quentin Coppels.
05:14I heard this story years later.
05:16I didn't hear this at the time, but someone told me years later that works for the Jets
05:21that they were talking to a coach in 2014 and they didn't like Aaron Donald's arm length.
05:25So what I've, yeah, so it's like, you know, it's the measurables get, you know, you get
05:33tripped up on that stuff.
05:34And I, especially I feel like address, I get it for more for offensive tackle.
05:39Like we talked about this with Bill Campbell a lot more last year.
05:42I don't know.
05:42I think you can judge the production addressing wise in college.
05:46So to me, these are two good players and they're going to debate it.
05:50If it comes in, I think Reese is a good player too.
05:52Reese is more of a projection at edge rusher because he hasn't played there as much.
05:55But yeah, we've got, you know, tons of stuff coming up with the combine and a senior role
06:01next week, which I think Bain is going to be out.
06:03Is Bailey going to be there too?
06:05Yeah, he is.
06:05Yeah.
06:05He might be there too.
06:06Yeah.
06:07So you got the two of them.
06:08So they're going to do, you know, you'll see the interviews and that part of the process
06:11is huge too, to see what they, you know, how much they love football, as they love to
06:17say.
06:18And so we'll see that over the next four months.
06:21Yeah.
06:21I'll say this about David Bailey.
06:23If you look at his measurables, right?
06:27405 pound bench press cause that's big time.
06:30I know.
06:30I know you used to do that back in the day.
06:32I heard that there's a rumor going around, but 550 pound squat.
06:38He was clocked at over 22 miles an hour, heavier 22.16 miles an hour.
06:44He was clocked at David Bailey, which if you go on next gen stats, that would be top five
06:49for any ball carrier during a play, uh, last season, um, in the NFL.
06:56So David Bailey is a freak in a lot of ways.
07:00And the more and more I look at his tape, I cannot tell you how much in love I'm falling
07:06with him as a prospect.
07:08Um, he's unbelievable.
07:10And the height is a little bit of a concern and he's a little stocky, but he's got long
07:15arms.
07:15So he's got like a kind of a stocky build, but, um, he's got the long arms.
07:19David Bailey to me, I think when this whole process is said and done and he runs at the
07:25combine and they see the way he moves, I think that'll be your pick at two.
07:29Um, I know we're going to get into our bell Reese.
07:32I don't know if you want me to get into him now.
07:33No, no.
07:33I, so it's interesting to say the measurables, like you like his measurables more than it
07:37compared to a Bane who's, I think I would say way more stockier as a player and definitely
07:42yeah, they both are, but he's shorter arms, but he has a high motor and he plays with
07:47relentless pursuit and loves football.
07:50It seems like from everything you see with him, just the passion he plays with the energy
07:54he plays with, you see on the field, I guess there's this debate cause.
07:58And I wonder what your thoughts are.
08:00If we're projecting a player right at number two, you kind of want to make sure that you
08:04nail that picket too.
08:05There's so much pressure there.
08:06Like it's gotta be a guy who's going to give you immediate production.
08:09You know, like, Hey, this is a guy we could start from day one.
08:13It feels like Bailey has the higher ceiling potentially because of the measurables you
08:18mentioned, Frankie, and he does have high production in college football, which is no
08:22debate about that, but Bane might be the safer pick just because, you know, he's going to
08:26bring that relentless motor every single day to the practice field.
08:29Do you think that weighs a ton into how they pick at number two?
08:34Yeah.
08:35I think when you're picking here, you want the lowest risk, right?
08:39That's, that's always, I remember in 22, when there was debate about whether the Jets
08:44would take sauce or whether they would take another player.
08:47I remember I projected sauce to them cause I felt like he was the most sure thing at number
08:53four, right?
08:54He was the guy that kind of knew what you were getting coming out of college.
08:58So I think when you're drafting in the top five, you're lowering the risk, you know,
09:02you don't want your, you don't want to blow one of these picks.
09:06So yeah, maybe somebody else has more upside and we've seen that where guys get drafted,
09:11you know, Michael Parsons, where he was drafted, or I mentioned Aaron Don, where he was drafted,
09:15they weren't seen as maybe absolutes coming out.
09:18So I think, you know, I think that's where our release comes into this too.
09:21It feels like he's the guy who everyone's really projecting the highest out of these three
09:26players and have been since early in the season.
09:30I feel like every list I've looked at has had him, uh, as the top non quarterback or in
09:36the conversation with Jeremiah love, I think as a, some people have had him higher.
09:40So yeah, I think Reese is going to Reese is the one that's interesting to me.
09:45Let me say this about Arvel Reese.
09:47There is a fallacy going on online.
09:50In my opinion about Arvel Reese and what kind of player he actually is.
09:55He is not an edge rusher.
09:57He is an off ball linebacker.
10:00And I can't state that enough.
10:02You're not you cause I'm saying people are projecting Reese to be an edge player.
10:08He plays a little edge, but he plays outside linebacker, but he plays inside next to sunny
10:14styles.
10:14Very good against the run, right?
10:17As a linebacker, Jeff fans are making a mistake here thinking about this, where they're telling
10:23themselves we were bad against the run this year.
10:26We have this guy, Arvel Reese that can play edge, but can also play Quincy's position in
10:32a way.
10:32So we kind of get all that in one.
10:35Remember, you're only taking the snap at one position.
10:39Are you an edge or are you an off ball as an edge?
10:42Because Arvel Reese only had seven sacks in 36 games at Ohio State.
10:49Six of those were in his first year.
10:51Granted, he was only a special teamer, so I won't dock him for that.
10:54But 30 games, seven sacks.
10:56Had a half a sack last year.
10:59Six and a half this year, which tied for second on the team or tied for third because there
11:02was two guys with six and a half and then one guy had 11.
11:05So Arvel Reese, to me, he's a project defensive end slash edge.
11:13Very strong, good at the point of attack, but I don't know if he's going to be a great
11:18run stopper if he is playing edge every snap.
11:23I would not draft a linebacker.
11:26I would not draft Isaiah Simmons or a better version of Isaiah Simmons, which I think Reese
11:33is, and he's phenomenal sideline to sideline, has some twitch, great tackler in space, got
11:39all the tools you're looking for for a linebacker, undersized a little bit.
11:44Don't think, though, if you put him at edge, don't think you're not going to have issues
11:48with him trying to hold up some of these big offensive tackles.
11:51David Belly's stronger.
11:53David Belly's got better pass rush moves by far.
11:55If you want an edge, it's David Belly.
11:58If you want a finishing piece guy or somebody that is going to come in and you could put
12:05him everywhere, that's Arvel Reese.
12:07But I don't really, I'm not looking at solving the Jets run stopping issues this year or next
12:13year.
12:13I'm looking at bringing in a guy that I know is going to be able to get you 12, 13, 14,
12:19maybe 15 sacks a season.
12:21David Belly can do that.
12:23He has the upside.
12:24But Arvel Reese, to me, doesn't.
12:26And I think we're making a big mistake if we consider him to be this can't miss edge
12:31prospect, which people are projecting him to be.
12:34I just think it's wrong.
12:37Does Reese compare to Micah Parsons coming out of college?
12:40Because that was Micah played linebacker.
12:42Yep.
12:43Great, great point.
12:45To me, he doesn't because, and their sack numbers are very similar.
12:49To me, he doesn't for one reason.
12:51Micah Parsons is a north and south kind of linebacker.
12:56He's not sideline to sideline.
12:59He doesn't really play.
13:01He's great at chasing down quarterbacks east to west, man.
13:02Yeah, but Reese is more of a linebacker.
13:05Parsons was more of an edge.
13:08Even when you were seeing him at Penn State, he was more downhill.
13:13He was more feisty.
13:15Let me ask you a question here, and this is something to cause.
13:17This is my opinion, by the way.
13:18So this is something for cause, too.
13:20It's about positional need, right?
13:22The Jets need an off-ball linebacker with Quincy Williams now being a free agent.
13:26Arvel Reese, theoretically, if you took him at two, cause, and I would imagine this is what
13:30Glenn and his new defensive coordinator, which we'll touch on a little bit later in this episode,
13:34they're going to try and scheme him to be first and second down.
13:39Feels like you're going to play off-ball linebacker.
13:41Third down pass rushing situations, we can line you up anywhere on the defensive line
13:45to be your quote-unquote Micah Parsons.
13:47That could be an appetizing thought for Aaron Glenn.
13:50What do you think about that, cause?
13:52Yeah, I mean, look, if you're taking someone number two, they better get after the quarterback, right?
13:56You know, you could, like, I guess you'd take Ray Lewis at inside linebacker at number two.
14:01But there's not many others, right?
14:04Like, it's just not a position that's going to have the impact that doesn't affect the quarterback enough.
14:10And so, if you're taking a number two, you better have a plan for him to get after the quarterback.
14:14So, I don't know if that's edge just on third downs or if that's edge all the time.
14:18Like, you're just going to convert him.
14:20Wait, Frankie, why, I guess?
14:21Cause, you know, I'm just, I'll start getting into the draft stuff more.
14:26I go to the senior bowl next week if the snow allows me to.
14:29Yeah.
14:31But, like, forget about Jets fans projecting this.
14:34Why are, like, the Mel Kuypers and the Matt Millers and those guys, Dane Brugler, like, why are they, they all have this guy rated very high, Reese.
14:43Like, why are they projecting him as an edge rusher?
14:45Yeah, I'll say this, his traits, his, his, his speed, his agility, his strength, he's extremely strong for his size.
14:56Um, I think they're projecting him to be an edge because of those traits that he has that sort of are off the charts in a lot of ways.
15:05He's, he's a four or five guy.
15:08He is very strong for 240 ish pounds.
15:12He's got plays with a great base.
15:14When he has played edge, he's looked good.
15:17He's a good.
15:18I won't say he's looked great, but he's looked good.
15:19I don't think the pass rush moves are there.
15:21I think he's someone that, as a project, he probably has the highest ceiling, maybe out of any player in this draft, because of all the traits that he gives you.
15:33And he's a phenomenal tackler.
15:35And he played in a defense, he played in an NFL style defense under, under Matt Patricia.
15:41I don't know if that's necessarily a good, a good thing for a stock though.
15:44I mean, people are saying what you're saying, but also you did have Matt Patricia.
15:48You played next to Sonny styles and you had Caleb down behind him defensive coach.
15:52But do you think that might make him look a little better?
15:55I mean, obviously.
15:57Yeah.
15:57So like, I don't know.
15:58That's kind of a yin or yang point there.
16:00I'm with you though, for the most part, I'd rather you come from a system like that than not.
16:04Cause you know how to get things done and you're used to being successful.
16:08But cause I think sometimes these, these, these pundits also, to be honest, I think they swing and miss a bunch.
16:15I mean, I've, I've heard points that they've made about players that I've disagreed with that, you know, ended up not.
16:23Yeah, they do.
16:23But I mean, it's just weird that everyone's projecting him that way.
16:26Right.
16:26Like I just, I was wondering if there was an answer of why everyone universally, like it's not Jets fans going, not Jets fans going.
16:33Oh, like they're, they're, they're hearing that from the, you know, any draft stuff you listen to is pretty much projecting him as an edge.
16:41I'll say this though.
16:42Him projected that last thing there.
16:43Cause I, yeah.
16:45I even reached out to field the eights.
16:47He did his, he did his rankings a week ago or whatever.
16:51Right.
16:51And so I looked at it.
16:52He does, you know, he did his top 25, I think.
16:56And then he did position by position.
16:58So I noticed he had at least the, at least number two and that he didn't have them in position rankings.
17:06And so I messaged him and I'm like, Hey, I'm like, I'm fascinated by this.
17:10Like what position this guy plays?
17:11He was like, you didn't have them.
17:13And he goes, Oh, that was a mistake.
17:14He's like, he's the number one edge.
17:15So, you know, like, yeah, he had him as the number one edge rusher.
17:22Let me say one last thing here.
17:23If you look at Bailey, he has a higher pass rush win rate than basically any edge in football right now.
17:32He was the number one edge player in the college football last year.
17:34He had 27 sacks his last, 26 and a half sacks his last three years.
17:38There is no question about it.
17:40If you're looking at a guy that's going to be able to get to the quarterback, it's Bailey over Reese.
17:45Reese, I'll, I'll, I'll say this, you know how many forced fumbles and I hate using stats like that, but like, you know, you're an edge.
17:52You force, you force fumbles, you know, it's kind of what you want to do again.
17:55It's zero.
17:56It's a limited role.
17:57This is where I, I listened to the pundits a little bit too.
18:01And this is what they are all universally praising Reese because of his traits and because of his qualities.
18:05This is a guy who in limited reps as an edge, what did produce in those reps.
18:11So that's why I think like Kaz is saying, if they project him to be a full-time edge, he could potentially be a Micah Parsons.
18:20Like now I know I listened to Mel Kiper and he said, if I were to rank Micah Parsons, Abdul Carter, guys that were similar in this play style and way they were used in college football, like Arbel Reese, he says, I would have Reese three compared to those other two.
18:34So he's a lesser of those two right now in terms of projections, but that's the thought I think.
18:40And ultimately cause there's a lot of pressure on that number two pick to nail it.
18:44And I, and I think this is just a fascinating discussion of like, what position is Arbel Reese going to play?
18:48Do we like the ceiling of, of Bailey more than Bain or do we like the safety of Bain because we like his profile?
18:55We like how he's, he's productive and he does well against the run and pass.
18:58So it's, it really is an interesting discussion of what they're going to do at number two.
19:02Cause do you remember Deion Jordan?
19:04I know he had some outside Miami.
19:06Yeah.
19:06Yeah.
19:07Yeah.
19:07Miami took him.
19:08Miami jumped up to take him right at three.
19:10Yeah.
19:11He had some off the field issues.
19:13So that probably had something to do with him not panning out, but I never liked him also as a prospect because I want a guy that I know where they're going to play to your point.
19:23If it's true, what you said earlier, and that was a great point, actually, if you can say on early downs, he's going to be off ball and then I'm passing down to rush.
19:31But who's done that really?
19:33I mean, Micah Parsons might be one.
19:35Micah Parsons did his first couple of years in the NFL.
19:37Yeah.
19:37Then eventually they found out task, man.
19:39That's as hard as it can get for a defensive guy.
19:41His first year, I remember, cause I did film study with Rex Ryan when I was at Sunday countdown with ESPN.
19:46We watched a lot of Micah Parsons play as a rookie.
19:49They put him as an off ball linebacker a ton his first year, but then they saw the production when he was a pass rusher, not only as an edge, but up the middle.
19:58So this guy's a demon and he's getting after the quarterback.
20:01We got to make him a primary pass rusher.
20:03And that's what they did the next couple of years after that and evolved into being that.
20:07If you could tell me you could develop an Arbel Reese into that.
20:11And that's a home run at number two.
20:13Yeah.
20:14Yeah.
20:15I think it's, I think it's easier said than done.
20:18A hundred percent.
20:19It all, it all depends a lot about the coaching that you get in the scheme that they're going to put you in.
20:23Yeah, for sure.
20:24The Jets, let's the Jets, Jets history.
20:26Number two has always been good, too.
20:29Man.
20:29I was waiting for that.
20:31Lamb Jones, Blair Thomas, and Zach Wilson.
20:34Do you, do you think that Arbel Reese?
20:37Honestly, early on though, early on though, cause like, do you get a sense that the Jets really do have a really good option at two,
20:46no matter what, in those, out of those three players, like you would support those three picks?
20:52Yeah.
20:52Right now I would.
20:53I mean, look, I, who knows Ryan with the like projections, right?
20:58I'm not going to sit here and pretend like I know what these guys are going to be in the NFL.
21:02It's hard, man.
21:03It's hard.
21:03Like I've seen guys, so many guys come in and very few of them look like they're, they hit the ground running in the NFL and, and look legit.
21:13And, and, you know, I, I joke about the number two pick, but Zach Wilson, there's a lot of revisionist history out there about Zach Wilson now and pre-draft stuff.
21:22And like, everyone was on board with Zach Wilson, the number two at that time, it wasn't, it wasn't like it was a thought like, oh, he's going to be terrible.
21:31I mean, there was some questions about who he played at BYU, but I don't think anyone thought it was going to be as bad as it was.
21:36So it's hard.
21:37It's a hard, it's a hard thing to project these college players into the NFL.
21:41Now I'll, I don't think this is as strong a number two as other years, Ryan.
21:46Like, I feel like there's been other years where if you felt really good, if you were in the top three about who it is, I feel like there's more of a projection this year in this draft.
21:55Yeah.
21:55There's no Abdul Carter there too, for the Jets this year.
21:59And the other thing I'll say to wrap up the number two discussion here for a little bit, I get revisionist history and I get scared when I think about off-ball linebackers from Ohio State or even linebackers from Ohio State and the Jets draft history with Vernon Golsan and Darren Lee.
22:15Big Vern?
22:16Big Vern.
22:16Not been a good history when the Jets draft linebackers from Ohio State, point blank.
22:22Look.
22:22Yeah.
22:23Like, Utah Vern's the classic example of a guy who didn't love football.
22:26And that's, you know, I saw a press conference, when was it, on Tuesday with this coach who invented football that they hired in East Rutherford.
22:35And I kid, I kid, but they, you know, and here's the, what do you look for at a player?
22:43We look for guys who love football.
22:45And I'm like, oh God, like they all say that.
22:47And it's sometimes you get a guy and he does not love football and Vernon did not love football.
22:54No, he certainly did not.
22:55And Darren Lee, again, did not work out either for the Jets picking in the first round.
23:00Yeah.
23:01God, that was a terrible pick.
23:02Another terrible pick.
23:03Mike McKagan, thank you.
23:04That was talking about a guy who didn't have a position.
23:06Yeah.
23:07That's true.
23:08Woof.
23:09And then we talked about him playing all over the place and then they never played him anywhere other than inside linebacker.
23:13Cause it's very, it's very hard to do.
23:15Yeah.
23:16No, it's a good point.
23:17Look at Isaiah Simmons.
23:18Isaiah Simmons has had some really good years.
23:19Did Blossom this year though.
23:20He did, but you got to get in the right spot at the right time.
23:24I think this Jets defense is going to change so much over the next couple of years, depending on who the coordinator is and whatnot.
23:30And that guy might be gone at that point where I just think, in my opinion,
23:33David Bailey, I look at him and you can go to sleep at night knowing that that guy is going to give you 12, 13 sacks a season.
23:40Just, just my opinion.
23:42All right.
23:42I lied about the last, about part two.
23:43Let's say they take David Bailey or Reuben Bain.
23:45Kaz, would they, would the Jets potentially look at trading a Jermaine Johnson or a Will McDonald if they ended up taking a pass rusher or two?
23:55I think they'd look at it, but I don't think they would just be like, let's give one away.
24:00I think you can live with three pass rushers, right?
24:04Like we've seen that in plenty of teams have three pass rushers and you're, you can have a rotation there and you can be fine.
24:10So I don't think they'd be like committed to it.
24:13I do, you know, if they're, if they draft a guy too, and then Friday, Friday afternoon, they're getting a ton of calls or something, you know, or even that night they get a calls.
24:23I think they'd listen and consider it.
24:25Like they were, they were listening on Jermaine at the trade deadline.
24:29Will, they told everyone no.
24:31I heard that for sure.
24:32That way they got shut down at the Astro Will McDonald, but Jermaine, they were listening.
24:36And so, yeah, I think, I think it's a possibility, but you can't have enough edge rushers.
24:42So I think you, you, you'd ride it out with Jermaine with Jermaine being his fifth year, right?
24:48Contract year.
24:49I think you would just, you might just ride it out with him unless you got blown away by a trade package.
24:53Yeah.
24:54And I completely agree with you.
24:55It's good to have as many pass rushers as you can.
24:58And, and I do wonder if Jermaine can have a bounce back year, another year removed from the Achilles injury.
25:03I know it's tough for a pass rusher because they need that get off, but I just, I believe in the talent.
25:09This is a first round talent player.
25:11I, I think he could have a bounce back year, but also who's to say, you know, Robert Sala is now a head coach again in Tennessee.
25:18Maybe he wants to bring Jermaine in or the Atlanta Falcons with Jeff Ulbrich.
25:22They want to bring him in.
25:23Could be a possibility if they wanted to trade for a player like Jermaine Johnson to bring them back.
25:27Cause that's like, that's the guys that were there to draft him.
25:29And Aaron Glenn's trying to reshift this defense and reshift this defensive line into what he envisions is going to work for them on their defensive side of the ball.
25:39Let's not forget though.
25:40There's another pick.
25:41The jets have number 16.
25:42And this week we got Mel Kiper's first mock draft post college football championship where Fernando Mendoza had an incredible season, finished undefeated, brought Indiana to their, you know, championship there.
25:53Incredible job that they did.
25:54But Mel considering there's only one quarterback worthy taking at one and none at number two for the jets.
26:01He decided to put Ty Simpson at number 16 for the jets.
26:06Here's what Mel Kiper had in his first mock draft.
26:08But he's 23 years of age as father's a coach, Nick Saban's there with him, advising him.
26:13So he had heard first round.
26:15You think about Ty Simpson, like I said, he could have been top five.
26:17He would have continued through offensive line, let him down.
26:20Ryan Williams didn't have the year expected.
26:21He had no running game.
26:22Okay.
26:23Ty Simpson obviously goes to a team that you say, can they screw it up?
26:27Can they affect, Hey, let him sit for a little bit.
26:29He's only has 15 starts, but again, put a little weight on that frame.
26:33This kid's so competitive.
26:34He won't let a play die.
26:35A fight still to bitter end a little too much.
26:37He'll figure that out.
26:38Ty Simpson, like I said, at this point at 16, we were talking top five back in October.
26:42I think it would make sense for the New York jets or the Steelers or the Rams late first round.
26:48So Kaz, uh, Ty Simpson, interesting quarterback prospect.
26:51Not many starts, uh, with Alabama or in his college career, he's coming out and many consider
26:56him the second best quarterback in this draft.
26:59I don't know, man.
27:00Do you think the jets are in a spot where they can swing and take Ty Simpson, who seems like
27:06a developmental quarterback prospect, or, uh, is it just too rich of a pick there to take
27:13him at 16?
27:15I feel like 16 is too rich right now.
27:18You know, maybe I'll feel differently in a few months.
27:20Uh, but you know, I think I heard Mel, I think it was Mel or one of the guys on the panel
27:25said like, Oh, well, if, if they, if it doesn't work out, you can just draft one next year
27:29with the three first.
27:31I 16 is a little rich for me to miss on like that and go, okay, yeah, we'll just draft another
27:36quarterback next year.
27:36I know the Cardinals did it with Rosen and Kyler Murray.
27:39I'd feel a little better, you know, if you take it in about 44 or something like that.
27:43And then, then you go, okay, let's take a flyer on them, see if we get anything out
27:48of them.
27:48If it doesn't work out this year, then we take a quarterback next year.
27:51That, I, that, I, that makes sense to me.
27:53Um, but 16, boy, I'm, I want somebody who's going to start for my team for the next five
27:59or six years, you know, um, still a first round, first round pick top 20 pick.
28:05So I, I feel like it's a little rich right now, Ryan, maybe I'll feel differently in a
28:09few months, but right now it seems, seems too high for me.
28:12Yeah.
28:13The thing with Ty Simpson too, is he had such a great first half of the season.
28:18And then when injuries started to kick in a bit, you saw the accuracy sort of go away.
28:23He would like Mel would just said on that clip.
28:26He didn't have much help with the run game.
28:27We'd spoken about that.
28:28The offensive line play was, was inconsistent.
28:31The thing with Ty Simpson though, that intrigues me when he's accurate and he's balling, he's
28:39accurate.
28:39He's really balling.
28:40Like he, he makes really good decisions.
28:42He does.
28:43He reminds me, and I always use these like comps and I call everyone like the Temu version
28:49or whatever, Walmart, Temu, whatever.
28:51Temu.
28:52I can't pronounce anything.
28:53Um, the Temu, uh, Drew Brees.
28:57That's my, that's my, uh, that's my little comp.
28:59Drew Brees was what?
29:00I think he was a second rounder.
29:01What do you go?
29:0259th.
29:02I believe.
29:03Yeah.
29:03I think it was like the first pick of the second round.
29:05Okay.
29:06Simpson 33.
29:07So I like what Kaz said with 44, I'm more of a 44 guy for Simpson, but, um, listen,
29:16we need a quarterback.
29:17I'm always a fan of drafting a quarterback.
29:19I'm a little bit, uh, biased there.
29:23Huh?
29:24We know.
29:25We know.
29:25No, I wanted to draft him.
29:27He killed him for not taking one day three last year.
29:28Yeah.
29:29I want to Riley Leonard, man.
29:30I want to Will Howard.
29:31I want all of them guys.
29:31But, um, listen, I like, I like Ty Simpson cause he's smart.
29:35He comes from a football background, limited starts when he's balling, he's balling.
29:4016 is as high as rich, but you know what?
29:43Based on the, the mock that Mel had, I'm okay more.
29:48And this sounds crazy with Ty at 16 than I am with our Vela to considering the situation
29:53that quarterback room is young.
29:56It's there's nothing really in there.
29:58Actually, it's nothing in young.
29:59Yeah.
30:00That's the other part, Ryan is we don't really know.
30:02Right.
30:03Yeah.
30:03We kind of have to see what plant part one and two of the quarterback plan is.
30:07I feel like the draft is like part three, like, you know, and do they make a trade?
30:12Do they sign a free agent?
30:13What, what does that quarterback room look like on April 20, whatever, whenever the draft
30:19is like, wait, cause I think that influences the decision as well.
30:22Yeah.
30:23I completely agree with you guys.
30:24And I agree with you, Frankie is, is that Ty Simpson really lit the world on fire for
30:28the first half of the college football season.
30:30And he caught my eye.
30:32And like you guys were saying, decision-making and the accuracy are things you really can't
30:38teach.
30:38In my opinion, to some of these quarterbacks, because it's, it's kind of innate in them.
30:43They're built, they're built into it.
30:45And like, they have that ability of like fast processing decision-making.
30:49I know one, two, three, I got my read.
30:51I'm making my decision.
30:51And he delivers it on time and accurate throws that you're like, wow.
30:55Okay.
30:55I could see that transferring over to the NFL, the next level that to me are traits that
31:01I would look at if I were Tanner Angstrand and Aaron Glenn and going saying, you know
31:04what?
31:05Maybe we take our swing at 16.
31:07We don't let him play at all this year, his rookie year.
31:09We bring in veterans like Kaz is saying, how do they address the quarterback position before
31:13the draft?
31:14Bring in a very good veteran that can start for you.
31:17Day one, Ty can sit there as the backup or even the third string, and there's no pressure
31:22on the kid to really show anything year one, but he's a developmental piece that maybe by
31:27week 14, 15, 16 next year, he could start three or four games for you.
31:30You get a good sample size.
31:32And if you don't like what you're seeing so far, if he doesn't look like he's fully invested
31:36in and he doesn't take those steps that you believe in, then you could take a swing
31:40at with one of those three first round picks next year as well.
31:43So I just, I think no matter what though, and this is something I'll make a stance on
31:48in those first two rounds, I feel like you have to take a quarterback here and give, give
31:53this team a chance to, to have a lottery pick.
31:55Because I think if you go past the first two rounds, you really aren't like, I don't believe
32:00you're really investing in the quarterback position and giving an actual chance for someone
32:04to develop into something.
32:05Does that make sense?
32:06It does.
32:07Yeah, it makes sense.
32:08Yeah.
32:08I think it also matters to, and Kaz, I don't know if you agree with this.
32:12I think it also matters who's available at 16.
32:15If Sonny Styles is off the board, if Makai Lemon's off the board, so do I, but if there's
32:20a possibility, both of those guys are off the board, you drafted, let's say an edge.
32:25Listen, it's, I rather, I think draft Ty Simpson at 16, assuming it doesn't affect how they're
32:31looking at the position in the following draft.
32:34We have three first rounders.
32:35If it doesn't really affect their thought there and they're kind of taking a shot on
32:38the kid, I'd rather that than a defensive tackle there, in my opinion.
32:43I mean, that's just me.
32:44I don't know, Frank.
32:45You think, you think you can draft someone to 16 and just go out next year, we'll, we'll
32:48draft one again.
32:49I don't know.
32:50I was going to ask you that.
32:50That seems like bad roster construction to me.
32:53And like, and they have a million needs, a million needs, especially on defense right
32:58now.
32:58Like, I feel like you, you better get one of those needs filled with number 16.
33:04And if you're using it on a flyer, on a quarterback, you're not filling one of those needs.
33:08Like I, like I get Mekhi Lemon is the guy that everyone likes, but there's, there's a lot
33:12of, I've heard there's a lot of receivers in this draft, like a lot of different receivers.
33:16So can you take a receiver at 16 and, you know, fill that hole?
33:20Yeah.
33:20No, I hear you, man.
33:21It's just, we're so starved man for that position.
33:24You know, that it's just, it's just, I know it's tantalizing.
33:28If you, if, I mean, if Ty Simpson turns into, I'll use your comp, Drew Brees, you're going
33:32to be, you're going to be stoked.
33:34You're going to be like, holy crap.
33:36Like the jets finally nailed the pick for a quarterback.
33:38Yeah.
33:38But remember Drew Brees was not Drew Brees.
33:40No, totally.
33:41I was going to say that.
33:42Yeah.
33:42Took him like three years.
33:44I can remember when Mark Sanchez was here, there was a thought of like, Oh, Drew Brees didn't
33:49really, didn't really click for Drew Brees until his third year.
33:51So Sanchez could click in his third year.
33:54I'm like, okay.
33:55I remember that was a storyline at that time.
33:57Yeah.
33:58You're not wrong.
33:59Uh, did he have any carryover Aaron Glenn with Drew Brees with the saints when he was
34:03the DBs coach with, uh, Sean Payton?
34:05Yes.
34:06Yeah.
34:07You're connected.
34:07Some people actually played.
34:08He actually played with Drew Brees for a year.
34:11I think he was on the saints for a year, right?
34:13He played with them.
34:14And then, yeah, he was, when he was the DBs coach, when he was the DBs coach there, Drew
34:18Brees was the quarterback and coached with him.
34:21You're like, you're like, you're like, I don't think Drew Brees is going to come out
34:24of retirement though.
34:27Listen, if, uh, Philip Rivers can do it, I guess this week can, right?
34:30Not this week.
34:30If not this week for not only this week for the Broncos, I don't think he's ever doing
34:34well, didn't the dolphins say that his medicals didn't check out when Saban was there and
34:38they just let him write.
34:38Yeah.
34:39It was a Saban thing.
34:40Yeah.
34:41Yeah.
34:41Cause he really had a bad shoulder injury at the end of his time in San Diego.
34:45Bottom line though.
34:46I, I, in my opinion, this is just me.
34:48It's early in the process and we'll see how they, they address this in the off season with
34:52free agency and trades.
34:53If not, I wouldn't be upset.
34:55They took Ty Simpson to 16, to be honest with you.
34:57Like, I know there's needs.
34:58It wouldn't upset me.
35:00Like I, well, you liked him.
35:01I am a fan of top quarterback early in the season.
35:04He was.
35:04It's not, it's not a question of you're upset now, right?
35:07Are you going to be upset in a year from now?
35:08If they take him at 16?
35:10No.
35:10Cause I don't, I know, but here's my thing again.
35:14I don't think Simpson should stop you from, if you don't believe in him, like, or I guess
35:19not believe in him, but like, if you're not seeing immediate results, it's not going
35:23to stop me from taking another quarterback next year.
35:25And again, we don't know, but it's supposed to be a loaded quarterback class next year, but
35:30supposed to be, supposed to be, you never know what these things you did.
35:33This is one thought I've had is like thinking about taking a quarterback in the first two
35:38rounds.
35:39And I mean, we're, we're really bringing up some, I'm really picking at some old scabs
35:43here for you guys.
35:44How amazing is it that Christian Hackenberg never played a snap?
35:49We didn't want him.
35:51Nobody wanted him.
35:52Nobody wanted to draft him.
35:54I'm saying Jets fans.
35:57Like we were all shocked when he, when they took Hackenberg.
35:59I'll be honest.
36:00I wasn't that, I wasn't that pissed at the pick.
36:04I kind of like take, I guys, I'm a, I love quarterbacks.
36:06I love shot in the dark.
36:07I just, so I, I'm not going to lie.
36:10I, I wasn't, I didn't hate the pick.
36:13What are you looking at me?
36:14Hey, I'm being honest.
36:15I listen.
36:16I'm just, I'm just being honest about it.
36:17Listen, it's amazing.
36:19It didn't take a snap, but again,
36:21I'm going to get on me last week about the Mel Kuyper comment, but you love Christian Hackenberg.
36:25I don't know, man.
36:26I mean, listen, I have weird opinions about quarterbacks.
36:29You guys know how I am with quarterbacks.
36:30I don't know if, you know, but well, I used to, I gave, I gave bowls a lot of crap about
36:35not playing Hackenberg.
36:37I remember there was his second year.
36:40I want to say a second year and the last game of the year, people were talking in New
36:44England, like, is he going to play?
36:45Like there was, and he didn't play him.
36:47And I gave bowls a lot of crap.
36:49We all did.
36:50And I want to say like the following year, Hackenberg went into that, that league.
36:58It was like the AAF, I think it was, or something.
37:00Oh, yeah.
37:01And he got benched at halftime of his first game.
37:05What went wrong with that guy, Kaz?
37:07Sorry.
37:08We were in the, we were at the combine like a week later.
37:11And all of a sudden I just hear, hey, you still think I should have played Hackenberg?
37:20And Todd is yelling down a hallway in Indianapolis.
37:24Yeah.
37:24He got, he got the crappy out of Penn state, Frankie, after Bill O'Brien left.
37:29They had no line.
37:30I think he was just damaged goods after that.
37:32Did he, was he someone that quote unquote, didn't love football?
37:37No, I think he loved football.
37:39I do.
37:39I just, just wasn't happening.
37:41And then they had like no plan for him.
37:44Like to your point, Ryan, the coaches didn't want him.
37:47And McCagnin like shoved him down the front.
37:49And so like Chan Gailey had no, no use for him that first year.
37:54And yeah, like they just had no, and remember they had four quarterbacks.
37:58Yeah.
37:59They had Fitz and Petty and Gino, and they just had no developmental plan for him at all.
38:04I don't know if it would have worked anyway.
38:05He just, he missed, he was a guy.
38:09He, you talk about like the short throws.
38:10He could not make a short throw.
38:12Like he had screen passes.
38:13Oh, it was rough.
38:14Yeah.
38:15Thanks again, Charlie Cassidy, uh, and giving us Mike McCagnin.
38:18Um, uh, look, I think I do want to ask you just because you brought up Penn State quarterbacks.
38:25Drew Aller, guy who was highly touted two years ago, has a rough, rough year, gets hurt,
38:32has apparently an incredible arm, has the traits.
38:36Someone who can't throw screen passes.
38:38Another guy who can't probably throw screen passes for his life, depending on it.
38:42Kaz, what are your thoughts on Drew Aller?
38:44Cause I, I know you've paid attention to Penn State, uh, and how they've played in recent years.
38:50I really don't.
38:51I went to Penn State, but I really don't watch Penn State football.
38:54Yeah, I don't.
38:55So I know a little bit of my niece actually goes to Penn State and knows him a little bit.
38:59So I've heard things from her, but I, so I haven't seen much of him.
39:02I watched them play.
39:04I played, I watched them play Oregon.
39:06Oregon.
39:06Yeah.
39:06Yeah.
39:07I remember that game and he's never really blown me away.
39:11I, I, he hasn't, he hasn't been that impressive to me.
39:13So I, if it's a day, if it's a day three flyer late, late in the draft, I guess that's where you take him.
39:20Will he, is he in the senior bowl?
39:21I don't have no idea.
39:23I don't think so.
39:24Okay.
39:25I don't think I saw his name, Ryan.
39:26I don't think he's in the NBA.
39:27I think Nuss, Nussmeyer is going to be there.
39:28Nussmeyer I like a lot.
39:30He's an interesting prospect.
39:31Another kid who's a son of a coach.
39:33So, you know, born in a football family.
39:35Him and Ty Simpson have a lot of similarities.
39:37That's what I'm saying, man.
39:38Like I wouldn't, Ty's got a better arm though.
39:40Yes, absolutely.
39:41Yeah.
39:41All right.
39:42Now let's flip it over to the deep.
39:43Since cause it, you brought up, they really need to rebuild this defense.
39:47The big aspect is going to be, who's going to be the defensive coordinator for the jets.
39:51The jets decided to do a Friday news dump and say, here are all these defensive coordinators.
39:56We did first round interviews with, uh, the headliners obviously are wink Martindale and
40:00Jim Leonard.
40:01We know who jets fans are all rooting for, including myself, Jim Leonard.
40:04We pray that he gets the job because I just think it would do one, a good thing for the
40:09PR of this team.
40:10Considering the jets fans are so down on this team right now and where this future is for
40:16this franchise.
40:17I know Jim Leonard is highly unlikely to get this job just because he's a highly touted candidate
40:21for other defensive coordinator jobs and why would you take the jets job, but what
40:25are your thoughts cause on the, who they're interviewing right now?
40:27And could there be early favorites to get this, this, uh, defensive coordinator job?
40:33Yeah.
40:33I mean, the names that stuck out, you obviously the wink and Leonard jumped out.
40:38Uh, Dallas just hired a defensive coordinator this afternoon.
40:41So he was up for that job.
40:42So they hired somebody else.
40:43They had the guy from the Eagles.
40:45Um, green Bay is the one to me to watch with Jim Leonard, right?
40:48He's a Wisconsin guy.
40:50I think they almost hired him once before I read that they were, they were talking to
40:54him and he, but he was, he was kind of content to stay in college at that point in Wisconsin.
40:58So he didn't go.
40:59So that, that to me would be one to watch there.
41:02And remember too, like there's going to be all these defensive coordinator jobs with all
41:06these head coaches being hired, you know?
41:08So now there's six head coach openings still open.
41:12I imagine some of those are going to be filled over the weekend.
41:14So, and then, so then there's gonna be a ton of jobs open and Leonard will be able to
41:20do more interviews and things.
41:21If Denver loses on Sunday, if they continue on, he's then, then he's not able to do anything
41:26after the Superbowl, which could help the Jets if they want to wait.
41:28Cause, cause other teams might move quickly.
41:31Wink's the most experienced guy on the list.
41:34Um, you know, I have major questions of whether Wink and Aaron Glenn can work well together.
41:40Uh, I know Wink a little bit, but I obviously know what happened with the Giants.
41:44So that would be the question to me.
41:46If you remember, Aaron Glenn was talking about, uh, like synergy and compatibility and things
41:52at the end of the season, any press conference, like doesn't feel like that would be the greatest
41:56marriage to me in the world.
41:58The guy to me, if I had to handicap this, I would pick Jim O'Neill as my favorite.
42:04Um, Jim O'Neill was an assistant with the Jets under Rex.
42:07He was the assistant DDs coach.
42:09He really was a Mike Patton guy more than a Rex guy.
42:11He was kind of Patton's right-hand man and followed Patton to Buffalo and then followed
42:17him to Cleveland.
42:17He was the Cleveland defensive coordinator when Mike Patton was the head coach there.
42:22And his assistant defensive backs coach was Aaron Glenn.
42:24So they worked together there.
42:26He went on to San Francisco, was the defensive coordinator under Chip Kelly that year that
42:31Chip Kelly was there.
42:32Didn't go very well.
42:33Um, he's bounced around and he was most recently with the Lions as the safeties coach.
42:39And he spent a year, I think, under Aaron Glenn there.
42:41And then he was, he's still there now.
42:44So I don't know, just looking at like connective tissue, I can see, you know, the relationship
42:49working.
42:51He knows Aaron Glenn's defense from the time in Detroit.
42:54They, they probably know each other pretty well from the time in Cleveland.
42:58He knows the Jets organization, uh, a little bit.
43:01So I'm sure some people there that remember him from his time here.
43:03So I don't know that name jumped out to me of the other guys on the list.
43:09Kaz, do you think Aaron Glenn is going to get more hands on with his defense in 2026?
43:15Or I think he should.
43:17I mean, I don't see why you wouldn't.
43:18If you're him, like your job's on the line.
43:21Like, do you want to sit back and let somebody else run the defense?
43:26And I think he has to be more hands on.
43:28I get what he wanted to do and be the CEO and kind of take the view from 50,000 feet.
43:35But I think, I think he's probably realized that he needs to be more hands on.
43:39One name that did stand out to me, Kaz, on the list that they announced, uh, was, uh,
43:44Efrain Banda.
43:45Uh, you know, coached under Flores, who I, I have high respect for as a defensive coordinator.
43:50And I wonder if that's a name that potentially the Jets could really give a good look at there
43:54for the defensive coordinator job.
43:56Banda's under Schwartz, right?
43:57He's in Cleveland.
43:58Sorry, he's under Schwartz.
43:59That's right.
43:59Sorry.
43:59You're talking about Durante Jones.
44:01Sorry, you're right.
44:02Durante Jones.
44:03Sorry.
44:03Durante Jones.
44:04I'm looking under Flores.
44:05Yeah, but both of those guys jumped out.
44:07Yeah, I think both those guys could be interesting guys to bring over just because I know it's
44:12like, you can't really give them full credit for where they're coming from defensively.
44:15Yeah, but they're part of that system and I just want a successful system brought over
44:20here and considering it seems like the Jets are going to infuse this defense with a lot
44:25of talent, hopefully with high picks and three agent signings and reshaping this defense the
44:30way they want.
44:31You'd want a guy like that who's coming in, getting his first shot as a defensive coordinator,
44:35hopefully, and it can build something here.
44:38Am I wrong though, Kaz, in just saying this?
44:41I really don't want to see Chris Harris get the job like they Jets should move as far
44:46away as possible.
44:47I know it's not nice, but again, if I'm playing the PR game and I know that coaches don't
44:53give a flying crap about PR game, but if I'm playing the PR game, I'd want to stay as far
44:58away as possible from anyone on that staff on the defensive side.
45:02Yeah, that was responsible for zero interceptions and one of the worst defenses ever in NFL history.
45:08I don't think you have to worry about it.
45:09I think if they wanted to name Chris Harris as the defense coordinator, they could have
45:12done that at any point.
45:14You know what I mean?
45:15They could have just promoted him to the job.
45:19So, and yeah, I agree with you.
45:21You can't, after this year, after no interceptions, after 503 points and the way it looked the
45:28last few weeks of the season when he was the coordinator, and that's obviously not all
45:33his fault.
45:34The players were, we've talked about, the roster was not in good shape at that point.
45:38But yeah, you can't go, oh, I really liked what I saw there at the end of the season.
45:41Let's, let's promote them to defensive coordinator.
45:43So I don't think that's going to happen, guys.
45:45I'll say this about Efron Banda that I do like for the Jets.
45:49Safeties guy.
45:50So safeties coach knows that.
45:52Kale down to two.
45:54Oh, no, no, no.
45:55I'm not going that far.
45:5616 though.
45:57Yes.
45:57He's not making 16.
45:59He's not making it to 16.
46:00You never know, man.
46:01Life is crazy.
46:02I mean, the draft is crazy, but he's probably not, but it's, listen, there's a lot of good
46:07offensive linemen too, in this draft.
46:09So you never know.
46:10It's going to be a lot of edge, offensive linemen.
46:12Ryan, I, I would think about Downs at two.
46:15I just love him.
46:16I knew you were going to go there and I didn't want to go there, but I kind of want to get
46:19your thoughts on it.
46:20I love him when I watch him.
46:21Dude.
46:21He's incredible.
46:22He's a playmaker.
46:23He's great.
46:24I know.
46:25And we get all hung up on this position stuff and I get it, but I don't know.
46:30Jets don't have a safety player to me.
46:32Yeah.
46:32They don't have any safety.
46:33What if we, what if we move up?
46:35What if we package 16 and 33, we move up three or four picks.
46:39I would rather take a receiver.
46:41I take the BPA or whatever, a receiver between, I have Tyson Tate, like one, a one B and then
46:47lemon.
46:47But I think the jets should be in the market to do something like that, but maybe they
46:51can move up a few spots.
46:52I wouldn't do it.
46:53Maybe.
46:53I just love him.
46:54I watch him.
46:54He's just certainly such an impact.
46:56He is.
46:57In Alabama and Ohio state.
46:59Yeah.
46:59You can put them in the box.
47:00You can put them back at free safety.
47:01He can, he can do it all.
47:03He's a fun player to watch.
47:04And yeah, I just, there's such a bad stigma to drafting a safety at number two overall
47:10just because.
47:11Well, the last one is Jamal, right?
47:12Six.
47:13The last top 10 safeties, Jamal Adams.
47:15Yeah.
47:15You know, Malachi Moore put together a pretty good season when it was all said and done.
47:19I think we overlooked him a little bit.
47:21So I think we have something there.
47:23I don't know what his upside went, but he had over a hundred tackles this year.
47:26He played well.
47:28He didn't miss a lot of tackles.
47:29Something to work with there.
47:30Is this defensive coordinator job desirable at all?
47:34Or is this kind of like, you know what?
47:38You kind of have to take what you got.
47:40And it's.
47:41Yeah, it's desire.
47:42It's desirable because it's one of 32.
47:44It's one of those jobs, you know, where you don't get many shots at being a coordinator
47:48in the NFL.
47:49So you're going to take it.
47:50But if you've got options, you're not coming here.
47:52Um, and you know, I saw, was it Connor reported that two high profile guys, like, yeah, if
48:00you're, if you're high profile, why would you like, you know, just logically think about
48:05it.
48:06Like you've got 10, there's 10 coaches who are just getting hired who have a blank slate
48:12that you think they're at least going to have three years of job security.
48:16That's what, you know, that's kind of what you think going in.
48:18Maybe like, you know, John Harbaugh probably has more, um, job security.
48:23And so if you're going to be his DC and then the other job Packers job, like, yeah, that
48:29was pretty good.
48:30Matt LaFleur has got a nice contract extension.
48:32They got Micah Parsons.
48:33They're always a good team.
48:35Um, you know, the Cowboys are in better shape than the Jets right now.
48:40And then, so yeah, I did Aaron Glenn, we talked about, he's going into the season.
48:45He needs to win games.
48:46And when you look at the personnel they have, I mean, who's the best defensive football
48:51player right now?
48:53It's gotta be Jamie and Sherwood.
48:56Yeah.
48:56I would agree with that.
48:57Or, or will McDonald or will McDonald?
49:00Yeah.
49:00Yeah.
49:01If you're talking about talent, sure.
49:03McDonald, but that's not that exciting.
49:05Like if you're sitting there going, okay, all right, think of all the things I can do
49:09with Sherwood.
49:09Like that's, that's probably not, it's probably not the case.
49:12So yeah, it's not a, it's not a great job.
49:14I don't know how you can spin this and do a great job, but the security is one part.
49:19Yeah.
49:20The security is one part.
49:21I mean, and, but I think, you know, um, it, these jobs are hard to get, so they'll be
49:26able to get someone and maybe they'll get lucky.
49:29Because if, oh, but quickly, if you come in here guys and you, you make a name for yourself
49:35and we get an interception, man, we're going to put up a statue for you as a DC, this will
49:41propel your career.
49:42If you come here, I mean, you just need to get one interception, one interception and
49:47you did better than last year and you need five turnovers.
49:50That's it.
49:51You could get that in two games.
49:52You know, so I mean, like I covered, uh, I covered Patriots Texans on Sunday and it
49:58was like three quarters.
49:59I saw the Patriots get like two interceptions.
50:01I'm like, they've spent a five minutes.
50:02I was like, Oh my God.
50:04And then more turnovers than the Jets had all season.
50:09Sorry to cut you off.
50:10I was going to say what you could sell to the defense coordinators.
50:13You get to have a heavy influence in the pick at number two.
50:15So that's another thing that's pretty interesting.
50:18Yeah.
50:19I mean, if they, if a defensive coordinator does love a Ruben Bain, David Bailey, Arvel
50:23Reese, Caleb Downs, maybe they say, you know what?
50:27I want that guy.
50:29I'm going to, you know, showcase to everyone what this defense is.
50:33Buy in a little bit to what we're doing.
50:35Let me, let me, let me get a little closer here.
50:36Jaime, Woody, Darren, Aaron, hire Jim Leonard.
50:43Give us Jets fans, something positive to look at.
50:46We have nothing right now.
50:48It's bleak.
50:49Dante Moore went back to college.
50:51We don't have a quarterback option at two.
50:53We're debating edge rushers that aren't sure things.
50:57We're debating if the Jets should take a project at number 16 at quarterback.
51:02If you truly want to give us something positive to talk about, bring back a guy like Jim Leonard,
51:07who we liked when he played here.
51:09He has connections to, to Darren Mugi has connections to Aaron Glenn.
51:14It'd give you a positive in what has been a very negative 12 months.
51:21That's my pitch.
51:22Great.
51:22$5 million.
51:23Make me the highest paid DC in football.
51:25Give it to him.
51:26Deal.
51:27Well, I got this one for you guys.
51:31Why so much hatred for Charles London?
51:35Oh, you want to know why?
51:36It's a punching bag.
51:37Well, yeah.
51:38Punching bag, one.
51:39Two, quarterback development was not there at all this year or production.
51:43But who did you want him to develop?
51:45I would, I also would ask who has he developed in his career?
51:49Okay, but like, who did, like, if we're going off last year, like, Justin Fields is Justin Fields.
51:58Like, he, he, he played exactly who he thought he was going to be.
52:01Um, Geno Smith is the only guy he, like, maybe developed.
52:06I don't think we thought Brady Cook was going to be, I, I, it's just weird to me.
52:10It's just so much, like, passion about wanting this guy to be fired.
52:13Like, we don't really know what he does.
52:16We don't even know if he's a good coach, you know?
52:19We don't, but he's also made his career as a running back coach.
52:22I, I just.
52:23I get it.
52:24I get it.
52:25But people move around.
52:26People do different stuff.
52:27The offensive line coach did a good job, and he was a tight ends coach.
52:29Like, he moved.
52:31Let's go a spade a spade on this, guys.
52:34People want Jim Leonard.
52:37Let's get, let's get real about this.
52:39Does anyone have any idea what kind of defense Jim Leonard's going to run here and what kind of scheme?
52:43No one has a damn clue.
52:44You know who he is.
52:45Yeah, he's a, he's a former Jack.
52:47They liked him as a player.
52:48Yeah, I mean, like, so, I get it.
52:50I get it.
52:51But, like, we look at him.
52:52You look at his history.
52:54You see where he's from.
52:55And you're kind of making us, nobody really knows.
52:57Let's not kid ourselves.
52:59You could do it better, I think, with OCs.
53:00If they have been play callers, you can go in and look.
53:03But this guy, you don't know.
53:04No, yeah, the evaluation of assistant coaches is an interesting world.
53:07Yeah, it's like, people get so passionate about it, too.
53:11Yeah.
53:12I don't know.
53:12Sorry, I kind of rained on your little parade there.
53:15You just ruined his speech.
53:16You just ruined his dear Woody speech.
53:20He's not listening.
53:21It's okay.
53:23That's a show.
53:24Some of them listen to the Gangs All Here podcast.
53:27I know they do.
53:28I've not heard from Woody, but other people high up the food chain do listen.
53:36Oh, boy.
53:37I've questioned their sanity sometimes.
53:40You know, but they do listen.
53:42Jaime, if you're listening, please take it.
53:47Please go get Jim Leonard.
53:48All right.
53:49That's the Gangs All Here podcast, guys.
53:50We'll catch you all next week.
53:51Kaz, hopefully you have safe travels down there to the Senior Bowl.
53:55I know that it's been getting a little nutty here in the Northeast and the East Coast for where that's happening.
53:59But we appreciate you always for hopping on here.
54:01This is just the beginning of draft season.
54:03There's going to be a lot of talk in the future.
54:06Hopefully we'll get to talk to you soon about who the Jets do hire as a defensive coordinator.
54:09And then we'll see how it goes with the Senior Bowl.
54:11As always, man, hit that like, hit that subscribe button, the New York Post Sports YouTube channel for Frankie, for Ryan, for Kaz.
54:17We'll catch you next time, Jets fans.
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