00:00For 60 minutes of football, as far as my clock and NBC's clock was concerned,
00:07the incredible victory that Western Michigan pulled off over Michigan
00:13only to have one second be put back on the clock,
00:17and then another set of prayers were answered as the Hail Mary went down in history.
00:23And the NCAA today saying that'll never happen again.
00:26To talk about that and so much more, joining us on our Wiseheart, right?
00:31We Make It Right, Call Cow, Right Hotline, Dr. John Steinbrecher,
00:34Mid-American Conference Commissioner.
00:35We check in with him sometimes, often, now we'll say early in the football season.
00:41Dr. John, welcome to the show.
00:44Good morning. Good to be with you.
00:46Well, great to be with you, and so let's get down to it.
00:49I think the Mid-American Conference not only acquitted itself so well with the football,
00:54but also the class that had been demonstrated from top on down.
00:59And I see America.
01:02America is on your side, Dr. John.
01:05So if you could comment about, obviously, a change in direction from the night of that victory,
01:13what I will call a victory over Michigan,
01:15to the statement that was put out yesterday by you and your office.
01:21Well, in the immediate aftermath of the game, you're seeking information.
01:29And, hey, were proper procedures followed?
01:31What occurred?
01:32Boom.
01:33And every indication I saw was that, yeah, things were handled per protocol that's been laid out for this.
01:43Okay, so you get through all that.
01:45And then the next day you have a chance to step back and take time and ask more questions.
01:52Okay, why did this even occur?
01:55How did it occur?
01:56What's happening here?
01:57And this is where it starts to get complicated.
02:01And to a large extent, this was all an issue around technology.
02:08And we have some technology evolving probably quicker than we've had policy for.
02:15And it starts with the fact that the Big Ten has put in place a replay system that's unique.
02:20I think it's the only one of its kind being used right now.
02:23The other nine are using it different.
02:25And it's a very good system.
02:27I mean, it gives them some capabilities that are exceptional in terms of angles and so on.
02:32One of the things it has is it has a clock feed.
02:37Now, understand this.
02:39And this is where it gets even more convoluted.
02:41The clock feed comes from the stadium.
02:44There's a single camera in the stadium that gives the clock feed to the production truck.
02:49And so now you have the feed that goes one wire feeds into the game production truck, the TV truck.
02:57The other feed feeds into the Big Ten's command center where the replay stuff is, right?
03:03So you've got two feeds.
03:05As it turns out, feeds can get unsynchronized.
03:09And we've had a protocol for I don't know how long that speaks to the fact when you're dealing with
03:16end-of-half timing issues in a replay situation,
03:20the feed that is to be used is the game feed from the production truck.
03:25In this case, the decision got made based on the game feed that was showing on their replay system.
03:36And the two feeds weren't synced.
03:38They were off a little bit.
03:40And that's, boom, that's where you go.
03:42So if this isn't an issue of integrity or anything else, it was not utilizing the protocol that we had
03:53in place.
03:53Well, yeah, you're not saying anything nasty about them.
03:58You're saying they just didn't follow what they were supposed to do, which I think is a fair thing to
04:03accuse them of.
04:04So, you know, the only time I've ever seen anything actually turn into a forfeit has been illegal players, ineligible
04:14players.
04:14You see it a lot in high school football in this state.
04:17Well, not a lot, but usually once or twice a year you see it.
04:22What do you think will be the results of all this within the NCAA?
04:28I am unaware of any prior situation in which a game result has been overturned as a result of a
04:35protest on an officiating issue.
04:40By the same token, you don't put the putt in the hole unless you get the ball to the hole,
04:45right?
04:46You've got to ask the question.
04:48And so that's, in part, why we did what we did.
04:51And second, I want to keep in the mind of the CFP Selection Committee what Western Michigan accomplished on Saturday
05:02night.
05:03And that if Western Michigan has an exceptional season and we get to the end of the year and they're
05:12in line for consideration for the college football playoff or high rankings or steedings or whatever,
05:19I want them to be looking positively at their performance about their game with Michigan.
05:25How close a contact have you been in with the officials of Western Michigan University about all this?
05:32We've had any number of conversations and exchanges.
05:35And I think if people have seen, they've managed this in a way that's exemplary.
05:42I think they have raised the level of discourse for how people, when they're dealing with adversity, whether it's in
05:52athletics or others, should deal with it.
05:55You have a couple choices.
05:56You can jump up on the table and start banging your fists and screaming and shouting.
06:00Or you can step back, look at the information, and then react.
06:06And this, you know, we talk ad nauseum.
06:11You hear coaches talk about it.
06:12You hear others talk about, you know, athletics builds character.
06:17It teaches you how to deal with adversity, et cetera.
06:19Well, deal with adversity.
06:21How do you deal with it?
06:22They've, that's a real-life demonstration of how to deal with it.
06:27And I really applaud the president, director of athletics, coach.
06:34You want to talk about life lessons.
06:37They're living it right now.
06:39Dr. John Steinbrecher, Mid-American Conference Commissioner on the hotline right now.
06:45When it comes to recourses for you, we saw the NCAA come out and say they couldn't give you guys
06:51a victory, overturn the outcome.
06:54Speaking of protocols, they say that protocol is not in place.
06:57If this were the SEC, we know damn well lawyers would get involved and judges would get involved.
07:05Was there any thought at all to at least consider that at this point to try to find a judge
07:12or at least find someone to make an argument that the NCAA did not follow protocol here?
07:18If they won't reverse this, can we get, or at least pursue litigation?
07:25We're not aware of any legal course of action that you could pursue here.
07:29And I'm not sure that's the right thing.
07:31I think, I think we've, I think we've done the things we can do to draw attention, do a wonderful
07:39performance by Western Michigan,
07:41to draw attention to what, what I would say was a miss on an application or, or delivery of the
07:51protocol.
07:53And we're all going to get better across all of FBS because of this.
08:00Dr. John Steinbrecher joining us here, Matt Commissioner.
08:04Yeah, you know, I also find you in an inenviable position where you really have to, like, you have to
08:10fight for all your teams.
08:11I mean, there's a lot of movement going on, a lot of, a lot of conferences trying to poach.
08:17And so you do have to stand up there, and you've handled this well, but you do have to stand
08:23up there and kind of fight for your programs, do you not?
08:27Well, you do, but you go where the facts take you, is what I would say.
08:34Yeah, I'm going to be a strong, strong, strong, incredible advocate for all of our member institutions,
08:39but I also need to be an arbiter of the game itself, right?
08:44And, and so as we got information, we were able to then attack the issue and point out, A, where
08:54there were flaws,
08:55and continue to emphasize a tremendous performance by Western Michigan.
09:01And it must have been a meaningful game because they stormed the field.
09:08The biggest game for many of those kids, apparently.
09:11I know.
09:13And that's the glory of sports, right?
09:15There's, there's, you talk about two sides of a coin in any of these games.
09:20There's great joy and great sorrow.
09:24Well, there's also economics involved.
09:27You can fact check me here.
09:28Is it $4 million the conference would get being a non-Power 4 if a team were to advance and
09:35get in the playoffs?
09:36I think that sounds correct.
09:38Yeah, that would be distributed.
09:39So there's also, there's also finances here.
09:42I mean, forget about the people that bet on the game.
09:44I know you guys don't like to talk about that.
09:46But, you know, this, you know, what's interesting, I have not even thought about that, that, and maybe shame on
09:55me, that, that thought never even came to my mind,
09:59other than the fact that I don't want this game to impinge in any way on Western's ability to make
10:05the CFP.
10:06But, yeah, there are economics involved in everything we do.
10:09Yeah, so that's what I want to know, what kind of conversation they had yesterday.
10:14Like, when they denied the appeal so quickly, it almost seems like they didn't even think about it.
10:18They didn't even give it much time from the moment you wrote the statement to the time the NCAA came
10:22through.
10:23And then the NCAA came through a little bit later and said, this can't happen again.
10:28The way that Michigan won the game will never happen again under their protocols established.
10:33To me, it validates your argument completely.
10:36I don't think Michigan has a leg to stand on at that point.
10:39Well, but I'll get back to the fact what apparently has been said is they just don't have authority to
10:49step in.
10:50So, here we are.
10:52And also, Kamish, John Steinbrecher joining us right now.
10:56The fact that, in a way, I don't know if you perceive it this way.
10:59I know you have great relationships with the Big Ten and these other power conferences.
11:04Do you consider yourself partners with the way the payouts work, the way that they help fund the athletic departments
11:11in your conference, that these games can certainly help from an economic standpoint that you want to be?
11:16You want to have good relationships with these people.
11:19You don't want to have to go to court.
11:20You don't want to have to try to get the NCAA to intervene.
11:24You know what?
11:26Yeah, well, exactly.
11:27But we didn't take action or not take action out of any fear of retribution.
11:35Can I be any clearer than that?
11:37We took the actions we felt were appropriate based on the information we have.
11:44Period.
11:47Dr. John Steinbrecher joining us on the show.
11:49So, while we have you, all right, what do you think about the contest to let the guy call the
11:55plays who wins the offensive coordinator for a drive thing that Akron has right now?
11:59What did you think of that?
12:02I thought it was brilliant.
12:03I just recently had a social media report done, and you cannot believe the amount of attention that generated.
12:15I thought it was brilliant.
12:17What a clever, clever idea to draw attention to your program.
12:23You know, I probably can't prove it, but I know their ticket sales have increased significantly.
12:31You know, I hearken back to kind of a Bill Veck kind of thing, right?
12:38And good for them.
12:41Well, I didn't like it until I talked to Joe Moorhead about it on this show because he kind of
12:46– I was like, what was your initial thoughts?
12:48He said he hated it, and then he said if he wasn't the one calling plays, he never would have
12:51agreed to it.
12:52But, you know, do you guys – does this open up a conversation with you and your athletic directors and
12:58even university presidents about, you know, what is okay, what might be a little bit too far when it comes
13:05to something like this?
13:07Yeah.
13:08No, I think – and I think where you're going with it is where do you draw the line, right?
13:13Yeah.
13:13When does it – I have great confidence in the administration as well as the football staff down there that
13:22they would manage that appropriately, and I think they did.
13:27So, yeah, you know what, it gave a fan a chance to spend a little time consulting with Coach.
13:36I imagine Coach could probably direct the play calls pretty much where he wanted them to.
13:41Don't know that for a fact.
13:42That wasn't in the conversation.
13:43But what a neat opportunity to let someone or give people – a lot of people a chance to think
13:50they might have an opportunity to kind of touch a program.
13:54We need to do more of that.
13:56I think the more our programs can personalize themselves, I think the better – I think that will help them
14:06grow attendance and build their fan base and help make our programs distinctive in ways that perhaps others won't or
14:15can't.
14:16We don't – we can't be standoffish.
14:18We need to invite you into the house and make you part of the team.
14:23Doctor, we thank you very much for the time.
14:25All the best to you and yours.
14:26You've been very gracious with your time, and we hope that the season goes well for you guys.
14:31Hey, thank you so much.
14:33Wish you guys the very best.
14:35Dr. John Steinbricker.
