- 1 day ago
Willard and Dibs react to the report that the Seattle Seahawks are planning to sign cornerback Terrion Arnold, who has a laundry list of felonies attached to his name from earlier this offseason, which led to his release from the Nuggets. How does this make you feel?
Category
🥇
SportsTranscript
00:00If you were a general manager of a football team, you could, you're allowed to, not sign people who are
00:13accused of criminal kidnapping and armed robbery.
00:18Accused?
00:19Accused.
00:21Accused.
00:22However, there are some facts already in place in this case.
00:28Yes, trial needs to happen, blah, blah, blah.
00:33That's not even really what I'm getting at.
00:34This is not a due process conversation.
00:37This is a Seahawks process conversation.
00:41Because if you wanted Terry on Arnold, and we'll explain for those of you who don't know who that is,
00:48who that is.
00:49If you wanted him on your football team, and you want to do the due process thing, then great.
00:55Wait.
00:57Wait.
00:58And due process will run its course.
01:01And then if it turns out that this has just been a terrible misunderstanding surrounding Terry on Arnold, well, then
01:09you can sign him then.
01:10But that's not what the Seahawks did.
01:12And here's the point that I'm making.
01:14This is not because the Seahawks are a rival.
01:16That's what sort of makes it relevant to us, because they're a rival.
01:22But I would say this about any team that does this, and I would very much appreciate it if my
01:27favorite teams would not do this.
01:30The Detroit Lions are also a multi-billion dollar organization, are they not?
01:36And Terry on Arnold, who is a defensive back in the NFL, and a young one, and a not-too
01:43-long-ago high draft pick, was a member of the Detroit Lions, and was arrested and charged with four counts
01:51of kidnapping and four counts of armed robbery.
01:54As the alleged story goes, Terry on was robbed of $100,000 in cash and luxury items from a rental
02:05home.
02:05So, allegedly, Terry on coordinated some friends to go rough up the people who did this.
02:17Okay, not legal, but some people will go, hey, turnabout is fair play.
02:22Here's the problem.
02:23They got the wrong people.
02:24Wrong people.
02:25They got the wrong young people.
02:27So, he's looking for retribution, and he goes out and grabs and roughs up, and I know kidnapping is a
02:35part of it, and turned out you didn't get the alleged perpetrators in your own robbery.
02:40Correct.
02:40You got, and these were just, these were, I don't want to call them kids like they were five years
02:45old, but these were like teenagers.
02:47And roughed them up.
02:49Problem is, got the wrong people.
02:52Turns out, he allegedly watched it all on a live stream.
02:57Just watched it unfold.
03:00And here's something that's not alleged.
03:02One of the kids now has brain damage.
03:04So, he didn't even go out there and grab and rough up the people.
03:08No, he allegedly coordinated it.
03:11And then watched it on some sort of a live stream.
03:13And one of the individuals that they grabbed and roughed up, you're saying now has brain damage.
03:19Correct.
03:20Yeah, that's not great.
03:21And the Seahawks thought, yeah, but can he cover puka?
03:27Somebody has to cover puka.
03:29Listen, I get it.
03:32I'm no, I'm not naive on this.
03:35I understand that professional sports franchises, these rosters, communities, the whole thing, these are very large groups of people, and
03:43some of them aren't great.
03:44I am not on some sort of a high horse here.
03:47I am not under the impression that everybody who puts on a Bay Area jersey is just a perfect human
03:54being.
03:54That's not the case.
03:56Okay?
03:56I realize that.
03:57This, to me, is a little bit more about process.
04:00And Grandy actually was the one who brought this up before the show today, and I'm really glad he did,
04:05because I wonder how everyone feels about this.
04:09In a general sense, we can make it general, and then we can make it specific.
04:14But in a general sense, how much does it matter to you who the people are that are on your
04:21team?
04:22And forget abilities.
04:24Forget X's and O's.
04:25Forget exit velo.
04:27You know, forget your 40 time.
04:30Forget all of that.
04:32I'm just talking about the conduct of the human and how much that matters to you.
04:39I know a lot of sports fans who are like, it doesn't matter to me at all.
04:43Now, I think, to a point, if this person is an abuser, if this person's a murderer, you know, if
04:49this person is Aaron Hernandez, now we're having a very different conversation, obviously.
04:56On another level, though, it can be conduct of any particular type or just sort of, I don't know, the
05:04way you go about your business.
05:05I mean, the general question is, how much does that matter to you as a fan?
05:09It's a slippery slope, and it's also a sliding scale.
05:13And so you think about, and I believe it was Greg Hardy way back where he was, you know, alleged
05:19to have done a lot of things, including throwing a woman onto a pile of guns on a bed and
05:25other domestic violence types of things.
05:27And so that became something that was really dramatic.
05:31And yet he got signed, and it's because he can go out there and rush the quarterback.
05:35I remember the Niners had a guy named Bruce Miller.
05:37I don't know if you remember that story where he, a week before the season started, allegedly,
05:43and I only say allegedly because I don't know if I've seen the entire video, but he was down near
05:49Fisherman's Wharf, Pier 39,
05:50and he went into the wrong hotel room and beat up somebody in their 70s, and the 49ers promptly released
05:57him, and his career was over.
05:59So I think when you talk about, as you were mentioning, like felons and other things, like Ray Carruth is
06:06a name that springs to mind.
06:07Well, he killed somebody, yes.
06:09Correct, but even if he was eligible to, you know, go out and play football, like that is such a
06:15heinous thing that he, I don't believe, would be signed.
06:18And then as you move on down the road, you might have a player on your team that doesn't align
06:23politically or socially with the area
06:26and what they might think and what they might believe.
06:28But when it comes to these types of things, like the Terry and Arnold story, about which I'm still learning,
06:34yeah, if you tolerate it, then you're basically telling your fans his ability to cover a wide receiver is more
06:42important than what he actually might represent as a person.
06:45Do you remember the name Lawrence Phillips?
06:47Of course.
06:48Yeah.
06:48Oh, yeah.
06:48Lawrence Phillips.
06:49Former Niner.
06:50Former Niner.
06:51Ended up only playing in the NFL.
06:53Sixth overall pick.
06:55Played in the NFL for a collective, yeah, three, I think three seasons.
06:59Drafted by the Rams in 96, got a chance with the Dolphins in 97, had to go overseas, came back
07:07to America, got a shot with the 49ers in 99, and then that was it.
07:12It was back to the CFL and pretty much flamed out assault of a woman, I think, more than once.
07:21And Lawrence Phillips' career was over.
07:23Lawrence is no longer with us.
07:24Lawrence lived to age 40 and is no longer with us.
07:29I just bring that up because spitballing, mind going to win your team, gives a chance to that person who
07:38has a dotted past.
07:40And I'm not against that in theory.
07:43I think people can change.
07:44People can better themselves.
07:46What upsets me about this is that we're still right in the midst of this.
07:50This whole thing just popped a few months ago.
07:53And the Lions were like, get him out of here.
07:55And the Seahawks were like, great.
07:58The Seahawks have publicly admitted that if this workout and timing had happened back when they were filming Hard Knocks,
08:07they would not have been able to sign him.
08:09Right.
08:09Because of the PR disaster that would have come with it.
08:13So what is one of the great old adages with the way we behave, right?
08:17You're supposed to be trusted whether someone's watching or not.
08:21You want to cheat on your spouse?
08:23It's not okay only if she walks in on you like it's not okay even if you don't get caught.
08:30So if you're telling me you couldn't do it on Hard Knocks, why is it okay that you're doing it
08:35off of Hard Knocks?
08:36Why is not more being made of this?
08:39Because these are, and they are only allegations, but they are disgusting allegations that have changed lives.
08:48And the Seattle Seahawks, in the name of keeping their defense at a high level, got to replace Reek Wollin.
08:54They're going to go ahead and put all of those morals in their hip pocket and just move on?
09:00And then, like, it's even been said that the Seahawks have said if this court case goes the wrong way,
09:06then we'll release him.
09:08Yo, dog's wrong order.
09:11If the court case goes well, then sign him.
09:14Don't sign him and then be like, well, we'll let him go if this goes wrong.
09:18But if they don't sign him, then somebody else might have beat them to it.
09:21Well, then screw them too.
09:22Yeah, and he, I'm reading this that he might land on the commissioner's exempt list once the...
09:28Gee, you think?
09:28Well, yeah, so you're going to sign him and you may not even have a chance to play him because
09:33he might be on a list that prevents him from actually playing.
09:36So the PR hit is not going to be worth the fact that the player is going to come out
09:41and help you.
09:41The player might not even play at all.
09:44And so the one thing that...
09:46I don't get it.
09:47Well, I don't get it either.
09:48But if you look at every single team and you could look at different things and different incidents and you
09:54can draw your line on what you would tolerate and what you wouldn't tolerate.
09:58And I think we can all, like, put the Ray Carruth and Lawrence Phillips, like, some of the most heinous
10:03things.
10:03You can put that in the, okay, that's an obvious, like, no-brainer.
10:07But then there are other things that players have done and teams have said, you know, we can tolerate that
10:12level of lawlessness or, you know, things that have been done wrong.
10:16And this is one that is now dramatically front and center.
10:20Yeah, Grady, what's going on?
10:22Boy, and with the commissioner's exempt list hanging over the head of Terry and Arnold, the Seahawks are preparing for
10:28that.
10:28They've also signed Trayvon Diggs, formerly of the Cowboys.
10:31There you go.
10:31So they're preparing for likely, even though they're signing Terry and Arnold or are planning to, they're planning on not
10:37having him for at least a stretch of time.
10:39This is shameless.
10:41This is absolutely shameless.
10:44Like, I just, to me, this is not the way you go about your business.
10:50And I, again, I get it.
10:52I get it.
10:52Am I being naive?
10:53Am I being a little milk and cookie here?
10:55Like, this is the adult world, and I know that there are a lot of non-choir boys running around
11:04in the NFL.
11:05But I thought we had arrived at a time where there was at least a little bit more of an
11:12awareness of this kind of thing that you couldn't just thumb your nose at it.
11:17Second chances?
11:18Absolutely.
11:19Third chances?
11:21Sometimes?
11:22Absolutely.
11:23But to go do this right in the middle of it all?
11:27Like, I just, I would not want the 49ers to do this, and I'm glad they didn't.
11:33I don't think that I would want that either, but, you know, there are incidents across football where teams decide
11:39that the talent is worth the PR hit.
11:42And I'm thinking about Tyreek Hill as an example where, you know, going back to 2014, 2015, he was arrested
11:49in college for punching and choking his then-girlfriend.
11:53And this is before he even made it to the NFL.
11:56But, you know, the cheetah, you've got to have the cheetah.
11:59And so he's a chief, and then he's a dolphin, and he gets paid tens of millions, if not hundreds
12:03of millions of dollars,
12:04because he can run a 4-2-5-40, and he's a great wide receiver.
12:09There's no doubt.
12:10And, I mean, Joe Mixon once upon a time had this exact same thing, and I've told this story before.
12:16It'll bother me till the day I die.
12:20I was literally, I mean, we're talking about in a girls-youth soccer game.
12:26Okay?
12:26It was the day after day one or day two of the NFL draft.
12:30I can't remember back then if they were doing two days or three days or whatever.
12:34But whenever Joe Mixon was drafted, and the word was the majority of NFL teams had him on the no
12:40-draft list.
12:41Like, we're just absolutely, I don't care if it's, they could change the draft to be 100 rounds, and we're
12:47not taking him in the 99th.
12:50But the Bengals did.
12:52And I can't remember if it was round one or round two or whatever.
12:56The Bengals did.
12:58And this guy I know, his daughter's on my daughter's soccer team.
13:02So he'd get up on Saturday morning and head over to the local field, get a little coffee,
13:08and go watch your five-year-old daughters run around and play soccer.
13:13And I go up to him, and he's like, did you see what the Bengals did?
13:17And I go, I did.
13:19And I go, Joe Mixon, yeah, so what do you think?
13:22And he's like, well, can you run?
13:24And I'm just like, I get it, but gross, dude.
13:29Like, just, ugh.
13:31But at least I understand because, believe me, we've watched Joe Mixon and Tyreek Hill
13:38and countless others play football and have figured out a way to compartmentalize the whole thing.
13:44But at least the process on those had run its course.
13:49That does not make any of it okay.
13:52But there is, there's a legal process that has to happen, and then the punishment is given,
14:00and then the league can come in and do what its punishment may or may not be.
14:05And they have total power in that.
14:07They may suspend Puka Nakua, and I guarantee you Rams fans are like, why?
14:11We don't even know, what did Puka do?
14:13He said some weird things, and he got drunk, and he might have had some drugs or something.
14:19We don't even know what Puka did.
14:20But if the NFL wants to suspend him for conduct policy, boom, they do.
14:24They don't even need to answer to anybody.
14:25DeMarcus Robinson got suspended in three games for a, like, pretty bad DUI.
14:31DUI.
14:31But going more than 100 miles an hour.
14:33Yes.
14:34Bad stuff.
14:35Right, bad stuff.
14:36And so I do think that every organization has to figure out where that line is.
14:41And so, you know, if you are, was it Henry Ruggs, who was a Raider, who was going 115 miles
14:48an hour,
14:48and he actually killed somebody behind the wheel.
14:51It was vehicular manslaughter.
14:52And so, yeah, he's in prison, and when he gets out, if he's still able to play football,
14:57and I think he's getting out soon, not that far down the road, but he'll still be young enough to
15:04go out there
15:04and maybe be a professional football player.
15:07And each organization will have to decide if what he did and the time that he served,
15:12was it so bad that you can't tolerate or you can't stomach having him actually be out there?
15:17Three to 10-year sentence.
15:19It's funny you brought him up.
15:21I saw this story recently.
15:22He was just denied parole two months ago.
15:25In June, Henry Ruggs, his next mandatory eligibility date will be almost exactly one year from right now.
15:33One year and five days from right now, Henry Ruggs will have another parole hearing.
15:38So he's going to be in prison for at least one more year.
15:41And he's probably 26 years old, maybe 27.
15:45I don't think that he's necessarily that old.
15:48My point is not to make this about vehicular manslaughter or DUIs or any of that.
15:53It's more about the teams and the decisions and, you know, your question about, as a fan,
15:59does it affect the way that you want a fan?
16:02And I'm thinking about the Giants Pride Night fiasco where we now know that three players wrote scripture on their
16:09hat
16:09and another one didn't even want to wear the hat.
16:11And so we know who those players are.
16:13And if you're somebody like myself, and I won't speak for you,
16:17but I think we're kind of in the same camp about it,
16:19it makes me feel a different way about those players than I felt before this actually happened.
16:24And we all have those players.
16:25I mean, like there was a discussion for a period of time.
16:29Everybody can answer this their own way.
16:31But there was a discussion for a period of time after Nick Bosa throws on a red hat on national
16:37TV.
16:38And I still know.
16:39I mean, I know for a fact that there were players on the 49ers who were like,
16:45I don't like this.
16:47I know this for a fact.
16:49Right.
16:50And again, social causes are different than like felonious crimes.
16:53I'm not trying to compare the two.
16:56For sure.
16:57And I think we get that.
16:58And anybody who's going to come at you for that, you're kind of being a cherry picker.
17:01Like the point is, is does any of this sort of shade the way you view the player or view
17:07the team?
17:07And I bring this up just because, again, Grandy mentioned it to us earlier today, and I've been thinking about
17:14it.
17:15And so I did a little bit more of a dive into what exactly is going on in the Tarion
17:21Arnold situation.
17:22And the bottom line opinion that I come away with is that this is completely inappropriate behavior by the Seattle
17:29Seahawks.
17:29I mean, think about it now.
17:32Think about what the NFL is potentially doing.
17:35How hypocritical would it be for the NFL to say you're on the commissioner's exempt list.
17:42If you ever become active for an NFL game, we're going to suspend you for conduct detrimental.
17:50But during all of that, you have no problem with your teams signing him.
17:56Like that doesn't make any sense.
17:58You can't tell me this person is not eligible right now.
18:02Oh, but you can sign him.
18:03Like, why would the Seahawks not be violating the conduct detrimental policy of the NFL?
18:10By bringing him in, if you as a league are saying you're not even eligible to play right now,
18:16because at minimum, we're going to wait for due process to play out and see where this goes,
18:22because these are crazy allegations, and there's at least enough of your fingerprints on it
18:28that we're pretty terrified about where this is going.
18:31But sure, sign a contract.
18:33That does not make any sense to me at all.
18:36I think it makes sense to the extent that, you know,
18:38the teams are able to act of their own volition and make the signings they want to make.
18:43But the reality is, like you said, the league has the right and they will exercise the right
18:48to put a player like this on their exempt list.
18:51And so, yeah, Seattle, go ahead and sign him.
18:54And you may not have a chance to actually play him because we'll decide whether or not
18:58he actually gets to play depending on the jurisprudence and how this trial goes
19:03and the rest of it.
19:04So the thing that strikes me more, Mark, is the fact that on Hard Knocks,
19:08an episode that aired last night, and I actually watched this one as I was cleaning up the kitchen,
19:12and you hear the GM say, yeah, you know, if we knew, you know, we wouldn't sign this guy
19:18because you're on camera and this is now going to be put out in the public.
19:21But now that all the taping is done, you can come out and sign the player?
19:25That, to me, is the hypocrisy of it.
19:27I agree completely.
19:28So, again, we're talking about Tarion Arnold, a cornerback who was cut by the Lions
19:33because he is currently been accused with four counts of kidnapping,
19:43four counts of armed robbery.
19:44By the way, I think a professional sports team,
19:48this is one thing I always keep in mind when you see stories like this,
19:52they do their own background homework.
19:55So, for example, if you're on a team and you get arrested or accused of a crime,
20:02the first thing the team is going to do, they're not going to cut you right away,
20:05not if you're a good player, not if they want you on the team.
20:08We've watched this a hundred times.
20:10They'll go, well, we're going to let this play out a little bit.
20:13They may end up on the exempt list, but they're going to be like,
20:16let's wait and see what's going on.
20:19Well, the Lions waited about four seconds, and then they went and get him out of here,
20:24which tells me they did some sort of research behind the scenes,
20:28and this doesn't make him guilty without a trial,
20:32but it does tell me that the Lions didn't like what they found
20:35as they did their background homework.
20:37They did not like what they found.
20:39So they said, get him out of here.
20:40Yeah.
20:41You're going to tell me now, a couple months later,
20:44before the season has even started,
20:46the Seattle Seahawks are then going to just sign him,
20:49even though nothing else has played out to dissuade authorities
20:55from what's going on in this particular case.
20:58I find the whole thing absolutely hypocritical, pretty gross.
21:03I'm glad my favorite team didn't do it,
21:06and the only part I'm thankful of, and I say this tongue-in-cheek,
21:09this will help me hate the Seahawks this year
21:12because they're sort of the more kind of, you know,
21:17kind, easy division mate, like the Rams are the Niners' rivals.
21:20Everybody loves Sam Darnold.
21:23Nobody's threatened by Seattle.
21:24Win a Super Bowl and start behaving like this,
21:26now I got no problem rooting against the Seattle Seahawks
21:29every time they take the field.
21:30It's always easy to root against Seattle and also the Rams,
21:33but I'm with you in terms of this and the fact that the GM on Hard Knocks
21:37was talking about, well, we would have had to cut him if he was our player,
21:40and then Hard Knocks taping is over, and now you go out there
21:43and you sign him and you sign him and you probably won't get to play him.
21:47This one is a head scratcher for me.
Comments