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00:00I have in some way incensed Anthony Lima, and it's been a couple months now.
00:05Hold on, is this going to be their bit, though? Is this what this is?
00:08Oh, they recap our show for us?
00:09For three weeks, Ken did the whole, like, well, I'm tired of LeBron and that decision.
00:15I don't even want to deal with it. That's fine. Understandable.
00:18It was a reasonable take. It was what it was.
00:20But it was like three weeks of their show doing that, and again, totally fine.
00:24But is that what, like, Lima all last week did the bit you're talking about right now.
00:28He kept going down the road of, this show is being too optimistic.
00:31Why are we being so optimistic? Is this just what they're going to do for the next three weeks?
00:35Yeah, and it's interesting. I think Lima's painted himself into a corner.
00:39I think he's just wanting everyone to know he thinks the Browns are going to suck and that your door's
00:43a jabroni.
00:44Okay.
00:45I thought it was long established he thought that. I didn't know that was breaking news.
00:48If you go off, you know, recent history and you bet against the Browns and take the under, you're going
00:54to be right.
00:54A lot of the time, you're going to be right.
00:55Also, if you bet on incumbent favorite for the Browns quarterback spot isn't going to work out, you'd also be
01:02right.
01:02Yes.
01:02But I think he took umbrage.
01:04I think he thought we were subtweeting them by saying there's really only three thoughts on the Browns quarterback situation,
01:11or the Browns in general,
01:13and that it's a little annoying that there's not a diversity of thought.
01:16Honestly, you know, we can talk about the Browns and not be trying to talk about their show.
01:20Well, what's funny about it is...
01:21That is a thing that can happen.
01:22What's funny about it is, maybe there's a little bit of guilt from Lima, because we weren't subtweeting them.
01:27No, we were just having a conversation.
01:29Also, I don't know if you know this about me.
01:31We'll put your name on it at any point.
01:32We have no problem with that.
01:33I'm not much of a subtweeter.
01:34We also kind of go out of our way to put people's names on it when we're talking about them.
01:38So, clearly, I am being a Browns homer for saying this is a 7 or 8 win team, and that
01:43while everyone is in agreement that this is the 32nd out of 32 quarterback rooms in the NFL,
01:50that there might be a player in here, in the quarterback room, that can go ahead and change that conversation.
01:55There will come a day, and I think it's going to be sooner rather than later, Nick, where saying 7
02:00wins will be looked at the way that it's supposed to be,
02:02which is, oh, so you don't really think that team's that good, do you?
02:06Yep.
02:06There's going to come a day, maybe two years from now, maybe three years from now, someone at the station
02:10is going to say 7 or 8 wins,
02:12and people are going to act as if they just said the craziest thing sports talk radio has ever heard.
02:17We're not there yet, but it's wild that we're at a spot where 7 wins is acting as if you
02:22think this team is the 85 Bears.
02:23Now, you mentioned the LeBron story that was several weeks in the making and how, like a weekend.
02:31Well, so instead of talking about the LeBron side of things, they just pivoted to the idea that they were
02:34bored with the LeBron conversation or didn't like the LeBron conversation,
02:37and that's where I wonder if this is where this quarterback conversation is going for them.
02:40That's what's fascinating to me.
02:41It's like, you know, like, even to Andy Baskin's charge about talking about quarterbacks in the abstract,
02:47we've actually talked about, like yesterday, we talked about the fact that Deshaun, for the first time,
02:53that when Shador went against the Ones on Saturday, he looked like the best quarterback.
02:57That's the first time that the guy that went against the Ones looked like the best quarterback in practice.
03:02That is a development.
03:03There's nothing abstract about that.
03:05And by the way, speak more specific than that.
03:09What do you mean abstract?
03:10It's a guy that hasn't played good football in five years,
03:13and a guy who no one will say anything balanced about the seven games he played last year,
03:18and he's either underdrafted or a fifth-round pick.
03:21Well, I don't know what more he wanted.
03:23I mean, I think in the context of it, he was trying to say—
03:26More talk about self-driving cars, I think.
03:29Don't worry.
03:29He'll give you the list of cities that are allowed—
03:31Would you get in it?
03:31That are allowed—
03:32Oh, Jeff said no, by the way.
03:33Jeff, if Jeff was a hard stance, no.
03:35I would not get in the—
03:36That's such a Jeff Phelps move.
03:37As of right now, my answer is no.
03:41Yeah.
03:42Oh, wait.
03:42We can also—I mean, we can just do—
03:43Hey, Taylin Green.
03:45I think he's awesome.
03:46I'm buying stock in that like they do for an hour each day.
03:48We can do that conversation if you want instead.
03:50I would like to point out, that is Jonathan Peterlin throwing the shade at the midday show.
03:56I have said nothing other than the self-driving car, which was just—
03:59What the hell was that?
04:00What was that?
04:00I'm not sure.
04:01By the way, I'm going to help Jeff out here.
04:04He is massive.
04:04He's a massive human, Taylin Green.
04:06Yeah.
04:06He does just hover over every other quarterback when they're all lined up together.
04:09You know, I will tell you, I was out there.
04:12Not a lot of small guys out there.
04:14Yeah.
04:15Well, Quincy Williams, you know, I told you about that.
04:16I mean, Emmanuel, Neil Warren's like 6'2", 6'3".
04:19You put those shoes on.
04:20I'm going to say this right now.
04:21They got a lot of athletes out here.
04:22He did hover over, though.
04:24And Dylan's right there, so it helps.
04:25But, like, he hovered over them.
04:27But maybe it's because I came into the LeBron conversation a week into it,
04:31because it began when I was on vacation.
04:34That's right, yeah.
04:34When I came back and people were already starting to bitch about it
04:37and say, oh, I'm tired of this already, I chuckled.
04:42Well, when Daniel Oyefusi, who did a great job of the morning boys today
04:45when Lima wasn't sandbagging me, Daniel Oyefusi talked about the race
04:51and how the quarterback race and how unimpressed he's been to this point?
04:55I'm starting Shador Sanders.
04:56And, again, I don't think any quarterback is necessarily wowed me.
04:59But I think the biggest difference through five practices that I can definitively say
05:02is that Shador Sanders is taking care of the ball,
05:04and he's comfortable pushing the ball downfield.
05:05We'll see if Deshaun can, you know, kind of pick it up over the next coming weeks
05:10and then into training camp.
05:11But one thing that I've noticed from him is just he just seems like he's just a tick slow
05:15in the processing.
05:16I asked him specifically if he's still trying to reacclimate to the speed of the game,
05:20and he talked about trying to let his instincts take over.
05:23And I feel like he's just hesitating a lot.
05:25And I don't know if it's a mental thing.
05:26I don't know if it's a physical thing.
05:27But I just see him kind of hitch, hesitate a little too much,
05:30maybe not trust what he sees.
05:31And that's when we've kind of seen some of those head-scratching interceptions.
05:34But if I throw Shador out there to say tomorrow to win a game for my life,
05:37I don't know if the pre-snap is going to be perfect.
05:39I don't know if, you know, all the situational decisions are going to be perfect.
05:42But that's kind of life with a young quarterback.
05:44But I know that he's going to be comfortable throwing the ball downfield.
05:47I mean, he's not going to be afraid to let it rip.
05:49All right.
05:50So what I like about this is this was the nuance that I was asking about.
05:54You can say the quarterbacks, by and large, have not impressed you.
05:58But differentiating where Shador is and where Deshaun is,
06:02you cannot say after a full week of practices now that they are in the same ballpark.
06:07There's plenty of time for Deshaun to round off the edges here.
06:10There's a lot of time left, yeah.
06:11But let's not act like, again, all unimpressive is the same unimpressive.
06:17Yeah, it's different.
06:18The interceptions matter.
06:19The idea that Deshaun has continued the theme that he's always had this,
06:23at least since he started practicing again with the Browns,
06:26the idea that one throw seems great, next throw seems like, where the hell was that?
06:31Like, these type of things do matter in the big picture, no question about it.
06:33Also, the one thing I will poke fun at Daniel, and he's not listening because he's out here,
06:38so hopefully he does hear that this is in fun.
06:40Yeah.
06:41Daniel kind of seeming over the quarterback battle to this point.
06:45And so, again, that's kind of like Munkin's had this vibe the entire time.
06:48Munkin's been done with it since March, it seemed like.
06:50No, that's fine because he's trying to shoot down any idea of any sort of conspiracy
06:55or any sort of, you know, drama that comes with that.
06:58That's a head coach's job.
06:59We're in the media.
07:00Why the hell would we be sick of a quarterback battle?
07:03I think the quarterback battle's all we got, if we're being truthful about it right now.
07:06There's four quarterback battles across the NFL.
07:08We have one of them.
07:09It's the most important position in sports.
07:11We should care about this.
07:12But I do get the sense, like Lima, for instance, and Ken in the morning,
07:15they're not alone in this, and Daniel's not alone in this either.
07:18There is a sense of people that are getting, I don't know, frustrated with the amount that we're talking about
07:23it.
07:23Alant certainly seemed to voice that last night.
07:25That's for damn sure.
07:26Like, I don't know.
07:27I don't know where that comes from.
07:28Another theme of camp beyond Deshaun Watson maybe not having the best camp so far
07:34is Jerry Judy continues to struggle with drops.
07:37So some more of the same themes we've seen here for the first week.
07:41Yeah, it's interesting that Denzel Boston is stealing the show.
07:44Concepcion is stealing the show.
07:46And then anything you hear about Jerry Judy is just about these drops that he continues to have.
07:49Yeah.
07:49This is not going in the right direction.
07:51I mean, listen, I don't want it to be here because, honestly, Jerry kind of comes off as like now
07:57an underdog after last year.
08:00Like, I know he's a disappointment, but once you see a guy have like a career low in yardage and
08:04the struggles and the frustration with the media, all that stuff,
08:08he's kind of become a little bit of like I'm rooting for him to succeed.
08:12This is how you play yourself off a roster.
08:14Well, I just I expected more.
08:16And listen, it's early.
08:17It's very early in this.
08:18So I'm not going to act as if all of a sudden this year is going to be a disappointment
08:20or anything.
08:21But the excuses we got out of last season and I listen, there's a lot of things that went wrong
08:25last season.
08:26But we got a lot of excuses out of Jerry Judy.
08:28And so I was kind of hoping we'd have a different, more in tune Jerry Judy to Jerry Judy to
08:32kind of open up this camp and kind of get him,
08:34I don't know, head in the right direction, at least challenge these guys to be the number one.
08:37Well, and what's interesting about this is a fair amount of Jerry's drops have come with Deshaun Watson.
08:43And, you know, I came with Shador, too, though, not the reason why Shador stopped throwing to him, but not.
08:48Oh, I'm talking about this year so far in camp.
08:50Oh, OK, OK.
08:51But I think it's interesting is I buy into the perception, not because of the social media post a couple
08:56of weeks back.
08:57I buy into the perception that Jerry Judy is in the Deshaun camp and not the Shador camp.
09:03Well, if Deshaun's your guy and he's fighting for a spot here and he's already struggling, you're going to keep
09:08your damn mitts on the ball.
09:10Yeah.
09:10You know, if you go back and look at, like, the Jerry Judy-Deshaun Watson relationship, there's a couple good
09:14games sprinkled in there.
09:15And so maybe I always wondered if he was just he was in that camp because he just didn't really
09:18have any when it came to with Shador Sanders.
09:20But this is just it's just a bad start all the way around for Jerry Judy.
09:24Hopefully he gets this thing turned around.
09:26Hopefully we can have a different conversation about him.
09:27Also, also, Baskin, very upset with you for taking that shot.
09:32I did not.
09:32I know if you remember.
09:33You're the one that brought up practices.
09:34I was this.
09:35Well, that was that practice.
09:36That was a shot at Lima.
09:37And then you just full guns a blazing at Baskin.
09:40No, I made a Taylor Greene joke, which is an obvious reference towards Phelps.
09:45Also, I'm debating, not even debating, arguing with Anthony Alant for his shot at us yesterday.
09:51Now, did I did I do a bad job in that I presented all of these at your feet as
09:55if like, hey, so as if I'm like the I don't know, the gatekeeper of it all.
09:59Like, Alant took this shot.
10:01Baskin took Baskin was as loose as I've ever heard Baskin.
10:03I swear to you.
10:04That man was ready to take some shots today with the quarterback competition.
10:07Of everyone, he's the one that I'll allow it.
10:11Oh, definitely.
10:11If Baskin and Phelps take a shot at me, very rarely.
10:14I welcome to the arena.
10:16Yeah.
10:16Like, I'm happy that they, hey, come on.
10:18Yeah.
10:18Have fun playing in this arena.
10:20I like this with you guys.
10:21And there's a lot of obvious built-in respect for them.
10:23Alant getting his one hosting job a month to go ahead and crap on me, I don't care for.
10:29I've talked more Guardians in one year of life than he'll ever talk about in his entire life.
10:36Is that right?
10:37And I guess my thing is with Lima is he's clearly using me to further his agenda against Shador Sanders.
10:44And listen, I can't say like I'm clear here.
10:47I don't want to see Deshaun Watson start.
10:49Right.
10:50But that's because, like, of what I've actually seen instead of, like, I don't know, Shador fans were mean to
10:57me online.
10:58Which is, they say mean things to me.
11:00I can't handle it.
11:02You think Lima's being sensitive is what you think?
11:04Yes.
11:04Yes, I do.
11:05And listen, there is a fair conversation about what Shador's ceiling is, whether you think that he is being given
11:13a fair shot or whether you think he's being given too much of a shot.
11:16All those kind of things are fair, but when you start at it from the point of it's a non
11:20-starter, all right, which quarterback should we be starting from the standpoint of a non-starter with?
11:26The biggest disappointment in franchise history in Deshaun Watson or a kid that won three games down the stretch and
11:31showed some playmaking ability?
11:33Well, and so, I mean, this is Lima aside for a second.
11:35Like, if you try to have this conversation with anybody, there's not a quarterback on this roster that's going to
11:40satisfy any of what they're discussing.
11:41They don't want to entertain Dylan Gabriel, and I agree with them, by the way.
11:44You shouldn't entertain Dylan Gabriel at this, although I did watch him make another pass like five minutes ago that
11:49was really nice.
11:50Dylan Dimes is what we're calling him now.
11:52Again, Dimes is being overused.
11:53What about Dilly Dimes?
11:55Obviously, we don't even know what's going to happen with Taylin Green.
11:57There's a reason Phelps keeps bringing him up, though, but, like, there's, like, you're out of options.
12:01This is the quarterback race that we're in.
12:03The idea of going out there and getting Malik Willis was months ago.
12:06The idea of going out there and adding anybody, even like a Jacoby Brissett type, that was months ago.
12:11This is your quarterback room.
12:13This is what you have.
12:14There's no option D to play with.
12:17This is what you have.
12:18Now, while we are talking about the Browns, and again, I'm being labeled a homer because I say they can
12:24win seven or eight games this year.
12:26Go ahead and throw me on the coals, guys.
12:28I'm really putting them out there, really putting the credibility on the line.
12:32But Connor Orr did his yearly exercise where he predicted every game in the NFL.
12:40Yeah.
12:40And what's interesting about that, there's a few things that are interesting about this.
12:43But if we were starting to say, like, what's the Browns' path to success look like, I would say being
12:49through the first nine weeks of the season,
12:51or first eight weeks of the season at four and four, I would say that you're going to end up
12:55with probably somewhere to seven or eight wins, right?
12:58You would think so, yeah.
12:59Yeah, he has them at five wins.
13:01I know, yeah.
13:02And so what I like about Connor's exercise is the idea that he doesn't just do this blanketed, like, they'll
13:06get five wins, they'll get six wins, they'll get...
13:08He legitimately puts a win-loss total for every single game.
13:12I'll tell you, Jacksonville, week one, the Browns start off hot with a win, and so it accounts for it
13:17accurately, where you don't have an AFC North,
13:19where it's like three teams with nine wins and the Browns with five.
13:22Like, no, it accounts for every win-loss.
13:25And I think that's important in these discussions.
13:26We don't do that enough.
13:28He's got the Steelers at six, the Browns at five.
13:30But what I thought was interesting, Nick, is the idea that in his write-up on this, he mentions that
13:35the Browns could just as easily end up as a playoff contender,
13:39somebody that could end up near the playoffs.
13:40What a Browns homer, right?
13:42While also saying they could be a five-win team.
13:44I think that the problem with talking about this Browns team is that there's just a wide gap that could
13:51potentially exist within this roster.
13:53It's so good everywhere but the quarterback spot.
13:56If the quarterback happens to be decent, you could be that type of team that at least contends to see
14:03the postseason.
14:03I can't believe you said that, like a real homer, saying that they could actually, they could have a wide
14:08swath of outcomes.
14:10I mean, yeah, that's basically it.
14:11I guess I'm just a homer in this.
14:13The guy that said seven wins the entire time.
14:16Still well short of 500 on the season.
14:18I just, I look at this and I go, like, I think the thing I'm not expecting is a collapse
14:24late, which is what this would be.
14:26I mean, they go from week nine on, they have one win.
14:29That would just surprise me.
14:31Like, if you talk about a young team that is trying to develop their quarterback position, if anything, if they're
14:36going to struggle anywhere, I think it would be early in the season.
14:40Because, again, you're trying to get the offense going and you are still developing a lot of players on both
14:47sides of the ball.
14:47Like, the one thing I actually disagree with is I would kind of call it for, like, a slow start
14:53and then finish in the second half of the season.
14:55Because I think that's, I think that's what well-coached teams do.
14:58Why does he have us beating Jacksonville week one is what I want to know.
15:01I know he kind of, like, he kind of, like, proud of it.
15:04He calls that out in his write-up.
15:06Well, it is.
15:06I mean, it's going to be, I think, I think we're already seven and a half point underdogs in that
15:09game.
15:09Something to that effect.
15:10They just won double-digit games last year.
15:12They're trying to build on year two with Gladstone and Liam Cohen.
15:15And, like, there's a lot Jacksonville has going for it right now.
15:18No, no.
15:18What I meant was he was very proud of that idea.
15:22The only loss that he has on the schedule that I take umbrage with is coming off the bye, Las
15:27Vegas.
15:27That is week 12.
15:29I think he's accounting for Mendoza being maybe better than he will be.
15:32Or at least Mendoza having the job at that point.
15:34Oh, see, I think that's right around the time Mendoza will take over.
15:38And similar to Shador last year, who, again, made his debut against Vegas.
15:45In a game that you might say they should win, that's going to be a tricky one if that's his
15:49first start or second start or third start.
15:51If you believe the Sando quarterback tiers, Kirk Cousins is in a different tier than Deshaun Watson and Shador Sanders.
15:56I mean, Cousins wasn't bad last year.
15:59He's in tier three.
15:59He's also not good last year.
16:01I agree with you.
16:02It's a tough one.
16:02I tend to think that Kirk Cousins, if it's Kirk Cousins versus Shador or Deshaun, we have the advantage in
16:06a lot of other spots in the field.
16:08Obviously, they've got advantage with Brock Bowers.
16:10They have an advantage in a couple areas.
16:13But even like offensive line for us, we have a better offensive line than they do.
16:16Theirs was the one that was worse than ours last year.
16:19I don't know what Jente's going to be.
16:21I think they'd have an advantage in the run game.
16:22They're not completely just depleted of talent.
16:26But yeah, the Browns should be competitive in that game.
16:29I think the Raiders got their quarterback in year one of a rebuild, and that's tough.
16:35That is really, really tough.
16:37Even if you spot them a year for...
16:40They might be like the Patriots year one with Drake May thing.
16:42Oh, no, I don't.
16:43I would be shocked.
16:44That was a four-win team.
16:45No, it was a four-win team.
16:46That's not impressive.
16:47No.
16:48Oh, okay.
16:49I got you.
16:50Sorry.
16:50Year one.
16:50Logic hard.
16:51Year two is where they obviously went off and everything was great.
16:54Year one was them passing the torch off basically four games in.
16:57As I was reading the Connor Orr piece, I was like, oh, this continues to fall into the line of
17:03the three lines and the Browns.
17:05And you mentioned a lot of talent outside the quarterback spot, worst quarterback room in the NFL.
17:09But even with Connor talking about one of the five easiest schedules in the NFL, it's like everybody agrees they
17:18could be better, but nobody's willing to say it.
17:20Except for Colin Coward.
17:22And Nick Wilson and Jonathan Peter.
17:23Here we are.
17:24Oh, it is...
17:25Truth tellers.
17:26Truth brokers.
17:26Is Coward in the Homer clan too or whatever we're calling this?
17:29I don't like the word clan in whatever club we're going to use there.
17:32If we could just, you know, maybe club would be better.
17:35Is that right?
17:36Yeah.
17:36Oh, Bill Simmons too, right?
17:38Bill Simmons.
17:38Is he in our club?
17:39He's from Boston, so he might be in a clan.
17:41Stop it.
17:42No, no, I don't mean like, I meant like the Bill Simmons clan, whatever that means.
17:472-1-6-4-7-4-0-9-2.
17:51Very complicated folks from Boston there.
17:53Connor Orr.
17:54It's a bad history.
17:55Has the Browns at 5-12, but says they could be a wild card.
18:01Do you think the Browns could be a wild card?
18:02I think that's all I've said.
18:03I really do think, like, when I say seven or eight wins, like, I think they could be a team
18:08that surprises people, even if in Cleveland you and I go, eh, how much really is seven or eight wins?
18:15And this, to me, Nick, doesn't feel like the typical, oh, we're just in training camp and so everything's awesome
18:20and let's have our browns and orange sunglasses on.
18:22I'd tell you if that was the case.
18:23We've done it over a multitude of years, being like, no, you guys are getting a little too high.
18:28This team, you're playing that if game of if everything goes right.
18:31No, there's a lot of talent on this team.
18:32They're young, but there's a lot of talent on this team.
18:34I don't think everything needs to go right for them to be a seven or eight win team.
18:38I think if everything goes right, I think Connor's right that this could factor into a more competitive scenario than
18:43even I can envision.
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