- 2 hours ago
A political crisis is unfolding in West Bengal as over seventy of the TMC's eighty newly elected legislators skipped a protest rally and meeting convened by party supremo Mamata Banerjee.
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00:01Good evening, you're watching India First. I'm Gaurav Savant.
00:05It's Khela Hobe Pro Max in Bengal.
00:09And that's our top focus story on India First.
00:12Less than 10 MLAs, 10 of 80 Thirmul Congress MLAs
00:17showed up for West Bengal, former West Bengal Chief Minister
00:20and Thirmul Congress Chief Mamata Banerjee's protest rally
00:24in Kolkata today by some accounts.
00:27Initially, there were about five and six,
00:29then another two or three, they came up.
00:31But remember, of 80, there were just about eight.
00:35And as Mamata Banerjee pledged,
00:38ladeinge ya maringe, at this protest rally,
00:41majority of the newly elected TMC MLAs were not by her side.
00:45And this isn't the first time that a meeting called by Mamata Banerjee
00:49saw such poor attendance of her MLAs.
00:53Take, for example, the 6th of May, 10 MLAs did not show up.
00:57Then 19th of May, that number went up to 35.
01:0135 of 80 MLAs did not show up.
01:04Then the 31st of May, 60 of the 80 MLAs were not there.
01:09And just a couple of hours ago, 2nd of June, 72 of 80 MLAs were not there by her side
01:15at this very crucial protest that she called after Abhishek Banerjee was targeted.
01:21And to add to her troubles, MLAs stay away.
01:25CID gives the TMC very little space.
01:28The CID, the Criminal Investigation Department of the Bengal Police,
01:31they have intensified their investigation into the alleged fake signatures on that letter
01:36that nominated Sohandeep Chattopadhyay as the leader of opposition
01:40and Firhad Hakeem as the chief whip of the TMC.
01:43Because within the TMC, there are MLAs saying,
01:46this does not have our signature.
01:47Our signatures were forged or worse to that effect.
01:50So will it be Khela Hobe, Promax in Bengal,
01:53with reports that more than 50 TMC MLAs are exploring the possibility
01:57of declaring themselves to be the asli TMC or the real TMC
02:03and then staking claim to nominate Ritabrata Bandupadhyaya
02:07as the leader of opposition in the assembly.
02:09TMC leaders allege that this is part of BJP's Operation Lotus in the state
02:14and the Maharashtra model that the Shiv Sena was split
02:19and the real Shiv Sena was not of Uddhav Thakre,
02:23but a different Iknach Shinde was given the title, the chief minister,
02:30the symbol and the name of the party.
02:33That model is being tried out in Bengal.
02:35So we'll get you a 360 degree perspective on this big story.
02:39Also coming up at 8.30 tonight,
02:42Yogi Ji, maaf kardije se criminals carrying placards
02:46and I'll just show you that image.
02:47These are criminals, they're carrying placards in Uttar Pradesh.
02:51They've pledged to quit crime and reform.
02:55This is happening in Uttar Pradesh and some of them are registered history sheeters.
03:00So Yogi Adityanath announced zero tolerance for crime in the state.
03:03Remember there have been a series of encounters and half encounters and three-fourth encounters,
03:09whatever that may mean.
03:11But several history sheeters were caught on camera holding placards saying,
03:15forgive us.
03:17Requesting the chief minister to forgive them.
03:19Watch that.
03:20Is what these criminals are saying.
03:23The history sheeters according to police reports are about 115 number
03:27who've pledged to abandon a life of crime.
03:30I get you that story at 8.30 tonight.
03:32And also coming up on the show,
03:34reports from the United States say there were heated exchanges between
03:38US President Donald Trump and Israel's Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu over
03:42Israel's commitment to intensify ground operations against the Hezbollah in Lebanon,
03:47including clearance to ground operations to target Hezbollah in their stronghold in Dahiyeh
03:53in the southern part of capital Beirut.
03:56As of now that's not happening.
03:58But then heated exchange between President Trump and Prime Minister Netanyahu.
04:03Reports say Israel's intense bombing in the past 24 hours.
04:06Iran has decided to stop negotiations with the US Houthi forces in Yemen.
04:10They have said that if these attacks against Hezbollah or the resistance forces continue,
04:16then Houthi forces will now block the Babal Mandam.
04:19And they'll block the Suez Canal.
04:21And that would be a disaster for world economy with the state of Hormuz already blocked.
04:25We'll get to that story at 8.35 tonight.
04:28But first I want to take you to our top story.
04:31Our top story is from West Bengal.
04:34It's Khela Hobe, Promax in Bengal.
04:36This is the fourth time that a large number of TMC MLAs,
04:40newly elected TMC MLAs stayed away from a meeting called by Trinmool Congress Chief Mamata Banerji.
04:46The numbers are rising.
04:47From 35 to 60 now, more than 70 of 80 MLAs have stayed away from a protest rally.
04:53In fact, suspended TMC spokesperson Reju Datta has said about 50 MLAs have held a secret meeting.
05:00And they are backing expelled TMC MLA, Ritabrata Banerji, as the leader of the real Trinmool or the asli Trinmool
05:08in the state assembly.
05:09They will stake claim as the asli TMC on the floor of the house.
05:12At least that's a possibility that's being explored.
05:15Those close to Mamata Banerji say this is part of BJP's Operation Lotus in Bengal.
05:21They're trying to implement the Maharashtra model in Bengal.
05:25Mamata Banerji, of course, remains extremely combative.
05:28At her protest rally, she said this is a do or die battle.
05:31And for her, it's a fight to finish the BJP and she intends to carry out that fight.
05:37But imagine, in the autumn of her political life, she is fighting most of the MLAs.
05:45And this is something that TMC leaders themselves say.
05:47That she campaigned for you.
05:49You did not win as independents.
05:51You all fought and won together because of Mamata Banerji.
05:54And now, you have abandoned her.
05:57Is this the biggest crisis she faces or the Trinmool Congress faces since the birth of the party?
06:04Our Bengal Bureau brings you our top story tonight.
06:13Sharp dissent.
06:15Threat of a split.
06:16Perhaps this is Didi's biggest challenge yet.
06:20Mohamata Banerji could be staring at a crisis that goes beyond an election defeat.
06:26Suspended TMC spokesperson Rijudatta has said that around 50 MLAs had held a secret meeting
06:32and were backing the expelled TMC MLA, Ritavrata Banerji, as their leader.
06:55The claims come at a time when the Trinmool Congress is battling what may be its biggest internal crisis,
07:01since Mamata Banerji founded the party in 1998.
07:05And that's not all.
07:08Unprecedented scenes were witnessed in South 24 Parganas, where a TMC leader was seen returning money allegedly collected as cut
07:15money.
07:15The cut money was initially collected from the beneficiaries of the Pradhan Mantri Awas Yojana.
07:22But Mamata Banerji is in denial.
07:25The TMC supremo, who held a protest in Kolkata against the attacks on Abhishek Banerji and Kalyan Banerji,
07:30has said that the TMC MLAs are not being allowed to leave home.
07:34They are being asked to form a new party.
07:59What was also surprising is that many TMC MLAs and MPs were not seen at Didi's Dharna on Tuesday.
08:07After Trinambul Congress's poll debacle in 2026 assembly election, for the first time,
08:12Mohamata Banerjee had hit the streets here in Y Channel.
08:15She had sit here on a protest, Dharna, where she continued to remain for three and a half years.
08:21And finally, she has set the narrative straight and clear that the game is not over yet.
08:28Meanwhile, the forged signature row continues to explode.
08:31After expelling two MLAs, a TMC delegation has submitted a fresh letter
08:36seeking appointment of their official nominee, Sovandev Chattapadhyay, as the leader of the opposition.
08:42She is a leader in the M.O.O.S.
08:49As the president signed the question of the M.O.S.
09:11As the crisis deepens, one trend is becoming increasingly clear.
09:16Most disgruntled leaders are not targeting Mamata Banerjee.
09:20Their anger appears to be directed elsewhere at a bhaipo or nephew and political heir Abhishek Banerjee.
09:28Many within the party blame him for sidelining the old guard and centralizing power within the organization.
09:35Others accuse him of relying too heavily on IPAC, a strategy that they believe contributed to the TMC's electoral collapse.
09:43With the party out of power, leaders who once stayed silent are no longer holding back.
09:49The battle lines within the TMC are becoming clearer.
09:53Old guard versus new guard. Mamata loyalists versus Abhishek loyalists.
09:58The TMC insists this is merely a difficult phase.
10:02But the BJP says the party is collapsing from within.
10:06The Tridamool Congress is being held against the Tridamool Congress.
10:10The one and the other is being defeated.
10:12So in this situation, Mamata Ji is talking about the outlook on the Dillian.
10:17But the people of Prasciv Bangal have been punished by the Tridamool Congress.
10:21Accepted, tested and rejected.
10:25But the signs of unrest are becoming harder to ignore.
10:29Secret meetings, public dissent, leaders under attack, MLAs under suspension, and rival power
10:36centres emerging inside the party.
10:39The battle for Bengal may be over.
10:41The battle for Trinambool Congress may have just begun.
10:45With Indrajit Kundu and Tapasen Gupta in Kolkata, Bureau Report, India Today.
10:53So, let's try and make sense of these latest developments in Bengal.
10:56Joining me from Kolkata is India Today's Indrajit Kundu.
11:00Also with me is Dr. Shatarupa, spokesperson of the BJP, Manujit Mandal, joins us as a political
11:05analyst.
11:06Sayantin Ghosh is the author of Battleground Bengal.
11:09I'm also in a moment going to be joined by Jawahar Sarkar.
11:13But before I bring in our guest, Indrajit, how many MLAs were you able to spot?
11:19And is there an explanation of the 80 MLAs?
11:22Why were the numbers, the numbers that were there?
11:25How many could you count?
11:28Well, this was a big, you know, agitation program called by the Trinambool Congress Supremo
11:34Mamata Banerjee today, her first after the poll debacle.
11:37So, every time, and history has told us, whenever there was a call given by Mamata Banerjee, her
11:44party members were extremely enthused and they are out in large numbers.
11:48But the scenes are very, very different from what we are used to in West Bengal politics.
11:53And there was a time, 2 o'clock was the given time, at about 10 minutes past 1 o'clock,
11:59there
11:59was a Facebook post that was put up by the Trinambool Congress leadership asking, calling its
12:05party workers to come and start gathering because there was a handful of people who had come
12:09in at that point in time.
12:11Then, Mamata Banerjee came out and there were about 8 to 9 odd MLAs and there were 3 MPs
12:17who were there today along with, you know, some supporters who were there in central Kolkata.
12:22This, of course, in the backdrop of these allegations that are now being levelled by the Trinambool
12:28Congress Supremo herself, that her party is under duress, that the police is threatening her
12:34party, MPs, MLAs and, you know, councillors and leaders, they were not being allowed to
12:39attend, they were not given permission, is what they are alleging, for holding these agitation
12:43programs.
12:44So, the tables have turned.
12:45It's now an opposition party and the allegations that were once levelled by the opposition
12:50against the Mamata Banerjee government, now the same allegations are on the lips of Mamata
12:55Banerjee right now.
12:57Okay, I will come back to you for more, but for the moment I want to bring into this special
13:01broadcast, Jawahar Sarkar, former Member of Parliament, has worked very closely with Trinambool
13:07Congress, former CEO of Prasar Bharti, a bureaucrat for more than four decades standing.
13:13Mr. Sarkar, welcome.
13:14Your assessment of the situation today, MLAs who stayed away from May 6 to June 2, that
13:22number has constantly gone up from 10 to 35 to 60, now apparently 72 of 80 stayed away?
13:29I don't think the number will be so large, but definitely this was something that one was
13:37expecting because of the eerie silence following the victory of the BJP, the complete silence.
13:45So we attributed it to the demoralization, but then there was more to it.
13:51There were whispers of what's going on.
13:53Now it appears that a large section of the party is likely to break away from Mamata Banerjee and
14:03Abhishek Banerjee and their persons.
14:07And whether it will be a new party allied to the ruling dispensation or whether it will be a
14:37IPAC as some sort of a parallel party come KGP or whatever, that has really hurt people, a bunch of
14:48youngsters telling them what to do and his style.
14:51Right. And the second thing is that though the BJP has made it very clear, they don't want any more
14:58defector.
14:58The state BJP president said so in as many words, no trivialization of the BJP.
15:05But I think these fellows haven't given up hope.
15:09You know, the problem is that most of them have committed acts from which cases may arise.
15:17I've been pointing that out for many years that many of them are vulnerable to criminal cases and they would
15:24like some sort of a blanket insurance.
15:27So something like this going on.
15:29Maybe 50 of 80, they would perhaps require I think 53 or 55 of 80 to be what they call
15:36is Asli TMC.
15:37Do you think they have the numbers for 55 of 80?
15:42Well, they are saying so, but up to so they haven't come up with any lists.
15:48People are saying, I heard one of the ministers of the BJP government, who I know rather well,
15:54saying that they have the numbers and all that.
15:58And I heard Ritza Broto also making this claim.
16:02But until the names and signatures come out, because Mamta and her people will not be sitting idle also.
16:10They have a lot of resources, you must remember.
16:14So they won't be sitting idle now.
16:16So they'll hark back toward loyalties.
16:18And there will be some amount of turning.
16:21It's heading for something of a split, whether formal or informal, I don't want to, doesn't know.
16:29But this was coming.
16:30This was coming.
16:31So, you know, since you mentioned signatures and both sides trying to, you know, being a part of this churn,
16:38you've been a top bureaucrat and you've been a bureaucrat for over four decades.
16:42You understand the way governments function and the administration functions.
16:46Now, the complaint that Ritza Broto Banerjee and Sandeepan Saha have made about Ford's signatures.
16:52How serious is that for Abhishek Banerjee and Mamta Banerjee?
16:56How serious a setback would that be for the TMC?
16:59See, Ritza Broto himself came in from some other party.
17:03So she'll start with that sort of thing.
17:05But if he has the guts to come forward and make an allegation against somebody who's considered to be the
17:11supremo supremo,
17:13he must be having some material with him.
17:15He'd not make an ass of himself in public.
17:18So he has some material with him to justify.
17:22But until these were scrutinized properly by the speaker,
17:26what should we jump to conclusions?
17:28The weight of doubt is in Ritza Broto's favor.
17:34Because he is the one who's sticking his neck out.
17:38You're reading of this asli TMC and this so-called meeting that was held with over 50 TMC MLAs
17:46is that Maharashtra model or Operation Lotus 2.0, as TMC puts it,
17:51is the Maharashtra model doable in Bengal?
17:56Well, overnight it seems doable.
17:58But it's not the same thing.
18:00Because you don't need these MLAs or this group or this new party to be involved.
18:05In Maharashtra, you needed them, number one.
18:07So they are superfluous to the existing party, BJP.
18:13But they are seeking their own insurance, you must realize.
18:17Because they fear that if they stay with the original group,
18:23they might be victim.
18:28So that is my reckoning.
18:30Because I've been talking of corruption and extortion for a long, long time.
18:35I think that's basically the game plan.
18:38That you select and you get an insurance policy so that nobody can bounce on you.
18:43And you act as a buffer so that the original opposition, whatever it is,
18:47I mean, the main opposition is reduced to a petty size.
18:52That's the game.
18:53But it's not critical to the formation or the sustenance of the government.
18:58And in your reading, is this the end of the road?
19:00Is this the end of the road for the Trinamul Congress or Mamata Banerjee or Abhishek Banerjee?
19:07Because there are some who are talking about political disintegration.
19:10Or is this just exaggeration of a situation?
19:14I think for the moment, it's jumping the gun too fast.
19:18Because I've seen this lady come up from when she was a little more than in her early 20s.
19:26But she's no more in her early 20s, one has to remember.
19:30And her chosen successor doesn't have that volcanic spirit within him.
19:36He has the hegemony in his eyes and attitude.
19:40But he doesn't have that spirit.
19:41It is, so we'll have to see how it works out.
19:46You know, sometimes adversity, the underdog thing also works.
19:50So we will see how it pans out.
19:53But it looks like heading for a split, whether it's a legit split or a legitimate split.
19:59Like the minister in their government right now, Arjun Singh.
20:03He was in the BGP, but he was attending TMC.
20:07You know, these sort of midway houses and what I call political adultery often takes place.
20:13So one will have to see what form and shape and legitimacy this group can acquire under the constitutional provisions
20:21and the legal provisions.
20:22But there is a definite undercurrent of a split.
20:28You know, when the Trinamool Congress or when Abhishek Banerjee and Mamata Banerjee is part of the TMC,
20:34when they blame the BJP or Operation Lotus or Outside Forces or EDI or CID,
20:41should they be looking within?
20:43Why did things come to such a pass?
20:45There are images that are going viral of cut money being returned in Bengal,
20:51of a large number of Bangladeshis now heading to the border once again.
20:57Are these aspects that they also need to introspect?
21:01About Bangladeshis, I would not make any comment right now because we talk about it as it moves along.
21:06But yes, introspection on the model of accommodating, encouraging or keeping with you people who are known to be corrupt.
21:16That's one thing that I could never get reconciled.
21:19I was told that I'm not a political animal and therefore I can't.
21:23If this sort of thing happens in politics, then I shouldn't take it too hard.
21:28But I think it's time.
21:31In fact, the letter that I sent about two years ago, if only a few paras were taken in, it
21:37wouldn't reach this proportion.
21:39So, they need to introspect also.
21:42You recall I interviewed you after that letter, that very pained letter that you had written
21:47and that cut money is now, you know, perhaps it's come back to bite the Trinmul Congress
21:54and now their leaders are returning that money.
21:56Those images are also going viral.
21:57But on that Bangladesh issue, I hope to have you back on the show.
22:01But as always, Mr. Sarkar, many thanks for joining me.
22:07I now want to throw it open for a wider discussion and I want to bring in Dr. Shatarupa into
22:12this conversation.
22:13Dr. Shatarupa, the BJP is being accused of Operation Lotus 2.0 in Bengal,
22:19trying to implement the Maharashtra model.
22:22How do you, you know, respond to this, ma'am?
22:25That this is intimidation of TMC, MLAs and MPs.
22:28That is why majority stayed away.
22:31God of good evening.
22:33First of all, I was listening in to Jaworsharkar.
22:36And although I may not agree with all that he's saying, but he's very categorically said that BJP doesn't need
22:43to do anything like this.
22:45We have the numbers.
22:46I mean, why would we?
22:47We have a thumping majority.
22:50People have voted in some 208 MLAs.
22:55And with the last Malta MLA who got elected now.
23:00So we don't require, I mean, we actually would have been very happy with a healthy opposition.
23:06They have 80 MLAs.
23:07They should have, you know, stuck to their guns and created a good healthy opposition.
23:12In fact, the first few ministry meetings that we had or when the chief minister called a meeting of the
23:19government,
23:20you know that we had called the opposition also.
23:22Even in the first Vidhansa power that was held, you remember when the leader of opposition was talking,
23:32the chief minister heard him out very patiently and then gave his stand in a very dignified manner.
23:37So we don't have a problem with an opposition, number one.
23:40Number two, you will definitely remember what Amitri had said, the Honourable Home Minister had said a long time back.
23:48Probably in another interview, maybe with Rahul or somebody, not on your channel, that Mamata Manerji is beyond the constitution.
23:57In his own sarcastic manner, he had said.
23:59And they blame everybody, everybody else except them.
24:03You know, they blame all the central agencies that BJP has taken over everything.
24:06And then maybe a day will come when her party is going to disintegrate.
24:10And then she will say that her curry cutters have gone to BJP.
24:13This is coming true.
24:14We have, we're not saying anything.
24:16We're not welcoming anybody.
24:18In fact, our state president is very categoric that no new membership will happen.
24:23You cannot, you know, change colors faster than a chameleon and then suddenly say that, okay, now I'm BJP.
24:30It doesn't happen like that.
24:31Number three.
24:31So, let me bring in Manojit Mandai to respond.
24:34Just let me finish.
24:35What if two, two, what just one small point?
24:37Go on, ma'am.
24:38You, you remember the eggs thrown at Abhishek, eggs thrown at Shoghat Rai, Kulyan Banerji apparently being harassed.
24:47These are all general public.
24:49You will not find a single BJP karekarta doing this because we are strictly, much as we would like to.
24:55But we are strictly forbidden to do this.
24:57Today's dhanna.
24:58Much as we would like to.
24:59Ma'am, okay.
25:01I'm not saying this.
25:02But give me a moment.
25:03But give me a moment.
25:04Let me get Manojit Mandai into this conversation.
25:06The point that is being made, sir, is BJP doesn't need to do this.
25:11It's a crisis.
25:13It's a mess of TMC's making.
25:15You know, Ritabrata Banerji, for example, is your party, is a TMC MLA.
25:21So is Sandeepan Sahai.
25:22They've complained of Ford signatures.
25:24Isn't this ghar ka mamla?
25:26As an analyst, how do you look at it, sir?
25:29No, first of all, when Abhishek Banerji was attacked on Saturday, I think there were BJP women activists around.
25:35They were throwing eggs.
25:36It was clearly visible on TV and cameras.
25:39So I think that's just not true.
25:43Yes, there is a problem.
25:45Can I speak now?
25:47There is a problem.
25:48That's true.
25:49But look who is sparing this problem.
25:52Ma'am, let's hear Mr. Mandal.
25:53I will come back to you, ma'am.
25:54Please clarify that with him, sir.
25:55I think Shathurupadi is, you know, some of the other acknowledging that Mr. Sovandir Chattopadri was already recognized as the
26:04leader of the organization.
26:05Ma'am, 30 seconds.
26:0630 seconds.
26:07Let him just complete his point.
26:08I'll come back to you before I go to Sayantan Ghosh.
26:10But go on, sir.
26:12Mr. Mandal, complete your point, sir.
26:14No, I think, I think, Shathurupadi, now you have won the election.
26:17Let's behave like a ruler, you know.
26:20So, it's this operation times for us.
26:23Clearly not rulers.
26:23No, people are the rulers, sir.
26:25They may have won the elections, but they have won to serve.
26:29If they think they're rulers, hopefully they'll be out in case they think they're rulers.
26:33But be that as it may, sir.
26:34I've never said we're rulers.
26:35I do hope so that they do it, you know.
26:37Instead, what they're doing, what they're focusing on, that quote-unquote forgery,
26:41where it was clearly visible that 70 MLAs actually voted for Mr. Shobandev Chottapa,
26:47that they needed barely 41 of them to do so.
26:50And he rightly recognized as the leader of the opposition.
26:53Now then, suddenly, because of these two, you know, what do you call this, expelled MLAs,
27:01one was a perennial, you know, expeller, was expelled by the CPM party also.
27:06I don't know why TMC took him in the party.
27:09I opposed it clearly.
27:10You know, eight years ago.
27:12So, this rotten orange, I said that he had no value to any political party.
27:17Right?
27:17But again, because of this, their letter, the whole thing was completely turned around now.
27:22Now, there is no opposition leader, apparently.
27:25Even today, there was a letter from the party, the Trinamaluk Congress, saying that.
27:28But you have to recognize Shobandev Chottapa there as the leader of the opposition because they've already given the recognition.
27:34Both the speaker and the chief.
27:35So, Sayanthan Ghosh, give me 30 seconds.
27:39Dr. Shotarupa wants to quickly respond.
27:41She wants to just rebut what Mr. Mandal said, but then I'll come to you.
27:44Go on, ma'am.
27:45Yeah, Gaurav, it is on television.
27:48Police have, you know, immediately swung into action.
27:52There has been investigation and five Trinamal goons were identified.
27:56Now, it is not BJP's fault that, you know, these people want to fight amongst themselves and they hate Obishek
28:02Baron ji so much.
28:02Like you had interrupted me, much as we would like to throw some eggs, we are permitted to because Trinamaluk
28:09has harassed our karekartas, not only harassed, murdered our karekartas.
28:13They have pelted stones on our national president, our then state president, on several national leaders.
28:20They have done that.
28:21We have been restrained to the last karekartas down to the bottom by our state president.
28:26He has told us not to do this.
28:29So, none of us are doing this.
28:30And on investigation, you have seen, Gaurav, five Trinamal goons were identified.
28:35Number one.
28:35Number two, all this nonsense that Manojit is talking about, the forgery and the LOP letter, it is all the
28:42Trinamal people who are now pointing out.
28:44In the Vedansaba, the protest seek out…
28:45So, you know, we'll wait for the CID report.
28:48We'll wait for the CID report.
28:50But, Sayanthan Ghosh, is the writing on the wall for Mamata Banerji if, you know, of the 80, more than
28:5870 stay away today.
28:59More than 60 stayed away last week.
29:02More than 35 stayed away the week before that.
29:05Local leaders are returning cut money.
29:08What does all of this indicate within the TMC Parivar?
29:16Okay, so, I think that a few things, Gaurav, that one is that the Trinamal Congress, from the inception, I
29:26think this is something we are missing, that inception, the TMC has fought against the left.
29:31And after fighting against the left, when it came to power, from 2011 to 2026, it has been a party
29:39in power.
29:40So, everything around, for the people, for example, we are talking about Rito Brito Banerji.
29:47They came with the TMC because TMC was in power.
29:51Sandeepan Saha, his father was a congressman, was Srona Kumal Shah, who was with Mamata Banerji.
29:59Because he died, his son got the ticket.
30:02So, what I am trying to say is that these people were not associated with the TMC because of any
30:12kind of ideology, any kind of their sentiment or anything.
30:16Because the party was in power.
30:18When you are in power, you can give a lot of benefit to your people, your karekartas.
30:24And this kind of people were with them.
30:27What is your reading, you know, Sainthan, just give me 30 seconds.
30:30If 70 of 80 stay away, so are we to think that 70 of 80 are not believing in the
30:37ideology of the Trinmul congress?
30:39If, you know, maybe 60, maybe 55, maybe 50, I don't know numbers, but I am asking you, 0.1,
30:450.2.
30:46What about party MPs? There were just about a handful of MPs also there.
30:51Yes, I think the number game will be clear in some days.
30:54Okay. But I think what is happening, just one picture I will tell you, that today there was a sit
31:01-in dharma happened by Mamata Banerji.
31:03You have covered it. Sit, look at the people who are sitting around Mamata Banerji.
31:10Madan Mitra, Shobondya Chattapadhyay, Kunal Ghosh.
31:14These kind of people, majority of them are with Mamata Banerji.
31:19I think Kulan Banerji, there are a lot of allegations and things against him.
31:24One thing in his speech, he said wonderfully, that we have come to TMC and survived in TMC by holding
31:33Didi.
31:34Okay?
31:36Kunal Ghosh also said that earlier today.
31:39Yes, so what I am trying to say is that the new generation, the corporatized TMC,
31:47under Abhishek Banerji, which we are discussing now, were non-ideological, were mostly, there were opportunistic issues and this kind
32:00of people came to TMC.
32:03Is this, Monojeet Mandel, is this anger against Abhishek Banerji, IPAC and the corporate style of functioning and not anger
32:10against Mamata Banerji but then this was a meeting that was called by Mamata Banerji.
32:14This was supposed to be a show of strength for Mamata Banerji and yet MLAs and MPs stayed away.
32:22You know, and what would you make of leaders like Kakoli Ghosh, Dastidar resigning from party post.
32:27Is there a need for TMC to do introspection within, instead of blaming IPAC or corporate culture or the BJP?
32:39No, first of all, I think that if I rephrase that proverb, nothing is sweeter than success, right?
32:45I mean, the same Abhishek Banerji and IPAC won two very, very difficult elections in 2021.
32:51I believe that was the most difficult election so far for Mamata Adi.
32:55And in 2024, just two years back, BJP was reduced to 12 from 18 in their parliament.
33:01I mean, look, the 15 years of anti-incumbency is a very big factor.
33:04And there are, of course, other reasons, corruption, you know, intimidation, Gundagart, the cut money.
33:09And on top of this, SIR, where 3.8 million people are out of the voters' list.
33:15So, I mean, don't write of a person who, I believe, has remade himself in the last five, six years.
33:21Ravisek Banerji has become, I think, a very good young politician in the country.
33:26Even the prime minister of the country, Lorde Moini, you know, held that parliamentary delegation,
33:30after that, you know, Ghasni Teresh attack in Kashmir.
33:35I think, you know, just don't write him off.
33:37There are problems in the party.
33:39I believe 15 years, I think, is a quite long time for a party to go.
33:43TMC has to take it in stride, yeah.
33:45He ruled 15 years and you talk about ideology, morality and politics.
33:48Oh, my God.
33:49That doesn't happen these days, my dear friend.
33:52I mean, the ideology is a fig in politics.
33:54I think the same TMC, I think, decimated one of the biggest regimes in the world,
33:59the leftist regime, under Manta Banerjee.
34:01And they won three successive elections, you know.
34:05So, I mean, yes, you have won the election.
34:08I repeat, nothing, nothing success like success.
34:10Enjoy and, you know, govern the state.
34:12There are problems.
34:13I'm acknowledging on TV.
34:14There were problems.
34:15Cut money culture.
34:16I mean, you're talking about this.
34:17Ritav Manta Banerjee, you know, lauding this up.
34:20He is a term court, perennial term court.
34:22He was expelled from his party for an anti-party activity.
34:24Dr. Shatarupa wants to come in.
34:26Now he's expelled again from TMC.
34:27It will be fatal.
34:28You don't want to lauding him up, that's your problem.
34:31Okay.
34:32It will be very dangerous to write off either Manta Banerjee or Abhishek Banerjee.
34:38Are some making the mistake of trying to write off Manta Banerjee in this situation?
34:45Dr. Shatarupa.
34:46I don't know who's writing them off.
34:48We are not.
34:49Srinumul themselves are writing their leader off, whether it's Manta Banerjee and her age
34:55or whether it's Abhishek Banerjee and his arrogance.
34:57It is the Srinumul people who are reacting to their leaders.
35:00We have absolutely nothing to say whether Manta Banerjee, in fact, the chief minister
35:04has very, very, very gallantly, I will say, maintained that nobody, even the state president,
35:11we've constantly been maintaining nobody should make any kind of personal insults on Manta Banerjee.
35:17We generally don't. But even then, there is this very strict stricture on us that we are
35:22not supposed to get any permanent, get into any personal attacks or insults. But I mean,
35:28I have to laud Manta Banerjee. He's still holding on to his guns and defending Abhishek Banerjee.
35:34I mean, he's a very loyal person, I'm sure. But the point here is that some 10 other people
35:40or maybe 20 other people or now probably 80 other people and the whole party is disintegrating
35:46like a pack of cards. And they are the ones who are pointing out the problems with Abhishek
35:51Banerjee. And some are pointing out the problems with Manta Banerjee. I can tell you one thing
35:57as a BJP spokesperson, whenever we've had top leaders of Srinamul crossing over earlier,
36:04I'm talking about earlier, 2016, maybe 1918, when Mukulda came, all of these people had a problem
36:12with Abhishek Banerjee. They were hurt because Manta Banerjee didn't say anything. Now that is
36:18a problem that Srinamul has to sort out within themselves. BJP has got nothing to do with it.
36:23And one thing, Saintham Ghosh was saying something very nicely. I always admire what he says.
36:30But you know, he's talking about some ideology. For the life of me, I don't know what ideology
36:35Srinamul has except for being in opposition. They have to be against somebody. Srinamul was
36:42born out of opposition to Congress. Srinamul grew. Their single point agenda was opposition
36:49against CPM. I'll get Saintham to respond to that. But Bonocheeth wants to respond to you.
36:53On that point, that very pertinent point you raised, you think they may be disintegrating.
36:59But Aadeh, Monojeet Mandel, is the TMC disintegrating?
37:05If 50 plus are saying we are a TMC, then that's serious trouble for Manta Banerjee and Abhishek Banerjee, sir.
37:12First of all, Srinamul knows that we fight on TV, but I respect her off the camera.
37:18She knows it very well. I'm speaking about the fact. You know, what I'm saying is political history
37:24of the state, right? Yes.
37:26The facts, I know, because I do have some connection with the party.
37:30This Ritoprata Banerjee was made the MP because of Abhishek Banerjee, right?
37:35He was in the party because of Abhishek Banerjee.
37:38He got the ticket because of Abhishek Banerjee.
37:41Sandipan Shah, no, hang on.
37:42Right now, he's against Abhishek Banerjee.
37:44Look at these people. Look at the people. I mean, Sandipan Shah, one of the young guns of the party,
37:51his father used to hold that seat. He got the ticket because of Abhishek Banerjee, right?
37:55Now, look at their attitude. I mean, I just pity these people.
37:59And I pity also the people who shelter them.
38:02Sir, but if it were just these two, if it were just these two, you could pity them.
38:07But if that number truly is, as they claim, either 50 or 55, is that a serious threat to the
38:15Janubul Congress?
38:16I'll wait for that. I'll wait for that.
38:18But please look at the councillors who are resigning and now singing a different tune.
38:22Investigate them. Investigate the 100 plus councillors.
38:25They are the most dangerously corrupt people of TMC, I tell you.
38:30The councillors and the lower-level panchayat, where I'm sitting in a village right now, in my village.
38:34I could see them. They are the most dangerously corrupt people, you know.
38:37Sir, but I wish you had said all of this when TMC was in power.
38:41That these are the most corrupt people. You're only saying that now.
38:45But, Shainthan Ghosh, last 30 seconds.
38:47I used to say, because I'm eating into the time of the other big story that we're getting here on
38:50the show.
38:51And I quickly want to go to it.
38:53Do you see this as major trouble for TMC?
38:56If 55 were to break away, is that, you know, as Dr. Shudarupa argues, is that TMC disintegrating then, sir?
39:05Yes. So, just a few things I would like to correct, okay.
39:11For the international delegation of Operation Sindhor, the central government, under Mr. Modi, did not choose Abhishek Banerjee.
39:22True.
39:22They chose Yusuf Pathan and then the TMC objected to that.
39:28And then they decided to include Abhishek Banerjee and not Yusuf Pathan.
39:34This is a factually wrong thing.
39:36And another thing is that, okay, today we are talking about West Bengal.
39:41Today we are talking about morality and ethical considerations against the TMC, which is happening.
39:48But just, Gaurav, I would like to take you to 2021.
39:52And if I'm not wrong, it was February, sorry, November, TMC did the same thing in the state of Meghalaya.
40:02In an overnight coup, they dismayed, they took over 12 out of 18 MLA's of the Congress and became the
40:11opposition party in Meghalaya.
40:14Okay, under Mukul Sangma.
40:16So, I think that this is all, this is all about, this is a power game.
40:22This is a power game.
40:24Who can put more power on which situation the number will depend on.
40:30And that's a story we will be tracking very closely.
40:31I want to thank all my guests.
40:33It's a very interesting discussion.
40:34But clearly, this is a story that will remain interesting in the days and weeks ahead.
40:39Thank you very much for joining me.
40:41I want to quickly now switch focus and take you to Uttar Pradesh.
40:44Now, in police stations in Uttar Pradesh, I want to take you to one police station in Ghaziabad.
40:49Criminals, including history sheeters, they are holding placards.
40:54Placards that say, request Uttar Pradesh Chief Minister Yogi Adityanath.
40:59Please forgive me, is what that criminal says.
41:02He says, he will abandon a life of crime.
41:04And not one, not two, but multiple, yes, muja kshama kare is what this alleged history sheet according to the
41:12Uttar Pradesh police.
41:13This is what they are saying.
41:14There is a police verification drive, a special verification and reform drive that was conducted by the Ghaziabad police.
41:20And criminals, including registered bad characters, history sheeters, they are carrying placards to request Uttar Pradesh Chief Minister to forgive
41:29them.
41:29And that they will reform and that they will no longer, that's the pledge they're taking.
41:35150, close to 150 history sheeters, they were called to local police stations as part of a verification drive.
41:41During the drive, many of them came with these placards.
41:45They publicly pledged they will stay away from crime and follow the law of the land.
41:51And this is being termed as Operation Clean Sweep that's being conducted within the jurisdiction of Sahibabad Police Station in
41:58Ghaziabad.
41:59Now, to verify their credentials, these 150 odd individuals, they were called, they have criminal antecedents, they have cases against
42:07them, they're registered bad characters, some of them are history sheeters.
42:11They have criminal records and they were called to pledge that they will not resort to crime.
42:18Listen in to their pledge and what the police are saying.
42:43I want to quickly bring in India today's Arvind Ojha for more on this.
42:46Arvind, abhi Uttar Pradesh ke mukha mentri yogi Adityanath nne kaha tha maabap ko ki apni nalaiq auladho ko samjha
42:53lo.
42:54Woh jab bakreed ke dhin ek hindu ladke ka gala kaart diya tha, kuch logon ne.
43:02Kya uske baad yye pura shurru huwa hai, iska background bata yye.
43:06Bilkul dhekhe, surya ka murder huwa tha Gaziabad mein, jis mei jomain accused tha, asad uska encounter huwa uske baad
43:13se.
43:13Gaziabad police nne operation clean switch chalana shurru kiya hai.
43:17और उसी के तहत, अगर आपने अभी सुना होगा India Today पर वसीम, ये साब साब बोलना था, वसीम murder
43:23का accused है, इसने murder किया था.
43:25लेकिन अब इन सभी, जो criminal है, history sitter है, उनको गाजयाबाद police ne search करके, police station में उनका
43:33verification करना शुरू किया है, और सभी से सपत दिलवाई गई है.
43:37सबसे interesting बात यह है, कि जितने भी criminal है, वो हाथों में poster लेकर बकायदा पहुंचे थे, जिसमें लिखा
43:43था, योगी जी, हमें माफ कर दीजे, आगे से हम भविस में, future में हम कोई crime नहीं करेंगे.
43:50तो इस तरह का एक mega drive गाजयवाज पुलिस चला रही है, बहुत मुम्किन है कि उत्तरप्रदेश में इस तरह
43:55का mega drive देखने को मिलेगा, जिसमें जो criminal है, वो शपत लेते दिखेंगे, कि हम आगे कोई crime नहीं
44:02करेंगे, खीक उसी तरह से जैसे वसीम, इंडिया टुडे के कैमर
44:05पर जो साब बोल रहा था कि पुलिस नहीं हम से कहा है, कि अगर कोई परशानी हो, हम से
44:10कहो, लेकिन अगर कोई crime किया, तो फिर एक्सल लिया जाएगा, तो इस तरह का mega drive है, वो उत्तरप्रदेश
44:16पुलिस, जो अलग-अलग साहरों में, वो चला रही है.
44:35Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, now both of them are seen as very close together, but as the war escalates, or
44:43there's a no war, no peace situation right now, signs of strain are very clearly showing.
44:49Donald Trump and Benjamin Netanyahu, they held a phone conversation in which Trump is believed to have told Netanyahu, hold
44:56back military action, there should be no action in Beirut, in the southern part of Beirut.
45:01But Netanyahu said, Israel will continue to strike if Hezbollah attacks persist, not in Beirut right now, but in the
45:08southern part of the country, the operations will continue.
45:11I'll get you more in this report.
45:19Conversations between two of the world's closest allies don't appear to be friendly anymore.
45:26U.S. President Donald Trump and Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu held a phone call which Trump says was very
45:33productive, but if reports are to be believed, it was a tense exchange to say the least.
45:39Trump claimed that after their conversation, Netanyahu agreed to pull back any troops that were preparing to attack southern Lebanon.
45:46Trump also said that he spoke with Iran-aligned Lebanese militia group Hezbollah through intermediaries and secured a pledge that
45:54it would not attack Israel.
45:57But Netanyahu posted soon after that he told Trump that they will continue to attack Beirut if Hezbollah does not
46:04stop its attacks on Israeli cities.
46:08Israel's security minister even said that now is the time for Netanyahu to say no to Trump and continue strikes
46:15on Hezbollah.
46:17But this is not where the disagreements end.
46:20Hours after the two nations made their positions clear, an Axios report quoted U.S. officials saying that the call
46:27between Trump and Netanyahu was in fact an expletive laden one.
46:32The call was prompted after Iran threatened to stop negotiating with the U.S. due to Israel's action on Lebanon.
46:41A miffed Trump, therefore, reportedly lashed out at Netanyahu over the escalation and yelled at him, calling him crazy.
46:48According to the report, Trump felt that Netanyahu was reacting disproportionately and accused him of being ungrateful, saying he would
46:56have been in prison if not for the United States.
47:00The report even quoted Trump telling Netanyahu that everybody hates him and Israel because of this.
47:08Israel and Lebanon are set to begin another round of talks in Washington, D.C.
47:13But with Netanyahu facing intense pressure at home to continue attacks, will he heed Trump's call to stop the military
47:20action in Lebanon?
47:22Puro Report, India Today.
47:29Will the war in West Asia escalate or will there be peace, return to peace?
47:35Because Iran has stopped negotiations till the time the situation eases out in Lebanon.
47:41Orsh Shakedh is U.S. correspondent at Israel's Hayom, joins us on this broadcast.
47:45Richard Sanders is a former U.S. State Department official, also joins us on the show.
47:51Orsh Shakedh, how do you look at the situation?
47:53Right now, Benjamin Netanyahu says Israel will continue to strike at Hezbollah, maybe not in Beirut right now.
48:00But Iran says should that happen, there will be no negotiations.
48:03And there is fear that Bab al-Mandab could be targeted next by the Houthi forces.
48:09Yes, so good evening and thank you for having me, Mr. Sawant.
48:13I would be careful not to overstate this as a dramatic rupture between Trump and Netanyahu.
48:19It was clearly a tense conversation, but the two leaders have a deep working relationship and speak very frequently, three
48:25or four times a week.
48:27Any two leaders, even close allies, can have disagreements.
48:30And the real question is whether they can manage those disagreements through ongoing dialogue while facing the strategic challenges.
48:37I do not believe that this is a dramatic shift in terms of the military situation.
48:43Specifically in Lebanon, we need to create a distinction, and you mentioned it, and rightfully so,
48:48between the escalation of attacks, including attacks in the Dachia area of Beirut against Hezbollah assets,
48:56and the ongoing defense measures that Israel is taking in order to protect itself from ongoing Hezbollah attacks in southern
49:03Lebanon.
49:04One needs to mention that there are currently, since the announcement of the ceasefire in April,
49:1013 Israeli soldiers have died as a result of Hezbollah attacks,
49:13and Israel retains the ability to respond to them as these attacks happen.
49:19Okay. Mr. Sanders, do you see this as a regular disagreement between the Israeli Prime Minister and the American President?
49:28Do you see this as a rupture or something far more serious than a disagreement?
49:33I think this is a time in which the United States and Israeli interests,
49:38which were closely aligned at the beginning of the conflict, are beginning to diverge somewhat.
49:44The United States' priority is to find a solution to what's going on in the Persian Gulf,
49:50and to get the Straits of Hormuz reopened,
49:53and, of course, to reach some kind of arrangement on the nuclear issue.
49:58At the same, these, of course, are of importance to Israel,
50:01but Israel's current priority has to do with Hezbollah and Lebanon.
50:07And so, for them, the fact that there are missiles being fired on their northern settlements,
50:14stopping that is their top priority.
50:17And the two may overlap, but they are not necessarily the same concerns.
50:23Both leaders, of course, have not only international security concerns, but domestic concerns.
50:30President Trump's war with Iran is not popular.
50:35At the same time, Netanyahu looks like his current government is coming to its end,
50:41and he'll have to face elections.
50:42So there are domestic pressures involved in this as well.
50:45At the same time, there are a lot of moving parts going on.
50:49There's, be it in Washington, between the Lebanese and the Israeli representatives,
50:57we have messages and negotiations being passed back and forth between the Iranians and the Americans.
51:05At the same time, we have a so-called ceasefire,
51:09but it looks right now more like a kind of a low-intensity conflict in which missiles and drones—
51:15I mean, there's a ceasefire in place, and yet missiles are being launched,
51:19and missile silos are being targeted.
51:21But do you see an escalation in the days and weeks ahead?
51:24Iran has pulled back from negotiations if there's an escalation on the Lebanon front.
51:29But do you—is there an apprehension that we are still suffering straight off Hormuz?
51:34There could be an impact on Bawal Mandab on the Swayze Canal route next?
51:41Mr. Sandoz?
51:42Well, I would say that we're at a moment of considerable tension.
51:48At the same time, there is this memorandum of understanding whose terms are being hammered out and negotiated.
51:56So we may be coming to a fork in the road, whether there will be continued or even intensified conflict,
52:02or will we see some kind of way forward?
52:05A lot of pain has been inflicted both on Iran and the Gulf states and the global economy,
52:13and less the United States as well.
52:14We hear different signals out of Tehran from the Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps.
52:20Of course, you hear very hardliners saying, well, further conflict is inevitable.
52:26But at the same time, you see, well, we're talking again.
52:31And if the fact that the Israelis are backing off of engaging in some kind of strikes in the suburbs
52:37of Beirut,
52:38perhaps that will provide some breathing space for further negotiations to take place.
52:44But is that detrimental?
52:46Because Benjamin Netanyahu has to face elections, you know, or Shekhet, if I could,
52:53would he want to go into elections with Hezbollah still in a position to target northern Israel?
52:59We've seen multiple attacks take place on Israeli soldiers, as you pointed out, in the southern part of Lebanon.
53:05Initially, they said we want to clear area till the Litani River,
53:09but now apparently they want to clear everything till the Zehrani River.
53:12Is that possible?
53:13Till the elections?
53:14Is that more to do with elections in mind or security of northern Israel in mind?
53:20Well, I think it's all of these things.
53:22I mean, the elections in Israel are due to take place around October,
53:26unless the Israeli parliament, the Knesset, would be dissolved earlier.
53:29So that remains to be seen regarding the actual timeline of when the elections are going to take place.
53:35It means that Prime Minister Netanyahu, from a domestic political standpoint,
53:40has something like four months to show more accomplishments to the Israeli public as we head toward the elections.
53:47That doesn't mean, of course, that the security considerations aren't in mind.
53:51I mean, look, many people in northern Israel have been displaced, just like many people in southern Lebanon have been
53:57displaced.
53:58And one needs to understand that these communities cannot live in peace, even psychologically speaking.
54:06I'm talking about, like, the emotional and psychological safety.
54:10The fact that you have an Iranian terrorist proxy still standing, weakened severely, but still standing,
54:17is a perceived threat that the residents of northern Israel are not willing to take.
54:22So there is a domestic push in order to finish this escalation with Hezbollah.
54:27And the push is to close in on it, both kinetically, militarily speaking,
54:35but also diplomatically as it pertains to the current rounds of negotiations in D.C.
54:40One of the key things to understand here is that there's supposed to be a mechanism in place
54:45in order for Israel and the government of Lebanon and the Lebanese armed forces to dismantle Hezbollah together.
54:53That is what is stipulated in Resolution 1701 of the Security Council, and that's what needs to happen.
54:59But will that actually happen?
55:01Because if Iran right now says any attack on Hezbollah or any attack on any of the resistance forces
55:07will lead to negotiations going in deep freeze,
55:11Mr. Sanders, does that indicate that the situation could now go from bad to worse?
55:18And with President Trump also scheduled to face midterm elections in the United States,
55:24is he facing fire on multiple fronts?
55:26And that's why he wants Israel to back off.
55:29But if Israel backs off, that's trouble for Netanyahu.
55:34There are a lot of complications that need to be worked through under the current situation.
55:39Unquestionably, back in the United States, there is a great desire to get this conflict behind us.
55:46And Trump says he's not concerned.
55:49He may or may not continue with negotiations unless he gets what he wants.
55:53But there are enormous pressures inside the United States to get some kind of forward movement,
55:59to get past the current situation,
56:01to get past the economic pressures that are leading to gasoline at higher prices
56:07and the softening of the U.S. and the global economy.
56:10At the same time, the situation in Iran, the situation in Lebanon is extremely complex.
56:18One can understand fully why Israel would not be prepared to tolerate attacks on its northern settlements.
56:28And this is what points out how bad the situation is.
56:31And now the fear is, if the Houthi forces get involved in Yemen
56:36and the Babal Mandab gets activated or, you know, there's a blockade there,
56:42the world economy will be in tailspin.
56:44And that's the story we'll be tracking very closely.
56:46I want to thank both my guests, Mr. Sanders and Orsh Shekhet,
56:50for joining me here on India First.
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