- 16 minutes ago
A major political crisis is unfolding in Bengal as twenty rebel Members of Parliament announce a split from their parent party and a merger with an obscure, unrecognised political outfit based in Tripura.
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00:00Good evening, you're watching NewsTrack with me, Maria Shaquille.
00:03The twists and turns in the Bengal rebellion of the TMC has taken new turns and it is continuing to
00:12unfold.
00:13On Sunday, rebel MPs announced a merger with the Nationalist Citizen Party of India, a relatively lesser known political outfit.
00:20So why this sudden move?
00:23Experts are suggesting that it is an attempt to avoid disqualification under the anti-defection law.
00:28But the rebel MLAs in Bengal are telling a different story, saying there are no such plans for a merger.
00:36Two rebel camps, two different versions.
00:38So what is really happening and what is unfolding in this TMC rebellion?
00:44Will the matter now move the court?
00:47And will the rebel Bengal MPs or MLAs follow the Shif Sena and NCP playbook?
00:55To decode the legal hurdles, we will be joined by top legal voices of Bishak Manu Singhvi and Mahe Jett
01:03Malani shortly.
01:04But first up, here's what happened today.
01:16A political bombshell from Bengal.
01:2120 rebel TMC Lok Sabha MPs have announced a dramatic split from the party.
01:27And merger with an obscure Tripura-based Nationalist Citizens Party of India.
01:39We will be joined by the Nationalist Citizens Party of India.
02:04The rebels have also sought separate seating in Parliament, signalling a formal escalation of the rupture with Mamata Banerji.
02:12The big announcement came after rebel MPs met Lok Sabha Speaker Aum Bhirla and Union Minister Bhupendra Yadav on Sunday.
02:21But the question now is, what is NCPI?
02:26Founded in 2022 as a regional tribal-focused outfit from Tripura, the Nationalist Citizens Party of India remains an unrecognised
02:34political party with limited electoral success.
02:38Until now, it barely registered on the national radar.
02:41But the merger claim has suddenly pushed it into the centre of a high-stakes political stoke.
02:46The merger is expected to help the rebel MPs to evade anti-defection law.
02:51And then came the twist with the NCPI founder questioning the merger itself.
03:15A claim that throws the entire political arrangement into uncertainty.
03:19Meanwhile, the Mamata Banerji camp has hit back hard.
03:40The battle lines are now clearly drawn.
03:43The rebels want to project themselves as the real TMC,
03:46while Mamata loyalists want to reinforce her as the party's undisputed leader.
03:51The rebels are showcasing their numbers in Parliament,
03:54while the official TMC is banking on its organisation, CADA and legislators.
03:59The rebels are using the NCPI merger as their political vehicle,
04:03while Mamata's camp is trying to isolate them as a breakaway group.
04:08The legal debate is on whether the merger with NCPI is enough for the rebels to escape the anti-defection
04:14law.
04:14But if the merger is cleared, the NCPI will overnight become the fifth largest party in Lok Sabha.
04:21Bureau Report, India Today.
04:45The entire TMC defence, sir, appears to rest on one proposition,
04:51that Mamata Banerji is TMC and TMC is Mamata Banerji.
04:54But the election commission's NCP ruling established that political parties are legal and organisational entities,
05:04not the personal preserve of their founders.
05:07Sharath Pawar built the NCPI, led it for decades and remained its most recognisable face.
05:13Yet, that did not really prevent him from losing the party name and the symbol.
05:17If founders' legacy and public recognition were insufficient to protect Sharath Pawar,
05:22why should they be sufficient to protect Mamata Banerji today?
05:27Now, I think there's a huge amount of mix-up in a lot of these issues.
05:30And I don't want to sound technical, but let me make it as simple as possible.
05:34But just first, a couple of, a minute or so on the political part.
05:38Let me make it clear that nobody is suggesting that there is no dissatisfaction within the erstwhile TMC.
05:47And there is no discontent.
05:48Obviously, there is.
05:49And BJP cannot be blamed for everything.
05:51But there is no doubt at all, Maria, about two things.
05:55The enormous, humongous availability of misuse of agencies never before in 75-80 years of Indian history
06:02by all the parties, including BJP, prior to this government put together.
06:08And secondly, the humongous, enormous misuse of resources and money power,
06:13which are the lubricant and which fuel these movements.
06:17The second political point I wish to make is that there is, you must categorize to some extent.
06:22For example, Suvindu Adhikari left years ago, fought a battle on the streets,
06:27and legitimately got elected as, ultimately, as the CM.
06:30You can't object to that.
06:32There's another small number who decided to walk the talk
06:36and leave the loaves and fishes of office by designing their posts as MP, Raj Sabha, Lok Sabha, or MLA.
06:45The Suvindu Adhikari or the Sushmita Sen, etc., etc.
06:48At least they had the guts to leave their post.
06:51But the large bulk of these people are displaying naked greed for pelf, position, and power.
06:58They continue to be MPs or MLAs, and they have not left their posts.
07:02So, just keep their categorization in mind.
07:04Now, to your legal question.
07:07Till now, just let's leave aside this merger with the NCPI.
07:11Prior to that, one of the biggest misconceptions moving around in Indian politics and law
07:17is that you simply take two-thirds away and you are exempt from the anti-defection law.
07:29That is a complete misconception.
07:31The 10th schedule has two conditions, not one.
07:35And everybody is talking of one condition.
07:37That's the fundamental error in the AAP, AAP, so-called two-thirds.
07:42And also, till now, till today, on the TMC front.
07:45We'll discuss today, I mean, till the NCPI issue.
07:48We'll discuss that in a minute.
07:50The conditions are, first and foremost, the political party must merge with a new party
07:56or create a new party with another party.
07:59And second, cumulatively and conjointly, two-thirds of the legislature party should agree to that merger.
08:07Now, in all the AAP cases and the TMC cases till yesterday,
08:11you've been only looking at the second condition.
08:13That only two-thirds leave and you are exempt.
08:14That is completely contrary.
08:17Anybody with any degree of literacy and legal knowledge has to read roughly pages 82 to 84
08:24of Chief Justice Dhananjaya Chandrachur's judgment in the Shiv Saina case.
08:29It makes it crystal clear that unless the political party merges or creates a new party with another party
08:36and conjointly two-thirds of the legislatures approve such merger, there is no merger.
08:43And therefore, the anti-defection law applies.
08:45Now, this is a fundamental point already decided by the Supreme Court and being tom-tombed about as if just
08:51two-thirds have to move this way or that way to exempt from the defection law.
08:54Now, that's wrong.
08:56But now, there is a twist in the tale.
08:58The twist in the tale is for the first time in political history probably somebody has understood what I've been
09:04seeing on television.
09:04In fact, that you must have a political party merging along with the two-thirds.
09:10So, this time, a very interesting fig leaf has been invented.
09:15That of merger of this TMC breakaway group with a virtually non-existent shell party called the NCPI.
09:24Now, what effect that has on law will have to be determined in a court of law.
09:28I believe that the merger contemplated, because remember, the 10th schedule uses two different words.
09:33Political party in the first place and legislative party in the second place.
09:38Legislative party, of course, the ARP also fulfilled it.
09:41TMC has also fulfilled it.
09:43But the political party test has never been fulfilled by anybody till now.
09:46This is the first time an attempt has been made with the NCPI merger.
09:50Now, the question is, did the TMC as the political party as it then stood or stood till three days
09:56ago,
09:56which is the TMC as a whole, which is the undivided TMC, which is the Mamata Banerjee-included TMC,
10:02ever agree to such a merger?
10:04Obviously not.
10:06Now, what you've done is, only these two-thirds people are merging with the new political party.
10:11I personally believe that is not a sufficient compliance of the twin conditions of the para-4,
10:18of the anti-defection law, but that will be determined by a court.
10:21But yes, an attempt has been made for the first time to recognize twin conditions,
10:26not a solo condition, as everybody's been talking about in television, in courts and outside.
10:30Oho, two-thirds have gone, so you don't apply your anti-defection law.
10:35This is a wrong thing.
10:36Okay, but you know, Mr. Singhvi, TMC leaders here have repeatedly expressed confidence that constitutional processes will prevail.
10:45But from Karnataka to Maharashtra to Manipur, political outcomes have often been decided long before legal processes conclude.
10:54Isn't the bigger reality than in Indian politics, time almost favors the rebels rather than the parent party.
11:03I would absolutely agree with you.
11:04In fact, you put it well.
11:06We have to wake up and smell the coffee.
11:08This is all theory which I'm talking about till now.
11:10Now let's smell the coffee.
11:12I am the original TMC.
11:14I'm giving you only an example for our viewers to understand.
11:16You along with others are the breakaway.
11:19I will file a complaint saying,
11:21Maria, Shaquille and the others are a breakaway.
11:23They should be disqualified.
11:25Assume that every condition of disqualification is fulfilled.
11:29My complaint goes to whom, Maria?
11:31It goes to the Speaker of the Assembly or Speaker of the Lok Sabha?
11:36Or sometimes the Rajasabha?
11:39Now, do you really expect that a Speaker who is necessarily owing his post and is beholden to the party
11:46in power
11:47will ever decide that disqualification petition in my favor?
11:51It never happens.
11:53So the Speaker does two things.
11:55Either immediately he will recognize the breakaway group as is happening
11:58or he will delay it endlessly.
12:00I, that is the original party, will then go in the courts.
12:05The courts will issue notice, reply, rejoinder, and you will have a merry-go-round for six years, three years,
12:10two years, four years.
12:12You are lucky if the decision comes in three years
12:14or well after the five-year term of the entire Parliament of the Assembly.
12:18Now, this is a reality.
12:21So, you know, that old saying applies.
12:28When institutions are not really performing their duty,
12:33that's why I have advocated for a long time a complete repeal of this farce of attention.
12:39It's a replacement by a two-sentence, four-line clause.
12:43Anybody elected on party X, symbol Y, if he changes or works against or rebels against that entity,
12:51must seek re-election after resigning his post.
12:54That's all that we need.
12:55But nobody is going to do that.
12:56We are going to keep having sophistry of splits and mergers.
12:59We are going to have persons deciding who are not entirely objective.
13:05And let me tell you that to expect a fair decision in such a context from even constitutional authorities like
13:12the EC
13:13is unfortunately extremely far-fetched.
13:17But, Mr. Singhvi, you know, you make an important point with regards to the 10th Schedule.
13:21The anti-defection law was designed to prevent precisely this kind of political instability.
13:27Yet again and again, what we have seen is legislators use resignations, procedural delays
13:33and also litigation to bypass its intent.
13:36Then has the 10th Schedule effectively become a paper deterrent, strong in theory, but weak in practice?
13:43I just said so. I have called for its repeal.
13:46You see, the 10th Schedule was enacted after Rajiv Gandhi came back with a four-fifths majority in the mid
13:54-80s.
13:55In conception, it was good.
13:57In fact, it worked well for a few years.
14:00This kind of abuse is relatively recent in the last decade plus.
14:04Now, the basic reason is something which I think the founders in mid-80s did not envisage or foresee.
14:11And that is this.
14:15The adjudicator, the tribunal under the 10th Schedule, is a political appointment of a party.
14:23That is the speaker or the presiding officer.
14:25That's the fundamental problem in the 10th Schedule, architecture, which is why I am calling for its repeal.
14:31The architecture appoints you, Maria Shakil, as the speaker or the presiding officer, be it Rajya Sabha, Lok Sabha or
14:38Assembly.
14:38You necessarily owe your position to the party appointing you.
14:44It is completely misplaced and in the world of cloud-cuckoo land imagination that you will ever be able to
14:54give an objective decision against the interests of your party.
14:58This can work in a system where you start having, prior to the elections, a single person nominated with no
15:05contest by any party, pre-nominated, that he will be the speaker after the election.
15:10This used to happen in the very old days in England.
15:13That you had Mr. X saying, look, he will be made to stand from this place.
15:16Nobody will contest and he will be the speaker.
15:18That gives strength and power.
15:20He is a non-political party person, non-partisan.
15:24Today, I am not talking of any particular body.
15:26I am saying presiding officers necessarily, in every context, can never decide these things in favor of the party, against
15:35the party which has appointed them.
15:37So, depending on whether you are the complainant or the incumbent, you know, these things will happen.
15:44And therefore, I have called for a repeal, a single four-line thing saying, you must leave your post, fight
15:49re-election, otherwise you are out.
15:51But, Mr. Singh, you have used a very interesting term on the show, that is, shell party.
15:57NCPI is lesser known, doesn't have a single MLA, MP.
16:02Very little is known about this political party, but in case if the speaker allows, then overnight it will get
16:1020 MPs.
16:13My question…
16:13Yes, go ahead, sir.
16:15Go ahead, sir.
16:15Please go ahead.
16:16No, no, go on, go on, finish your question.
16:17So, my question then is, isn't there some kind of category then of a political party, definition of a political
16:25party, if anti-defection law has to not apply?
16:29Clearly, you see, the law is not supposed to be an ass.
16:31And in this NCPI example, I think we are all making it an ass.
16:36The NCPI is not even the last hair on the tail of the dog.
16:41The dog is the TMC breakaway group.
16:46Now, the NCPI is supposed to wag the dog.
16:49That's just not possible.
16:50It's a shell.
16:52It's just something picked up on the roadside.
16:54I can pick up 20 such parties across India and merge myself with them.
16:58I think that the contemplation of the 10th schedule, the relevant para, which opens with the sentence political party, was
17:05that the main political party, the undivided, the original party, intends to merge with somebody else.
17:14And, cumulatively, two-thirds of the party approves such merger.
17:19Now, that has to happen first and foremost by the undivided TMC or the original TMC making the merger move.
17:26And then, these two-thirds walking away and approving that.
17:29That has not happened here.
17:31So, that's the only reasonable interpretation of the 10th schedule.
17:35Otherwise, it becomes an ass.
17:36It means that you effectively have only one test, not two tests.
17:40The one test is two-thirds walking away.
17:42The first test of a political party merging with a new party becomes non-existent because you just pick up
17:47any party by the roadside and say, I merge with that.
17:51You know, Mr. Singhvi, in this particular case, there are two chapters of rebellion playing out.
17:58One in the state, another one at the center.
18:00One in the assembly, another one in the Lok Sabha.
18:02In the Lok Sabha, these 20 MPs have submitted a letter to the speaker that they want to merge with
18:08this lesser-known party called the NCPI.
18:10In the state, they are claiming that they are the real TMC.
18:14There's a clear contradiction.
18:16There is no concept in the 10th schedule of a real TMC.
18:20There is no concept in the 10th schedule of sitting apart as a separate new block.
18:25They're disqualified.
18:26It's as simple as that.
18:28Because mere two-thirds moving away is not enough to exempt you.
18:33The first condition is not satisfied.
18:36So, clearly, that is wrong.
18:38I've been saying this for many weeks now, for many days.
18:41Now we come to the central.
18:44Central, I've told you, yes, they are trying to do a superficial lip service or a fig leaf of a
18:52pretense of complying with the 10th schedule first part.
18:56But that's a fig leaf.
18:58It's a pretense.
18:59It really means that the main TMC should have resolved that we want to merge with another party.
19:05And then thereafter, in the light of that decision of the main party, which is non-existent today, two-thirds
19:12approve it and move on.
19:15I have just one last question to you, Mr. Singhvi.
19:18This is with regards to what is the future of All India Trinamul Congress of Mamata Banerjee.
19:26Look, nobody can be an accurate astrologer for this.
19:30But my comment, I think it's a fair comment, is number one, there are very few agitational politicians of the
19:41caliber and the quality of Mamata Banerjee.
19:44There are very few politicians in the country who have that connect on the grassroots, and that's the meaning of
19:52Trinamul, by the way, grassroots, with the people.
19:56So I think it would be a grave error to write off Mamata Banerjee.
20:00It will be a grave error to consign her to the dustbin of history.
20:05Yes, these are hard, tough times.
20:09I would not be surprised that as time goes, and she is consistent and pushes hard and bounces back.
20:16A lot of these very turncodes whom you see might start regretting their decision or might start finding ways back.
20:25But that's for the future, it's in the womb of the future, and I'm no astrologer.
20:28But I think it's a grave error to assume that a major, major setback, howsoever major.
20:34And you have had in politics many cases of much, even much more major setbacks, where people have recovered.
20:41All right, Dr. Abhishek Manu Singh.
20:42Indira Gandhi is the best example.
20:44Yes, Dr. Abhishek Manu Singh, we always have a pleasure speaking to you, sir.
20:47Thank you for that perspective on politics and also on the legalese behind this.
20:53Joining me now is a senior advocate of the Supreme Court, Mahesh Jaitmalani.
20:57Mr. Jaitmalani, you represented Eknath Shinde in the Supreme Court.
21:01The rebels here are using the same playbook, two-thirds of the legislature party, merger root, speaker's door.
21:08You said then that democratic aberration, to quote you, should meet its Waterloo in Bengal too.
21:15Is this that moment, and does the law support it?
21:22Well, Maria, the situations between the Shiv Sena episode in 2022 and the present episode are quite distinct.
21:34First, in that case, there was a sitting government which broke, and that has some impact.
21:40And secondly, more important, at least the legislature party of the Lok Sabha, of the TMC, right, has decided to
21:51merge into a new party.
21:53They are availing of a different route altogether, which I think is the least contentious route, and it's safe harbour,
22:00as I've said before.
22:02Mr. Jaitmalani, TMC is citing the 2023 Constitution bench judgment against the rebels,
22:08that a valid merger needs the political party itself to merge, not just MPs.
22:13Here, Abhishek Banerjee's letter to the Speaker makes exactly this argument.
22:17As the lawyer who argued the Shinde side, is TMC's legal reading correct then?
22:27No. Fortunately, Abhishek Banerjee, or whoever has instructed him to write that letter, advised him to write that letter,
22:35is not the last word in the law.
22:38There is a clause, Clause 4, which deals specifically with the case of merger, right?
22:44In the Shiv Sena case, please remember that there's a distinction, that the Shiv Sena was not claiming to merge
22:51with another party.
22:52The Shiv Sena was saying, we are the original party.
22:56So please keep that aside.
22:57That's a distinct set of circumstances.
22:59What is happening here is that a fresh election has shown up a split in a losing party, right?
23:07And that makes it altogether different because that losing party now, at least some of them,
23:14have decided that they're not going to claim to be the original political party, right?
23:19They are saying that we are going to join, we're going to merge with another entity, right?
23:25Called the NCPI in the Northeast.
23:28That's what they say, right?
23:29That puts the situation out of the Shiv Sena type of case law.
23:34Because now, you are governed by Clause 4, which deals with mergers of the 10th schedule, right?
23:42Clause 4 has a subsection, Clause 4-2, which unequivocally says that the original party shall be deemed to be,
23:53right?
23:56Any party, any political, the original political party, which is the word in use, right, shall be deemed to be
24:02those members of a house, right, who constitute two-thirds of the legislature party, right?
24:11So the legislature party is what counts in the case of a merger, right?
24:16And the legislature party has also been defined on the 10th schedule.
24:19And the legislature party is the members of a legislature of a house.
24:25So strictly speaking, right, four houses can act differently because you have a legislative council, you have the legislative assembly,
24:33you have the Rajasaba and you have the Lokasaba.
24:36Strictly speaking, on a strict construction of the burning of 4-3, you can have four different outcomes, right?
24:43As far as I know, one has taken the perfectly non-contentious right-in-law route, it decided to go
24:52for a merger, they are not getting into party structure, etc.
24:55And they are abandoning all that, you know, a very discredited TMC brand, right?
25:03Good thing, I think.
25:05Make a fresh start.
25:07Mr. Jidmilani, the NCPI here got 822 combined votes in the 2023 Tripura elections.
25:1620 TMC MPs are now merging with it, within quotes, merging.
25:22Doesn't this expose a fundamental absurdity, I would say, in the anti-defection law,
25:27that you can shelter 20 elected MPs in a party that has no electoral existence whatsoever?
25:37Although I have done many anti-defection law cases, I am a conscientious critic of the anti-defection law.
25:45I think that the anti-defection law has completely proved to be a burden on our court system.
25:54I think that, you know, it's made the courts enter into the political ticket, right?
26:00I think it's taken up a lot of judicial time.
26:03And I think that you can't control these kind of...
26:06And inevitably, this was supposed to be an anti-defection law.
26:0990% of the cases that have taken place, right, have supported the defectors.
26:1590% of the judicial defectors.
26:17So what are we talking about?
26:19There's no...
26:19And frankly, you know, when this matter was first challenged,
26:23the constitutionality was first challenged in the Supreme Court, right?
26:25My father had appeared many years ago, right?
26:27And I remember, he was a conscientious objector to the whole thing.
26:30He was saying you're curbing the freedom of action and freedom of conscience of an individual legislator.
26:37So what you are saying, for instance, in the merger case, right,
26:40is that you can defect in bulk, but you can't defend if you're one person.
26:46Mass defection is good.
26:48Single defection, bad.
26:51Troubish!
26:51According to me, this law leads a serious relook.
26:54It's a political issue, right?
26:56It should be left to the politicians to deal with it, unless it's a case of corruption.
27:00If you have proof that people are defecting for money,
27:04punish them and make the punishment serious.
27:06That's a bane of our system.
27:08But this, you know, takes it in sweet, all kinds of things.
27:12For instance, there can be serious ideological differences.
27:15You can seriously agree your conscience revolts against a particular stand taken by the leadership of your party.
27:23There can be a challenge to leadership, right, which can't be resolved.
27:28The existing leadership taken cudgels against by a challenger, right?
27:32And he has the numbers, but he can't do anything about it.
27:36Okay, couple of more questions here, sir.
27:38Another legal view is that the Speaker rules for rebels,
27:41courts take three years and politics moves on.
27:43You know that's true.
27:45You have seen that in Maharashtra.
27:47So isn't the NCPI merger less a constitutional argument
27:50and more a time-buying device that BJP has now perfected twice?
27:57Why are you saying the BJP?
27:59What has the BJP got to do with this?
28:0120 MPs, right, had chosen to join an entity, right?
28:06Now, where is the proof that the BJP has recommended this?
28:09Again, you know, somebody makes...
28:12We are very used to this loose talk every time the opposition takes a defeat, right?
28:18Or doesn't have the wherewithal as to how to handle a situation,
28:22which is quite often nowadays, right?
28:24They start attacking institutions or the party concern, the BJP right now.
28:28All right, these people have gone.
28:30Who's...
28:30Where is the real illness lie in this?
28:33The real illness lie is that you have no real ideology in these parties.
28:37That's the root cause of the matter.
28:39Face it!
28:42Mr. Mahir Jitmulani, pleasure speaking to you.
28:44Thank you for your views and thank you for your time here on India Today.
28:47We are putting out those two interviews on our website
28:50and also on our YouTube channel.
28:52That's all from me.
28:53I'll be seeing you tomorrow.
28:54Thanks so much for watching.
28:55Bye-bye.
28:55Bye-bye.
28:55Bye-bye.
28:55Bye-bye.
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