- 2 months ago
The Trinamool Congress (TMC) in West Bengal faces a severe internal crisis as sixty-one out of eighty legislators skipped a crucial legislative meeting in Kolkata.
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00:00Good evening, you're watching NewsTrack with me, Maria Shaquille.
00:04First, the Marti slipped away, then the Manush, or the voter, voted for change.
00:10And now the tremors are being felt inside the Trenmul Congress itself.
00:14Mamata Banerjee is no longer just battling a resurgent BJP.
00:18She's fighting dissent, desertions, and growing disquiet within her own ranks.
00:24In fact, the TMC Supremo has expelled two-party MLAs, even as there is intense talk of mutiny within Mamata's
00:32ranks.
00:33Sandeepan Saha and Ritabrata Banerjee are the two MLAs who were expelled.
00:39A day after, nearly 61 out of 80 TMC MLAs skipped a crucial legislative party meeting in Kolkata.
00:47And amidst rising turmoil, the question now is, can Didi keep her flock together?
00:52And has saving TMC become Mamata Banerjee's biggest challenge now?
00:59Before I bring in the guests, here's a report on what really unfolded and has unfolded so far.
01:27Mati and Manush gone.
01:34And she is now facing a mutiny.
01:39Mamata Banerjee has already lost Bengal, but her biggest battle may be beginning now.
01:46Not against the BJP, but within the TMC itself.
01:51What started as an electoral drubbing is rapidly snowballing into a full-blown crisis for the party.
02:01It all began with Kakoli Ghosh Tostidar stepping down from a key organisational post,
02:07blaming misgovernance within the party and IPAC for the TMC's electoral washout.
02:13She then went a step further and attended an administrative meeting chaired by West Bengal Chief Minister Suvendu Adhikari.
02:20But that was just the tip of the iceberg.
02:24Soon, the spotlight shifted to a series of attacks on senior TMC leaders.
02:31On Saturday, party No. 2, Abhishek Banerjee came under attack in Sonarpur.
02:40Eggs were hurled.
02:45Stones were thrown.
02:50Less than 24 hours later, Kalyan Banerjee was allegedly injured during a confrontation in Hooghly while protesting against the attack
02:58on Abhishek.
02:59While opposition parties condemned the incidents, questions began emerging from within the TMC itself.
03:09In a strongly worded social media post, Kunal Ghosh questioned why many leaders had failed to condemn the attack or
03:16publicly stand by Abhishek Banerjee.
03:19Amid the growing unease, Mamata Banerjee called a meeting at her Kalighat residence.
03:25It was meant to be a show of strength. Instead, it exposed the cracks.
03:29Nearly 60 of the party's 80 MLAs skipped the meeting, forcing it to be called off.
04:09The TMC insists the absent legislators were leading protests on the ground and standing by party workers.
04:19To regain the narrative, the party has launched a fresh political offensive.
04:24Ward-level protests were held on Monday.
04:27And on Tuesday, Mamata Banerjee plans to lead a symbolic sit-in at Kolkata's Esplanade.
04:35A protest that is yet to receive official permission.
04:40Didi alleges the BJP is attempting to engineer a rebellion within her ranks.
04:46The three congressmen have been forced to give the police.
04:50Even the police have been told that they have been forced to do this.
04:57But the troubles don't end there.
05:00The party has suspended two newly elected MLAs, Sandeepan Shah and Ritabrata Banerjee, over alleged anti-party activities.
05:09The party has taken a decision. I still believe that I am a soldier of the party.
05:14So anyhow, the party has taken a decision. I won't challenge the decision of the party.
05:17The party is supreme always.
05:20The move came after Chief Minister Suvindu Adikari claimed the two legislators has raised concerns
05:26over allegedly forged signatures on a party letter backing appointment of Sovandeb Chattopatthaya
05:32as leader of the opposition.
05:35Honourable Chief Minister of Australia has stated that two of our members, namely Ritabrata Banerjee
05:43and another is Sandeepan Shah.
05:46Shaha, both of them wrote a letter to the speaker stating that there are number of member signatures
05:53is there. Those who have not signed in the menacebook. Menacebook. Menacebook. Not later. Menacebook.
06:05The CIT is now probing the claims of forgery.
06:08A team of investigators also reached TMC MP Abhishek Banerjee's residence to get his signature
06:14on a notice.
06:16Remember, all this comes days after a mass exodus of 127 councillors across 11 civic bodies.
06:24The TMC has already lost control of six municipal boards.
06:28Leaders are quitting. MLAs are skipping meetings.
06:33Councillors are walking out.
06:36And the cracks are getting harder to hide.
06:39For over a decade, Mamata Banerjee's greatest strength was that the party moved when Didi
06:44spoke.
06:50Today, the authority appears under strain.
06:55Is Mamata Banerjee fighting the opposition or is she fighting to keep the TMC from turning
07:01on itself?
07:04With Indrajit Kundu, Aastha Bhardwaj, Bureau Report, India Today.
07:13Several chapters perhaps happening simultaneously in Bengal is the TMC unravelling.
07:20Joining me on the show tonight, Shahzad Poonawala, national spokesperson of the BJP.
07:24We have Manujit Mandal, political analyst, someone who is seen as pro TMC.
07:28Maidul Islam is political analyst as well.
07:30Maidul Islam, is this the repeat of 2011?
07:36Yes and no.
07:38Yes is that there is an implosion going on, but the implosion was slow within the left front
07:50in 2011.
07:52It took eight years from 2011 to 2019 for the left to completely be decimated.
08:00Whereas here, the implosion is very fast.
08:05It's happening very fast, precisely because the left at least had an ideology which combined
08:10several sections of the population, whereas the Trinamul didn't have an ideology.
08:14Only very recently, I think in an interview, Abhishek said that their ideology was welfareism.
08:19But the welfareism was actually coming out from the power or the absolute power that
08:24actually corrupt absolutely.
08:27And that has happened.
08:29And this kind of forgery or this kind of corruption, there was a limit to everything
08:34and people thought that the last 15 years this was going on.
08:38So this kind of implosion was about to happen.
08:40And I must also add that, you know, given the pedagogical training of Momota and Abhishek.
08:46Remember, Momota was forged her doctorate degree of 1984-85 from a university in the
08:52US which never existed.
08:53Whereas in Abhishek Banerjee's pedagogical training was in Indian Institute of Public Planning
08:58and Management, which is absolutely a fraudster, you know, place which the UGC never recognized.
09:06So I don't know whether this kind of pedagogical training and this history of going to this
09:12kind of fraudster institutions actually had an impact in the very everyday practices of
09:18the party because the party was never democratized.
09:22It was never structured properly.
09:24And this was about to happen.
09:26Okay.
09:27So you saw this coming and it is happening.
09:29So Manujit Mandal, 61 MLAs do not turn up when the party boss called them for an urgent meeting.
09:39It's very clear that TMC is imploding.
09:43Do you think that Momota Banerjee can continue to say that all is well and blame it on the BJP?
09:52First of all, these quote-unquote forged, you know, autocratic, undemocratic political party
10:00was responsible in decimating one of the biggest regimes in the world, the left regime.
10:06And then successfully holding power for three consecutive terms.
10:13And even in 2024, nobody was speaking about these things in the party, right?
10:19You know, there are only one or two persons in the party.
10:22These things happen.
10:23Even in most democratic party, like BJP, dare I say, only a few people recall the sorts.
10:31There is a structure, of course.
10:33There is a structure.
10:33They follow more democratic structure than any other party.
10:36But, you know, ultimately, there is a coterie.
10:39There is, I mean, the first among the equals who take, you know, all the decisions.
10:45Even in the United States of America, who is taking the decisions?
10:49It's only one, you know, madman who is taking the decision and holding the whole world into ransom.
10:55So I think these are quite natural for this kind of charismatic leader.
10:59And if you say that Mamata Banerjee was not a charismatic leader, she has forged her degree, then I think
11:04you are not really a political historian.
11:07In fact, Mauna Ji, you know, it's surprising.
11:10Maidul Islam is one of the biggest sympathizers of the TMC, you know, viewpoint, I would say now.
11:16Not an ideology, because he says that there is no ideology at all.
11:20So, you know, why attack him, respect him?
11:23I'm not attacking him.
11:25I'm asking him not to get break from the reality.
11:29I'm criticizing the party for the last three weeks, despite the fact that I have connections with the party.
11:35I'm saying the party was wrong.
11:38The party took a bad decision, including induction of this rotten orange or rotten egg Mr. Ritabat Banerjee.
11:46And surprisingly, when he was being inducted, I was asked my opinion from a very big, categorically said that he
11:51is a rotten egg.
11:51He, you know, kicked the, kicked this Ritabat.
11:54I can't, I can't name him because he's a very honorable member of the parliament.
11:58So I can't.
11:59So he kicked Mr. Amit Mitra.
12:01He was expelled from the left party.
12:03Now he's probably the only political leader in this state who was expelled from two political parties.
12:09And I hope, I, I believe my good friend Shahjad Pati will not take him in.
12:13Because he has, he doesn't have anything.
12:15I mean, I mean, he has got all kinds of other charges also.
12:17I mean, I'm not going into that detail.
12:19So Shahjad, here is an advice that is coming in from a TMC sympathizer to you.
12:24Don't induct any of those MLAs who are being expelled by Mamata Banerjee.
12:29Ten seconds.
12:30Ten seconds, Maria.
12:31There lies the problem, the TMC, all these people who are coming from outside the political party,
12:36especially from the left, on their shoulders, on their head.
12:39This is one of the problems.
12:40This is one of the problems in the party that I have been speaking about.
12:43Okay.
12:45Shahjad.
12:47First of all, Maria, we are very happy to focus on what we have promised to the people of West
12:52Bengal.
12:53That's good.
12:53These are the promises that were made to deliver justice to the Arjikar victims.
12:57So we got Devanaji into a disassembly.
13:00They have taken action on the cops.
13:02They have given free bus side to the women.
13:03They are trying to attack the industry.
13:05They are cracking down on law and order issues.
13:07And we are ensuring that the borders are safe by handing over the land to BSF.
13:10And today is a very big day.
13:12And we should all be talking about Kalita Maji being made a minister.
13:15A woman from the most humble background.
13:17Today getting the force and getting the power.
13:20So that is what we want to talk about.
13:21Having said that, let me just explain and take the point that Maidulji was making,
13:26a very serious point he was making.
13:28The difference between BJP and the other regional personality driven parties, Maria,
13:32and you have covered politics for so long.
13:34I have also interned at one point.
13:37You would know that there is an ideology and cadre based party of BJP.
13:41And therefore even when BJP goes out of power with ideology and the cadre keep it united.
13:46And then there is the personality and power based party like TMC or Congress.
13:51Where it only depends if you are in power or if the personality is strong.
13:54And the moment personality becomes weak or power goes, then they start dissenting and they start disintegrating.
14:00And therefore you see today the level of leaders.
14:02Kakoli goes in Dratila.
14:04Then you have Sankar Hussein.
14:06Then you have Sukhenu Sekar Roy.
14:09Indranil Sain.
14:09Arup Chakraborty.
14:10Hundreds of corporators.
14:12All of them are willing to lead.
14:13And we have also seen that today this forgery of science that has been done by Abhishek Banerjee.
14:18So at least five MLA's.
14:19You have just shown a statement of two MLA's.
14:21Actually there are five MLA's who have come out and said that our signatures have been enforced.
14:25That is a very big offense.
14:26And maybe 60 or 70 MLA's are actually there.
14:29Therefore the meeting today had to be cancelled.
14:30So today the long and short of it is that when you are only having dynastic based, power based, personality
14:37based parties.
14:38Then these things are bound to happen.
14:39Therefore they must all democratize and institutionalize the BJP.
14:43We don't need anybody's party on the gundas of left.
14:48BJP is a very full party.
14:50It is a party of great kare karta.
14:52No, but Shahzad.
14:53Shahzad.
14:54In the initial years also you gave place to every TMC dissenter.
15:00Mukul Roy.
15:01Late Mukul Roy.
15:01How do we forget him?
15:04Look.
15:06Including the chief minister.
15:07Yes.
15:08I'll tell you.
15:09See BJP has come from zero.
15:11To this place in West Bengal in the last 10-15 years.
15:15Lot of voters have also changed their affiliation from TMC.
15:18Core TMC voters are today voting for BJP.
15:21You would have never thought that these voters would vote for BJP.
15:23Similarly the leaders also want to sometimes, they have had an experience in the TMC.
15:28And therefore at some point of time when some leaders merited their inclusion, we took that.
15:33Nobody can say that people should now, once they have not had a good experience in the party, should not
15:39join the party.
15:39No, but not one.
15:40Multiple leaders.
15:41Of course.
15:42From the TMC.
15:43These were all those who left TMC, rebelled and joined the BJP, including the chief minister himself.
15:49Who was once upon a time a close aide of Mamata Banerjee.
15:54That's okay.
15:55There is no problem in that.
15:56Simply because there is a BJP ideology, core ideology.
16:00Somebody is now leaving the ideology of TMC, whatever it stands for, and is coming close to the BJP ideology
16:07and is sticking by that ideology.
16:08Why will not have to be welcomed then?
16:10We have welcomed the voters also.
16:12By that logic then we should never welcome the voters who have changed from TMC to BHP.
16:16Yes, but voters and politicians can't be placed in the same category, Shahzad.
16:24Why not?
16:26No, no, no, no.
16:28Voters, they vote on the basis of what you are proposing.
16:31And when a NETA switches sides, it is not necessarily on the basis of an ideology here.
16:39They may be switching sides on the basis of more opportunities as well.
16:43Maria, you are diagnosing the problem wrong.
16:45The problem is not a political party making space for another person or personality leaving A party or B party.
16:51The problem is why that original party is unable to retain.
16:55And the problem lies because there is no core ideology in NETA and NETA.
16:59Oh, I'll just give you one last example and then I will stop.
17:02Even before TMC lost power, you would have remembered, just 10 seconds, 10 seconds.
17:06You would remember the fight between Kalyan Banerjee and Mova Moitra?
17:09Yes.
17:09It was the fight between Abhishek camp and Mamata camp.
17:12Yes.
17:12Public display.
17:13Public display, yes.
17:14Exactly.
17:15That had nothing to do with BJP.
17:17BJP is nowhere.
17:18We are fulfilling our promises.
17:20Of course, we don't call it in the debate.
17:22No.
17:23No.
17:24No.
17:24Mauna Ji, you know the point here is also this, that it is TMC which is unravelling.
17:31One of the reasons why Shuvendu Adhikari, the present Chief Minister, quit TMC was because
17:38he was the one who mobilized the cadre, the people during the 2006-2007 movement.
17:44And then when it is about giving the place which was his due, a rightful place, only next
17:52to Mamata Banerjee.
17:53Mamata Banerjee chose the family.
17:55Chose her nephew, Abhishek Banerjee over someone who was perhaps a karekarta who has really worked
18:04his way up.
18:05So, what is essentially happening here is a rejection of a brand of politics which most
18:13of these parties have been associated with.
18:17No.
18:18First of all, you know, the TMC member of parliament are fighting among each other.
18:23That also speaks about their internal democracy.
18:25No, no, no.
18:25But now, not publicly.
18:28Each other, they were abusing each other and saying, you know, name calling which was happening.
18:33That's not really internal democracy for public display and consumption.
18:37Please.
18:38It looks quite bad, but nonetheless…
18:41It looks ugly.
18:42It's called washing of dirty linens in public domain.
18:46I can speak for myself when I had a connection with the party.
18:49I still have the connection with the party.
18:51The party has never dictated me the term that you can't criticize the party on TV.
18:54And I'm quite proud of that.
18:56That's what I'm saying.
18:57Now, coming back to the moot point here.
18:58I think there is a fundamental difference between Shubhandi Udhikari leaving TMC and Ritabharth
19:04Manarji joining TMC.
19:06Shubhandi Udhikari moves from… to take a reverse, you know, direction.
19:10From power to non-power.
19:12But Ritabharth Manarji comes to grab power.
19:16That is the difference.
19:17I know why Shubhandi Udhikari left, though he was holding 20 sports in the territory of
19:21government.
19:22He was a very important minister along with 27-4.
19:25But people know in this country why he had to go out of the party.
19:31Not because of Udhik Manarji only.
19:33Because of other reasons.
19:35Those reasons will never come out.
19:36Because now he's holding the power.
19:38But nonetheless, I would appreciate the fact that he at least left the power corridors
19:43to join a party which was not in power.
19:45Unlike these rotten eggs that you are showing on the team.
19:48TMC takes these people into the party fold.
19:51They do not need them.
19:52No, but you did not call them rotten eggs when you were in power.
19:55I do.
19:57I do.
19:58I do.
19:59I do always call them.
20:00And that's why I am not in any position of the party.
20:02Right?
20:02And I have no regret about that.
20:04I do.
20:05I have been with this party for the last 27 years.
20:0828 years.
20:09But I don't hold any post.
20:10Because I criticize the party even on TV.
20:13Right?
20:13Because I have got the right to present the party.
20:15So, you are accepting that because you criticize the TMC,
20:18that's the reason why TMC punished you.
20:21The TMC leadership punished you.
20:22And did not give you a party position.
20:24No, hang on.
20:25I...
20:26I...
20:26You see, I was...
20:28I'm quite, quite happy with that.
20:29I was made a spokesperson for Vanya.
20:31Then again dropped.
20:32And again I was made a spokesperson.
20:33Third time when I was given the offer, I said that's enough.
20:35I speak for the party.
20:36Okay, Shahzad wants to say something to you.
20:38Shahzad, please go ahead.
20:40What do you have to tell Monajit?
20:42You look very concerned, Shahzad here.
20:45No, no.
20:46I declare Monajit as the conscience keeper of TMC or whatever is left of it.
20:50But I want to ask conscience keeper Monajit that Kakoli goes.
20:54And this is a very serious car.
20:55She's an MP.
20:56She has written in a handwritten note that Kalyan Balaji has made many abusive,
21:02misogynistic comments, etc. against her.
21:04Now I want to ask Mr. Conscience Keeper that whether it was RG Kar,
21:08whether it was Sandesh Kali or whether it was this case.
21:10The problem in the TMC is that you have allowed the entire TMC to become the mafia culture.
21:17And then because of Mamta Banalji's erratic politics,
21:20where she wanted only to promote her nephew,
21:22because of that you have allowed all these elements to prosper.
21:25And even the old women of TMC were now victimized.
21:29So I think now they should be churning within the TMC for the betterment of TMC.
21:36Monajit, you want to come in?
21:39For all said and done, in the last five, six years,
21:43Avisek Banerjee has remade himself into a good leader.
21:46You have to give a target.
21:47Two years ago, it is Avisek Banerjee and AIPAC who won the election,
21:52who decimated you.
21:54He was reduced to 12 from 18.
21:56Two years ago only, just two years ago.
21:58And now because he lost an election,
22:00I do not want to completely write him off, right?
22:03He has come a long way.
22:05He is an extremely articulate person.
22:08He speaks all the three languages quite well.
22:10You have seen it when he was, you know,
22:11visiting the foreign countries as a delegate, parliamentary delegation.
22:14We all know that.
22:15So give the due that is, you know,
22:17give the credit that is due from Mr. Banerjee.
22:19Coming back to Conscience Keeper,
22:21Ms. Ghosh Dastidhar was also seen taking money along with Shubhandi Hudikani.
22:25I defended them since 2020, 2016.
22:28I will defend them now even.
22:30That was a conspiracy.
22:32That was a sting operation.
22:33That was a conspiracy.
22:34Because most of the leaders who are seen taking money are still with the TNC.
22:39I defended Mr. Azikari till 2020.
22:41I am defending him now as I am defending other people.
22:43Manajit is visibly angry and he is revealing lots of secrets here, Shahzad.
22:48I am not.
22:49What I have said on TV, that's what I am saying.
22:52I have defended all the political leaders who are,
22:55we are part of this conspiracy.
22:57You know the problem with Conscience Keepers is,
22:59Monajit, as you said,
23:00you have been associated with the TNC for 27 years.
23:04The party did not really give you any position.
23:07But I have no regret.
23:09I have no regret.
23:09You may not have regret.
23:11I have my job.
23:11I have no regret.
23:12You were made spokesperson for your year.
23:16Then you were removed as a spokesperson.
23:18I have no problem with that.
23:19I write books which are taught in university.
23:22For universities, I have no problem with that.
23:25Okay, Shahzad.
23:25Let us expand the debate a little bit more than Monajit.
23:30And I wish Monajit luck if you want to join Sandeepan Saha and Subhashi Zas also.
23:34No way.
23:35No way.
23:36Never.
23:37Never say never.
23:39Monajit is not the issue.
23:41Monajit is not the issue.
23:42Monajit accuses a larger problem.
23:44And the problem that we need to address is that these are personality-driven, dynastic-driven parties.
23:50And these parties are not institutional parties like the BJP.
23:53BJP has lost so many elections.
23:55You have covered BJP so much.
23:57You please tell me, even when we have lost election after election,
24:00the party then goes to the new leadership from Atal Gyari Vajpayee to right up to Nitin Naveen.
24:05It takes a hard call.
24:06Even Advani Ji lost the election.
24:08We then moved on from Advani Ji.
24:09And we had a leadership like Nadeem Ramothi.
24:12And even Amit Shah Ji and Nanda Ji have made way for Nitin Naveen.
24:15They have only one election.
24:17Why they made way?
24:18So, the point is, BJP is an institutional democratic party.
24:22These parties are not institutional and democratic.
24:24So, please, therefore they have to reform.
24:27This is Gen Z era.
24:28Gen Z has zero tolerance for all these nepo-kits.
24:31They don't have to do anything.
24:32They don't have to do anything.
24:33The Gen Z is not accepting.
24:35Okay, so if the Gen Z is rejecting this kind of politics,
24:39because...
24:39No.
24:40No, no, no.
24:41But, Manu Ji, let's not forget.
24:42I mean, the BJP has won with a landslide.
24:46And with...
24:46No, no, no.
24:47With a vote share of 46%.
24:49Correct me, Shahzad.
24:51And that kind of a vote share actually means it's a huge number.
24:54Abhishek Banerjee won TMC election in 2021 and 2024.
24:592021, the most difficult election from Mamata Banerjee because all the big political leaders of the party left, including the
25:07present chief minister.
25:08But that election was won by Mamata Banerjee and Abhishek Banerjee together, along with IPAC.
25:13Yes, IPAC made mistake.
25:15Yes, IPAC should have done what they have done.
25:17But that doesn't discount the fact that both these leaders are still holding...
25:21No, but there is something going horribly wrong with the TMC.
25:24That's evident.
25:26If the party boss invites...
25:28In fact, I would say it's a diktat that all MLAs must be present in an important meeting which is
25:34going to be chaired by Mamata Banerjee.
25:36How is it possible that the two-third of them do not appear?
25:39So, if that is the case, that is the case, Maidul Islam, is the TMC then heading towards perhaps its
25:49worst face ever?
25:52Yes.
25:52And also, then we should not be even surprised that by 2029, the looks of our elections and then the
26:02assembly elections which will follow,
26:05will TMC be actually the party which will be the primary opposition party or the challenger to the BJP at
26:11all?
26:11Or do you think that space will then go back to the real ideological party which is the left?
26:18It will become like a left versus right battle because the Trinamul Congress, as you said, doesn't really have an
26:25ideology.
26:28Yeah, I would just, first of all, correct you as a professor of political science.
26:32First of all, this whole entire TMC.
26:35From 1998, the TMC was actually Tamil Manila Congress.
26:39You know, the only thing is that it's West Bengal, Trinamul Congress, the WTC in 1998.
26:45And then the 1999, also all India Trinamul called AITC.
26:49That's a technical thing.
26:50I didn't hear much from Mr. Shahzad Punawala, who was once with the Congress party and then turned court to
26:57the BJP.
26:58But in politics, I think that happens.
27:00The main point coming to the, coming to your point, is that 2006, Trinamul was at its lowest in 30
27:08seats.
27:09So, Gota Rai won from a bipolar to become the one of the LOP.
27:15The, and then 2006, the mom that came back.
27:20So, she also had this fight back, you know, sorry.
27:2630 seats, 30 seats she got.
27:28Pato Chati was at the LOP.
27:30Correct.
27:31Pato Chati was at the LOP, but Shoghata Rai won as a kind of a bipolar.
27:37So, I just, I'm just, I'm just giving you an interview that the Shoghata Rai gave last, last night.
27:44The point is that 30 seats and then Mamata came back within five years.
27:49Actually, within three years, 2009, there was a Congress and the Trinamul Alliance.
27:53The point is that 50, they got 80 seats.
27:57So, two-third majority you need to completely break away.
28:02The last meeting yesterday, only 20 MLAs attended that meeting.
28:06So, that was one thing which is still, you know, is, I don't know what's happening now.
28:12In the Falta election, the CPM became second.
28:16The Trinamul was nowhere.
28:18It got fourth position.
28:20So, I think there's a lot of, a lot of churning happening in the opposition space.
28:25Look, in the ideologically, the Buddha de Bhattacharya brand of politics was actually the right-wing politics.
28:31They wanted the neoliberal model of development.
28:33And the Trinamul actually captured the arsehole left space.
28:37Now, this left space was dominant.
28:39Now, today, after the BJP came back and they're having this whole agenda of big money coming in, big capital
28:46coming in, completely demolition drive.
28:48This is a kind of proper, what you call the developmental rightist kind of program.
28:53So, the left space is open.
28:55Now, this is in the left space as an opposition.
28:57Traditionally, the opposition space has to be left, technically because the opposition always sits on the left of the speaker
29:04in the house.
29:05The point is that whether the CPM or the Trinamul, who will eventually gain and in the opposition space, that's
29:15something we have to still wait for the next two, three years.
29:17You have a, you have a municipality elections in December or maybe January next year.
29:23Or, and then the, and the 2028, your panchayat elections.
29:26And finally, you have the 2029 low survey elections.
29:29So, until then, this whole churning in the opposition space, West Bengal will notice.
29:34Okay, so what's going to happen next? I have 30 seconds each for Shahzad Poonawala and Manajit Mandal. Manajit, will
29:40you go first?
29:43I think, I think it's quite, quite possible for Mamatadi and Abhishek to come back.
29:47You know, remember they have 42 MPs, many of them are not rebelling, only one or two are, you know,
29:51singing different kind of tunes.
29:52They still have 100 plus municipal bodies and all the, you know, panchayat, all the Jilla Parishat.
29:57So, I think they should get their acts right, they should ask the cadders to act.
30:01And remember, they have got 40% of the votes and BJP is only 5% ahead of them.
30:06And again, one more thing, the people who are out of the voting voters list because of SIR, the TMC
30:12should be standing firmly behind them.
30:14What makes you think that all of them are TMC supporters?
30:17They should be brought back on the electoral rolls as soon as possible.
30:19All those who have their names in the adjudication, what makes you think that they are some TMC supporters only?
30:26I'm not saying that, but TMC should be standing firmly behind them to rope them in.
30:32So, BJP should also stand firmly with them, Shahzatunawalla?
30:35BJP is not doing that. That should be one of the major reasons for the movement.
30:38That should be one of the major reasons for the movement. Mind you, 3.8 million, they have every 3
30:43.8 million.
30:46It's the size of a small state.
30:50Yes, Monojiit.
30:52I will send Monojiit a good, strong brand of coffee, then you can smell the coffee and wake up.
30:58First point. Point number two, Maidulji made a little bit of...
31:00I'm happy with water. I'm happy with water, not the coffee.
31:03I'm happy with water. So, listen, Rijitra.
31:07It's like Maidulji made a little bit of a comment on me.
31:10Maidulji, even Mamata Banalji came from Congress to TMC.
31:14And even if you know, Hergaywalji was in Congress and he from Narasim.
31:17So, we all have a right to go into a political view which matches our ideologies rather than stain...
31:22I can't hear you. There's a systemic glitch, I guess. I can't hear the studio audience.
31:27And the last point that I want to make, I slightly differ from what Maidulji said about opposition space.
31:33Actually, the opposition space is a space of political politics.
31:37And that is now that one vote bank, there are many claimants for it.
31:40There is Congress, there is the ISF, there is more extremist Islamist groups and then there is TMC.
31:48Whereas the nationalist point of view, there is only one claimant, that is the BJP.
31:52And this is the consolidation of the nationalist vote which the opposition people are not understanding.
31:56Okay. Yes. Because I've been on the ground, Shahzad, I would agree with you.
32:01This is indeed about nationalism pitch of the BJP.
32:06As much as multiple analysts would say that this is consolidation of Hindu vote bank,
32:11this was also about nationalism as the big umbrella that the BJP wanted to pitch in this election.
32:18And they certainly had that convince the people of Bengal.
32:22So, Shahzad Poonawal, I appreciate your time. Thank you so much for your time here on the show.
32:25So, Manujit Mandal, Maidul Islam, thank you for joining us on the show tonight.
32:29We now turn to another big story, the Iran conflict.
32:32A fragile ceasefire now appears to be under severe strain as the US and Iran continue to exchange strikes and
32:40barbs.
32:40Reports also suggest that Washington has sent back Iran's latest proposal with some suggested changes.
32:48Meanwhile, Israel continues its military operations in southern Lebanon and has reportedly taken control of Burkfort Castle.
32:58Iran media is now reporting that Tehran will halt negotiations with the US and has vowed to completely block the
33:05Strait of Hormuz.
33:06So, where is this conflict headed? Is peace in the region still a distant prospect?
33:12Before I bring in my colleague Pranev Padya and other guests, here's the report.
33:24Amid talks to find an amicable solution to the US-Iran crisis and efforts to lessen the economic burden on
33:31the global economy,
33:32the US carried out what it calls self-defense strikes on Iranian radar and drone sites in the city of
33:39Goruk and the island of Kashmir.
33:44This comes as President Donald Trump said he is close to a very good deal with Iran.
33:49But the reports in US media suggest that Trump had made changes to a proposed deal and sent it back
33:55to Iran with tougher terms.
33:58Kuwait, too, has reported hostile missile and drone attacks which were intercepted as sirens sounded across the country.
34:05Saudi Arabia has strongly condemned Iran's repeated and malicious attacks following the Iran strikes.
34:14Iran's IRGC said it launched a retaliatory strike on a base it claims was used for an attack on its
34:21Syriq island.
34:24Footage released by Iranian media showed a sticker depicting a bruised US President Donald Trump
34:29and a text reading until the last American soldier leaves the region.
34:38Iranian Foreign Ministry said ceasefire violations indicate misconduct and bad faith of the US.
34:45Meanwhile, Foreign Minister Sayyad Abbas Arachi in a tweet reiterated that the ceasefire between Tehran and Washington
34:52is unequivocally a ceasefire on all fronts, including in Lebanon.
35:05One of the obstacles to negotiations with the current US administration is precisely the frequent changes in positions
35:12and contradictory and conflicting statements.
35:15This situation undoubtedly disrupts the process and makes the path longer.
35:21This is the minimum that can be said about the outcome of this approach in negotiations.
35:25These US actions are not merely violations of the ceasefire.
35:30They constitute an act of aggression and a violation of Article 2, Paragraph 4 of the United Nations Charter.
35:37They entitle and authorize us in line with the right of self-defense to undertake corresponding defensive measures.
35:44Today, we explicitly announced that we targeted the source of aggression.
35:56Earlier, top Iranian leadership said no agreement to end the war could be reached unless there was assurance that the
36:02rights of Iranian people were secured.
36:10The soldiers on the diplomatic front have absolutely no trust in enemy's words and promises.
36:17Our only criteria is to achieve tangible results before we fulfill our own commitments in return.
36:23Until we are certain that the rights of the Iranian people have been secured, we will not approve any agreement.
36:30The guarantee behind this strategy is our own lives, which we hold in our hands, ready to sacrifice for the
36:37people of Iran.
36:43Following the strikes and counter strikes, Revolutionary Guard fast attack boats are conducting routine patrols in the Strait of Hormuz.
36:52The report stated that these patrols are carried out day and night on a regular basis.
36:57According to reports, 15 ships, including four oil tankers have passed the Strait of Hormuz in past 24 hours.
37:09While the US continues to attack targeted sites in Iran, Israeli troops seized 900 years old Buford Castle in southern
37:17Lebanon.
37:21It was the first time Israel had held the site since May 2000, when Israel withdrew its troops from southern
37:28Lebanon after 18 years.
37:31The advancement has granted Israeli troops a vantage point over much of southern Lebanon and northern Israel,
37:37from which attacks have been launched towards Israeli residential areas.
37:44The order has prompted people to flee from Beirut, with streets packed with traffic, creating chaos.
37:54Together with the Minister of Defence, I have instructed the IDF to strike terrorist targets in Beirut.
38:00There will not be a situation in which Hezbollah attacks our cities and our citizens and its terrorist headquarters in
38:08Beirut, in Dahiyeh, remains out of bounds.
38:11We are continuing to deepen our operational activity on the ground in southern Lebanon and are eliminating Hezbollah strongholds.
38:20Hezbollah is on the run. We are determined to restore security to the residents of the north, just as we
38:27did for the residents of the south.
38:33The strikes amid the fragile ceasefire has further surged the international oil prices in Asia.
38:42The gains reflect heightened market concerns over uncertainty surrounding the Strait of Hormuz.
38:49European shares opened lower, with prices of crude oil, a key resource for energy-deficient Europe, climbed more than 2%.
38:56With Mahashwet Alala, Bureau Report, India Today.
39:08And some piece of breaking news coming in now.
39:10Donald Trump has told US media that he has not heard from Iran on reports they are suspending talks.
39:16Donald Trump has said, and I quote him,
39:19I think we have been talking too much. If you want to know the truth, I think going silent would
39:25be very good.
39:26So, there is this threat, which has come in also from the US President, that they could go silent.
39:33So, does it mean then Pranay Upadhyay, who is joining me live, that is this a sign of perhaps stopping
39:42even talks with Iran?
39:45Maria, last 24 hours have been very turbulent for the entire West Asia.
39:49From Kuwait, to Lebanon, to Iran, to US CENTCOM activity in the region.
39:55Definitely there are worries, there are concerns about the return of hostilities and return of the armed conflict in the
40:01region and in a wider area.
40:03But President Donald Trump, you just read out his statement in response to the questions posed by the US media.
40:10He kind of downplayed this statement coming from Tehran, because Tehran strongly reacted to the Israeli offensive action in Lebanon.
40:20And in fact, Iranian Foreign Minister Sayyad Abbas Arraqchi said that if ceasefire, if in one condition or in one
40:28region the ceasefire is disrespected,
40:31then this is a total disrespect or violation of the entire ceasefire plan.
40:36Because you will recall, Maria, that Iran insisted that the ceasefire should be extended in the region of Lebanon for
40:44them to adhere.
40:45And that's why Iran is insisting that Israel should stop taking action against the Hezbollah and carrying out their military
40:54action in Lebanon.
40:55But President Donald Trump here not only downplayed this statement of Iran,
41:00but he also said that that does not mean that we are going to start bombing Iran again.
41:04It may take long, and we are already done with a lot of talking, so we may go silent for
41:11a while.
41:11But this silence might be a facade, a charade for some kind of strategic move because the US naval assets
41:18are there,
41:19US military assets are there, and he has confirmed that the US naval blockade will remain in the region.
41:26And in fact, they want Iran to bleed, which President Donald Trump said that Iran is bleeding in millions per
41:33day.
41:34Pranay, I appreciate your time. Thank you for joining us.
41:37And joining me now is Ishang Amir Ahmadi, who is the President of American-Iranian Council and also a professor
41:43at the Rutgers University.
41:45Professor Amir Ahmadi, given the positive memorandum for a 60-day ceasefire extension that includes, of course,
41:54the reopening of the Strait of Hormuz and, of course, the commitments on Iran's highly enriched uranium,
42:01what do you think are the biggest remaining obstacles to the final approval by both President Trump and also by
42:10the Iranian leadership?
42:11What is stopping them?
42:18Well, yes, I believe the real problem is that both sides want to front-load the other side.
42:29By front-loading, I mean both sides want the other side to start implementing whatever agreement they have.
42:42Because of Iran's total distrust of the United States,
42:51Iran doesn't want, for example, to open the Strait and then wait for its assets to be released.
43:02On the other hand, Mr. Trump has a serious problem in releasing Iran's assets before Iran has made any move.
43:12And, of course, the U.S. speaks the language of power, but Tehran speaks the language of mistrust.
43:23So here, the power and the mistrust are facing each other and creating this obstacle.
43:32You're talking about, perhaps, mistrust creating this obstacle.
43:37But here is, you know, a U.S. president who continues to voice optimism for diplomacy.
43:45He took to Truth Social and has said that despite another exchange of airstrikes over the weekend,
43:51Iran wants to make a deal, he has advised critics to sit back and relax saying it will all work
43:57out well in the end.
43:58But there are also the Iranian media.
44:01The Iranian media outlets, the news outlets, which are talking about the IRGC,
44:08which is saying that the regime is suspending indirect talks with the U.S. and opening other fronts in the
44:15war.
44:15So these are completely opposite interpretations of the ongoing talks.
44:24Well, first, Mr. Trump is right.
44:28Iran is interested and willing to make an agreement.
44:35There is no question about it.
44:37They have very openly expressed their interest and they have been negotiating toward an agreement.
44:45So, Mr. Trump is right, saying Iran is very much interested in an agreement.
44:52The problem, as I said, is not in that trust.
44:57It's not on this interest.
45:01The problem is, Mr. Trump wants Iran to capitulate on the who goes first.
45:14Again, it's a front-loading problem.
45:19The U.S. wants, you are interested.
45:24Okay, I am interested.
45:26Okay, go ahead and open the strait.
45:29And Iran says, well, I am interested, but I want to first, my assets will be released.
45:36I don't trust you.
45:37Again, the bottom line is not that either side is lying.
45:42I think Iran is interested, United States is interested in a deal, but both sides have a problem to start.
45:53Each side wants the other side to take the first step.
45:57That is the issue.
45:59So, Professor, here is the IRGC, which is saying that it would be activating other fronts, including Babel Mandib straight,
46:09because both sides have accused each other of ceasefire violations.
46:16Well, both sides have accused each other of the ceasefire violation.
46:23Indeed, if you look at it carefully, it is the United States that has violated the ceasefire.
46:31Iran and the U.S. started at, let's say, point zero.
46:39At that point zero, Iran had the control or the closing of the strait in its hand.
46:49And then the United States went and closed the strait from the other side.
46:56That was the first violation of the ceasefire.
47:01In the meantime, Israel started bombing, you know, Lebanon.
47:08That was another instance of violating the ceasefire.
47:13So, and then, of course, Iran responded.
47:18So, but the issue, I think, is beyond who violated the ceasefire.
47:25The fact is, unless they come to a solution, the ceasefire will not last long.
47:32One month, two months, but at some point, the ceasefire either will end into a war or into a permanent
47:42peace.
47:43So, the ceasefire is a temporary, shaky situation.
47:50And both sides have to do everything in their power to make, to move beyond this ceasefire to a permanent
48:04solution.
48:04Which, in my view, would be to open up a direct talk for normalization of relationship and not focus so
48:17much on single issue matters.
48:21And, but to start with, they have to negotiate with a framework that they are trying to and come up
48:30with a solution with that, too.
48:32Okay, Professor, really appreciate your time.
48:34Thank you for joining us.
48:36Joining me now, from Washington, D.C., is Daniel Fried, who is the former U.S. Ambassador and Wiser Family
48:46Distinguished Fellow at the Atlantic Council.
48:49Ambassador Fried, I appreciate your time with the U.S. conducting the strikes on Iranian radar and drone strikes in
48:56southern Iran this past weekend, following Iran's downing of a U.S. drone.
49:01And the brinkmanship, which is continuing around the Strait of Hormuz, how stable do you see the current ceasefire?
49:09And what risks does this tit-for-tat escalation pose to reaching a possible, durable agreement?
49:23The ceasefire is obviously not stable.
49:26That is, if it's being violated, if both sides are launching military operations, the ceasefire is in question.
49:35That said, I think both Iran and the United States want to avoid going back to a full-scale conflict.
49:44They just are not quite ready to close a deal.
49:52They are both looking for advantage.
49:55Both sides are trying to test whether their position is stronger than the other side's position.
50:05The Iranians may believe that because the war is unpopular in the United States, which it is, and because the
50:13economic costs are high, which they are, that Trump doesn't want to go back to a full-scale conflict, and
50:22that he is eager, if not desperate, to settle, and therefore they can drive a better bargain.
50:26That seems to be the Iranian calculation.
50:31The U.S. calculation is that Iran may be hurting and may be under severe pressure internally, and that the
50:43U.S. should be prepared to wait it out and test the proposition whether we, in fact, the United States,
50:51in fact, has the leverage.
50:53Now, Trump is known for trying to bluff his way through.
51:02Even if Trump feels under pressure to settle the war, he also doesn't want to be seen as a loser.
51:09So, both sides want to avoid, as I said, want to avoid a full-scale conflict.
51:16They also want to avoid a deal which is less advantageous to them.
51:23So, you have this testing, probing, and pushing situation which could lead to escalation and unforeseen consequences, but may not.
51:34So, here we are, not full-scale war, not on the brink of peace either.
51:41So, Ambassador Frye, given your experience with sanctions and also with complex negotiations, how do you assess the current U
51:49.S.-Iran talks for extending the ceasefire and addressing nuclear issues at the Strait of Hormuz and also the regional de
51:57-escalation?
52:00Well, I'm not familiar with all of the details.
52:03I'm familiar with what has been in the press, and it has seemed to me, and I'm not alone, that
52:12where this was headed was toward some arrangement like the JCPOA of the Obama administration that Trump hates and continues
52:26to condemn, plus some arrangement on the Strait of Hormuz.
52:31Now, any arrangement of the Strait of Hormuz that gives Iran any say over it is a net loss for
52:39the United States and arguably a net loss for the world.
52:44Whether the United States can get a somewhat better deal on nuclear issues than the JCPOA, I don't know.
52:52It feels as if Trump is worried that accepting a deal only as good as or not even as good
53:03as the JCPOA will leave him exposed to attacks that he has lost, and those attacks would have merit under
53:11those circumstances.
53:12So, it is an awkward situation.
53:15Does Trump want to risk being seen as a loser, or does he want to risk an escalated war?
53:22That's all to his disadvantage.
53:25However, what I don't know is how badly the Iranians are hurting.
53:31Trump's claims of complete victory over them ring rather hollow, since their military capacity, it appears, has not been damaged
53:39as much as the U.S. claimed.
53:40But they do seem under considerable economic threat.
53:45I don't think they want to risk a return to war.
53:48So, we're in this awkward period, to use the American expression, where both sides are playing chicken.
53:55Okay, I have just enough time for my last question, Ambassador Frye.
53:58Does the Trump administration's mix of tougher proposals and then public optimism increase the chances of a pragmatic, out-of
54:09-the-possible deal, or does it actually risk further breakdown?
54:17Well, Trump can make a deal.
54:21He has the ability to bring along his political base and probably the ability to intimidate some of the Republican
54:33members of Congress who would otherwise reject a deal which is only as good as the JCPOA.
54:41But that's to be tested.
54:44When the details of the arrangement, if there is an arrangement, are made public, Trump will be tested.
54:53And I think he does not want to settle, to make a settlement that would leave him vulnerable.
55:03So, the risks are all there.
55:06But again, the chief unknown variable to me is what kind of shape Iran is in and what kind of
55:11pressure its regime or the different disparate elements of the regime feel how much pressure they feel under to get
55:21a deal.
55:22All right, Ambassador Daniel Frye, I'd really appreciate your time.
55:26Thank you for joining us here on India Today.
55:29That's all from me on this edition of the news track.
55:31I'll be seeing you tomorrow.
55:32Thanks so much for watching.
55:33Bye.
55:34Bye.
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