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00:19Are we rolling yet?
00:21Yeah, anytime.
00:22My name is Jochen Harms, and my dad's name is Abraham Harms,
00:27and I'm here to set the record straight.
00:33It's a famous name.
00:35A lot of people know him, and my brother Enrique.
00:39To me, it was an amazing dad.
00:42I love him.
00:44Weekends when he was coming home after his trips,
00:47played games with us kids at the house,
00:50and we're all exciting.
00:53People that know him love him.
00:58He wasn't this bad person who wanted to be in the drug business.
01:04That wasn't him.
01:06He was a small trafficker.
01:10Like, he was one of the best persons on planet Earth.
01:15He got into this marijuana business, but it wasn't that he wanted it.
01:19He got into this business because of life took him there.
01:25He did it for us.
01:28So can somebody be a drug dealer and be right with God?
01:32That's the question.
01:49Bye.
01:49Let's see.
02:22I think the drug game is never-ending.
02:27Whenever you take out or chop off the head of one snake, another snake arises.
02:35Being an undercover agent is challenging.
02:38It's a mental game.
02:40Thinking in the way the criminal would think.
02:43Trying to be cool under pressure.
02:46Being quiet enough to look normal, but asking enough questions to covertly gather intel.
02:55There's a fine line on being able to execute the mission safely, and then really putting
03:05yourself in harm's way and doing yourself a disservice in the investigation.
03:09I think it's the best gig in the world.
03:12You get to go out and play cops and robbers every day.
03:16It's the same stuff you were doing and imagining when you were a kid.
03:20You get to live that out in real life and get paid for it.
03:27Just letting Border Patrol know that we're going to be out there, one, so they don't mess with
03:31us, and two, we're a long ways from help.
03:35So, uh, they'll be our first call that we make, and anything pops off.
03:47When the regular citizen thinks of the word Mennonite, they think of a quiet, very religious,
03:53proper group of people that are just doing the right thing and living a good life of the
03:58simple life.
03:59They're very into their agriculture, and it's a very peaceful group of people.
04:06But just like every society has, the Mennonite population is a very small fraction of people
04:13who commit crimes, and a lot of that crime is drug smuggling.
04:16The majority of the narcotics that we seize at the ports of entry are, we call it, deep
04:24concealment, to where it's concealed inside a non-factory compartment of a vehicle, whether
04:32it be a gas tank, a frame rail, an engine block.
04:35You can find different compartments in cars, and seats in car seats.
04:39Mennonite were so trusted, like, at Borders, like, when you were approaching Borders, like,
04:44you were just good to go.
04:45My dad, he told us what he was doing and, like, what was going on, and unfortunately,
04:50we accepted, but he didn't force us.
04:53My understanding is that Abe enlisted the help of his sons, particularly Enrique.
05:01Enrique Harms, he's comparable to the Chapa Guzman of the Sindelon cartel.
05:07He's at the top of the food chain.
05:10Anybody along the community, especially in the valley of El Paso,
05:14has heard of the Harms, we knew that the Harms are running the Mennonite mafia.
05:19It was kind of like this mythical figure, right?
05:23Cuauhtémoc, Mexico, is a town about two hours south of the U.S.-Mexico border,
05:30and it is a Mennonite colony and home to thousands and thousands of Mennonites.
05:52There's this community laid out in, like, almost perfect geometry.
05:56The roads are, like, perfect straight lines.
06:00They're collective style of very efficient cattle farming and dairy farming and making a nationally known cheese in Mexico,
06:11known as queso Mennonita.
06:12My dad, he was in the cheese business way before he started into the drug trafficking.
06:21Back in Cuauhtémoc, back then, there were different cheese factories.
06:25So he was working with this company, and, like, he bought cheese,
06:29and, like, he went all over Mexico to look for market.
06:32And he was doing pretty good.
06:34He was making a good living, was good money in it.
06:38Then, after some time, he finds it in the American Crisco, like, and they love this Crisco and Cuauhtémoc.
06:44If you could get a load of Crisco, you would be selling it in a day or two,
06:47and he could make good money, double or triple the price.
06:51At the first time when he got to Crisco, like, he was coming to the Mexican customs and showed him
06:57the permit,
06:59like, everything was good.
07:00After a third or four times when he came to customs and showed him the permit load,
07:04they were telling him this is a fake one.
07:07So they just pulled the truck aside and let it sit there.
07:12And, like, and it was a middle of May somewhere, and, like, in the desert by Cuauhtémoc.
07:17Like, it gets really warm, and Crisco started melting, and people that were driving by,
07:23the agent just took boxes of Crisco and just gave it away, and that was my savings.
07:29That was a really tough time for him.
07:31It was a really tough situation.
07:34All the money that he had been saving up, he spent into it, and then after, like, he was getting
07:39a loan,
07:41trying to get it solved, and, but it was just not working.
07:46All the years of hard working to get somewhere and to get something to start up, and then just all
07:54of a sudden, like, you just lose everything.
07:58By that time, like, life was, like, really tough.
08:01He owed the money, and he needed to pay, and, like, it was a high interest, and he couldn't, just
08:06couldn't make it for it.
08:07Like, and then all of a sudden, there this genius comes up with this idea and tells him, hey, you
08:13know what, like, I got some marijuana, like.
08:18Probably you can get into the business and sell one of this stuff and pay off your debt, and so
08:23he did.
08:24He didn't want it to be this drug dealer, but being in drug business isn't easy.
08:33It's, uh, it's a tough life.
08:37You get used to it, and then, um, you don't see it as a sin anymore.
08:45Beneath the surface, there is something much more sinister taking place.
08:50Like many Canadians, I thought Mennonites were God-fearing, law-abiding, hard-working citizens
08:56who had the best interests of their children at heart, who worked an honest life,
09:03who believed that, um, faith was important.
09:07They believed that God rewarded your life of hard work with entry into heaven,
09:12and so prohibitions against riding bikes, radio, TV, rubber tires on the tractors.
09:19You had to wear your overalls until they stank.
09:23You did not wash them.
09:25Weird things like this began to get people excommunicated, and then they couldn't be hired.
09:30Eventually, a culture of flouting prohibitions takes root in these communities,
09:35which has its final expression, I would argue, in drug trafficking.
09:48Even in the Mennonite community, as religious as they are,
09:52sometimes they fall down on their luck,
09:53and there is an opportunity there in that community to smoke on narcotics.
10:00In the 90s, the crop price dropped so bad that year,
10:04almost every farmer in Kuokdemu got into big debts.
10:09And that's when a lot of people walk up to you that were judging you for a long time
10:15for what you did.
10:18And now they're coming up to you and asking,
10:21what can we do?
10:24How can we survive this, this crisis?
10:28I don't want to be in drug business, I don't want to be a drug dealer,
10:32but I have this farmland, and I have been doing this all my life.
10:38My dad did it, and my grandpa did it.
10:40Not that they want to be drug dealers,
10:42but believe you and me, people will do things that they will not do.
10:46Like, if it comes money, money is money, and people do things.
10:54Through the 90s and into the 2000s,
10:56the Harms' sons, Enrique Harms, Johan Harms,
10:59begin to develop the drug business that their father bequeathed them.
11:05Johan Harms, he decides he's going to use his money
11:08to get into the movie business.
11:10In Mexico, there is a long tradition
11:13of straight-to-video B-movie narco shoot-'em-ups.
11:19Just about drug trafficking and all that kind of stuff.
11:28Johan Harms apparently decides
11:30that this is his life's work and his life's dream.
11:32He puts a lot of money into producing these movies,
11:35and in one movie, which I have seen,
11:38takes a guy's head and suffocates the guy
11:40by sticking his head into a big pile of cocaine.
11:56I was living my dream.
11:58It was exciting.
12:00I was getting famous,
12:01and I was super exciting of the work that I was doing.
12:07Abe was quite content
12:09trafficking in pretty poor-quality dope.
12:12Enrique sees the opportunity,
12:15and, unlike his father,
12:17I think was more of a visionary
12:19insofar as he knew he had to adapt.
12:26The B.C. bud was flooding into the U.S. market.
12:30The Mennonite product was really seedy.
12:33It wasn't very good quality.
12:35And like good businessmen,
12:37they anticipated how the market was going to change,
12:40and they adapted to the market.
12:42So they diversified into cocaine, heroin,
12:46made a hell of a lot more money.
12:51It's a tough life.
12:52It's not easy.
12:54Like, you get into tough situations,
12:56and you're facing with tough people,
13:00and you've got to stand up for yourself.
13:02Not that you want to be this mean person,
13:05but sometimes, like, you really have to stand up for yourself.
13:09And that's in every single business.
13:11Like, it's all over.
13:12Like, you've got to defend your business.
13:14You've got to defend yourself,
13:15because, like,
13:16if you're not going to be standing up for yourself,
13:18the people will eat you alive.
13:20Like, that's not that you want to be this bad person,
13:23but sometimes, like,
13:25you've got to face whatever it presents to you, right?
13:31Like, if you really got a tough situation,
13:35okay, I would bring a gun along,
13:37but not, that wasn't the normal me, right?
13:44I grew up around Socorro, late 80s, early 90s.
13:48The thing about Socorro at that time,
13:50when one of the main highways
13:52that the cartels used to use to smuggle their drugs
13:55into the United States
13:57went directly through that main street in Socorro.
14:00So at the time that I was growing up in that area,
14:04Socorro was one of the major thoroughfares
14:06for the cocaine and marijuana
14:08that was coming in from the Juarez cartel.
14:10So in that little town,
14:11everybody knew who was involved.
14:14They either were involved
14:14or you knew people that were involved.
14:16It was just common knowledge.
14:19The ironic thing about the Mennonites
14:21is that we always heard of the Mennonites
14:24being this religious, holy faction
14:29that they would turn away
14:30from modern luxuries like electricity
14:33and all they wanted to do
14:35was, you know, live by the Bible.
14:37But all we knew growing up
14:39is when the Mennonites were in town,
14:41when they would come in for the weekends,
14:42they were the hardiest partiers.
14:44Do you like that?
14:45It was always ironic
14:47because when we would hear that,
14:49you know, about the Mennonites,
14:50you know, being so religious,
14:51we're like, well, not the ones
14:52that we hang out with
14:53because those guys come hard
14:54and they party,
14:56downing their bottles of Jack Daniels
14:57and partaking in any party drug
14:59that they can get their hands on.
15:04In 2003, I was working on a book
15:08about Mexican immigration.
15:10I get to know a local social worker.
15:12And one night, he begins to tell me
15:18about the Mennonite community,
15:21about how the community
15:22is really completely in advanced decay.
15:26First, he says,
15:27there's a terrible problem with inbreeding.
15:30And I go, what?
15:32The Mennonites from Mexico
15:33you're talking about now?
15:34I mean, it just didn't jive
15:36with what I knew about these people, right?
15:38And you know, the other thing is,
15:40and we're driving along.
15:42The other thing is,
15:43they're major drug traffickers.
15:45I say, whoa, you know,
15:47pull up, what do you, pull over.
15:48I gotta hear this, you know.
15:49He goes on to say,
15:50I have a client, a woman,
15:53whose husband was a huge informant
15:56for the Bureau of Narcotics of Oklahoma
15:59as they put together
16:00the largest drug bust in the history of the state
16:03up to that point in 1999.
16:06I don't know if you've heard of a guy
16:08by the name of Enrique Harms
16:10and I had, like, never heard of that guy before.
16:12I was like, yeah, he's kind of the copo.
16:14His dad was the first one.
16:17This is the most bizarre story
16:20I have ever heard as a journalist, man.
16:23And I consider myself
16:24to have a highly refined
16:26journalistic compass radar
16:28right in here somewhere.
16:30And it was going haywire.
16:32It was like, get down to there.
16:33Go start.
16:33Somebody's gonna do
16:34the Narco-Mennonite story before you do.
16:39So I went down to Cuauhtémoc,
16:41to the Mennonite Campos,
16:43as they're called.
16:46I go down there
16:47and the first thing that happens
16:49is I realize
16:50that I need to rent a car.
16:53So I go into the budget,
16:54rent a car,
16:55and I say,
16:56what's the cheapest car you got?
16:58And they point to,
17:00they point to
17:01a gold
17:03Chevy Love,
17:04which is about as large
17:06as your kitchen table.
17:06Okay, it's really dinky.
17:08I'm like,
17:09okay,
17:10I guess I'll rent that.
17:11And I'm driving off the lot
17:13and, of course,
17:14this is a rural area.
17:15There's trucks
17:16and pickup trucks.
17:18That's it.
17:19No one's got a Chevy Love.
17:22And, you know,
17:23I got down there
17:24and you could see
17:26the remarkable development
17:28that was due
17:30to the very industrious,
17:32hardworking
17:33Mennonite community.
17:35The farms
17:36were perfect.
17:37No trash,
17:39no litter.
17:40Very perfect
17:42roads,
17:43right?
17:43They just go straight.
17:44It's the middle of the desert
17:46and talk about
17:47making the desert bloom.
17:48That's exactly
17:48what Mennonites
17:50had done by then.
17:52Here I found
17:53this entire community
17:54that was planted
17:55in the middle
17:56of the old world
17:57that they imposed
17:58on themselves,
17:58but unable to avoid
18:00the new world
18:00that was all around them.
18:02The old world
18:03I began to see
18:04was definitely
18:06damaging,
18:07harmful to them
18:08because they use
18:09this old form
18:11of educating
18:12their kids,
18:13which was almost useless.
18:15So I went
18:16to one-room schoolhouse.
18:17I mean,
18:17you'd think
18:18this would be
18:18more at home
18:19in like 1870 Nebraska
18:22or something like that,
18:23you know,
18:23where you have one teacher
18:24and you have kids
18:25of all ages
18:26sitting there
18:27writing out
18:28in chalk
18:29on these little
18:30black chalkboard slates
18:32scripture.
18:33The teacher
18:34was a farmer.
18:35He didn't know anything.
18:35He asked me.
18:36Literally,
18:37this guy asked me.
18:38Six times seven,
18:39that's 42, right?
18:40Yeah,
18:41that's 42, all right.
18:42You know,
18:43but this was the level
18:44of knowledge
18:44that these teachers had.
18:45There's almost none.
18:46And so these kids
18:47graduated from this
18:48one-room school class
18:49and that's all
18:50the education
18:51they ever got, right?
18:52And so they were
18:54vulnerable.
18:55They could not
18:55really get jobs.
18:59Anyway,
18:59for the next
19:00several days,
19:01I drive around
19:02the Mennonite colonies
19:05and talk to people.
19:06I was asking questions
19:07about trafficking
19:09and I saw it was
19:10going to be a difficult
19:10story to write
19:12because of the fact
19:13that I really didn't
19:14know much about this
19:15community.
19:15I didn't speak the language
19:16and I was clearly
19:17an outsider.
19:19I talked to this one guy
19:20and he said,
19:21there is a guy
19:22who owns a restaurant
19:23out on the main highway
19:24and his name's
19:26Enrique Harms.
19:29I go,
19:30Enrique Harms,
19:31okay.
19:31That's the same name
19:32is the Mennonite capo
19:33and so I go
19:35to the restaurant
19:36La Huerta
19:37and I meet
19:38Enrique Harms,
19:40the owner of the restaurant.
19:41Thin little guy,
19:43face like a ferret
19:44and he begins
19:46to tell me
19:46about how he had
19:47a cocaine habit
19:48but now he's doing better
19:49and now he's got
19:50this restaurant.
19:52I stay there a week.
19:55I go by that
19:56Huerta restaurant
19:57one more time.
19:58I'm eating there,
20:00reading my notes,
20:01doing that
20:01and all of a sudden
20:02Enrique Harms
20:03sits down
20:03in front of me.
20:05He goes,
20:06what are you still
20:06doing here?
20:08Now this does not
20:08feel very welcoming.
20:10You know,
20:11I'm like,
20:12I'm here,
20:13I'm leaving actually.
20:14I'm about to,
20:14I've got a plane
20:15later today.
20:16Oh,
20:17okay.
20:18So I finish up,
20:19I pay the bill,
20:21I walk outside
20:22and all of a sudden
20:23he appears next to me.
20:25Hey,
20:25let me take your picture.
20:27And at that point
20:27I start getting
20:28like a little defensive.
20:30I'm like,
20:30screw you man,
20:31you're not taking
20:31my picture.
20:32I get in my car
20:35and I head off
20:36down the very,
20:37very long highway
20:38into Koltemuk
20:39and as I'm driving
20:42I look in my
20:43rear view mirror
20:44and I realize
20:45I am being followed.
20:52I look
20:53and there's
20:54this purple Dodge Stratus,
20:56smoked windows,
20:57no plates.
20:58And that's when
20:59I really began
21:00to get terrified,
21:01honestly.
21:02Nobody really knows
21:03I'm here
21:03except my girlfriend
21:04up in Chicago.
21:05So I realized
21:06I just got to
21:07make a room for it,
21:08you know?
21:08And so I hit the road
21:10out of town.
21:11I come to a stoplight
21:13and I see
21:15a big
21:16forest green
21:18Chevy pickup
21:19coming
21:20and this guy
21:22pulls up
21:22in his
21:23pickup truck
21:26and he reaches
21:28down into
21:28the well
21:29of his car
21:30and I think
21:30right there
21:31I believe
21:31he's going to
21:32pull out a pistol
21:33and shoot me.
21:37Up to this point
21:39I had been gripped
21:41by the most
21:42razor sharp
21:45crystalline terror
21:47I have ever felt.
21:49I am in real
21:51serious trouble
21:52now.
21:55And he reaches down
21:57into the well
21:58of the truck
21:59and I really thought
22:00he was going to
22:01come out
22:01with a gun
22:02and just
22:02kill me right there.
22:05Instead he comes out
22:06with a
22:07digital camera
22:09and he holds
22:10it up like this
22:10and he starts
22:11taking my picture
22:12cha-ching
22:12cha-ching
22:13cha-ching
22:13like
22:15the light changes
22:16all the cars go
22:17and I just squeal
22:18out of there
22:18and I drive into
22:20the first business
22:21I can find
22:22and I get out
22:24of my car
22:24and it's
22:252 o'clock
22:26lunchtime in Mexico
22:27nobody's there
22:28but this kid
22:2820 year old kid
22:30who's kind of
22:31minding the store
22:31and I go up to him
22:32and I'm like
22:33the narcos
22:34the narco
22:35Mennonites are after me
22:36man call the cops
22:37this kid
22:38all alone
22:39he begins
22:40to hyperventilate
22:41he begins
22:42to try to push me
22:43leave
22:43get out
22:44get out
22:44we don't want you here
22:45you know
22:45I tell him
22:46look man
22:46I'm not moving
22:47until you call
22:47the cops
22:48get somebody
22:48over here
22:49finally he gets
22:50a picture
22:50he calls the cops
22:51the cops come
22:52about 10 minutes
22:53later
22:53it seemed endless
22:54it seemed like
22:55they would never
22:55arrive
22:56and finally
22:57they get there
22:58and they take me
22:59up to the police
23:00department
23:00and so
23:03a plan is devised
23:05for two of the cops
23:06to take me
23:07to the Chihuahua City
23:08airport
23:09one guy
23:10is driving me
23:12and the other guy
23:13is driving
23:14my gold chubby love
23:15right
23:17the guy driving me
23:18lays his AK-47
23:21on my lap
23:22as he drives
23:23and we take off
23:25it's supposed to take
23:26hour and plus
23:28to get to the airport
23:30I think we did it
23:31in 45 minutes
23:32we were blazing
23:34blazing fast
23:35we get to the airport
23:37I get onto the plane
23:39I'm like
23:39almost bent down
23:40and kissed
23:41the plane
23:42you know
23:43as I got onto it
23:44that was my
23:46bizarre
23:48experience
23:49with the
23:50narco-Mennonites
23:51of Mexico
24:19I get to the
24:26In 2012, we started seeing a lot more of the marijuana being smuggled through the Presidio
24:31Texas Port of Entry.
24:32We would see utility trailers being loaded with marijuana in the frame rails, utility
24:38gas tanks, like those big diesel tanks that are in the back, they would put a tank within
24:42a tank.
24:43In the regular gas tank of pickups, they would put a steel box full of contraband.
24:51Mennonites are welders by trade.
24:54They're really, really good at welding farm equipment, and they're really, really good
25:00at welding non-factory compartments.
25:02And inside those non-factory compartments is where they hide their drugs.
25:07So during the interviews of these drivers of these vehicles, they would always come up
25:13with, you know, we answered an ad in the paper.
25:17There were individuals from Mexico.
25:19They were looking for work.
25:21And part of their way to look for work is they were looking for different ads in the newspapers.
25:29Many of them encountered the same ad.
25:32Someone requesting drivers who had tourist visas to enter the United States, and they were requesting
25:38those drivers either deliver products, legal products in the United States, or pick up some
25:45farm equipment in the US and transport that equipment back to Mexico.
25:48Unbeknownst to them, those drivers were given a company car, but that company car had narcotics in it.
25:56And so they began smuggling drugs into the United States, and they didn't even know what they were doing.
26:31So, were these drivers Mennonites?
26:32A mule is a person that smuggles contraband for a criminal organization.
26:40So, part of our investigation was to try to figure out who was putting these ads in the Mexican
26:45newspaper.
26:46We started asking, hey, who did you call?
26:49What was the phone number you were given?
26:51What were the instructions you were given?
26:53Do you remember what the guy looked like that delivered you this vehicle?
26:56That happened over a course of several months to where now we started to get a few nicknames.
27:03Some were Juan Weeby, Mario Blanco was a good one, Oscar Silva was another one.
27:10There was just a lot of different ones.
27:13You know, we started hearing a lot of Ingeniero, you know, the Ingeniero Silva or Ingeniero or Inke.
27:20There were several drivers that stated that the engineers are the one to hire me, and that's
27:26all we had to go by at the very beginning.
27:28Once we started to realize that, hey, this is one person that was responsible for this,
27:33we started trying to get as many identifiers, physical characteristics of what that person
27:38looked like, and to start to narrow down a target profile of who we believed was responsible
27:44for these newspaper ads.
27:45He was described as a tall white man, a Mennonite man, but spoke Spanish and spoke German.
27:56That person was identified as David Giesbrick Furr.
28:01So once we identified David Giesbrick Furr as our main target, we ran a target profile on
28:07him and tried to find every bit of information we could on his past.
28:12David Giesbrick Furr had a history of narcotics melanin.
28:15We found out that he himself used to be a mule.
28:18He was arrested in Presidio, Texas for bringing drugs across the US-Mexico border.
28:24He went to prison, and then he was later deported back to Mexico.
28:30We felt like he hadn't learned his lesson from when he was caught the first time and he was
28:35back to his old ways, this time a little bit smarter, a little bit wiser.
28:39And so instead of now of being that mule and taking all the risk, he was assuming very
28:46little of the risk and just drawing up the blueprint in Mexico.
28:50And he was the one that was, you know, had the master plan, and that plan was working for
28:57a long time.
28:58David Giesbrick's operation was a well-oiled machine until it wasn't.
29:05Marking.
29:14My name is David Giesbrick Furr.
29:24I'm doing this just because I need to clean my name.
29:29I grew up in the Mennonite family, my dad's born in Mexico, my grandpa's in Canada.
29:35We were nine in the family.
29:37I was the seventh, I was Peter, Hans, Maria, Willy, Henry, Justina, me, and then Margaret,
29:46and then Daniel.
29:47All right.
29:49Hans, or John, he died in 86 when I was 13 years old, drinking and driving.
29:57He was my best brother.
30:00Yeah.
30:01Things happen in my life, and I got, I had a really hard time for that.
30:09My dad was kicked out before I was born.
30:12He was kicked out from the Mennonites because he started driving trucks.
30:17He started dealing with Mexican people and used electricity.
30:24I never in my life have used overalls.
30:27I never in my life had a Mennonite school.
30:30I never had a Mennonite girlfriend, never a Mennonite wife.
30:34I grew up with Mexican people.
30:37The Mennonites, they are like, you're David Giesbrick, you're a drug dealer, you're a murderer,
30:42or something like that, and they go away from me, something.
30:46That's why I'm here.
30:47I'm not a drug dealer.
30:48I'm not a killer.
30:50I'm not a murderer.
30:52I'm a legal person.
30:54That's why I'm coming for this, yes.
30:59The next phase of the investigation, we tried to figure out, how do we defeat this?
31:04How do we get ahead of this?
31:06Because right now, there is an unlimited amount of people in Mexico that are going to answer
31:11these newspaper ads, and if we don't put a squash to this, we are going to be inundated with it.
31:16The only option that we had was to start delivering those narcotics from the border
31:22to their destination in the United States, and we needed the blind mules' help to make that happen.
31:29So, some of the next steps that we did, we started talking with some of the drivers.
31:34You know, after they tell us they don't know anything about this.
31:36They didn't know anything, that any drugs or contraband was in the vehicles,
31:40and, you know, some of them were like, no, you're lying to us.
31:43You know, we had to go and show them.
31:45In interviewing these blind mules, we would inform them that the vehicle they had,
31:51that they were driving, had narcotics in it.
31:54Obviously, it was news to them.
31:56They were shocked.
31:58Most of them were really, really upset, and they wanted to do whatever it took
32:02to get back at David Geese McFerr for putting him in that position,
32:06and they agreed to cooperate with the investigation.
32:09Supposedly, they cut the driver, and this driver goes like, yes, it is him.
32:15But it's not me.
32:16The drivers, usually, when they cut them, just go home or just be free.
32:22They show somebody, like, and that's what they tried to do with me.
32:26They want me to show somebody, like, to put somebody in.
32:31Who do you want me to put?
32:34And then they got mad, you know, and they said, hey, you know what?
32:37Where are you supposed to go?
32:38Well, I'm supposed to go to Albuquerque, or I'm supposed to go to Tulsa, Oklahoma.
32:43And I said, all right, well, are you willing to help the U.S. government?
32:46And, of course, you know, some of them were all for it.
32:49And we did quite a few of these controlled deliveries to different cities in the U.S.
32:54We're going to take it to its final destination in order to apprehend more individuals
33:00higher in the cartel.
33:02We're driving these drug-laden vehicles all across the country.
33:08We were all over the map.
33:10And it was a really, really big network that we were dealing with.
33:15At that point in my career, this was the biggest thing I'd seen.
33:20One of our controlled deliveries was to Tulsa, Oklahoma.
33:23We arrived in Tulsa late at night.
33:25It was pitch black in this neighborhood.
33:27And there was an open house party at the residence where we're delivering this marijuana-laden truck.
33:34We parked the vehicle with marijuana in the front yard as we were instructed to do.
33:39And several minutes later, our law enforcement team converged on the property.
33:44We booted the front door in.
33:47We encountered several people in the house.
33:50Myself and another agent, as we were walking down the hallway, entered the first bedroom on the left.
33:57When we entered that bedroom, we encountered two people that were having sex.
34:03We were able to get them secured and verify they didn't have any weapons on them, which was pretty easy
34:10to do.
34:10And then we continued to secure people throughout the house until we had 10 or 12 people secured and we
34:19were running out of handcuffs.
34:21So during some of these controlled deliveries, we know that David Gishprick Furr wanted to be in contact with the
34:27driver.
34:28So we had the co-operator, which was the driver that was hired in Mexico.
34:32He's now willing to record some of these phone calls with David Gishprick Furr.
34:37You know, and there were phone calls like, hey, where are you at?
34:40I need you to stop here.
34:41I need you to go get a phone.
34:42I need you to get a hotel.
34:44Once you get a hotel, I need you to tell me what hotel it is.
34:47Send me the address.
34:48Send me what room number.
34:49Give me the phone number of the room.
34:52Just different things that he wanted to know, which to me was he wanted to know where his product was.
35:01David Gishprick Furr just had a unique voice.
35:03It was once you heard it the first time, you knew it was him every other time you heard him.
35:19I was five years old when they took me to Spanish school.
35:24I learned first German and then Spanish.
35:27I was in the primaria and secundaria, we started learning English.
35:32But my English got better on the street, I guess, on my jobs.
35:39And after that, Jill.
35:42David Gishprick Furr was well-spoken.
35:45He sounded educated.
35:46He sounded controlled.
35:49Relatively pleasant to talk to.
35:51But he just had that monotone that there was no doubting his voice when you heard him on the other
35:58end of the line.
35:59Do you want to hear some of these recordings?
36:01Yeah, go ahead.
36:02Go ahead.
36:06You join me at a Q&A
36:07Time to rent it.
36:08Log in to the hotel some days, of May.
36:08At a short break, he's going to arrive there.
36:11The rental rate.
36:12He will come in in the afternoon with you.
36:14At a different week, they will come with you.
36:17For the 달mine's May.
36:27All day at 2 BC, sly.
36:32It's not my voice, it's not me.
36:35So you did not place the newspaper advertising?
36:39No, no, it's not me.
36:43So he could say that he was Mario Blanco,
36:46Ingeniero Silva, engineer, whoever he was.
36:50But at the end of the day,
36:51when I listened to some of these recorded phone calls
36:54that we have with co-operators,
36:55I know it's David Keysprick for her.
36:57On one occasion,
36:59we're trying to conduct a control delivery.
37:02And we have the co-operator in our office
37:04here in Presidio, Texas, which was,
37:07we were on a phone call with David Keysprick.
37:10For, for knew that the gig was up.
37:13You know, he knew that his load was intercepted
37:15at the port of entry.
37:16He started, you know, talking with agents.
37:19And I basically told him,
37:22David, I know it's you.
37:23I know who you are.
37:24You know, we've got you this, we need you to come in.
37:26We know who you are.
37:28And he kept on denying,
37:29well, I don't know who you're talking about.
37:31You know, I don't know that name.
37:32And what's that name that you're telling me?
37:34And who is that?
37:36Who is that?
37:40American, U.S. Customs.
37:49But later on, he ended up calling us back.
37:53You know, he starts pleading with us that the driver
37:55didn't know anything about it.
37:56You know, he's got small kids.
37:58You know, I don't want his kids to go through what my son did,
38:01or my son went through.
38:03You know, my son was murdered by these individuals.
38:20He was telling us that his son was murdered.
38:40I remember that phone call.
38:43I've seen falling too many people.
38:46I've seen how, like I told you, Mennonites got killed
38:52just to, because they're starting doing jobs for cartels.
38:59And the most important thing is this is not,
39:04that's not Mennonite problem, the cartels.
39:08That's Mexican problems.
39:09The Mexican abuse from Mennonites.
39:19I think that they kind of looked at it like,
39:20oh, poor Mennonites are getting corrupted by the cartels,
39:23where all this time, the Mennonites were corrupting themselves.
39:29Is it safe for you to be doing this interview?
39:32I feel safe.
39:33Shouldn't I?
39:35Have I seen something what I shouldn't?
39:37I don't think.
39:44On one of the control deliveries,
39:46we ended up in Lumberton, South Carolina.
39:49We were working with the locals, of course,
39:51and then we're working with DEA
39:52in order to secure an indictment
39:54on David Gieschbrick for trafficking of the cocaine.
39:58He was arrested in Mexico, extradited into the U.S.,
40:02and he was sentenced to five years.
40:04So I plead guilty, and then I went to Georgia,
40:09to Macquarie prison.
40:11So I did four years, five months in prison.
40:15Before I came out of jail,
40:17every time I talked to my wife or to my brother,
40:20they goes like,
40:21don't come back to Mexico, they will kill you.
40:23I go, what?
40:26Because those are cartels.
40:28You have been doing stuff for them, they will kill you.
40:31So the American government told me,
40:34you can choose, do you want to go to Canada or Mexico?
40:37Because I'm Canadian Mexican.
40:39I go, I want to go to Mexico.
40:40I want to see my kids, I want to be with my wife.
40:44And that's what I did, they sent me back to Mexico.
40:47The first thing what I did, I went to my cousin,
40:50I go, I need to talk to the big head,
40:53like from the midnight mob.
40:55What do you need?
40:56I want to talk to him.
40:58He called him, he passed me the phone,
40:59and I go, okay, do I have problems?
41:03Am I in dangerous?
41:05He goes, no, don't worry.
41:07Hold on, that's it.
41:10So, I was free from the midnight mob.
41:13After that, I went to work, I stopped the police,
41:16and I go, I need, I need to talk to the cabeza grande.
41:20And if you want to talk to the mafia,
41:23you must have a reason.
41:25If not, you are in big problems, you are in big shit.
41:30So, yeah, they took me to the place,
41:32and I talked to the guy, and I go, like,
41:34I am coming from prison, I only need to know
41:38if I have to run, or am I in danger, or...
41:41He goes, no, there's nothing wrong.
41:44You can go.
41:45That's it.
41:46So, from there on, I have been working again.
41:53After he got out, he went back to Cuauhtémoc,
41:55and from what I heard, he was back in the business again
41:59of smuggling narcotics.
42:03So long there are addicted people in Canada, United States,
42:09or Europe, or wherever, somebody will sell drugs.
42:15Somebody will sell drugs.
42:18So fur, like anybody else, had a boss.
42:21We determined that Enrique Harms was part
42:24of the David Giesberg Fur organization,
42:26but he was even higher up on the food chain
42:28than David Giesberg Fur.
42:30The investigation was a lot bigger
42:32than we even thought.
42:37David Giesberg Fur was telling us that
42:40the organization murdered his son,
42:44and we believe that the organization
42:47he was talking about was Enrique Harms' organization.
42:55Throughout my career, from being an agent,
42:57to being a supervisor, to being the director
42:59of organized crime and drug enforcement for HSI in D.C.,
43:03I always heard the name Harms.
43:04Harms always came up.
43:06You know, reports and intelligence reports
43:08that were coming out from then.
43:10To me, it was like, man, it took them that long?
43:11I remember those guys from high school.
43:14So my knowledge, historically,
43:17about the Harms organization, the Mennonite Mafia,
43:20as I like to call it, it evolved,
43:21and it has evolved throughout the years,
43:24just like other cartels have evolved, right?
43:26So at the time that the Juarez cartel had control
43:31of basically all of Chihuahua and Durango and this area,
43:35of course, they had to fall in with the Juarez cartel.
43:38There was a time when they actually fell in
43:40with the Salazaras, which was a faction of the Sinaloa cartel,
43:44when the Sinaloa cartel was starting to gain ground.
43:48But just like anything, you know, the power shifts,
43:50and so I think that the Mennonite Mafia,
43:52they're very keen and very smart in the way, you know,
43:56that they align themselves, because they align themselves
43:58to whoever is gonna have the power
44:00and is gonna align their interests.
44:03And that's the way it's been forever since the cartel started,
44:06and it's not only just the Mennonites.
44:09It's any organization that wants to survive.
44:12Well, the Harms drug family has been untouchable for so long,
44:15and it's the Sable story.
44:19Corruption, bribes, and the fact that they've been offered
44:23this sort of immunity for years by the Mexican government.
44:26I believe that Kiki Harms has remained in power for so long,
44:30survived this long, I believe because, first of all, he's smart,
44:35remained just high enough to where he controls
44:39the Mennonite smuggling portion of it,
44:42but not so big that he gains attention
44:45from Mexican authorities or U.S. authorities.
44:49And he uses the fact that Mennonites, by nature,
44:52are very secretive.
44:53They keep the outside world, for the most part, at bay.
44:58And so he's able to travel in these communities
45:00with some sort of protection,
45:03because even if the Mennonites are not involved,
45:06or members from the Mennonite community
45:07are not involved in smuggling,
45:09they're gonna offer him protection because he is a Mennonite,
45:11and he is seen as a leader.
45:13That community is very secretive.
45:15They keep everything in a small group.
45:17They don't let much get out.
45:20It's a close community within a close community,
45:23because cartels themselves are very secretive, right?
45:25The Mexican cartels have, like, recently started doing stupid things,
45:29like putting stuff on social media,
45:31where you don't see the Mennonites doing that, right?
45:34So Kinky Harms uses that to its advantage.
45:37Just like any cartel leader or any organization, criminal organization,
45:42if, I mean, the people that need to know that he's a boss know that he's a boss.
45:46The people that are actively involved, right, that take orders from him.
45:53Nothing where Mennonite is involved as far as smuggling is not gonna be known by Kinky and authorized by Kinky.
45:59So the illegal aspect of them, Kinky Harms has control over.
46:10Well, November 6th, 1994, well, it's a Sunday morning, I wake up, and...
46:17And I did hear, like, my dad, yeah, we got a phone call.
46:22And... and he left. He left the place.
46:26And... and about 45 minutes or an hour after,
46:31somebody comes in and gives us the news that Kinky had a car accident
46:40and... passed away and died in a car accident.
46:48I saw the accident.
46:50I walked down where the car was because it was inside the bridge, flipped over,
46:55and I only saw the body, and I saw a bullet hole at the door, driver's door.
47:02Like, you have seen a bullet hole, right?
47:04Yeah, that's what it was.
47:11Me, personally, I don't believe it was an accident.
47:15Because, uh, a couple of days after, like, we found bullet holes
47:20in one of the fenders of the car.
47:23So that raises question, like, who shot the tires.
47:31And there are a lot of rumors that he had a Bible and he was away to church.
47:37But, definitely, he was not on his way to church, and he was not...
47:40But he... there was not a Bible in the... in the car.
47:44I want to clear that up.
47:45That wasn't...
47:48That's...
47:48not exactly what happened.
47:56But I know that John, the actor, he did a lot of shit.
48:01You think it's more possible that John, Johan, was actually the boss of the Mennonite mafia?
48:07Yes.
48:08That's what I think, yes.
48:09What do you think?
48:10I think that he was a good one.
48:12He was a big hat.
48:15What makes you think that?
48:17Why would he make movies?
48:18Why would he like to be a movie star?
48:21Why would he spend so much money?
48:24Because that's... that costs a lot of money.
48:27I bet you that must be.
48:29And everyday new pick-up and all that stuff.
48:32I... I... I... I always stood away from them.
48:37So, you think John was actually the guy, not Enrique?
48:39Yeah, no, not Enrique.
48:41I don't... I don't believe Enrique is the big hat.
48:45No more questions.
48:48I'm out.
48:55Who's in charge of the Mennonites that comes to the business?
48:58Not quite taken out today.
49:05Who's El Bolos?
49:10Mmm...
49:10I don't want to get into that.
49:15No, I don't want to get into that.
49:32Go there, too.
49:33I don't want to forget it.
49:33No, I could sell my sights.
49:47English McCoy weak, not quite points of writing in the book.
49:48No, I don't want to sells and
49:50Study Bureau of Mennonites
49:502004
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