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00:00Joe DeLeon on this very show, A to Z Sports NFL Draft Analyst on the Make It Right.
00:05Call Kyle Wright Hotline.
00:07How we feeling, champ?
00:08Come on, slugger.
00:09How we doing?
00:10I'm doing good, guys.
00:12I'm doing especially great now that I get to catch up with you.
00:15We've been told that being a guest on our show is like a whole week's worth of amoxicillin.
00:23I can attest to that.
00:26It sounds about right.
00:27How you guys doing?
00:28We're doing all right here.
00:29I do want to know, if we put Carnell Tate up against the, let's say, five wide receivers
00:36drafted from Ohio State in the first round since 2022, so Emeka Abuka, Marvin Harrison Jr.,
00:42Jackson Smith and Jigba, Garrett Wilson, and Chris Alave, where would he rank?
00:48The funny thing about this is when I was in Indy, me and my colleagues at A to Z Sports,
00:54we were having this same exact debate because we were trying to gauge where
00:58Carnell Tate's fit.
01:00And where I saw it is I would place him above Chris Alave, but I see him behind Jackson
01:09Smith and Jigba and Garrett Wilson.
01:12And I don't think that, like, the thing that gets complicated with talking about this is
01:15it sounds like that's almost a knock and it's like a negative evaluation of Carnell Tate,
01:21but it's really not.
01:22I think it just goes to show how ridiculously talented the Ohio State wide receivers have
01:27been that have come out in the past five-ish years.
01:31It's just, for me, I don't see that same level of game-altering talent that Garrett Wilson
01:37had coming out.
01:38And he has displayed that he can be highly productive and be a team's number one receiver.
01:42I thought that Jackson Smith and Jigba maybe didn't have this expectation that he would have
01:47propelled himself into an offensive player of the year, but I thought that he could be
01:50a top ten wide receiver in the NFL.
01:52I just don't really see that with Carnell Tate.
01:54I see a really, really good wide receiver, too, that can be reliable and impactful, but
02:00he needs a running mate.
02:02He is more Robin to someone else's Batman.
02:05So why is it he keeps being propped up with everyone else at the top of the wide receiver
02:09list?
02:10Why is he in the same conversation with Tyson if he's only, at best, somebody's Robin?
02:16Well, I think that part of the discussion, kind of the funny thing with the top three
02:22receivers, Lemon, Tyson, and Tate, is that they've all, all three of them kind of have
02:27something wrong with them.
02:29Lemon, just apparently he's weird.
02:31That's the whole narrative that it's been the case.
02:34And I think he's tremendously talented.
02:36I'm not really worried about anyone who's got concerns about his athletic capability.
02:40Tyson, though, there are some serious concerns because of his health.
02:43Health, he's had a long list of injuries that have kept him off the field, and he's just
02:49struggled to straight up finish, like, seasons.
02:52He just can't stay on the field.
02:53And it's not like we're talking about, you know, a minor lingering hamstring or like an
02:58ankle or something along those lines.
03:00He's had serious, serious injuries.
03:02The thing is, though, if we're removing all that, we're evaluating in a vacuum, and we're
03:06just looking at who are the most talented guys, Tyson's the most talented.
03:10I think Tyson is the higher ceiling.
03:12He reminds me of Justin Jefferson, the smoothness, the overall well-roundedness.
03:18He can do everything that you call upon him to do as a receiver.
03:21He's got a diverse route tree.
03:23But the problem is, is that are you going to buy into a guy that's just not been on the
03:27field very much?
03:28If you only do every year or so, every couple of years, he gets banged up and he's not available.
03:33It really kind of takes away the benefit of drafting a player like that early.
03:38So I agree.
03:40But what does kill me is when people have the Browns, who share your opinion that Jordan
03:45is the highest ceiling guy of the wide receivers.
03:49And they're like, no, Browns can't take him at six because of that.
03:52And they'll be like, this is why the Rams will draft him at 13.
03:55Or the Chiefs will draft him at nine.
03:59That inconsistency of logic does drive me all the way up the wall.
04:04Well, and I agree with you on that.
04:06I kind of, I think if a team is going to take him, it would need to be, one, I
04:12really just
04:13don't think he's going to go in the top 12.
04:15Just reading the general trend of receivers that are just players in general that have fit
04:20this description of long injury history, didn't test at the Combine.
04:25His medicals came back good, though, which was a positive sign.
04:28There were no red flags or anything.
04:30But naturally, NFL teams freak themselves out in this process.
04:34I think he's probably going to go 15 or later, if I'm just assuming, based on all of that.
04:38But he probably needs to go somewhere where there wouldn't be an immediate expectation
04:42that he would step on the field and be ready to go and that he would need to be the
04:47number
04:47one guy and have this immediate large impact.
04:50So I agree with you.
04:51Him going to the Chiefs or to the Rams doesn't really make as much sense to me.
04:55If anything, for projecting who the Rams would take, I feel like Makai Lemon would make more
04:59sense because he's been their style receiver of high IQ player.
05:03They need somebody in the slot that I think of his style that he could be really, really
05:08impactful.
05:09But I'm on the same page.
05:10Tyson going to either of those franchises hasn't really made a lot of sense.
05:14All right.
05:14So if we're still doing wide receivers, I want to tell you who my favorite is outside of the
05:17top three.
05:18I like Denzel Boston a lot and I get it.
05:21He's not the fastest player in the world.
05:22I think sometimes I can get a little overrated, but he's not the fastest player in the world.
05:26What am I missing?
05:27Why isn't he perceived to be better than he is?
05:30Well, I just, I get a lot of pause when we talk about these receivers, these big body
05:35catch point guys that aren't overly consistently dominant.
05:41I think that there's just been this track record of players who, unless you're Tedderall
05:46McMillan, who's in a different bucket and he was a separate category for the production
05:51that he produced, despite not being a true like burner, he was just still winning with
05:55his size, the Nikhil Harry's and Keon Coleman's of the world remind me too much of Denzel
06:01Boston.
06:02So I've always had a lot of pause with these big frame dudes who win through contact and
06:08physicality, because as fun as that is to watch on film, a lot of times those types of
06:14receivers end up getting caught up to in the NFL, especially nowadays when you look across
06:18the board, most of these corners that are getting picked early, they're bigger, they're
06:22stronger, they're faster.
06:24It's just a lot harder to win that way.
06:27When in college, every other week, even if you're in like a really good conference, you're
06:31going up against some foreigners that are probably going to be getting jobs at enterprise in a
06:36couple of years, even if they do get like an NFL spin or something.
06:40It's just, it just requires a lot to be able to win that way.
06:44Joe, I was big on the idea of Monroe Freeling at 24.
06:48The more the hype train has left the station here, Monroe Freeling at six is really starting
06:54to scare me, especially the implication that he might not be a week one player in the NFL.
07:00So is it fair to question if Monroe Freeling at six is a reach?
07:06I don't think that it is just because it's class overall.
07:10After we get past the fifth pick, there's a lot of prospects that kind of fall into the
07:15same bucket.
07:15Now, I do agree with you that like six overall just generally has felt a little rich for me.
07:20And the rise has been kind of random.
07:23I don't have a super high grade on him.
07:25I have a day two grade on him.
07:27But if he goes somewhere around like pick 10 to 20, somewhere in that range, it's fine for
07:35me because this class doesn't have a real pure, great left tackle prospect.
07:40I was also pretty disappointed with Caleb Lomu's film, who I thought was going to be the pure
07:45left tackle in this class that was going to be the big riser.
07:47This tackle class overall is just quite bad.
07:50It is really, really bad.
07:51I was doing a little bit of digging yesterday as it was kind of like finalizing the players
07:56I wanted to make sure I have watched.
07:57And after 15 guys, the list really capers off.
08:00So when there's very few just pure left tackles and even good draftable tackles in general,
08:05a guy like him who's mobile and is a good athlete and is really long is at least going
08:11to be worth the swing in a class where the talent level is just down.
08:15So that's kind of where the rise in his projection has increased.
08:19What's the difference in talent in someone like Freeling at six versus whoever else the
08:24Browns could potentially get at 24?
08:25How big is that gap to you?
08:29Well, anyway, so you're asking what the difference is if he goes at six or just in general, like
08:34the gap between him and whoever else might be on the board at 24.
08:37I'm saying like, yeah, the difference between if the Browns take someone or they take him
08:41at six versus letting it say, letting it, taking a wide receiver at six and then going with
08:46someone at 24, how much worse of an offensive lineman did we get at 24 if we, if we don't
08:52in fact take Freeling at six?
08:54In my opinion, I don't think that there would really be much of a difference because again,
08:59I have a day two grade on him.
09:01I have a grade that more lines with him going at pick 24.
09:05You're really going to end up getting guys with that same.
09:08Oh, you have a day two pick on Freeling in general.
09:11Yes.
09:11I have a day two grade on him.
09:13Me specifically, I'm much lower on him.
09:16So the, the offensive linemen that are going to be on the board that could be taken that
09:21are comparable to Freeling.
09:23There's really not much of a difference, but the problem is, is there's just not some very,
09:27very many pure left tackles.
09:28Now I'll say this, I would, I would almost lean towards, instead of taking him at six,
09:34I would lean towards taking like a Blake Miller from Clemson at, at 24 just because there's
09:41really very little separation between the grades that I have on those two guys, because both
09:45those guys, I have mid day two grades on.
09:47All right, Joe, uh, we've had both of these conversations on air before free agency.
09:53We talked about a two offensive lineman first round for the Browns.
09:57Uh, now we've talked about the two wide receiver idea.
10:01What do you think would be a better utilization of, uh, their first round picks this year?
10:07If they went all wide out in the first round or all offensive line?
10:11Uh, I think it would be all offensive line.
10:13If we're just talking about how difficult it is to find talent and offensive line in
10:18the NFL in general, regardless of year, regardless of draft class, it is a very complex task just
10:24for the simple nature of the fact that there's just only so many human beings on this earth
10:28that can be that big and move that well.
10:30I also think that instead of us doing the whole, you know, Monroe Freeling discussion,
10:35I think it'd be a lot more intriguing to maybe take a vague Ione at six and come back around
10:41at 24 and to take, I mentioned Blake Miller, a Maxi on a chore from Arizona state.
10:47I think there's just a lot more compelling alternatives and, and, uh, you know, mismatches
10:51that we can kind of put in there.
10:53The thing that to me with receiver, you could end up landing and grabbing a receiver somewhere
10:58on day two.
10:59And I also think that as you don't really have a solidified vision for what you're doing
11:04at quarterback, trying to build up this receiver arsenal before you start to establish that
11:12foundation at QB and figure out if you're going to have a veteran in the future or a youngster
11:16or whatever it is, the far better thing to set up whoever that guy ends up becoming in
11:202027, they're going to be a lot more better prepared to succeed if they've got a good
11:25offensive line compared to if there were two wide receivers that were drafted.
11:29How do you think the board falls for Jeremiah Love at this point?
11:33Man, it's been weird trying to project what's going to happen with Jeremiah Love because
11:36he, before free agency, he could have been projected to go to multiple teams in the top
11:4210, but now we kind of have to cross off the chiefs and the saints.
11:47Maybe they would think about it, but it just wouldn't really make a lot of sense for the
11:50money that they committed to, um, to, to, to free agent running backs.
11:55And I think that now the Titans would maybe have a stronger consideration.
11:59It would be really fun to see him in Tennessee, knowing the history of running backs that have
12:04played there.
12:05But I also, I feel as though that the giants considering they brought them in for a visit
12:09are now more of a realistic option.
12:11The one team that I would be blown away by if they took them purely from the explosiveness
12:17standpoint of what you would have in that backfield since the commanders took them at
12:21seven, or maybe even traded up to go and get them, uh, because of pairing Jeremiah Love
12:27and Jaden Daniels, you would have two of the fastest players in the NFL playing alongside
12:31one another.
12:32So that, that to me would be frightening.
12:33And I can imagine that if he ends up being there and he's still available, that they would
12:37probably run to go make that pick outside of that though.
12:40Uh, the, the Cowboys still seem to be in play, which was once a team that was considered
12:46to take him for a very long time.
12:48They were one of like the preseason easy projections, uh, to have taken Jeremiah Love.
12:53I feel like if the Cowboys ended up passing on him, that would be really shocking.
12:57I just, I, it would be very strange to me considering he is the best offensive prospect
13:02in this class that he would make it somewhere outside of the top 10 without somebody trying
13:07to trade up and go and get them.
13:08All right, Joe, uh, we had a hypothetical conversation yesterday and it, it was born a born rather
13:15out of my co-host's hatred of the idea of trading for Tanner McKee.
13:20So I said, what would you rather do trade Tanner McKee for a fifth round pick or trade pick
13:26number six for Jalen Hurts?
13:29I know there is no chance of that second, uh, trade happening, but I will ask you, would
13:35you rather have the sixth pick in this draft if you're the Browns or Jalen Hurts?
13:39The sixth pick in this draft?
13:41I don't think it's not even a question, right?
13:43No, I'm not touching Jalen Hurts.
13:45Absolutely not.
13:46Oh, oh, you said the wrong thing.
13:48Wait, hold on.
13:48I misheard that.
13:49You're taking the sixth.
13:50That's why I was, that's why I gave you that look as you were in my head.
13:52I already assumed he was just going Jalen Hurts.
13:53I didn't even consider the opportunity.
13:55You wouldn't want a starting quarterback in the NFL?
13:57So like the eighth best quarterback isn't, isn't as good as the sixth overall pick?
14:00I, it's okay.
14:01Here's my problem.
14:02Jalen Hurts is the perfect example of a quarterback that like needs the perfect situation.
14:07He has needed everything around him to go as far as he's needed a good offensive line,
14:12a good run game, good receivers who like him and actually are willing to like work with
14:18him and an offensive coordinator that can effectively call first off the receiver part is debatable.
14:22We don't know that he's ever really gotten along with AJ Brown or Devontae Smith.
14:26Fair point.
14:26But my point here is that he's needed so many variables to be in his, he's in the perfect
14:31situation.
14:32He couldn't be in a more perfect situation.
14:33I just don't think throwing him onto a team that's in the process of like rebuilding, especially
14:39rebuilding.
14:39No, you took this too literally.
14:40This is the problem with this.
14:42Jalen Hurts on the open market.
14:44Does he command more than the sixth overall pick?
14:49Oh, probably commands more than the sixth overall pick.
14:52I mean, think about it for a second.
14:53Deshaun got three firsts, but it was six picks total.
14:55It was three firsts.
14:55Russell Wilson got two firsts when it was all said and done.
14:58Matt Stafford would never want to play off game.
14:59I know how great he is.
15:00He got two firsts in total.
15:01How we trade defenders.
15:02We trade defenders for two firsts.
15:04Jalen Ramsey twice.
15:05Laramie Tunzel has been traded for two firsts.
15:08Do you think somebody that's been at the Super Bowl twice in the last five years doesn't
15:11at least get the sixth overall pick?
15:12I think in a vacuum, yes.
15:14I think that that's true.
15:15But me personally, I'm not doing that.
15:19I just wouldn't trade anything for Jalen Hurts because I wouldn't have much faith that it
15:24would work out.
15:24But to your point, yeah, I think that somebody would.
15:26I think that there'd be some franchise that would willingly mortgage a ton of...
15:30We literally saw the Browns do this with Deshaun Watson.
15:32To your point, teams will blindly throw picks at quarterbacks that have had small sample
15:38sizes of success in hopes that it'll rescue them.
15:41So, no, it probably would be.
15:43I just personally would not do it.
15:45One, you're a Giants fan.
15:46Two, that was impressive browbeating by Jonathan Peterlin right there.
15:50I'm very proud of you right there.
15:51I'm amazed.
15:52You hopped on him.
15:53Joe, I'm amazed.
15:53I'm amazed.
15:54Have you seen how many bad quarterbacks we've had and you're just not interested in Jalen Hurts?
15:58Also, I think Jalen Hurts is one of those bad quarterbacks.
16:00I'm just going to add that.
16:01Oh, you think he's bad?
16:02You think he's straight up bad.
16:03Like 12 games from Jackson Dart and you folks in New York are talking about this.
16:08I think he had 33 total touchdowns last year to six interceptions and you guys won't
16:12take them.
16:13Can't work with that.
16:14Okay.
16:15A lot of their offensive, I watched it up, Jalen Hurts, a lot of their offensive problems
16:18were derived from him.
16:20Not A.J. Brown.
16:21The play calling was bad, but a lot of their problems were derived from him.
16:25Oh, yeah.
16:25Big problem winning the Super Bowl.
16:27I got a real problem.
16:28I got a real problem.
16:29He makes Nick Sirianni look good day in, day out.
16:32What are we talking about?
16:33You've never had to carry Nick Sirianni, Joe.
16:35He got Nick Sirianni to a 700 winning percentage.
16:38That's like fourth all time.
16:40Tell him more, sharing the both of them.
16:42I think that's the better way to frame that.
16:44Joe, great stuff, buddy.
16:46Appreciate you.
16:46Thanks, guys.
16:47Appreciate it.
16:48Joe DeLeon on the Megan Wright Call Kyle Wright hotline.
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