- 2 days ago
The TDN Writers’ Room saw a host of entertaining and enlightening guests in 2025. Here’s a look at few of our favorites: Griffin Johnson, Terry Bradshaw, Junior Alvarado, and a collection of industry veterans who shared stories of the legendary D. Wayne Lukas.
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00:00:00welcome to another edition a holiday edition of the thoroughbred daily news writers room
00:00:22podcast my name is bill finley i'm a correspondent for the tdn ho ho ho i'm randy moss with nbc
00:00:29sports zoe cabman here with first racing and first tv so uh what we're doing something a little bit
00:00:37different um we're giving our staff a much needed a little break and we're going to show on this show
00:00:43some of the highlights of we thought were some of our best guests of the year on our gains way
00:00:49guest of the week show you're going to be seeing interviews with hall of fame quarterback terry
00:00:53bradshaw social influencer griffin johnson who did such a tremendous job getting the word out about
00:00:59sandman to all his followers on social media jockey junior alvarado who's the pilot of sovereignty and
00:01:06did such a good job with him through the year and one that we're really fond of after the passing of
00:01:10dwayne lucas we did a special memorial to him talking to many of the trainers that he mentored over the
00:01:16years all the future trainers of themselves that may make the hall of fame todd pletcher's already in
00:01:21and some others who have all been so successful we couldn't get to so many but i want to say that
00:01:26here's my list of honorable mentions and we're very proud of these guests bobby flay jamie osborne
00:01:31james owen and david anderson were some of my favorites you guys have any other favorites that uh
00:01:36we could have uh shoehorned in if we had more time ladies first oh i do for sure bill mark anytime you
00:01:44can talk about a kentucky derby winner and going to a dive bar after winning the kentucky derby
00:01:49is a big thumbs up for me bill was absolutely brilliant he what most of the viewers might not
00:01:55have seen after we did the interview bill gave us a tour of his fabulous lake house and all his trophies
00:02:01on the wall that to me was fabulous jamie osborne was brilliant frank miramati pizza who doesn't want to
00:02:09talk about pizza and racing he was awesome as well and then dave anderson probably one of the most
00:02:14candid conversations i think we've ever had when the plight of canada's racing was in peril i love
00:02:21dave to bits so some of those definitely yeah right before we started taping this uh bill was like how
00:02:29are we going to remember all these guests we had i can't remember 52 you know and so the producers
00:02:34started ticking off the guests beginning at the first of the year i'm like wow we had some we had
00:02:39some pretty darn good guests it's kind of hard to choose between them but to me the two most
00:02:44entertaining guests were uh terry bradshaw and frank miramati and miramati i mean miramati could
00:02:54have gone on for an hour uh you just ask him one question and then sit back for 10 or 15 minutes and
00:02:59then you know ask him another one um junior alvarado also i thought was a really really good guest
00:03:06obviously the jockey of sovereignty um and before that you know uh a lot of really top horses
00:03:12from the uh from the belmont stable like cody's wish and it really um in my opinion made it easy
00:03:20to root for junior he really came across well uh in that interview and uh came across as just an
00:03:27incredibly uh likable guy and that's good that's what we want to showcase the likable people people
00:03:35that you wouldn't ordinarily think oh let's have a conversation with this guy let's talk about
00:03:40this person you're like oh yeah he's cool terry bradshaw before we came on talking about his parrot
00:03:47that flew off after 16 years oh i just took her out she knew 100 words and she started circling
00:03:53i didn't know the wings grew back and off she went but that was brilliant terry was the most entertaining
00:04:00i think we're probably one and done with terry though because we spent a lot of the podcast talking
00:04:04about how we feel about running in the breeder's cup and we jinxed him right definitely all right
00:04:12we hope you enjoy the show it should be a lot of fun horse racing obviously lost a titan this year
00:04:18with the death of trainer dwayne lucas whose unparalleled success made him a legend not just
00:04:23in this country but around the world lucas passed away on june 28th at his home in louisville at age
00:04:3089 after which the tributes came pouring in we dedicated an entire podcast to wayne lucas
00:04:37and here were some of the highlights all right and we fittingly uh kick it off with todd pletcher
00:04:43todd i know you've had a lot of opportunity in the last week to reflect on uh on your long background
00:04:50with wayne uh when you think back now to the six and a half seven years you spent with him as an
00:04:58assistant and the three decades since then you know what are a couple of the things
00:05:02that your mind invariably goes back to i mean it there's there's so many i mean obviously
00:05:11um you know the the opportunity to to work with with him and and jeff and you know the all the
00:05:21assistants that were were there when i first got there that have gone on to have remarkable careers
00:05:26um you know just the amazing talent of of people and horses and and uh you know the opportunity as a
00:05:36young person to to to get to work in an environment like that and learn from from all of those guys it
00:05:42was just uh you know tremendous experience i mean one that that you just uh you can never imagine
00:05:50yourself being fortunate enough to to be in that position
00:05:53todd one of the things that struck me as i was reading uh some older articles about dwayne lucas
00:06:01uh just trying to take a look at his career arc is that uh in an interview about 10 years ago
00:06:07he was reflecting on his amazing streak he's won 15 triple crown races and at the time that i believe
00:06:14that you were uh working with dwayne he at one time won six triple crown races in a row in the span
00:06:21between 1994 and 1996 and the thing that stood out to me was later in his life dwayne said at the time
00:06:28it was just go go go i didn't really have time to let that soak in and appreciate it at the moment and
00:06:34as a young person working for him at the time did you get that sense and as a trainer in your own
00:06:39career later in life do you now try to take the time to soak in and appreciate those moments
00:06:44i i wish that i could say that i do but no i i think uh you know you get on the hamster wheel and
00:06:53you're rolling and and you know i think when we all get older we look back and we reflect and say
00:07:00man i wish i had taken a little more time to enjoy that and actually wayne said we was having dinner last
00:07:05last summer with wayne and and he he actually said something like that you know like i wish
00:07:11that i would have taken a little more time or you know taking a day off every once in a while and and
00:07:15it really struck me like wow you know wayne saying that you know that's that's significant because
00:07:22a day a day off wasn't wasn't part of the wasn't part of the game plan you know it was uh it was it was
00:07:29on to the next one and you know that's horse racing probably more so than than than any sport um
00:07:37really is there there's no day off you know and then you you reach the pinnacle and you win the
00:07:44derby and the next day you're trying to figure out how to get to pimlico and when you're gonna go and
00:07:48so it's just you know it it never ends and and you know i know i know he says that but you know
00:07:54there was also a huge reason why he was so successful and who he was is that he he was
00:08:01110 percent committed todd we've heard lots of anecdotes lots of stories about wayne over the past
00:08:11couple of days since his passing but what is one of your perhaps oldest and most favorite stories
00:08:19of wayne that you can actually tell us here so um wayne came into belmont i can't remember which
00:08:27year this was but he came into belmont and uh he was staying at the garden city hotel so after we
00:08:34finished we finished training um i was giving him a ride back to the hotel and he said um let's uh let's
00:08:42stop by that carvel ice cream store on the on the way to the hotel so we we go we go in and um
00:08:51wayne orders an extra large double chocolate milkshake and you know it's like a teenage girl
00:09:01working behind the counter and she goes back and she she makes the shake but she uses vanilla ice cream
00:09:07with two squirts of chocolate syrup in it and she brings it over and he goes very politely said you
00:09:14know that's that's not really what i wanted i wanted double chocolate i wanted chocolate ice cream
00:09:19and chocolate syrup so she says oh i'm sorry sir and she starts to take it back and he says no no no no
00:09:26here let me have that i'll drink that while you make me one double chocolate so she makes double
00:09:33chocolate and she puts one squirt of syrup in it and she kind of looks over at wayne and wayne gives
00:09:41her the go ahead so she puts another another double so but you know i was thinking about it so at the
00:09:48time i was like man this is so cool that he while he's waiting on this other milkshake to be made
00:09:54he downs this extra large vanilla with chocolate syrup now he gets the second one and i'm thinking
00:10:01you know like that's pretty cool that he did that but then i started thinking about it later on and
00:10:06it's like you know what that's why he was who he was that's who he was the guy that had chocolate ice
00:10:14cream with two squirts of chocolate syrup you know and that that's the way he lived his life you know
00:10:20he was he was always gonna have the best looking pony he was gonna have the you know the the nicest
00:10:26suit that's that to me it was just like you know what that that kind of sums up who he was
00:10:32and we're joined now by kieran mclaughlin who is a protege was a protege of dwayne lucas
00:10:39retired trainer of his own right and currently the jockey agent for john velasquez and louis saez
00:10:46kieran you're joining us just as you pulled into saratoga for the season welcome to the show
00:10:51thank you very much uh take us back let's let's start at the beginning uh tell us how you first
00:10:57how old you were and how you first ended up uh in dwayne under dwayne lucas's shed row and what
00:11:02your first impressions were of the man i met him arletti and i met him in 1984 at arlington park when
00:11:10he shipped in lucky lucky lucky and from there it was like september and we stayed in touch and finally
00:11:17he hired me in january of 85 to go to california so we drove seven days from miami we were in miami then
00:11:28and went to work for him at santa anita in 1985 february what was one of your first impressions of
00:11:38arriving after spending seven days driving across the country to land at dwayne lucas's barn at santa
00:11:45anita well the first thing was he told me to meet him at four o'clock at the donut shop i said four
00:11:52o'clock what do we do at four o'clock and then walked noble three wit and uh willard proctor and
00:12:01we grabbed a coffee and donut and we were out of there by before four o'clock i got there a little
00:12:06early and uh we drove to the barn at four and it was dark and i wondered what we were going to do that
00:12:14early but it was the set list he waited to the rate to the day of morning up to do the set list
00:12:20in case it rained and he had to change something so we looked at the horses they were walking and we
00:12:27talked at four in the morning and for the next seven years it was four in the morning get up and
00:12:33go to work but it was the landscaping probably and the quality of horses that got me the first
00:12:40day or two i mean with the trees there and the flowers there it was beautiful he took some
00:12:47harassment from some people i brought up willard proctor i think he said this guy this isn't
00:12:54landscaping this is horse training so we'll see how long he lasts but that was a lot of you know what
00:13:01people thought and talked about back then yeah there was a lot of a lot of animosity towards
00:13:07somebody who came in from the quarter horse world and was such an immediate success so seven years with
00:13:13wayne and jeff yes at the time um we can't we can't overlook jeff um what was he like give us an
00:13:23idea what he was like as a boss he was demanding and i have another famous story about you don't want
00:13:30to be late and one day i lived in san demas so it was 40 minute drive to hollywood park and my alarm
00:13:40didn't go off because the electricity went off and i got up and i got there about 20 minutes late
00:13:49and he was on the pony heading to the track and i said wayne i'm so sorry the electricity went off
00:13:55i will get more alarm clocks and it'll never happen again and he didn't say anything but i knew it
00:14:03better not happen again so i went and bought three alarm clocks wind up plug in whatever and i was never
00:14:09late again karen um we've had so many uh different guests on the show today sharing their recollections
00:14:19and remembrances of de wayne and you know he's portrayed as as a driving laser focused trainer
00:14:26however that may be true but he he also didn't last five decades six decades of the game without
00:14:33changing his ways to some degree and even after you left his employment and you continued on as friends
00:14:39and you were a trainer and later as a jockey agent um you know part of his legacy is that
00:14:44he rolled and changed with the times too and and how did you see that playing out i saw it play out
00:14:50very well he was always positive and always thought about the next crop of babies and going to do you
00:14:57know win the derby but he was a little tough on us agents sometimes and you know he yelled at me a few
00:15:03times about thought he had a call with me and he didn't have a call but going back to the beginning
00:15:09i have a couple of good stories that says a lot about him when letty and i were in california he
00:15:16asked us to go to new york and be the assistant there at belmont and it's okay so he said are you
00:15:25have flights all set i said yeah your secretary got us first class flights from los angeles to new york
00:15:33he did everything first class he said oh cancel those flights he said you can take my private jet
00:15:39as assistant trainers 25 years old laddie and i got on his private jet with our cat and stuff and
00:15:49flew all the way to new york stopping omaha for gas and then going on to new york but the weather was
00:15:57bad so we had to land in new jersey got a limousine took us to garden city new york 105 jackson street
00:16:05which we bought off of him in 1992 and we're just coming from 105 jackson street right now so we still
00:16:13own his house but he just took such good care of us and back in those days he had a helicopter also
00:16:21and the helicopter would land at hollywood park in the training track pick up six jockeys or four
00:16:28jockeys and we would helicopter down to del mar and work the babies it wasn't del mar it was the
00:16:36training center that he bought with mr klein and built barns there that bill gates owns now but it was
00:16:44really neat to get in the helicopter and go down the coast get off work horses and fly back so those
00:16:51days were amazing retired hall of fame jockey jerry bailey now joins us as we continue with our
00:16:59recollections and remembrances and a celebration of the life of d wayne lucas jerry thank you for taking
00:17:05the time to join us today um i was as i was researching some questions to ask you it struck me that
00:17:12early on in your career um i know you're known for your association with riding grindstone the 1996
00:17:19derby winner and i know you wrote a couple of breeders cup winners for d wayne but essentially
00:17:23you guys were competing geographically on opposite sides of the country were your first interactions
00:17:29with d wayne as a competitor before you got to ride for him and tell me what that was like please
00:17:33well my first interaction with lucas was when i was a kid in new mexico at rio doso downs
00:17:39i grew up in west texas and we used to go up to rio doso every summer my dad owned some horses
00:17:44horses and wayne was up there training and i never remember meeting him but i remember where his barn
00:17:50was and wayne's been called a lot of things a lot of nicknames rhinestone cowboy uh but he had a
00:17:58nickname back then called mr clean because he had a vacuum between every other stall of the horses
00:18:05and before they would go up to the paddock because he was betting on sawdust as everybody was
00:18:09he would take the vacuum and suck all the dust off of them before they went to the paddock
00:18:14and he got the nickname mr clean so my association with wayne goes probably back 60 years even when we
00:18:22would hit the back side wherever we were uh covering whatever race we were covering um
00:18:28especially the kentucky derby but if if wayne was stabled at a track where nbc had a telecast or espn
00:18:36before that we would always make it a point even if he had no horse in our race even when he was down
00:18:42to you know a dozen horses and no real good horses we would always make it a point to stop by
00:18:48and say hi to wayne because that's that's just who he was i mean he was uh he was he was the icon
00:18:55how special was it that we got a chance in the later years of his life to see him back
00:19:03on top sort of in the triple crown races and sort of the rejuvenation of wayne lucas
00:19:11yeah i i think that it was it was very special and i think he deserved that
00:19:17for as good as he was for as long as he was you know everybody i mean i don't have to tell you this
00:19:23everybody knows he set all the records he was the benchmark uh number of races won greatest stage
00:19:28one he revolutionized the travel back and forth i mean that was just it was crazy uh but then he as
00:19:35you all know he went through that low and then you can never count way now because here he comes again
00:19:40i would i would never believe that he was going to win another preface or two i mean because in the
00:19:4520 years i've been a broadcaster he won with oxbow and then he won with seize the gray so i never
00:19:51thought wayne had it and him to do that because he just wasn't at the time getting those kind of
00:19:56horses but then again if i really sit down and think about it i shouldn't have counted him out
00:20:02because he was always the kind of guy that would come up with something and i think that's due to
00:20:07his positivity look i think most people know he was a motivational speaker as well he was really good
00:20:13at that kind of stuff and um that that's just wayne he was just mr positive jerry your second
00:20:21kentucky derby win was with grindstone you had already won the race three years earlier with
00:20:25sea hero um tell us a little bit about how you partnered up with d wayne and how you got the
00:20:30mount on grindstone even though it was a very short-lived partnership because grindstone
00:20:35suffered an injury and was subsequently retired and did not compete in the preakness how did that
00:20:40all come about please yeah i wayne had a he had so many cool phrases and as a jockey you could
00:20:48never expect to ride a horse that you've just ridden previously he wayne's phrase was listen jock
00:20:55these are one race commitments and we're going to take it race to race we're not getting married buddy
00:21:01we're just dating so um that's the way that you took it as a jockey and and when i won the
00:21:07louisiana derby i kind of expected to ride him back in the arkansas derby but when he was beat a beaten
00:21:13second in the arkansas derby i wasn't sure i was going to have the mount back again i thought i would
00:21:18but you never knew with wayne um so yeah he put him back put me back on him and i'm not i'm not sure
00:21:24he thought grindstone was the best of the four the five i think he had five in that year that he had
00:21:30um but when he went around the circle talking to the rider all of us riders in the paddock he made you
00:21:37think your horse was the horse to beat uh so he always inspired confidence uh i mean he didn't he
00:21:45didn't uh i don't think he told me anything specific but i think he said something like you
00:21:49need a clear trip you're gonna have to have a pretty clear trip and you know it was it was really a
00:21:54great trip and i think it meant more to wane to win for bill young and over brook farm than anything
00:22:02else in that particular year and now we welcome in the hall of famer bob baffert bob thanks so much
00:22:08for joining us and it's almost fitting that you are our last and final guest today as the last and
00:22:14final horse that d wayne lucas ran and won with at churchill downs was yours owned by jill and yourself
00:22:22can you talk about what wayne meant to you over the course of the past couple of years
00:22:27and i first saw him when i was like 17 years old i was at we have a little meet there at sonoid arizona
00:22:34it's like 30 miles away from nogalus where i grew up on the border and he was training for a guy that
00:22:40i eventually started training for later on you know 10 years later his name was rulon goodman he owned
00:22:46these grocery stores you know spent a lot of money on good horses and uh wayne picked him up and he
00:22:53we had a little fraternity there in uh sonoid arizona that my my dad and my uncle put together it was
00:23:01that was our first saturday may the sonoid arizona that was the big deal and he came in from new
00:23:06mexico in this shiny trailer with the chrome wheels and the big stetson hat and just i mean like i mean
00:23:14just talk about you know first class operation into these and the horse went into these ricky dig
00:23:20dinkity stalls you know that we had out there but i remember him i thought wow man that's wayne i was on
00:23:26the fence i can still remember i exactly where i was standing outside the little chain link paddock
00:23:31fence that we had there and watching him just maneuver and just uh ran his horses he cleaned up
00:23:37took off and i didn't see him again for probably another you know five years and so and i think when
00:23:44he he switched over the quarter horse world he didn't have any clients you know most thoroughbred
00:23:49trainers they start they work for somebody or they you know some thoroughbred trainer and then they get a
00:23:55horse or two he had to just go out and and recruit that's where the basketball skills came in
00:24:01and he was like nil he recruited his own people and uh he went in there and and like he just made this
00:24:09big splash he went to the sales and he bought fast looking horses and uh he you know he he wasn't
00:24:15looking at bloodlines he was just looking at the physical probably the first guy that started just
00:24:20buying off a physical and later you know and i noticed that he always stuck with the same sort
00:24:25of bloodlines that he had luck with he was smart and even though he had his you know uh he you know
00:24:32the way he'd grade him a one a five eight or whatever i think that was more like you know like hey this is
00:24:37how we do it you know like basically but he went it was all about the physical but uh and i remember
00:24:44when he was at the quarter horse world he his barn you know go to his barn the way he had it just so
00:24:49pristine i mean not a he had the herringbone raking the puffs out front and the trainers next to him
00:24:55they try to mimic him and they all went broke i mean you just couldn't do it i mean it was like
00:25:00i there was a couple guys where they tried to do it no way it just wasn't going to happen you know
00:25:04and uh but you didn't want to be stable next to him because it's like you know moving in and you
00:25:09got a house and this guy built a mansion next to you you know you got to update your your your
00:25:14your gardens and stuff like that but he was at the but behind all the the the showmanship
00:25:21there was a really a good horseman and i i'd asked him for a job when i was a junior in high school i
00:25:27called him up one time and i was scared to death i finally called him and i but he was so nice to me
00:25:33he let me down you know that's one thing about it he he uh he he validated your your the way you
00:25:40know he made you feel really good after you talked to him and he said oh you would have been perfect
00:25:44for me but i just hired somebody just and when i got off the phone i go what what a great guy you
00:25:49know he just made you he made you feel good inside that's awesome so wayne was already king of the hill
00:25:59and thoroughbred racing when you made the transition from quarter horses to thoroughbreds and now all of a
00:26:04sudden the guy that you looked up to and then everyone idolized now you're competing head to head
00:26:11against and doing well against when you transition to thoroughbred racing what was that like at that
00:26:17point to be competing with wayne not only on the track but even for some of the same owners
00:26:22i learned from him you know the kind of horses he bought but the way he ran his business the way he
00:26:30he focused on everything and i always i'd always be in the box next to him like after a race he'd get
00:26:38beat but i'd listen and i'd win there i'd listen to see and i mean it was you would have thought they
00:26:45won the race you know like it's perfect that's exactly horse ran fourth got beat five six length
00:26:52that's perfect that's exactly what i was looking for we're looking good we're going to move forward
00:26:56it's charismatic right and i go look at you got no shot you know and so uh sure enough he takes
00:27:02from lexington wins at lexington then he went to the kentucky derby but i'm telling you he was he was
00:27:08optimistic you know he's just an optimistic and all and we were talking about telling stories and he was
00:27:13telling me one time that uh they were in a big race and they're coming down and when you come out of
00:27:18the paddock and that little lane to the the main paddock it was my uh wayne was with uh mike smith was
00:27:25next to him all of a sudden his horse is acting up is running backwards towards him so wayne gets
00:27:30mike and puts him in front of him and mike smith goes wayne you're trying to kill me he says mike
00:27:37there's a thousand of you there's only one wayne lucas you know and so i just i i just love that
00:27:44about him i've got one more bob uh before we let you go you wrote a very heartfelt fitting tribute
00:27:52to wayne on x we don't see you post an awful lot of things nowadays on social media and right at the
00:27:58end of it you said quite fittingly i hope i made him proud yeah he uh gonna make me cry here but
00:28:09he just i gotta miss the guy you made him proud
00:28:15we do this so your granddaughter can work on a farm someday
00:28:21so the stands will still be packed in 50 years that's why we come to work every day
00:28:30obsess over every single detail
00:28:33because the story of racing is written one moment at a time and the future of our industry
00:28:42deserves nothing less keeneland every moment matters
00:28:47and now we're going to highlight griffin johnson the new owner of the year we spoke to him right
00:28:54before sandman went for his bid in the kentucky derby grandmas love him and tiktokers really love him
00:29:01let's take a look at griffin johnson now we welcome in the gamesway guest of the week and
00:29:07it's a young man by the name of griffin johnson may not be that familiar with in horse racing circles
00:29:12but to the general population he is very well known he's an influencer which means he has six
00:29:18zillion followers on tiktok and and and uh instagram and all that uh griffin before we get into racing
00:29:24stuff and you are on because you're part owner of sandman but for those of us who were born before
00:29:30the social media craze took off what is an influencer well thank you for the intro i appreciate
00:29:37that uh i would say an influencer at least for me is someone uh on the internet that's able to
00:29:45uh kind of you know captivate the culture of the iphone or i guess any internet device and uh you know
00:29:54make content that people enjoy whether that's horse racing whether that's cooking cleaning
00:29:59uh anything in between really uh just you know putting content out there that helps people or
00:30:05gives them entertainment really and if you can influence sandman to run another big race in the
00:30:11derby you got something there huh yeah we'll see how how great of an influencer i really am i guess
00:30:18going up here so how did you get involved how and why did you get involved with the with the
00:30:25ownership of sandman yeah that's that's a great question it actually was kind of just random um
00:30:32i i run a venture capital fund animal capital uh that's kind of my second job aside from influencing
00:30:39on the internet and uh i had a mutual friend that uh had someone that worked at west point that they knew
00:30:46and they connected me with america's best racing and told me about their program
00:30:51so it was i guess not really uh me reaching out it was just kind of something that happened and
00:30:59they just had got sandman west point had just came into their ownership with sandman and they're like
00:31:05hey we have this beautiful gray horse we really think that you guys could be a great pair uh would
00:31:11love for you to meet them and just you know see if you would be interested in getting into racing and
00:31:15obviously i saw him and i was sold immediately so so you jumped in from the beginning it's not like
00:31:23you all of a sudden he's a grade one winner and you're like yeah i'll have a piece of that one
00:31:27you heard from the get-go were you yeah i mean it's just like anything else once he starts winning
00:31:33people start paying attention so now they see me and sandman and you know all of our content on
00:31:39the internet but yeah i jumped in you know from from day one we hadn't even seen him really train or do
00:31:44anything yet uh so yeah it was it was kind of a i trust you you trust me moment and you know luckily
00:31:52no matter how much money you spend or how much prep you put into it you never know if you're going to
00:31:57get a true winner so uh i just think my lucky stars that i got a piece of sandman out of all the horses
00:32:04you know how lucky you are i mean someone should just be rubbing you or something
00:32:09you are lucky as to be yeah i trust me i am fully aware of the amount of luck that went into this i
00:32:17mean i feel for genuinely feel for everyone that's been putting their heart and soul into this sport for
00:32:22so many years you know just uh look at the derby trail itself you know you have cole battle himself
00:32:28you know uh you have people that have been doing this their whole life and then there's me
00:32:32so i'm taking it every moment i i hope that we can really use this to grow the sport and expand it
00:32:38and you know bring in people and show them what horse racing is really all about well griffin most
00:32:44people i i think i'm pretty accurate in saying this who are involved in thoroughbred racing in any way
00:32:51were either born into it from a family that was involved in the sport or they had a grandfather or a
00:32:57father or an uncle or a brother that took them to the races at an early age and got them
00:33:02interested where are you from and did you have any of that growing up yeah for sure uh i definitely
00:33:09have a background i'm from you know central illinois uh right on the border of illinois and indiana so
00:33:15i'm only three hours from you know churchill down so for me growing up it was mostly you know farm
00:33:23animals i grew up bailing so much hay i couldn't even tell you that i've went to feeding you know more of
00:33:29the the 4h ponies and some of the barrel horses and things like that but definitely not the level
00:33:35of you know thoroughbreds and horse racing you're definitely right uh and it was actually something
00:33:40for me i guess it was spoken about in a way that was almost unattainable unless you were born into it
00:33:46um and i think that with this new social media wave it's kind of shown people that there's more than
00:33:52just having a multi-million dollar upbringing to get you into this sport now so the answer is yes i
00:34:01had some but it still seemed you know pretty pretty unattainable until recently uh that i could even have
00:34:07a thoroughbred or any skin in the game of horse racing so i've got one quick question how does a kid
00:34:14from illinois get 9.7 million um tiktok followers like how did you start we were you a nurse someone
00:34:24said that you were in nursing school yeah i was uh i was in college actually i was it was my junior year
00:34:30and i just had a friend he said hey you can post online and make money um you know at the time i was
00:34:36flat broke so i heard money and and internet i was like okay i can i can make some videos i can i can do
00:34:43that um so yeah it was just me in class the life of a nursing student uh just kind of going throughout
00:34:50my day and it really wasn't anything special i think it was just humility and showing people
00:34:56my struggles and kind of what it was like to to be in the medical field and that's where
00:35:01it all started and i ended up pivoting and moving to la for a bit and doing the whole influencer life so
00:35:07you know i've lived a few lives in the past five or six years
00:35:11so griffin i i can't believe i'm aging myself like this but i've been involved with the sport in
00:35:19one way or another since the late 70s or the early 80s and throughout my entire time in thoroughbred
00:35:24racing it's always been said one of the challenges in the sport is how to attract young people to be
00:35:32interested and it seems like it's getting worse and worse and worse in that regard as as we've gone
00:35:39on now what do you see as the biggest challenges in getting other people like you involved in the
00:35:46sport yeah thanks for that question it's actually probably my biggest passion in the sport right now
00:35:53is getting my generation involved um and i think that just this conversation we're having now is the
00:36:00perfect indicator that people recognize that and it's starting to change um i think that you know
00:36:06me getting a piece of sandman was was just uh you know kind of a gift from from the god somewhere uh
00:36:15you know just saying hey it's it's time to bring people to the sport and i think you know um you take a
00:36:21perfect blend of social media and traditional entertainment and media coverage like yourself
00:36:27and if you can connect those two and and find the synergy between you know finding the people
00:36:33that have the power in the sport and are already traditionally in it and ingrained into it and
00:36:38pairing up with new people newcomers that are interested um and can give a new perspective and
00:36:44and show people that it's possible to get in and not just have a legacy and uh combining those two has
00:36:50been working really great i think that you know we're we're actually doing it on this interview as
00:36:55we're talking about it right now um and just and just getting that out to the public
00:37:00well griffin johnson thank you so much that was really a breath of fresh air thank you on behalf
00:37:06of all the sport for your efforts to bring in a new generation and the new eyeballs good luck to
00:37:11sandman in the kentucky derby thank you very much and uh once again thank you guys for your time uh
00:37:17i really appreciate you know you guys taking a chance on a young buck trying to
00:37:22bring some new people in so thank you guys as always
00:37:25mckinsey in a dominant performance
00:37:29million two million two right there a million two hundred thousand
00:37:40biazza gets his moment in the sun in the pennsylvania derby chancer mcpatrick wins the champagne
00:37:45impressively spectacular display from scottish lassie who's in front by 15 legs
00:37:53one of the biggest stories in american horse racing in 2025 was the emergence of sovereignty
00:38:02the winner of the kentucky derby belmont jim dandy travers unfortunately sovereignty didn't make the
00:38:08breeders cup classic and as we tape this we're not yet sure if he's going to run next year as a
00:38:14four-year-old but the story covered a lot of bases we probably weren't going to get shake muhammad on
00:38:19the podcast but we got belmont and jockey jr alvarado who really showed the human side what it's like
00:38:26to be the rider on top of sovereignty welcome in now the gainsway guests of the week and it is belmont
00:38:33stakes winning jockey jr alvarado jr thanks for joining us um this is a tuesday afternoon
00:38:39what were you doing earlier today hey well hello thanks thanks for for having me and you know just
00:38:46getting home actually i was in the in the city we're doing kind of like a a um a food tasting in
00:38:53the in the city in one of those restaurants you know i was invited by the by the yankee staff and
00:38:58and so we were recording something for for just network and and the yes tv so yeah you know i was
00:39:05with javier castellano and and johnny velasquez so we did have a lot of fun there well let's talk
00:39:11about the belmont stakes for a second um just another dominating performance by sovereignty
00:39:16going into the race what were you thinking like what was your strategy were you going to follow
00:39:22journalism again if possible like you did in the derby what was your mindset yes you know it was a
00:39:29little bit of a question mark where i was gonna be you know i knew i was i was in a perfect uh
00:39:35post position because i wanted it too i wanted in the inside i wanted to save ground the first turn
00:39:41and but yes i i didn't know i i figured probably i was gonna be following either journalism or baeza or
00:39:48maybe both of them you know i i thought i was gonna be behind both of them to be honest but
00:39:53listen i guess he was he was super ready he was super sharp uh going into the belmont day he he put my
00:40:00he put himself and myself in a in a even better position than i thought junior it's been a real
00:40:06up and down year for you and right now it's obviously on an upswing but on march 23rd you
00:40:11fractured your scapula at gulfstream park and that you had to miss the mount on uh on uh sovereignty in
00:40:18the florida derby manny franco took over uh did you think at that time that you're not only gonna miss
00:40:23the florida derby but you might miss the kentucky derby as well yes i mean i remember laying in the
00:40:29in the bed right there with my agent next to me and then when you know i keep telling my name man
00:40:34i think i i may have a fracture mic as like i know my body and and this is a you know i can't handle
00:40:40pain i've been through a lot of injuries and and and i knew it's like this is this is a little more
00:40:45than i think it is and and you know when the doctor told us you know you have a uh a fractured
00:40:51scapula so i was like what is that like a her line like it's not that bad you know can i go back in a
00:40:56week and it's like no no no no you have a completely fractured scapula you you will have to probably
00:41:02be out between six to eight weeks so like right there i just i remember looking at my agent and
00:41:08i'm like shaking my hands like why this has to happen to me like why these things keep happening
00:41:14to me and i didn't say that at the moment it's just like that's all this keep going in my hands like
00:41:19god well why like why like since i like i know the horse that i'm riding i know the the the horse
00:41:28ability i know what he's capable of and like i say everything just started like a lot of thoughts
00:41:34going through my mind like i'm thinking like well i mean i i cannot believe i'm gonna be missing the
00:41:38derby like at that point i wasn't even thinking about the florida derby which is the derby because
00:41:43somehow i was gonna try to find my way to get back in the kentucky derby if he wins the derby
00:41:48with many friends that was even before uh bill called me and tell and tell me that that i was
00:41:54gonna have that that the ride back whenever i was ready but but once again i mean that day that night
00:42:01it was just a nightmare a completely whole nightmare that i was living living in life you
00:42:06know i couldn't believe that all that was happening and and i remember even telling him the doctor
00:42:11before he left the room again i thought like there is anything you guys can put me like give me
00:42:17they you know can kind of numb the pain then i can move it and i can and i can go through all this
00:42:22and he like said like it was like we i we i can do that like we can there's nothing i can do that i
00:42:28can help you you need to rest as a very rare fracture because the scapula is kind of like a flat bone
00:42:34we don't even how you ended up breaking that so he says he's like you have to just just rest
00:42:39so yeah he was he was you know it was a nightmare of first probably couple days to be honest
00:42:48so they told you six to eight weeks what did the timetable turn out to be and how did you get it
00:42:54quicker well it was exactly three weeks and three days when i was back again riding in races and
00:43:02riding riding in the morning it took me two weeks and two days you know like i i i spoke the next
00:43:11day that i got out of the hospital you know i spoke with one of the doctors that normally sees us here
00:43:15in saratoga and he was in south florida so i went to see him in person and he said like you know it's
00:43:20funny because actually he had the same fracture i guess a long time ago and he says like they'll tell
00:43:26you don't move your arm i'll tell you the whole opposite move your arm move your arm because once
00:43:32you stop moving your arm for a week then you're gonna lose a lot of mobility and it's gonna be
00:43:37hard for you to recover it's like you're gonna have pain it's it's like it's up to you how much
00:43:42pain you will handle but what i would recommend you is to keep moving your arm i'm not gonna tell
00:43:47you lift anyway or none of that don't lift anyway don't lift none of your kids but keep moving your
00:43:52arm keep moving your arm keep moving your arm and hopefully in two weeks you should be
00:43:56much better and and and then you know after three weeks you can come see me and then we hopefully
00:44:01you'll be able to to be back around four weeks hopefully but once again i don't know where i
00:44:08guess it was meant to be god helped me to heal quicker than like in two weeks i remember going
00:44:14to see him here in saratoga and i thought listen i felt not a hundred percent but i felt good enough to
00:44:20go get him some horses in the morning and i need the okay and then you know i went to see him he
00:44:24checked me out he said like well go get him some horses and you call me the next day or call me
00:44:29after and let me know how you feel it's like you're gonna be probably in pain and i remember i went to
00:44:34work a couple horses for billy mo and i galloped two horses then i went back again the next day and and
00:44:39and and myself i couldn't i couldn't even believe how great i was feeling each day you know moving on
00:44:46and and and and and then i called my agent i listen put me in some horses i'm i'm ready to go so i'm
00:44:51ready to i don't want to waste more time i've been out already for for two long weeks so like i need
00:44:56to be back in action well you've ridden so many other good horses in your career for matt and for
00:45:02everyone else let's talk about a couple of them what was the experience like with the whole cody's wish
00:45:08phenomenon yeah you know randy that was that was very special it just uh it was completely different
00:45:15than than than writing sovereignty i think with sovereignty being very calm writing cody's wish
00:45:21i felt a lot of pressure every single time i was writing it you know i didn't want i didn't want to
00:45:26be the one who couldn't make a mistake and be the villain of the beautiful story what was happening
00:45:33i always that was always in my mind like i cannot make i can't make mistake i cannot do anything wrong i
00:45:40came over i can't make anything little and get this horse beat because all the eyes are on me i'm
00:45:47gonna look like the bad guy right here so but every time i get to cross the wire first i mean it was the
00:45:55happiness it was like for me i was giving something i was giving something every time i got to win the race
00:46:02i didn't i never celebrated like it was uh uh one of my victory i never feel like wow that was for me
00:46:09wow all the work that i did for this no it never was i never felt that way right in cody's wish i always
00:46:14felt like i i was doing it for for cody dormant for the family for for everything that was happening with
00:46:21with with my horse and with cody dormant that's that's what i all the time i felt every single time i
00:46:26every every time i was gonna write it i felt like i need to win for them i need to keep this going
00:46:34this beautiful story going i i i i have to make it happen one more time that's what i always say
00:46:40every time i had to write that horse and and you know at the end i remember the last race and and
00:46:48and the breeders cup you know like actually it was almost like a relief that as a jockey you never want
00:46:53a horse to retire but for me i was like wow that will be the last one you know like i would be like
00:46:58now probably relief after that and and and you know it was a dramatic act as can be you know we went
00:47:06down head to head with national treasure then it's a claiming foul then it's like i don't know if you
00:47:12ask me it felt like it was like a 30 minute way and and and it was just an unbelievable but that
00:47:18experience yeah that was that was unique completely different to any other experience i ever have
00:47:25winning great ones or any other big races to be honest junior most people must think i think they
00:47:32think anyways that junior is a nickname and lo and behold it is not as your official legal first name
00:47:39but obviously that's different normally junior would be at the end of the name uh tell us how this you
00:47:46came to be junior alvarado yeah you know it was supposed to be rafael alvarado jr that's how my
00:47:52dad and my mom kind of planned and and what happened was like you know i was born and then my mind was
00:47:57having some complications and you know right there you have to do all the process very quick and and
00:48:03and you know when they listed up they put junior rafael alvarado and my dad didn't want to kind of like
00:48:08waste more time trying to change it and redo it all over again and he's like yeah yeah that's good just
00:48:14leave it like that you know he say he he said he thought it was probably meant to be that way then
00:48:19then he said like he didn't want to change it because i did you know growing up when i was probably
00:48:24a night a lot of people were already asking me it wasn't supposed to be junior is normally like you
00:48:29know after your dad like you're the junior so it's rafael alvarado junior and then i get to ask my dad and
00:48:35you know they they told me the story about what happened and and you know and that that's i guess that's fine
00:48:40then you know but it that's how it was all right well junior thanks so much for joining us today i
00:48:48really enjoyed all those stories i like you even though you're a yankee fan we'll have to work on
00:48:52that okay once again thank you for being on the gainsway guest of the week on the thoroughbred daily
00:48:59news podcast and continued success yeah well no thank you so much again thanks for having me
00:49:04the pennsylvania breeding program is the best program in the country the stallion awards the
00:49:13owner bonuses also the restrictive races and the stakes races for pennsylvania brands this year eight
00:49:18breeders are on track to earn over two hundred thousand dollars in breeders awards and two could
00:49:25hit the million dollar mark we have the best program in the country take advantage of the fantastic
00:49:32program that we have learn more at pabred.com with some of the fullest fields in the country
00:49:39and quality racing year round there's never been a better time to reap the rewards of breeding and
00:49:45racing in kentucky purse money in kentucky is at an all-time high as his average purse per race
00:49:53outpacing california florida and new york kentucky breads breed them raise them race them
00:50:02we all win
00:50:06and now perhaps not one of the biggest stories was terry branshaw who owned a stake and taken
00:50:12by the wind who took down the pocahontas stake she's actually she won that she was headed towards
00:50:18the breeders cup and she never got to the breeders cup so the chances of us having terry on are perhaps
00:50:23nil from now on but talking to him when we did boy oh boy that was so much fun we learned an awful lot
00:50:29about terry we learned about parrots we learned about reigning horses we learned about quarter
00:50:35horses and we really learned about the man terry bradshaw well we have a special gainsway guest of
00:50:42the week you know him from his play on the football field being in the nfl hall of fame and also his
00:50:47work on fox uh nfl broadcast but you might get to start to know him as a possible owner of a
00:50:53breeders cup horse this is none other than terry bradshaw who was obviously uh very excited about
00:50:59the wind by taken by wind in the pocahontas stakes terry i want to back up a little bit though you were
00:51:04very involved in the quarter horse business for a very long time uh you've owned a couple of
00:51:10i still am okay you still am uh you own part of mission impassable you own part of gradar
00:51:16now you have taken by the wind where did this affinity for horses come from
00:51:21i grew up um i spent most of my time on my grandfather's farm and he had clydesdales and
00:51:26i used to sit on top of them while he plowed and the smell of the horse sweat was something it was
00:51:32like perfume to me i thought it was the coolest thing and i was always down there loving on them and
00:51:37crawling on them and if and my uncles were all cutting horse riders they all rode cutting horses
00:51:44so that's you know it's kind of like a kid introduce them just a bunch of stuff and they'll
00:51:48pick what they like and i picked horses it's just a natural thing for me so with cutting horses you
00:51:53were obviously raised around the quarter horse breed uh right what some people don't realize is that
00:51:59you've actually had a kentucky derby starter mission mission impossible you also own gradar
00:52:06uh through your association with your louisiana tech buddy steve davison and twin creeks racing but
00:52:12then you got out to focus primarily on raising quarter horses of all kinds not just racing
00:52:18quarter horses and now you're back right what why the return now to thoroughbreds
00:52:23randy i got a call uh i watch all the i watch 602 all the time uh thoroughbreds channel and it's all it's
00:52:36racing um and i never really got out of it mentally i got of it physically and then i always wanted to get
00:52:46back in but i i didn't really i could easily have done that and i'd actually called steve davison and
00:52:53said steve uh i've done this horse the quarter horse thing i've got my stallion business going i said you
00:53:00know what i'm a little bored i i need to get that some action back and i said what do you got that i can
00:53:06buy into and to his to to his credit he said you know i really don't have anything that i would want
00:53:14you and i to be in and i said well yeah i appreciated that uh and then um kurt menifee and i got together
00:53:23and kurt was telling me what a great because fox does the belmont and kurt said you got to meet
00:53:31this kenny mcpete he's he you and him would hit it off you guys are just alike so i bought those two
00:53:37fillies and then i'm in on eight more yearlings this year so it's exciting i understand the game i know
00:53:48win or lose horses you know they either run or they don't or they get hurt and so on and so forth and
00:53:54it was just the excitement of being back in the thoroughbred business and then taken by the wind
00:53:59and come on did i expect her to win uh i can't say no i'll tell you exactly no no um and just
00:54:10kind of like with terry bradshaw it's not going to win anything like that although i was successful
00:54:13with mission and um great art but then it got fun and then she won the stakes race the pocahontas
00:54:22and the way she ran on that race i was watching that told my wife look how easy she's running i mean
00:54:26she's not even tired and then coming out of turn four and she split them and just turned it on you
00:54:33know and she has that she has that uh distance in her pedigree and i went wow and that got me excited
00:54:39i don't mind telling you and i couldn't i couldn't wait to tell kurt hey kurt you know made a little
00:54:44money yesterday
00:54:48so i mean that's a long story but it was just let's do it just for fun that's all it was
00:54:54terry before we get back to horses uh we want to know what are those bird-like noises in the
00:54:59background you're so smart birds birds they're birds they're they're macaws um and they are loud
00:55:12i mean they right now we're catching a break but this is where i do podcasts and um you know they're
00:55:19they're over grooming themselves right now but they are some loud suckers you're right
00:55:24but they're birds were they squawking when you watched the race i take it did you watch the race
00:55:29from home terry the pocahontas uh no i was um on the road i i think we were in uh new york um and uh
00:55:46i called kenny kenny said i said kenny what when does the mare race and he said six minutes
00:55:52so so you only had six six minute warning before the race started did you even have time to get a bet
00:55:58down uh no i don't hey randy i don't bet i don't bet i don't gamble i well that's not true i i steve and
00:56:06i do when i'm with steve i throw i put 500 in and and it's and it's like uh okay when i lose it you know
00:56:16i'm through and it's like well why you always got to lose was it's thoroughbred racing and i don't know
00:56:21how to handicap these things and steve's pretty good at he owns the raggason you know he owns that paper
00:56:28and uh he's pretty good and we we won like uh in the first two races at churchill he and i he picked
00:56:35them we won the first two we pocketed about three thousand dollars a piece i went wow i am i'm through for
00:56:43the day and then we he said let's do a trifecta and i said i don't know how you do a trifecta
00:56:51we won fifty thousand dollars on the trifecta fifty thousand dollars now here's the kicker here's
00:56:58the kicker i am so beside myself i've made so much money on three on the on four or five races
00:57:06and every time we won we go to the window and get the cash right on the eighteen hundred bucks we
00:57:13went and got the cash at the two south we went and got the cash the fifty thousand i had a mare out of
00:57:21indian charlie and uh she was she was saddling in the paddock and steve said let's go look let's go
00:57:29watch him saddle our mare for the race we got a big race coming up and i said no no no no no no let's go get
00:57:36to fifty thousand dollars he says well we'll get it on the way back i said no no no no let's
00:57:40get the money right now if we get eighteen hundred dollars surely you'll go get fifty thousand right
00:57:47so he said no so i thought okay we go down watch her we watch her get saddled up and then she gets
00:57:52last in the race and i didn't care because i'm worth the fifty grand we go back to the windows
00:57:58thieves doing this
00:58:01oh no oh lost it lost the ticket lost the fifty thousand dollar ticket lost it and i'm sitting
00:58:10there and i'm going what what what happened what's up he goes i don't have i can't find the ticket i
00:58:16said what do you mean you can't find where'd you put it he said i think i put it in my pocket my shirt
00:58:21pocket i went you gotta be kidding it was gone he looked everywhere now as you well know there's
00:58:29all over the floor you sure impossible impossible to find and so i was sick and uh steve to his credit
00:58:42traced it went back to the machine gave the number the credit card number or something he had a suite at
00:58:49church we're down and they re they redid eight well anyway eight months later we got our money
00:58:56oh okay you know they traced it back to the betting and that's something but yeah that was
00:59:03it's quite that's quite a story right there all right so you mentioned breeders cup let's circle this
00:59:08back around now okay there's got to be nothing in your world like winning the super bowl i mean you won
00:59:13four of them right right but but that's got to be the ultimate the ultimate now but what about
00:59:19winning a breeders cup brace i don't know how do you think that would feel i already told you i'm not
00:59:26going to work sunday
00:59:31i i don't i'm one of those people that doesn't like to think about greatness okay it scares me um
00:59:43playing in the super bowl uh i'm in charge i'm in control um and i'm nervous because i don't want to
00:59:50screw up uh i know my legacy depends on winning the super bowl and so the greatest stress i've ever had
00:59:58in my life was those four super bowls we won um the breeders cup uh i'll be there if we if we make it that
01:00:08far if we get there everything goes all right and training goes okay and um she makes it there
01:00:15and i'm sure i'm going to talk myself into saying look this is this is pretty good just getting here
01:00:22with a horse that well it is it is 20 grand come on 20 000 i'm in the breeders cup um
01:00:29um and i'm going to talk myself into low expectations i guess because i can't i don't
01:00:36have control of this so many variables come into play when you win those kind of races uh i've watched
01:00:42them at hall for years on television i've been to a couple of breeders cup myself so i'll be nervous
01:00:50um i'll be real nervous well terry we're going to let you go uh it's fascinating and fun and thank
01:00:58you so much for doing this best of luck with taken by the wind and all your pursuits with thoroughbreds
01:01:03hope to see you thank you bigger part of the game because you bring some life and fun to it so we will
01:01:09have fun with it it's uh no question about that so and thank thank all of you for having me on this
01:01:14i've never done anything like this i've done it for the quarter horses but never like this so
01:01:18i don't know if i said anything good or bad or i don't know you were awesome thank you thank you
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01:02:26well that's a wrap on this special show i hope you really enjoyed it and i want to thank my crew my
01:02:31partners randy moss and zoe cabin and i want to thank not only the people that we highlighted in this show
01:02:37but all our gainsway guests of the week throughout the year um just they were so wonderful to us so
01:02:42cooperative and uh we really had a lot of fun and we really learned a lot and i hope the viewers
01:02:47really enjoyed listening to some of the people that we had on and you know what randy said pretty
01:02:53impressive group we deserve a little thumbs up there for what we did in 2025 have a happy holiday
01:02:58everybody and we'll be back soon
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