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00:00as a journalist you are consumed by two questions constantly how to tell a story
00:17but that's more crucially why to tell a story imagine a country nice weather
00:25let's give a nice one nice weather for England anyway imagine the people in this country believe
00:32they are living in a democracy believe in their own freedom but they are being abused by a power
00:40so every day they don't know to look for it a treacherous combination of press the police and
00:46politicians that hide in plain sight imagine a country where that concealment was imagine a
00:55country where where the news organizations my name is Nick Davis I'm a journalist and this is a story
01:12that ends in seven major police investigations nearly 40 convictions and some of the most powerful people
01:18in this country being brought to their knees my name is Nick Davis I'm a journalist morning I'll just
01:33check in this all started with Stuart Kutner hello this is the most troubling story I've ever written
01:48a story about the abuse of power and the concealment of truth hi hi Nick Davis for the today program I'm late
01:57British journalism is sloppy and morally bankrupt that is the claim of the journalist Nick Davies who's
02:12written a book that shows how often newspapers use illegal messes for getting their stories
02:17it's called flat earth news and Nick Davis joins us now good morning hi you say sloppy because newspapers
02:25use press releases rather than getting their own stories and morally bankrupt because of the
02:31illegality involved really the route that binds together all the different themes is that the logic of
02:36journalism has been overwhelmed by the logic of commercialism journalists no longer have the time
02:42or the resources to do their jobs properly instead they're just passive processes of unchecked secondhand
02:48material okay but you also you go much further in suggesting that there has been criminality involved
02:54and that's generally accepted within the press okay so principally that involves hiring private
02:59investigators they hire private investigators to get your bank statements your credit card statements
03:04your itemized phone bills your tax record even your health records these creatures are getting all of
03:10that is illegal okay we're joined by John Mullen who is the editor of the independent on Sunday and
03:15Stuart Kutner who's managing editor of news of the world John Mullen do you recognize this well I ploughed my
03:22way through the first half of the book not the second half so far and no one can deny that life in
03:29journalism is much harder than maybe it was 20 30 years ago but to say that journalism as a whole is a
03:36passive processor of news I think that's erroneous Stuart Kutner yes I'll tell you what I think I think
03:43frankly listening to Nick Davis I thought he was speaking from a newsroom on another planet it is totally
03:51unrecognizable to me many years in newspapers in Fleet Street now of course at the news of the world
03:58but what did he say that was so wrong well he talks about if you like shortcuts PR interests commercial
04:08interest I have to tell you none of my news of the world journalists would recognize that but what about the way
04:14these people get the stories and access to personal information well if it happens it it shouldn't
04:23happen it happened once at the news of the world the reporter was fired he went to prison the editor
04:29resigned and while Nick is talking about all this I notice he doesn't mention the Guardian's own act of
04:36criminality when the Guardian forged the signature of a cabinet okay I don't want to go to details of
04:42story I think the charge that Nick Davis may not want to go into detail but Nick makes a broad brush
04:48sweeping attack on our profession which I happen to believe is an honorable profession okay
04:53you hear it I wish I hadn't you're too kind I did say appearing on the today program to attack journalism
05:17wasn't exactly the most sensible idea listen before I go home I wanted to talk to you about something good
05:22thing was you weren't representing the Guardian you were talking about your book my book
05:27Kutner did have a good go at trying to besmirch us through you I want out
05:32do you know anything about baking competitions I want to know how many people cheat at baking
05:41competitions round number exactly the sort of thing the Guardian should be investigating I don't mean
05:47out altogether I'd like to go to Brussels investigate a whole new horizon something
05:51well paid naturally that will allow me to commute the kids are old enough now to be able to I need
05:56you here Sadiq Khan bugged 40-year convention breached and why keep the Americans happy needs a good
06:08journalist I'm knackered nobody likes me I'm come on I like you some of the time and I'm sure there
06:16are a few others who all please self-pity is not a redeeming quality we'll talk tomorrow I'm freelance
06:24precisely so I don't need to talk to you tomorrow you're freelance with more or less a sole employer I
06:30say you should talk to me tomorrow mm-hmm we've all been roasted by Stuart bloody Kutner bye
06:36let me explain Alan is what we grew up together in journalism that is and he is always understood sorry
06:52yep Nick Davis who's this my name is redacted sorry we'll call him mr. Apollo because um well
07:02actually because he is it doesn't matter how did you get this number listen Kutner made a mistake well I
07:10know it's several chief amongst them appearing on the today program he said it happened once it happened
07:16once it happened once upon news of the world the reporter was fired he went to prison the editor
07:22resigned you're talking about phone hacking Nick your book only scratched the surface we have to meet
07:29face to face somewhere absolutely discreet I think you'll like what I have where and when in the
07:37beginning it was next to nothing two men were arrested for hacking phones in 2006 a private
07:43investigator Glenn Mulcair and the royal editor needed a well Clive Goodman the sentences they
07:50received were short the attention they got limited but the crime was unusual they had discovered they
07:56could access other people's voicemail messages and they spent months eavesdropping on three of Prince
08:03Williams staff at Clarence house how they didn't say why for the discovery of private information it was the
08:15start of the next six years of my life to be clear I've never told anyone who mr. Apollo is so
08:35some guesses have been made bad guess no no sorry it's not you okay oh come on
08:59hi you're coming in or job well this is nice nice choice of room just to check is the guardian paint
09:24because if so I'd implore you to stay away from that minibar Mulcair in the trial he said he'd
09:29hacked other five non-royals I remember yes um L. McPherson Sky Andrew Max Clifford he's a liar
09:39Kuttner's a liar and one of the five is suing them which one well that five is just the tip of the
09:49iceberg hacking phones at the news of the world has been endemic endemic they pick up their leads by
10:00intercepting voicemails and only then do they get photographs and quotes so as to lay a false trail
10:06to pretend they found the story through legitimate means they've hacked thousands yeah dial a number
10:14someone who's likely to not answer this is Alan Rusbridger that's your phone a friend the editor of the
10:28guardian press nine please enter your four-digit pen now enter one two three four that's the factory
10:35resetting welcome to your voicemail you have one new message Alan it's mummy I'm just calling about
10:44Jill Wyatt she won best sponge again and I'm sure she cheated this it's that easy hmm doesn't even need
10:52a Glenn Mulcair most of the time and you're saying this was widespread Glenn's main job was that when
10:58it got tricky unlike with your Alan was to blag the mobile phone companies into resetting the
11:03celebrities pin codes to their original factory setting one two three four that's Alan please who
11:12is this hi yeah it's Nick listen change the voicemail settings on your phone and how do I do that ask a
11:18young person I've got to go but who is suing the person who is is currently trying to get Scotland Yard
11:28to hand over evidence they collected and did nothing with when they arrested Mulcair it's evidence that
11:34could burn fuck and destroy everything twice over you won't tell me which one of the five it is will you
11:42I will tell you but you're missing two names Gordon Taylor and Simon Hughes will you go on the record
11:54if you dig it comes from you I can I can confirm things but
12:01it's just another story of journos behaving badly you're not interested it's interesting
12:11you should talk to someone else do you realize I could lose my job just by talking to you don't
12:16worry this conversation never happened no no no that's not my point Nick you think think who edited
12:22the paper think about where he sits now you're talking about Andy Coulson stop him
12:33mind to the gap stand clear of the doors please Andy Coulson a rapid ascent journalist from a local reporter to showbiz at the Sun he was made editor of news of the world in 2003 even after he resigned in 2007 he was made editor of news of the world in 2003
12:40even after he resigned in 2007 over the original phone hacking case it was seen as honorable him carrying the can for the one rogue reporter
12:47not me really gov
12:51but if he is if this is endemic
12:54Descent journalist from a local reporter to showbiz at the Sun. He was made editor of news of the world in
13:002003 even after he resigned in 2007 over the original phone hacking case
13:04It was seen as honorable in carrying the can to the one rogue reporter not me really gov
13:12But if he would if he is
13:14If this is endemic, he's David Cameron's communications director
13:19For him to be involved in widespread criminality
13:24No, no bad idea
13:40I'm not late. It would be fine if you were to be a bit late. You don't need to be so worried. Are they ready? Are they ever ready?
13:46Kids!
13:48You okay?
13:50Kids!
13:51You're anxious to go then
13:53Sorry, how are you etc?
13:55I'm fine etc. You all right?
13:57Never better
13:58Really?
13:59I heard you on the radio
14:01That's all performance help sales.
14:03Oh, I would doubt it
14:06I'm um, I am worried about
14:09I'm not going to reveal my child's name. Let's call him
14:13Beans
14:15He comes home, locks himself in his room
14:17I have tried to talk to him, but
14:19Avoids all questions
14:21So, do we bring the score then?
14:26Let's get the details and make sure he wants the help
14:28Oh, you sound like a journalist
14:30Let me try
14:32Let me try
14:36Let me try
14:39Okay
14:40I've got a new recipe
14:42Okay, Dad
14:44The stuffed tomato thing
14:46Yeah, no, it's good
14:47Call you when it's ready
14:48It's Turkish
14:49Yeah
14:50So
14:51I met someone today
14:52A source
14:53He was pissed off with what Cutner said on the radio
14:55Okay
14:56Hacking was endemic, he said at News of the World
14:58And someone is now suing Scotland Yard for information on what was hacked
15:02Now, no, I know it's one of either
15:03Elmuth Furson, Simon Hughes, Gordon Taylor
15:05Sky Andrew or Max Clifford
15:06I know
15:07I know it's one of either
15:08Elmuth Furson
15:09Simon Hughes, Gordon Taylor
15:10Sky Andrew or Max Clifford
15:11I don't know which one
15:12What do you think
15:13Do I dig?
15:14Trying to find out who it is
15:15If I find them
15:16It might
15:17We might get some evidence that proves foul play
15:20was a bit more wide-spread
15:21Imagine what it does
15:22to Andy Coulson
15:23He's about to go to a
15:24Okay
15:24Hacking was endemic, he said
15:25In News of the World
15:26And someone is now suing Scotland Yard
15:27For information on what was hacked
15:28Now, no, I know it's one of either
15:29Elmuth Furson
15:30Simon Hughes, Gordon Taylor
15:31Sky Andrew or Max Clifford
15:32But I don't know which one
15:33What do you think
15:34Do I dig?
15:35Trying to find out who it is
15:36If I find them
15:37It might
15:38We might get some evidence
15:39That proves foul play
15:40He could soon have keys to 10 Downing Street.
15:43Did Cameron even do a fit and proper person test on him?
15:45Did he even look into Coulson's past?
15:48That's a good angle.
15:49But another tabloid's behaving badly story.
15:53I said the same thing.
15:55And who wants to kick a bee's nest?
15:58Murdoch, you know?
16:00This sauce, has he got under your skin?
16:04No, I just wanted to talk it out with someone.
16:07You.
16:07Well, always grateful to be your sounding board.
16:13Go ahead, Mammon.
16:15Who says I'm in the office?
16:17We'll always have Brussels. Bye.
16:32It's creepy when you do that.
16:35Stare at me like that.
16:36How are you?
16:38Why are you asking?
16:40If there ever is anything you need to discuss.
16:42Yes, Dad.
16:43I know.
16:43And where is the defence?
16:45Martin is completely unarmed as he powers his way to the United's goal.
17:06I, um, I, I never much liked school.
17:09Not being bullied.
17:10I always saw school as a necessity.
17:12Why does everyone always think I'm being bullied?
17:14Not a virtue.
17:15There was a guy who used to hit us.
17:21Another kid?
17:23Actually, a teacher.
17:26Used to, God, used to really scare me.
17:29And I, I never used to do well, um, well, I never used to do well with fear, but also the thing I remember most clearly, rage.
17:39I heard you on the radio.
17:41I heard you on the radio.
17:47You listen to the Today programme.
17:50Mum makes us listen to or read everything you do.
17:52You, you have an impressive dad.
17:55And she says it like, he may be a total dick, but he's impressive.
18:00Oh, God.
18:01You know the story of the Dung Beetle.
18:08Oh, God.
18:09Really, again?
18:10If you want to fly free.
18:11First you have to eat a lot of shit.
18:13Sometimes you have to ignore bullies.
18:15Not being bullied.
18:15Sometimes you, you, you have to puncture them.
18:18I'm not that.
18:18There's always a way to, there's always a chance when the wankers, when they suddenly seem vulnerable, when they are, you have to clamp your pincers onto them as hard as possible.
18:29Do not let go.
18:38Tomatoes in the oven.
18:39Brilliant tent.
18:40They're Turkish.
18:43Thank you very much.
18:48It won't surprise you to know we didn't get the rights to use their masthead.
19:11Or this one.
19:18Hi, it's Nick Davies.
19:26You still have that contact at Scotland Yard?
19:29No, sorry, mate.
19:30Really can't help you get involved with that one.
19:33You know how that is.
19:34But Andy Coulson will soon be sitting in Downing Street.
19:37Yeah, and Murdoch's already sitting on Downing Street.
19:40Yeah, I, yes, I appreciate that.
19:42I understand.
19:43If I could get some evidence of this.
19:44No.
19:45No.
19:46No.
19:46All right, thanks, bye.
19:53Oh, hi, thanks for coming back.
19:55Do you have the number four name redacted?
19:58Say this one.
19:59Yeah.
20:00Okay, great.
20:02Zero.
20:03Seven.
20:04Seven.
20:05Zero.
20:06Zero.
20:06Nine.
20:07Zero.
20:08Zero.
20:08Nine.
20:09Five.
20:09Four.
20:11Got that.
20:13Hi.
20:14I'm wondering whether I could speak to whoever represents Elle Macpherson.
20:20No, no, I'm not a fan.
20:21No, I'm wondering whether she's currently suing the news of the world.
20:25Is that Max?
20:27Hi.
20:28It's Nick Davies.
20:29We met at the Orwell Prize.
20:32I'm actually after a bit of insight.
20:33Well, no, give me a chance.
20:58Detective Buzz Aldrin.
21:00What is real name?
21:01My name is Nick Davies.
21:02I'm a Guardian journalist.
21:04I believe you were looking into the Clive Goodman case.
21:05I'm very busy, Mr. Davies.
21:07I followed your work, Buzz.
21:08I know how principled you are.
21:09I think you know that this, that, that what is happening here is acutely in the public interest.
21:13And if it's all dealt with in behind-stairs deals, it'll help no one.
21:16I can't talk to journalists.
21:17Don't have to talk.
21:18Look, all I need to know is which of the five non-royal names in the Clive Goodman case is now suing the paper.
21:23Cough.
21:24That's all I ask.
21:25Cough when I hit the right name.
21:26You are very, very persistent.
21:28Because what I understand is that those five names represent thousands, thousands of people who've had their privacy stolen by this newspaper.
21:35Please.
21:37L. McPherson.
21:38Simon Hughes.
21:41Gordon Taylor.
21:46You did the right thing.
21:48Sorry, excuse me.
22:05Charlotte Harris.
22:06Nick Davis of The Guardian.
22:08I believe you represent Gordon Taylor.
22:09I'm doing court.
22:10I understand that he's suing News of the World for breach of privacy.
22:13Mr. Davis, whether or not Mr. Taylor is my client.
22:15I have no interest in putting to any press.
22:17Sorry.
22:17These so-called journalists bring our whole industry into disrepute.
22:22I'm very persistent.
22:25Well, can you, can you tell me then about John Hewison?
22:29He's also a claimant, is he not?
22:31And the interesting thing is, if you ask the public who those two are, they might know Taylor.
22:36They wouldn't know Hewison because he's a lawyer, like you.
22:39He's entrusted with the secrets of others in the secrets of sports stars in his case, which makes him interesting to the news of the world.
22:47This is a news operation, which is trying to undermine the confidentiality that crucially underlies your profession.
22:55If you want to fight it, well, you're a tiger, but they're lions.
23:00The Guardian's a lion too.
23:01Well, what if I'm neither a lion nor a tiger?
23:04What if I am a walrus?
23:07Walruses can be fierce.
23:11And what if you're a...
23:12See, I'm trying to think of an annoying animal.
23:14Is Mr. Taylor settled?
23:16What evidence do you have?
23:17Are there other claimants?
23:19I'm sure you must be looking to engage more clients.
23:22Privacy cases like this can sometimes be...
23:24What did Max Mosley get?
23:26£60,000 and costs.
23:28Line enough up.
23:29You could have a class action suit worth a lot of money.
23:32See, you were doing well.
23:33Reasonably well.
23:34Until you brought money into it.
23:36I can't talk to you about specific cases, but I can tell you...
23:41I can tell you that there is so much more to come.
23:51You got the name.
24:05Mr. Apollo, you're back.
24:07Are you watching me?
24:09I take it you're still interested in this case, then.
24:17Deer is in the fireplace.
24:18The lion is alight.
24:19What the fuck are you doing?
24:22Sorry, I've had a tendency to make jokes.
24:24I was trying to be a Russian spy.
24:28It could be spotted at any moment.
24:29Do you know the risks?
24:30I do, sorry.
24:33So you found the lawyer?
24:36Is this some kind of a test?
24:37Do I get a prize at the end of it?
24:39Do you know how much they're settling for?
24:40No.
24:42£400,000 in damages.
24:45Another £300,000 in legal expenses.
24:47And their associates are getting £140,000 in damages, plus they're legal.
24:52The whole package comes in at just over a million pounds.
24:55Now that's a lot.
24:56Even for News International to stomach.
24:59But...
25:00Max Mosley was their cute him of being a Nazi at an orgy.
25:05All he got was £60,000, yes.
25:08Now you're getting it.
25:09Look, I need...
25:13I need paperwork or audio recording, some sort of hard evidence.
25:17I don't even have to publish it.
25:19I just need to be able to show the Guardian.
25:21The preliminary hearing's in 2007, the public record.
25:23That's not enough.
25:27Hmm.
25:30Right.
25:30What is it?
25:36You work it out.
25:37Can I use it?
25:38Nope.
25:39I need to be able to use it.
25:40Summarise it?
25:41Yes.
25:42Show it to your editor?
25:43Yes.
25:44Quote from it?
25:45No.
25:46Can I have your number?
25:49Be careful, Nick.
25:52This could get nasty.
25:53I have a piece on MP's expenses I want you to have a look at.
26:13OK.
26:13Do you want some gingerbread?
26:14My mother made it.
26:15It's not very good.
26:16I have evidence.
26:18How long did that take you to get?
26:20Maybe two months.
26:20And you've never mentioned it?
26:24They're paying up millions to cover this, huh?
26:26This is their story.
26:28Nick, newspapers reporting on newspapers.
26:31But the editor of that newspaper is about to enter government.
26:34If Andy Coulson was complicit in hacking phones as an editor,
26:38imagine what he might do to enemies of the government.
26:42Show me what you have.
26:44OK.
26:44So, printout of an email.
26:48Ross Hindley at News of the World to shadowmen at yahoo.co.uk.
26:53It's Glenn Mulcair's email.
26:54His email was shadowmen.
26:56Hmm.
26:56It says, transcript for Neville.
26:59Wednesday, 29th of June, 2005.
27:01I can read.
27:02And Neville is?
27:04Neville Thirlbeck, chief reporter at News of the World.
27:07There are transcripts of 35 voicemail messages
27:10which have been left on the phones of Gordon Taylor
27:12and a colleague.
27:13It wasn't just Claude Goodman.
27:15And then there's this.
27:18Greg Miskew, assistant editor.
27:20Proving a payment of 7,000 pounds,
27:22two-mile care for a story on Gordon Taylor.
27:25And the police have access to all of this and more.
27:29Can we use this?
27:30No.
27:32Can we get your Mr. Apollo to speak on the record?
27:36How long have we known each other?
27:38I've no idea.
27:39I had no interest in trying to work that out.
27:41It'll make me feel old.
27:42Nearly 30 years.
27:44This is it, Alan.
27:45There is an industry making huge profit
27:47from evading people's private lives,
27:49and Rupert Murdoch's bullying tabloids
27:51have explicitly encouraged it and are buying it.
27:58This matters.
28:05Tin hats on.
28:09Good.
28:09Okay.
28:11I'll let you know where I've got something.
28:17Thanks, Alan.
28:19You may think you lead a private life,
28:22but The Guardian has uncovered evidence
28:24to suggest otherwise.
28:25This strange story began in 2006
28:28with the arrest of two men,
28:30the News of the World Royal editor Clive Goodman
28:32and a private investigator, Glenn Mulcair.
28:35The men pled guilty to phone hacking charges
28:38and served prison sentences.
28:39Following an investigation,
28:41the paper told the world that hacking was the work of one rogue reporter.
28:45The story should have ended there,
28:47but it didn't.
28:49from the beginning on,
29:05newspapers have prospered for one reason,
29:07giving readers the news they want.
29:10keep it simple.
29:21Rupert Murdoch's newsgroup newspapers had paid out more than £1 million to settle legal cases
29:27that threatened to reveal evidence of his journalist's repeated involvement in the use of criminal methods to get stories.
29:33Payments secured secrecy over out-of-court settlements in three cases that threatened to expose evidence of Murdoch journalists using private investigators to illegally hack into the mobile phone messages of numerous public figures.
29:47Cabinet ministers, MPs, actors and sports stars were all targets of private investigators.
29:53Are you sure we can safely list all those groups?
29:55We already have evidence of actors, Elle Macpherson, sports stars, Sky Andrew.
29:59MPs then.
29:59I have an invoice recording a payment to a private investigator showing John Prescott had been targeted. It's likely hacking.
30:06This article has no named sources, no evidence on the record.
30:09Alan thinks we have enough. I do too.
30:11And we haven't got right of reply.
30:12It's a declaration of bloody war. Murdoch and Brooks, they have nuclear weapons.
30:16Right now they do, but we can neuter their nuclear weapons with this.
30:19If we do, Fleet Street will fall in behind us, the police soon after, and they have when they find the information they already have.
30:25Information they've lost?
30:26Information they don't know they have. The Met we're talking about.
30:29Look, once we publish, they'll be forced to act.
30:32Can we name Coulson?
30:35Now you're worried I haven't gone far enough.
30:37That makes it more in the public interest if we can name him.
30:40I did ring Conservative HQ right to reply, Jill.
30:43I asked about the Gordon Taylor settlement.
30:45His office replied it didn't ring any bells.
30:47There'd be nothing that directly linked them.
30:49I agree.
30:49But we can say that he was the editor in place when journalists for whom he was responsible, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera.
30:58It's good.
31:00It's good.
31:05Yes?
31:07I'm uneasy.
31:08But if you're sure?
31:09I am.
31:19It reads well.
31:27Okay.
31:28At half past five in the afternoon on Wednesday, 8th July 2009, we posted my news story on the Guardian website.
31:42As it ran, the Guardian news desk asked a reporter, Caroline Davies, to call John Prescott, ex-deputy prime minister, to get a quote.
31:49I told him the gist of the story, and he said, fucking hell.
31:54You'd have thought the police, in the committing of a criminal offence, as clearly it is against anyone, and particularly you'd have thought a cabinet member, they would have come and told me about it.
32:03I would have asked them, what are you going to do about it?
32:05Prescott ruled, but the house fell silent.
32:10Anyone?
32:14Anyone?
32:19And Fleet Street, well, Fleet Street essentially did their best to ignore the story.
32:29Ask any journalist what a great story depends on.
32:32They'll say the same thing.
32:35A new angle.
32:36Well, at least journalists can get mine.
32:39We are reliant on our own profession to follow up on stories so they have impact.
32:43To make a story newsworthy requires multiple news outlets.
32:46But on this one, crickets.
32:50My company couldn't have settled the legal action like the Guardian claims.
32:53If they had done, I'd have known about it.
32:56I tried to get this out as wide as possible.
32:58I talked on radio stations, TV shows.
33:00I took constant calls from agents of public figures asking, am I on that list?
33:04I slept about four hours.
33:06And then at five in the afternoon, I was surprised to hear that John Yates, assistant commissioner at Scotland Yard,
33:12was preparing to make a statement.
33:14Good afternoon.
33:16I was not involved in the original case and clearly come at this with an independent mind.
33:22In my opinion, what I have seen is a most careful investigation by very experienced detectives.
33:28He proceeded to gently demolish our work.
33:31We'd suggested there were thousands of victims.
33:34Their potential targets may have run into hundreds of people.
33:37But our inquiry showed that they only used the tactic against a far smaller number of individuals.
33:43And since no additional evidence has come to light, I can see no reason to reopen the inquiry.
33:47That was assistant commissioner John Yates speaking in response to Fred.
34:13What is it?
34:19The police haven't backed us.
34:21And Kistana's conducting a review.
34:24He was director of public prosecutions then.
34:26But he doesn't consider there was anything inappropriate in the prosecutions undertaken in this case.
34:31We are being squashed.
34:34We need to speak to your Mr. Apollo.
34:36We need to get him on the record.
34:37He...
34:38He can contact me.
34:40I can't contact him.
34:41Nick.
34:41Nick.
34:43Our colleagues upstairs are gravely concerned.
34:48Is it possible you were set up?
34:49No.
34:50This is right.
34:51I've...
34:51I've used no named sources.
34:53No quotes from documents.
34:55We should never have published.
34:57And Murdoch has set his attack dogs on us in the comments.
35:01They're briefing that we can't back up our story.
35:04And now the CMS Select Committee want to see us urgently.
35:08That doesn't sound great.
35:09They want to barbecue you, Nick.
35:12And Johnny Yates has given them permission.
35:16I'm sorry.
35:18I, uh...
35:18I've read the runes wrong here.
35:23The Guardian are putting together a statement.
35:25What kind of statement?
35:27I'll know when I see it.
35:28I feel like I'm having a heart attack.
35:34Why is everybody doing this?
35:36I feel like I'm having a heart attack.
35:55my mother was a strong character intelligent forceful imaginative trapped as she believed
36:15in domestic drudgery she had she had a furious temper this wasn't the 1950s toxic ideal of spare
36:23the rod and spoil the child this was mad beatings when she came after us with a black-eyed fury
36:28armed with whatever weapon she had to hand a dog lead a slipper a riding crop a rope
36:35are you ready to say you're sorry
36:38no
36:42i've been working as a journalist for a couple of decades thinking i was interested in
36:52criminal justice and social problems when i saw that i was being drawn to stories
36:57again and again with the same theme
36:59a deep-seated urge to hit back at anybody at all who takes power and abuses it
37:09stupid child
37:16oh
37:23oh
37:27Oh, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.
37:57Why?
37:58Seizing rage.
38:01I thought he looked vulnerable.
38:04Oh.
38:05Didn't work.
38:06No.
38:07You look terrible.
38:09What happened to you?
38:10You're asking me or him.
38:11Okay, so I need to take you to your mum's tonight.
38:14I'm sorry.
38:15I'm sorry.
38:16I'm sorry.
38:17I'm sorry.
38:18I'm sorry.
38:19I'm sorry.
38:20I'm sorry.
38:21I'm sorry.
38:22I'm sorry.
38:23I'm sorry.
38:24I'm sorry.
38:25I'm sorry.
38:26She comes tonight.
38:27Um, she says she's cool with it if you are.
38:29Yeah, sure.
38:30I don't mind.
38:31It's been a day of statement and counterstatement in the phone hacking affair with News International
38:47angrily refuting all the allegations made by The Guardian.
38:50With the editor and the reporter due to appear at the media select committee, certain publications
38:55are claiming a leftist agenda against the news of the world by The Guardian and calling
39:01for legal action to be taken against the organization if they can't back up.
39:06Period.
39:07Claim made against Murdoch's paper.
39:11Up.
39:12Wife.
39:13We've been a whileoloos.
39:14Just to stop the examiner.
39:15Wow.
39:16It's all right.
39:17Well, it's perfectly fine.
39:18We'll come back up.
39:19Come on.
39:20It's a great idea, Mum.
39:21Hello.
39:22See you, kids.
39:23Whoa.
39:24I'm fine, Mum.
39:25I'm fine.
39:26It's my fault.
39:27Sorry.
39:28Bad advice.
39:29Coffee?
39:30Um.
39:31Thanks for this.
39:32I'll see you on Monday.
39:34I'm sorry.
39:35Nick.
39:36Yeah?
39:37Have you eaten?
39:38When?
39:39In the last day.
39:41I'm just a bit tired.
39:43I'm not really at my best.
39:45I need to think.
39:46And the House of Commons Select Committee want to see us tomorrow.
39:53And the Guardian have got this message that their PR have written that is just...
39:58All right.
39:59Okay.
40:01You look worse than he does.
40:03I didn't tell him to fight back.
40:05I don't have to pick his mark.
40:07Come on, hit someone, you shit.
40:09All right.
40:12Come on.
40:14Sit down.
40:15Sit down.
40:16Super okay?
40:23What do I do?
40:25How do I make it better?
40:27Well, we will talk to the school.
40:30You think they'll be better?
40:32It's a good school.
40:36Things have changed, you know.
40:37Teachers, parents.
40:39They're not allowed to do.
40:42There's systems, right?
40:46I thought about her.
40:48Earlier today, I was reading this...
40:52paper magie over apologetic PR nonsense.
40:56I thought about all the times I'd gone to her and apologised.
40:59And all the times that I...
41:01And then my son gets her face like that.
41:06Okay.
41:09I'm gonna make the sofa out you're staying here tonight.
41:13And just put the soup on.
41:14I've got a soup on.
41:15I've got a soup on.
41:29I've got a soup on.
41:38I can't read that statement. A retraction at this time.
41:52You're asking me to say I was wrong.
41:54If we can't get Mr. Apollo on the record, then we need to make a retraction.
42:00You know getting him on the record is impossible.
42:04Then I'm afraid you'll have to make that statement to the Select Committee tomorrow.
42:07If you make me read it out, I won't come.
42:11If you don't come, we're fucked.
42:37Carl Bernstein, one of the great reporters who exposed the Watergate scandal, said,
42:50I think all good reporting is the same thing.
42:55The best attainable version of the truth.
42:58The best attainable version of the truth.
43:02The best attainable.
43:03So no matter what you've got,
43:04you've got to...
43:05You've got to...
43:06You've got to...
43:07Good morning.
43:27Hi. Does this, um, printer scanner thing still work?
43:31Uh, yeah, that one does. Coffee?
43:34And do you have some black paper and some glue and some scissors?
43:37Oh, are you making me a collage, Nate?
43:40Might need the kids to be slightly late for school.
43:42Right. Why?
43:46OK, so these are emails written to a journalist, that's Neville,
43:52with transcriptions of a man called Gordon Taylor's voicemail messages.
43:56What I need you to do is to block out all the sections
43:58which are clearly transcribed from those voicemails.
44:01Leave everything else visible.
44:02You should be able to tell which bit's which, but in doubt, just ask.
44:04Hmm. May I ask, why aren't you doing this at The Guardian
44:07with some sort of vague professionalism?
44:09Alan can't know.
44:11Your editor can't know?
44:13Because I can't have him tell anyone else.
44:15Oh, yeah. That man is a gossip.
44:17Fleet Street can't know about this.
44:18As far as they know, I'm walking naked into that committee room.
44:21I was just trying to protect my editor and my newspaper.
44:24And you.
44:26What sort of danger are you putting yourself in here?
44:30No.
44:31Okay.
44:33That's probably an Anglo title.
44:34No.
44:35It's a nom, too.
44:36Oh, what's going on?
44:37Okay.
44:42I'm trying to protect myself.
44:43hypnism.
44:44No.
44:45They're walking easily depois.
44:46Well, they're alan them first.
44:48And yuk.
44:49And you.
44:51Oh, yeah.
44:52They're Mā уч N veure'an.
44:54I mean, it's my life.
44:55And it's my life.
44:56I've been doing it, this way.
44:57It's Figure out.
44:59Nick.
45:03How are you, man?
45:05I'm fine.
45:06Bit tired.
45:07Something interrupted my sleep last night.
45:09I hate it when that happens.
45:13I hate all of this.
45:16Sorry if I've made your life difficult.
45:18My life?
45:20This is bigger than me.
45:23Could have brought down the whole Guardian newspaper
45:25with this one.
45:27What a way to go.
45:29I mean, consider the glory.
45:33I, Nick Davies, have destroyed.
45:36Utterly destroyed.
45:39Close to 200 years of journalistic endeavour.
45:43You're an absolute god.
45:46God, I can't even think what you are.
45:49You're awful.
45:52You know what Peter Preston told me
45:55when I took over the editor's desk.
45:57Why and how did they choose you?
45:59Don't join the club.
46:01He had to make adjustments to the paper
46:03after the move from Manchester and he didn't...
46:05He wouldn't be part of the media cabal.
46:11He liked being on the edge of Fleet Street.
46:13He considered it part of our DNA.
46:17Last night in bed I realised something.
46:21What you've done, bringing us here,
46:24is in the line of great Guardian coups.
46:29But I do want to keep the newspaper I've been entrusted with alive.
46:34Are you reading the statement?
46:36No.
46:37No.
46:38But I do have things to say.
46:44If you go too far, I will squeeze your leg and you will stop.
46:49I've got a paper to protect.
46:53And you.
46:54Be sure to protect yourself.
46:57Turn heads on.
46:59Thank you for joining us, gentlemen.
47:01Now we have a lot of questions,
47:03so I'll try to keep opening statements short.
47:06I'd like to keep this whole experience quite short, if I may.
47:09But I do have...
47:12There's a lot for me to say.
47:17I'd like to start by showing you, first of all,
47:20copies of an email.
47:22Live left.
47:24Four.
47:26The word hash
47:30Seven.
47:31Seven.
47:33Six.
47:39Seven.
47:42One.
47:45Seven.
47:48Eight.
47:49One.
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