- 3 months ago
The big talking point of this episode of News Today is the battle for Bihar. Prime Minister Narendra Modi kicked off the NDA's campaign in Samastipur.
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00:00Good evening, hello and welcome. You're with the news today, your prime time destination news,
00:04newsmakers, talking points ahead of the weekend. We'll tell you what's making the news on the
00:09news today. Our big talking point, Bihar's Chief Minister Nitish Kumar. Is this his last stand?
00:16Will the BJP stick to Nitish or are they set to dump him after the Bihar election? That contentious
00:23issue. Also, we'll remember the legend of Indian advertising, Piyush Pandey, who passed away today
00:29a special tribute to the one and only Piyush Pandey. So there's plenty on the show tonight.
00:35But first, as always, it's time for the nine headlines at nine. In the battle for Bihar,
00:41Prime Minister Narendra Modi kicks off the NDA's campaign, claims the NDA is fighting again under
00:47Nitish Kumar's leadership. The opposition Mahagat Bandhan scoffs at the NDA, says the BJP won't be
00:54making. Nitish Chief Minister after polls. They insist. The BJP wants to dump him.
01:02At least 20 people are dead in a horrific bus tragedy in Andhra's Karnool district. Bengaluru-bound
01:08bus from Hyderabad catches fire after collision with a bike. Over 20 people hospitalized with burn
01:14injuries.
01:14The India bloc wins big in the Jammu and Kashmir. Rajya Sabha polls. Ruling National Conference
01:21comfortably wins three seats out of four, reaffirming the party's dominant position. The BJP
01:27wins one.
01:30Commerce Minister Piyush Goel asserts India won't sign a trade deal with a gun on its head,
01:35calls out UK and Germany for seeking exemptions from sanctions on Russian oil companies.
01:40U.S. Secretary of State Marco Rubio, who is on a visit to Israel, claims there is no plan
01:48B to establish a permanent peace in Gaza other than the Trump plan, says Hamas can't be involved
01:53in governing Gaza anymore.
01:57Afghanistan set to echo India's Indus water move, mulls to limit flow of water into Pakistan
02:03by building dams across the Kunar River. This comes after recent skirmishes at the APAC
02:08border. A doctor in Satara in Maharashtra dies by suicide amidst controversy. She leaves
02:16a note on her palm accusing a police officer of raping and sexually harassing her over the
02:21past five months.
02:25Sushant Singh, Rajput's family to challenge the CBI report into the actor's death. Family
02:30lawyer calls it incomplete and inconclusive. Earlier, CBI ruled out any evidence to suggest
02:36foul play in Sushant's death. And India's advertising industry loses its most celebrated
02:44voice. Piyush Pandey, the creative genius who transformed how brands communicated with
02:48the nation, dies at 70. Tributes pour in.
02:52But let's turn to our top political story, which is coming once again from Battleground Bihar,
03:01where the focus is on the Bihar chief minister, who now holds the record for having been sworn
03:08in the most number of times in the country, a record nine times. Nitish Kumar has dominated
03:15Bihar politics in a way for the last two decades. But there are now serious question marks over his
03:21health and indeed whether the BJP will agree to make Nitish Kumar the chief minister if the NDA
03:28wins. Today, Prime Minister Narendra Modi addressed a rally with Nitish Kumar and said that the NDA
03:36was fighting under his leadership. But the BJP has been hesitant to officially declare Nitish Kumar
03:42as their chief minister choice, which has led the opposition to question, is the BJP now planning
03:49a coup against Nitish Kumar if they win the elections in Bihar? What really is Nitish Kumar's future,
03:59one of the longest serving chief ministers in the country? That's our top political focus.
04:05First, take a look at this report.
04:35He declares the NDA is fighting under the leadership of Nitish Kumar in Bihar as he kicked off the
04:40coalition's campaign on Friday. Amit Shah reiterated the line at another campaign rally.
04:47Nitish Kumar, who has been the chief minister for nearly 20 years, is once again the key to the power puzzle in Bihar.
05:08But this time, the opposition insists that it is different.
05:16The Maagat Bandhan's chief ministerial candidate, Teja Shviyadav, points out that the BJP has been hesitant to name
05:22Nitish Kumar the chief ministerial candidate.
05:24The Maagat Bandhan's chief ministerial candidate, Teja Shviyadav, points out that it is the chief ministerial candidate of Nithish Kumar in Bihar.
05:38The chief minister of Nithish Kumar, the chief minister of Nithish Kumar, the chief minister of Nithish Kumar and the chief minister of Nithish Kumar,
05:42Nithish Kumar, the chief minister of Nithish Kumar, the chief minister of Nithish Kumar, the chief ministerial candidate,
06:03While the BJP has dominated the Hindi heartland for decades, it has been dependent on Nitish
06:31in Bihar. The party has never got a chief minister in the state despite being in power for nearly
06:41two decades. So will the BJP be tempted to change the script this time around? Bureau
06:49Report, India Today.
07:01Nitish Kumar's last stand. Will the BJP stick to Nitish's CM or dump him? Is Nitish the face
07:10or the mask of the NDA in Bihar? And can the NDA win without Nitish Kumar? Some of the big
07:18questions on that big battle for Bihar. Joining me now is Pavan Verma, national spokesperson
07:25of Jan Suraj. That's the party of Prashant Kishore. Pavan Verma was once a very close aide
07:30of Nitish Kumar. Also joined by Sanju Verma, national spokesperson of the Bharatiya Janta
07:35Party. Anshul Avjit, national spokesperson of the Congress. And Sajjan Kumar, political
07:42analyst and number cruncher. I appreciate all of you joining us on the show. Let's turn
07:47to you, Sanju Verma, right at the very outset. Today, the Prime Minister made it clear in his
07:53first rally in Bihar that they are fighting the election under Nitish Kumar's leadership.
07:58But the BJP has been hesitant whenever asked that will Nitish Kumar continue as chief minister
08:05if the NDA wins big in Bihar? Do you want to clear the air once and for all? Is it clear
08:11that only Nitish Kumar will be chief minister if the NDA wins the election in Bihar? I want
08:18a straight, clear, short answer, ma'am.
08:20My straight, short and clear answer is we will wait for the 14th of November. The BJP-led
08:27NDA is going to come back to par because anti-incumbency has now transformed into pro-incumbency
08:34under the Modi juggernaut, which is unstoppable. You are a very seasoned journalist and I remember
08:41having done a zillion debates with you prior to Uttarakhand 2022. I was asked if Pushkar
08:46Singh Dhani will again become the chief minister. And I said, let's wait and let's cross the
08:52bridge when we come to it. I am not trying to shove the uncomfortable truth under the
08:56carpet. But the fact of the matter is, come 14th November, with a week of that, dood ka dood
09:02or paani ka paani ho jayega. But when the prime minister goes...
09:04That's not an answer. Sanju Verma, with new regard. Ma'am, you are not answering. Normally
09:09you answer very straight. What is it? Why is the BJP hesitant to just say, yes, Nitish
09:16Kumar will be the chief minister if the NDA wins? Why this hesitation? This is what is leading
09:22to speculation. Amit Shah says that legislators will decide. Somewhere the impression is going
09:28out that the BJP is waiting to see the final results. You get more seats than the JDU this
09:35time. You may want your own chief minister. Is that true or not?
09:40You know, Rajdeep, I always back with a straight back. And I always take your googlies.
09:47But let me be very honest with you. There is a time for everything. Right now, the time
09:57is to campaign. The time is to ensure that the good work done over the last 20 years finally
10:03fructifies into winnable seats. It is time to ensure that we not only improve our seat tally,
10:10which was limited at 74 last time, I'm talking of the BJP, but we also improve our vote share,
10:15which was limited at 19.46 percent. It is time to ensure that joe bachi khuchi izzat hai Congress-RJD duo ki,
10:24in ki dhajiya to uduna waali hai, but there need to be shown the mirror. Aar wo janpa janaardhan in ko dikhayegi.
10:31Ma'am, you are not, I will give you one more, I will, I will throw one more googly at you.
10:46I will throw one more googly at you. Nitish Kumar, is he the face only of your party for up to 14th of
10:55November? Should you win? Are you going to discard him? I will ask you one last time.
11:01Is Nitish, if you, you could directly tell me, I'm putting up the BJP's faces in Bihar. I meant,
11:07this is the one state you've not had a chief minister in North India of your own. I will ask
11:12you one last time. Is Nitish Kumar only being used by the BJP till the 14th of November? Are you going
11:18to dump him or are you going to retain him as chief minister? Straight answer with a straight bat.
11:25Straight answer with a straight bat. I remember there are four options normally in most competitive
11:32exams. Yes, no, maybe, none of the above. I am going to add five options. Come 14th
11:40November, the BJP will take a decision based on the numbers that we get, based on what the
11:46legislators decide and what the BJP's parliamentary core committee decides. Simple, straight answer
11:53to your Google. Okay. Okay. Straight answer. Interesting. Now you're hearing Sanju Verma saying
12:01that the BJP will decide on the 14th of November based on the numbers. Pavan Kumar Verma, let me give
12:09you a shot since you know Nitish Kumar better than most. You're with the Jan Suraj party now, but you
12:14were once with the JDU. How do you interpret what Sanju Verma is saying? She's saying what many
12:19politicians will say formally, the legislators will decide. Is the opposition simply trying
12:24to create trouble where none exists between Nitish Kumar and Narendra Modi led BJP?
12:31Thank you, Rajdeep. I'll give you a straight answer. Nitish Kumar is a dispensable transient utility
12:45to the BJP. And I'll tell you the reasons why. First of all, the coup against him hasn't taken
12:55place fully as yet. It began in 2020. You will recall, Rajdeep, that in 2020, the JDU was the big brother.
13:06It was allotted 115 seats. The BJP had 110 seats. Then Chirag Paswan was unleashed solely against
13:18the JDU candidates. He called himself the Hanuman of Prime Minister Narendra Modi. As a result
13:27of that, the JDU lost, by estimations, as many as 38 seats, reduced to 43 seats, which at the BJP
13:39got 74, by far the senior partner in the coalition. Nitish Kumar was livid. He was visibly angry at this
13:50planned conspiracy against him and his party. And I can tell you that he spoke to me personally
13:58about this. Having cut him down to size and given what you said right in the beginning that there are
14:08assured indications that Nitish Kumar today is not what he was in 2020.
14:13the BJP is using him until the elections for the vote bank that he may bring to the NDA.
14:25And after that, they will dispense with him. This is the last election he's fighting.
14:32As you rightly said. How do you know they will dispense with the BJP parliamentary board?
14:39No, no, no. Pavan Verma, how do you know that the BJP is going to dispense with Nitish Kumar? Is that
14:45your speculation or do you have some inside information? Has Nitish Kumar told you or
14:50Nitish Kumar supporters told you that BJP intends to dispense with him?
14:53Rajdeep, I am not an astrologer, but I have been enough of a political analyst to tell you
15:08exactly what is likely to happen on the basis of past events which are verifiable. The conspiracy
15:15began in 2020. Nitish Kumar became a helpless rump of the larger BJP and now when he is also perhaps
15:27in a less strong position personally, his party is in disarray. The attempt will be to use him till
15:35the elections and after which I think Nitish Kumar will definitely be replaced. By the way,
15:44Nitish Kumar knows it. I think his party knows it also and the BJP is planning for it. So within the
15:52NDA coalition as a result of this, there is a fair degree of concern and also perhaps in some quarters
16:02resentment.
16:05Can I, can I though for a moment bring in Anshul Abjit? It almost seems Anshul Abjit of the Congress
16:11Party that the opposition is using the possibility that Nitish Kumar won't be chief minister to, as I
16:20said, try and create confusion in the minds of Nitish Kumar's core voters. And rather than focus on what
16:27you will do, you are now making the elections about Tejasvi versus who. That's the aim. You are trying to
16:35make Bihar a leadership contest. Is that the aim when you, when your leaders keep saying, oh,
16:41Nitish Kumar will not become chief minister of Bihar because you are worried that there is a
16:45Nitish Kumar vote out there. And that whoever Nitish Kumar has gone with in the last 20 years has won
16:52the Bihar elections. Nitish Kumar, Bihar ki majburi hai. Nitish Kumar zaruri hai, ya nahi, we don't know,
16:59but majburi to hai. And that's why you're playing on it.
17:03No, but that was your ploy with the BJP as a co-conspirator. Look, look how the tables have
17:10turned. Earlier we were, you know, under siege by this question that why don't you announce your CM
17:15candidate, look through all the shows and of all the other rankers. You know, the Congress was under
17:20siege all the time being asked this question. And now the BJP, it's caught on in its own net of
17:26accusations. They have no answer. You know, an answer, a similar answer was given by Amit Shahji.
17:33And today in that meeting, you know, that public rally in Samastipur, the prime minister said,
17:40that Nitish Babu ke nititv mein chunaav lade jayenge. The nititv is the most overused word in the NDA
17:48with regarding the fate of Mr. Nitish Kumar tomorrow. Look, we said it again when we announced our
17:53pressure. Nitish Kumar's leadership. No, no, the leadership doesn't mean leadership. Prime Minister
17:57has said Nitish Kumar's leadership. Harato samaj gaya. Mujhe is ka anuvat pata hai. Lekin does that mean that
18:04he's the CM face? That is what is causing the deep amount of ambiguity among his voters. Look,
18:09you want a presidential face-off. The media wants it. The BJP is supposed to have wanted it. That's
18:15why it went hammond and tongs and asking us this question. What is it doing now? What does nititv
18:19mean? You know, when there is Bihar and his core voters want categorical answers, this means nothing.
18:27This answer carries no weight. This is what the Amit Shahji said. This is what the prime minister said.
18:32This is what time and again people are saying. The fate of Mr. Nitish Kumar hangs in the balance
18:38in the winter of his political career. Look, there is some… Mr. Ashok Gehloth and Tejasfi
18:44Yadavji commented on the same thing. There was a bit of empathy there as well because we formed a
18:49couple of governments with him. The reason for forming those governments was to keep the BJP at bay,
18:54but that is a part of history. So we were expressing our concern. What is his fate? Why don't you name
19:00your CM candidate? Now that you've come, you know, time and again asked us. In our case,
19:06in our case, Rajdeep, it was a fate accompli, right? There was never any doubt. The doubt only existed in
19:12newsrooms and the BJP's behest. There were a lot of questions. Okay, I've heard… Rajdeep…
19:18Anshul, I've heard you. Sanju, just be a little patient. Let me just explain to our viewers and
19:25maybe we'll put a graphic up in a short while as to why Nitish Kumar is Bihar Majboori as he's called.
19:32Sajjan Kumar, you join us and you have tracked Bihar closely. If you look at the numbers in every
19:38election, even in the worst phase of Nitish Kumar, he's got between what? 13% of the vote. Even last time,
19:45he got between 13-14% of the vote, even though his seats came down to 43%. And that made a crucial
19:51difference. In a sense, over the last 20 years, whoever Nitish Kumar joins hands with, 2015 joins
19:57hands with Lalu Prasad, they sweep the election. He brings that additional vote, especially among the
20:03extremely backward castes and to some extent among the woman voter. That's why every party needs
20:09Nitish Kumar. He's the Majboori of every party. Do you agree that Nitish Kumar is the
20:14x-factor of Bihar? Whoever he goes with wins the election mostly.
20:19Yes, Razdeep, not only the x-factor. Nitish Kumar is the fulcrum of all the x-factors in Bihar.
20:24Reason being, as you rightly pointed out, if you go by the caste and community equation, then certainly
20:30you have upper caste who constitute around 10%. I'm talking about Hindu upper caste. And then you have
20:37dominant intermediary caste. Now, all these communities have caste leaders, so they have a
20:42caste anchor. But that leaves around two-thirds of Bihar, around 75%. That is basically overwhelmingly
20:50EBCs, Mahadalits, and you can add also the women. Now, they are unanchored caste and communities from
20:58the point of view that they do not have a caste leader, right? That is why these communities cannot
21:04have a caste-led party or a caste leader to have the incentive to vote. And they look for a leader because
21:11Bihar being a poor state and they being falling into a precarious state. A leader who gives them
21:17relatively material benefit in terms of the welfare scheme. So, a leader who is identified with the
21:22schemes. And two, who also assures them of a better law and order compared to the alternative. On both
21:29these planks, Nitish Kumar remains, you know, the indispensable factor. Whether it is zaruri or majburi,
21:36is secondary, right? So, that is why Nitish Kumar is the only leader who has a swing.
21:42Let me further explain what you're saying. The extremely backward castes are about 26% of the
21:48population. If you add Paswanda Muslims, they become 36%. And this is the group over the years that Nitish
21:54Kumar has cultivated along with the Mahila voter. And therefore, that becomes the sizable chunk of Bihar's
22:02voters who become decisive in every election, at least over the last 20 years. And that's,
22:08in a sense, explains the longevity of Nitish Kumar over the years. But I just want to play
22:16what Nitish Kumar said in the last five years. Remember, Nitish Kumar has also switched sides.
22:21That's why he's not just called Sushasan Babu. He's also called Palturam. This is what he said
22:27when he switched sides, left the NDA in 2022, joint hands with Teja Svi Adav to form a government.
22:35And what he's saying now. So, you've got a switch in that. Just listen to this. And then, Sanju Varma,
22:41I'll come back to you in just a moment. This is Nitish Kumar when he was with the Mahagadbandan
22:45and now when he's back in the NDA.
22:54He's so...
23:07That the government, you know, had a chance to get the opportunity.
23:11There was also a chance to get the opportunity in 15 years.
23:14Now then the government has to be removed from 7 by the house.
23:20Then there is no need to be removed from the house,
23:24or no need to be removed from the house,
23:26which is no need to remove from the house,
23:28so that he has to be removed from the house,
23:30and the wife, that he has to be removed from the house.
23:33This is the reason why you have to respect your care,
23:35इसन consequence आप उनलों का जान लेजिए
23:37किसी के लिए कोई नहीं काम किया
23:40और सब के सब
23:42ये लोग आप जान लेजिए
23:44अपने परिवार का
23:45पत्नी का बनाया
23:47बेटा बेटी यही कर रहा
23:49ता गळऴ कर रहा है
23:50आद जानते हैं दो बार
23:52गल्टी हुआ था
23:53Sanju Verma, given all these flip-flops of Nitish Kumar, how confident is that why you don't want to antagonize him?
24:22This is a leader who openly spoke out about Narendra Modi when Mr. Modi was made PM candidate in 2013, walked out of the NDA there.
24:31This is Nitish Kumar who joined hands with Lalu Yadav in 2015, with Tejasvi Yadav in 2022.
24:38But you need him because you've got a coalition government at the center dependent on him and a government in BR.
24:44Is Nitish Kumar, as I said, your majboori?
24:46There is no real chemistry between him and Narendra Modi.
24:50It is a majboori. Am I right or wrong?
24:52His health is deteriorating by all indications, yet you have to show him as a face.
24:59You know, Rajdeep, now you said a few minutes back, Sanju Verma, be patient.
25:02So I am returning the favor back to you.
25:04Rajdeep Sardesai Ji, please be patient.
25:07Do not jump the gun and do not interject me.
25:09I will not use the word heckle, since you take strong objection to the word heckle.
25:14What Rajdeep Sardesai should be asking Sanju Verma and the BJPs, do you think Sanju Verma, BJP-led NDA, will sweep Bihar 2025,
25:25because more than 6.5 crore Biharis are getting the benefit of Pradhan Mantri, Garib Kalyan Yojana?
25:33Rajdeep Sardesai should be asking Sanju Verma, do you think that more than 2.5 crore people in Bihar get the benefit of Ayushman Bharat?
25:41And that is going to be a game changer.
25:44Rajdeep Sardesai should ask, do you think Sanju Verma, more than 1.5 crore people get the benefit of steam drinking water under judge-even mission,
25:53thanks to Narendra Modi, and that will be the game changer for BJP-led NDA and Bihar?
25:58Do you think Sanju Verma, the fact that 63 lakh houses have been built under Pradhan Mantri, Awaaz Yojana,
26:05Rukiyaya Zara, sabar kariye?
26:06Do you think Sanju Verma, may have 67 lakh houses?
26:09May ne aapko googly pheka hai, may ne aapko googly pheka hai, you've gone on a different pitch.
26:14That is the reason you will win.
26:15Ma'am, bat on the pitch, I asked you, is Nitish Kumar your majburi?
26:19If you've done so, I keep asking you this question.
26:23If all of this has been achieved, then why not openly say, Nitish Kumar is our leader,
26:30and Nitish Kumar will be the chief minister of Bihar.
26:32The point is, there is a suspicion that the BJP is ready now to use Nitish Kumar till the 14th of November and then dump him.
26:42Why don't you end that speculation once and for all?
26:45Narendra Modi and Nitish Kumar have had an uneasy relationship in the past.
26:49Rajdeep, now please don't interject.
26:53Let me answer.
26:54You are a seasoned journalist.
26:55Thoda patience, thoda sapra dikhana lazmi hai.
26:59Or, patience dikhana apke mazboori nahi hai.
27:03Aapke liye zaruri hai, aur mera liye bhi zaruri hai.
27:05So that the debate is seamless.
27:08Now let me say something to you.
27:10What journalists should be asking, and I'm not saying this about Rajdeep Sarbesai, because he's asked such questions.
27:16Why is, please don't wait, wait, wait.
27:19Please, I will not play on your pitch.
27:21Mai apne pitch pe khanoongi, aapka sunna padega.
27:24You know, let me get one thing very clear.
27:27What Rajdeep Sarbesai should be asking is,
27:29last time Congress contested on 7-0, 70 seats,
27:34and won only 19 seats, with a strike rate of 27 percent.
27:38This time the Congress has been reduced to 61 seats.
27:41Congress's Bihar President Rajesh Ramadalit was thrashed for demanding 5 crore per ticket from potential candidates.
27:50What Rajdeep Sarbesai should be asking,
27:52why is it in a joint RGD Congress press conference,
27:55Tejasui Yadaka lamba bada sa chehra dikhraha tha,
27:58looming last, but Rahul Gandhi was missing?
28:01What Rajdeep Sarbesai should be asking is,
28:03in the last 48 days,
28:05why has Rahul Gandhi not gone to campaign,
28:08even once in Bihar?
28:10What Rajdeep Sarbesai should be asking is,
28:12the same Priyanka Vajra who says,
28:14larki ho, larsakti ho,
28:16has not opened her mouth,
28:18even once on the fact,
28:20that Rabdi Devi threw out her daughter-in-law,
28:22Aishwarya,
28:24and it's brouhaha.
28:25What Rajdeep Sarbesai should be asking is,
28:27how is it that Prashant Kishore declared an income of 241 crores in 3 years,
28:33but still did not pay more than 3 crores taxes?
28:36What Rajdeep Sarbesai should be asking is,
28:39ki jab Rahul Gandhi se na ho pae ga,
28:42to Congress ki aisi kya majboori hai,
28:46ki Rahul Gandhi continues to be there,
28:49says,
28:51kya majboori hai,
28:52I have heard you,
28:52I have decided,
28:54ma'am,
28:55in the way you've gone,
28:56I have decided,
28:56I will now make you the anchor,
28:58because you will ask the question,
28:59and I will have to respond in the future,
29:01Sanju Verma there was on a roll,
29:03but Anshul Abjit,
29:04some of the questions she raises are valid,
29:06while she was not playing on my pitch,
29:08I hope you will play on the pitch,
29:10the fact is,
29:11that while you focus on Nithish Kumar,
29:13the truth of the matter is,
29:15Anshul Abjit,
29:16the Congress itself,
29:18would happily welcome Nithish Kumar,
29:20just a few years ago,
29:21y'all were more than happy,
29:22to have him as part of your India alliance,
29:24he then goes back to Narendra Bodhi,
29:26and now you're looking for,
29:27now you're suddenly discovering,
29:29that Nithish Kumar is,
29:31has ill health,
29:32cannot continue as,
29:33is not fit enough,
29:34to continue as Chief Minister,
29:36without telling us really,
29:38what the Congress,
29:39RJD stands for,
29:40you see the BJP is saying,
29:41you tell us what you stand for,
29:43we will handle our affairs,
29:44we have put our vision,
29:51and our agenda for Bihar,
29:53forward,
29:54to answer,
29:55you know,
29:55what the BJP's question,
29:56if the BJP thinks,
29:57to use the cricket analogy,
29:59that they are in a strong wicket,
30:01because of the economic prosperity of Bihar,
30:03because of its economic heft,
30:05that they made Bihar,
30:06into a some kind of powerhouse,
30:08that they reduced poverty,
30:09that they've reduced unemployment levels,
30:11that they've given MSP rates to farmers,
30:14that they brought in investment,
30:16are,
30:16what the President,
30:17that Pradhan Mantri,
30:17has said in his speech,
30:20they were futuristic,
30:21they were perspective,
30:22they were about the future,
30:23we will lie,
30:24we will do this,
30:25what are you doing now,
30:25what are you doing now for 20 years,
30:26what are you doing now for 20 years,
30:27what are you doing now for Bihar,
30:27what about the plight of law and order,
30:33you know,
30:33my best wishes,
30:35to the NDA,
30:36if they think,
30:37that they are winning this,
30:39on the plight of Bihar,
30:40about reducing law and order,
30:42about reducing levels of corruption,
30:44with land being sold to a storm,
30:45don't worry about Dittish Kumar's health,
30:47where is,
30:48they are saying,
30:49don't worry about Dittish Kumar's health,
30:50he's fine,
30:51tell us where is Rahul Gandhi,
30:53they are claiming,
30:54why is Rahul Gandhi,
30:54who went with his vote Adhikari Yatra,
30:57for a 17 day vote Adhikari Yatra,
30:59why has he gone missing,
31:00from Bihar for the last 40 days,
31:03look again,
31:04he was,
31:05he was there for two weeks,
31:06look this is a top down,
31:07look at elections,
31:09he will be there,
31:10I'll come to you,
31:11I'll come to you just a minute,
31:13no no,
31:13are you,
31:14did you ask me that,
31:14go ahead Anshul,
31:15you know I,
31:16look,
31:17Rahul Gandhi ji was there,
31:19with all the charismatic leaders,
31:21of the Mahagadbandan,
31:23highly representative bunch of people,
31:25for two weeks there,
31:27he will come back again,
31:28now it's time,
31:29for the campaign to take ship,
31:31campaigns are fought on the ground,
31:32at the booth level,
31:33this is the real time,
31:38when the metal,
31:39and the case that we brought to the people,
31:41will be tested,
31:42they have to be on the ground,
31:43of course all these leaders will come,
31:45and they will give momentum,
31:46and they will give momentum,
31:46I must make a comment,
31:48I have to leave,
31:50yeah I'll come to you,
31:51I'll come to you,
31:52I'll come to you,
31:53I've taken your point,
32:00okay I've taken your point,
32:01Anshul,
32:02but Pawan Varma,
32:03you as I said,
32:04you know Nitish Kumar well,
32:06is he coming across to you,
32:07as a bit of a tragic figure,
32:09someone who claimed,
32:10to be one of the original,
32:11JP social justice wallahs,
32:13comes from the 1970s,
32:15possibly the last,
32:16of that generation,
32:18today it appears,
32:19that Nitish Kumar,
32:20according to some,
32:21is simply a mukhota,
32:23for the BJP,
32:24is that how you see him,
32:25as a tragic figure,
32:27in the last phase,
32:28of his political career,
32:32I see,
32:34multiple tragedies,
32:37if the same dispensations,
32:38come back,
32:41unfolding in Bihar,
32:42the first question,
32:42is about Nitish Kumar,
32:44yes in a way,
32:46it's a Shakespearean tragedy,
32:48here was the most polished product,
32:50of the socialist movement,
32:52a man of personal integrity,
32:53administrative acumen,
32:56who in the first phase,
32:58between 2005 and 2010,
33:01and later,
33:03brought back Bihar,
33:04from the brink,
33:05and predicament of Jangal Raj,
33:07and then there's the decline,
33:09of Nitish Kumar,
33:10where through his many flip-flops,
33:12he lost credibility,
33:14and then in 2020,
33:16thanks to the conspiracy,
33:17played against him,
33:18by the BJP,
33:19and Chirag Paswan,
33:20he was reduced,
33:21to 43 seats,
33:23as a helpless,
33:24younger brother,
33:24of the BJP,
33:25and now,
33:26he's playing,
33:27his last innings,
33:29that's how I see,
33:30but the second tragedy,
33:31in Bihar is,
33:32that the choice,
33:33that is left to them,
33:34is between a ninth-pass,
33:36Tejasui Adav,
33:37and a tenth-failed,
33:39Samrat Chaudhary,
33:39who's the deputy chief minister,
33:41that's a bigger tragedy,
33:44because for 30 years,
33:46Bihar has been ruled by them,
33:48and 30 years later,
33:50Bihar is still the poorest,
33:51and most backward state,
33:52in the country,
33:53with the lowest,
33:54per capita income,
33:55the highest rate,
33:56of unemployment,
33:58the largest number,
33:59of outward,
34:00immigration,
34:0150% of the women,
34:03illiterate,
34:04so that's the choice,
34:05and as far as,
34:06the Congress is concerned,
34:07let me say,
34:08the Congress may have,
34:09arm twisted the RJD,
34:11by getting 60 seats,
34:12last time they got 70,
34:14they won 19,
34:15the fact is,
34:16that the Congress's,
34:17ambitions,
34:18are far beyond,
34:19its electoral capability,
34:21and organizational strength,
34:25and this time too,
34:26you will see that happen,
34:27so whether Rahul Gandhi,
34:28is in Colombia,
34:29sipping coffee,
34:30or in Bihar,
34:31it doesn't make a difference,
34:32because a party,
34:33which doesn't have,
34:34the organizational strength,
34:35on the ground,
34:36and only 5% of the vote,
34:38is going to lose seats,
34:40so that is the position,
34:42and as far as,
34:43I want to go back,
34:44whatever pitch you may go to,
34:45whatever pitch you may go to,
34:48whatever pitch you may go to,
34:50the truth is,
34:51that the BJP,
34:52is planning to dispense with him,
34:56you are saying this,
34:57with a great degree of confidence,
34:59I am recording,
34:59what you are saying,
35:00in case the NDA wins,
35:01that the NITISH KUMAR,
35:02is going to be dispensed with,
35:04Sachan Kumar,
35:05do you believe,
35:05it's that easy though,
35:06for the BJP,
35:07to dispense with NITISH KUMAR,
35:09do they still need,
35:10NITISH KUMAR,
35:11if not,
35:12for the full 5,
35:13for a full 5 year term,
35:15if they win,
35:15at least for another year,
35:17despite,
35:18reports of his fading health,
35:19NITISH KUMAR,
35:20is not the primary concern,
35:22precisely because,
35:22to his co-supporter,
35:24NITISH KUMAR,
35:25health is not the primary concern,
35:27what is important more,
35:29is the continuity,
35:30of the scheme,
35:31that he is associated with,
35:32and to that extent,
35:33NITISH KUMAR,
35:34is still very much there,
35:36relevant and pertinent,
35:37among his support base,
35:38two,
35:39can BJP,
35:41dispense with,
35:42NITISH KUMAR,
35:43if that is,
35:44supposed for the sake of argument,
35:45is the plan,
35:46then is it,
35:47is it possible,
35:48certainly not,
35:49because unlike neighboring,
35:50Uttar Pradesh,
35:51and Jharkhand,
35:53Bihar BJP,
35:53is still not,
35:54a OBC dominated party,
35:56minded,
35:57that's reflect,
35:59in their ticket distribution,
36:0049 out of 101,
36:02are upper caste,
36:03and two,
36:03you cannot become,
36:04a hegemonic party,
36:05in India,
36:06without having,
36:06overwhelming support,
36:07of the OBC,
36:09so,
36:09we talk about,
36:10non-Yadav Yadav,
36:11but even in Bihar,
36:13significant,
36:14and overwhelming number,
36:15of non-OBC,
36:17non-Yadav OBC,
36:18and decisively,
36:19the EBC,
36:20still vote to NDA,
36:23to BJP also,
36:24via NITISH KUMAR,
36:25and you have seen,
36:26this happening in 2015,
36:27but Mr. Modi,
36:27is OBC Sajjan,
36:30Mr. Modi himself,
36:31is OBC,
36:31so do you believe,
36:32that the NDA,
36:33goes into this election,
36:34with Mr. Modi,
36:35as the chair,
36:36NITISH as the chair,
36:37or NEMO,
36:38NITISH and Modi,
36:39both as their chair,
36:40NITISH,
36:41that's a very fine,
36:42chemistry,
36:43at this juncture,
36:44but mind it,
36:45you take NITISH out,
36:46Bihar is not,
36:47ready to cross,
36:49the Rubicon,
36:50from NITISH,
36:51to Modi,
36:51when it comes,
36:52to assembly election,
36:53because many of,
36:54mind it,
36:55the most flagship,
36:56women-centric scheme,
36:57of 10,000 rupees,
36:59to 1.25 crore women,
37:01is still called,
37:02Mukhamantri,
37:03Rojgar,
37:04Yojana,
37:04so NITISH knows,
37:05how to continue,
37:06the perception,
37:07like Naveen Patnaik,
37:08used to do in Odisha,
37:09so I think,
37:10he may be,
37:12in a bad state of health,
37:13but to his core supporter,
37:14his presence is via,
37:15scheme that still matters,
37:17and therefore,
37:18whatever may be,
37:18the top down,
37:19and it is on the ground,
37:20he remains,
37:21indispensable to the BJP,
37:22right,
37:24I am giving you,
37:2430 seconds Sanju Verma,
37:26otherwise you will complain,
37:27you won't give an ad,
37:27but 30 seconds,
37:28by the clock,
37:30are you going,
37:30into this election,
37:31the same question,
37:32I asked Sajjan,
37:33under Nimo,
37:34NITISH and Modi,
37:36under NITISH ji,
37:38or Modi ji,
37:39NITISH Kumar,
37:40aapki majboori hai,
37:43you don't really,
37:44like NITISH Kumar,
37:46because he's,
37:46ditched you,
37:47betrayed you,
37:48in the past,
37:48but he's your,
37:49majboori,
37:4930 seconds,
37:50Rajdeep Sardesai,
37:54ki kya majboori hai,
37:55that he wants to create,
37:56a rift between,
37:57NITISH Kumar,
37:58and BJP,
37:59mujhe nahi pata,
38:00but Rajdeep Sardesai,
38:01ki zaroorat yye hai,
38:03ki woh bar bar,
38:04Sanju Verma,
38:04ko debet,
38:05par gulai,
38:05and he has a great sense of humor,
38:08he takes things in his trine,
38:12so I will answer your question,
38:14in four lines,
38:15Tufar mein taash ka ghar nahi bantah,
38:18Tufar mein taash ka ghar nahi bantah,
38:21rone se,
38:22bigra hua,
38:23mukaddar nahi bantah,
38:25ek haa se,
38:26koji fakir nahi bantah,
38:27aur ek jit se,
38:29koji sikandar nahi bantah,
38:30but BJP is not something which is,
38:35one summer does not make it,
38:38one swallow does not make it a summer,
38:40woh BJP ke liye lagu nahi hota,
38:42we have a track record,
38:44and Congress has a track record,
38:45okay your time is up,
38:47ma'am your 30 seconds is up,
38:49I went by the clock,
38:50your 30 seconds is up,
38:52you've given me your share or shairi,
38:53it's not a bad way to end this part,
38:56of the show today,
38:57clearly NITISH Kumar is the great survivor,
38:59of Indian politics,
39:01some will call him a tragic figure,
39:03others will say he still has mastered,
39:06the art of real polity,
39:07either way,
39:08it would seem that the NITISH Kumar era,
39:11in Indian politics,
39:13is slowly coming to an end,
39:15in the context of Bihar,
39:17this is in all probability,
39:19his last stand,
39:20Pawan Kumar Verma,
39:21Anshul Abjit,
39:22Sanju Verma and Sajjan Kumar,
39:24appreciate you joining us,
39:26on the NITISH Factor,
39:27here on the news today.
39:29You are with the news today,
39:32he made India,
39:34laugh,
39:35think and feel,
39:37one advertisement,
39:39at a time,
39:40the man behind,
39:42Fevical's wit,
39:43Cadbury's charm,
39:45and Vodafone's pug,
39:47the one and only,
39:48Piyush Pandey,
39:49is no more,
39:50the legendary advertiser,
39:52passed away,
39:53of a prolonged lung illness,
39:55Piyush Pandey,
39:57redefined Indian advertisement,
40:00and advertising,
40:01in the last quarter of a century,
40:03take a look,
40:04Piyush Pandey,
40:05the one and only,
40:18the one and only,
40:19the one who's a hero,
40:19the other,
40:22the other,
40:23the other,
40:25the other,
40:26He gave us the Fevicol bus that never broke apart.
40:56A Cadbury girl who danced her heart out on a cricket field.
41:13And the pug that followed us everywhere.
41:22Piyush Pandey, the man who turned everyday India into unforgettable storytelling.
41:31A cricketer turned copywriter, he joined Ogilvy in 1982 and went on to build the country's
41:37most successful ad agency.
41:53His magic with the pen didn't just extend to copy but also to lyrics penning Mille Sur Mera
41:58Tumhara, an Indian song that promoted national integration and unity in diversity.
42:05And when politics called, Pandey's words powered one of India's most defining election slogans.
42:29He was honoured with the Padma Shree in 2016, named Global Chief Creative Officer of Ogilvy,
42:39and celebrated across continents as the man who gave Indian advertising its own accent.
42:44And joining me now is another special figure from the world of advertising.
43:05He's a man of many parts.
43:06Prasoon Joshi joins me.
43:07Prasoon Joshi joins me.
43:08Appreciate your joining us.
43:10Prasoon, what for you was your, what was the first thought that came to you when you heard
43:15that Piyush Pandey is no more at the age of 70?
43:18Prasoon Joshi joins me.
43:19Prasoon Joshi joins me.
43:20Prasoon, I'm really saddened by the news.
43:23Piyush Pandey would be someone whom I would always very fondly remember.
43:37Piyush Pandey was the first person who actually made me believe that in the advertising world,
43:48a lot of views for people like me who came from smaller towns.
43:54Piyush was not like any other advertising person I met at that time
43:58while I was doing my MBA.
44:01So he was someone who was very authentic,
44:04someone who would always be remembered for, you know,
44:08the joyful work he did and inspired others to do.
44:12And I was fortunate to have worked with him and collaborated with him
44:18on a lot of campaigns, be it Cadbury's, Asian panes,
44:22many stuff we did together.
44:23A lot of things which I outside did and he admired
44:27even when I had left working with him.
44:33You're mentioning some iconic ads there like Cadbury's
44:36and other ads that Piyush in a sense conceived kuch khas hai.
44:44Your memories of him, your remembrances of Piyush
44:48in the context of those ads, Prasoon?
44:53When we talk about Piyush Mande, I think one important thing
44:57which will always be remembered about him is his love for life.
45:02Be it professionally or personally, he just loved life.
45:06He believed in enjoying every moment of life.
45:10And I think that's what also reflected in his work.
45:14He always, you know, got these nice stories from life,
45:19from everyday life and he wanted to share those stories.
45:24He always inspired you to share vulnerability of your life
45:29with other people.
45:30Be it his relationship with his family,
45:33be it his relationship with his friends.
45:34He will always talk about it.
45:36And that's what he wanted to share with the world.
45:40I think his love for life, that was very evident in his work.
45:44His love for life is how you're putting it.
45:49Prasoon Joshi speaking to me earlier.
45:50Let me now go live to Anuradha Sengupta,
45:54a journalist who's tracked the world of advertising for several years now
45:58and CVL Srinivas, country manager, WPP India.
46:01I want to come to you, Anuradha first, because give us a context.
46:06Put Piyush Pandey and his work in context.
46:09One of the tributes flowing to him today was interesting.
46:11It said he reflected the Swadeshi-fication of Indian advertising,
46:17the Hindhi-fication, Swadeshi-fication.
46:20Do you agree?
46:20Or was he much more than just that?
46:26Well, Rajdeep, you know, Amitabh Bachchan tweeted earlier today two words.
46:33Stabd, Nishabd.
46:35That's the way most of us are feeling today.
46:39You know, to be here, to say and speak about Piyush Pandey in the past tense
46:46feels really strange.
46:47I didn't expect to be doing this, but here we are.
46:52And Swadeshi, Hindhi-fication, Desi-fication, you just spoke to Prasun.
46:58Prasun used the word authentic, which is very much the currency today.
47:02Piyush Pandey was authentic as long as, you know, we've known him.
47:07What you saw is what you got.
47:09He brought in this age of artificial intelligence.
47:13He brought the human heart and he kept it front and center.
47:17You know, in the past 10 years or so, a lot has changed.
47:20In the last five years, the entire industry has been completely disrupted.
47:25Marketing, advertising, brand communication.
47:28You have data, you have algorithms, you have the big tech companies,
47:31you have influencers, you have reels, transitions.
47:33You know, everything is transactional.
47:36Everything is transitory.
47:38Piyush Pandey remained focused on the human heart, on the beating heart of India in this age of artificial intelligence.
47:46So he's way beyond just those few things that he did do.
47:50And he does get credit for in the way he changed Indian advertising.
47:56Let me come to you, Mr. Shinivas, in that context.
47:59When I look at these advertisements, Asian Paints, Har Ghar Kuch Keta Hai, Bajaj, Hamara Bajaj,
48:05Vodafone, the pug that everyone remembers.
48:08Of course, Cadbury's Kuch Khaas Hai.
48:09The ad like, todo, nahi, jodo.
48:15How do you see, Piyush, the body of work that he did over the years stands out for you?
48:20Or just as Anuradha said and Prasoon before, a certain authenticity that he brought to Indian advertising in a way,
48:28which was very anglicized in its early years.
48:32Yeah, absolutely.
48:33You know, Rajdeep, advertising is supposed to make brands famous.
48:37But I think Piyush Pandey made advertising famous.
48:40I think that's what we'll all remember him by.
48:42Because in the early 90s, when he came up with all those fantastic ads,
48:48firstly for Cadbury's and then, of course, Fevicol and everything else.
48:51I think it's thanks to him that, you know, advert…
48:53And remember, those were the days where there was no social media.
49:01Your audio.
49:04Okay, we'll try and…
49:06Yeah, go ahead.
49:07Okay, we'll come back to you, Srinivasan, in a moment.
49:10But Anuradha, you know, there is the Piyush Pandey,
49:13Mille Sur Mera Tumara Piyush Pandey,
49:16and there's the Piyush Pandey who also did Ap Ki Baar Modi Sarkar.
49:19So, he actually conceptualized some belief, part of that 2014 campaign.
49:25I write about it in my 2014 book.
49:26But was he, in that sense, political in the way he saw the world?
49:32Or was he just the authentic, creative person looking for an interesting campaign to put out there?
49:38Whether it was for a politician or a product?
49:41You know, Rajdeep, that is…
49:44Rajdeep, that's something that I have grappled with.
49:50It is not a question that he has taken head-on or directly ever in terms of what his politics are.
49:57But there is no doubt about the fact that he was extremely, extremely enthused by what Prime Minister Modi represented,
50:05the change he represented when he, you know, burst into our lives and won that election in 2014.
50:13And Piyush, you know, worked with him when he was the Chief Minister of Gujarat on that famous Gujarat tourism campaign.
50:21So, he saw definitely in Prime Minister Modi a chance for change.
50:27And, sorry, say again?
50:31Khushmu Gujarat Ki, that was the campaign.
50:35Yes, yes, yes.
50:37And, you know, and he loved advertising.
50:41He had a challenge.
50:42He had to communicate something and he communicated what he believed in at that point of time for that campaign.
50:48That's the way I see it.
50:51Because the simplicity, you know, authenticity is one word associated with Piyush, larger than life, of course.
51:00And there was the simplicity, Srinivas, about his campaigns.
51:04He didn't, he wasn't, he wasn't flashy in his advertising, but he made it simple and accessible.
51:10Would I be right in saying that?
51:12Absolutely.
51:13I think he was someone who really connected with the real people, with all the real incidents, you know,
51:20and every situation that he went through in his own life and whatever he experienced in his own life.
51:27And remember, he was a cricketer before he became an ad man.
51:29So, he brought a lot of that, you know, into his work, into his craft.
51:34And he wasn't someone who would, like, sit far away in a fancy building and, like, meet clients once in a while.
51:40He was out there.
51:41He was, like, in the market.
51:42He was meeting clients day in and day out.
51:44He really knew the pulse of the consumer.
51:46And, yes, so, extremely authentic.
51:49And, I mean, I would say God's greatest gift to Indian advertising.
51:52You know, you mentioned his cricket.
51:56Just to tell our viewers, Piyush was a very good wicket keeper, batsman, or should I say batsman, wicket keeper.
52:03And I was sent by a friend, one of his college photographs at St. Stephens in the 1970s, Arun Lal, the test cricketer, was part of that team.
52:11And I always felt, Srini, that Piyush would have rather played cricket for Rajasthan or India instead of even being the head of O&M as he was for many years.
52:22That was his first love.
52:23Pihla Piyar was not Cadbury's, but cricket.
52:26Yes, every conversation, Rajdeep, every conversation one had with him, even the last time I spoke with him a few weeks ago, you know, he would always start and end with the cricketing analogy.
52:36And so, especially on a day like this, for me, you know, he's a man who, he never ducked to a bouncer.
52:41In fact, he hit every bouncer for a six.
52:43And he always played with a straight bat.
52:46Right.
52:47Anuradha, you've seen a lot of Piyush's ads.
52:49You want to pick a favorite one for us, something that for you defines what Piyush did.
52:55Would there be one such ad for you as someone who's observed that industry for so close?
53:03You know, the ad he does for Asian Pains, Har Ghar Kuch Kehta Hai, which is his own voiceover.
53:09The voiceover in that ad is his own voice.
53:12That, if you hear those lines, they are, you know, it's poetry.
53:19And we don't, and what Piyush did with his advertising was that he took advertising, which is commercial, brand-led communication, and made it part of our culture.
53:28Today, we have specialist units that are listening to culture and trying to create something.
53:33What he created became part of culture.
53:35I'd pick Asian Pains and the work he did, the Favikol, and how he took a, you know, a product which was used by carpenters and made it a part of culture and, you know, everyday language and something all of us use.
53:47Is a huge, huge, massive case study in brand building.
53:53Okay.
53:54My favorite, of course, and I think Piyush's favorite somewhere secretly was Cadbury's because he got to shoot at the Brebon Stadium and thereby was able to bring cricket and chocolates together.
54:05And as someone who was a cricket fanatic like Piyush, I'm sure that ad gave him a lot of personal satisfaction.
54:12But Anuradha, Sengupta, and Mr. Srinivas, I appreciate you joining me.
54:16Piyush Pandey will be much, much missed.
54:20Thanks for all the memories.
54:22Piyush, we will miss you.
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