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00:00It's hour three of the GVAC Nation here on 105.3 The Fan.
00:03I hope you're having a fantastic day. Thanks for making us part of it.
00:06Of course, a big Friday coming up tomorrow.
00:08Just heard from Eric Nadel, he can't make tomorrow's 440 because he's in Cuba.
00:13Yeah, says the cell service isn't that great right now, so he can't get a call in tomorrow.
00:18But we are joined by a special guest right now from All-City, national NBA writer,
00:23Tim Cato here to talk about what is next for the Mavs.
00:27And a good afternoon, Tim. How the heck are you?
00:31I'm doing fantastic. How are you guys today?
00:34We're doing great. We love talking basketball with you.
00:38And we thought, well, there's not going to be much going down here for the next couple of weeks.
00:42But there they were a couple of days ago making the decision, then the presser yesterday.
00:48So I guess now it goes to who's going to be the next coach.
00:52And, of course, we have great memories of Sean Sweeney, who's now doing great things with the Spurs.
00:57So that would be my first question for you as you were on the beat when Sweeney was on the
01:02Mavs bench.
01:03Do you think he'd be a good fit here?
01:06Absolutely. Sean Sweeney is going to be a coach in the NBA sooner than later.
01:12Obviously, I can't tell you right now on this radio hit if he's going to be the Mavericks coach.
01:19But absolutely, I am a Sean Sweeney fan.
01:23I think he's very impressive.
01:26That's what everybody says about him.
01:29And, yeah, you know, he does have a relationship with Jason Kidd.
01:35And I've had people even suggest I was on, you know, obviously the DLS show yesterday.
01:41And I saw people in the comments talking about, you know, well, would that relationship with Jason Kidd,
01:47since they just released Jason Kidd, since there has been reporting, you know, that Jason Kidd and his approval
01:55or, you know, willingness to do a Luka Doncic trade, that was part of the tension, part of the, you
02:01know,
02:01idea that, you know, Dallas was going to do a clean slate.
02:06You know, would that relationship with Jason Kidd preclude him from the job?
02:12But I would point to last summer, where Sean Sweeney blessed the Mavericks, you know,
02:16like this is not a, you know, directly tied at the hip situation or anything, anything approaching that.
02:23You know, Sean Sweeney does have a relationship with Jason Kidd, but I would not lump him into, you know,
02:31just a, you know, just a, you know, Jason Kidd type or anything like that.
02:36Absolutely, you know, if he were to be offered a head coaching job, I'm sure you would take it.
02:42You know, the question is more about, you know, is Dallas going, you know, would Dallas do that?
02:48But I think he should be on their list. I think he should be interviewed.
02:51I think he should be someone that they take a serious look at.
02:54Do you think it was a good decision to let Kidd go?
03:00And ended up in Dallas, I think that would be a fantastic thing.
03:04Tim Cato here with you on 105.3 The Fan from All-City.
03:07Do you think it was a good idea to let Jason Kidd go?
03:12I think, I think it was probably unavoidable.
03:17I think it's, it's a, it's a decision, like I said, that, that fully cleans house.
03:24I think that Jason Kidd has merits as a head coach.
03:28I think that with the right squad, he can elevate players to be more of the sum of their parts.
03:36He also has three losing seasons in four years in Dallas.
03:40You know, you know, you don't get to rest, uh, fully on a conference, like a surprising conference finals run.
03:47And then a surprising finals run, you know, that, that those don't weigh so much more than the fact that,
03:54you know,
03:55I think we all agree that the 22, 23 team, you know, underperformed under, under Jason Kidd's coaching, um, more
04:03so than that.
04:04Jason Kidd is somebody who wants influence.
04:06Um, you know, he wants, uh, to have some level of power within an organization.
04:11He obviously wanted, uh, to do GM job.
04:14He was very interested in, in, you know, the job that went to Messiah jury.
04:18Um, you know, I, I don't think that's directly, you know, why he was, he was, uh, let go or
04:23fired or, you know, why they parted ways.
04:26Um, but, but I do think that, you know, just, you know, someone like Messiah is so big and so,
04:34um, you know, influential.
04:36If you're going to hire him, you're committing to his project.
04:38You're committing to him running the show.
04:41And I just don't think that was ever going to, uh, jive, um, or, or mesh well with Jason Kidd
04:47as head coach.
04:48Tim Kidd with us here in the G bag nation.
04:50I think I was a little bit surprised initially because of the relationship that it seemed like Jason Kidd had
04:56with Kyrie and Cooper flag.
04:58And it's such a player driven league, at least from the outside looking in, can you help put into context?
05:03Like, was that relationship maybe overblown and how much in terms of keeping Cooper flag happy, will that influence the
05:11decision of the next coach?
05:14I don't think it was overblown at all.
05:15I think he, uh, one of, one of Jason Kidd's very, um, most prominent strengths is, uh, building these relationships
05:23with, with the star players.
05:25And when you had Luca and Kyrie on the same team, um, I'm not sure there's another coach in the
05:29NBA who could have managed and built those relationships, uh, better than he could have.
05:35Um, it did, but, um, you know, Kyrie and we can talk about, you know, his, his exact future with,
05:42with the, with the team, but you know, he's, he's adaptable.
05:45Um, you know, maybe, maybe he's part of the future.
05:49Maybe, maybe he isn't.
05:50Um, I sure hope he is, um, with Cooper, he's, you know, he's 19, he's 20.
05:56Um, I don't think at this stage, uh, there's any indication that, that Cooper is, is going to be someone
06:02who, you know, doesn't mesh with the next head coach.
06:06Um, you know, at the press conference, Masai said that they were, you know, both involved.
06:11Involved, they were both, uh, you know, the, this, this decision was, was brought to them.
06:15Um, you know, not, not that they had influence over it, but, but, you know, it was communicated to them.
06:21Um, I, I don't think there's any concern about Cooper flag at this point of his career, though.
06:26Um, you know, that, that, that he's going to, you know, like, this isn't going to linger with him.
06:33Um, I, I, I don't have any indication of that at least.
06:36Tim, do you think this is some big, comprehensive search for a guy, or do you think they have the,
06:43the one or two guys that they want to zero in on?
06:47I think that's a great question.
06:49Um, I would imagine that the starting point for how this decision happened, how they, um, you know, parted ways
06:58with Jason Kidd,
06:59was more of an examination of, can Jason Kidd mesh with Messiah Jerry in the front office?
07:06That's, that's my best guess and understanding.
07:10So it wasn't a, a, it wasn't a, a approach of, can we get someone better than Jason Kidd?
07:16It's, does this even work?
07:18Um, you know, oddly enough, my sense is that the biggest fan of Jason Kidd being the head coach of
07:24the Dallas Mavericks
07:25was not Jason Kidd, was not Messiah Jerry, but was Patrick Dumont, um, just a, just a very curious, uh,
07:32situation.
07:33Very clearly, you know, and, you know, he extended him, uh, before last season, uh, Patrick Dumont did extended, uh,
07:39Jason Kidd.
07:40Um, he clearly believed in, in Jason Kidd as a, as a head coach.
07:44Um, but when you bring in someone like Messiah, uh, it is an indication that you are handing him the
07:50reins.
07:50Um, you know, in that this is going to be his project.
07:54He has both hands on the steering wheel.
07:56He is fully in charge.
07:58Um, he also has a lot of relationships with people around the league and, you know, when they decided, okay,
08:04Jason Kidd does not fit.
08:06I imagine it's not like, okay, well, let's, let's go, let's go see which high coaches are out there.
08:11Messiah has names and candidates and people that, that, you know, I, I'm sure were very quickly like in his,
08:18you know, the, the, the,
08:20the short-term memory part of his brain that he just kind of, okay, let's look at these guys.
08:24Um, you know, I, I think and hope Sean Sweeney is on the list.
08:28I think, uh, Tiago Splitter is someone who comes from Paris basketball, a very innovative European club.
08:34Uh, the same club that Darko, uh, came from, who is the, the Raptors head coach that, um, you know,
08:41that, that Messiah hired in, uh, 2023, I believe.
08:44Um, so there could be something there, uh, Nick Nurse is under contract.
08:49He's employed by the Philadelphia 76ers, but, uh, with Daryl Morey going out the door, uh, you maybe can see
08:57the writing on the wall.
08:58It's, it's possible that, um, you know, it's, I, I see a possibility that, that Nick Nurse would, uh, look
09:06very curiously or interestedly at the Dallas gig.
09:11And, you know, maybe that's something that can be worked out even with him, you know, technically being employed.
09:16Uh, and then Mike Anori is, is, is the other name I've, you know, I believe Mark Stein, my colleague
09:21Mark Stein reported, uh, that connection that, that him and, and Messiah, um, you know, have past history, uh, in
09:30a, in a, in a positive way.
09:31Uh, Mike Anori is the, is the lead assistant in Minnesota and he has, uh, been someone who has been,
09:37uh, lauded for being one of those future head coach types.
09:42Um, I, I think any of those four names would be very interesting, very appealing.
09:46They all have pros and cons, uh, but, but definitely pros.
09:50Um, and, and the other thing to remember is that Dallas is the one head coaching opening vacancy right now
09:56that has Cooper flag.
09:57That's pretty appealing in my mind.
09:59That's more appealing than any other candidate or, you know, any other situation.
10:03Uh, so if I'm Dallas, I would assume, I would believe that I am coming into this head coaching search
10:10from a position of strength because there's no situation.
10:13That's more appealing than a, um, coach Cooper flag.
10:17Tim, I was, you know, and I was just wondering in, in the NBA is the game of connect the
10:23dots.
10:24Is it one that tends to work out or is it one like, no, I'm not, I mean, you, you
10:30went through a lot of those candidates and stuff like that.
10:33And, but with the NBA is the history of connect the dots.
10:36Does that seem to always play out or is it now we need to keep an open mind?
10:41It could be, you know, we heard whispers about the John Shire, the Duke coach.
10:46I mean, where, uh, where, where should we, what should we believe in and what direction it might go?
10:52So when you say connect the dots, you mean like if a guy has been like, yeah, like Nick nurse
10:58are the biggest indicator.
11:00Yeah.
11:00Like all of a sudden, are we going to get, you know, are we just automatically in, in a lot
11:04of sports, we always try and play connect the dots.
11:07And then you're like, Oh, then it happens.
11:09I just wondered in your experience with the NBA is connect the dots, a game that, that, that, that tends
11:15to lead to coaches being hired.
11:19Uh, yes.
11:20Yes, it is.
11:21I think that's kind of how life works to be honest in a, in a lot of ways.
11:25Um, but, but absolutely.
11:27I can tell you, um, you guys remember, uh, Greg St.
11:31Gene, the assistant coach that was initially on, on Jason good stuff.
11:34Sure.
11:34Absolutely.
11:34Um, he hired or he had a lot of influence and a lot of the hires, Jason kid and the
11:41Mavericks made, uh, that, that first season.
11:44Um, I, I believe, I want to say I'm blank.
11:47I think it's St.
11:47John's.
11:48He went to St.
11:48John's.
11:49I believe, uh, apologies if I got that wrong.
11:51It's something like that.
11:52Um, a lot of the people Dallas hired, uh, when Jason kid first came in were people who went to
11:58St.
11:58John's who had a relationship with Greg St.
12:00Gene, um, you know, so absolutely.
12:03We've seen that, um, you know, Nepo isn't the right word, but you know, just the personal relationships, uh, absolutely
12:12100% matter in the NBA.
12:14And it is how often, you know, people go place to place.
12:20What, what was Sweeney's motivation for leaving the Mavs last year?
12:25I mean, it was mostly that, that, so, okay.
12:29I'm, I'm, I'm, uh, I'm rewinding to that moment when, you know, I was deeply embedded in it.
12:35Um, after the finals run, Dallas did not extend its assistance for the most part.
12:43I believe there's one, I think Jared Dudley was, um, but that is a NBA tradition that if you have
12:52a successful season and absolutely in 2024, the Mavericks going to the finals was like success.
12:58It was a surprise of an overachievement.
13:01The typical thing that happens is that the entire coaching staff gets rewarded and Jason kid got an extension, uh,
13:10actually in the middle of that finals run.
13:12Um, but his assistants didn't, which is why Sean Sweeney, uh, was a free agent, uh, last summer.
13:20And so he chose to go to a place that paid him a lot of money.
13:25Uh, and, and technically, you know, he's the lead assistant in Dallas, but you know, they did give him a
13:30associate head coach title, which is a, you know, slightly higher, uh, you know, slightly better title.
13:36But it came from, you know, just kind of this, this, uh, lack of tradition, uh, that, that wasn't applied.
13:44And I've heard a million reasons.
13:47Um, I mean, not a million, I've heard like three or four different reasons why that might've been the case.
13:52And, you know, some people have argued Jason kid didn't go to that for them enough.
13:57Um, some people have argued that was just kind of the way Dumont did it.
14:01Um, but that, that was why.
14:03And, um, you know, it, it clearly, you know, I watched game two last night, you know, this, this is,
14:11uh, you know, the, the Spurs is looking like the, uh,
14:14Spurs Thunder is looking like one of the best series we've had in quite some time.
14:18And, uh, you know, can't really fault Sean for the choice.
14:21It seemed to have worked out pretty well for him.
14:23Listening to, to Mike Schmitz, who was on with KNC earlier today.
14:27I, they obviously have an eye on what's going on in this series.
14:30And, and with two teams that are in your conference, in your division with the Spurs and the Thunder.
14:34Yeah.
14:35How do you see that maybe impacting what they do this off season?
14:38I know we kind of hinted around Kyrie, but is that somebody that you think that they want here moving
14:43forward?
14:43To pair with Cooper Flagg, or is that, you know what, we're going to build young and kind of follow
14:47this model that those two franchises have?
14:51I would imagine they want Kyrie here, uh, because he's Kyrie Irving.
14:56And it's a joy to watch him play basketball.
14:59It's, it's, he's, he's one of the greatest Hoopers, you know, most, uh, you know, enjoyable to watch type, type
15:05guys.
15:06And, you know, he's been fantastic here, you know, like, like we all know that.
15:10We all know how much he has, you know, embraced Dallas, that, you know, any controversy and any past offs
15:17is, is just not who he's been when he's, uh, you know, in his time here.
15:22Um, that said, I do think you can make an argument that the Spurs and the Thunder are at such
15:31a high level of basketball that Dallas might just admit, okay.
15:36You know, like that, that's something we're probably a few years away from and maybe a few more draft picks,
15:41you know, maybe a few more, uh, chances to, to really build this team more slowly.
15:48Not to say that, you know, they don't own their picks, so they're not going to be tanking.
15:52You know, I'm not suggesting, you know, that this team will not be trying to win going into next season.
15:57They will be trying to win, um, but if you're watching this series, uh, maybe it is an acknowledgement that
16:03a slow methodical or slightly slower methodical build with Kyrie, you know, it's just not going to match Kyrie's timeline.
16:11If, if he's interested in contention, you know, I, I do think that Dallas would be right to do right
16:16by him and, you know, try to honor that if there are deals, if there are opportunities, uh, to, to
16:23build for Cooper's future, um, and, and, uh, you know, get Kyrie somewhere that, that he wants to play.
16:30Um, but, but I don't think any of that is determined right now.
16:34And my hope and my best guess is that Kyrie will at least start the season.
16:39And that's a, that's a conversation or a debate or a topic that you can get to at the trade
16:45deadline throughout the season, depending on how things go.
16:48I would be bummed out personally, if I never see Kyrie and Cooper get to play together.
16:53Yeah, me too.
16:54Great stuff, Tim.
16:55Can't thank you enough for your insights and the time with us and enjoy the, uh, the rest of these
17:00playoffs.
17:00In your off season, we'll try to catch up with you soon.
17:03Absolutely.
17:04Great to talk.
17:04Salute.
17:05There he goes.
17:05Tim Cato, all city national NBA writer, a hell of a guest, hell of a Mavs B writer for many
17:12years.
17:13And, uh, his insights are much appreciated here as we continue to track this story for you.
17:18Okay.
17:19Top 100.
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