00:02first of all i just want to say i'm gonna this is a great interview for me to do because
00:06i
00:07actually got to go to the set um i wrote a cover story on lisa for the hollywood reporter and
00:12spent
00:12some time with michael and i got to go to the set and i have to say i was a
00:17little intimidated at
00:18first because it's you it was like seeing the genius at work but the thing that i was seeing
00:23the crack monkey at work yeah let me rewrite that but but yeah stepping onto your set um and seeing
00:30how exacting and precise your vision is and how how you directed that episode and and and had them
00:37had the performers tweak the lines and getting the cameras right but also at the same time it was not
00:42this sort of mad genius at work you were having the best time when we when we talked you were
00:47having so
00:48much fun um so let's talk about that because this you have a clear vision but you guys wouldn't
00:55have come back if you weren't having fun as jimmy burrow says in episode four i'm quitting because
01:00i'm not having fun you guys are having fun but you didn't just do this to have a laugh and
01:04collect a
01:04paycheck you guys really elevated and executed on on the highest level this season so tell me about
01:09setting the bar that high and why you incorporated so many cameras this season um first of all it was
01:16was a party it was like being at a great party and i thought to myself if you're not having
01:20fun doing
01:20this which is this weird fairy tale of getting canceled in 2005 and then 10 years later having
01:29the dvd interest bring you back and being offered to do it again and then coming up with an idea
01:3611
01:36years later that it's just a very magical thing a lot of amazing shows don't get past a first season
01:44so we were all very grateful that we got to come back but what we did at the first season
01:50of the
01:51comeback is basically supposed to be unedited raw footage so the look of the show it's filmed with two
01:57documentary cameras and the dance between valerie who's lisa kudrow's character who is desperate to
02:05be in the spotlight getting trapped in an unedited version of of her embarrassment and her need
02:12so that was the the prototype and as a matter of fact when we started we thought we were going
02:17to
02:17do the whole series with one camera like that would be good that would be interesting and carolyn
02:22strauss who was at hbo at the time said maybe two so you have something to cut to so we
02:28have two cameras
02:29and then at the and that was the format of the comeback it was that sort of raw footage vibe
02:35and then at
02:36the end of the second season in the writing room we she had a moment where one of her characters
02:42which
02:42is featured in the clips you're going to see talking about i got sick and went to the hospital
02:47and the story was that valerie left the emmys to go because life became bigger than awards to her for
02:53the first time and we thought we can't really have a real scene if she's worried about these dark cameras
03:00so the writers lisa and i decided that she would leave the cameras behind which meant we were leaving
03:06behind the style of the show so she sort of walks away and into the real world almost like dorothy
03:15going
03:15from the black and white into the color and the wizard of oz like it's a different vibe and we
03:20didn't
03:21know we were doing a third season so that was a big swing that may or may not have worked
03:25that we
03:26thought worked at the end and then people were like oh you went into the real world we're seeing
03:32real valerie so then 11 years later we decided to come back and i was like well we can't negate
03:38the fact that we let the real world in so how do we give people what they remember which is
03:47the doc
03:47camera embarrassing quick movement and bring in the fact that real life is there and the only way i could
03:54think to do it was like three card monty where you move the camera the card so fast you don't
03:59know
03:59where the ace is that you've just been told so the first thing i thought was if we give them
04:03enough
04:04screens they won't think about which screen we're on because the world is all about screens now
04:12everybody's on a screen you see people walking down the street having you know facetime conversations
04:17on a screen and everybody is sort of valerie now everybody's tweaking their image in their uh
04:24instagram stories and like not that take you see whenever i see somebody crying on the instagram
04:28story i think what take was that
04:32you know it's not the first take right that's all everybody's created a could they're like making
04:38themselves a collection of energies which is what valerie was doing like look at me this is who i am
04:44so if i had many cameras and i wanted to incorporate real life which is what we call the traditional
04:51cameras trad cam um and then the doc cam which felt like familiar and then we had a multi-cam
05:00because
05:00she's cast on a sitcom so we had four multi-cam operators we had two traditional cameras two doc cams
05:09and then ella stiller who plays patience her social media uh person was actually filming with an iphone
05:17that we use the footage of so she became actress non-dga member cameraman i mean she she actually i
05:28i said
05:28to her ella you're the only one covering this and she's like what and we actually ellie smokin who is
05:34our dp created this device because you know whenever you see uh iphone coverage in a show it has the
05:43two black bars next to it and i thought but that means it's already playing somewhere how can we make
05:50it feel like it's happening right now so ellie created this brace that she held that held the camera
05:58that you could still see her hands but the aspect ratio was wider so you could see the blurry thing
06:04the focus thing the other side blurry so at one point the chrissy and the camera tech came up to
06:11me
06:11and said 20 20 cameras so far 20 cameras and the the fun of it was that everybody was acting
06:19all the time
06:20because it was those doc cameras were uh mark and carissa who are uh operators were really like in
06:29a dance they their job was to get valerie but then spill over and get reactions from people and come
06:35back so come back come back again to her so everybody was excited because in these the bit one of
06:43the
06:43scenes you're going to see is like everybody filming the multi-cam and everybody i told everybody you
06:49could be in this at any moment so none of the actors were bored you know you have to stay
06:56in
06:56there for hours suddenly they were acting and the fun was to go over to them and say see that
07:01woman over
07:01there that's your manager you're upset go and then it all became a game but it was really about
07:08creating and then the other type of camera we used was security cameras in houses because every rich
07:15person's house i go into you go past the laundry room and it's like nine cameras shooting nothing
07:19i go that's my favorite show your garage that's my new favorite show and i thought that's part of
07:28we're all being observed all the time so we introduced those two so that it also reflected the first season
07:35when we had a camera on the ceiling which was for the reality show but now you're seeing valerie and
07:41her husband mark in their condo like a maze and it kind of little interactive because you're hearing
07:48them and you have to figure out which room they're in so it was a blast as a director it's
07:53a blast but
07:54also i imagine a challenge too so when you're looking when you're directing that many people on set and
07:59that many cameras i mean first of all it's such a joy to watch lisa play to all of those
08:04and so i want
08:04to ask you what it's like to direct her but what is it like for you and what's what's the
08:07challenge for
08:08you and directing that many people across that many cameras um the challenge and the gift is to trust
08:14trust that everybody that's doing a camera work is great and getting you something because there's no
08:21way we had like eight monitors but you can't see everything and then when you get in the editing room
08:28you're like wow look at what everybody did so you can't micromanage you can design
08:37a marching plan for everybody to be in the moment and you know even the multi-cam operators knew what
08:44they were doing because they were filming a sitcom within a sitcom so trust trust that you hire the
08:49right people and that everybody is doing their best and everybody when you tell them it's up to them
08:57they show up it's a really thrilling thing and you feel like you're you're in a
09:04a troupe rather than sitting in your chair barking at people because there's no way you could cover all
09:10that oh we can clap for that that's the best part of it right yeah and let's show up and
09:15work with
09:16other people is the best part of it i can't imagine another performer nailing that rip line just
09:22everything lisa does in that oh lisa yeah lisa and you know the joy of seeing her in a writing
09:28room
09:28writing it and then forgetting that she wrote it completely and just be in the moment and there's
09:35a scene coming up that we're going to show last which is like every member of the show is it
09:40and
09:40and valerie's talking all the time and lisa would do nine pages one day one time and she's finally
09:46forgot where she was and she said how can i still be the only one talking like shouldn't other people
09:51be
09:51talking she had a lot to do but it was a joy she had a lot to do what what
09:55is it like to direct her
09:56like in that scene i mean obviously you guys have such a chemistry writing together creating together
10:01over two decades what what's what is what was it like to direct her this season and in a scene
10:06like
10:06that if you want to break it down for her did you give her notes does she just nail it
10:09on the first
10:10take how does that work lisa doesn't repeat she's like i think the curse for her is being in the
10:19moment not being in the moment she's in the moment so i sort of just watch her and when something
10:25isn't
10:26working i usually do something to get her in the moment like i'll have an extra bump into her
10:33or something that brings her right to the moment but she's a joy to watch because it's believable
10:39and yet broadly comic it's a really interesting there's really little to say we she knows what
10:47we wrote but she will also say i think it's moving too slow and am i too slow and i
10:54say i don't think
10:55so i think you're doing great it's just very collaborative and really fun but it's fun to
10:58work with all the actors too i think that's one of the things the comeback does so well in that
11:03scene
11:03the fluidity of the direction um of moving seamlessly from the iphone conversation to the
11:09mirror to you know to her exit but also the fluidity of the emotions going from just hysterically
11:15funny to really emotional we don't see valerie like that very often can you talk about directing
11:20that scene um valerie doesn't get like that very often because she's always aware of the camera so
11:24from the directing point of view how am i going to catch that when the character would clearly turn
11:29her back so of course the trick of the mirror and that just little tiny sliver of a crack of
11:37her
11:38in her voice and so that's technical but also emotional and the other thing that's really
11:45interesting and technical about that scene is that is not a burn-in that was actually the phone call
11:50was actually happening the actress was in the parking lot outside the storage unit that's in real time
11:56lisa's playing with it you know you used to be able to she'd have to have somebody on the stage
12:00reading the lines but that was an actual we're filming it because of technology now and where we
12:06are you can actually have that performance affect both of them and and then the final thing is just
12:14the choice of the camera person after she said human remains just knowing that that was a gross
12:21funny thing and just that little push-in and it only happens once because we're not trying to
12:28it's not freeze-dried so when you're in the editing room you're like where's the thing where i saw that
12:33she pushed in but it's a it's a it's a testament to uh everybody but lisa in particularly that she
12:41can
12:42expose and then hide her stuff and i think what's great about when we get a chance to do it
12:48people are laughing one minute at mount olympus that's far and then in the next second something
12:56sneaks up on them about somebody dying during covid and it taps into whatever feelings we all had when
13:03somebody died and they couldn't be with them specifically during covid did you cry in real
13:09life for mike robert michael morris yeah that the character they're talking about mickey was my college
13:15theater teacher professor he wasn't even he had retired and we brought him out of retirement to
13:21play this part of this hairdresser and i said the good news is lisa and i've written you apart the
13:26bad
13:26news is you have to audition for you so he went to hbo and auditioned and he was wonderful and
13:31when he
13:31died we knew he was in the last season the second season we knew he was sick he had stage
13:36four cancer
13:37but we thought we could do it and hbo knew that he was sick and they couldn't insure him and
13:43they said
13:43what do you think and i said i think he'll make it and they said okay and then he got
13:48better and
13:49better and better and better like the more he was in service and feeling energy and strength he became
13:56less and less sick and the doctors were saying what are you doing the tumors aren't growing what are you
14:00doing and he was just being happy and then when he died everybody was really sad and one of the
14:08things that i remember is entertainment weekly said television star michael robert michael moore is dead
14:14at 77 and i thought it would almost be worth him leaving if he heard him described as a television
14:22star
14:23he would almost take that uh but i i always felt it was a great uh chapter and so it's
14:30sad that he died
14:32but it's thrilling that he's still here and that this episode is somehow still plucking
14:37his energy and heartstrings and people are really responding to that um let's keep the emotions
14:44going to the opposite end of the spectrum to josh's tantrum played by the great john early who
14:49stomps his feet in this scene because he's upset over some wardrobe choices yeah i mean one of the
14:53great things about writing characters about show business there are so many types to pull from
14:57and uh john early plays the over emotional very protective writer sitcom writer i know a couple
15:07and abby jacobson plays the very detached detached showrunner who is really just worrying about her
15:14kids and in this scene you'll see everything we were talking about you'll see pieces of the multi-cam
15:19you'll see the camera crew the different coverage but the plot is the actress that's coming in
15:25is supposed to be wearing a t-shirt that says my anish you two stories uh about that
15:32unless you're shooting the sitcom if unless i'm showing the sitcom on the monitor that shows the
15:37sitcom people don't know what they're looking at as soon as you see it framed as a sitcom all the
15:42jokes feel like oh they're not great sitcom jokes but if you show it in the regular thing it's like
15:48this show stinks so that was a trick i learned that you have to show the show in context and
15:53the jimmy burroughs story when when uh john early started doing all that i went up to jimmy and i
15:58said
15:58what would you do if this was really happening he said i want to stop do it and i said
16:05well why aren't
16:06you what do you mean i said put a stop to it he goes when i said whenever you feel
16:12like it and because
16:14i had enough cameras i could catch jimmy coming in and doing his thing which was just let's get off
16:20the stage and it was fun for him because i was saying it's up to you when you come in
16:25and that's the
16:26most fun when you can actually have a playground with people who have done it and i've worked with
16:33jimmy for so many years but when i said go in when you feel it he actually got fear in
16:37his eyes for the
16:38first time like oh i'm not an actor i can't go in when i feel something but he was great
16:42um that's our
16:44time but i can't let you go without without acknowledging um that this coming a week from
16:49tomorrow is the series finale episode um and i know from talking to you about it that it was
16:56quite a moment for both you and lisa but can you tease the audience a little bit about what they're
17:00going to see next sunday um this is the end of the series i know people say oh you'll say
17:05that and
17:06people will like it and you'll come back no because it after getting canceled it became our brand that we
17:12come back every 10 years but we feel like there's something about the three that ends it so what
17:19you're going to see is the end of this 21-year journey for this character valerie cherish who's
17:26been desperate for the spotlight and what happens when she gets it and it's uh it's got a couple of
17:32very big guest stars and uh lisa's phenomenal i think so thank you very much for the time i really
17:40appreciate being here
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