La puntata parte dal giallo di #Garlasco. In studio l'avvocato di Marco Poggi, che ha presentato denunce nei confronti di chi istiga l'odio e la violenza contro la famiglia Poggi. La famiglia Poggi viene insultata sui social come se fosse in qualche modo "complice" di quanto avvenuto. E poi, le indiscrezioni sulla consulenza di Cristina Cattaneo che parlerebbe di uno strenuo tentativo di Chiara Poggi di difendersi smentendo le consulenze precedenti: il Dna sotto le unghie della ragazza sarebbe quindi quello del suo aggressore? E ancora, il caso di Liliana #Resinovich: il fratello Sergio aveva chiesto di poter riavere i suoi resti per poterle dare finalmente sepoltura. Il nulla osta è arrivato, ma nonostante la nuova legge, ha dovuto cercare un accordo con il marito. In studio il figlio di #CarmelaCerillo, uccisa dal marito: grazie a lui è stata in questi giorni approvata la nuova legge in materia di disposizione delle spoglie mortali delle vittime di omicidio.
#Chilhavisto #Chilhavintage
#Chilhavisto #Chilhavintage
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TVTrascrizione
00:05There are some divisive cases and that's for sure, before going on air, so in the afternoon
00:11As you know, I look at all the emails and messages you send us. There's a viewer.
00:17very kind and very courteous but he wrote look I always saw who wrote it
00:23I saw, it's an important service program but I decided not to watch it this evening
00:30because he said I don't want to see it, we don't know if our viewer is listening
00:35because he must have read in the press release, good evening, comrade lawyer, that we had invited
00:41in the studio the lawyer companion, so this viewer of ours said I this evening
00:46but whoever saw it I won't see it and the lawyer companion and the lawyer of Marco Poggi in some way
00:52way this evening represents the family, it's a bit like saying that the Poggis don't have
00:58more right to speak, that's how I took it, it was a very polite email but it was an email
01:04even tough, he says I won't see you anymore and then before going with the lawyer companion
01:11which I thank because it is a very delicate subject, they have decided to put forward some
01:16complaints, complaints, before going to understand what is happening in this
01:22path, in this parallel line that somehow has something to do with it or not, however
01:27with the investigations underway, I would see with Vittorio Romano the news, what I am Cristiana
01:32Mangani, the news which are then the previews on the report that the anatomist has filed
01:38pathologist Cristina Cattani, a very important report of course because this has been said
01:44report can review the Garlasco case and of course as always we say if there is a
01:50innocent in prison, the injustice must be remedied immediately, let's see the report
02:03it was one of the few fixed points in the dynamics of the crime, Chiara Poggi did not defend herself
02:09it is written in the final sentence and did not react at all to further confirmation of the relationship
02:14of extreme confidence and intimacy with the visitor, that it was not a theft, a robbery
02:20It was clear from the start that it ended badly, for the judges Chiara opened up to the only man
02:25to whom she would have shown up in shorts Alberto Stasi, her boyfriend
02:31she trusted blindly and shortly after she would be hit on the head
02:40It was 2015, and the prison doors opened for Stasi.
02:44It is a punishment that is neither in heaven nor on earth, as the Attorney General said, if someone has
02:48someone who did something like that must have some gastro
02:50Andrea Sierpio wasn't even an extra in the background
02:53Andrea, do you want to tell us something?
02:55Siren?
02:56Siren?
02:57Siren?
02:58A few days ago, Dr. Cristina Cattaneo submitted a report that outlines an opposite scenario.
03:04at least according to the first rumours reported by Tg1
03:08Chiara would have fought for a long time with her murderer, she would have defended herself
03:12In support of this thesis, Cattaneo highlights the bruises, ecchimus and abrasions on the victim's arms and legs.
03:22Mind you, they didn't just pop up out of nowhere after 19 years.
03:26The coroner who performed the autopsy in 2007 had already photographed those bruises
03:31but he had interpreted them differently
03:33It could be an expression, writes Ballardini, of a fall during an escape attempt
03:38or impact on the floor surface while dragging
03:42or even slipping down the stairwell
03:45The damaging picture, we read in the conclusions, seems to indicate poorly effective or absent attempts at defense
03:54Today those same signs would take on another meaning
03:58according to the pathologist appointed by the Pavia prosecutor's office
04:01A desperate fight for life
04:03And under Chiara's nails, therefore, the reasoning of the investigators
04:07there can only be the DNA of her attacker
04:10And this DNA is compatible with that of Andrea Sempio
04:13other than contamination
04:16If they find traces of me around, I wouldn't be surprised.
04:20because I frequented the house and for better or worse I was everywhere in there
04:23so it's another thing that wouldn't surprise me
04:27And Alberto Stasi?
04:29In this scenario, according to leaked information, it would be completely extraneous to those investigating
04:35victim of a gross miscarriage of justice
04:38of a traffic jam of expert reports elevated to sacred texts and one-way investigations
04:42Let's proceed in order.
04:46The DNA on Chiara's nails was so small that it was not detected in 2007.
04:51then extracted in 2014 through amplification and deemed unusable
04:56It was analyzed again in 2025 by Dr. Albani
05:00and his conclusions were crystallized in the evidentiary incident
05:04these are mixed haplotypes that have not undergone consolidation
05:08and therefore subject to artificial risks
05:11It makes the comparison, that is, the use of those findings for the purpose of identifying
05:17at least the parental line of whoever may have left that DNA
05:24makes the result legally unusable
05:27And that DNA is mixed, that is, overlapped with other genetic traces.
05:32it is the demonstration, as the defenders of example repeat
05:35that it is a matter of contamination of an object touched by more than one person
05:39inside the house, like the TV remote control that was left on that morning
05:43or is there an accomplice at the crime scene who remained in the shadows
05:46who is unknown 2?
05:50Let's get to the other rumors
05:52Chiara died about half an hour after having breakfast
05:56but we don't know when he ate the cereal in front of the TV
06:04The only certainty about the time is that at 9.12 he deactivated the house alarm
06:12The murderer, or rather the perpetrator, another indiscretion, yet to be confirmed
06:16it would be just one
06:17and at least on this there are no differences with the final sentence
06:21On the other hand, the footprints in the blood are from only one pair of shoes.
06:25Lefrau Appallini size 42
06:27certain fact from the first degree of judgment
06:30there is no evidence of the presence of at least two attackers
06:34Judge Vitelli wrote in 2009
06:37The fixed points end here
06:40only open questions remain
06:42because I have always investigated in conjunction with Stasi and other unknown persons
06:45what if the tracks have always indicated the presence of only one person?
06:50Are the PMs perhaps hypothesizing a moral complicity?
06:53Did anyone else instigate, cover up, or decide on the murder that was then carried out by the suspect?
06:58And how can a murderer be an example if he wears size 44 shoes, not 42?
07:04Did he lie?
07:05Or as a Stasi defense consultancy suggests
07:08Could that Appallini footprint have also left a larger shoe?
07:14And the black bike?
07:15The one seen by the neighbor in Bermani at 9.10 on August 13th
07:19Sempio has never owned a black bike, let alone a woman's bike.
07:22Not to mention the motive
07:24the relationship between Chiara Poggi and Sempio was almost non-existent
07:28According to the final ruling
07:30the victim would not have welcomed a stranger wearing those pajamas
07:33much less an acquaintance like the brother's friend
07:36but also on this front the prosecution has hypothesized other scenarios
07:39the motive, according to the investigators, would be hidden in Chiara's PC
07:43that computer that his brother and his group also played on
07:46On the desktop, in the albert.zip folder
07:49intimate videos shot by the couple were saved
07:52To Checco's IT consultant
07:54it was asked to scan that computer for the motive
07:57and the minutes of appointment at least one page is covered by omissions
08:10Lawyer Campagna, you have decided to be here not to talk
08:13let's say investigations but for a fact that runs parallel
08:17that is what is happening to the Poggis
08:19I have to say, I was impressed when I spoke to her.
08:22when he once told me
08:23The Poggis are afraid that they will go and demonstrate under their house
08:26at this point are they?
08:28Well, a toxic climate has been created
08:31let's say there is a world
08:32which concerns the conduct of the investigation
08:35what will be the conclusions
08:37let's wait calmly, in short, and we will evaluate
08:39you are rightly looking for previews
08:41We as lawyers have to stick to what we read
08:44and we will evaluate
08:45then there is this parallel world
08:47which was born first and foremost on the web
08:48with insinuations, accusations
08:50in short, free information is confused
08:53and the interpretation with the formulation of absurd hypotheses
08:57and then it all ends somehow
08:59to bounce on some television broadcasts
09:02and there's a sort of parallel world
09:05where news is the existence of news
09:08which are often fake news
09:10in short, for us the most incredible thing
09:12is that it is said
09:13it's not true that Marco Poggi was in the mountains
09:15well, really
09:16I don't know if viewers realize
09:19What level of madness have we reached?
09:20because that means
09:21that you had to take out the photographs, right?
09:25that is, it is assumed that this family
09:27let's say he hid the truth
09:29on the dynamics of a daughter's murder
09:30that is, that Marco Poggi's parents
09:31they hid Marco Poggi's guilt
09:35and they took out the photos
09:37after that nothing is enough
09:38one shows the photos
09:39and they say the photos are not posted
09:40it's a photomontage
09:41then the photos are recovered
09:42taken by other people who were there
09:44even those aren't enough
09:46they recover
09:46there is a person who was with them on vacation
09:49who said
09:49If you want I can give you more photos
09:51Giuseppe told me today
09:53but seeing these absurdities
09:55someone said
09:56but if they need them
09:57we saw each other
09:57we have some photos too
09:59in short, facts that are
10:00listen lawyer
10:01what I wanted to make clear
10:02to viewers
10:03that sometimes
10:05we are getting hounded
10:07in a sense
10:09and then against this person
10:10in this case
10:11for example Chiara Poggi's mother
10:13it has been criticized
10:15in the first month
10:16because she had said
10:17who believed in Alberto Stasi
10:19he believed him innocent
10:21gave him all the support he could
10:23all solidarity
10:25so absurdly
10:27it has been criticized
10:28at the time
10:29when Chiara died
10:30because she was with Alberto Stasi
10:32and is criticized today
10:33instead because he believes
10:34to what was then
10:35the ruling of the Italian justice system
10:38and then I wanted to make you feel
10:40this phone call
10:41I had proposed a part of it to you
10:42we are a month away
10:45since the death of Chiara Poggi
10:47and it's getting organized
10:48they organized a mass
10:49to the shells
10:50and there's the phone call
10:51between the two mothers
10:52Chiara's mother
10:54and Alberto Stasi's mother
10:56because Alberto Stasi's mother
10:57he doesn't know what they have to do
10:59there is this mass
10:59they have to go
11:00what they have to do
11:03let's hear it
11:04listen Bessi
11:05I'll tell you
11:06this morning he came there again
11:08and it makes me feel like
11:09it makes me
11:11look, this evening
11:12there will be journalists
11:13it makes me
11:16because the voice
11:17it has spread
11:17there will be journalists
11:19so we have
11:19few
11:21Enough
11:22Indeed
11:23it makes me
11:23I'll let it pass
11:27by
11:28it makes me
11:28because if not
11:29it will be crowded
11:31I'll tell you
11:33Meaning what
11:33I wanted to save Alberto
11:36I wanted to avoid them
11:37the journalists
11:38oh I know
11:39you understand me
11:42you are the mother
11:44by Alberto
11:44I am the mother
11:45by Chiara
11:48Here you are
11:48and I would like
11:49avoid journalists
11:51to the boy
11:52You are right
11:54it makes an impression
11:56let's hear this mom
11:56who is crying
11:57Chiara's mother
11:58what does he say?
11:59I want to avoid him
12:00the journalists
12:01and he's crying
12:02precisely in favor
12:03by Alberto
12:03then at a certain point
12:04All
12:06change
12:07No
12:07and what does it mean
12:09that now they
12:10they don't want it anymore
12:11the truth
12:12that they are
12:14let's say
12:14at the time
12:15what changed
12:16a little bit of perception
12:17it was the discovery
12:18of DNA
12:18on the pedals
12:19let's say
12:19That
12:20in a situation
12:21in which these parents
12:22they didn't want to believe
12:23that the boyfriend
12:24that they had welcomed
12:24in your own home
12:25could be responsible
12:27but
12:28he sees
12:28Federica
12:29what
12:30the spectators
12:31they don't know
12:32is that the number
12:33of appraisals
12:33of investigations
12:34that have been made
12:35over the years
12:36they are very vast
12:37these parents
12:38they followed
12:39like anyone else
12:39can imagine
12:40all these vicissitudes
12:41piece by piece
12:42they analyzed them
12:43verified
12:44and so on
12:45instead the world
12:46of the media
12:47it's anxiety
12:48of a novelty
12:48that you explain
12:49and gates
12:50and gates
12:51All
12:51I'll give you an example
12:53how many people
12:55on the scene
12:55of the crime
12:56we heard
12:57more people
12:58maybe so
12:58you can play
12:59with the hypotheses
13:00etc.
13:00we who knew
13:01a bit
13:02what had emerged
13:02from previous investigations
13:04we know it's there
13:04a single walk
13:06of a single shoe
13:07so everything
13:07he was always brought
13:08then we hear
13:09that this would be
13:10confirmed status
13:11from Cattaneo
13:13from the RIS of Cagliari
13:14Meaning what
13:15it's difficult
13:16get an idea
13:17of the truth
13:18if they don't put themselves
13:19all the pieces together
13:20instead this is a game
13:21in which someone
13:22he thinks he's found it
13:23a new stain
13:24a new element
13:25and to be able to rewrite
13:26I wouldn't want to
13:27to return
13:28in the investigations
13:29why now
13:29then they found
13:30DNA
13:30of Sempio
13:31so why is there
13:32DNA
13:32of Sempio
13:33what is he doing?
13:34there the DNA
13:35and therefore the possibility
13:36precisely that it was
13:37made a mistake
13:39judicial
13:39but what I wanted
13:40to make it clear
13:40is that there are
13:41the parents
13:42who are victims
13:43the victims
13:44secondary
13:45so the mother
13:46by Chiara
13:48is attacked
13:49because he gives his
13:50solidarity
13:51to Alberto
13:51today is attacked
13:53on the contrary
13:54why doesn't he say
13:56take it away
13:57from prison
13:58you did
13:58a mistake
13:59judicial
14:00but then
14:01at that mass
14:02what does Alberto do?
14:04he goes there or he doesn't go there
14:05there is a new call
14:06of Alberto's mother
14:07to Chiara's mother
14:11Here you are
14:12I
14:15I don't know what to say
14:16that day
14:18that I came
14:18from you
14:19the next day
14:20I felt
14:21a
14:23I do not know
14:24as it seemed
14:25who knows what
14:26I had done
14:27yes yes yes
14:32then that day
14:33that I came
14:34from you
14:34I felt
14:36who knows how
14:37What
14:37I had done
14:38Therefore
14:39then he won't go there
14:41Alberto
14:41in that
14:43religious function
14:45Why
14:45he says better not
14:47why it is exposed
14:48then journalists
14:49first note
14:50who went there
14:52to photograph it
14:52etc.
14:53then everything changes
14:54it turns upside down
14:55the situation
14:56and the mother
14:57now of Stasi
14:59who was convinced
14:59of Italian justice
15:00and then followed
15:01the process
15:02is attacked
15:04again
15:04At that time
15:06you have presented
15:08of the complaints
15:08to various prosecutors
15:10No
15:10what are they
15:11can you explain to us
15:12these exposed
15:14complaints
15:14quarrels
15:14what are they
15:15lawyers
15:15me in particular
15:17I assist Marco
15:18we have read about it
15:19of all colors
15:20Marco in a house
15:21recovery
15:22he is a drug addict
15:24I had
15:25child pornography files
15:26all lies
15:27It is not true
15:28that it was
15:28in the mountains
15:29In short
15:30of absurdities
15:31that are going to hit
15:32precisely
15:32as she pointed out
15:34the victim's brother
15:35that is, people
15:36already severely tested
15:37And
15:39then he will evaluate
15:41the judicial authority
15:42where there is defamation
15:43where there is no defamation
15:44we want to see
15:44with Marina Borrometi
15:45What
15:46it was written
15:47and what
15:48was
15:49said
15:56the hills
15:56they won't find
15:57a hole
15:57deep enough
15:59to hide
15:59for the rest
16:00of their miserable life
16:01maybe in the family
16:02it was accepted
16:03a purifying sacrifice
16:04compared to Chiara
16:05this is a thought
16:07that really
16:07it worries me
16:08you guys are shameful
16:09in front of all of Italy
16:11justice for Chiara
16:12daughter and sister
16:13of all of us
16:13Italian people
16:1519 years have passed
16:17the family rests
16:18Chiara is crying
16:19during the funeral
16:20in private
16:21but since then nothing
16:22it's more private
16:23the impression you get
16:25is that these family members
16:26by Chiara
16:27they are nobody's children
16:29that is, they are no longer of interest
16:30to no one
16:30they can be attacked
16:31and defamed
16:32as if nothing had happened
16:33the villa taken
16:35assault in 2007
16:36becomes the protagonist again
16:38and if at the time
16:39they didn't exist
16:40influencer
16:40or youtuber
16:41today instead
16:42the network does it
16:43as a mistress
16:43the most targeted
16:45he is brother Marco
16:46I'm starting
16:47to think
16:48that Marco Poggi
16:49have something
16:49that's not going well
16:50in the photos
16:51it seems to me
16:51too strange
16:52absent
16:53worried
16:53unfortunately atrocious
16:55but I think
16:55that he is involved
16:56in my opinion
16:57Marco Poggi
16:58was inside
16:59of a punitive expedition
17:00and was present
17:01to the murder of his sister
17:02I can't believe it anymore
17:04that the Poggis
17:04they are not in bad faith
17:06to save what can be saved
17:07that is to say
17:08Marco Poggi
17:09they are the comments
17:11online
17:11fueled by opinion makers
17:13or as they say today
17:14influencer
17:15that they have carved out
17:16their audience
17:17on social media
17:18even attacking the Poggi
17:19obvious consequence
17:22visible to all
17:23it's the aggression
17:24media
17:25towards
17:25of his closest
17:26relatives
17:27as well as
17:28somehow
17:28even of memory
17:29by Chiara
17:30there was a problem
17:30of diffusion
17:31some photos
17:32of the autopsy
17:33In short
17:33levels of unscrupulousness
17:34very strong
17:35even in comparisons
17:37of memory
17:39of the victim
17:40and of course
17:41this is also a reason
17:42In short
17:42of further
17:44pain
17:44Well yes
17:46the photos too
17:47of Chiara's death
17:48put up for sale
17:49a trade
17:50blocked immediately
17:51our daughter
17:52he didn't deserve it
17:53Truly
17:53all this mud
17:55Truly
17:55he didn't deserve it
17:56let's continue
17:57Marco Poggi
17:58it doesn't show itself
17:59to the cameras
18:00and then
18:01Marco Poggi
18:02he disappeared
18:02I know which clinic
18:04is found
18:04even if I can't
18:05say it for privacy reasons
18:06or maybe he went out
18:07recently
18:07but I think
18:08that is under guardianship
18:10in the sense that Marco
18:10maybe perhaps
18:11he knew something
18:12what does the ticket say
18:14who found
18:14Mrs. Preda
18:15he says
18:16to kill
18:16Marco was
18:17I think
18:18that the lady
18:19a little thought
18:20he did it
18:21and the network
18:22but online
18:23you can say everything
18:24the opposite of everything
18:25without limits
18:26who is watching with me
18:28Marco Poggi
18:28weekly
18:30must draft
18:31exposed
18:32complaints
18:32etc.
18:33we involved
18:34the guarantor
18:35of privacy
18:35we involved
18:36the Pavia prosecutor's office
18:38and the Attorney General's Office
18:40of Milan
18:41even the lawyer companion
18:43he ended up in the middle
18:44to this meat grinder
18:45just because he assists
18:46Marco Poggi
18:47what is it for?
18:49the lawyer
18:49to Marco Poggi
18:50is he under investigation?
18:51No
18:51is he suspected?
18:53No
18:53we don't know
18:54not even where it is
18:55nobody is looking for it
18:56what do you do with it?
18:57of the lawyer?
18:58let's say
18:59alright
18:59not everyone can
19:00know
19:01procedural dynamics
19:02we are here
19:03constituted
19:04civil party
19:04at the time
19:05but let's continue
19:07to read
19:07other posts
19:08Marco Poggi
19:09there is no
19:10he doesn't speak
19:11does not appear
19:12he doesn't answer
19:13he disappeared
19:14literally
19:15his lawyer
19:16it appears very little
19:17on television
19:18and when it appears
19:19no one asks him
19:20that question
19:21the question
19:22that any journalist
19:23to which it is granted
19:24should do
19:25the question
19:26that all Italians
19:27they are done
19:28where is Marco?
19:29how are you?
19:30for many years
19:31for many years
19:33is involved
19:35in a large
19:36medial process
19:37initially
19:37was involved
19:38exclusively as a victim
19:40and anyway
19:40this has weight
19:41Why
19:41live in a house
19:42where journalists
19:43every morning
19:44they pass by there
19:45In short
19:46it's not something
19:46recently
19:47right now
19:48is involved
19:49also as
19:50alleged executioner
19:51or how
19:52free target
19:53that anyone
19:54can defame
19:55here is Marco
19:56is he in a clinic?
19:58Marco is not in a clinic
20:00he's a normal guy
20:01working
20:02which follows
20:04and law
20:05like all newspapers
20:06reads the procedural documents
20:07how he did it
20:08how he did it
20:09at the time
20:09No
20:10Marco is not
20:11in a clinic
20:12psychiatric
20:12his lawyer tells us
20:14just like Marco
20:15it wasn't
20:15in Garlasco
20:16the day of the murder
20:17of the sister
20:18we had to
20:19take out the photographs
20:20we had to
20:21because there are those who say online
20:22that even Marco
20:23be Chiara's murderer
20:24that is, his sister's
20:25but look
20:25it's not online
20:26I sometimes
20:27I'm looking for a moment
20:28of relaxation
20:29in the evening
20:30at a dinner
20:30or in an aperitif
20:31and they ask me if
20:33the lawyer is right
20:34we're talking about it
20:35in television containers
20:36online
20:37articles from weekly magazines
20:38but we're talking about it
20:39even at dinners
20:40the Garlasco case
20:41it has become an object
20:42for discussion
20:43and debate
20:44everywhere
20:44the hills
20:46they take out
20:46the photos
20:46of the holidays
20:47and there are those who compare them
20:49with other photos
20:50of the same place
20:51mountain
20:51taken by others
20:52and says
20:53those of the hills
20:54they are photomontages
20:56the director of people
20:58Umberto Brindani
20:59which has always been
21:00occupied Garlasco
21:01he writes
21:01they went down
21:02overbearingly
21:03on the field
21:04subjects
21:05that with the crime
21:06they have nothing
21:06what to do
21:07but they monopolize
21:08communication
21:09on the matter
21:10social media
21:10they have populated
21:12of ad hoc groups
21:12of real or presumed
21:14experts
21:14of naive enthusiasts
21:16of poisoners
21:17of wells
21:17by youtuber
21:18of influencers
21:19everyone feasting
21:20at the canteen
21:21from Garlasco
21:22these are very harsh words
21:23there are those who profit from it
21:25behind all this
21:26let's go back to the place
21:27by Brindani
21:28he writes
21:29how many people
21:30on the scene
21:31I really am
21:32interested in the truth
21:33about what happened
21:34August 13, 2007
21:35how many are able
21:37to reason
21:38with his own head
21:38or rather they act
21:40an assigned part
21:40them from others
21:41or by circumstances
21:42how many have gone up
21:44on the moving chariot
21:45this way or that way
21:45It does not matter
21:46just to participate
21:47at the banquet
21:48how many people earn from it
21:49hard cash
21:51there are many
21:53ongoing proceedings
21:54and whoever is responsible
21:55will evaluate the responsibilities
21:56because in some cases
21:58it's not about
21:59only
21:59of defamation
22:01but anyway
22:01there is an orchestrated action
22:03between multiple subjects
22:04that makes you think
22:05to associative dynamics
22:06In short
22:06a real one
22:07criminal association
22:08there is a new economy
22:10that travels on the web
22:11and that does yes
22:13that all these activities
22:14they allow earnings
22:15quite easy
22:16without in fact
22:18no obligation
22:20to respect
22:20rules
22:21ideological
22:22and so on
22:23in some cases
22:23also subjects
22:24that by moving abroad
22:26they remain in some way
22:27even protected
22:29if not to say
22:29immune
22:30from Italian jurisdiction
22:37In short
22:38listen lawyer
22:39as they say
22:40that no journalist
22:41he asked her the question
22:42where is Marco Poggi?
22:43and everyone is wondering
22:44all Italians
22:45if they ask themselves
22:45but I
22:46he made them to Marina Borromenti
22:47but why Marco Poggi
22:49he's not here
22:50Marco Poggi
22:51lives work in Veneto
22:53has chosen for many years
22:54so it's not
22:55in a psychiatric clinic
22:56to escape
22:56to communication
22:58and precisely because
22:59he withdraws
23:00there is an attitude
23:02towards him
23:04even more violent
23:06as if one had to take revenge
23:08of those who do not participate
23:09to this representation
23:12it's a personal choice
23:14I don't hide them
23:16that many times
23:17I also said
23:17but maybe we do
23:19once an interview
23:20etc.
23:20but there are some profiles
23:21of sensitivity to people
23:22I think they have to comply
23:23then everyone decides what they want
23:24listen though
23:24lawyer
23:27block with complaints
23:28with exposed
23:28with complaints
23:29what freedom is
23:31not in print
23:32of expression
23:33because some
23:34they are not journalists
23:35so let's not talk
23:36not even freedom
23:36of print
23:37how much expression
23:39it's not a thing
23:40unjust
23:40that is, there is someone
23:41what does he say?
23:42no for me Marco
23:42he is guilty
23:44morally if anything
23:45then I'll show it to you
23:46I will be investigated if he is investigated
23:48I'll tell you later
23:48I told you so
23:50I believe
23:51that your service
23:52explained well
23:53that there are interests
23:54cheap
23:55that is, it's not a speech
23:56of evaluation
23:57or of interpretation
23:58there are professionals
23:59of hatred
23:59of the representation
24:01of the absurd
24:02and we live
24:03in a strange world
24:04in which the theses
24:05more absurd
24:06they are the ones that sometimes
24:07they have greater visibility
24:08and so we struggle
24:09to find our way anymore
24:11we have to deal with it
24:12with this world
24:13But I Federica
24:13I wanted to send them
24:14even a message
24:15in some positive ways
24:16they write to me
24:17even weekly
24:18many people
24:19what they tell me
24:19lawyer
24:20but he read this
24:21but how is it possible
24:22it's incredible
24:22but do something
24:24me obviously
24:24for some aspects
24:26you feel helpless
24:27because the times
24:27of criminal justice
24:28but you have decided
24:28to trigger anyway
24:30we also feel
24:31having to do so
24:32compared to many people
24:33that tell us this
24:35that express solidarity
24:36that is, there is a healthy part
24:37of the web
24:38which sometimes ends
24:39to be hidden
24:40behind these tons
24:41of garbage
24:42but I believe
24:43it's also right to say it
24:44what impressed me was
24:46It's Brindani
24:46when he wrote
24:47everyone to Banca Entrara
24:48at the Garlasco canteen
24:50she says
24:51there is the economy
24:51there is a business
24:53behind
24:53in quotation marks
24:54the crime
24:55that is, they are episodes
24:56dramatic
24:57of a murdered girl
24:58Meaning what
24:59what she thinks
25:00it's that there are people who make money from it
25:02with
25:02Yes
25:03for the spectators
25:04sometimes it's the impression
25:05of a game
25:06as if it were a collective cluedo
25:07and it's also understandable
25:08because then the spectator
25:09he's listening to something
25:10maybe he doesn't know everything
25:11they are not all spectators
25:12experts
25:13or be careful
25:14for those on the other side
25:15there really is
25:15explicit speculation
25:17then I know
25:18that are coming
25:19why do they warn me
25:20many criticisms
25:21many criticisms
25:22for me
25:23not for the lawyer
25:24for me
25:25why I invited him
25:26but
25:26I want to tell you this
25:29there is the judicial route
25:31which is important
25:32I always repeat it
25:32if there is an innocent
25:34in prison
25:35it needs to be fixed immediately
25:36for us
25:37the greatest satisfaction
25:38when we had it done
25:39the review process
25:40for Asci
25:41for the case of Ilaria Alpi
25:42that was
25:43in jail
25:44by many
25:44many years
25:46but that the hills
25:47they have no right
25:48to speak
25:49this is not possible
25:51At that time
25:51if someone writes
25:53something
25:54the lawyer
25:55companion
25:56we can do it
25:56invite
25:57it's our right
25:58our duty
25:59to make him say
25:59theirs too
26:01And
26:03that's fine
26:04in the sense that
26:04among other things
26:05I am convinced
26:06that the criticisms
26:07they make you grow
26:08me when
26:08when I read them
26:09I'm not surprised
26:12they make me
26:13they make me think
26:14but this case
26:15it must make us think
26:16of what is happening
26:17happening
26:18around the case
26:20Garlasco
26:20And
26:22must
26:23we need to think
26:24because if then
26:25Really
26:25there are some deals
26:26really
26:27the lawyer spoke
26:27of an association
26:29No
26:30that is, of more people
26:31That
26:31who have decided
26:33to make this case
26:34also a business
26:36In short
26:36it all remains to be seen
26:38I do not believe
26:39that the lawyer
26:40wants
26:40repress no one
26:42or mortify
26:43freedom of form
26:44of expression
26:45but how can you say
26:46that Marco Poggi
26:47he's in a clinic
26:48psychiatric
26:49the lawyer
26:50can deny
26:51this news
26:52When
26:52and as he wishes
26:53in this program
26:55thank you lawyer
26:56thanks to her
26:56Until we meet again
26:57At that time
26:59there is news
27:00that we
27:01We see
27:02Truly
27:02with great
27:03contentment
27:04Why
27:05every week
27:06we are worried
27:07of not having
27:08our
27:08Connections
27:09war
27:09here with us
27:10Why
27:11the risk
27:12era
27:12let's see if it works
27:13to appear
27:14somewhere
27:15with his dad
27:16At that time
27:16Connections
27:17we all
27:18Hi Gian Paolo
27:20we Nessi
27:20every week
27:21let's say
27:22let's hope it appears
27:23because it means
27:23that didn't go well
27:24in prison
27:26At that time
27:27there was a hearing
27:28important
27:29what happened
27:30he retracted
27:31the one who accused you
27:32of adultery
27:34pushed
27:35from Tamer
27:36they would have
27:38In short
27:39retracted
27:40the testimony
27:42would have in short
27:43confessed
27:44and told the truth
27:44finally
27:45And
27:46my ex
27:47precisely
27:48before the judge
27:49he said
27:50one thing
27:50who left
27:51everyone's mouths open
27:52and arrived
27:53in front of him
27:54introducing himself
27:55as a matter of fact
27:55Jesus Christ
27:56in person
27:57saying that it was
27:58been sent
27:59from God Almighty
28:00king of the heavens
28:01of the earth
28:02with all his
28:03host of angels
28:04and the judges
28:06they remained
28:06visibly
28:07displaced
28:08from this exit
28:09and they suffered it
28:11Anyway
28:11truncated
28:12saying
28:13we don't care
28:14what needs to be said
28:14we need to discuss
28:15of the case
28:16but
28:17this thing
28:18he's had enough
28:18shocked
28:19Why
28:20resisted
28:21saying that
28:22he wanted to finish
28:23his presentation
28:24divine
28:24Meaning what
28:25but he
28:26even in front
28:27to the Egyptian judges
28:28he says he is
28:29Jesus
28:29because to us
28:30of those who saw it
28:30he sent us
28:31an email
28:32very long
28:32I look
28:33I read it all
28:34among other things
28:35then he said
28:35no I was wrong
28:36something
28:36they sent us back
28:37even the corrections
28:39I don't know if it can flow
28:40but
28:41aside from what he wishes us
28:42an earthquake
28:43and let's hope
28:44also no
28:45but
28:46I keep saying
28:47that he
28:48And
28:48Allah
28:49the Messiah
28:49and Jesus
28:50In short
28:51that he has to decide
28:52All
28:53In short
28:53it seems to me
28:54that they are things
28:55Enough
28:55delirious
28:57then leave
28:57your daughter
28:58in his hands
28:59In short
28:59it would really be
29:00worrying
29:01And
29:01listen to Nessi
29:03but
29:03but now
29:04the sentence
29:05there will be on April 28th
29:07that is, when will it be known?
29:08if finally
29:09it is no longer
29:10this nightmare
29:12on the head
29:13April 28th
29:14the sentence will be released
29:16but precisely
29:16as they told me
29:17the lawyers
29:18the fact that they have me
29:19returned
29:19my passport
29:20which usually
29:21it is delivered
29:22when you enter
29:22in court
29:23precisely because precisely
29:24if they were to condemn you
29:26they are holding him back
29:27the fact that they gave it to me
29:28returned
29:29they made me
29:29go back home
29:30it's a good sign
29:32precisely because
29:32precisely
29:33if they had had
29:34a doubt
29:35they would have held me back
29:36and of course
29:38we have to wait
29:39until the 28th
29:39before singing
29:40victory
29:41and anyway
29:42In short
29:43we're not done here
29:44he started
29:46as always
29:47to send
29:47of threats
29:49but seeing him like this
29:51it was very disturbing
29:52because it makes us understand
29:53how much this subject
29:54it's dangerous
29:55and how much it can
29:56commit
29:57maybe some documents
29:58irreparable
29:59In short
29:59without warning
30:02Here you are
30:03the bomb
30:05but he still wants
30:06the compensation money
30:08it is not known what
30:09from the Italian State
30:11Yes
30:12Yes
30:12continues
30:13he is really convinced
30:14of this thing
30:15he is convinced that he will take
30:16189 million euros
30:18from the Italian State
30:19and has already divided
30:21in all people
30:23that will help him
30:24that anyway
30:26they will talk
30:26they will confess
30:27they will say that he
30:28he announced the earthquakes
30:30In short
30:31who moved
30:32an asteroid
30:34what does your father say
30:37which he had announced
30:39that it was him
30:40to make things change
30:42the route
30:43to an asteroid
30:45as a few months ago
30:47there had been an asteroid
30:48which hit
30:50a bit
30:51the scientists
30:51why suddenly
30:52he deviated
30:54slightly
30:55its trajectory
30:56and then
30:57he took
30:57the shovel on the leap
30:58saying it was him
30:59because they had given him
31:01even a power
31:02to deflect asteroids
31:05alright
31:05I also imagine
31:06Dezian judges
31:07but
31:07saying these things
31:09anyway they move away
31:10then the accusations against you
31:12because if it is said
31:13these
31:13these nonsense
31:15then in short
31:15that too
31:16which he accuses you of
31:17which among other things
31:17apart from the fact that it wouldn't be
31:19a crime
31:19here in Italy
31:20adultery
31:21why did you leave
31:22from Tamer
31:23for a long time
31:24but then it's not even true
31:25that is, the absurd thing
31:26is that there are people
31:28which then come
31:30invited
31:30threatened
31:31to go
31:32against
31:33Connections
31:34and that fortunately
31:35then in the end
31:35they tell the truth
31:37Connections
31:38At that time
31:38we always hope
31:39to see you here
31:40in this study
31:41with your dad
31:42because really
31:43how much has passed
31:44how long
31:45are you in Egypt?
31:47Oh me
31:48from 2021
31:49Therefore
31:50a long time
31:51at this point
31:51almost five years
31:52Oh mama
31:54it's been three years
31:55which in short
31:56it started
31:56all this
31:57this persecution
31:58in such a violent manner
32:00And
32:01I'm almost
32:02tired
32:03At that time
32:04I see that your dad
32:05among other things
32:06he left
32:06Liguria
32:07to be by your side
32:09In short
32:09they take turns
32:10And
32:11fortunately
32:12Then
32:12I have to say
32:13Also
32:13by
32:15of ours
32:16embassy
32:16there is help
32:17naturally
32:18for this woman
32:19which was due
32:19to self-seize
32:20because the problem
32:21is that Nessi
32:22he can't go out
32:22without his little girl
32:24his little girl
32:24there in Tamer
32:25naturally
32:26he doesn't leave her
32:27Connections
32:28I hope to see you
32:29here in Italy
32:30Soon
32:30eh
32:31Thank you
32:33Thank you
32:34HI
32:35HI
32:35HI
32:37At that time
32:39I thank you
32:39because I am
32:40remained
32:41until
32:41up to this time
32:42they failed
32:43to greet you
32:44Before
32:44between a case
32:45and the other
32:45Fabrizio
32:46and Fabrizio
32:47At that time
32:47Fabrizio
32:48the brother
32:49by Marafavro
32:49and Fabrizio
32:50Peace
32:51that for Penelo
32:52for President
32:53by Penelo
32:53and Piedmont
32:54has always had
32:54followed
32:55this case
32:55what should I say
32:56it takes a while
32:57of sadness
32:59Unfortunately
32:59it's not like that
33:00you know why Fabrizio
33:01because it seems to you
33:02at a certain point
33:02that the word arrives
33:05end
33:05it's called archiving
33:07but I imagine
33:08than for a brother
33:09but you too
33:10that by now
33:10you are
33:11Like this
33:12you threw yourself
33:13in this case
33:13forever
33:14it gets ugly
33:15this word
33:15archiving
33:16yes yes exactly
33:18but
33:19distinguishing is not so much
33:20archiving
33:20maybe exactly
33:21it's not that fine
33:21it's suicide
33:22the word archiving
33:23by suicide
33:24then she was brought
33:25from the institutional side
33:27towards this solution
33:28of suicide
33:29which no one
33:31of those who followed
33:33the vicenza
33:33even today
33:34he believes
33:35because there are too many things
33:37that don't carry
33:38to tenability
33:40of this
33:40of this
33:41solution
33:41which was
33:42Surely
33:43the simplest
33:43because anyway
33:45as we already had
33:46mentioned
33:49many investigations
33:50they were
33:51in-depth
33:52turning points
33:53more to search
33:55to justify
33:56that motivation
33:57that not to search
33:59Truly
33:59that is, it was followed
33:59that line
34:00that line
34:01it was perhaps
34:02one of the simplest
34:03because anyway
34:03he solved
34:04many problems
34:05many doubts
34:06some doubts
34:07that could come
34:08that had been
34:09Surely
34:10look for
34:10the reasons
34:11to justify
34:12that kind of solution
34:13it is definitely
34:14the simplest
34:15then I wanted you
34:16to show
34:16this photograph
34:17that we have seen
34:17that you gave us
34:18many times
34:19the one at night
34:20because our
34:20viewer
34:21whose name is Axel
34:22what should I say
34:23he starts studying
34:24all our cases
34:25and gave us
34:27a reading
34:27completely different
34:28to which
34:29we hadn't thought
34:30because he looked
34:31the dental arch
34:32of your sister
34:33and tells us
34:34which probably
34:35it might not be
34:36a selfie
34:37and explains to us
34:38Why
34:39so if it's not a selfie
34:40it means that a person
34:41he took that photo
34:43so it means
34:43that a person
34:44plus there was
34:45besides Mara
34:46and then I
34:47you will follow the service
34:48by Ivan Bacchia
34:49Maria Chiara
34:49Iacucci
34:50and then I'm back again
34:51from you
34:57reading the seven pages
34:59of archiving
35:00one almost gets the impression
35:01that the accent
35:02be placed
35:02on private life
35:03by Mara Favro
35:04Mara had
35:06mental fragility
35:07Mara had
35:08economic difficulties
35:10Mara had
35:11dubious acquaintances
35:13Mara had
35:14thoughts of death
35:17as they would testify
35:19these writings
35:20in which it is present
35:21even the date
35:21of his death
35:22the bitter conclusion
35:24of the GIP therefore
35:25is that Mara
35:25most likely
35:26she killed herself
35:27in fact he writes
35:29further investigations
35:30they would be completely
35:31exploratory
35:32and in any case
35:34unsuitable
35:35to bring out
35:36such elements
35:37to be able to reach
35:38to formulate
35:38a reasonable one
35:39prognosis of condemnation
35:43further investigations
35:44they had asked for them
35:45Mara's family
35:46found
35:47after a year
35:47from the disappearance
35:48in a precipice
35:494 km away
35:50from the pizzeria
35:51where he worked
35:54Vincenzo Luca Miglione
35:55and Cosimo Esposto
35:56so
35:57they emerge from the investigations
35:58their stories
36:00they were judged
36:01reliable
36:02and all the contradictions
36:03emerged
36:04as the GIP explains
36:04I'm alone
36:05slight dyscrasias
36:07that remain
36:08at the outcome
36:08of the articulated ones
36:09and complete investigations
36:11mere elements
36:12of suspicion
36:13about something
36:14of not perfectly lawful
36:16perhaps occurred
36:17between Mara
36:17and the former suspects
36:20contradictions therefore
36:21not traceable
36:22to a murder
36:23but for example
36:24it is assumed
36:25to a drug deal
36:26or to an adulterous relationship
36:28that's really why
36:29that both suspects
36:31they had the telephone
36:31turned off that night?
36:33and why Luke says
36:34that the carabinieri
36:35they went to wake him up
36:36around 3am
36:37for the usual check
36:38but this
36:39is it not in the records?
36:41other lies
36:42as highlighted
36:43from the investigation documents
36:44they were said
36:46instead to cover
36:47minor crimes
36:47actually accomplished
36:48by the suspects
36:49such as
36:50the fact that Cosimo
36:51drove a car
36:52he had denied it
36:53because it is devoid
36:54of the driving license
36:57it had been the prosecutor's office
36:58to ask
36:58the archiving
36:59compared to non-involvement
37:01of the suspects
37:02in the death of Marafavro
37:03supporting
37:04the suicide hypothesis
37:06I am the first
37:07who pays a lot of attention
37:09to this thing here
37:10I mean, I thought about it
37:11many times
37:12but to say
37:13that yes
37:14it's a suicide
37:15you must have
37:17many elements
37:18that move you
37:19this thing
37:20that is, that strengthen you
37:22this thesis
37:23that you don't have them
37:24but nobody has them
37:26Nobody
37:26he wrote
37:27they declared
37:29this thing
37:29that is, they said
37:30we have nothing else
37:32this turns out
37:33from the request
37:34of archiving
37:34we have nothing else
37:36so maybe
37:36the easiest thing
37:37is to say that
37:38you committed suicide with her
37:39so we close everything
37:40and we solved the problem
37:42also on the movements
37:43by Mara
37:44the night of the disappearance
37:45there are many things
37:46that don't come back
37:46analyzing precisely
37:47his movements
37:48and using the telephone
37:50according to the judge
37:51it was quite unlikely
37:53that Mara
37:53he found himself in company
37:55of third parties
37:58this means
37:59which he believes
37:59that she was
38:00alone
38:01in the heart of the night
38:02under the rain
38:03at zero degrees
38:04and in a parking lot
38:05in the middle of the woods
38:06between half past three
38:07and six in the morning
38:08because no other
38:09telephone user
38:10beyond that of Mara
38:11he was there
38:12where was she
38:14according to the tables
38:16Mara that night
38:16he used the phone
38:17continuously
38:18and in the same ways
38:19of the previous days
38:21that is, doing
38:21similar searches
38:22and always listening
38:23the same music
38:24because of this
38:25the jeep
38:26he thought
38:26that Mara
38:27she was alone
38:28that night
38:32it would actually exist
38:33the possibility
38:34that someone
38:34was he with her?
38:35Yes
38:36but only
38:37if he had before
38:38turned off the phone
38:39a clue
38:40in this direction
38:41It comes to us from Axel
38:42one of ours
38:43faithful viewer
38:44do you remember this photo?
38:47it has been forwarded
38:49to several people
38:50when Mara
38:50he was in that parking lot
38:51shortly after
38:525 in the morning
38:54Axel writes to us
38:55because he noticed
38:56an interesting detail
38:57that can help us
38:58to understand
38:59if that photo
39:00it's a selfie
39:01or if it was taken
39:02from someone
39:03and then
39:03if Mara was alone
39:05or if there was anyone
39:06with her
39:07the detail
39:08It is in all the photos
39:09in which Mara smiles
39:10it's about
39:11of the dental arch
39:12superior of Mara
39:13this detail
39:14go
39:14according to Axel
39:15viewed
39:16taking into account
39:17of another element
39:18very important
39:18of the photo
39:19that is the modality
39:20with which it was taken
39:22the photos taken
39:23like a selfie
39:24they are inverted photos
39:25why the camera
39:26smartphone front
39:27he snaps them as if it were
39:28a mirror
39:29reversing
39:29right and left
39:31this means
39:32that the dental arch
39:33superior of Mara
39:34in selfies
39:35it goes in one direction
39:36this
39:37while in normal shots
39:40like this one you see
39:41that is, carried out
39:42from another person
39:43the direction
39:44it's the opposite one
39:48let's add now
39:49Mara's photo
39:50taken that night
39:54let's see first
39:55the direction
39:55of the dental arch
39:56of the night photo
39:59let's compare it then
40:00with the others
40:04you see
40:05the direction
40:06it's identical
40:07to that one
40:08of the photos taken
40:09Therefore
40:09in conclusion
40:11according to Axel
40:12the mysterious photo
40:13it's not a selfie
40:14but someone
40:15he took the shot
40:16that photo
40:16and Mara
40:17that night
40:18it was not therefore
40:19alone
40:22it makes an impression
40:23this study
40:25what he did
40:25our Axel
40:26what do you think?
40:28you who are
40:28the consultant
40:29well yes
40:30Surely
40:30it is an element
40:31to add
40:32Therefore
40:33Surely
40:34we will take it
40:34under consideration
40:35to observe
40:36if there is the possibility
40:37to do
40:37a further
40:39piece of work
40:39on this
40:40but now
40:41what's happening
40:42it's closed
40:42definitely
40:43for suicides
40:44or you
40:44I will oppose you again
40:47we should
40:48have some elements
40:49you must have
40:50of the elements
40:51interesting
40:51one thing that is evident
40:53even a little bit
40:53from the documents
40:54that you have highlighted
40:56you
40:56is that
40:57it has been declared
40:58that was no longer necessary
41:00do further
41:01investigations
41:01because they had been made
41:02many investigations
41:03in-depth
41:03but towards the suspects
41:05that is here
41:06it didn't open
41:07a bit of the horizon
41:08it's clear
41:09this thing
41:10all these testimonies
41:11they make you understand
41:11that there could be
41:12someone together
41:13and she wasn't alone
41:14why didn't he say
41:15that it is Million
41:15or the pizzagliolo
41:17no one said
41:18unless
41:19we never said
41:20it's them by force
41:21Surely
41:22she wasn't alone
41:23but there are also
41:24many others
41:26hypothesis
41:27which could be followed
41:28instead they were not prosecuted
41:31Please
41:31I don't feel at all comfortable
41:32agree
41:33on the fact that
41:34were conducted
41:35meticulous investigations
41:36why the minuscules
41:36investigations
41:37were conducted
41:38towards Mara
41:40it has been explored
41:41to Mara's life
41:42but they were not done
41:43of the investigations
41:43of meaning
41:43they were not taken
41:44the cameras
41:45in front of the pizzeria
41:46in time
41:47they weren't even made
41:48the photos
41:49on the hypothetical scene
41:51before recovery
41:52of the remains
41:53that is, I am
41:53the chain of custody
41:54there is a whole series
41:55of aspects
41:55which are to be taken
41:57under consideration
41:57within an investigation
41:58of laughing
41:59forensic type
42:00that is this
42:01must not
42:02it's not CSI
42:03Meaning what
42:03it's field work
42:05so these aspects
42:07what there is to say
42:08which as he said
42:09Ivan Bacchi
42:10he placed himself very much
42:10attention
42:11about Mara Favro
42:12what he did
42:12what wasn't
42:13etc.
42:14and sometimes
42:14of the victims
42:15they then become
42:16their life
42:17is being scanned
42:19they become
42:20in quotation marks
42:20their butchers
42:21Why
42:22In short
42:22for what
42:23they did in life
42:24among other things
42:25it happened
42:25At that time
42:26he had so much
42:27an accident
42:27million
42:28then motorcycle
42:29so we wish him
42:30ready
42:30heals
42:31but it happened
42:32something
42:34In short
42:34which was then
42:35blocked
42:36stopped
42:36Why
42:36in all acts
42:37of the investigation
42:38there were some things
42:39truly very private
42:40but that
42:41they went there
42:42and a million
42:43he decided
42:44to put them on
42:45online
42:46it's a bit
42:46at everyone's mercy
42:47at everyone's mercy
42:48it also means
42:48at the merced
42:49of the daughter
42:50by Mara Favro
42:52that maybe
42:52In short
42:53these things
42:53shouldn't
42:54nor know them
42:55nor have to
42:55light
42:56let's hear it
42:57million
42:57what did he say
42:58online
43:00as you know
43:01you already know me
43:01I'm Luca
43:03the case
43:04Mara Favro
43:05the case
43:06which was
43:06archived
43:08I was
43:10from 6
43:11at 8 o'clock
43:12in the barracks
43:14Carabinieri
43:14they came
43:15two cars
43:15bourgeois
43:16plus a car
43:17of carabinieri
43:17they took me away
43:19they brought me
43:21in the barracks
43:21do you remember
43:22that file
43:23of 5,000 pages
43:24they gave it to me
43:25seized
43:26there is no problem
43:27there is another copy
43:27there is no type
43:29of problem
43:29let's make another copy
43:31and I'm coming back
43:32same as crown
43:34Boys
43:34if you don't see me
43:35more on social media
43:37it's because
43:37they blacked me out
43:38social media
43:38because when
43:40there is no truth
43:40it's uncomfortable
43:41it is the truth
43:42it hurts
43:42you understand
43:43the truth
43:44it hurts a lot
43:46these are
43:47the evidence
43:49minutes
43:50of search
43:51minutes
43:51of seizure
43:52minutes
43:53they just came out
43:54look guys
43:55they just came out
43:57what I want to tell you
43:59I want to tell you
44:00that with this
44:02I don't stop
44:05they only owe me
44:06kill
44:07to stop me
44:10At that time
44:11it's a page
44:13which in short
44:13to you
44:14it also shook you
44:15Therefore
44:17sometimes
44:18us
44:18we'll tell you
44:19these stories
44:20let's talk about these women
44:21then there are
44:22the suspects
44:23that become
44:24almost more protagonists
44:25of them
44:25Why
44:29Million
44:29In short
44:30he can speak
44:31Very well
44:32in front of the camera
44:33make videos
44:33among other things
44:35the same Million
44:35he had said
44:36go and investigate
44:37in other directions
44:38Why
44:40it wasn't
44:41everything was investigated
44:42because actually
44:42he had some acquaintances
44:44Marafavro
44:44which could have been
44:45of the acquaintances
44:47dangerous
44:48so it was necessary
44:49maybe think
44:49even to another person
44:51that it wasn't
44:51Luca Milione
44:52that it wasn't
44:52the employee
44:54not the employee
44:54the pizza chef
44:55In short
44:55the colleague
44:57of work
44:57in this pizzeria
44:59and then
44:59Ivan Bacchi
45:00he asked
45:01to Fabrizio
45:03not live
45:03but registered
45:04to talk to us
45:06of the sister
45:06that is, who was he?
45:07Marafavro
45:10Boys
45:10Good evening
45:11I'm Luca
45:12Luke Luke Luke
45:13here it is
45:13of file
45:14of the investigations
45:15by Marafavro
45:16now slowly slowly
45:17I will publish everything to you
45:19look how tall he is
45:20as much as my hand
45:22and I will make you
45:24to upset
45:25he had said it
45:26and he did it
45:27some excerpts
45:28of the file
45:29he published them
45:29on his social media
45:30for this reason
45:31the PM ordered
45:32the kidnapping
45:33of the computer
45:33and the telephone
45:34of Million
45:35and investigated it
45:36for having disclosed
45:37some acts
45:38of the file
45:38in which there was
45:39all the material
45:40of investigation
45:41collected by the prosecutor
45:42on the Marafavro case
45:43in the ordinance
45:44of archiving
45:45they were said
45:46many things
45:46about Mara
45:47but it is never mentioned
45:49the special relationship
45:50that he had with his daughter
45:51Mara
45:52she was also a mother
45:54Hi Massimiliano
45:55listen to me
45:56me on Saturday
45:57I've been working since three
45:58in the afternoon
45:58until closing
45:59so I can't
46:01to make the time
46:01from last week
46:02if that's okay with you
46:03see you at ten
46:05I'm coming to pick you up
46:05let's go to the pool
46:07I keep it with me
46:08for lunch
46:09and then I'll bring it back to you
46:10for half past two
46:11if you're okay with that
46:11OK
46:12just let me know something
46:14send me a message
46:14confirmation
46:15Thank you
46:16you are kind
46:17HI
46:17his is a crystalline voice
46:19educated
46:20and kind
46:21that of a mother
46:22thoughtful
46:23who agrees
46:24to see his daughter
46:25to pass the time
46:26with her
46:26Mara
46:27for the little girl
46:28he had given his soul
46:29that is, he gave her everything
46:30everything that the little girl
46:31he asked
46:32she depended a lot
46:33from the little girl
46:34so all that
46:35what he was doing
46:36it was now dedicated
46:38to the little girl
46:39Who was Mara?
46:41we asked ourselves
46:42many times
46:42listening to his voice
46:43and looking at his photos
46:45his big green eyes
46:46and his open smile
46:49what were his dreams
46:51and his hopes
46:52when she was just a girl
46:54Fabrizio tells us about them
46:55her older brother
46:57nine years old
46:58she is born
46:59October 11th
47:00of 72
47:01my parents were merchants
47:03so they worked a lot
47:04and at the beginning
47:06I lived it
47:07as I almost was
47:07the older brother
47:09in the sense that I almost did
47:10as a parent
47:11because then precisely
47:12my parents worked
47:13etc.
47:14so all the first years
47:15I followed it directly
47:17precisely from the point of view
47:18also practical
47:20growing up
47:20she has always been
47:22a studious girl
47:23has always had
47:24the desire
47:25the will
47:26of curiosity
47:27and to discover etc.
47:28he did all the studies
47:29of accounting
47:31Mara starts working early
47:33find a job as an employee
47:35in a company in Bologna
47:36so she has always been
47:37very autonomous
47:38but the big problem
47:39is that these office works
47:41they weren't for her
47:42she was a person
47:43who loved to stay in touch
47:45with people
47:46at this point
47:47Mara makes a choice
47:48different work
47:49from Bologna
47:50he moves
47:51in Milano Marittima
47:52that is, he started
47:53to work in bars
47:53he started working
47:54at the premises
47:56to attend
47:58Milano Marittima
47:58it's another environment
47:59Bologna type
48:00very dynamic
48:01where it was financed
48:02for a long time
48:03with a person
48:04who had a place
48:05run a business
48:07it's not that simple
48:08and banal
48:08his problems
48:10they started
48:10precisely in those years
48:11in Milano Marittima
48:12then the return home
48:14Mara returned to Piedmont
48:16start doing another job
48:17which puts her more in touch
48:19with people
48:19but without the responsibility
48:21of a business to manage
48:22she for several years
48:24he provided assistance
48:25to older people
48:27and it was very much appreciated
48:28because there was
48:29kindness
48:29the way of doing
48:30very calm
48:31patience
48:32in relating
48:33with people
48:34she was made like that
48:35that is, she liked it
48:37being with people
48:37and he was a person
48:38who never belittled you
48:40he took care of you etc.
48:41she was very careful
48:42about these things here
48:42he devoted himself a lot
48:43to all activities
48:44he always did them
48:46with a lot of effort
48:46and so on
48:47Mara turns 40
48:49and in Susa
48:49knows Massimiliano
48:50the future father
48:52of their little girl
48:53Idyll
48:54because precisely
48:54she came out of this story
48:55important in Milano Marittima
48:56and then
48:57they met
48:59with Massimiliano
48:59and everything was fine
49:01everything was fine
49:02and the problems
49:04they were born
49:04after the baby's ascites
49:05Mara through
49:07a very dark period
49:08he is not able
49:08to take care of
49:09not even of herself
49:10and struggles to recover
49:11so much so that it separates
49:13from the companion
49:14and the little girl
49:14stays with him
49:15it was a very long inter
49:17but
49:17all stages
49:18he had overcome them
49:19that is, he had had
49:20the meeting
49:20with all social workers
49:22by now he had
49:22a trust
49:23very continuous
49:25and then at the end
49:26the assistants
49:27they had understood
49:27that it was all reliable
49:29and she was left alone
49:30with the little girl
49:30so he took her home
49:32he did all the various activities
49:33after a few years
49:34Mara is better
49:35turned 50
49:37start working again
49:38Fabrizio finds out
49:40only after
49:40that among the various activities
49:41by Mara
49:42there was also a special one
49:43unfortunately Mara
49:45which unfortunately
49:47it came out
49:47even from this whole story
49:50is that he had
49:51of attitudes
49:52of sexual attitudes
49:55let's just say it
49:56not normal
49:57In short
49:58but sexual attitudes
49:59I am a thing
50:00very personal
50:01when you find yourself forced
50:03she in my opinion
50:05at a certain point
50:06has united
50:06the speech
50:07to say
50:08I need money
50:09I have to make a living somehow
50:10and I see that anyway
50:12there is a world
50:13that the money
50:14can you give them to me?
50:15it was occasional
50:17she is not a professional
50:20Mara needs to work
50:21to provide for herself
50:23and help Maximilian
50:24in the maintenance of the daughter
50:27and so
50:27we come to the days
50:29before disappearing
50:30always in perspective
50:31to find a stable job
50:33had recently supported
50:34a first aid course
50:35first aid
50:36on the highway
50:37but he hadn't finished it
50:39because in the meantime
50:40he had started working
50:41to Don Ciccio of Chiomonte
50:42as a waitress
50:43where he worked
50:45they noticed
50:46who was not a person
50:47that it wasn't
50:48completely unfamiliar with the trade
50:49he knew how to do the job
50:51Mara worked for a week
50:52to Don Ciccio
50:53and everything seems to be fine
50:54this one at least
50:55it was Fabrizio's feeling
50:57she always kept telling me
50:58that everything was fine
50:59Meaning what
51:00he kept writing
51:01the messages are those
51:02look, I found a job
51:03look I'm doing the course
51:05look, everything's fine
51:07Therefore
51:08for her
51:09just like her character
51:11he would hardly have told me
51:13look, there are problems
51:14because she was trying to figure it out on her own
51:17after only a week of work
51:19sought and obtained
51:20to provide the best
51:21to the daughter's needs
51:23Mara dies
51:24It's March 8th
51:26the day
51:26dedicated to women
51:33we wanted
51:34that you told us about Mara
51:37but Fabrizio Pace
51:38what are you doing with Penelope?
51:40who helped the family
51:41of the missing
51:42what happens now
51:44we try to be there for you
51:46to this family
51:47that beyond everything
51:48it's always difficult
51:50address these dynamics
51:52now Fabrizio is here too
51:54to tell anyway
51:54one last piece of truth
51:56I guess it's not that easy
51:58Therefore
51:59definitely us
52:00we will continue to stand by each other
52:02to them
52:03And
52:03if they wanted
52:05we are also here for
52:07try to understand
52:08how to re-propose
52:09a request to open
52:11of investigations
52:11because in my opinion
52:12and in our opinion
52:13absolutely
52:14Mara did not commit suicide
52:15that's what I want to say
52:16to our viewers
52:17it's just that it's not clear
52:18how Mara did it
52:19to take that path
52:20alone
52:21at night
52:21etc.
52:22so if someone then
52:23actually
52:24he met Mara
52:25or someone gave it to him
52:26a passage
52:27or does anyone know something
52:29we are always here
52:31to try to understand
52:31what happened
52:32because if the brother says
52:34and you can hear that voice
52:36shrill
52:37who agrees
52:38with his partner
52:40for the daughter
52:41etc.
52:41actually
52:42anything can happen
52:43but
52:44it could also be
52:45the opposite of suicide
52:47that is, a murder
52:48Thank you
52:48allow me
52:49I just really wanted
52:50thank you
52:51the entire editorial staff
52:52Ivan Bacchi
52:53which was really
52:53a very kind person
52:55it has always been followed
52:56Obviously
52:56and you who put it there
52:58in contact
52:58with Penelope
53:00with all the lawyer
53:01the whole structure
53:02who assisted us
53:03because I think
53:04fundamental
53:05because unfortunately
53:06the institutions
53:07at the moment in which
53:09a person disappears
53:10there are researches
53:12and so on
53:12they completely attract it
53:14that is, people
53:14they come completely
53:15abandoned
53:16if we didn't have
53:17I had your help
53:18Penelope's
53:19etc.
53:19we would really be
53:20abandoned states
53:21and that's the period
53:22worse
53:23because then when
53:24things
53:25and I thank myself too
53:26then all those
53:26what they did
53:27the investigations
53:27the research
53:28and so on
53:28once
53:29it was discovered
53:30something
53:32another chapter opens
53:33and that
53:34it's part of justice
53:35I repeat
53:36today there was
53:37it was filmed
53:38a chapter
53:38we passed
53:39a chapter
53:40there was a closure
53:40investigations
53:41but I'm still
53:43hopeful
53:43that somehow
53:44may jump out
53:46over time
53:47something
53:47I'm reopening
53:48and then you don't have to stay
53:49alone
53:49and you're right about that
53:50thanks Fabrizio
53:51Thanks Fabrizio Pace
53:53then I
53:54I would connect
53:55with ours
53:55Francis Paul of the King
53:56why we started
53:57this episode
53:58speaking precisely
53:59of Pietra Catella
54:01this country
54:02that we have learned
54:03to know
54:03why this mom
54:05and this daughter
54:05that were finished
54:06in the hospital
54:06it looked like poisoning
54:08now we're talking
54:09of poisoning
54:10of ricin
54:12Francis Paul
54:13among other things
54:14It's something that family members do
54:14they found out yesterday
54:15from the press
54:19yes Federica
54:20it's a story again
54:21all to be written
54:22that of the double
54:23death
54:24of the mother
54:24and his daughter
54:25of Pietra Catella
54:26it's from Campobasso
54:28that have left
54:29the investigations
54:30because mother and daughter
54:31they died in the hospital
54:32it was thought
54:32to an intoxication
54:33as you said
54:34but instead yesterday
54:35it was known
54:36that scientific analyses
54:38pipelines
54:39on the finds
54:40taken during the autopsy
54:41they detected
54:43the presence
54:43of a poison
54:44ricin
54:45in the body
54:46in the blood
54:47of the mother
54:47and his daughter
54:48and now we start again
54:49all over again
54:50we have to go back
54:51in that house
54:52which is still
54:52under seizure
54:53for three months
54:54why the investigators
54:55they have to look for
54:56to understand
54:57through
54:58of the analyses
54:58specifications
54:59if for example
55:00on the dishes
55:01or on food
55:03which still are
55:03inside the house
55:04there are traces
55:05of this poison
55:06of this substance
55:07which is not easy
55:08to be found
55:09that is, it cannot be found
55:10on the market
55:10we talked
55:11of purchases
55:12via the dark web
55:14it will be necessary to verify
55:15who could have done it
55:16which could it be
55:18was the goal
55:18we don't know
55:19if who acted
55:20he wanted to eliminate
55:22the entire family unit
55:23if the goal
55:24it was a component
55:26of the family nucleus
55:27and other people
55:28let's say they remained
55:29that came into contact
55:31with this poison
55:32they did it by accident
55:33by mistake
55:33let us remember that also
55:34the dad
55:35he had some symptoms
55:37he was hospitalized
55:38also in Rome
55:39at the Spallanzani hospital
55:40and then instead
55:41it was better
55:43and the spectators
55:45Federica tells us
55:46that castor oil
55:49It is used in cosmetics
55:51but we have to
55:51underline
55:52that the toxic part
55:54the toxic component
55:55it's another one
55:56that is, ricin
55:57there is a specific thing
55:58which is extracted
55:59castor oil seeds
56:00so castor oil
56:02it's not dangerous
56:03that is, it's not that
56:03the cause of death
56:04Surely
56:05it's a different substance
56:06I thank
56:06Francis Paul
56:07actually if for so many months
56:09it remained under seizure
56:10to the house
56:11probably already a suspicion
56:12there was
56:13then we'll see each other right away
56:14after this short break
56:31another emergency
56:32Rosario who is 65 years old
56:34is a guest of a facility
56:35of Nocera Inferiore Salerno
56:37Sunday, March 29
56:38he went out with his sister
56:40they went to an ice cream shop
56:41of Castellammare di Stabbia
56:43there were a lot of people in the place
56:45and Rosario, no one knows how
56:46he disappeared
56:48consider that he doesn't have a cell phone
56:50he doesn't have the drugs
56:51which must be taken
56:52for his therapy
56:53and the sister tells us
56:54that he might have taken
56:55a train
56:56in the direction of Rome
56:58or of Florence
56:59they are cities he knows
57:01the family members are very worried
57:03for his health
57:05then I'll show you again
57:07Sveletterana's photo
57:08why did he call us
57:09one of our viewers
57:10who works in Fiumicino
57:12at the airport
57:13and he told us that actually
57:14he saw her
57:15wandering around the airport
57:17he thought it was
57:17a homeless person
57:19so the woman
57:20that we told you before
57:21she had disappeared
57:23he had to take a plane
57:24for Bulgaria
57:25he came from Zimbabwe
57:26and called his sister
57:27with the phone
57:28of another passenger
57:29but it disappeared
57:31literally
57:32At that time
57:33if we show
57:34this is his photograph
57:35in this photograph
57:37let's see exactly
57:38how is she dressed
57:38and wanders
57:39between the airport
57:41and we don't know though
57:41if he took
57:42a direct train
57:44in Rome
57:45but it was definitely
57:46until this morning
57:48at the airport
57:48me now
57:49thank you
57:50for being with us
57:51I'll give you the news
57:52very important
57:53night line
57:54of TG3
57:54there is ours
57:55Elaria Capitani
57:56and as always
57:57we'll see each other
57:58next Wednesday
57:59Speaking of which
57:59happy Easter
58:06Speaking of which
58:13Speaking of which
58:14Speaking of which
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