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00:00:00So I think Volpe is playing for a job. He might be playing for New York. He might be playing
00:00:05to stay out of Scranton-Wilkes-Barre.
00:00:08It's a drive by Derry Dawson. Jeff Chisholm goes deep.
00:00:17Hello, welcome to the Pinstripe Post. We were off for last week. I was banged out sick, but we're back.
00:00:21I'm Ryan Sampson, your host, but he's the star of the show, Joel Sherman. Today is Monday, April 27.
00:00:25Joel, since the last time we spoke, the Yankees have won seven of their last eight.
00:00:29They reeled off a bunch of wins there, or eight of last nine. Did I get that wrong? I don't
00:00:34even know.
00:00:34They've won a lot of games, Joel, since the last time I spoke to you.
00:00:37The best record in the American League, as we speak.
00:00:39They look damn good right now. Obviously, they dropped yesterday, Sunday.
00:00:43Luis Hill, we get that news we'll dive into a little bit, but before we get to any of that,
00:00:47how are you doing on this Monday morning, sir?
00:00:50Ryan, the key thing is, how are you doing? You're a young man.
00:00:52You can't be the one who's all sick and everything. When we miss a show,
00:00:55it's got to be because of me, man. I'm an old dude.
00:00:59No, look, I appreciate you giving me some time to heal up.
00:01:04That's easy. I'm glad you're feeling it. I still hear it in your voice,
00:01:06and so I appreciate that you're even fighting through it to do this.
00:01:10I'm sure people who are watching this appreciate it as well.
00:01:13You clearly were very sick last week, so we're glad that we got to do this again.
00:01:20Trust me, especially in the middle of a Yankee winning streak,
00:01:22there's no other time that I want to talk to you about this Yankees baseball team.
00:01:27But look, what's interesting is, I don't know where you want to start.
00:01:32I think there's a lot about the Luis Hill thing that we can get into,
00:01:35but really just quick from a bird's eye view, I always ask you,
00:01:38what is your take over this really nice stretch they had versus the Royals,
00:01:42the Red Sox, and then taking two out of three against the Astros?
00:01:45Because it was looking a little tough after that Angels series.
00:01:48Where he's like, oh man, where the hell is this team going?
00:01:51Are they good? Are they really bad? Are they somewhere in between?
00:01:53What are you sensing right now?
00:01:55Well, you know, they're going to have more bad streaks during the season.
00:01:59You know, it's just the nature of the beast.
00:02:01The question is, are they a 95-ish win team?
00:02:05I think that they've given a lot of indication that's who they are.
00:02:08I think there's been a lot of indication that the AL East isn't quite as good
00:02:11as we thought it was going to be a month ago.
00:02:14You know, there's already been a firing of a manager in the division.
00:02:17And if I was going to start in one place, can I suggest something about the Phillies and Mets,
00:02:23who I believe have the two worst records in the major leagues, right?
00:02:27We did a lot of shows where I was, I thought the Yankees had a very good offseason,
00:02:32and I thought had put together a very, very strong team.
00:02:36And I knew that flew in the face of the general consensus of the people who scream the loudest
00:02:41and usually know the least.
00:02:43But the Phillies ran it back, and it's not working.
00:02:50Like, that was the criticism in Philadelphia, is running it back.
00:02:53So, like, you have to know that what you're running back is really strong to make it work.
00:02:58And let's give the Yankees credit for, they were one of the two kind of, like,
00:03:03major, at least payroll superpowers that really, to a large extent, ran it back.
00:03:08You know, the Phillies did some stuff at the edges, Adelis Garcia, Brad Keller,
00:03:13that kind of stuff, like the Yankees did with Ryan Weathers.
00:03:16But for the most part, their big moves in the offseason were Kyle Schwarber and JT Real Muto.
00:03:21They ran it back.
00:03:22The Mets tore it down and did a complete change.
00:03:27And what people love in the offseason is change.
00:03:30They love when the teams spend a lot of money and bring in big names.
00:03:35You know, I just looked.
00:03:37Dante, Bo Bichette and Jorge Polanco have two of the worst wins above replacement in the major leagues right now.
00:03:43That's their big first baseman, third baseman.
00:03:46Freddy Peralta hasn't been that good.
00:03:49Luis Robert, after a positive kind of first week, 10 days, has kind of reversed and gone the wrong way
00:03:56and can't play every day.
00:03:59They took the two Yankee relievers, and that's generally been a disaster, especially Williams.
00:04:05But Williams and Weaver have not been good.
00:04:07So, like, in the bottom of the NL East and really the bottom of the major leagues right now, it's
00:04:11the two worst records.
00:04:12You have one team that kind of ran it back with a big payroll and one team that changed it
00:04:17with a big payroll.
00:04:18And I do have to think that to some degree, like, the Yankees actually internally thought this was one of
00:04:25the better teams they've put together in a long time.
00:04:27And that involved running it back.
00:04:31But, though, again, like, at this time last year, Devin Williams was doing for the Yankees what he's doing for
00:04:36the Mets right now.
00:04:37And it isn't running it back because at some point you got Bednar.
00:04:40And Bednar helped kind of, like, create an anchor at the end of the rotation, at the end of the
00:04:46bullpen.
00:04:48And, you know, Caballero has obviously brought some positives.
00:04:53You know, I still think that McMahon has value for what he does with a couple of left-hand starters
00:05:00and a reliever like Tim Hill who puts the ball on the ground all the time.
00:05:04And I still think that he'll probably be who will be at the end of the year.
00:05:07He'll hit 205 with 30% strikeouts, 18 homers and field really well and walk at about 12%.
00:05:15And I think that the Yankees have already shown they're going to be much more aggressive about not playing him
00:05:22against lefties.
00:05:23And I think probably when Volpe comes back, they'll be very aggressive of, in games, they're trailing pinch-hitting for
00:05:30him during the game.
00:05:31And so, like, I think that they have some versatility.
00:05:35And I just â I was at the Mets.
00:05:38I really watched â I've been watching a lot more of the Mets than the Yankees.
00:05:41I've got to be honest with you and the people who are watching it.
00:05:43And it's like I can't take my eyes off of a car crash right now.
00:05:46Yeah, exactly.
00:05:47As opposed to the Yankees.
00:05:49And I was at the Mets yesterday.
00:05:51And so it was just on my mind as I was watching the Mets and I had the Phillies on
00:05:55my phone and I was watching the Phillies get blown out by Atlanta.
00:05:59That here are two teams that did things in kind of this very diametrically opposed way from each other.
00:06:05But also, like, the Yankees were criticized for not doing it like the Mets.
00:06:08And they were criticized for doing it like the Phillies.
00:06:10But there is an art to knowing that you have the right team or not.
00:06:15No, look.
00:06:15I mean, Joel, we all know they finished one win short of winning the AL East last year.
00:06:19Obviously, the playoffs, they win the first round against the Red Sox who they beat up last week.
00:06:23And then they get smoked by the Blue Jays.
00:06:26And it's like, okay, where are this Yankees squad?
00:06:28You just pointed out, though, like, look, they felt really good about this team.
00:06:32They have a lot of levers to pull in certain situations that you just brilliantly pointed out.
00:06:36The thing I will say, and I do want to go from that, is let's talk about, though, the Jose
00:06:43Caballero, right?
00:06:44The Anthony Volpe question seems to be happening here soon, the answer.
00:06:48It seems like he's going to get called up here, I believe, by the end of this week.
00:06:52And they're going to have him up here on the Major League roster.
00:06:55I guess my question is, and this is kind of like my real or unreal, is Jose Caballero, the season
00:07:00he's having.
00:07:01We saw some power in poppies had recently.
00:07:03He's putting together a pretty nice start to the year.
00:07:05I know he had a little cold streak in the beginning, but he's playing pretty damn well right now.
00:07:10And he's providing athleticism on the base pass.
00:07:13He's creating havoc.
00:07:14He's stealing bases, right?
00:07:15For all the faults you deal with, Jose Caballero, the player, mentally, you know, he checks out sometimes with questionable
00:07:22strike calls.
00:07:22And you see him get frustrated at the home plate umpire.
00:07:25But at the end of the day, he's providing you good shortstop play and pretty decent bottom-of-the-line
00:07:31-up production.
00:07:33Is it worth Anthony Volpe just automatically, boom, you're getting the everyday shortstop role when a guy like Jose Caballero
00:07:41is playing pretty damn well right now at shortstop for them?
00:07:44Yeah, I think it's a legitimate question.
00:07:47You know, you do see the stuff pop up, the, you know, two attempts at stealing third base with lefty
00:07:54hitters up that you don't love in Caballero where it's kind of a, you know, a little undisciplined.
00:08:00But he's kind of a fearless player.
00:08:03He has some obvious skills.
00:08:06He feels very much like the, if he's on your team, you feel much better about him than if you're
00:08:11playing against him because he has the devil about him.
00:08:16You know, you see this with the way he tries to play with the pitchers and the clock all the
00:08:21time.
00:08:23And, and by the way, I think the Yankees could use some edge and that, that's fine.
00:08:29I would say that to a slightly larger degree, and I have no, I want to begin this by saying
00:08:35I have no inside information on this.
00:08:38This is not something I believe the Yankees will talk about publicly.
00:08:41But not to the full extent of Luis Gil, but I think Anthony Volpe is somewhat in the Luis Gil
00:08:48vote, which is you're going to get a shot again here, but it is not an endless shot.
00:08:56And while he's doing that, I believe that Caballero will probably start at shortstop twice a week.
00:09:04Uh, I believe he'll probably start in the outfield, the third base or second base, another two times a week.
00:09:11And I'd be shocked in every close game if he's not in the game, right?
00:09:15Because he's such a late game weapon to run and then get double switched in someplace.
00:09:21So while I think his playing time is about to shrink, I don't think it's about to shrink to zero.
00:09:26And there probably is a case to be made that if Volpe is a major league average player at shortstop,
00:09:36are the Yankees a better team being able to use Caballero as a move it around 10th player weapon who
00:09:45starts three or four times a week,
00:09:47but then it's just sitting there as a great off the bench hit, especially run, play multiple positions guy.
00:09:56And again, that's one of the reasons I thought the Yankees were better this year.
00:09:59Their depth is better.
00:10:00You know, we know their depth is better.
00:10:02The guy who was the starting third baseman last year is in the minor leagues.
00:10:06The starting left fielder is just coming up now in Jason Dominguez.
00:10:10One of their starters, Luis Gil, is going back to the minors.
00:10:14Uh, you know, they have some real depth.
00:10:17And I think what real depth provides is Anthony Volpe in year four does not have the,
00:10:25hey, you could hit 111 with 35% strikeouts for seven weeks and we're just going to live with it.
00:10:31I, I think there's options there.
00:10:33And I mean that in both ways.
00:10:35There is an option in that there's an alternative with Calviero.
00:10:38There also is the option if the Yankees want to send him to the minor leagues, like they have Hill,
00:10:43like they have Dominguez, like they have Oswaldo Cabrera.
00:10:46So I think Volpe has to play well.
00:10:50And I think, well, you know, make all the plays, be a 725, tough out, hit some homers and doubles,
00:11:00steal some bases, shortstop.
00:11:02Where you say he's the 13th best shortstop in baseball.
00:11:05If that's where you kind of get with him, I do think Caballero's value goes up in some ways as
00:11:13a, as a man, like, like, like he's almost like a good six.
00:11:18I I've made some comparisons between Jose Caballero and Jose Alvarado.
00:11:22Yeah.
00:11:22Like there is this energy and this change of pace you have when you bring him off the bench.
00:11:28And I do think that, that Caballero has the ability to do some of that.
00:11:33Yeah, I agree with you, Joel, but I think there's also that, that question, right?
00:11:37Because Anthony Volpe's career right now has fallen short of what I think a lot of Yankees fans and what
00:11:43the Yankees have told us about the player as he was a prospect.
00:11:46It's fallen short of those expectations.
00:11:47We know he's had some solid and great moments like the World Series home run.
00:11:51We know he's also had some really bad moments where defensively he leaves you a lot to, to, to wonder,
00:11:56like, does he have the arm to play shortstop?
00:11:58There's some questionable decisions in the play, in the play of field of, is he, is he mentally in tune
00:12:04of what he's supposed to be doing?
00:12:05And then offensively, obviously it's, it's a huge Valley compared to the brief peaks that we've seen so far in
00:12:13his career.
00:12:14So the real question I have for you is, is, is this it for Anthony Volpe?
00:12:18Is this his last chance to prove himself to be a viable starting shortstop for the New York Yankees?
00:12:24Because like you just pointed out and you have said multiple times on this show, Ryan, they're playing for everything
00:12:30this year and they have to be able to say to themselves, Anthony, we love you.
00:12:36We love the player that you, we think you can be.
00:12:38But if you struggle, like you just said for a couple of weeks here, we're going to pull that option
00:12:43on you where we have a better player in Jose Caballero.
00:12:46Who's going to give us a better chance to win baseball games?
00:12:49Yeah, I think you hit a lot of important points to discuss here, Ryan, really.
00:12:56So number one, when it comes to his last chance, you know, I, I don't know if you saw the
00:13:00smirk at all.
00:13:01Like, again, I've just been watching the Mets and spending so much time around the Mets.
00:13:05And I'm just like, how many times am I going to hear this is the last chance for Ronnie Mauricio,
00:13:10Brett Beatty and Mark Vientos?
00:13:11Yeah.
00:13:12Like, like, like at some point, it's really got to be the last chance.
00:13:15And part of the Mets failure this year is that those guys have not fully fired in the way that
00:13:21you hope that they fully fire.
00:13:24But, you know, the, the, so, so, so there's that.
00:13:30The, the other thing is there was not a really good alternative to Volpe these last three years.
00:13:37So part of it is he's not on scholarship anymore and he's not on scholarship for the two, for two
00:13:45reasons.
00:13:45One is I am not changing my, my, my, my words.
00:13:50The Yankees are playing for everything.
00:13:52And so you can't just be the, here's our first round Jeff choice.
00:13:56We're going to shove it down your throat and act like we're whistling when things are going bad.
00:14:02Because that's what they did for a lot of the last three years.
00:14:05They kept telling us good was bad and it shouldn't have been acceptable.
00:14:09But they didn't have another alternative.
00:14:11And when they had another alternative late last year, they did use Caballero Summit shortstop.
00:14:16They have the best record in the majors with Caballero as their shortstop.
00:14:20And so they know they could live with that.
00:14:23And so Volpe has to come up and you're not on scholarship anymore, man.
00:14:28Like this is graduate school and he's going to have to play well.
00:14:34And now you, me, Aaron Boone, Brian Cashman, we all may have different opinions of what well, you know, well
00:14:43is.
00:14:43I will say we all have to agree on one thing.
00:14:46It has to be better than the last three years.
00:14:49Damn right.
00:14:49And if it's not, then you have to decide is Volpe valuable as a backup or does he belong in
00:15:00Scranton and does he belong in July trade discussions where other teams might still be valuing him as a real
00:15:09piece to play shortstop or second for them.
00:15:12I mean, that's one of the things that's going to be interesting when we get to July is what does
00:15:18the Dominguez of it all look like?
00:15:20What does the Luis Gil of it all like?
00:15:22Like some of these guys who've been valuable guys for them could suddenly be, you know, and again, I know
00:15:29how aggregators work in this world, you know, where I'm going to be saying that the Yankees are trading these
00:15:34guys.
00:15:35No, I'm just saying that that they have to be open to the thought of it when you're playing for
00:15:42it all.
00:15:42Well, I think we probably agree.
00:15:44You don't have to do the July trade deadline to July and who knows what your needs are in July.
00:15:50But it seems pretty clear that if we were sitting here today for a team that looks like that is
00:15:55going to play for it all, the Yankees need to be the team that gets the best relief pitcher available
00:16:00or somebody you feel great about in that kind of way.
00:16:05Because, you know, sometimes you get the guy who's the best reliever available and he blows up for 20 innings.
00:16:11But they've got to be aggressively out there for whoever that is.
00:16:18And, you know, like if you're sitting with a Dominguez or a Volpe or Luis Gil or somebody who has
00:16:24had some major league time and success, but still has a lot of control moving forward, then those guys have
00:16:32to be considered seriously.
00:16:34So I think Volpe is playing for a job.
00:16:37He might be playing for New York.
00:16:39He might be playing to stay out of Scranton-Wilkes-Barre.
00:16:41Like, and he's got, again, you, me, Brian Cashman, Aaron Boone might have a different idea of what that leash
00:16:49looks like.
00:16:50Yeah.
00:16:50Is that three weeks?
00:16:51Is it a month?
00:16:53Is it six weeks?
00:16:54Is it two months?
00:16:55Is it until the All-Star break?
00:16:57And then the All-Star break is kind of just a couple of weeks shy of the trade deadline?
00:17:01I don't know, but I do know that for a month, the Yankees are a fully functioning team with the
00:17:06best record in the American League with Caballero playing shortstop.
00:17:09So your scholarship has been revoked and you need to play well.
00:17:14And then we're all going to decide what well looks like.
00:17:17Yeah.
00:17:17It's interesting, Joel.
00:17:18And that's fascinating you mentioned that because, again, Jose Caballero currently is batting 271.
00:17:22He's got 11 stolen bases.
00:17:24He's got three home runs, 11 ribbies.
00:17:25He's doing some damage.
00:17:27He's got a 731 OPS.
00:17:28Yes, the Volpe time.
00:17:30Unafraid.
00:17:31And the Volpe time.
00:17:32You know, important element.
00:17:34Like, again, I'm spending a lot of time, as I always do with the Mets, and a lot of their
00:17:40new guys are struggling.
00:17:43This is â and then once you get into the quicksand in New York, it's like you get thrown an
00:17:48anvil, not a lifeline, and it's hard to get out.
00:17:52So, like, Caballero came in with attitude last year and helped the team late, and he's kept doing it.
00:17:57Now, I know it might be easier to come in as a supplementary player than as Bo Bichette or Jorge
00:18:03Polanco or Devin Williams or Freddie Peralta, but he certainly is not afraid of being a New York baseball player.
00:18:13And I think that that always has to be checked off here.
00:18:18You've got to check it off.
00:18:21Like, I don't think â I think Ryan McMahon is failing because Ryan McMahon has certain things he doesn't do
00:18:27well as a baseball player.
00:18:28I don't think he's afraid of New York.
00:18:31No.
00:18:32No.
00:18:32I think he's fine.
00:18:33I think the things he does well, he does well.
00:18:35And the things he does poorly, he does poorly.
00:18:36And he did it exactly like that in Colorado, and he's doing it exactly like that here.
00:18:42But, hey, credit to Ryan.
00:18:44I mean, that Kansas City home run in the bottom of the eighth was actually huge, I think, for him
00:18:48as a monkey off his back.
00:18:49You could see the energy he had.
00:18:50Interesting that the two homers have gone the other way.
00:18:53Yeah, yeah.
00:18:53So, I think â well, to wrap up this Volpe â
00:18:57I think he's going to be a bad offensive player, by the way.
00:18:59Like, I just think that's who he is.
00:19:00But here's the thing that you pointed out again before was about the playing for everything, and it's something I
00:19:05think the Yankees, while they probably didn't have the options at the time to play someone else a third in
00:19:10previous years, with McMahon, they're not afraid to say, hey, you're sitting versus the lefty today.
00:19:16Rosario is going to play every time he gets the lefty.
00:19:19And we're going to pay shit for you against the tough lefty in the sixth inning of the 3-3
00:19:22team because â
00:19:23Even with another year of money guaranteed next year on this guy, we're not afraid to sit you.
00:19:29That's what I'm saying, Joel.
00:19:30Like, in previous years, they were, like, committed to Josh Johnson, committed to DJ LeMayu, even with the years on
00:19:35the deal.
00:19:36This feels different, and I think that should be something, like, I'm glad we're talking about because I think that's
00:19:42something that's not being highlighted enough is there's a different attitude, it feels like, in the way Aaron Boone and
00:19:47Brian Cashman are operating here a little bit.
00:19:49Yeah, look, I think that we're probably heading towards a point where â like, I think there's an interesting moment
00:19:59for Dominguez.
00:20:03I suspect one of the reasons he's up is they want to get â they don't want to IL Stanton.
00:20:10There's an off day on Thursday, and between now and then, the Rangers are starting three righties.
00:20:16And so there's going to be open DH slash maybe an outfield game if they want a DH judge or
00:20:23DH Bellinger, something like that.
00:20:26So I think he's going to get three games here, and then it will be interesting when the Rangers bring
00:20:31in a lefty reliever, what is done?
00:20:34Because in a very small sample size, Dominguez has hit lefties in the minor leagues this year.
00:20:39It's very small.
00:20:40As we see anything that comes up from the minor leagues pitching-wise this year, there is a huge gap
00:20:45about who you're getting out at AAA and who you're getting out in the major leagues.
00:20:48But, like, Dominguez went to the minors and did what â go back if anyone would like to go listen
00:20:55to the show.
00:20:55The thing was, go back and make yourself valuable.
00:20:59Like, play hard and play well, and you will get opportunities.
00:21:03If not here, then someplace else.
00:21:05And now here's opportunity one.
00:21:07How long will it last?
00:21:08I don't know.
00:21:10If he looks good hitting a couple of lefties late in the game.
00:21:16Like, I think that Boone will be the â hey, I know it's 3-3.
00:21:22I got Goldschmidt on the bench.
00:21:24I want to see it.
00:21:25Like, it's still late April, early May.
00:21:28Let's see it.
00:21:29Because if he can do it, he just becomes a much more valuable player than Randall Gritchick.
00:21:33Oh, yeah.
00:21:33And when you're playing for it all, you suddenly say the, oh, now I have another pinch runner.
00:21:40I have another pinch hitter.
00:21:41I have another guy to take Stanton off his feet and feel more comfortable.
00:21:45The speed Dominguez provides is insane off the bench.
00:21:49He's just like Caballero.
00:21:50So, can you imagine if you have his speed and Caballero's speed as bench players?
00:21:54And also, by the way, lefty-righty guys who have shown some history of hitting the opposite.
00:22:00Caballero against lefties.
00:22:01Dominguez against righties.
00:22:03Like, the Yankees could deepen up here.
00:22:05And I think this is an interesting little, I think for him, I think for Volpe, I think these are
00:22:12interesting little tryout periods that are coming up for guys who are, like, part of a 94, key parts of
00:22:21a 94-1 team last year.
00:22:22Who, you know, you've got to play for your lunch a little bit, man.
00:22:26And let's see.
00:22:28And I think the most idealized version of the Yankees might have both guys on it.
00:22:34And look, I don't think we're there yet.
00:22:36But they might have to have a difficult Paul Goldschmidt discussion at some point in June or July about, you
00:22:45know, like, the question becomes, if you have a first-base injury to Rice, what are you doing?
00:22:54At least with Goldschmidt, you feel like, eh, it's a major leaguer.
00:22:57You could whatever.
00:22:58Do you feel like you could put Ahmad Rosario there and feel good about it?
00:23:02I don't know.
00:23:03But, like, I don't think we're there yet.
00:23:05Could you put Bellinger there, though, if you had an injury with Rice?
00:23:08You could.
00:23:08That's an excellent point that kind of slipped my mind.
00:23:10Yes.
00:23:11You could put Bellinger there.
00:23:12It'd probably be the best first baseman on the team.
00:23:14Right.
00:23:14And then you could put Dominguez in the outfield, right?
00:23:16You would have a spot open for him.
00:23:18So, I think we might.
00:23:20Like, if Dominguez actually could be major league average against lefty pitching, major league average against lefty pitching, and let's
00:23:28remember, he's a natural right-hand hitter.
00:23:30He was taught to hit left-handed.
00:23:33If he could be major league average, think about how much more versatile and, like, just the chess game that
00:23:45Boone and his staff could play daily with lefty-righty, with guys who could run late in the game, with
00:23:51guys who can hit opposite sides late in the game.
00:23:54It's, they, their idealized version of them might not have Gritchick and Goldschmidt on it and might have Volpe, because
00:24:04even if Volpe becomes a backup second baseman shortstop, he provides you some speed.
00:24:08He's used to taking big at-bats.
00:24:11Yes.
00:24:11So, I don't think we're there yet.
00:24:15I think we're getting close to there with Gritchick.
00:24:17Yeah.
00:24:18I don't think we're there yet with Goldschmidt.
00:24:21He's just, he's a borderline to maybe even higher than that Hall of Famer.
00:24:24He's very close with the most important player on the team.
00:24:27Uh, it is not going to be an easy decision.
00:24:31It's a lot easier on talk radio to tell that player he no longer plays on your team than the
00:24:37emotion for a player who is universally respected in the clubhouse and universally respected around the game and has accomplished
00:24:45as much as Paul Goldschmidt.
00:24:46But, to our larger point that when you're playing for everything, sometime in June or July, there might have to
00:24:53be a very, very tough conversation about this.
00:24:59And, and look, I'm sorry I'm going on.
00:25:02I'll just add one last thing.
00:25:03One of the reasons the Yankees are 18 and 10, and one of the reasons they, they, they, like, ended
00:25:09up with depth and not sure exactly how to handle it is,
00:25:12the other day when they put, please help me with the last name, Chavey?
00:25:17Oh, yeah, Chavelli.
00:25:19Chavelli.
00:25:20However, Chavelli, yeah.
00:25:22Yeah, that was that first in-season IL move all year.
00:25:26They were the last team.
00:25:27They were number 30.
00:25:28Last team to have to make an in-season IL.
00:25:31And it almost completely coincided when, when two of their IL and maybe three would call are close to coming
00:25:37back.
00:25:38Um, and, uh, they've gotten to play their guys.
00:25:42And so, like, we haven't seen a lot of Goldschmidt yet because there hadn't been the Stanton injury.
00:25:48There hasn't been a Rice injury.
00:25:50There hasn't been a judge.
00:25:50But, like, unless this is going to be a miracle health year for them, those injuries are coming.
00:25:57And you don't want to give up your depth right away before you have to.
00:26:00So, I think, I think there's probably a Gritchick conversation.
00:26:03I'm sorry.
00:26:04Yes, a Gritchick conversation.
00:26:06Yeah, coming in a shorter rather than a longer period of time.
00:26:10But I'm not sure that there's a Goldschmidt conversation coming for a couple of months.
00:26:16Yeah, I mean, look, I think this goes into, again, the playing for everything conversation, right?
00:26:20There was a question of, Joel, at the beginning of the season, would Goldschmidt play versus all the lefties, right?
00:26:24And Ben Rice would sit versus those tough lefties.
00:26:26Ben Rice is hit out of that question.
00:26:29It's just incredible what he's done already to start this year.
00:26:32He's leading the team in average.
00:26:34He's leading the team in ribbies.
00:26:35He's one homer shy of Aaron Judge.
00:26:37Team's leading 10 home runs.
00:26:38Forget about the team, Ryan.
00:26:39I think he's second in the American League in on-base percentage.
00:26:43I think he's second in the American League in slugging.
00:26:45I think he might be first in OPS or second in OPS.
00:26:49He's in the top five in homers and RBIs.
00:26:52And, you know, we don't give out the MVP after a month.
00:26:56But if I would have told you we're giving out the MVP to a Yankee slugger after a month, you'd
00:27:01go, wow, Judge got off great.
00:27:02And, by the way, Judge has been good.
00:27:03He's got 10 homers.
00:27:04He's been good.
00:27:05The MVP of the team has been Ben Rice.
00:27:07Easily.
00:27:07Like he's striking out a little too much for my taste.
00:27:11But, you know, like that should be a minor complaint when you're as productive as he's been and as generally
00:27:17selective because he's also drawing a ton of walks and hitting a ton of homers.
00:27:22He's been, you know, the comparison I think I made in both the paper and on our show was to
00:27:26some, are we watching a young Kyle Schwarber?
00:27:28And, you know, Kyle Schwarber walks a lot, strikes out a lot, hits a lot of homers, and is a
00:27:33great player who just got $150 million.
00:27:37And if that's Ben Rice, then he's going to make a ton of money if this continues.
00:27:42And, again, if we were sitting here discussing how do you get to 18 and 10 early in the season,
00:27:46best record in the AL, I don't know.
00:27:48If you draft Ben Rice in like the 12th round and Cam Schlittler in the seventh and they would both
00:27:53be top five after a month for MVP and Cy Young, that's like a damn miracle, a baseball miracle to
00:28:02have that happen.
00:28:02And that's happened.
00:28:04Of course, you still want to keep seeing more and more baseball's hard.
00:28:08There's been a lot of meteors that have, you know, gone through the sky.
00:28:12But this is over two years for Schlittler, and it feels like it's over parts of at least three years,
00:28:17but certainly two years for Rice of being a high-level hitter.
00:28:21And that both guys got better off of last year so far.
00:28:25Really, really impressive.
00:28:27The two players to pull from small Northeastern colleges.
00:28:31The irony of pulling them both from the Boston area is really something.
00:28:39It's really, they've been special players so far.
00:28:42And I think that, again, goes back to, right, like we always heard from Aaron Boone, you know, like, hey,
00:28:47you know, I wanted to get Ben off his feet versus the tough lefty today.
00:28:50You can't sit him.
00:28:51You just can't.
00:28:52You have to keep playing him.
00:28:53Keep giving him those opportunities.
00:28:54He's your best bat right now.
00:28:55He's one of the best batters in the American League, like you just said.
00:28:58And can I throw in one thing also, Ryan, is I think they've clearly defined he's not going to catch
00:29:04this year.
00:29:04Yeah.
00:29:05I think he's played well at first base defensively.
00:29:08He's been, that's the thing is, he's played well enough at first base that you don't have to worry about
00:29:14defending for him.
00:29:15Plus, you don't want to do anything to disrupt the bat, which is, you know, a top five bat in
00:29:20the sport.
00:29:21I mean, he's, if Judge had these numbers, you'd go, oh, Judge.
00:29:25Like, he has these numbers, and Judge has pretty good numbers, as we're speaking with the expectation that Judge will
00:29:32have one of those hot streaks.
00:29:33And then suddenly the average will be 290 and whatever, and he'll be, you know, whatever.
00:29:39But I think that they've shown that Ascara's going to be the backup catcher, Wells is going to start, and
00:29:49Rice is there for an emergency.
00:29:51You know, like, they'll have him catch some bullpens, whatever, so that, like, again, if they get to their idealized
00:29:57team, and suddenly you feel like, hey, I got a, they brought in two different lefties, and I hit for
00:30:04both Wells and Ascara in an important game.
00:30:06Can I put Rice to finish the game? I think they'll keep the skill, but I don't think they're going
00:30:12to put him at a high-end risk when having his bat in the lineup is so important.
00:30:17And also, like, we've seen what happened with Wells, which is, I do think that Wells' bat was why he
00:30:24came to be drafted in the first round and why he moved to the minor leagues.
00:30:28I think working so hard at a time where it's so hard to catch has diminished his offense, and the
00:30:33last thing you want to do is diminish Ben Rice's offense, too.
00:30:35So, I think that they've defined whatever else they're doing as they're moving these chess pieces around, Ben Rice is
00:30:42just going to be the play 94 out of 100 games at first base.
00:30:48You know, like, look, there can't be whining against a lefty every once in a while, Goldschmidt starts the game.
00:30:54Yeah, no, I think I agree with you, Joel. Goldschmidt only had 33 at-bats this year, so I'm sure
00:31:00we're going to see more of him over the next couple weeks.
00:31:01The one thing I will say about the Volpe timeline, to go back and circle back on that, I wonder
00:31:07if six weeks is that timeline for him.
00:31:09Because you know why six weeks, Joel? It brings us right to June.
00:31:13And what do the Yankees do in June the last couple of years? They have that June swoon.
00:31:16And I wonder, again, like you said, hey, we're in first place.
00:31:20We're the best team in the American League, you could argue, with Jose Caballero playing shortstop every day.
00:31:24If we bring Anthony Volpe at the end of this week, and we give him the everyday shortstop role, and
00:31:28Caballero is our chess piece, and we start going down in June, I wonder if they start recognizing, and Volpe's
00:31:34not playing well?
00:31:36Have that conversation, like you said.
00:31:38Something to think about there is that June timeline.
00:31:40Joel, let's switch over to Luis. Go ahead.
00:31:42There's some timeline.
00:31:44Yeah.
00:31:44You know, like what the date is, I don't know, and what the skill level he'll have to show, I
00:31:50don't know.
00:31:51But they're not, he's not on scholarship anymore.
00:31:53I think that's, at least I think that no Yankee person has come to me and said, hey, he's not
00:31:58on scholarship anymore.
00:31:59But it just makes sense, right?
00:32:02Like, Dominguez wasn't on scholarship.
00:32:04Luis Hill wasn't on scholarship.
00:32:05Oswaldo Cabrera wasn't on scholarship.
00:32:08Like, none of these, they might have to make, like, remove a guy who's pitched well, either Warren or Weathers,
00:32:16from the rotation.
00:32:18If they get both Cole and Rodon back, and they stay healthy otherwise, and again, like, where do you sign
00:32:24up to have to make that decision?
00:32:25It means you've stayed healthy.
00:32:27But, like, and if you care, Ryan, the person, I know a scout who saw Cole's last, who saw the
00:32:35last rehab start, and he said, Cole looked terrific.
00:32:40I like that.
00:32:41I mean, Rodon put up some pretty good numbers.
00:32:42So, Cole and Rodon, he told me Cole looked terrific.
00:32:45He said Rodon kind of, like, worked into it and wasn't as sharp as Cole.
00:32:50Yeah, it's his first rehab start for Rodon, so I'm sure there's, like, some things to work out there.
00:32:55But let's talk about the starting rotation, specifically Luis Hill.
00:32:59They sent him down yesterday to AAA.
00:33:01He has a 6.05 ERA in his four starts this year.
00:33:05The fastball, Joel, is down in velocity.
00:33:08We talked about his delivery is inconsistent.
00:33:10He can't control that fastball right now, which affects the secondary stuff.
00:33:14Boone talked about it yesterday as well.
00:33:16So, look, there's that whole roster gymnastics right now.
00:33:20They have a day off on Thursday, and then they have 13 games, I believe, straight in 13 days where
00:33:26they'll have to make a decision.
00:33:28Does Luis Hill come back to the majors here, depending on injuries at all?
00:33:33Could he be a bullpen beast?
00:33:35Do we see him again as a starter here with the Yankees?
00:33:38Does he stay at AAA?
00:33:39There's multiple questions there.
00:33:41And then, in the meantime, if they don't bring him back, and let's say Rodon and Cole are not ready,
00:33:47obviously,
00:33:47could we see a Yarbrough slash Blackburn start?
00:33:51Or do they call up one of the young guys in Elmer Root, Cruz Rodriguez, or a Legrane?
00:33:56I know there's a lot there.
00:33:57I just threw it at you.
00:33:58No, it's â there's a lot there because they have a â the reason I like the Yankees this year
00:34:05was I thought they had starting pitching depth.
00:34:09And that's proving out to the point where they're going to have really tough decisions.
00:34:13They continue to stay this healthy.
00:34:16You know, give Will Warren credit.
00:34:19He graduated a little this year, right?
00:34:21Like, he got a â I mean, not to the leaps and bounds of Schlittler.
00:34:24I mean, Schlittler might be an ace if this is really who he is.
00:34:27But Warren is showing to be a legitimate, pretty good number four on a contending team.
00:34:31And that's, again, for like a not a top draft pick.
00:34:35It's really a good thing for them, for the Yankees, for their whole organization.
00:34:41Let's deal with Luis Hill first.
00:34:44I think he's got to go to the minor leagues, and I think he has to go to the minor
00:34:47leagues for an extended period of time and try to rediscover himself.
00:34:54He is walking 12.9%.
00:34:57The guys, he's striking out 10.6.
00:34:59He's walking what he's striking out, and he's striking out numbers among the least in the league.
00:35:02Like, so this isn't a, hey, for one start, like, get it together or three starts.
00:35:08He's got to go down there and be like, Luis, we believe that guy from the beginning of the 2024
00:35:15season is still in you.
00:35:16We've got to give it a run to see if we can get it out of you.
00:35:20So, like, let's get in the lab.
00:35:22Like, let's figure out, do you need some time off because the lat thing, you're not telling us something, whatever.
00:35:27And so I would think about fixing him.
00:35:29Number two, I know that there is this feeling with the Yankees, and this probably will play out, that one
00:35:35of the ways they'll fix their bullpen big picture for the last two months of the season and a postseason
00:35:40is to reach into their starting pitching depth either in the major leagues or minor leagues.
00:35:45To me, there's two things you don't want a relief pitcher to be bad at.
00:35:50One of them is walk rate.
00:35:52I think, like, we've become too accepting of this sport.
00:35:57Well, to get to his strikeouts, he walks.
00:36:00And to me, it was a little bit like the devilish stuff on, like, Devin Williams where people would say
00:36:06to me, well, his underlying numbers with the Yankees were good.
00:36:09I'm like, he's in terrible counts all the time.
00:36:11Horrible, horrible counts.
00:36:12He's in terrible counts, and it's with the Mets again.
00:36:14He's in terrible counts all the time.
00:36:16These are major league hitters.
00:36:17They're going to tee off on you if you're 2-0 and 3-1, and Luis Hill is in bad
00:36:24counts all the time, and so he walks too many, and he gives up home runs.
00:36:32Like, so you'll look at a guy like Tim Hill who strikes out, like, less than 5% of the
00:36:40hitters.
00:36:41It's, like, ridiculous for a major league pitcher to strike out this little.
00:36:44But you essentially have to get three singles off of him to score a run.
00:36:48He doesn't walk anybody, and he doesn't let the ball get over the fence.
00:36:52He gave up a homer the other day and put a big lead on a slider that he's never throwing
00:36:55if it's a 2-2 game, right?
00:36:58So he's just, like, for, like, what he can't do, what he does do is he dominates the strike zone.
00:37:04Like, he's very aggressive.
00:37:05And I think, again, how are the Yankees at 18 and 10?
00:37:11I thought one of the things, I went and looked at this, I sensed this about them before I did
00:37:16this, and I looked just before we came on the show.
00:37:19Their hitters lead the major leagues in walk percentage, 12.6%.
00:37:23Probably no surprise if you watch the Yankees play.
00:37:25Guys like Rice and Judge walk a ton, other guys walk, 12.6%, I'm sorry, 12.6%.
00:37:32It's almost, Louis Heal's walk percentage is 12.9%.
00:37:35So it's, like, the equivalent of the Yankees' league.
00:37:38Conversely, their pitchers have the second lowest walk percentage, 7.2%.
00:37:44Their starters are 6.3%, and their home run rates are low.
00:37:49So, like, I'm doing this broadly because Mariano Rivera is the greatest relief pitcher ever, one of the greatest players
00:37:58ever went to Hall of Fame unanimously.
00:38:00Mariano Rivera was, part of his success was he never walked anybody, and he never allowed home runs.
00:38:08So good luck against a 95-mile-an-hour cutter getting three singles before he got three outs.
00:38:15And to me, the Yankees, a lot of their pitching this year is, we're not giving you walks, we're not
00:38:22giving up long balls, and they have this good ERA.
00:38:26Try to score a run by getting multiple hits when you have stuff like Schlittler, whose walk rate just has
00:38:34been slashed, and by the way, should be slashed.
00:38:36If I had his stuff, I'd throw it right down the middle every pitch.
00:38:39And so, like, he has low walk rates.
00:38:42Freed has low walk rates.
00:38:44Will Warren dropped his walk rate.
00:38:46Ryan Weathers gave up some long balls, but he doesn't walk a lot of guys.
00:38:50You know, Brett Hedrick seems to be a guy who's helping them in the bullpen.
00:38:54Low walk rate.
00:38:55Like, so to me, we're watching, especially with ABS, walk rates have gone up around the sport because the strike
00:39:05zone has condensed because guys are calling that strike zone.
00:39:09The walk rate is up.
00:39:11The Yankees are expanding on it on offense, and they're limiting it on the pitching mound.
00:39:18And they have created a sizable gap, a 5% gap in there, like, between, like, 7% walk and
00:39:2712% walk on offense and defense.
00:39:29That's a huge gap.
00:39:31And it means your starting pitchers go a little longer.
00:39:34So they've kind of protected a not-great bullpen.
00:39:36Yes.
00:39:36Because guys like Schlittler are getting into the 6th, 7th, 8th.
00:39:39Freed is getting into the 6th, 7th, 8th.
00:39:41Ryan Weathers has done it a few times now where he's lugged it deep.
00:39:45And, you know, I think you probably have an expectation that Cole and Rodon will do some of that.
00:39:50I know Cole will throw strikes.
00:39:51I'm not positive about Rodon.
00:39:53It's been a big deal in an ABS year that the Yankees have taken advantage of walks on offense and
00:40:01not helped other teams on defense.
00:40:03And Luis Hill has to go to the minor leagues and kind of, like, redominate the strike zone if he
00:40:11can.
00:40:12And I would not put him in the bullpen unless that changes a great deal because he does the two
00:40:18things that get you beat if you're a relief pitcher.
00:40:21He walks too many and he gives up too many fly balls that lead to home runs.
00:40:25He is not a solution for the bullpen for me unless something changes a lot.
00:40:32I just wonder if the mentality, though, and this is just, again, me thinking, because he has such an electric
00:40:37fastball, Joel, when it's going, it's really, really good.
00:40:40But that's the thing.
00:40:41He's not generating any swing and miss on his fastball.
00:40:44So I don't know if there's something.
00:40:45He's either tipping or not, or that it's just clean.
00:40:50Like, there's no deception, no hide.
00:40:52Because, like, we see it.
00:40:54Ryan Weathers' fastball is 100 sometimes.
00:40:58It's 98, 99.
00:41:00It's clean.
00:41:01Like, people, the hitters see it.
00:41:03So he has to have that other stuff.
00:41:06Like, Schlittler could throw his fastball and good luck.
00:41:10Yeah.
00:41:10Now he's throwing three different fastballs.
00:41:12He's throwing three different.
00:41:12He's throwing a sinker and a cutter as well.
00:41:15I mean, and the cutter's ridiculous, and it's a relatively new pitch.
00:41:20But, yeah, I just, to me, to me, it's a little bit the Deval problem.
00:41:29Deval, in this bullpen, he walks too many and he gives up long balls.
00:41:34Cruz does not give up long balls, but he just walks too many guys, Fernando Cruz.
00:41:38I just think a bullpen, the way the air goes out of the ballpark, out of your defense, is leadoff
00:41:47walk.
00:41:48And then it's like this feeling of doom begins to surround it.
00:41:54And to me, a reliever has to be on constant attack.
00:41:58You've got to hit to beat me.
00:42:01You must hit the ball to beat me.
00:42:03And it's just, with whatever stuff he has, I think the greatest lesson in the world is Tim Hill.
00:42:13Like, and I get it.
00:42:15He throws from a funky arm angle, the movement, the sinker, whatever.
00:42:19But it's 84, 85, 86.
00:42:21And he just refuses.
00:42:23Like, you've got to hit it to beat him.
00:42:25Yeah.
00:42:26You must hit it to beat him.
00:42:28And I think relief pitchers, if I ran a team, I will never do that, obviously.
00:42:34But if I ran a team, I'd be really hard-pressed to put a guy with large walk percentage numbers
00:42:40into my bullpen.
00:42:41Now, I know it's hard to find quality guys who don't.
00:42:46But it just, can I give you one other?
00:42:50I think he says, I think David Bednar is probably got B2B plus stuff.
00:42:57But it's always 0-1, 1-2.
00:43:00And so he's, he doesn't walk anybody.
00:43:03So, and I don't think he's given up a home run this year so far.
00:43:08So David Bednar has, every once in a while, walks the tightrope.
00:43:14But the tightrope is, you've got to get three hits before he gets three outs to beat him.
00:43:21He's not giving up homers.
00:43:22And the ball is in the strike zone.
00:43:24And he's in positive counts where he can use a high fastball to maybe strike you out.
00:43:28He can use his curveball or his split to see if you could chase because he's doing it from 0
00:43:34-1, 1-2.
00:43:35It's hard for like Devin Williams to get to the airbender when it's 2-0.
00:43:39It's 3-1 because it's not a strike.
00:43:42And so, like, if you have the discipline to let it go, it's now it's a walk in the air
00:43:46is out of the balloon.
00:43:47And so I think your relievers have to dominate the strike zone.
00:43:52And we got into an era, a very analytic era, where it's like, I'm willing to exchange walks for strikeouts.
00:43:58And I think that's wrong-headed.
00:44:01It's tough to see Luis Hill, a guy like you said, was once the American League Rookie of the Year.
00:44:07Thought he could be Cy Young a couple years ago.
00:44:09And for a World Series team in 24 that lost Cole for six weeks.
00:44:15And he stepped in and pitched like, I'm sorry, for two and a half months.
00:44:18And he pitched like Garrett Cole for two and a half months.
00:44:21Yankees had the best record in the AL when Cole came back.
00:44:24And part of it was like if you had a Cy Young conversation at that point in the season,
00:44:29Hill would have been part of it.
00:44:30And he did win the Rookie of the Year.
00:44:31He was a valuable guy on an AL championship team.
00:44:35He just has not come close to that since.
00:44:38And I think maybe he was a meteor.
00:44:42And it happened real quick.
00:44:43And that's as good as it's ever going to be.
00:44:45But, you know.
00:44:48Well, I'm going to ask Joel Sherman to put his tinfoil hat on
00:44:51and tell us how are they going to attack the rest of this rotation
00:44:54if Luis Hill is not coming back and he's staying down.
00:44:57Is it a Yarbrough-Blackburn combination?
00:44:59Could we see one of the young prospects make it up here for a start or two?
00:45:03Yeah.
00:45:04So, I think they used Yarbrough and Blackburn over the weekend.
00:45:07I think they might have used Yarbrough twice.
00:45:09Is that correct?
00:45:10Yeah.
00:45:10Over the weekend.
00:45:12So, I think the question is what does Monday, Tuesday, and Wednesday look like this week?
00:45:18Because I think, without being positive, the Yankees are going with 14 position players
00:45:23and 12 pitchers to begin the series.
00:45:26Unless Stanton gets IL.
00:45:28But you're saying they probably don't want to ILM, right?
00:45:31I sense the move is Luis Hill down, Jason Dominguez up.
00:45:35Which means the balance goes to 14 hitters and 12 pitchers.
00:45:39And then they're going to live day by day here.
00:45:41Which is, if they don't need to use Blackburn and Yarbrough for these games,
00:45:49then they have those guys to piggyback a game if they want.
00:45:56It might be, like, look, they're going with their probably three best starters,
00:46:01depending on what you think of the...
00:46:02It's certainly Fried and Schlittler, and then what you think of Warren and Weathers
00:46:05over the next three days, guys who have given them a lot of innings.
00:46:10But I think they're just going to do the smart organization thing and live day by day.
00:46:15By the way, like, if Fried is out after an inning and a third today,
00:46:19Dominguez could go down tomorrow for a relief pitcher.
00:46:23And that will just be life.
00:46:24And, you know, like, I think they're going to play it like that.
00:46:27I do think this is an interesting moment for them if they would like to reward a young player,
00:46:36whether it's Rodriguez, Elmer Rodriguez, or Lagrange, and kind of, like, show them off to the world.
00:46:43And, like, it's right at the beginning of a, like, homestand, right?
00:46:47It would be this weekend coming up, right, is when they would need the pitcher.
00:46:51May 2nd, right?
00:46:52Saturday would be that?
00:46:53Because right now they're lining up Warren will be day three.
00:46:56They'll be off Thursday.
00:46:57Then Weathers will probably get that Friday start.
00:47:00So, you know, like, you know, when you think about it's a business also,
00:47:04they draw nice big crowds anyway.
00:47:07But would you like to draw a couple of thousand more to see Lagrange or Rodriguez's debut?
00:47:12Would you like to have more eyeballs on?
00:47:14Yes.
00:47:15For one of those games, then I think it's not impossible.
00:47:19And I think that the way that happens is they either feel like let's reward one of these kids
00:47:24or they use Blackburn or Yarborough a lot in this series and they really don't have another alternative
00:47:30unless they want to throw a complete bullpen game, which I'm sure they don't want to do
00:47:34and blow out an entire bullpen.
00:47:36So I think that I bet you they have a plan A, a plan B, and plan C and that
00:47:42the decision will be made for them.
00:47:45Yeah, no, I hear you.
00:47:47Except for if they actually want to make a commerce slash let's show one of these kids off,
00:47:54give them a little taste of the major leagues because it will help them.
00:47:57And if they think that one of those two guys, I don't even know who they play this weekend, Ryan,
00:48:01who's coming in.
00:48:02They're playing the Orioles this weekend.
00:48:05You know, like, do they want to do they think that one or the other guy really matches up well?
00:48:13Well, well, are they even built up to be a starter?
00:48:15Is it going to be a full bullpen day anyway with one of them taking the start probably on Saturday?
00:48:20With Rodrigo?
00:48:20No, I'm sorry.
00:48:21With Yarborough and Blackburn.
00:48:23Correct.
00:48:24Like, I think you're probably looking at 40 pitches each to get to 80 and they hope the sixth inning.
00:48:29Are you going to do that on the middle of the start of a 13 game stretch and 13 to
00:48:338?
00:48:33I think you probably won't.
00:48:36Yeah.
00:48:37But I don't think it's impossible.
00:48:39Sure.
00:48:40And I think it really is dictated by these next few days.
00:48:43I think that they're very curious to see Dominguez up here.
00:48:48I would be very surprised if he's not in the Monday night lineup because you don't know.
00:48:53Again, if suddenly you need a reliever, he's going back down.
00:48:56Right.
00:48:56So you want to make sure you get the game.
00:48:58Like, see what it looks like.
00:49:00There's three righty starters.
00:49:01I know that for Texas.
00:49:02I think it's Leiter DeGrom-Avaldi the next three days.
00:49:07So.
00:49:08Look, you have your horses in Fried, Schlittler, and then you got Warren going on game three.
00:49:13So.
00:49:13But I'm talking about how you're going to use Dominguez.
00:49:16I think that they, like, I'd be very surprised if, like, does he sneak Goldschmidt in against one righty here
00:49:25and make Rice the DH for one day?
00:49:28And then maybe it's a little tougher for Dominguez to play all three games.
00:49:32Possibly.
00:49:34But I think that Dominguez will start two, maybe three, because they'd like to see him.
00:49:39And I think that they're just, like, day by day.
00:49:42Do we need a reliever?
00:49:43Do we need a reliever?
00:49:44Did we have to use Blackburn?
00:49:45Do we have to use the Yarborough?
00:49:49And do they care about Commerce?
00:49:52And do they think that either of the young guys matches up well?
00:49:56They're both on the 40, man.
00:49:58You don't have to worry about that.
00:49:59Do they think either of those guys match up with the Orioles well?
00:50:04And, look, you might even have a weather decision, right?
00:50:07Like, you'd want those guys to pitch in good conditions, like on a Saturday, Sunday, whatever situation coming up.
00:50:15So I think they're just going to stay flexible.
00:50:18They probably have a preference.
00:50:22But, you know, preferences go out, you know, I wish I could tell you the general who said it.
00:50:28But essentially, you know, we have a plan, but then the battle begins.
00:50:35Yes, exactly right.
00:50:37You know, and so it's like, okay, you know, your plans get, you know, the Mets had a plan.
00:50:44And now it's kind of a little bit out the window.
00:50:48You know, life happens.
00:50:50The battles begin.
00:50:53But, you know, I'm a story guy.
00:50:58And I'd like them to bring up one of the kids because that would be a good story.
00:51:02Better than watching a, you know, a seventh starter throw 37 pitches.
00:51:07And it'd be fun for me because I'll be there Saturday.
00:51:09And hopefully they can call up one of those kids and that'd be fun to watch.
00:51:11I forget if I'm there Saturday or Sunday, but I'm there one of them.
00:51:14All right.
00:51:14Well, maybe I'll see you there on Saturday.
00:51:16If it is Saturday, it's bobblehead day.
00:51:17It's Star Wars bobblehead day, so that's why it's going to be.
00:51:20Oh, how can I miss that?
00:51:21Exactly.
00:51:21It's going to be nuts there.
00:51:23Joel.
00:51:25Joel Sherman.
00:51:26It's time for Joel's Notebook.
00:51:28And I am curious because the Yankees are going from Houston to Texas Rangers.
00:51:33In your time of covering baseball, you got anything good for me when it comes to the state of Texas
00:51:37and going down there?
00:51:40I had a tornado watch one time in Arlington.
00:51:44I remember how crazy it was.
00:51:50There was a start.
00:51:51It's so hot in Arlington.
00:51:53There was a start in Arlington.
00:51:54There's the older stadium.
00:51:55The older one, right?
00:51:56Arlington Park, right?
00:51:58Arlington Park, yeah.
00:51:59So where they had the temperature up on the scoreboard, and it was a 7 o'clock.
00:52:05So it's night.
00:52:06It was beginning night.
00:52:07Now it's July, so the sun's still out.
00:52:09And, like, the first pitch was thrown at 100 degrees, and then it went to 101 at night.
00:52:15And I was like, how's it getting hotter?
00:52:19And so I remember that.
00:52:21But my strongest thing is this is really, really gross.
00:52:24So that old Arlington Stadium, the Arlington Park, to get to the visitor's clubhouse,
00:52:33you had to go underneath the stands, right?
00:52:38You were under the stands.
00:52:39Okay.
00:52:40So, like, it was this, like, brownish-red clay that, like, kicked up dust.
00:52:46So it was like...
00:52:49And, again, it's 100 degrees, 100 humidity, the whole thing.
00:52:54But also because it was under the stands, like, hot dog droppings and things drop down there.
00:53:00And so rats, the size of, like, a medium-sized dog would be coming.
00:53:05They're running around.
00:53:06And then the visiting clubhouse, the air conditioning always backed up and was underwater.
00:53:11So you were, like, walking through water.
00:53:13Like, it was so minor league.
00:53:14And I...
00:53:15Forgive me.
00:53:16I do believe it started as a minor league stadium.
00:53:18I'm not positive.
00:53:19I think it did.
00:53:21But it was so tough to go to their clubhouse.
00:53:26It was just constantly...
00:53:28It had that smell of mildew because the carpeting was always wet from the air conditioning backing up.
00:53:34And the dust is kicking up.
00:53:37And there's, you know, you're eluding rats underneath the stadium.
00:53:41And so it was not an attractive place.
00:53:46You know, and if I was throwing in one last thing about Texas is it gets lost to time a
00:53:53little.
00:53:53There's the 30th anniversary of the Yankees winning in 96.
00:53:56And 96, I always think of as the last innocent year in the history of the Yankees.
00:54:01Because not a lot was expected of it.
00:54:05The season begins.
00:54:06They don't really know who Jeter and Rivera are.
00:54:09They certainly don't know who Rivera is.
00:54:11He's the last guy in the bullpen.
00:54:12He turns out to be kind of the best pitcher in the league that year.
00:54:17And Jeter is the rookie of the year and plays great.
00:54:20And Joe Torrey's first year or whatever.
00:54:23Like, they...
00:54:25You know, testing my memory a little bit.
00:54:28I want to say the Rangers were favored in the first round against the Yankees.
00:54:33And they actually win game one.
00:54:36I think it was a John Burkett might have pitched a complete game against them.
00:54:40And it gets lost to time because the Yankees, from that point, they win the next three.
00:54:45And they kind of, like, got fortunate.
00:54:47They won the next game either in the ninth inning or extra innings.
00:54:50The third baseman, Dean Palmer, throws a ball away.
00:54:53And they win game two.
00:54:54And then they win games three and four.
00:54:55And then I think they play Texas twice more right away in, like, 98, 99.
00:54:59And they sweep them.
00:55:00So, they lost the first game.
00:55:01And then I think they won, like, nine playoff games in a row against the Yankees.
00:55:05I'm really testing my memory.
00:55:06I should have looked all this up.
00:55:07You are right.
00:55:07They lost game one.
00:55:09John Burkett, 100%.
00:55:10They lost 6-2.
00:55:13Did he pitch a complete game, I think?
00:55:15Stand by.
00:55:16I'll confirm that right now.
00:55:17I'm pulling up the box score.
00:55:17John Burkett, nine innings.
00:55:19Gave up ten hits.
00:55:21Two runs.
00:55:22Seven strikeouts.
00:55:23One walk.
00:55:24And, yeah.
00:55:25He faced David Cohn that game.
00:55:26David Cohn gave up six runs that game.
00:55:30And then I want to say that, like, maybe Jimmy Key pitched all the game twos that year
00:55:36and pitched really well almost every time in the game twos of series.
00:55:40Game two went to extra innings.
00:55:42They won in the 12th inning, Yankees.
00:55:44On an error by Dean Palmer, right?
00:55:46That's right.
00:55:46And then Jimmy Key, I'm not seeing him in the box score here.
00:55:51Game two.
00:55:51Was it Pettit was game two then?
00:55:53Pettit was game two with Mariano, John Wetland, Graham Lloyd, Jeff Nelson, Kenny Rogers,
00:55:58to Brian Boehringer.
00:55:59And then all those bullpen guys.
00:56:03So Graham Lloyd had pitched terrible for them in the regular season after they got him and
00:56:06pitched great in the postseason.
00:56:08All of them.
00:56:09Boehringer.
00:56:10Ryan Weathers, Dad David.
00:56:12These secondary guys.
00:56:14Like, Wetland ended up winning the World Series MVP and Rivera was Rivera through the thing.
00:56:18But all of those other guys, Jeff Nelson, Boehringer, Weathers, Lloyd, pitched great for them that
00:56:27postseason.
00:56:28And then they go to â so there it's 1-1.
00:56:30And, again, you'd have to find the story.
00:56:32Jimmy Key was game three.
00:56:34Yeah.
00:56:34Well, odds on those games.
00:56:37But I think the Rangers were favorite.
00:56:41And, again, I'm testing my memory, but Bernie Williams and Juan Gonzalez, I think were not
00:56:48born far apart from each other in Puerto Rico.
00:56:54And Gonzalez was, like, a star of stars.
00:56:57He might have been, like â was he the MVP that year?
00:57:00Like, he â it was right around there.
00:57:01And that was, like, Bernie's coming out party.
00:57:04That series.
00:57:05He played â again, this all might be wrong because I'm doing it for a while.
00:57:09You're 100% right.
00:57:10Juan Gonzalez won the MVP that year in 1996.
00:57:14And then in that game three, it's funny you say that.
00:57:17Juan Gonzalez hits a home run off Jimmy Key, but Bernie Williams hit a home run as well
00:57:21on the first inning off Darren Oliver.
00:57:24Right.
00:57:24And then maybe he hit another one in game four and knocked in a bunch of runs to eliminate
00:57:28them.
00:57:29And it was, like, this feeling, like, wow.
00:57:30He went mano a mano with Juan Gonzalez, the MVP, and he played great.
00:57:36And then he was â you know, he's lost the time a little because he's not considered
00:57:39part of the core four, but he was as valuable a player to those teams as any of those guys,
00:57:46except for maybe Rivera, who was just great.
00:57:51But, like, Bernie really stood up in that postseason.
00:57:55The length of their bullpen and Bernie and â if you want to do it, the â again,
00:58:04I'm testing my memory on this.
00:58:05I did write a book about the 96 Yankees, so I have a lot of things someplace deep in my
00:58:09brain.
00:58:10But they're playing the Orioles this weekend.
00:58:13I want to say then it was all the game threes.
00:58:16Jimmy Key or it was â it was game â whatever.
00:58:21I think he gave up a home run to Todd Zeal, like, as the first or second batter.
00:58:26And then â and it was like, oh, he's such a terrible matchup for the Orioles.
00:58:30And then I don't think he gave up another hit through eight innings.
00:58:34This is the ALCS you're talking about?
00:58:36ALCS.
00:58:37And that game really turned the ALCS around.
00:58:40I think he might have matched up â did he match up with Mussina?
00:58:43And he kind of, like, went pitch for pitch.
00:58:45And Mussina might have finished second or third for the Cy Young that year.
00:58:48And was that â we're doing this.
00:58:51I can't believe anyone's going to stick with this as we're testing my â
00:58:54That's okay.
00:58:54Yes, 1996, game three, ALCS.
00:58:58Yes, yes.
00:59:00Zeal hits a homer.
00:59:01It's like the first or second batter of the game, right?
00:59:04That's correct.
00:59:05And look at the box.
00:59:06And does Key give up another â I don't know that Key gives up another base runner from there on.
00:59:10No.
00:59:11No.
00:59:12Crazy.
00:59:13And for eight â like eight â and was he pitching against Mussina?
00:59:17Yes.
00:59:18It's crazy.
00:59:19And Mussina pitch great also, but that was the game where Todd Zeal, like, tried to pump a throw to
00:59:25fool the Yankees and spiked it into the ground.
00:59:28And I think Bernie might have scored from second base.
00:59:31Like, like Bernie, who didn't have great instincts as a base runner.
00:59:34Again, that was a coming out party for Bernie.
00:59:36Like, he just played great through that whole postseason.
00:59:38And I want to say they might not have even been favorites against the Orioles.
00:59:42They certainly weren't favorites against the Braves in the World Series.
00:59:45And that's why I say it was the last innocent year for the Yankees.
00:59:47Once they win that World Series and Jeter becomes Jeter and Rivera becomes Rivera and, like, they start to, like,
00:59:53spend money.
00:59:53Like, that is not a heavy free agent team.
00:59:56Like, the free agents on that team were, like, Wade Boggs, who was sharing third base with Charlie Hayes and
01:00:01Kenny Rogers, who they were running away from as a starting pitcher.
01:00:06And that was their big free agent, guys.
01:00:08It was mainly trades and homegrown.
01:00:12And, like, I'm surprised.
01:00:14Are they not celebrating that team a lot this year?
01:00:16It's the 30th anniversary of that championship.
01:00:19And it's the last time where it felt like people outside of New York rooted for the Yankees.
01:00:25Because it was like, oh, you know, here they are.
01:00:27They're like, you know, like, Jeter really captured a lot of imagination.
01:00:30And Joe Torre's story captured a lot of imagination.
01:00:34And people rooted.
01:00:35And then they became the Beatles after they won that World Series.
01:00:38And it was the last moment of innocence for the organization 30 years ago was that.
01:00:45And they beat â and who the next two teams are, they beat Texas and Baltimore to get to the
01:00:50World Series.
01:00:51That's a good name of a â
01:00:52That was Joel's notebook a little too deep, right?
01:00:54That was â that's Joel's notebook.
01:00:55And that's also the name of this book, the age of â the last age of innocence for the New
01:00:59York Yankees.
01:01:00It was â if you'd like to, you can still buy my book on Amazon or something like that, Birth
01:01:03of a Dynasty.
01:01:04Birth of a Dynasty.
01:01:05Joel Sherman, that was an episode, man.
01:01:07We appreciate you for always hopping on here, giving us all your insight.
01:01:11We're looking forward to seeing how the Yankees handle it this week.
01:01:13There's a lot of pieces and options that are going to be working.
01:01:15And we're going to see how they pull those levers and where they go from here.
01:01:18But as always, we appreciate catching up with you.
01:01:21And we'll talk to you next week, Joel.
01:01:23Glad you're feeling better, Ryan.
01:01:24And thanks, everyone, for watching.
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