Il Delitto delle Bambine di Marsala
Il 22 ottobre del 1971 tre bambine spariscono a Marsala. Si tratta di Antonella Valenti, undici anni, Virginia e Ninfa Marchese, nove e sette anni. Con la denuncia della loro scomparsa si apre uno dei casi di cronaca nera più inquietanti della storia del dopoguerra, conosciuto anche come "il caso del mostro di Marsala". Il giudice Cesare Terranova emette il mandato d'arresto per Michele Vinci, zio di Antonella, che durante l'interrogatorio confessa di aver rapito le bambine per stuprare una di loro e di aver gettato Ninfa e Virginia in una cava all'interno di un terreno di proprietà di Giuseppe Guarrato, dove effettivamente verranno ritrovate il 9 novembre. Durante il processo, tuttavia, emergono parecchi dubbi sulle dichiarazioni fatte da Vinci, e si profila la possibilità che abbia avuto uno o più complici. Nel 1978 Michele Vinci viene riconosciuto unico colpevole del triplice omicidio e condannato a 29 anni di reclusione. Nel 1988, dal carcere dove è recluso, Vinci accetta di farsi intervistare da "Telefono giallo", confermando la versione contenuta nel suo diario scritto in carcere: Antonella sarebbe stata rapita e uccisa perché suo padre, Leonardo Valenti, aveva fatto uno sgarro a Cosa nostra. Michele Vinci, scontata la sua pena, è ora di nuovo libero, ma se la verità processuale dice che è lui il "mostro di Marsala", a 45 anni di distanza è sulla verità storica che rimangono invece aperti molti interrogativi.
1988.12.30 - Telefono giallo 1988 - Il delitto delle bambine di Marsala - Seconda Parte
#Delitto #Mostro Marsala #Crime #TrueCrime #ColdCase #Cronaca #CronacaNera #Nera #CronacaItaliana #Crimini #Criminali #CasiIrrisolti #Misteri #Mistero #Documentari #DocITA #CrimeDoc #Indagine #Giallo #Omicidio #Assassino #Killer #SerialKiller #Noir #Racconto #Cattura #CSI #CriminalMinds #SubENG #Delitto #Delitti #Crimine #Criminale #DivinumCrime #Blu #Notte #Carlo #Lucarelli #Misteri #Italiani #Documentario #Docu #Doc #DocuITA #Netflix #Streaming #SerieTV #Serie #TV #Stagione #Completa #StagioneCompleta #Tutte #Puntate #Puntata #Episodi #Episodio #Mostro #Mostri #Monster #Marsala #Sicilia #Sicily #Italia #Murder
Il 22 ottobre del 1971 tre bambine spariscono a Marsala. Si tratta di Antonella Valenti, undici anni, Virginia e Ninfa Marchese, nove e sette anni. Con la denuncia della loro scomparsa si apre uno dei casi di cronaca nera più inquietanti della storia del dopoguerra, conosciuto anche come "il caso del mostro di Marsala". Il giudice Cesare Terranova emette il mandato d'arresto per Michele Vinci, zio di Antonella, che durante l'interrogatorio confessa di aver rapito le bambine per stuprare una di loro e di aver gettato Ninfa e Virginia in una cava all'interno di un terreno di proprietà di Giuseppe Guarrato, dove effettivamente verranno ritrovate il 9 novembre. Durante il processo, tuttavia, emergono parecchi dubbi sulle dichiarazioni fatte da Vinci, e si profila la possibilità che abbia avuto uno o più complici. Nel 1978 Michele Vinci viene riconosciuto unico colpevole del triplice omicidio e condannato a 29 anni di reclusione. Nel 1988, dal carcere dove è recluso, Vinci accetta di farsi intervistare da "Telefono giallo", confermando la versione contenuta nel suo diario scritto in carcere: Antonella sarebbe stata rapita e uccisa perché suo padre, Leonardo Valenti, aveva fatto uno sgarro a Cosa nostra. Michele Vinci, scontata la sua pena, è ora di nuovo libero, ma se la verità processuale dice che è lui il "mostro di Marsala", a 45 anni di distanza è sulla verità storica che rimangono invece aperti molti interrogativi.
1988.12.30 - Telefono giallo 1988 - Il delitto delle bambine di Marsala - Seconda Parte
#Delitto #Mostro Marsala #Crime #TrueCrime #ColdCase #Cronaca #CronacaNera #Nera #CronacaItaliana #Crimini #Criminali #CasiIrrisolti #Misteri #Mistero #Documentari #DocITA #CrimeDoc #Indagine #Giallo #Omicidio #Assassino #Killer #SerialKiller #Noir #Racconto #Cattura #CSI #CriminalMinds #SubENG #Delitto #Delitti #Crimine #Criminale #DivinumCrime #Blu #Notte #Carlo #Lucarelli #Misteri #Italiani #Documentario #Docu #Doc #DocuITA #Netflix #Streaming #SerieTV #Serie #TV #Stagione #Completa #StagioneCompleta #Tutte #Puntate #Puntata #Episodi #Episodio #Mostro #Mostri #Monster #Marsala #Sicilia #Sicily #Italia #Murder
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TVTrascrizione
00:00:01Very candidly, former Marshal Nicotra tells us that he disobeyed his commander's order.
00:00:07to go and arrest Franco Nania and that some time later he had from the man's brother
00:00:13which was supposed to hold a job in a factory.
00:00:17I think this speaks for itself, I don't want to add a word.
00:00:22Instead, I would like to summarize the facts at the end of this first part.
00:00:27that we have heard up to this point.
00:00:31Ready?
00:00:31Hello, good evening, I'm Gaspari.
00:00:33Who is it? Excuse me?
00:00:34Gaspari.
00:00:35Good evening Gaspari.
00:00:36Excuse me, look, since I know Marshal Nania well
00:00:40and so I had asked why he got the job at the south wood of Marsala,
00:00:47brother Nania who then always represent them,
00:00:50the place as a custodian, I don't know as a representative, but as a custodian
00:00:54in that factory it would be to say to wood south of su petane, lifting petane practically.
00:01:00Now I know well, that is, I knew well, because now for a long time
00:01:04I don't see him in Nania anymore, I know him well...
00:01:07Which of the two?
00:01:08Which of the two?
00:01:10Excuse me?
00:01:11Which of the two?
00:01:12No.
00:01:13Which of the two did Nania know well?
00:01:15No, no, no, I'm talking about Michele Vinge right now.
00:01:18Yes?
00:01:19I know Michele Vinge well, practically since then, because I no longer have any relationships.
00:01:23Sorry, I misunderstood.
00:01:24Here, and therefore I do not consider Michele Vinge guilty at all,
00:01:30as the father of the Marquises practically believed.
00:01:34Now I am in doubt about this marshal, to beat Nicotra,
00:01:42because she can also tell me that I am also, that is, I could also have a grudge against him,
00:01:46but it is his undoubted, this Nicotra had this place of caretaker, of residence currently,
00:01:57I believe, in the South of Marsala, on the unfo sea of Marsala.
00:02:02He told us in his own words.
00:02:04Yes, but how come he had this relationship, that is, this place directly in Nicotra,
00:02:10he could have had the others too, because he is a mentioned one.
00:02:14Excuse me.
00:02:14Dear friend, what do you want me to tell you?
00:02:17She asks herself a rhetorical question.
00:02:19To this question in our minds everyone answers,
00:02:23everyone has already answered.
00:02:25But it's our inference, it's our supposition,
00:02:29and there we have to stop, in front of the open microphones,
00:02:33and to the open television cameras.
00:02:36Thank you.
00:02:37Instead, I was saying, I would like to summarize the facts that have occurred up to this point,
00:02:42because we have witnessed the progressive evolution of a version given by the guilty party,
00:02:47certainly of a part of this fact, Michele Vinci.
00:02:51I did it all by myself, I did it partly by myself because I was pressured by Nicola De Vita,
00:02:58the person who ordered the crime was called, his name is Franco Nania,
00:03:04a progressive unfolding of a thing under two contrasting impulses,
00:03:08the fear of speaking out, the fear of guilt and the punishment associated with guilt.
00:03:16The fact is that Michele Vinci in July, on July 10, 1975,
00:03:21he is sentenced by the Assize Court to life imprisonment,
00:03:24with a sentence later changed on appeal to 29 years of imprisonment.
00:03:28Today, after so much time since then,
00:03:32the foundation, the core of this story remains unexplored,
00:03:38still remains unanswered.
00:03:40Why couldn't Michele Vinci have acted alone?
00:03:45This is certainly a fact, he could not have acted alone.
00:03:48Who did he act with and why did he act?
00:03:53If we have to exclude, believing the judges themselves who judged him,
00:03:57that he had a personal interest, even if it was of a natural, twisted, passionate nature, in acting.
00:04:03He did not act alone.
00:04:05Who did he act with?
00:04:07Why did he act?
00:04:09These, I think, are the two questions.
00:04:11It's 10:01.
00:04:13The news has to go on air now.
00:04:15But before the news goes on air,
00:04:16I would like to close this first part of Telefono Giallo
00:04:19offering you a document outside the Municipality.
00:04:22Because we entered the prison three days ago,
00:04:25A Yellow Telephone troop entered the Viterbo prison
00:04:28where Michele Vinci is serving his 17th year of prison sentence
00:04:32and we asked him these questions.
00:04:35And he gave us his answer.
00:04:37And he largely repeated what we already know.
00:04:40But he added a sensational novelty
00:04:43which I ask you to listen carefully with me.
00:04:47I am Michele Vinci, the man accused of taking three vine leaves in Marsala.
00:04:53I took them, it's true,
00:04:54but I didn't kill anyone.
00:04:56I took them only on behalf of Professor Franco Nania
00:05:00and brought to the war fund
00:05:02which I delivered to Nicola De Vita.
00:05:07It all happened because
00:05:09I told my brother-in-law Valente not to leave
00:05:12that his children were in danger
00:05:13but he didn't listen to me.
00:05:16He left for Germany anyway.
00:05:18But I have to specify that when I took them
00:05:21I was assured that nothing would happen to him.
00:05:24to the poor innocent little girls.
00:05:30Before that he had organized himself
00:05:31the kidnapping of the Honorable Quillo
00:05:34which failed because I didn't want to participate.
00:05:37Also my brother-in-law Valente Leonardo
00:05:39he did not want to participate.
00:05:41So much so that I was scared
00:05:43that I also had a toy gun
00:05:46which...
00:05:47I didn't need that at all.
00:05:49I'm not a violent person
00:05:50I am not capable of hurting anyone.
00:05:53I repeat I took them
00:05:54and I took them to the war fund
00:05:56delivered to Nicola De Vita
00:05:58on behalf of Professor Franco Nania
00:05:59who threatened me
00:06:01for my wife and my family.
00:06:04Unfortunately the fear was stronger than me
00:06:06and I took them.
00:06:07I have done nothing else.
00:06:09Regarding the kidnapping in Quillo
00:06:11she had organized herself
00:06:13a meeting on the case of Professor Franco Nania
00:06:16together with Leonardo Valente
00:06:17and other people I don't know
00:06:18because he was out that night
00:06:20out of province for work.
00:06:23It's not that the company was always in the city
00:06:24I toured Palermo, Catania, Ragusa.
00:06:27I wasn't there that evening.
00:06:31However, returning to the case
00:06:33Valente tells me
00:06:34nothing more is done about it
00:06:35of the kidnapping of the Honorable Grillo
00:06:39so everything frothed up
00:06:41we backed out
00:06:42then I don't know what else happened
00:06:44between the two of them.
00:06:46I only have to take Antonella Valente
00:06:49unfortunately that day
00:06:51cursed
00:06:52they were all three together
00:06:53I had to take Valente exclusively.
00:06:58This is the shocking one
00:07:00true or not
00:07:02shocking testimony
00:07:04by Michele Vinci
00:07:05collected three days ago
00:07:07in the Viterbo prison.
00:07:09Of this testimony
00:07:11of the validity
00:07:12of the prosecution
00:07:13to what extent
00:07:14the accusation that hit him
00:07:15locked up in that prison
00:07:16can be considered well-founded
00:07:18we will discuss
00:07:19in about ten minutes
00:07:20after the news
00:07:21in the second part
00:07:22of this program.
00:07:23Thanks see you soon.
00:07:44this is a remote control
00:07:46if you click here
00:07:48your voice rises
00:07:49if you press here
00:07:50everything gets darker
00:07:52no, no, not that
00:07:54No
00:07:56this year you preferred
00:07:58Rai 1, Rai 2 and Rai 3
00:08:00you hit the right buttons
00:08:03we hope you do it again
00:08:05and we wish you happy holidays.
00:08:15Rai 1, Rai 3
00:08:59Thank you all.
00:09:21Thank you all.
00:09:39Thank you all.
00:10:10Thank you all.
00:10:37Vice President of the Justice Committee of the House, we also have a representative
00:10:41of the legislative, socialist I believe.
00:10:46Alberto Libertino Russo, Dr. Russo was the investigating judge and he is the one who sent for trial, if
00:10:56I'm not wrong, Vinci.
00:10:58And it is precisely with Dr. Russo that I would like to begin this second part, once the introduction of the guests is over.
00:11:04Then we have Esposito's lawyer that we saw, he is Vinci's defender, we saw him in the first part
00:11:10of the program.
00:11:11Paolo Marchese, Mr. Marchese is Virginia and Ninfa's father and we have already met him too.
00:11:17Thank you again, Mr. Marchese, for coming all the way here to share your testimony and your company.
00:11:23Professor Ernesto Failla is a psychiatrist, he also carried out an expert assessment.
00:11:28Then there is Lucio Galluzzo, a colleague to whom I will not give other titles because he is just a colleague.
00:11:35And finally, Professor Carlo Baroni, a pathologist we also met in the first part of the program.
00:11:43Thank you all for being here with us to discuss a live, passionate case,
00:11:49in which I tried, doing my job as a reporter, to contrast a little the theses that have emerged
00:11:56and which is now up to you to delve into.
00:11:59Doctor Russo, I would like to start with you.
00:12:02She wrote, as they say, the order for Vinci's indictment then.
00:12:08Can you summarize in a few words what conclusions you reached?
00:12:11It was many years ago, but maybe you still remember it.
00:12:16Yes, I have to tell you that, given that a judge doesn't like to talk about his job...
00:12:24Yes, but that is written in an ordinance.
00:12:26The conclusions of the educational process were in fact incomplete and unsatisfactory,
00:12:36because many aspects of the story remained unexplained,
00:12:42not explained by all that could be ascertained through the elements acquired.
00:12:50In particular, two aspects that were ultimately very relevant remained in the shadows.
00:12:58The motive, that is, why Vinci had done it, given that the psychiatric assessments concluded
00:13:05in the sense that it was not the gesture of a madman and the way in which Vinci did it remained in the shadows
00:13:15he had realized that program that he repeatedly, often contradicting himself, never saying coherent things,
00:13:26said to have done.
00:13:28He blamed himself for the crime, but was unable to explain it to the judges.
00:13:35first in education, after all I don't know anything, even if this evening I learned some news,
00:13:41he could never explain how he did it.
00:13:44That is, the motive and the practical methods of execution remained unclear during the preliminary investigation phase.
00:13:51of that complicated crime, because it was a complicated crime, there were three creatures,
00:13:55three human beings to be brought from here to her and finished off in various ways.
00:14:00When an examining magistrate, Dr. Russo, finds himself with such an incomplete investigation, what does he do?
00:14:07The investigating judge is however obliged to conclude the investigation,
00:14:12refer the case back to the trial judge.
00:14:16He cannot keep the documents until the truth is certain,
00:14:21because the accused has the right to be tried.
00:14:26On the other hand, the investigating judge's job is to prepare all the evidentiary material.
00:14:31which only the trial judge will have to evaluate.
00:14:34The investigating judge cannot reach definitive conclusions,
00:14:40submits the documents to the trial judge in their entirety.
00:14:43And if after 17 years or 16, whatever, I asked her today what her opinion is on
00:14:48that fact,
00:14:49would she tell me or not?
00:14:50No, I wouldn't tell him because I have a duty not to express an opinion.
00:14:53I expected this answer, so I gave it to him anyway.
00:14:56Attorney Rossi, you represent the civil party Valenti,
00:15:00that is, the father and mother of Antonella Valenti, 11 years old, who died in 1971.
00:15:08I know you told our collaborator while we were preparing this program
00:15:14that if we had not strongly represented this part there would have been
00:15:19on the part of the worthy particular reactions, I read from a note that was passed to me.
00:15:24What did he mean?
00:15:26I meant to say, I wanted to refer to the particular situation that had arisen.
00:15:32And that is?
00:15:33She knows that at a certain point the arrows of the press were pointed, so to speak,
00:15:41I have to say it because it's a fact.
00:15:42Say whatever you want, of course.
00:15:45Of the press in particular and of certain environments, ultimately, of the press,
00:15:51against this family.
00:15:54Against the Valenti family?
00:15:55No against the family, let's try to be more precise, I have to be more precise,
00:16:00trying to identify precisely in the person, in the person,
00:16:06first of Valenti with the story of the kidnapping of the honorable, of the attempted kidnapping of the honorable Grillo.
00:16:12Look, I always have to—excuse me, sir—I always have to summarize for the listeners' clarity.
00:16:17She is referring to it, because maybe someone only sees this part and hasn't seen the other.
00:16:20Lawyer Rossi refers to the fact that Leonardo Valenti, father of the little girl Antonella killed in Marsala,
00:16:27it had been said, somehow, that he could perhaps be implicated in an attempted kidnapping,
00:16:32then gone up in smoke, of a regional Christian Democrat deputy, the Honourable Grillo,
00:16:36and that for this reason, for not having wanted to participate in that kidnapping, the little girl had been...
00:16:40Exactly, this is the gist of the tesa.
00:16:43Yes, so what Vinci said in prison during the interview is an old story.
00:16:49It is an old story that was completely abandoned, which does not have the support of a single clue,
00:16:56of a single means of proof, of any shade of proof,
00:17:00and which therefore remains a simple dissemination of Mr. Michele Vinci,
00:17:04who in this way, I think, tried to escape his responsibilities, or at least to attenuate them.
00:17:10This, let's say, is a bit of the first version of Mr. Michele Vinci.
00:17:13The second version, I think I am exposing things with extreme objectivity,
00:17:17because I try to detach myself and see the issue in perspective, even after 17 years.
00:17:25And the second, let's say, explua was the one that however cannot be directly traced back to Vinci,
00:17:32note well, because Vinci never said this.
00:17:36He never said anything about anything.
00:17:38that there was even an implication of poor Mrs Vinci, Antonella's mother,
00:17:43about which terrible things have been said.
00:17:45Just one moment.
00:17:46Which have been radically excluded.
00:17:48That is, it was said that at a certain point this woman was having an affair, these are things that...
00:17:52We haven't mentioned it in place.
00:17:53We haven't mentioned it in place.
00:17:54We haven't mentioned it in place.
00:17:55I give you credit for that.
00:17:55I give you credit for that.
00:17:56I simply wanted to say that there was a very harsh reaction on our part.
00:18:01They were...
00:18:02The matter led to criminal proceedings that ended in convictions.
00:18:10He condemns the press exactly, I won't name them obviously,
00:18:14who have unfortunately reported these proposals.
00:18:17Defamation.
00:18:18Exactly.
00:18:18Stop here for a moment.
00:18:19He pauses here for a moment, then continues.
00:18:21Ready.
00:18:21Please.
00:18:21Good evening, I'm Franco from Rome and I'd like to ask lawyer Manfredo Rossi a question.
00:18:25To the lawyer...
00:18:26Valenti.
00:18:26Yes.
00:18:27I would like to know why Valenti, your client, comes when Vinci shouts Nania's name?
00:18:33Oh, wait a minute.
00:18:34I need to clarify this because your question is unclear.
00:18:37We saw in the video that Leonardo Valenti, Antonella's father, who you represent here,
00:18:42he faints when Vinci screams Nania's name.
00:18:48There's a photograph, we saw it instantly in the video, maybe it wasn't even noticed that much.
00:18:52I didn't even notice, frankly...
00:18:53Yes, yes, you can see it, I'm sorry, frankly it escaped me.
00:18:58Excuse me, why did Vinci have the contact?
00:19:01Then he wasn't in the queue.
00:19:02Colleague Rossi wasn't there yet.
00:19:03It wasn't there.
00:19:04Here, we'll clarify this.
00:19:05So your question, dear listener, your question should not be addressed to lawyer Rossi,
00:19:11but rather to the lawyer Marrone.
00:19:13Please, answer her.
00:19:14I must first of all, in homage to the truth, in homage to the justice of things,
00:19:22to acknowledge your civic commitment, Dr. Agessi, in this broadcast.
00:19:28It would have been truly out of the ordinary if the Vinci case had not been brought to the fore.
00:19:35from his attention, from the attention of his commitment.
00:19:37One thing is certainly certain, and it must be said, immediately after the fact, when
00:19:44Michele Vinci confessed to Cesare Terranova.
00:19:48I have to interrupt her.
00:19:49I must point out that lawyer Marrone is speaking because he was the first to defend
00:19:55the Valenti family, where the lawyer Manfredo Rossi is superseded in a second
00:19:59On this point, but very simple and very clear.
00:20:03At a certain moment, when there was that incredible and unforgettable hearing on the 27th
00:20:11November 1973, when there was that applause that had no meaning for the call
00:20:20of Corrio di Nania, but it had its own particular meaning, the monster involved other people.
00:20:27And then it happened that the tension of interest of my clients decreased, if I may say so.
00:20:35That is, the tension of interest in the expectation, in the aim of justice has decreased a little.
00:20:44So what?
00:20:44So what happened?
00:20:45I, who had assisted from the beginning with the commitment that is known to me and that is known to all
00:20:50and that is part of my temperament as a lawyer and as a man, at a certain point there are
00:20:55seen, the colleague who I particularly appreciate, Rossi, came and Rossi went down
00:21:02in a reality, he immersed himself in a reality by receiving.
00:21:07But you have to answer the listener's question, however, I'll show you again maybe if you like.
00:21:12director could send her.
00:21:13Yes, he fell, then he fell.
00:21:14No, no, I'll show you the photograph again.
00:21:16Can we air that photograph, who knows?
00:21:19Here it is.
00:21:24Here, this is Leonardo Valenti, slumped and unconscious.
00:21:28Why does Valenti have that reaction to Nania's name?
00:21:32This is all I wish you would tell me.
00:21:34But I believe that this is not the reaction of Valenti, Leonardo Valenti, to Corrio's call
00:21:41from Nania, this reaction.
00:21:42But the fact that, and I leave it to the intelligence of him and of those who listen to me, the fact that
00:21:49opened up new horizons in investigative research.
00:21:54Are you following me?
00:21:55All this caused a reaction in Valenti and Leonardo.
00:21:59He even collapsed and fell, he practically fell next to me.
00:22:05Attorney Esposito, do you agree?
00:22:07It also collapsed when Michele Vinci was sentenced to prison and they took him away.
00:22:13taken away.
00:22:14And Michele Vinci shouted, you have to say he's really brave, he knows it.
00:22:21And it collapsed there too.
00:22:23What did you think he meant by that cry, Mr. Marquis?
00:22:29But I don't know, what's the point of falling apart when it has nothing to do with, you know, if the conscience
00:22:36he cleaned it.
00:22:38Certain.
00:22:39I don't know.
00:22:41Esposito, you want to answer this after the phone call.
00:22:44Ready?
00:22:45Ready?
00:22:45Yes.
00:22:46I'm Gilberto, I wanted to ask Attorney Marrone a question.
00:22:50To lawyer Marrone?
00:22:51Yes.
00:22:52At the time, that is, about 15 years ago, I saw a news program where he hypothesized...
00:23:00He Brown.
00:23:00Lui Marrone hypothesized in a very precise interview that Vinci had had, and he said it
00:23:09with extreme certainty, an accomplice and a mastermind.
00:23:13Yes, yes.
00:23:13I wanted to ask him if this is the reason why he was rejected by the Valenti and replaced by
00:23:21Manfredo Rossi.
00:23:22Thank you.
00:23:23Attorney Marrone, why were you rejected by your relatives and replaced by Manfredo Rossi?
00:23:28Because I didn't lend myself to giving credence to the series of complaints against the press.
00:23:36Because there was a very specific plan on the part of the Valentis, after the hearing
00:23:42of the 26th, sue all the newspapers.
00:23:44Since I am a defender of some newspapers, I refused.
00:23:48It's also a question of scene.
00:23:49Galluzzo, here we talk about newspapers, Manfredo Rossi is said later.
00:23:53I have something to say, it's very difficult to explain, I'll try to be very brief.
00:23:59Yes, we are very brief.
00:24:00Even today there is a strong problem in the Valenti family, regarding the crime, that
00:24:11that Mrs. Valenti's honor has been called into question.
00:24:15But we don't talk about this.
00:24:16Yes, we don't talk, but look, it's important because it's the basis, according to
00:24:24my very humble opinion, on the termination of the mandate to Attorney Marrone, who believed
00:24:30the prevailing issue at that time was not so much to establish whether the lady was, but rather to ascertain who they were.
00:24:36the accomplices.
00:24:36Manfredo Rossi, you must first clarify the facts.
00:24:40Please.
00:24:40In a few words, with your well-known gift of synthesis, tell us what we are talking about.
00:24:45What's this about Mrs. Maria Valenti?
00:24:49What is this shadow?
00:24:50But just look at the newspapers of the time, the newspapers of the time, I repeat, we do not do
00:24:56names because it would be unpleasant, but can you remind us of them?
00:24:58No, okay, the newspapers of the time said some atrocious things, that is, they said that this
00:25:04poor mother at a certain point had had a relationship that was nothing less than illicit, then she emigrated
00:25:13in Germany to escape the grips of this relationship.
00:25:19They would have even kidnapped and killed the child to force her to return and nothing
00:25:24less so her, getting out of the car she was in, in which she had gone,
00:25:31he was returning to Marsala from Palermo, he is said to have said the phrase you recalled.
00:25:37They said it and they did it.
00:25:38They said it and they did it.
00:25:39Now in this regard I ask if it is ever possible that a mother insulted in this
00:25:46way after what he had experienced he could remain without reacting in the firmest way against
00:25:52these were lies, but the most vulgar lies I would almost say.
00:25:56Excuse me, I wanted to add another question.
00:25:58But isn't there a reason to recall this fact here?
00:26:02Because the issue is so real that as soon as the complaints started this campaign
00:26:07of printing ceased, inevitably.
00:26:09But that's not the process.
00:26:10And I wanted to add...
00:26:11Wait, may my colleague allow me?
00:26:14Happy New Year straight away.
00:26:15I wanted to add a small detail.
00:26:17It may not be the trial, but it is certainly a vital issue for the Valenti family,
00:26:24of exceptional importance.
00:26:25This yes.
00:26:26Here, perfectly.
00:26:27And I believe that a civil party lawyer should protect the interests.
00:26:31One last thing, if I may, I'll finish right away.
00:26:35She had remembered the deposition of that certain Cucchetti,
00:26:39what Mrs. Valenti had said they said and did.
00:26:45Now, I would like to point out that Cucchetti was immediately denounced for false testimony.
00:26:50and escaped condemnation only because he recanted what he had declared.
00:26:57Here, look, I have right before my eyes a page from a certain memorial.
00:27:02where he stated that he had reported this disclosure
00:27:07in the exact words, in the euphoria of the moment
00:27:10where everyone appeared to be informed and under the psychological influence of journalists and TV
00:27:17asking for clemency for his carelessness.
00:27:19In other words, it had come into being, precisely as a result of a certain campaign,
00:27:24a certain climate of expectation, for which it became almost natural
00:27:30make this final point with that sentence
00:27:33«put it in this poor woman's mouth».
00:27:34Lawyer, I'll ask you...
00:27:36Please.
00:27:36Please excuse me for a moment, just one more second.
00:27:39Please.
00:27:39I asked her something first, I wasn't sure if she answered me or not.
00:27:42The specific reactions, what were they, what could they have been?
00:27:48Ready?
00:27:49Ready?
00:27:50Hello, this is Judge Cassata.
00:27:52Excuse me?
00:27:53Judge Cassata.
00:27:55Judge Cassata.
00:27:56Judge Cassata.
00:27:58Good evening, Judge.
00:27:58Good evening.
00:27:59He made the closing speech.
00:28:00He made the closing speech.
00:28:01I made the closing statement, exactly.
00:28:03And I think there are a few inaccuracies in his transition.
00:28:07Undoubtedly.
00:28:08First of all, the first inaccuracy I noticed is the one regarding the autopsy.
00:28:14and external view.
00:28:16Doctor Bellafiore, when you execute not a death certificate, but in technical terms
00:28:24it's called the so-called external view, that is, it's the view that the autopsy involves...
00:28:29Judge, I can tell you that this matter has already been clarified by the direct intervention
00:28:34of Bellafiore?
00:28:35I would move on to success.
00:28:50I'd move on to the next point, because this one seems resolved to me, right?
00:28:52Another subsequent point is the one you speak of General Dallachiesa.
00:28:56As far as I remember, General Dallachiesa only showed up at night, when
00:29:02these little girls were found and General Dallachiesa came…
00:29:05Colonel, he was colonel on the subject.
00:29:07Then he was a colonel, a finance colonel, several police commissioners came.
00:29:11By the way, Vinci's confession seems to me to be a true confession.
00:29:16Why?
00:29:17Why Vinci, when Terranova interrogated him and he confessed…
00:29:26Excuse me, judge, excuse me, judge, I ask you some questions for clarification every now and then.
00:29:32for the listener.
00:29:33She talks about Vinci's first confession.
00:29:36Is this what he's talking about?
00:29:37Yes, it's Vinci's first confession.
00:29:39Go ahead.
00:29:40This is Vinci's second confession, and there is now a final sentence.
00:29:43No, he changed his version later on.
00:29:45Go ahead, sorry.
00:29:47The other point I wanted to clarify was the Cucchetti issue, but I hope it was
00:29:54clarified by Attorney Rossi.
00:29:56Yes, exactly.
00:29:59Thanks for calling, Judge.
00:30:00Please, the image.
00:30:01Good work.
00:30:03Lawyer Avagna.
00:30:04Let's hope no one interrupts her again.
00:30:06Please.
00:30:07No, I was saying, I was quietly showing a certain intolerance, because by remaining still
00:30:15as my colleague, my illustrious colleague Rossi, said, that the civil party's defense lawyer must
00:30:21protect the honor of the party he represents, it seems to me, and therefore I agree, I would be careful about it
00:30:27well, I would be very careful about that.
00:30:29But it seems to me that we are here this evening for something else, the rest of us are here this
00:30:34evening to see if there are any, this is the spirit of the show, if there are such elements,
00:30:40new ones, which could reopen this legal case.
00:30:44My friends, we all know that there is a final judgment, the illustrious one knows it
00:30:50Attorney Esposito.
00:30:51Attorney Avagna, you've hit the nail on the head.
00:30:54This is the question that runs deep in our...
00:30:57Exactly, and so I want to tell you this, as a lawyer, because I don't want to split the lines
00:31:02my role, I am here as a lawyer, I have modestly protected the interests
00:31:08of the Marchese family together with other illustrious colleagues who it is right to say, especially the lawyer
00:31:14Cino Traina and Salvatore Traina, and initially also Senator Pellegrino, the lawyer.
00:31:21The crux of the matter, there are these new elements, it seems to me, and the lawyer also said so
00:31:30Esposito a little while ago, these new elements are not there, because in a second version, of course,
00:31:36the second version, after having affirmed his full responsibility, as said the
00:31:41Judge Cassata, as confirmed by the indictment, as confirmed by the
00:31:48first instance ruling, second instance ruling of the Court of Appeal of Palermo
00:31:53which sentenced him to 30 years, after the referral to another court in Messina which sentenced him to
00:31:5828 years old, then you win during the preliminary investigation, first pre-trial and then post-trial
00:32:06he gave a further version, saying that there was the famous instigator.
00:32:10And everything he said this evening, that we heard, I heard for the
00:32:14first time, as I think everyone, from the prisons of Viterbo, is nothing other than what he said
00:32:21in that famous skit, I call it skit, of the Court of Assizes of Trapani.
00:32:28So there are no new elements, the reality is that everything that Vinci said is not true
00:32:35suffrage in the procedural documents, because the criminal trial, my dear friend, is
00:32:40a very serious thing, we can discuss everything, but in a democratic system, woe betide
00:32:45if in the criminal process we give in to insinuations, scandalism, all that
00:32:51that people say, because at this point we will certainly no longer have legal certainty, it is judged
00:32:57according to what's in the court documents. I'll let myself finish, the court documents say
00:33:02that all those things for example scandalous and that this evening make one think of an instruction
00:33:09Prejudicial and fallacious judicial opinions are not true. This evening you have addressed the issue again.
00:33:16of the disappearance of Hans Hoffman, but it was clarified that Hans Hoffman did not disappear at all, it was
00:33:24It was clarified that Hans Hoffman was called to work in Germany after three months.
00:33:30and it was made clear that the Carabinieri knew Hans Hoffman's address.
00:33:37Lawyer, he told us.
00:33:39Leave aside what he said, but this is also in the trial documents. Leave aside.
00:33:42what they said, they must say in the trial, the witnesses must say in the
00:33:47preliminary investigation documents. The preliminary investigation documents state that Hans Hoffman was called to go
00:33:52in Germany and that the police knew the address. So insist, insist.
00:33:57saying but he disappeared in a suspicious manner, this arouses suspicion and does not provide certainty of the law.
00:34:04First element, I want to go further.
00:34:05No, no, I have to answer you. You keep in mind what you're about to say, but I'll answer you.
00:34:08right away. First of all, I didn't say he disappeared suspiciously. There's the lineup of...
00:34:11No, no, others said it, not that she said it. Second, second.
00:34:13This fact is under the process, I would look at it carefully. Second, you are doing the right thing, you
00:34:18Second. They said it, they said it, the process has been said. Second, you're right.
00:34:22to defend as you, men of law, must the iron form of the process, but if it allows
00:34:30I, who am not a man of law, but I defend the iron law, I understand your point.
00:34:36view, but I also allow myself to add any element, wherever it comes from
00:34:40that I can acquire. In this case, the newly acquired element is a statement by Hoffman,
00:34:46which you have all heard with your own ears, as I heard it in this broadcast,
00:34:50in which he says, I think I have to leave, because I thought it better that I
00:34:54I moved away.
00:34:56Does it seem serious to you to continue talking, because it would be very serious, about the famous Sicilian phrase
00:35:05ludissi and l'uffici, because ludissi and l'uffici must be explained to Italian citizens, is
00:35:10to practically mean that there is a mystery underneath, which practically had already been
00:35:15I said before that there could be a mafia crime, as has been hypothesized. Now let me
00:35:20come to please. Does it seem serious to you to insist on this, when then, as you rightly said
00:35:24said our excellent colleague Rossi, we have had from the trial documents the clear proof that
00:35:29Cucchetti had lied, he went through a trial and in the end he said, I didn't want to do bad things
00:35:35figure, since everyone seemed to be informed by the facts. Now it seems to me that this does not contribute
00:35:40seriousness neither to justice nor to the specific facts. We agree on this, right?
00:35:45Yes, hello. We'll take it back now. Hello? Yes, hello. Here we go. I had called
00:35:52First, I met Vinci twelve years ago. Yes. In prison. I recognized him now.
00:36:01He had to say his name, though. They know it at the switchboard. A democracy isn't...
00:36:04Okay. No, sorry, I have to stop. These phone calls, lawyer, lawyer, sorry, I have to give
00:36:11a response to lawyer Alagna, who is also vice president of the justice commission
00:36:16of the Chamber. Attorney Alagna, these calls seem anonymous, but they aren't. To be precise,
00:36:23We make these calls, RAI makes them. I mean, they call...
00:36:27This clarification is useful for the citizens, for those who listen to it. They call,
00:36:31we call back, also because since they are sometimes on air for a quarter of an hour, for the
00:36:37Make them spend the money, RAI will spend the money. But if this could be done...
00:36:42Then you know who I am. Perhaps you could have imagined this.
00:36:46Hello? Tell me. I met him twelve years ago. Yes. But I didn't say that.
00:36:54Huh? Sorry sir, we were a little distracted here with the studio animation. Do you want to start over?
00:37:00Very briefly and at a slightly faster pace. Yes, I have a bit of a cold.
00:37:05Yes, but try to cheer up, because otherwise I'm already here...
00:37:08Well, I'm excited because I know him well and I can also tell him that he's currently on leave too.
00:37:16Vinci. Yes. What point do you want to get to?
00:37:19He confided in me. It might be strange that the person, when he's inside, is all innocent.
00:37:25But in certain situations, at certain moments, a person cannot tell lies.
00:37:30Yes. What is the confidence you have gathered?
00:37:32The confidences are what I've more or less heard.
00:37:37This one, I don't remember if it's precise, a sister or sister-in-law who came from abroad.
00:37:42In short, he didn't speak because he was afraid.
00:37:47He says, I'm alive inside. If I speak, I'm dead.
00:37:53I'm watching TV, but I don't...
00:37:56And the phone, but I can't hear anything. Hello?
00:37:59All right, we are listening to him very carefully.
00:38:05This is the confession she collected.
00:38:08Yes, but many who are also in good...
00:38:11We thank you, despite...
00:38:12No, then I wanted to ask a question to the lawyer who was speaking now.
00:38:17You see miscarriages of justice, right?
00:38:19If a trial were held now in Vinci, would the same trial find him guilty?
00:38:25Now we ask him.
00:38:27Attorney Alagna, would you consider starting the trial over again today...
00:38:31According to the trial documents that I have studied, certainly, also because I would like to add them,
00:38:36that there was talk of a flawed investigation.
00:38:39Every investigation is evidently carried out by men.
00:38:41The Russian judge is a man, in my opinion he is an excellent magistrate, but being a man he could also make mistakes.
00:38:47In my opinion, however, the real mistake was that in the preliminary investigation,
00:38:53even if theoretically it has been said that not much attention has been paid to it and not much thought has been given to it,
00:39:01on the famous report of the well-known marshal, who said a lot of things about the family
00:39:08Valenti, on Nania, on the enterprise.
00:39:11Now I know about these things about the Marshal, because I am well informed, I will only tell you that.
00:39:15what Judge Cassata said in his closing speech, there are three words and I want to read them,
00:39:19because evidently all the magistrates, I tell you this, precisely on the relationship, the relationship
00:39:24number 132-101 of Brotolo, contains, contains, you should know this too, contains
00:39:31real propagations that border on the fantastic since not only do they not find
00:39:38in the documents there is no evidence, neither objective nor subjective, but even no connection
00:39:44and connection with the facts for which proceedings are being taken against Vinci and Guarrato.
00:39:49And then according to article 349 of the public penal code and article 141 it said they must not be
00:39:54not even mentioned, because they are anonymous, everything was based on this, because wanting
00:40:00or unwillingly everything was based on it, and from this all those things that are derived
00:40:03derivatives and we could even end up with her or I being responsible too.
00:40:08Thank you, Attorney Alagna. We'll speak to Attorney Esposito right after the phone call. Ready?
00:40:12Good evening, I'm calling from Milan. I'd like to ask a question. I'd like to know exactly...
00:40:17Mr. Alagna, a little discipline, please. How was Vinci's accusation of mania dismissed?
00:40:25Excuse me, madam, but Mr. Alagna was speaking and I couldn't hear the beginning of your question.
00:40:30I said, the accusation that Vinci made about the mania, how was it dismissed? What does the mania involve?
00:40:37his innocence?
00:40:38Well, this is a good question and we ask it to Attorney Esposito, even if he is not the right person
00:40:43more suitable, thank you.
00:40:44Let's ask the defenders of mania.
00:40:47Let's ask the defenders...
00:40:48Are there defenders of mania?
00:40:49There are no defenders of mania.
00:40:50There are none, he has no defenders, I can take over the...
00:40:53No, but can you tell us a fact, an objective fact, because mania, on the basis of which
00:40:58elements, nania, was acquitted?
00:41:01In my opinion, in a very particular setting of the trial that was conducted against Nania, that is
00:41:06it was hypothesized, fallaciously, that the whole episode had arisen from a relationship between the nania
00:41:14and Mrs. Valenti.
00:41:16This was, I never even remotely considered the possibility that this was
00:41:22a real hypothesis.
00:41:23And what hypothesis instead?
00:41:24So, having instructed the process in this sense, he obviously ascertained that there was no
00:41:31there was no adulterous relationship between Mrs. Nania and Mrs. Valenti,
00:41:37to whom I take this opportunity to send my feelings of esteem, not hypocritical, but real,
00:41:44because it is definitely a...
00:41:45And the?
00:41:45Between Mrs. Valenti and?
00:41:47The nania.
00:41:48And the nania.
00:41:49It's clear.
00:41:49This is the play, is he talking about the investigation done by Dr. Russo?
00:41:52I'm talking about the investigation carried out after Danilo was found guilty of incompetence.
00:41:57I understand.
00:41:58So, having only done this investigation, it was possible to come to the truth that there was no
00:42:04relationship and from this perspective particularly...
00:42:10I move on, I move on.
00:42:11Yes, I'm moving on, but...
00:42:12And this is a television studio, lawyer?
00:42:15There are things to do.
00:42:16Yes, please explain.
00:42:17She goes on calmly.
00:42:19So, necessarily, we came to ascertain what was already known, at least in my opinion.
00:42:25to see, that there was no relationship.
00:42:27Consequently, under this hypothesis, the nania was acquitted.
00:42:32He was acquitted.
00:42:32Indeed, it was written in the sentence, if you win, he will have had accomplices, everyone can be
00:42:38states, as long as in Danilo.
00:42:40However, since I finally managed to get the floor, I would like to clarify two things,
00:42:49if I may, briefly.
00:42:50First of all, this cannot be the place to put anyone on trial.
00:42:54Of course.
00:42:56Nor can any speech be aimed at incriminating or reviving theories of guilt.
00:43:05of Tizio or of Cai.
00:43:06This is the first thing.
00:43:08They are all victims.
00:43:09The poor Marquis is the victim, the brave men are the victims.
00:43:13Marquis for sure.
00:43:14Professor Nania is also a victim, until proven otherwise.
00:43:21But what we are discussing, we must fix it immediately, because it is useless for the colleague
00:43:26he warms up and says what are the new elements for which the reconstruction carried out by the
00:43:32the sentence is no longer reliable.
00:43:35We must talk about those reconstructions, about those facts that the sentence takes for granted.
00:43:40I want to hear you, Marrone and Manfredo Rossi say, without getting heated, of course,
00:43:47that you believe that two little girls can fall 60 feet and remain unharmed.
00:43:53I want to hear you say it, you have to say it now to this audience where your people are.
00:44:00readers, where there are 3 million, 4 million people who hear us.
00:44:04I want to hear you say, for me it's true that two little girls can fall and remain
00:44:09unharmed.
00:44:10I want to hear it said.
00:44:12Can you say that?
00:44:13Yes.
00:44:13But in a word though.
00:44:15No, first of all I have to say that deodontically...
00:44:19Difficult word.
00:44:20No, from ethics.
00:44:22Sorry, we're not going to dwell on this.
00:44:23I say no, we're stopping.
00:44:25It is not nice to bring up my role as a member of parliament because I said here that I do not
00:44:29I am here as a member of parliament.
00:44:32I have to say that my colleague is unaware or wants to pretend to be unaware that there is an expert opinion.
00:44:38who said how the girls could have fallen from 18 meters, having a body weight
00:44:45of 20 kilos and not 70, which is the average weight for men, and having a soft pillow
00:44:51of 2 meters it was also possible to verify that they remained damaged however apparently, because
00:44:57the colleague knows that it has even been hypothesized that there were skull fractures, that there were injuries.
00:45:03If the trial does not exist, but you have not read the trial, and the girls did not have
00:45:10not even a scratch, they had no internal lessons, they had no pecuniary detachments, they had no
00:45:15nothing these girls.
00:45:17No, no, wait, don't take my word away, excuse me.
00:45:20Well, let's assume that the two people are the things, but no, what procedural papers, but
00:45:27they don't exist for the calmer, but don't be sorry, you're talking to me about the lively Teresa, not
00:45:33you're talking to me about the project, you're not talking to me about the project, but no, they have this meaning,
00:45:37the little girls were I mean, she got used to doing theatre my friend, yes in fact, she plays in the
00:45:41company.
00:45:43Alagna, we are here in front of millions of viewers.
00:45:47But then let's stick to the trial, and grandpa to the accusations, but then I'll pull them out for you
00:45:54I'll read the trial documents to you, but let's not talk nonsense, keep doing theater.
00:46:02Lawyer Esposito, lawyer Alagna answered you, this is what I wanted to say, you said,
00:46:07Excuse me, please, you said, you believe, lawyer Alagna, that little girls can, and
00:46:12He said yes, well, he believes this, it's a matter of faith, we can't argue.
00:46:17I wanted to add another thing that is important, that he knows that you can also enter the quarry
00:46:21another part, the rule, the rule, the lawyer, it is important for her too, but if you can get in
00:46:28in the quarry on the other side, you can exit the quarry from that side.
00:46:32And when he tells us to shut up, we don't shut up, because we're not respecting the rule.
00:46:37Lawyer Alagna and Lawyer Esposito are rightly passionate, I understand them, about the place
00:46:42Maybe they would do something, I would do the same, but they should definitely listen to a little bit of something,
00:46:48otherwise I am forced, I don't know, to do things that you in Parliament are perhaps used to,
00:46:53but we're just in a television studio.
00:46:57Hello, excuse me madam, I have to say that this is called the yellow phone, because this phone
00:47:03yellow rings every now and then. And there's the listener, who is the one who pays the license fee to RAI.
00:47:09and we have to stay up.
00:47:11Excuse me, madam, please bear with me, we were digressing.
00:47:15Good evening, I've been following your show for some time now. First of all, I'd like to compliment you.
00:47:21And let's get straight to the point, for goodness sake.
00:47:24As?
00:47:24Let's get to the point, for goodness sake.
00:47:26Yes, so I wanted to know, if they had to hit the brave ones, just for the scaro let's say
00:47:32immediately because they had not arrived at the Grillo kidnapping, why take all three
00:47:40the girls?
00:47:41We have this...
00:47:41Then don't do it on a subsequent day.
00:47:42Madam, this is in fact a tragic question that you ask, which we have already tried to answer.
00:47:49to answer. You say it, I say it. Vinci said it, Vinci says, he arrived
00:47:56at a certain point, I'm told take Antonella, take Antonella, take Antonella, the man arrives
00:48:01of the bitter that is Nicola De Vita, I since Antonella was also with the girls, the marquise
00:48:07I took all three and brought them. I made a mistake, he repeated it, etc.
00:48:10I believe, it's my interpretation, give it the value you want, that in a certain way
00:48:16sense that Vinci foolishly, like a fool, wanted to set up a sort of insurance
00:48:24on the life of his granddaughter, carrying three, he will have thought, you will see that they will not have the courage
00:48:31to harm even three children.
00:48:33No, no, no, I don't know if...
00:48:34Then let her say it.
00:48:36It's a meaning that doesn't hold up, absolutely, because if they wanted to hit the brave ones
00:48:41understanding Antonella, I took it the next day, then at the limit you know very well
00:48:45that these things happen every day, that is, a story like this doesn't hold up,
00:48:51that is, it just doesn't give up.
00:48:53It's an opinion.
00:48:53There is no such argument, in my opinion.
00:48:56Thank you, ma'am. I didn't answer directly because my voice was gone for a moment.
00:49:00Lawyer exposed, then there's Galluzzo and then there's Dr. Russi.
00:49:04Okay, the verdict says the girls fell, there was a cushion of leaves, it's not
00:49:11they are done nothing.
00:49:12Here it should be explained that this is a crazy thesis because there were some spikes,
00:49:16the girls fell 18 meters or more, so that's about six floors, they had to determine,
00:49:21Is there a doctor who can tell you about compression injuries, girls are particularly susceptible?
00:49:26dedicated to that age in the growth zones, nothing of this kind was found.
00:49:30All right, let's assume, as Alagna claims, that the girls arrive unharmed, miraculously.
00:49:36unharmed on the doctor.
00:49:38Perfect.
00:49:39I didn't say that.
00:49:39No, stunned, how do they arrive?
00:49:41It results from the trial.
00:49:43No, you don't know how it turns out from the trial.
00:49:45But don't be offensive, that's not the way to think.
00:49:47But if you tell me it results from the trial, it isn't there.
00:49:50But it's not serious for a lawyer to tell his colleague you don't know.
00:49:52But leave me alone, I'm talking to the process.
00:49:55You are a presumptuous person.
00:49:56But leave aside who I am, you are presumptuous.
00:49:59But you're talking nonsense.
00:50:01We want to hear...
00:50:05They're coming, I can finish.
00:50:07You are not at peace.
00:50:08You are not at peace, you are not at peace.
00:50:09You are not at peace, you are not at peace.
00:50:10You are not at peace, you are not at peace.
00:50:10You are not at peace, you are not at peace.
00:50:11Don't insult me, don't insult me.
00:50:13I would like to say a few things.
00:50:15The third time you do something to make me angry.
00:50:17No, go away, I feel very angry.
00:50:18You are not at peace.
00:50:19No, I would like...
00:50:20Nobody is at peace.
00:50:21Neither of you are at peace.
00:50:22I would like...
00:50:22You are both rightly involved, taken in your part.
00:50:26I don't allow myself to say...
00:50:27I don't know, I don't know.
00:50:28This kind of makes you...
00:50:29I apologize.
00:50:30I didn't allow myself to tell her that she doesn't know things.
00:50:32But natural.
00:50:33But then again, we don't know things.
00:50:35We've said everything we know, there's nothing else.
00:50:37Please.
00:50:38But finish.
00:50:39Conclude.
00:50:40They arrive unharmed.
00:50:41Is that clear?
00:50:42What do the girls find in Guarrato's house?
00:50:45But please, don't put me on trial.
00:50:49No, no, I'm asking you.
00:50:49You know everything.
00:50:50No, no, I'm not...
00:50:51What is found?
00:50:52There is the possibility of accessing light, water and a staircase that is difficult to find.
00:50:59practicable, because there is the other access, from which they could exit.
00:51:03Malone, be quiet for a moment, let's finish.
00:51:05It's clear.
00:51:07From which they could escape.
00:51:08They would have broken their legs, they would have fallen, but they would undoubtedly have made an attempt.
00:51:13of this kind.
00:51:13Instead, what do we have from the autopsy findings?
00:51:16That the girls were found 10 meters further down, in the dark, and we found them,
00:51:23we see them, infected by dipteran larvae, in an area where, according to all the experts,
00:51:28since there was no light, the flies could not descend.
00:51:33Not only that, we find that one is heavily infested, the other almost not at all, and we find them
00:51:40set in a certain way, that is, the child who died first is found on top
00:51:46to the little girl who died later.
00:51:49And we find that one of these little girls, missing the panties that are worn 10 meters more
00:51:54over there, almost to simulate, given that there was the monster lurking, even some paperwork.
00:52:00A violence.
00:52:01And these things we must.
00:52:03In conclusion, what is your conclusion? Two words.
00:52:06The theory is that the girls were brought in dead and were the bait for a trap,
00:52:12into which Vinci falls.
00:52:13Galluzzo.
00:52:14Ah, sorry Galluzzo.
00:52:15Ready?
00:52:16Ready?
00:52:17And good evening, I'm Lorenzo Damilano.
00:52:19Yes, Lorenzo Damilano.
00:52:20Medieval name.
00:52:21I ask this kind of question, that is, whether an attempt was reported, that is, in those years
00:52:28of seizure against the Honourable Grillo.
00:52:32Has it been reported?
00:52:33I mean, no, I say no, I ask, since it was said by Vinci, right?
00:52:38Now, the question is, what kind of investigation has been done on this alleged attempt to
00:52:44kidnapping?
00:52:45No investigation.
00:52:46No investigation, Mr. Lorenzo.
00:52:48Then we'll explain, if you'll give me the floor, why.
00:52:51Excuse me, I wonder, someone says something like that, in my opinion, well, I'm not saying much,
00:52:57but a little investigation should also be done.
00:52:59The investigation was not done, Dr. Russo, an investigation was done on what
00:53:03does she know?
00:53:04No, I'm just saying, for your information.
00:53:05The episode is completely new to me, that is, I am not, I am just learning about this circumstance.
00:53:10tonight, Vinci will evidently have said it at a later stage.
00:53:13At a later stage of the investigation conducted by her.
00:53:15Here, thank you, thank you Mr. Lorenzo.
00:53:17Exactly, exactly.
00:53:17The answer to the Milanese listener's pertinent question is no investigation.
00:53:24Galluzzo, finally.
00:53:25I would like to give a very brief response to Attorney Rossi.
00:53:27Please.
00:53:28Very short.
00:53:29Do everything.
00:53:30What your colleague, the Honourable Alagna, suggests to me.
00:53:34The newspapers spoke badly of Maria Valenti, but the lawyer Alagna tells us that there were
00:53:43police reports, which were later disproved, which spoke badly of Valenti.
00:53:49So the newspapers you rightly sued did their job.
00:53:53There's one thing I don't understand in this debate.
00:53:55And to tell the truth, lawyer, in this whole legal affair I have never understood a thing.
00:54:02thing, not as a journalist, but as a citizen.
00:54:04Because the interests of the civil parties and the defense of Michele Vinci, who could not
00:54:11certainly be exempt from a very serious sentence, because it is not necessary to demonstrate the
00:54:16his responsibility, have not been to a certain extent in the path of interests
00:54:22absolutely coincident.
00:54:23And I would like to point out something to you, which is physically missing in this television studio, I wouldn't want to
00:54:29to go and interpret Levi-Straussian actions.
00:54:32She is physically missed, but for me the Valenti family that she represents is a sign.
00:54:37It's missing here.
00:54:38And once again, Honorable and Counsel, you are in conflict.
00:54:43And frankly I cannot understand why the civil party and Vinci's defense should not
00:54:50to travel a part of the way together in the search for the truth beyond any reasonable doubt,
00:54:57to then arrive at dividing up the quantification of the penalty.
00:55:01Russian.
00:55:03And I really wanted to go back a little bit because I had been called into question a little bit
00:55:09indirectly from the Honorable Lawyer Alagna and to make just one clarification that I believe
00:55:15it greatly benefits the cause of information that you are concerned with.
00:55:20That is, we often indulge in the assertion that the judge is wrong and the judge is not wrong.
00:55:27I must point out, not to defend the category, but that there are no judges who make mistakes or
00:55:32judges who guess.
00:55:34There are judges who evaluate what emerges from the trial.
00:55:37And not only that, it is also physiological that judges who see the facts in a certain way then come
00:55:48disavowed in subsequent degrees.
00:55:51So it's not like we can say that at a certain point someone made a mistake in conducting the
00:56:00investigations in the preliminary phase, in the subsequent phase and in the phase after that
00:56:05which I did not participate in because, as you pointed out, I stopped at the stage
00:56:11in which Vinci was still mute, he did not speak, he did not want to reveal any version that was
00:56:18compatible with the results of the process.
00:56:22Thank you.
00:56:22Lawyer Marrone, then I would like to hear Ferracuti and Failla on who this person is that they have analyzed.
00:56:29Win.
00:56:30I would like to hear their opinion on this gentleman we are talking about.
00:56:33Excuse me, lawyer.
00:56:34I would just like, Doctor Augias...
00:56:36I remember that Attorney Marrone is the civil party attorney for the Valenti family.
00:56:40Special Prosecutor of the Valentis.
00:56:42I would like to say this, I would like to conclude with a premise.
00:56:46It seems like a contradiction in terms, but it isn't.
00:56:49That is, the interruption of the lovely man so loved by me, colleague Rossi, was
00:56:57to a factual circumstance that I felt it necessary to clarify.
00:57:03But whoever lived through this whole story from the beginning to the first deaths has a question:
00:57:09in one's own conscience, in one's honesty as a citizen, lover of truth and inclined to
00:57:17search for the truth in this whole affair, illustrious Mr. Dr. Corrado Augias,
00:57:24There is a basic flaw in this story.
00:57:26It's good that we all agree here.
00:57:28It is the flaw of lack of investigative procedures that lies at the root.
00:57:32When Mr. Vinci confessed, eh forgive me, he confessed to the poor unforgettable
00:57:40Judge Terranova is accused of being the author of the crimes,
00:57:45well, Terranova packed everything up and that was it for the instructor.
00:57:48At a certain point there was this complete friction, this fracture
00:57:53with what should have been, in my opinion, further research.
00:57:57I asked myself a question and I ask it to you who conducts so magnificently
00:58:02this one's own.
00:58:03But please.
00:58:03And that's it.
00:58:04This hallucinatory, this chilling episode is more yellow
00:58:11for what was not done.
00:58:15Or it's more yellow for what has been done badly.
00:58:19This is what I address to the conscience.
00:58:22I don't know the answer.
00:58:23Certainly, Doctor Russo, I would like to express my deepest sympathy.
00:58:29I've seen that we all exchange compliments here, even on New Year's Eve.
00:58:33My deepest sympathy and unconditional respect.
00:58:37Surely...
00:58:38Here, just a moment, I'll come to you right away.
00:58:41One certainly has the impression that in its phase, in the subsequent ones,
00:58:46in the phase before her, the Terranova phase,
00:58:49not everything that could be ascertained was ascertained.
00:58:53There is no such thing.
00:58:55Your arms drop a little.
00:58:57Your arms drop a little.
00:58:58This is the drama of Italian justice.
00:58:59This is the drama of Italian justice.
00:59:02I have to give the floor to Attorney Rossi after he called.
00:59:05If I have to answer. Hello?
00:59:06Ready?
00:59:07Yes.
00:59:08Good evening.
00:59:08She's alive.
00:59:09I am Alessandro from Rome.
00:59:11Yes.
00:59:11I have two curiosities that arose during the broadcast.
00:59:14Please explain them clearly.
00:59:15Yes, I'll be very brief.
00:59:17The first is...
00:59:18There has often been talk of an honourable Grillo.
00:59:20I would like to know practically...
00:59:22I mean, I mean...
00:59:23Why...
00:59:24That is, a hypothetical kidnapping could have been planned against him.
00:59:28That is, what motivations could there have been.
00:59:29Now we will try to understand it.
00:59:31We see.
00:59:31Then...
00:59:31And then a doubt came to me.
00:59:33I wanted to know...
00:59:35I mean, it's normal for a Carabinieri marshal to refuse to respect one...
00:59:39Already.
00:59:39That's a good question.
00:59:41I wanted to do it.
00:59:41Then I forgot about it.
00:59:42Thanks for reminding me.
00:59:44Until we meet again.
00:59:44Thanks for remembering me.
00:59:46The Honourable Grillo was a Christian Democrat regional deputy against whom an attempt was made
00:59:50a kidnapping.
00:59:50Apparently, they tell us, no one has investigated so no one can answer today...
00:59:55No, no, I could explain what importance it has in this matter.
00:59:58Here, Attorney Esposito explains it to us.
00:59:59Now, in this context, in this process there are a myriad of other things that
01:00:04they are not convincing, a few days before the sentence and even before the speeches,
01:00:10as we heard Michele Vinci calls the journalist and tells him look, everything
01:00:14it was born, that the kidnapping of the Honorable Grillo had been organized.
01:00:19The journalist calls the public prosecutor Giacomo Ciaccio Montalto who was
01:00:24the Public Prosecutor and who then the next day, I think, also communicates it
01:00:29to me.
01:00:29We were deeply shocked because we didn't understand what this had to do with it.
01:00:36The Honorable Grillo is a good person, he is not a rich person, so it was not clear
01:00:41what he was aiming for.
01:00:44The kidnapping or the plan of the ventilated kidnapping, on the other hand, becomes clear, at least in our
01:00:51thesis, ten or nine days after the first instance sentence that condemned Vinci to life imprisonment,
01:00:59because Luigi Corleo, father-in-law of the powerful tax collectors salvo of Salemi, was kidnapped.
01:01:07I understand.
01:01:08One moment.
01:01:09Did you understand?
01:01:10But how do you explain the connection?
01:01:12I would like to say it.
01:01:12Say it quickly.
01:01:14Quickly.
01:01:14The Honourable Grillo, we must give him credit for this courage, he has never denied nor remained silent
01:01:21that he had a special relationship with Nino Salvo, so much so that he was the only parliamentarian
01:01:26who attended his funeral.
01:01:29Then it was understood that the rumored kidnapping of Grillo could actually be a kidnapping
01:01:39of the mafia to hit the Salvos, so much so that this is supported by the circumstance
01:01:45that after the Corleo kidnapping in the province of Marsala there were approximately 18 or 20 murders
01:01:52Trapani.
01:01:52I mean, well, it's a wish I make for the city of Marsala.
01:01:55I explained to myself that I was becoming a province.
01:01:57Thank you so much.
01:01:58This is clear.
01:01:59It's very clear.
01:02:01Lawyer or whoever can answer, maybe Dr. Russo, Marshal Nicotra
01:02:07he does not obey the order of his captain who tells him to go and arrest, but he can
01:02:12can a Carabinieri marshal do something like that?
01:02:15This is one of the new things I learned this evening.
01:02:18So, if...
01:02:19It's a shocking evening.
01:02:21Shocking.
01:02:22You see, coming to Rome gives us strong emotions.
01:02:26I have to agree with you that it is certainly not a legal act.
01:02:30It is not a legal act.
01:02:31And it seems to me that it was also inappropriate for him to then accept a position.
01:02:37Well, let's say at least a little or very little.
01:02:40This, but...
01:02:41A marshal cannot refuse.
01:02:43I think this can be said.
01:02:44A marshal cannot refuse.
01:02:45Surely...
01:02:45He shouldn't have accepted the job from the brother of the gentleman who was supposed to arrest the Carabinieri.
01:02:51Apparently he did this afterwards.
01:02:53I know it even now, me too.
01:02:54All right.
01:02:55He did this later, after he retired.
01:02:57Yes, very briefly.
01:02:58Excuse me, lawyer.
01:02:59Please.
01:02:59Just a quick phone call from our listener.
01:03:02Yes?
01:03:03Ready?
01:03:04I am Nicotra, Marshal Nicotra.
01:03:06Ah, Marshal Nicotra.
01:03:07Ah, Marshal Nicotra.
01:03:09Good evening, Marshal.
01:03:10I am called into question...
01:03:11Thank goodness he called.
01:03:12That's better.
01:03:14Eh...
01:03:14But I am referring above all to this statement that I could or could not repeat to myself to arrest
01:03:19they do it in Dania.
01:03:20Exact.
01:03:21Please clarify your ideas for us.
01:03:23Since it was a police detective story, I could have arrested Dania only with a specific
01:03:29arrest warrant.
01:03:30The arrest order was given as the type of arrest to be made.
01:03:37But a simple order from the Captain of the Company Commander to say with arrests
01:03:41Mudflag, arrest mudflag, would have for me, would have attested to me a responsibility
01:03:47that then perhaps this arrest would have been in vain.
01:03:50Meaning it could also have been an illegal arrest.
01:03:52I understand.
01:03:53But the fact that this defendant in the hearing is accused of having as an accomplice or as a principal
01:03:58or like what he wants the mudlania, for me it was not something that could be
01:04:04accepted like this.
01:04:07Thank you Marshal Nicola for calling him, but I have to tell you that while you were speaking there was
01:04:11Doctor Russo who disagreed a little with what she was saying.
01:04:16Dr. Russo will remember that I went to his house one day and told him that perhaps not
01:04:21I still remember it.
01:04:22He doesn't remember, nod your head.
01:04:24He had come to visit me three times at the barracks, perhaps to confess his crime.
01:04:31Twice he didn't find me, the third time he did.
01:04:35Only he had the courage to tell me, look Marshal, I did this, I did that.
01:04:39He told me.
01:04:41He told you that you did call me, what does he end up doing?
01:04:43Come and say hello, Marshal.
01:04:45And he's gone.
01:04:46Marshal Nicola, thanks for the clarification.
01:04:48The fact remains that we believe, I believe that by accepting that job,
01:04:52from the brother of the man he was supposed to arrest.
01:04:54Well, there's one more thing I want to clarify.
01:04:56I didn't like that thing there.
01:04:58She didn't like it, but it's not like I accepted because I needed this job,
01:05:04at least.
01:05:05It was a favor that I did for Michele Vinci, excuse me, for Franco Nania or for Nania.
01:05:10In the sense that I entered into life not to earn what he had to earn,
01:05:15as it is said that he had had the billaccio and billets.
01:05:18I didn't get anything from anyone, because I did my duty.
01:05:20The duty I did was not only done by me, because I acted with a group of collaborators,
01:05:27still the eldest, the highest ranking, with a group of collaborators and therefore
01:05:33No one could specify my actions.
01:05:36My work is noturro.
01:05:38I did my duty to take pictures of Franco Nania's shot,
01:05:42which then in fact the result can be strange to the eye.
01:05:46Thank you, Marshal.
01:05:47Thank you so much.
01:05:48We still need to clarify, doctor.
01:05:50Yes.
01:05:50As for Maestro Grillo, it was never talked about at the beginning,
01:05:54I talked about it recently, I remembered it five years ago, so I was already retired.
01:05:59It was said that the vice in the place of this translation from a garcere to the eye,
01:06:04from a garcere to the eye, from a garcere to the owner, etc.,
01:06:06he told a Carabinieri school that this teacher must not support Grillo.
01:06:11Thank you, Marshal.
01:06:13Thank you for calling and giving us this clarification.
01:06:17because we were a little shocked by it.
01:06:19Lawyer Rossi.
01:06:20Very briefly, three things.
01:06:22The first is this.
01:06:23I am a man of law like Alagna, like Sposito, like Marrone,
01:06:28and so I can't...
01:06:30Like Russian.
01:06:30Oh, sure.
01:06:31Excuse me.
01:06:32I speak as a lawyer.
01:06:34Especially as a Russian.
01:06:35I was talking about lawyers.
01:06:36Judges are above us, for goodness sake.
01:06:38So I can't give substance to hypotheses, I have to stick to the facts of the case,
01:06:42the facts of the case are those...
01:06:43And let's see them.
01:06:44And that's fine.
01:06:46Second clarification.
01:06:48They remained indebted to him for an answer
01:06:51because she had asked me for some explanation about a sentence
01:06:55which I would have said in relation to Valenti's reaction.
01:07:00Particular reactions.
01:07:01They might have specifics...
01:07:02But of course.
01:07:03The thing was referred to, now regardless of the type of expression used,
01:07:07He was referring to the fact that a man who is insulted in that way...
01:07:12At that time.
01:07:12Of course, to the press campaign...
01:07:15She understands that a man who at a certain point can also lose his head and react
01:07:18because when at a certain point his personal honor is brought into play,
01:07:21the wife's honor, the family's honor,
01:07:23she will realize what her reaction may be.
01:07:27The third and final clarification I would like to make is a response I owe to Dr. Galluzzo.
01:07:35Doctor Galluzzo asks me why at a certain point Valenti's civil defense
01:07:43didn't accompany each other for a while, let's say.
01:07:46For part of the road with the defense of Michele Vinci.
01:07:50I'll let you know that things are a bit difficult, let's say, when certain events of such gravity occur.
01:07:55that there may even be company for a stretch of the road,
01:07:59it can be difficult, even if the opposite can be conceivable.
01:08:03But when at a certain point Mr. Michele Vinci began to hint at alternative routes,
01:08:12in the presence of other people, there was the simultaneous outbreak of the press campaign
01:08:18which led in that direction, that is, the direction we saw,
01:08:23that is, Valenti's poor wife, brought into the affair in that ignoble, scandalous way that everyone recognizes today.
01:08:30So inevitably this fracture was determined, which is a fracture that not only aimed,
01:08:35I apologize, which was not only aimed at the condemnation of the guilty, just and exemplary,
01:08:42but which also aimed at the condemnation of those who defamed in that incredible way.
01:08:47I would like, since it's 11:13 and we have to close in the space of a few minutes,
01:08:57I would like to give, then you will maybe take a few words, but I give it to the lawyer Esposito,
01:09:04you see I was coming from your side, so that you can answer this question in conclusion,
01:09:10but come on, Vinci, this Vinci we're talking about, does he have an alibi for October 21st or not?
01:09:16of 71?
01:09:17In my opinion he has it, because the whole murder of Antonella Valenti is part of a pre-ordained execution
01:09:27which is independent of the murder of an individual, of the action of an individual.
01:09:32There is a short circuit near the time of death, there is a lack of…
01:09:40Can I say something about the short circuit?
01:09:42It has proven…
01:09:43After I finish…
01:09:44Please…
01:09:44If I may…
01:09:45Then if you give me your word…
01:09:46Yes, yes…
01:09:47After I finish…
01:09:48Be quick so Alagna can speak too…
01:09:50And he gives an alibi because he's right in Valenti's house...
01:09:54There is a lack of causality because it was later demonstrated that there is none…
01:09:59There is no movement…
01:10:00There is no…
01:10:00And Dr. Russo already had this in his first facility…
01:10:04There is this…
01:10:05This…
01:10:06This…
01:10:06This murder which in a certain sense is ritual…
01:10:09This tape, as Dr. Giulio Bertino Russo had already pointed out…
01:10:12Which covers the eyes, the mouth, the ears…
01:10:15Almost a stone in the mouth, here it is…
01:10:18And so all this leads to the conclusion that Michele Vinci, not having a causal…
01:10:25He was probably only able to carry out the part of the crime that led to Antonella's kidnapping...
01:10:31And unfortunately the other two little girls…
01:10:34Alagna a word…
01:10:35The short circuit problem…
01:10:37It was hypothesized that on the evening of the day the little girl was taken to the deserted school in Contrada Mabilina…
01:10:45A short circuit was deliberately and intentionally created to facilitate darkness…
01:10:49Well, it is amply demonstrated by the trial documents that the uninhabited school…
01:10:54Of course it's dark because there's no street lighting…
01:10:58So what was the short circuit for?
01:11:01And so…
01:11:02Go and read the court documents…
01:11:06Dr. Russo responds…
01:11:08And the whole area that was in the dark…
01:11:10A former mayor of Marsala tells you...
01:11:12Twice mayor then I tell you…
01:11:14It was the dark area…
01:11:16It's not like that…
01:11:17It's not like that…
01:11:19Viewers of Marsala in the province of Trapani…
01:11:22The whole area was in darkness…
01:11:24It falls on the shoulders of the public administrator…
01:11:27Certain…
01:11:27I take responsibility…
01:11:29But the area was completely dark…
01:11:30So the short circuit was irrelevant…
01:11:33I'm sorry, I don't speak anymore...
01:11:35And I have to say one thing…
01:11:38You have to give me a minute…
01:11:40Because the episode of the light which is procedurally confirmed…
01:11:43It has a relevance if you place it in time…
01:11:48And this short circuit would have occurred during the night…
01:11:53Between…
01:11:53I don't know…
01:11:54The day before the baby was discovered…
01:11:58The discovery was on October 26th…
01:12:01On the night between the 25th and 26th…
01:12:03Exactly the next night…
01:12:05I remember having ascertained then…
01:12:08Listening to the Enel manager himself…
01:12:12That this short circuit could not have been accidental…
01:12:17That is, he had been provoked…
01:12:19Painfully…
01:12:20This certainly doesn't mean it should be linked to someone's activity…
01:12:24It means it was intentional…
01:12:25Aimed at that…
01:12:26It was certainly a hoax wanted by someone…
01:12:30Alagna, we have at least achieved a small certainty on this point…
01:12:33I understand that Carini said that 80% of these cases happen by accident…
01:12:38It's the burnt agave stem…
01:12:41But it had two parts…
01:12:42But still the area was in darkness…
01:12:44No…
01:12:44The area was in darkness…
01:12:45The area was served…
01:12:46The area was in darkness…
01:13:08Thank you…
01:13:08The road wasn't electrified…
01:13:11In short, he deliberately caused an accident to turn off light bulbs that didn't exist...
01:13:15No…
01:13:15Maybe they wanted to turn off other things…
01:13:17But that area where there was the abandoned school…
01:13:19Where Antonella was found…
01:13:20It was dark…
01:13:21There was no street lighting…
01:13:23But there was lighting in the houses…
01:13:25You have to say it…
01:13:26And every house had a lamp in front…
01:13:28All the houses inhabited by that school were no less than 50-100 meters away…
01:13:34That is, nothing…
01:13:34For a ride…
01:13:35Professor Ferracuti…
01:13:36She didn't open her mouth…
01:13:38We had her come so she could tell us who Vinci was…
01:13:41And she didn't tell us…
01:13:42But I want to tell you quickly…
01:13:44I play by the rules of the game…
01:13:46She respects Fino…
01:13:47I must say that she compensates for the lawyer Alagna…
01:13:52You look at me…
01:13:55The history of the appraisals are…
01:13:57Alagna compensates and exposes…
01:13:57Thank you…
01:14:00Sorry, I'm interrupting you...
01:14:01Please…
01:14:01The history of the Vinci appraisals is a unique one…
01:14:04But not entirely unusual…
01:14:07There was an initial assessment…
01:14:09Experts, Professor Rubino…
01:14:12I…
01:14:13And Professor Pinelli…
01:14:16Which ended with mixed results…
01:14:18That is, Professor Pinelli and I concluded that he was semi-insane…
01:14:22Based on a series…
01:14:24I'm not going to cut it with medical terms...
01:14:26Various things…
01:14:27The most serious one…
01:14:29It was an oligophrenia…
01:14:32Professor Rubino concluded for a…
01:14:34Total liability…
01:14:36Total liability…
01:14:37That is, he was healthy…
01:14:38Integral capacity…
01:14:56That ordering a second appraisal…
01:14:57Which is carried out by a college in Naples…
01:15:00And here's Professor Failla…
01:15:01Which can explain to you…
01:15:03On appeal…
01:15:05The Neapolitan aperitif ended with complete health…
01:15:10I have to tell you that to conclude everything…
01:15:12On appeal…
01:15:13Vice was found to be semi-insane…
01:15:16Semi-mentally ill…
01:15:26From colleagues Ferracuti, Pinelli and Rubino…
01:15:29And we did not find any such elements…
01:15:32Ultimately the judge asks us…
01:15:34Not only…
01:15:35The existence of disorders…
01:15:37But if these disorders…
01:15:38They reach such a level of infirmity…
01:15:40By ability you mean wanting…
01:15:43In Vinci there was actually a leukocyte anomaly…
01:15:47Absolutely free of…
01:15:49What does it mean…
01:15:49A disorder of the blood cells…
01:15:51Some white blood cells…
01:15:53There were graph elements…
01:15:55Not specific to the geofrogram election…
01:15:58We did not find any of these elements in the set…
01:16:01And above all I would like to say…
01:16:03In Michele Vinci's existential analysis…
01:16:06In in-depth conversations with him…
01:16:08In the dynamics of the events that occurred…
01:16:11And in the way Vinci projected himself into the events that had taken place…
01:16:14On the other hand I would say…
01:16:15That everything that happened after our expertise…
01:16:19To conclude with the episode we heard this evening…
01:16:23That is, to end up with the short film…
01:16:25What you showed us…
01:16:27It proves in the end…
01:16:28Michele Vinci's ability…
01:16:31Not only to self-determine…
01:16:33And here I would like to say that oligophrenia…
01:16:35That the oligophrenia predicted by the first experts…
01:16:39It wasn't oligophrenia…
01:16:41But it was a modest cultural indigence…
01:16:43Also in relation to the standard of living…
01:16:46Who had waited for Vinci…
01:16:47Certain…
01:16:47So from all these elements…
01:16:49We found the non-existence…
01:16:51Of any interference…
01:16:52On his free will…
01:16:54So…
01:16:54If he was the killer…
01:16:56He was responsible for his crime…
01:16:57Here you are…
01:16:58Let's go back to Professor Rubino's thesis...
01:17:01Let's go back to the poor…
01:17:02He was less healthy…
01:17:03Excuse me…
01:17:03I would like to know from the professor…
01:17:05Ferracuti…
01:17:06Ferracuti…
01:17:07This relationship with the…
01:17:09Cesare Terranova…
01:17:12But…
01:17:14Judge Terranova…
01:17:17He remained…
01:17:18Let's say…
01:17:19Dissatisfied…
01:17:20Of our expert findings…
01:17:22And he verbally manifested to me…
01:17:23This dissatisfaction of his…
01:17:25In what sense?
01:17:26Literally…
01:17:27You snatched it from our hands…
01:17:30To Professor Pinelli…
01:17:32And to me…
01:17:33What he says…
01:17:34In short…
01:17:34That's how it is…
01:17:35It's right there…
01:17:36The conclusion is right there…
01:17:38Doctor Giauso…
01:17:39Meaning what?
01:17:39That is, the one that at a certain moment…
01:17:42A proposition like this…
01:17:44Put in the mouth of poor Cesare Terranova…
01:17:48Perhaps it sums up its most authentic meaning…
01:17:51The instructor's shortcomings…
01:17:52Thank you…
01:17:52In fact he complained about the result…
01:17:54No…
01:17:54Alagna, sorry, I have to close…
01:17:55Be patient…
01:17:56She can read it…
01:17:57No…
01:17:57I don't want to read it...
01:17:58What Professor Rubino says…
01:18:00But I can imagine it, yes…
01:18:01That is, beating a sex addict…
01:18:04Yes…
01:18:04Beating a sex addict…
01:18:06He had the ability to understand and want…
01:18:08Yes…
01:18:08Failla told us this…
01:18:09And the minority expert also said the first thing…
01:18:12Yes…
01:18:13Fascinating…
01:18:14Attorney Esposito…
01:18:14We have to close…
01:18:15It's 11.22am…
01:18:16I would like us to close…
01:18:17Mr. Marquis…
01:18:18I would like us to close with your answer…
01:18:22She of all the people here…
01:18:23Including me…
01:18:24Actually, me first…
01:18:25He's the one who has the best title to speak…
01:18:28She's leaving this studio…
01:18:31Today, December 30, 1988…
01:18:34A little less…
01:18:35A little more…
01:18:36Embittered…
01:18:37How he got in…
01:18:38What effect did it have on you…
01:18:40Join this discussion…
01:18:42Not bitter…
01:18:44Perhaps…
01:18:44It arrived a little tired to me…
01:18:46Because since this morning…
01:18:47Certain…
01:18:48Around…
01:18:50What effect did this discussion have on you?
01:18:53The effect…
01:18:54First of all it's a pleasure…
01:18:56To meet…
01:18:58To you others…
01:19:00Then the effect is always the same…
01:19:04That…
01:19:05That the truth…
01:19:08I think we closed ago…
01:19:10Drying…
01:19:11Chasing away…
01:19:12Put it…
01:19:13Put it…
01:19:14Available…
01:19:15Because here…
01:19:16If I speak…
01:19:17With all the tour…
01:19:18It could go…
01:19:19That I'm wrong…
01:19:20But…
01:19:21Michael wins…
01:19:22Alone is…
01:19:23I…
01:19:24I'm first…
01:19:25I who…
01:19:25I don't believe it…
01:19:26That Michele wins alone…
01:19:28Who did all this…
01:19:32Thank you…
01:19:33Gentleman…
01:19:33Let's end here...
01:19:34It's December 30, 1988…
01:19:37Tomorrow the year ends…
01:19:38Let's end this one here...
01:19:39Yellow telephone transmission…
01:19:41I make mine…
01:19:42Paolo Marchese's question…
01:19:44Michael Vinci…
01:19:45He may have done everything he did alone…
01:19:47With this for goodness sake…
01:19:48I'm just expressing a very poor personal opinion...
01:19:51Based on nothing but what you've heard…
01:19:54Everything we know about this case…
01:19:56We said it…
01:19:57Or 98% we said it…
01:19:59And it's there…
01:20:00Certainly a case that has been going on for 17 years…
01:20:03It leaves us deeply dissatisfied today…
01:20:05My opinion as a citizen…
01:20:08Of a man in the street…
01:20:09Of a man in the street…
01:20:09As Barone said before…
01:20:11Of newspaper reader…
01:20:12Even before being a journalist…
01:20:14It's just that in this process…
01:20:16It has not been done…
01:20:17We're talking about many years ago...
01:20:19Not everything has been done…
01:20:20Very little of what could have been done has been done…
01:20:23To know the truth…
01:20:25Let's wish each other a Happy 1989...
01:20:28Let's do it because with this justice...
01:20:30We all need it very much…
01:20:32Next Friday…
01:20:34Yellow phone…
01:20:35It's not on the air...
01:20:36We will resume our program…
01:20:37Second Friday of January…
01:20:40The 13th…
01:20:40With another case involving…
01:20:42Southern Italy…
01:20:44Thank you…
01:20:46Until we meet again…
01:20:57It's Antonella's story...
01:21:02The belly of Maressala…
01:21:07And of Ninpe and Virginia sisters...
01:21:10That I sing to you with pain…
01:21:14It's the story of the people…
01:21:18Which every day is forced…
01:21:22To leave one's country…
01:21:26For bread look elsewhere…
01:21:34Antonella's father and mother…
01:21:38They emigrated to Germany…
01:21:44And so his belly…
01:21:48Creating a better tomorrow…
01:21:51The valiant ones his daughter…
01:21:55They entrusted it to the grandmother…
01:21:59The family is large…
01:22:03And there's no work in town...
01:22:11Antonella every morning…
01:22:15He went to school…
01:22:18But an ugly man was eyeing her…
01:22:22With the thought of wickedness…
01:22:26With Virginia and her sister…
01:22:30The belly was walking…
01:22:34But a car…
01:22:36He approached the three little girls…
01:22:39On that day…
01:22:45It was blue…
01:22:47The Cinquecento…
01:22:50Testify…
01:22:51A gas station attendant…
01:22:54With three little girls…
01:22:55Moving…
01:22:57That were waving…
01:22:58The ma…
01:23:02The search begins…
01:23:05While the poor parents…
01:23:09At sea salt…
01:23:11They're back…
01:23:13With the train of pain…
01:23:19With dogs…
01:23:22Policemen…
01:23:24Squinzagliati…
01:23:26To sniff…
01:23:28Every mother wants to hope…
01:23:31Which can be found…
01:23:35Which can be found…
01:23:36But that thread of hope…
01:23:39It broke in a flash…
01:23:43They found on the ground…
01:23:47Only one flower trampled…
01:23:57Only one flower trampled…
01:23:58Only one flower trampled…
01:23:59Only one flower trampled…
01:24:00Only one flower trampled…
01:24:01Only one flower trampled…
01:24:02Only one flower trampled…
01:24:03Only one flower trampled…
01:24:04Only one flower trampled…
01:24:05Only one flower trampled…
01:24:06Only one flower trampled…
01:24:06Only one flower trampled…
01:24:07Only one flower trampled…
01:24:07Thank you.
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