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Great Books is an hour-long documentary and biography program that aired on The Learning Channel. The series was a project co-created by Walter Cronkite and television producer Jonathan Ward under a deal they had with their company Cronkite Ward, The Discovery Channel, and The Learning Channel. Premiering on September 8, 1993, to coincide with International Literacy Day, the series took in-depth looks at some of literature's greatest fiction and nonfiction books, along with the authors who created them. Most of the narration was provided by Donald Sutherland.
Episodes feature insights from historians, scholars, novelists, artists, writers, and filmmakers who were directly influenced by the books showcased and discussed.
Alice in Wonderland, by Lewis Carroll, is examined. Included: state-of-the-art computer animation, reenactments and puppets illustrate the story.
Episodes feature insights from historians, scholars, novelists, artists, writers, and filmmakers who were directly influenced by the books showcased and discussed.
Alice in Wonderland, by Lewis Carroll, is examined. Included: state-of-the-art computer animation, reenactments and puppets illustrate the story.
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LearningTranscript
00:02There are some absolute truths.
00:07The meaning of life is elusive.
00:11Childhood is fleeting.
00:14And following white rabbits is a dangerous pastime.
00:32Oh, my ears and whiskers, how late it's getting.
00:37You're nothing but a thing in his dreams.
00:41I wonder if I shall fall right through the earth in the earth.
00:45You may just as well say, I like what I get is the same as I get what I like.
00:50I can't explain myself because I'm not myself, you see.
00:53All the ways about here belong to me.
00:55Beware the jail walker, my son, the jaws that bite, the claws that catch.
00:59A whole person was more than a mile high.
01:01To leave the court with her.
01:04If you're going to turn into a pig, I'll have nothing more to do with you.
01:08It's ridiculous to leave me the conversation to the pudding.
01:10We're all mad here. I'm mad at your mad.
01:14What is the use of a book without pictures and conversations?
01:17Conversations, sessions, sessions, sessions.
01:40Both the two, each and two who have a good time.
01:42Horror, music and stayed.
01:46Who knows the room for hours.
01:51What is the name for your mother?
01:56We'll be right back for them being a friend.
01:57Our families and elders and elders show enemies,
01:59that are obviously as the people who are to belong here.
02:07It was a sunny, languid 4th of July in 1862.
02:12Charles Dodgson took Alice Little and her two sisters on a boat ride down the River Thames.
02:18As he had often done before, Dodgson began to tell a story.
02:26I distinctly remember how in a desperate attempt to strike out some new line of fairy lore,
02:32I had sent my heroine straight down a rabbit hole without the least idea what was to happen afterwards.
02:42That moment of magic on the river created a world that would change the landscape of childhood.
02:48It is a book which has become embedded in our culture.
02:53It's very difficult to find anybody on the street who hasn't heard of Alice in Wonderland
02:57or knows something about the characters, even if they've never read the book.
03:02Those who have read the book will never forget Alice's trip to Wonderland,
03:07a place where sizes shift and cats grin,
03:11where a mad hatter serves high tea and the Queen of Hearts plays flamingo croquet.
03:19And that was just the beginning.
03:21In a second book, Alice passes through the looking-glass into a huge chess game
03:26and is confronted with creatures as strange as the Jabberwock
03:29and as familiar as Humpty Dumpty.
03:34Alice's adventures have stirred the imagination of readers worldwide.
03:38Next to the Bible and Shakespeare,
03:41Alice in Wonderland and Through the Looking-Glass
03:43are the most quoted books in the English language.
03:48Jeshapus, would you tell me please which way I ought to go from here?
03:52That depends a good deal on where you want to get to.
03:56I don't much care where.
03:57Then it doesn't matter which way you go.
04:00So long as I get somewhere.
04:02Oh, you're sure to do that if you only walk long enough.
04:14Lewis Carroll, pen name of the Reverend Charles Lutwidge Dodson,
04:18found his way to Oxford University as a student.
04:22After graduation, he received a fellowship,
04:25giving him the privilege of spending the rest of his life there.
04:29As a mathematics professor,
04:31Carroll was a shy, stammering Victorian gentleman,
04:35never married and deeply religious.
04:38I don't think that he would have been easy to get on with.
04:42He had very stern and rigid ideas about how one should behave
04:48and how one should live and about relationships.
04:53He, very formal in his way, especially with adults.
04:59As creator of Wonderland, he was quite a different man.
05:03Playful, irreverent and passionately interested
05:06in the entertainment of little girls.
05:10He likes all children as long as they're girls.
05:13He's not too happy with boys.
05:16There's no sort of evidence why that should happen.
05:19Yes, he's from a large family and there are seven sisters,
05:22but there are also three brothers,
05:23so he gets on very well with.
05:26As a human being, he is spooky, I think.
05:30One of his little girlfriends says that,
05:33a very clever man with the heart of, you know,
05:36the brain of a very clever man and the heart of a child.
05:39And still, then, that's how he was.
05:41And, of course, much of his life was in that sense, I think.
05:43Very, I was going to say abnormal, but that's awful.
05:45What's normal?
05:46Let me say eccentric.
05:50Carol met the family of Henry Little
05:52at Oxford University in 1856.
05:55Mr. Little was dean of Christchurch,
05:57the college where Carol taught mathematics.
06:00Here we go, darling, and all we wish,
06:03and all we wish, and all we wish.
06:05Here we go, darling, and all we wish,
06:07and all we wish.
06:09From upstairs at Christchurch Library,
06:12Carol one day, by chance,
06:13caught a glimpse of the dean's daughters at play.
06:16He noted the day in his diary.
06:18They made quite an impression.
06:21The three little girls were in the garden most of the time,
06:24and we became excellent friends.
06:26I mark this day with a white stone.
06:31It was four-year-old Alice Liddy,
06:33who Carol found especially captivating.
06:36So much so, she inspired her own immortality.
06:40After Alice had said,
06:42Mr. Dodson, would you write that story down for me?
06:46Clearly, a request he could not refuse.
06:49He spent the following day
06:52writing all the chapter headings out,
06:54very carefully noting all the main features of the book.
06:59But what kind of a book was Carol writing?
07:03Are Alice's adventures a joyful celebration of the absurd?
07:08Are the haunting dreams of a tormented author?
07:12Alice dodges easy answers.
07:16She's drowning in tears and platypuses
07:19and doors being closed on her
07:22and things getting larger and smaller
07:23and swimming through keyholes
07:25and off with your head
07:26and decks of soldier cards falling apart.
07:29And she reacts to it,
07:31but it's all sort of fascinating.
07:35And there's a part of her that seems to enjoy
07:41and want more of it.
07:43It's a thirst, a curiosity, a thirst for life
07:46in all its forms.
07:59What a curious feeling.
08:01It must be shutting up like a telescope.
08:03And so it was indeed.
08:05She was now only ten inches high
08:08and her face brightened up
08:09at the thought that she was now the right size
08:12for going through the little door
08:13into the lovely garden.
08:16Alice in Wonderland is really an allegory
08:19of the journey of life, in a way,
08:21or the journey of a child growing up.
08:24And he's saying to that child,
08:26stick with it, you'll come through all right.
08:31It took Carol two and a half years
08:33to finish the story after that fateful boating trip.
08:37For Christmas 1864,
08:39Carol presented Alice the gift of
08:41Alice's Adventures Underground,
08:44written and illustrated in his own hand.
08:46The accuracy of his animal drawings
08:49was a result of hours spent studying natural history books.
08:53Prompted by friends,
08:55Carol was convinced to expand his tale
08:57and get it published.
08:58But he was dissatisfied with his original illustrations
09:02and went looking for a professional artist.
09:06Each as well.
09:08John Tennille's drawings
09:09had become as famous as the story itself.
09:12Published in 1865
09:13and renamed
09:15Alice's Adventures in Wonderland.
09:20It's strange enough,
09:21there was more comment on the Tennille pictures
09:24rather than the Alice text.
09:25Because Tennille was very well known,
09:27whereas Lewis Carroll wasn't.
09:28Tennille was known as a punch cartoonist.
09:31And this was his first venture
09:34into that type of book.
09:35And I think people were intrigued by that.
09:38And again, it does reflect
09:39how seriously Lewis Carroll took the book
09:41that he chose
09:42as one of the leading cartoonists
09:44in the whole country.
09:46Which is quite unusual.
09:50Tennille's drawings were so popular
09:52that Carol convinced him to illustrate
09:55through the looking glass as well.
10:08Artists by the hundreds
10:10have followed Tennille's lead
10:11in bringing the story to life.
10:13The foundation was laid
10:15for an empire of Alice's.
10:36Alice has inspired ballet and puppet shows,
10:40theater and music videos.
10:43One of the more unusual adaptations
10:46is this 1966 Jonathan Miller film,
10:49which explores the dark
10:51and dreamlike elements of the story.
11:13How queer everything is today.
11:16I wonder if I've been changed in the night.
11:20But if I'm not the same,
11:23the next question is,
11:25who in the world am I?
11:28Ah, that's the great puzzle.
11:30This book, in its comic version
11:35of that question,
11:36celebrates the issue of identity,
11:40celebrates this need to discover who we are.
11:44And it seems to answer that question
11:47with, we are what we make ourselves.
11:50It's cast in terms that suggests
11:53you won't get help from out there.
11:55Who Alice is,
11:57is what she fights through to make herself.
12:00Carol's childhood gave hints
12:02of his future transformation
12:04from math professor to storyteller.
12:06He was an attentive and affectionate brother
12:09to his seven sisters,
12:10inventing games and tales to entertain them.
12:15He began his literary career early.
12:19At 13, he wrote and illustrated
12:21the first in a series of magazines
12:23he created especially for his family.
12:29Life at Oxford was a dramatic change
12:32from Carol's childhood country home.
12:35It seems a somber place
12:37for a writer of playful fantasy.
12:44Perhaps it's very solemnity provoked him.
12:57One side will make you grow taller
13:00and the other side will make you grow shorter
13:05of the mushroom.
13:09No, even smaller.
13:15Try the other side.
13:37Talk of magic mushrooms
13:39that make you grow smaller and larger
13:42arouses some people's suspicions
13:44about whether the good reverend
13:45was taking drugs.
13:47I have one friend I can think of
13:50who is now in England
13:51believes that he did
13:53and believes that there is evidence
13:54and indeed adds that he thinks
13:56he may have given them to the children
13:58which I,
13:59as a sort of slightly hair-raising thought,
14:02I don't know.
14:03I personally don't know at all.
14:04What one does know, of course,
14:05is how easy drugs were to obtain.
14:08Did Lewis Carroll smoke pot?
14:10You know, it's a natural question
14:12given that scene.
14:13But he didn't.
14:14He didn't have to.
14:15He didn't need that kind of stimulus.
14:17He had it all built in
14:20automatically.
14:21And his imagination soared
14:23without stimulants.
14:30Whatever the source of Carroll's inspiration,
14:33Grace Slick and her band,
14:35Jefferson Airplane,
14:37put Alice on drugs.
14:39The song White Rabbit
14:40was a huge success in 1967.
14:44One pill makes you larger
14:47And one pill makes you small
14:51And the ones that Mother gives you
14:56Don't do anything at all
15:00Go ask Alice
15:04When she's ten feet tall
15:09There are magic mushrooms.
15:12There's a hookah.
15:13There are four or five different styles
15:16of getting loaded in that book.
15:18I think the caterpillar
15:21is probably the most obvious
15:22because of his character
15:23and because he is
15:25not only smoking opium
15:26but he's sitting on
15:27a psychedelic mushroom.
15:31The Alice books
15:32represented a kind of
15:35opening up of consciousness
15:37beyond normal consciousness.
15:40Here was a connection,
15:41for example,
15:42to the drug culture,
15:44to the opening of the doors
15:46of perception,
15:46the consciousness raising
15:49of a drug experience.
15:51So whether the young people
15:52who were so attached
15:53to the Alice's
15:54were themselves
15:55actually taking drugs,
15:57this represented
15:58a kind of LSD experience.
16:01John Lennon
16:02was also fascinated
16:04with Lewis Carroll.
16:05John Lennon
16:06had a very similar,
16:07rather bizarre
16:08sense of humor.
16:09and some of John Lennon's
16:11early poetry
16:13reflects a similar
16:15sort of Carolean style.
16:21When they did
16:22the Sgt. Pepper album,
16:25all four Beatles
16:26were asked,
16:27who are your favourite characters?
16:29Because we'll actually
16:30include them
16:31on the front cover
16:31of the album
16:32and Lewis Carroll
16:33is there.
16:44The 60s dubbed Alice
16:46a rebel,
16:48fearless in her quest
16:49for excitement.
16:51Alice was a good character
16:52in that she
16:53didn't freak out
16:55over any of this stuff.
16:56She would get
16:57a very human concern
16:58about it.
16:59She'd say,
16:59oh dear me,
17:00I think my feet
17:01are getting...
17:02But she didn't freak out.
17:03It was just noticing.
17:04She's just noticing
17:05that things are
17:05quite different.
17:07And I think that gave...
17:08gives people
17:10the opportunity
17:10to see that you're
17:11not going to fall apart.
17:12You're not going to go nuts
17:13if your reality changes.
17:15Tell them I hook up
17:18smoking caterpillar
17:20has given you
17:21a call
17:24for Alice
17:27when she was
17:29just as small.
17:34When Carol
17:35was small
17:35the British Empire
17:37was poised
17:38to begin
17:38its greatest age
17:39that of Queen Victoria.
17:41She was a powerful role model
17:43moral,
17:44somber
17:45and determined
17:45and her influence
17:48did not escape notice
17:49in Alice's adventures.
17:56Despite the Victorians' conservatism
17:58England throbbed
18:00with change
18:00revolutions
18:02in industry
18:02and politics
18:03confused a way of life
18:05that had been slow
18:05and comfortable.
18:07It was a world
18:08turning upside down.
18:11Here's an age
18:12where class distinctions
18:14which are so
18:15cherished by the English
18:17are fluid suddenly.
18:19Who's in what class?
18:20Here's an age
18:21in which
18:22an assurance
18:23that man
18:24for example
18:25he is superior
18:27to all the rest
18:27of creation
18:28that has to deal
18:29with evolutionary theory
18:31Darwin and others
18:33saying
18:34you just go look
18:35at those skulls
18:36in the museum
18:36and you see
18:37where we are
18:38we're just
18:38a step above
18:40the apes
18:40and so
18:41these very proper
18:42and self-important
18:43Victorians
18:44have to deal
18:45with that.
18:46If everybody
18:47minded their own business
18:49the world
18:49would go round
18:50a bit still faster
18:51than it does.
18:52Which would not
18:53be an advantage.
18:53Just think
18:55what work
18:55it would make
18:56with the day
18:56and night.
18:57You see
18:58the earth
18:58takes 24 hours
18:59to turn round
19:00on its axis.
19:01Talking of axes
19:02chop off her head.
19:05Very generous
19:06for letting us
19:07come.
19:08Independent
19:08little girls
19:09who questioned
19:10authority
19:10went against
19:11the grain
19:12of Victorian England
19:13where childhood
19:14was a phase
19:14of life
19:15to be endured
19:16not necessarily
19:17enjoyed.
19:18The story
19:19of Alice
19:20granted children
19:21unexpected freedom.
19:22The children's books
19:24up to that time
19:25were very didactic.
19:26They were there
19:26to instill
19:27moral,
19:28cultural,
19:29social standards
19:31which had been
19:32preset,
19:33dominated by the church.
19:34So many of the
19:35children's books
19:36were actually
19:36produced by
19:37church organisations.
19:38So they're very moral.
19:40And suddenly
19:41here is Alice
19:42in a story
19:44which has no morals
19:45in it
19:45apart from the morals
19:46that the Duchess
19:47talks about.
19:48And of course
19:49they're spoof morals
19:50they're not real morals.
19:51So yes,
19:52I think children
19:53suddenly thought
19:54a breath of fresh air
19:56here.
19:57Here is quite
19:58a different story.
20:00Carroll's
20:01unconventional
20:02view of childhood
20:03also found expression
20:04in the new art
20:05form of photography.
20:08His sensual portraits
20:09of his child friends
20:10are perceived
20:11by some as troubling,
20:13pure genius
20:14by others.
20:15Because of his
20:17engaging manner,
20:18his way
20:19of relaxing children,
20:21telling them stories
20:22and throwing puns
20:24at them
20:24and asking them
20:25quizzical questions,
20:27he diverts
20:28their attention
20:29and he's able
20:30to get them
20:30to sit still
20:31in interesting,
20:33relaxed positions.
20:35And so he produces
20:36some of the most
20:36beautiful child photographs
20:38that have ever been made.
20:42his greatest interest
20:43was in photographing
20:44little girls
20:45and this was an entree.
20:47He could ask mama
20:48if it was alright
20:50for him to photograph
20:51a little girl,
20:52then later on
20:53he could write
20:54another letter
20:55saying could he
20:55photograph her
20:56in a costume
20:57and eventually
20:58he would work up
20:59like a lover
20:59to saying
21:01could he photograph
21:02this child
21:03in the nude.
21:04We know that
21:04of course
21:05he was refused
21:06sometimes
21:06but it's astounding
21:07and how many mothers
21:09said go ahead.
21:11In a letter
21:12to one of those mothers
21:13Carroll spoke
21:15adoringly
21:16of his young subjects.
21:18Their innocent
21:19unconsciousness
21:20is very beautiful
21:22and gives one
21:23a feeling of reverence
21:24as if in the presence
21:25of something sacred.
21:29Carroll spent
21:3025 years
21:31working in the darkroom
21:33creating a collection
21:34of more than
21:342,000 photographs.
21:36Then suddenly
21:37he abandoned
21:38his hobby
21:39without explanation
21:40causing people
21:41to speculate
21:42about his intentions
21:43toward his models.
21:45Subconsciously
21:46who knows
21:46what was going on
21:47there must have been
21:48some sexual
21:50side to it
21:51perhaps
21:51but very much
21:52under control
21:53perhaps
21:54too much
21:55under control
21:56it was definitely
21:57a voyeurist
21:59looking
21:59it was look
22:00not touch.
22:02We have to think
22:03ourselves back
22:04150 years
22:05almost
22:06to grasp
22:07the kind
22:08of mentality
22:09that existed
22:10before Freud
22:11and there weren't
22:13the suspicions
22:14then that there are
22:15today
22:16and we're not
22:17we're a lot more
22:19self-conscious
22:19about sexual
22:21inner
22:21subconscious
22:24psychic
22:24sexual
22:25motives
22:26than they were.
22:29after Freud
22:30the world
22:31was eager
22:31to analyze
22:32just about
22:33everything
22:33including
22:34the imaginary
22:35Alice
22:35attempts to
22:37explain her
22:37intriguing
22:38experiences
22:39sent some
22:40scholars down
22:40rather contorted
22:41paths.
22:42Most convincing
22:44is Alice
22:46when she is
22:47trapped
22:47in the
22:48rabbit's house
22:49and the picture
22:50that Lewis Carroll
22:52presents
22:52is so
22:54obviously
22:54fetal
22:55and so
22:56obviously
22:56dangerous
22:57and threatening
22:58claustrophobic
22:59even more
23:01stunning
23:02is his
23:03illustration
23:04of Alice
23:05when she is
23:06growing bigger
23:07and bigger
23:07and it isn't
23:09simply
23:10when we find
23:11something phallic
23:12this is
23:13almost
23:13clearly
23:14a phallus
23:15Alice
23:16as phallus
23:17if you will.
23:19Lewis Carroll's
23:20innocent little girl
23:21had fallen
23:23from grace.
23:27It is ironic
23:29that a master
23:29of nonsense
23:30made his living
23:31as a scholar
23:32of logic.
23:34Carroll was first
23:34a mathematician
23:35which must have
23:36come as a surprise
23:37to those who knew him
23:38as creator of Alice.
23:40Queen Victoria
23:41having read
23:41the first book
23:42said
23:43I would like to read
23:44the next book
23:45by this author.
23:47The next book
23:47by the author
23:48was an elementary
23:49tutis on
23:50simultaneous
23:50linear equations
23:51and their application
23:53to
23:53is actually
23:55deriving
23:55determinants.
23:56Now
23:57I don't think
23:58he sent that
23:58to Queen Victoria.
23:59She would not
24:00have been amused
24:00I'm sure.
24:02Carroll's most famous
24:04mathematical work
24:05symbolic logic
24:06was a showcase
24:07of his favourite
24:08intellectual exercise
24:09the syllogism
24:11two premises
24:12and their conclusion.
24:15Now change the values.
24:17If M equals cat
24:19X equals French
24:20and Y
24:22equals chicken
24:24cats speak French
24:26some chickens
24:27are cats
24:29therefore
24:30some chickens
24:31speak French
24:32the premise
24:33has proven true.
24:39The Oxford math
24:41professor
24:41and the writer
24:42of Alice in Wonderland
24:43are mirror images
24:45of the same person.
24:47Even Carroll's
24:48scholarly texts
24:49were populated
24:50by animals
24:50and infused
24:52by what appears
24:53to be nonsense.
24:54No matter how ridiculous
24:55the assumptions
24:56logical conclusions
24:58can still be drawn.
25:01The basic concept
25:02is that you have
25:03a totally absurd
25:04situation
25:05that couldn't
25:06possibly happen
25:07as a major premise
25:08to start with
25:09like
25:10a rabbit runs by
25:11wearing clothes
25:12and with a watch
25:13and talking
25:13and runs down the rabbit hole
25:14and you run down
25:15after it.
25:16Now you take on
25:17that grand
25:18premise
25:19and then everything
25:20else follows.
25:22Well logic professors
25:23need vacations
25:24from logic
25:25and so he reverses
25:26everything
25:27and you get nonsense
25:28instead
25:28you get an illogical world
25:30a world in which
25:32all the rules of nature
25:33don't matter very much
25:36and you get nonsense
25:37instead of sense.
25:40In Victorian England
25:42tea time
25:43was a cultural institution
25:44an hour of appropriate
25:46importance
25:47for the most famous
25:48scene in Wonderland.
25:51Sit down
25:52have some wine.
25:53Er
25:54there isn't any wine.
25:55Of course not.
25:56Hee hee
25:57we've no time for wine
25:59we've no time for anything.
26:00Doesn't work see
26:02not a dick.
26:03He quarreled with time
26:04last March.
26:05And ever since that
26:06he won't do a thing
26:08I ask.
26:09It's always six o'clock now.
26:11Pass the tea.
26:12Oh thank you.
26:13I do feel like a cup.
26:15Yes you look like one.
26:17Hee.
26:18Time for tea
26:19don't know.
26:23We think the Hatter
26:25is probably modelled
26:26on a character
26:26here in Oxford.
26:27A chap called
26:28Theophilus Carter
26:29who had a furniture
26:31shop on the high.
26:32His claim to fame
26:33was he invented
26:34an alarm bed
26:35which threw you out
26:36when it's time
26:37to get up.
26:39Don't come around
26:41here no more
26:45Don't come around
26:47here no more
26:52Whatever you're looking for
26:56Hey!
26:58Don't come around
26:59here no more
27:00Whoever he was
27:02artists have found
27:04the Hatter
27:04an irresistibly
27:05eccentric character
27:06the embodiment
27:08of madness
27:09trapped in a
27:10timeless world
27:11The fact that he
27:12made time stop
27:13and things go
27:15backwards
27:15is a theme
27:17of the
27:17surrealistic movement
27:18and Salvador Dali
27:20in particular
27:20had this fascination
27:21for clocks
27:22and very funny
27:24shaped clocks
27:25Dali even went
27:26and produced
27:27his own Alice
27:27with some very
27:28interesting illustrations
27:42It's so easy
27:44to use Alice
27:45as an artist
27:46regardless of
27:47what you're singing
27:47writing
27:48Salvador Dali
27:49John Lennon
27:50because it has
27:51a wonderful
27:52panoply of stuff
27:53to reorganize
27:56identify with
27:57rearrange
27:59to put yourself
28:00into any of the
28:01characters
28:02It's fun to be
28:03the Mad Hatter
28:03the Mouse
28:04the Dormouse
28:05Alice
28:05the White Rabbit
28:06It's a
28:07spectacular book
28:13Carol often played
28:15croquet
28:15with the little
28:16children
28:16and even invented
28:18a complicated
28:18new version
28:19of the game
28:20In Alice in Wonderland
28:22this innocuous
28:24amusement
28:24takes on
28:25a bizarre twist
28:29The players
28:30all played
28:31at once
28:31without waiting
28:32for turns
28:33quarreling
28:34all the while
28:34and fighting
28:35for the hedgehogs
28:37and in a very
28:38short time
28:39the queen
28:39was in a furious
28:40passion
28:41and went stamping
28:42about and shouting
28:43off with his head
28:45or off with her
28:46head
28:47about once a minute
28:53Who stole the tarts
28:55is the question
28:55when Alice
28:56appears before
28:57the corrupt court
28:58of the queen
28:58of hearts
28:59A grave situation
29:00soon deteriorates
29:02into the ridiculous
29:03in any solemn
29:04ceremony
29:05something funny
29:07ought to happen
29:07something ought
29:08just to break in
29:10I vow
29:11there's some demon
29:12who sees to that
29:13you know
29:14we
29:15and goodness
29:16one does enjoy it
29:17you know
29:17it's lovely
29:19to have the great
29:19majestic pompous things
29:20that's fine
29:21they have their place
29:22but how nice
29:23just to go
29:23whoops
29:24you know
29:24and shake
29:25everybody up
29:39silence
29:41in the court
29:44sentence first
29:46verdict afterwards
29:50executioner
29:51forward
29:56off with her head
30:01I'm not frightened
30:03of you
30:03you're nothing
30:04but a pack of cards
30:06just cards
30:07the chaos
30:08of the world
30:09around her
30:09has become overwhelming
30:11Alice can't stand
30:12it anymore
30:13and forces herself
30:14to wake up
30:15the nightmare
30:16is over
30:17here's a book
30:19that represents
30:20a kind of
30:20disappearance
30:22of time
30:23of space
30:24of all of the
30:25things that make
30:27our life
30:27sane and livable
30:29a frightening book
30:31about that
30:32obviously
30:32it's a book
30:34that satisfies
30:36some need
30:37to dream
30:38those anxiety
30:40dreams
30:41and then
30:41to forget them
30:42Alice in Wonderland
30:44sold well
30:45it provided Carol
30:47with such a
30:47comfortable income
30:48that he asked
30:50Christchurch
30:50to reduce his salary
30:51but his success
30:53made him so
30:54uncomfortable
30:55that Dodgson
30:57refused to accept
30:57letters addressed
30:58to Lewis Cowell
31:00I think that was
31:01to protect
31:02not only himself
31:03but Alice
31:04and the other people
31:06who could be
31:06identified as Oxford
31:08characters within the book
31:09also he did not
31:11like the limelight
31:12he did not like
31:14people to make a fuss
31:15of him
31:15he was a very modest
31:17person
31:18and I think he would
31:20have found it
31:20quite difficult
31:21to handle
31:21if people
31:23kept coming up
31:24and asked for his
31:25autograph
31:25and made a fuss
31:26because he was
31:27the famous author
31:28of Alice's adventures
31:31Alice and her
31:32cast of characters
31:33have made her
31:33famous as well
31:35her adventures
31:36have been translated
31:37into languages
31:38from Arabic
31:39to Zulu
31:42it is not set
31:44in a particular
31:44historical time
31:45or place
31:46like Little Lord
31:46Fauntleroy
31:47or Little Women
31:48or some of the
31:49other books
31:50that we think of
31:50when we think of
31:5119th century
31:51children's books
31:53because of that
31:55you don't have to be
31:56from Victorian England
31:57to understand it
31:58you can understand it
31:59if you're
31:59you can get things
32:00out of it
32:00if you're French
32:01or German
32:01or Dutch
32:01or Italian
32:02or Russian
32:02or Japanese
32:05Charles Lovett
32:06owns a formidable
32:07collection of Alice
32:08books and memorabilia
32:09he travels the world
32:11giving lectures
32:12on her adventures
32:15it's a book
32:15that has
32:16very successfully
32:17fed on its own image
32:19because it's able
32:19to cross over
32:20into other media
32:21film
32:22television
32:22advertising
32:23spoken recordings
32:24radio
32:27another thing
32:27that's made it
32:28so popular
32:28is the thing
32:29we can't put
32:30our finger on
32:30George Plimpton
32:31called it the X Factor
32:32when he was writing
32:33about athletics
32:34and business
32:34that certain something
32:37that distinguishes
32:37a champion
32:38from second place
32:40and if you knew
32:41what it was
32:41you can make a lot
32:42of money publishing
32:43books or making movies
32:44but whatever it is
32:45I think Alice
32:45has definitely got it
32:48there is an
32:49international clan
32:50of serious Alice fans
32:52Maxine and David Schaefer
32:54are devoted
32:55to their book collection
32:56Maxine is librarian
32:58of the parody section
32:59the collection
33:01as a whole
33:01is both my husband's
33:03and mine
33:03and he had
33:05the parodies
33:06and the parodies
33:08were sort of
33:09pushing us out
33:10of the bookcase
33:11so he said
33:12he was going to
33:13give them away
33:13and I said
33:14you can't do that
33:15so he said
33:16fine
33:16you take the parodies
33:17so I've taken
33:19the parodies
33:19and I'm having fun
33:21collecting different
33:22versions
33:26and when you collect books
33:27on Alice
33:28you find all sorts
33:29of things
33:30that you can buy
33:30memorabilia
33:31encompasses
33:32an awful lot
33:34so you have to
33:35stop somewhere
33:36or start somewhere
33:38and I started
33:40with one little
33:43teapot
33:43and next thing I knew
33:44I found another one
33:46that appealed to me
33:47and I am now
33:49into teapot
33:50collecting
33:50this collection
33:52here is
33:53102 years old
33:55at the moment
33:56and it was started
33:57by my mother
33:58in 1891
34:01Schaefer has books
34:02in over 50 languages
34:04but his specialty
34:05is Alice
34:07on the silver screen
34:08his collection
34:10of 30 films
34:11starts with
34:12Cecil Hepworth's
34:13production
34:13of 1903
34:19here is a picture
34:20of Alice getting
34:22well she's small
34:24right here
34:25looking at the large table
34:26but in 1903
34:28people didn't have
34:29human beings
34:30getting smaller
34:31and larger
34:31this is probably
34:32the very first time
34:33anybody had ever
34:34tried that
34:34you use two films
34:35you superimpose
34:36one on the other
34:37you keep the background
34:38constant
34:39and you pull
34:40the camera away
34:44in 1910
34:46the Edison Company
34:47filmed Alice
34:48in the Bronx
34:59promotion for this scene
35:01described
35:02a banquet
35:03at which
35:03the dastardly
35:04knave
35:05steals the tarts
35:06and gets away
35:07with them
35:18this 1915 Alice
35:20premiered with
35:22the accompaniment
35:23of a 30 piece orchestra
35:24unlike earlier films
35:26no special effects
35:28were used
35:28to cause size changes
35:30so that Alice
35:31would always be
35:32tallest in the scene
35:33midget actors
35:35played the animals
35:50after Alice
35:51in Wonderland
35:52a shadow
35:54fell across
35:54Carol's life
35:55his relationship
35:57with the Liddles
35:58cooled
35:59suddenly
36:03we're not certain
36:04what happened
36:05the relevant diaries
36:07for that period
36:09are missing
36:11it's a time
36:12when the relationship
36:13with the Little family
36:14is in full bloom
36:15and we know
36:16afterwards
36:16when the diaries
36:17restart
36:18that the relationship
36:19is extremely cool
36:21Alice Little's mother
36:23was society
36:24with a big S
36:26and I think
36:26she saw herself
36:27as socially superior
36:28to Lewis Carroll
36:29although people say
36:30oh well he was just
36:31a mathematical lecturer
36:33and mathematical don
36:34in Oxford
36:35still had quite a status
36:36they sat at the high table
36:38they were a part of the
36:41staff in authority
36:44I think it was
36:44Mrs Little
36:45who possibly objected
36:48to any possible
36:49relationship with Alice
36:50that Lewis Carroll
36:51might be thinking about
36:54after Carol stopped
36:56seeing Alice
36:56he went on to charm
36:58countless little girls
36:59but the memory of Alice
37:01never faded
37:03when she was married
37:04he confided to her
37:05in a letter
37:06I have had scores
37:08of child friends
37:09since your time
37:10but they have been
37:12quite a different thing
37:15despite the broken
37:16relationship
37:17with his muse
37:18six years after
37:19the first book
37:20Carroll wrote
37:21the second installment
37:22of Alice's adventures
37:23through the looking glass
37:25and what Alice found there
37:49he saw it as a sequel
37:51to Alice
37:52but it's a structured book
37:54now
37:54it's based on the game
37:55of chess
37:57underneath it
37:58there seems to be
37:59this view
37:59that his Alice
38:00as the pawn
38:01moves across the board
38:03and becomes queen
38:04an analogy of Alice
38:06growing up
38:07becoming an adult
38:08and for Lewis Carroll
38:10to lose her
38:12once again
38:13Alice dreams herself
38:15into fantasy land
38:17dreams are an avenue
38:19to a kind of knowledge
38:20that cannot be achieved
38:21by the conscious mind
38:23and Charles Dodson
38:24was very committed
38:25to the conscious approach
38:27to knowledge
38:29and this
38:30to a certain extent
38:31satisfies that other need
38:33his recognition
38:34that there were
38:34kinds of things
38:36we knew in a dream state
38:37that we cannot know
38:39in a waking state
38:40besides that
38:41it seems to me
38:42he's tapped into
38:44what is essential
38:45for our lives
38:47we now know
38:48that if you do not dream
38:50you go crazy
38:50these books
38:52these books
38:52where dream states
38:54or situations
38:55where people
38:56are thrown
38:56into extraordinary
38:58circumstances
39:00hopefully give people
39:02the idea
39:04that they too
39:05can experience
39:07radical changes
39:08in their life
39:08or even plan
39:10to do so
39:11not just as a reaction
39:13to something
39:14that's happening
39:14to you
39:14but something you
39:15think maybe
39:16I just ought to
39:17flip this over
39:46all life flips
39:48snatch
39:48I think it's a masterpiece
39:49of real nonsense poetry
39:52he made up words
39:53which sound right
39:54even though they're
39:56not right
39:56until you've explained
39:57them that is
39:58and they're in a rigid
40:00poetic structure
40:01so that you understand
40:02the words
40:03even though you don't
40:04understand the words
40:05which is what Alice says
40:06she said it seems to have
40:07a lot of meaning in it
40:07but I don't quite know
40:08what it is
40:09I don't know if you would
40:10call it onomatopoetic
40:11I think I just made that
40:13word up but it's close
40:14in that
40:15it doesn't seem
40:17to make any sense
40:17but it sounds like
40:18somebody describing
40:19early morning
40:20t'was brillig
40:21in the slithy toves
40:23brillig sounds like
40:25a description of the light
40:26it was bright
40:27but maybe a little foggy
40:28slithy toves
40:29sounds like trees
40:30that have moss
40:31and stuff hanging on them
40:32so I see
40:33a scene
40:35an early morning scene
40:36in a forest
40:37although it makes
40:38absolutely no sense
40:39so I liked it
40:40very much as a child
40:41and I like the way
40:42it sounds
40:42to repeat it
40:43I like just hearing it
40:45so that's probably
40:47my favorite
40:49Carol actually did
40:51provide definitions
40:52for the Jabberwocky words
40:56they really helped a lot
41:01after substituting
41:02Carol's definitions
41:03the true message
41:05of the poem
41:05becomes clear
41:07listen
41:08t'was dinner time
41:10and the smooth
41:11and active badgers
41:12did scratch
41:13and bore holes
41:15in the hillside
41:16all unhappy
41:17were the parrots
41:18and the grave
41:19land turtle
41:20squeaked
41:37carol loved language
41:39carol loved language
41:39he loved the written word
41:41his register lists nearly
41:43100,000 letters
41:45sent and received
41:46during his lifetime
41:48some were spun in spirals
41:50some were spun in spirals
41:51some could be read
41:51only in a mirror
41:54and others were
41:55illustrated with
41:56fanciful creatures
42:09things are never as they should be
42:11in looking glass land
42:13the world is oddly distorted
42:16and characters from a nursery rhyme
42:18fight to the death
42:22Tweedledum and Tweedledee
42:24agreed to have a battle
42:25for Tweedledum said
42:27Tweedledee had spoiled
42:28his nice new rattle
42:32not far from the battleground
42:34the red king
42:35is snoring under a tree
42:36the argument
42:37over Tweedledum's rattle
42:38is postponed
42:39so that the twins
42:40can take a moment
42:41to torment Alice
42:43Dumbledee says to Alice
42:45you know what would happen
42:46if he woke up
42:46you're just a thing
42:47in his dream
42:48and you'd go out
42:49like a candle
42:50and she begins to cry
42:52but indeed
42:53whose dream is it?
42:56since Alice is dreaming
42:57her looking glass adventure
42:58she has dreamt the king
43:00who is dreaming her
43:01much like the question
43:03which came first
43:04the chicken
43:05or the egg
43:06there are 364 days
43:09when you might get
43:10unbirthday presents
43:11certainly
43:12and only one
43:14for birthday presents
43:14you know
43:15there's glory for you
43:17I don't know
43:17what you mean by glory
43:19of course you don't
43:20till I tell you
43:21I meant
43:22there's a nice
43:23knockdown argument
43:24for you
43:25but glory doesn't mean
43:27a nice knockdown argument
43:28when I use a word
43:30it means just
43:31what I choose it to mean
43:32neither more nor less
43:34it may well be
43:35a parody of
43:37the embodiment
43:38of all dons
43:39in the university
43:41who are a bit
43:43pedantic
43:44about the use of words
43:45and sometimes
43:46you know
43:47if they make a mistake
43:48they'll find a way
43:48around it
43:49by saying
43:49well
43:49when I use a word
43:51it means exactly
43:52what I intend it to mean
43:53no more nor less
43:57in a strange
43:58brief return to reality
44:00Carol paints his self-portrait
44:02in the character
44:03of the white knight
44:04who has just finished
44:06dueling the red knight
44:07the gallant
44:08but bumbling warrior
44:09says goodbye to Alice
44:10who is about to become queen
44:13there's a poignancy
44:15about that
44:16and I think he was
44:17looking back
44:18on what might have been
44:19with Alice
44:21I think the farewell scene
44:22where you will
44:23wave your handkerchief
44:25to me
44:25it'll encourage me
44:27and she turns back
44:28for one moment
44:29and sees him standing there
44:30I think that is
44:32a personal feeling
44:34because it's quite different
44:35than anything else
44:36in the entire book
44:37it's a lovely moment
44:40the tender
44:42wistful affection
44:42of the white knight
44:44suggests a man
44:45very much in love
44:46in love
44:48dodgy
44:49dodgy question
44:50isn't it
44:50that he loved her
44:51yes
44:53deeply
44:53I mean
44:54I think I would say
44:55passionately
44:56it depends what you mean
44:58by love
44:59I think he did love her
45:01but he loved her
45:02in the same way
45:03that a father
45:05would love a daughter
45:06the part that really
45:08excited him
45:09was the precocity
45:10the intellect
45:12yes and the physical
45:13features of the child
45:14she was an attractive
45:15looking girl
45:16but so were the other
45:18sisters
45:18but Alice was his favourite
45:20because Alice had a mind
45:21of her own
45:22she was an independent
45:23little girl
45:24and she would ask him
45:25questions
45:27Alice reaches the last
45:28row of the chessboard
45:30where she is crowned
45:31queen
45:32in celebration
45:33of her elevation
45:34she joins a dinner party
45:36which quickly gets
45:37out of hand
45:39the ending
45:39of looking glass
45:41I think really
45:42moves towards madness
45:43and gets very frightening
45:45you know
45:46where the
45:46where the
45:47the leg of mutton
45:48gets off the dish
45:49and comes and sits
45:49in the chair
45:50and the
45:50and the red queen
45:51has shrunk
45:52to about three inches
45:53high
45:53is running around
45:54the table
45:54and the bottles
45:55have got wings
45:56and are beginning
45:57to fly
45:57and the candles
45:58are growing
45:58oh
45:59it gives one
46:01slightly the shivers
46:02you look a little shy
46:04let me introduce you
46:05to that leg of mutton
46:06Alice
46:07mutton
46:08mutton
46:09Alice
46:09may I give you a slice
46:11certainly not
46:12it isn't etiquette
46:14to cut anyone
46:14you've been introduced to
46:16remove the joint
46:27I can't stand this anymore
46:33once again
46:34Alice needs to escape
46:35her nightmare
46:36in desperation
46:37she begins shaking
46:39the red queen
46:39who turns into a kitten
46:41whose purring wakes her up
46:45the end of
46:46through the looking glass
46:46is the end of
46:47more than the story
46:49queen Alice
46:50has won her chess game
46:51and Lewis Carroll
46:52has lost his dream
46:55I think Lewis Carroll
46:56realized that
46:57at some stage
46:58the relationship
46:59that he had
47:00with children
47:00would change
47:01that they would grow up
47:02they would go
47:03their separate way
47:04and he'd be left alone
47:07the real Alice
47:08did grow up
47:08but the storybook
47:10Alice avoids her mortality
47:12through her dreams
47:14we can re-experience
47:15childhood
47:15and escape for a moment
47:17the demons
47:17that come with age
47:20the books are
47:22subversive
47:23of all sorts of things
47:24and one of the delights
47:25of the books
47:26is a subversion
47:27of grown-ups
47:28grown-up behavior
47:29the grown-ups
47:30in these books
47:31are clearly shown
47:32to be infantile
47:33in many ways
47:34it's Alice
47:35who moves through
47:36those stages
47:37to a kind of maturity
47:39the fact that
47:40they are subversive
47:42helps to explain
47:44their popularity
47:45we need
47:46a kind of subversiveness
47:47we need it
47:49somewhere or other
47:50we need to
47:51overthrow
47:52in carnival
47:53or whatever it is
47:54the rules of the game
47:55and play
47:57in some place
47:58outside those rules
48:01Alice's adventures
48:03dance playfully
48:03between reality
48:05and fantasy
48:05nothing more
48:07perhaps than
48:07tantalizing dreams
48:09by their very nature
48:11such fairy tales
48:12keep their meaning
48:13to themselves
48:15you can see it
48:16as a classic of humor
48:17as a classic of logic
48:18as a classic
48:19children's book
48:20as a classic of parody
48:22and there's an element
48:23of truth in all of these
48:25but you mustn't get lost
48:27so much lost
48:28into an academic approach
48:29to the book
48:30that you forget
48:30the way that book
48:31was originally written
48:33that he was writing
48:34a children's book
48:35for a particular child
48:37Lewis Carroll
48:39remembered that child
48:40in the closing poem
48:41of Through the Looking Glass
48:45long has paled
48:46that sunny sky
48:47echoes fade
48:49and memories die
48:51autumn frosts
48:53of slain July
48:55still she haunts me
48:57phantom wise
48:58Alice moving in disguise
49:00never seen
49:01by waking eyes
49:03through the
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