- 5 months ago
Leader of Opposition Rahul Gandhi has made serious allegations against the Election Commission of India, claiming widespread voter list fraud and "vote chori."
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00:00Because yesterday, the leader of opposition Rahul Gandhi made some very, very serious and grave allegations against the Election Commission of India.
00:11Addressing today a Vote Adhikar rally in Karnataka, Rahul Gandhi demanded that the Election Commission of India hand over all India electronic voter list and videography of the past 10 years.
00:54The votes was stolen in the Mahadevpura Assembly segment in the Lok Sabha polls.
01:00He demanded a probe by the government into the alleged election fraud.
01:04The election commission and the BJP have killed the people from Karnataka.
01:09Congress MP Priyanka Gandhi Wadra seconded Rahul's allegations.
01:14Congress MP Priyanka Gandhi Wadra seconded Rahul's allegations.
01:38The election commission has hit out at Rahul Gandhi, giving him an ultimatum to either sign a declaration under oath or apologize.
02:05EC sources say, if Rahul believes in analysis, then signing an oath should not be a problem.
02:14Rahul Gandhi earlier released a video message reiterating his charges.
02:19The eight-minute long video by Rahul highlighted the special intensive revision of the voter list in Bihar, as well as alleged voter theft in Mahadevpura.
02:28The BJP has hit back, accusing Rahul Gandhi of tarnishing the poll body's image.
02:46It further accused the Congress of selective outrage.
02:50Next, I would like to say Rahul to Rahul,
03:09I'm telling people to stop the Bihar before.
03:16Led by Rahul Gandhi, India bloc leaders will hold a yatra in Bihar from August 17th to September 1
03:23over the electoral roll revision exercise in the state.
03:28The Bharatiya Janta Party is saying that the claims made by Rahul Gandhi are not only false
03:35but this also reflects the frustration of the Congress Party because they are not able to win elections after elections.
03:43With video journalist Manish Vidhudi, this is Amit Bhardwaj, reporting for India today from Delhi.
03:50Meanwhile, the election commission is once again under fire.
03:54Leader of opposition, Rahul Gandhi, accused it of voter list manipulation,
03:58citing a particular example of one constituency in Bengaluru
04:03where one address, 80 voters, were allegedly registered in a single room house.
04:09India Today investigated the claim by the leader of opposition.
04:12Take a look.
04:20India Today visited the address at the centre of this political storm
04:25and what we found raises serious questions.
04:28The house, which is barely 10 to 15 square feet,
04:32is currently occupied by a food delivery agent from West Bengal
04:36who moved in just a month ago.
04:38He claims he has no link to the alleged 80 voters
04:41and has denied knowing anyone on the list.
04:43The house is owned by Jairam Reddy.
05:09When contacted by India Today,
05:13Reddy initially confirmed being affiliated with the party
05:16but later backtracked.
05:17Shockingly, Reddy also admitted that he never informed election commission officials about the anomaly
05:44despite knowing that most of the registered voters no longer reside there.
05:48Shockingly, Reddy,
06:18India Today also spoke to the Muniratna BLO
06:30who confirmed that there are 80 voters registered in that one house.
06:33Okay.
06:34Okay.
06:35Okay.
06:37Okay.
06:41Okay.
06:43Okay.
06:45Okay.
06:54Okay.
06:55old-fashioned and rental agreement
06:59and normally 100 people can only order list
07:02but it doesn't need everyone
07:05but the average is 50 people
07:07and they will enroll in 8 people
07:14and they will enroll in 4 families
07:21For now, what's clear is this. Rahul Gandhi's claims have found some ground.
07:51Your house, house number 35, here in Munredi Garden, near Bellanduru.
07:57With you, there's one more, Sagai Raj, reporting for India Today, Bengaluru.
08:02Alright, so that was my colleague Sagai Raj, filing this report from Bengaluru on particular constituency of Bangalore Central, which Rahul Gandhi had pointed out.
08:12But let's now cut across to other ground reports that my colleagues filed where other addresses were concerned. Listen in.
09:53Alright.
09:54All right let's cut across right now to my colleagues who've been filing these reports from
10:10across the country at the back of the allegations that were made by Rahul Gandhi.
10:15Joining me is Sagai Raj from Bangaluru, Samr Shirashtar from Lucknow.
10:18Now, Sagai, would you take us through on what you investigated at the back of the address
10:23that Rahu Gandhi gave out as an accusation of multiple voters from one particular address?
10:34That particular address was near Mahadevpura and it is on the outer ring road nestling
10:40between IT companies and residential area.
10:42And when we went and checked that particular house, there were only three people.
10:46There were two adults and a kid which was living in that particular house
10:49and all three of them doesn't have any kind of voter ID.
10:53But still, that particular house has enrolled around 80 voters.
10:57What is even more interesting factor is that when we also spoke to the BLO,
11:01she claimed that, yes, 80 people have enrolled there, 80 people have voter list.
11:06And those are securities, homemade, servers, housekeeping workers who come there,
11:12get the rental agreement and thereafter get their ID card.
11:18But the question is, in last 10 years, 80 people.
11:20In an average, 8 people in a single year.
11:24So, probably even if you have two people in a house, elders, husband and a wife who come there
11:29and live there, probably they might leave for three months and get the EC card
11:33and vacate a house within three months.
11:35So, it is quite impractical to understand within three months, get your rental agreement,
11:40apply for your election card, get that and vacate the house and go.
11:44So, in any logic, they won't get the ID card within three months,
11:48even if you apply in last 10, 15 years, even after digitization.
11:52So, these are the questions which are still haunting me because BLO says that
11:55they come here, register, they take the local voter ID card
11:59and thereafter get a walk there, a job in any of the IT companies.
12:04And thereafter, they vacate and go to other places.
12:06But still, they maintain the same ID card.
12:09And the owner, the owner of the house also says that
12:12why haven't you informed the election commission about this?
12:15He claims that the same voters come back on the election days and vote.
12:19Many of them don't come back.
12:20And he himself admitted, saying that these are residents who live in Orissa,
12:25they live in Bihar, they live even in the other parts of Karnataka.
12:30But on the election day, they come back and vote, though they are not residing there.
12:34So, these were the answers we got when we tried to do a fact check.
12:38But they have accepted the fact that 80 people have enrolled from house number 35
12:44in Munreti Garden in Mahathepura constituency.
12:47And the irony is that the Congress candidate in the last three elections,
12:53he was leading in all the constituencies.
12:55Only when the Mahathepura constituency comes, that's when the Congress used to lose.
13:01And that's when now the Congress have gone to the ground and checked.
13:05And they have found this.
13:06When I was talking to a few Congress leaders,
13:08they said that they don't have any workers in those areas.
13:11And it is a fault of Congress.
13:13They have not vigilant.
13:14They have not taken care of their votes.
13:16They have allowed these kind of malpractice to happen.
13:20All right, stay with me, Sagai.
13:22You know, these were ground reports filed by my colleagues
13:26at the back of the allegations made by Rahul Gandhi,
13:29which Rahul Gandhi said that he had proof of it.
13:32And my colleagues went on ground to fact check.
13:34You heard what Sagai Raj said.
13:36I want to now bring in Samar Srivastava,
13:38who went to a residence of another person that Rahul Gandhi flagged,
13:42who was registered as a voter in Lucknow and then in Bangalore as well.
13:47Bangalore Central, Mahadevpura constituency.
13:50Bangalore Central constituency, the segment, of course, the Vidhan Sabha, Mahadevpura.
13:55Samarth, what did you find?
13:56Well, Priti, I must tell you that Aditya Srivastava has become a curious case in India.
14:01And when we reached the Lucknow residence, where he used to live along with his parents,
14:06we found that there was nobody inside the residence.
14:09As we got to know from the neighbors, that the family shifted to Bangalore
14:12as Aditya got the job in Bangalore.
14:14Though it's not just about Bangalore, he even worked in Mumbai.
14:18But in the COVID times, he lost his job and then shifted to Bangalore.
14:21And along with not just him, his family also shifted to Bangalore.
14:26And when it was checked by the Election Commission of Uttar Pradesh,
14:29it was said that officials from Uttar Pradesh Election Commission said that
14:33Rahul Gandhi's claims are baseless as he's not registered with Uttar Pradesh
14:37or what we see claimed that he has been registered in the name of Lucknow.
14:40And when you search Aditya Srivastava from the Lucknow column,
14:43it says that no user found.
14:46Same happened in the trunk of Maharashtra.
14:48That was the source of the Election Commission also claiming.
14:51So it's going to be worse, seeing like from where Aditya Srivastava is there to vote.
14:56And what Rahul Gandhi clearly claimed is Aditya Srivastava voted in Lucknow,
15:00in Bangalore and in Maharashtra.
15:02Though the claims are very high, and if they are found free,
15:04then that could be a massive explosion in the politics of Uttar Pradesh as well.
15:08But when we reached the ground, there was nobody in Lucknow.
15:11They have shifted.
15:12That means that they might be hardly coming once or twice a year.
15:15And if somebody is coming once or twice a year,
15:17it's not possible to vote in Lucknow.
15:19Or somebody can't plan to especially come to Lucknow during the time of voting.
15:22It's also unnatural when a person is obviously doing a job in corporate in Bangalore.
15:26So that's what we found in the ground report.
15:28He was currently not staying in Lucknow.
15:31And what we saw in the reports of Mumbai as well,
15:33he was not there as well.
15:34So once it's very clear, he's currently based in Bangalore.
15:37He could have voted somewhere, it would be Bangalore.
15:39Back to you.
15:40All right.
15:41And, you know, Sagai would, I'm sure, try to figure out where Aditya Srivastava,
15:45that person named by Rahul Gandhi, is in Bangalore.
15:48Where does he reside?
15:49Because he was registered in three places, Lucknow, then Mumbai, and then Bangalore.
15:56Sagai, I want to come back to you because you carried out a very detailed investigation.
16:00What more did you find?
16:01There were other addresses that were also given out.
16:04See, it is a clear system failure because according to BLO, she says that they have
16:14clearly mentioned when they've done a survey in that particular house, when they found out
16:19that there were not 80 people residing in that particular house, they have mentioned it in
16:24their report stating that shifted.
16:26So they have remarks to say after every single epic card, they have to mention what is the
16:32remarks, what have you found in that particular house.
16:34So they say that they have mentioned shifted.
16:37Despite mentioning shifted, there is no correction which has been done.
16:41See, the larger question is, she says from last 10 years, there were 80 people who have
16:47enrolled for the OTL list.
16:48So even she says that probably first year, not forget about nine years.
16:52First year, if she has said that shifted, at least they should have removed that eight
16:56numbers in that particular year.
16:58Why they haven't done, why they have to take nine years or 10 years, still not rectifying
17:04it, why they allowed them to vote for 15 years.
17:08And even if they have epic card in somewhere else, there should be some kind of accountability,
17:12some kind of duplication to be found out and to remove all those things.
17:17So this is a complete failure of the system, complete failure of understanding that there
17:21are multiple people who have enrolled.
17:24And even in this case, they have enrolled themselves for the ID card.
17:28But still, the election commission, when they do the survey, they should find out that whether
17:32those people are leaving.
17:34And even if their ground worker, like a BLO, gives a report saying that shifted, why they
17:38have not proceeded with this?
17:40Why they have allowed?
17:41And it's a basic common sense that nobody can live.
17:4480 people cannot live in a same house, which is just 10 by 15 feet in that particular house.
17:51And you cannot, more than two people who can sleep.
17:53There is no bedroom.
17:54There's a hall which has been converted into a bedroom and a kitchen and a bathroom.
17:59And these are small-time workers who are leaving.
18:02And poor people living in that small house.
18:05And they have to face these kind of investigation, definitely show that what might have gone wrong,
18:10maybe the system, and it is the entire system which has let down this particular malpractice
18:17which has been done there.
18:18All right, appreciate you joining us, Sagai and Samartha.
18:23You know, these, my two colleagues carried out a very detailed investigation at the back
18:28of the allegations made by Rahul Gandhi.
18:31And to somewhat, if you can, you know, pick up on what they both found, there was credible,
18:37you know, information that they picked up.
18:40But it seemed to suggest that, as Sagai pointed out, that a one-room house in Bangalore did,
18:47in fact, have 80 voters attached to it.
18:49Sagai can't seem, that was Sagai's report.
18:52Samartha, when he went to that address where Aditya Srivastava, who's registered not just
18:57in Lucknow, but in Mumbai as well as Bangalore, when he went to that residence, apparently Aditya
19:02Srivastava has moved away from there five years ago.
19:05So the curious case of Aditya Srivastava continues.
19:07I want to take all these questions to our panelists this evening.
19:12We have with us R.P. Singh, National Spokesperson, Bharatiya Janata Party, Sujata Paul, Spokesperson,
19:19Congress.
19:20I have Rajat Sethi, Political Commentator, Ashutosh, Author and Political Analyst.
19:25I'd like to begin right now with R.P. Singh.
19:27R.P. Singh, the fact is, there are allegations that the leader of opposition has made yesterday.
19:33We've had my colleagues who've gone on ground extensively investigated.
19:38There is some amount of credibility in those allegations which need further investigation.
19:43The larger question R.P. Singh is that why is the Bharatiya Janata Party coming out and
19:47defending the EC?
19:48Because the sheer reason that there is no debate in Parliament is because EC is an independent
19:54constitutional body.
19:55It is the EC's job to answer all these questions and dispel all doubts.
19:59The BJP, you know, shouldn't really come in and defend an organization like the EC when
20:05we are not even debating it in Parliament at the back of it being a constitutional figure.
20:12Thank you for calling for your debate.
20:14And your daughter, we can't discuss EC matters in the Parliament as per, because EC is a constitutional
20:22body as we, so we can't discuss it in the Parliament.
20:25But yes, if you are opposing the SIR in Parliament and are talking about what SIR is doing out, when
20:36you are holding a press conference or holding your so-called atom bomb, tuttli bomb, dhamaka, so that's
20:43what the case is.
20:44Unless there will be SIR wherever it's required.
20:46I mean, we are saying that.
20:47But again, this is not only matter.
20:49I mean, then he should go to Election Commission and file a petition, file a note to the Election
20:57Commission saying, yes, we want this to be investigated.
21:00Instead of holding a press conference, then Election Commission said on record, please do
21:04come and file your, whatever discrepancy you have found on oath and we will investigate
21:09that.
21:10What's wrong in it?
21:11But again, Election Commission has also said today that the statements made are misleading.
21:17This is the portal of Election Commission.
21:21The, sorry, Twitter handle of Election Commission.
21:23Now, I was going to the chat GTP, chat GPT, part of the, a person who misleads can be called
21:32as liar, misleader, fraud or fabricator.
21:36Let Mr. Holkandi go to Supreme Court and file a defamation against Election Commission.
21:42And this will be proven in the court that Election Commission is wrong.
21:46Because as per Election Commission, he is either fraud or he is misleader or he is a liar or
21:52he is fabricator.
21:52So, he should go to the court.
21:55But fact is that this is all because he knows that they are badly going to lose the Bihar
22:01election.
22:02And as I told you earlier, in your next part, I will show you that video where a woman in
22:06Bihar has told it on her face that their education system is very good.
22:10Although he kept provoking her, saying that no, no, English is being taught, computers are
22:16there.
22:16So, she said, no, everything is okay.
22:17Your time is up, sir.
22:18Your fader is going to go down.
22:19But I would think that there is a huge difference on what is happening in Bihar with the SIR and
22:23what the allegations of the leader of opposition is.
22:26A role revision exercise is something I don't think any political party has contested.
22:30The SIR in particular, in the manner of which it's conducted, is a question.
22:34So, they are quite detached from each other.
22:36But I'm going to come right back to you.
22:38I just want like five minutes of patience from all our guests.
22:40I'm just joined right now by Jagdeep S. Chokar.
22:43He's the founding member of ADR.
22:44We're going to speak to him for just five minutes.
22:46So, you know, just give us that amount of time.
22:48Mr. Chokar, appreciate you taking the time out, sir.
22:51With the allegations that were made yesterday by the leader of opposition, do you see now
22:55it is the, you know, the onus is now on the election commission to at least come out and
23:01dispel all these allegations point by point?
23:06That is true what you say, right?
23:08The election commission, to my mind, in all seriousness, has only two options.
23:16One, the first thing that it should do is to investigate what has been said, which at least
23:24on the face of a prime of SI looks very serious, rather than standing on formal complaint or
23:33an oath, it should just check whether all what has been said is really correct or it is not
23:40correct. If what has been said is found to be not correct, it should present that evidence in
23:47public and then take action against Mr. Raul Gandhi for having said something wrong in public
23:56with proof. If there is indeed something wrong, election commission should correct that and then
24:03correct its systems that such mistakes do not happen in future. And then it should also come out
24:09publicly that we have found that there was some truth in these allegations and we have made
24:15corrections and these are the corrections we have made. This is how we have changed or corrected
24:21our systems. These are the only two options to my mind. There is no third option.
24:26It is not a question of who has said what. The question is what has been said. Is that
24:33correct or is that not correct? And the onus of proving that, as you have rightly said, is
24:41entirely on the election commission.
24:43But Mr. Chokar, in midst of all of this, the EC has also made a point, which is that Rahul
24:48Gandhi filed an affidavit. Why is it? Because, you know, you've made strong allegations.
24:53There are clearly some basis to it. Shouldn't then Rahul Gandhi at least sign that affidavit?
24:58I see no reason for an affidavit. I mean, a man has made a public statement. There are hundreds
25:08of people who have seen that happen. You don't need proof or affidavit for that. I mean, if
25:15these allegations are incorrect, election commission should prove them incorrect and then take action
25:22against him. That is when you will have to file an affidavit and do something more. But
25:27to this is like, I mean, I didn't want to use that cliche. It is like shooting the messenger
25:33rather than focusing on the message. So to my mind, an affidavit is not necessary. If election
25:41commission wants to investigate, there is nothing preventing it from investigating. And election
25:47commission with due deference to the election commission, they can ask anybody to do anything.
25:54It is, I mean, they can decide whether to investigate or not. They cannot ask somebody for an affidavit.
26:02They are not a court of law. And this debate is not happening in the court of law. It is happening
26:09in the court of public opinion. I mean, it has, happens in the court because election commission
26:16on Demfo yesterday when there was a heading of our application for details of the 65 black people,
26:24the election commission lawyer said, this is wrong, this, that, and the other. And the court said,
26:30put all this on an affidavit. The right to ask for an affidavit rests with the court of law,
26:37not with the election commission. Sir, I'm going to ask you one final question,
26:41sir, before we're going to let you go. So it's very clear the point that you're making,
26:45that the onus is now on the election commission to make a point by point rebuttal to what Rahul
26:50Gandhi and the leader of opposition has alleged. And then if proven wrong, take tangible action
26:57against the leader of opposition for once again attacking the credibility of a constitutional body.
27:03Correct? Not only point by point rebuttal, with evidence and with proof.
27:15Fair point, sir. Only rebuttal by saying it is all misleading, it is all baseless,
27:23it is not based on facts is not enough. Election commission has to provide proof which stands
27:30public scrutiny. It cannot be the judge, jury, and whatever that expression is, everything by itself.
27:40Election commission has to be prepared to stand before the jury, which is the citizens of the country.
27:49That is the answer. I mean, if I take it that way, Rahul Gandhi is wrong. Rahul Gandhi will also lose
27:54at the jury, which is the citizens of the country. This is not an issue of one institution deciding it.
28:01All right. So I appreciate you joining us. Thank you, Mr. Chokar, for taking the time out. I
28:07also appreciate the patience of our panelists for staying with us through this conversation.
28:11I want to go now to Sujata Paul, Congress spokesperson. Sujata Paul, while you had even Mr. Chokar who say you really
28:18don't need an affidavit, but if the election commission of India is asking the leader of opposition to put,
28:23you know, his money where the mouth, you know, is to file an affidavit, sign in on that affidavit,
28:30what's the problem in doing so if you're so sure of your allegations and your investigation, ma'am?
28:36Good evening, Preeti, and good evening to my co-panelists and to your audiences.
28:42The fact of the matter is that this vote, Chori, has happened and the BJP spokespersons have become
28:49the spokespersons of the ECI. Now, as far as the evidence is concerned, that evidence obviously is
28:55before the world to see. And I've heard that probably it is being submitted by the leader who lost in
29:04Bengaluru Central in the Lok Sabha elections. So concrete evidence has been presented to the
29:11country to the world, that in the world's largest democracy, there is vote Chori happening.
29:17So instead of water boundary, the election commission of India now needs to get itself
29:25in the right by telling us why it did so much of wrong. Why is it that they are not being able to
29:31provide a rebuttal to every single question, question by question, point by point on the issues
29:38raised by Rahul Gadhiji? Also, my leader Rahul Gadhiji has put forward the allegations with
29:46evidence. So these are not mere allegations. This is the truth. And if the ECI had to say that this
29:52was wrong, they would have said it by now. Why is it that they are only, you know, insistent on the
29:58affidavit, not on the facts. This clearly shows that they are on the back foot and they have no
30:03answers because they have been colluding with the BJP. And this is the reason why the BJP spokespersons
30:09are so eager today. And every, every BJP leader is attacking my leader, Rahul Gandhi, because they
30:16have no answers to the questions raised by him. Why is it that your reporters are bringing proof?
30:22This is what the work of reporters is, to find out the truth of the matter. If we've made some
30:28allegations without proof, your reporter wouldn't have shown that, you know, the one that you've
30:34shown where they've gone to that Bengaluru house where 80 people were living. And there is just one
30:39delivery man. Okay, ma'am, your favor is going to go down on its own and I'll come back to you on this.
30:43Rajat Sethi, I want to bring you in the sheer fact, you know, these are allegations that were made
30:46by Rahul Gandhi yesterday. We sent out teams of reporters to try and investigate. Prime FSI,
30:51there seem to be some amount of credibility in the charges, which definitely warrants a deeper
30:55investigation. The larger question, Rajat, is the fact that the election commission of India is a
31:02constitutional body. Should the Bharatiya Janata Party come out in such strong defense of charges
31:09that are against a constitutional body when that is the premise, it's not holding a debate on SIR in
31:15parliament? I don't think BJP, again, I'm not the spokesperson of the BJP, but I don't think BJP
31:22is trying to comment on behalf of the election commission. BJP is commenting on the political
31:28comment made by Mr. Rahul Gandhi, where he says that all the elections have been stolen by the BJP.
31:34And BJP is in its full right to actually retort to that, that, you know, in spite of, so in fact,
31:39it is quite funny. I was looking at some of the assertions made by Rahul Gandhi in his opening
31:44slide itself. And he says that, you know, it has never happened that any party has beaten
31:48anti-incumbency so, so many times. And he was making those supposition based arguments. I mean,
31:54look at his own family, his own family was holding on to power for two, three decades nonstop. I mean,
31:59his own argument falls flat with the evidence which comes from his own party ruling for almost 50 years
32:04and maximum years of those, those were by a single party rule. Again, let's not go into that. Let's
32:10specifically stick to what he said. And BJP is well within its right to contest what Rahul Gandhi is
32:14making political assertions. Now, you know, election commission has come out and said that,
32:19see, this is not the first time we are receiving these complaints. Kamal Nath's case was a serious
32:24complaint in 2018, which went up all the way up to Supreme Court. And they are saying that Mr. Rahul Gandhi
32:30is a repeat. So he's carrying that repeat negative message over and over again. And this is
32:34why we want to put in some kind of a seriousness behind the election commission putting in the
32:39taxpayer amount money into investigating something. There has to be a degree of seriousness. Because
32:44otherwise, these claims of assertions went all the way up to Supreme Court and were settled.
32:49There is a fixed procedure. In fact, some of the fraudulent claims that Rahul Gandhi is claiming today,
32:55those voters are coming out and putting pictures that, see, we have an epic card and we are not fraud
32:59voters. So, you know, it is not like Mr. Rahul Gandhi is the lord here and his whatever statement
33:05he makes is the gospel truth. It is not the case. He has made an assertion that so many voters are
33:11fraudulent voters. Now, if people are themselves coming up, so it is not a settled affair where you
33:16are claiming that this is a fraud voter list or something on those lines. This has to be contested.
33:20Okay. Have to be contested, but also definitely has to be investigated,
33:24because there is some amount of truth to that. And that's the larger question I think that beckons
33:28to be answered. I want to bring in Ashutosh into this conversation. Ashutosh, you know,
33:32everything has come down to also what the EC, the press conference that the EC held today,
33:36is if this, the leader of opposition is so sure of his assertion and his allegations, sign that
33:45affidavit. Why not sign the affidavit and say we've done it?
33:47See, Preeti, for the last 24 hours, whatever has happened, I'm not a believer in the conspiracy
33:55theories, but now I'm slowly and definitely I'm started believing that there might be a conspiracy
34:03and that conspiracy must have been used to manipulate the elections. Because the way the
34:08BJP is defending, vehemently defending, there's no reason for the BJP to come out openly and defend it.
34:13There's no reason. Because the case is between the Election Commission and the Congress Party.
34:16And the way the Election Commission is finding one alibi after another alibi not to investigate
34:22the matters. Till now, the BJP in the Election Commission has been saying that Rahul Gandhi is
34:26in a habit of accusing and disappearing. And when the defamation case is lost, he's asking for
34:33forgiveness. Now the issue is, Rahul Gandhi has come out with solid proof. Now the proof is there.
34:40So, the Election Commission is saying, I will not investigate. You give me an affidavit,
34:46written affidavit. It's something like this. A murder happens in my area, but the police is saying,
34:52unless you give me an affidavit in writing, only then I'll come and investigate. This has never
34:57happened. This is so brazen. And this is so arrogant. And that is why I'm getting more convinced that is
35:04they are a conspiracy to manipulate elections. Why BJP is defending Election Commission and why
35:10Election Commission is not coming out openly and investigating. Look at the election commissions
35:14conduct in Bihar. The reporters were exposing the weaknesses in the system. FIR were lost against
35:21them. Reporters were threatened they will put you behind the bar. Why so? Reporters' job is to put
35:27things before in the public domain. If the reporters are doing that, FIR is being launched against them.
35:34That is why I'm a little worried today that what is happening to the whole electoral process? Is BJP
35:40defending electoral process? Is it because there is some kind of a connivance? I don't want to believe
35:46into this. But since the event which has unfolded in the last 24 hours, it is forcing me to have a serious doubt.
35:53All right, I want to go back to R.P. Singh as well now. Mr. Singh, you know, there are multiple
35:59questions, you know, which arise. Number one, the fact is the Election Commission's credibility
36:05is at an all-time low. It's not something that I'm just saying offhand. I'm actually looking at four,
36:09five surveys conducted over the last three years by different bodies. And it does seem to suggest
36:13that there are questions where the Election Commission's functioning is concerned. The Election Commission
36:18should. Would you not reckon? Come out and clear all. Number one, why are we assuming that whatever
36:24has taken place is for the benefit of the Bharatiya Janata Party who could very well have been at 370 mark?
36:31Possible. So why are we anyway, you know, somewhere down the line assuming that this is counterproductive
36:36to a particular party and helped the BJP? Number one, there are also questions, Mr. Singh,
36:42which have been raised regarding the EC's decision to limit CC2E footage retention in polling booths to just
36:4845 days. It's a matter which is in court and the EC has to answer on that. So there are multiple points to all of it.
36:57First, Preeti, I really don't know what survey you are talking about or what feedbacks you are talking about.
37:03I can give you the source, sir, but make your point. You have two points.
37:06No, but I'll appreciate. We are talking, we are sitting on India Today debate and then I'll appreciate.
37:12Show me one survey of India Today which says the Election Commission credibility is very low.
37:16I seriously doubt there is one, but yes, you can... Sir, we do a PSE and we do a mood of the nation,
37:22but I'll give you the figures later, but you must complete. I'll give you 30 more seconds because I've
37:26interrupted. No, you give me five seconds, it doesn't matter. But Preeti, issue is,
37:31I mean, Ashutosh was just now questioning the election commission. Mr. Chokar was questioning
37:36the election commission. That election commission should answer. I mean, tomorrow I say Ashutosh,
37:42I saw Ashutosh stealing money from someone and let Ashutosh defend himself. I am saying so.
37:48I saw him stealing money. So will he go and say, no, no, I mean, I have to prove it. I have to file an
37:54application. I have to file an affidavit for that or he can put a case against me or he can put a,
38:00he can go to court against me. I mean, tomorrow I can say that I saw you doing something which
38:05is illegal, but that's not how the system functions. But coming to the point, I mean,
38:10where did I, I mean, I'm shocked. Ashutosh said BJP, we never defended the election commission.
38:16I just not told you election commission is on record saying that all these are misleading
38:20statements. I mean, please, I would, I would have appreciated you would have gone through the
38:26election commission's, uh, uh, uh, Twitter handle is clearly saying that and if it is saying so,
38:32then let Mr. If, let's put it other way around, let Mr. Raul Gandhi go and file a case against
38:37election commission saying that they are defaming me. I mean, that, that much at least was expected
38:42from a leader of opposition. But again, because I told you there's a, there's a video which I must show
38:48you because that will probably answer your question also and answer the question of the ladies sitting
38:54here. And give me a second. Here it is.
38:56How is school, private school?
39:04I am a private school, is a company school.
39:06You have an attorney in that. Is it good in that?
39:08I mean, now, I am an intern. In the company school.
39:13Are you getting better?
39:15They are as computer players and they have books as well.
39:19And they also save the money of cycling.
39:22You buy له.
39:25This is the real reason that he knows that he is going to lose election.
39:35Sir, you can get 10 more seconds.
39:38I'm not understanding what video you were trying to show,
39:40but you have 10 more minutes, 10 seconds.
39:41The video categorically showed that he went on the ground
39:44and he was told by a woman in the village site
39:49that yes, the education is good in Bihar.
39:52We get a cycle also.
39:55Our children have computer access also.
39:57They learn English also.
39:58Schools are doing much better now.
40:00You're saying that's the reason why he's making these allegations?
40:02All, yes, because he knows that how to cover up.
40:05But sir, you know, I'll tell you what.
40:07How to cover up for coming election.
40:08Okay, I'm going to go to...
40:09Make your point.
40:11How to cover up now?
40:13And they never raised a question when 22 lakh voters were deleted from Tanagana.
40:17Not a single question was there.
40:19Rather, Mr. Raventredi was appreciating the deletion of vote in Tanagana.
40:24So it is all being cooked up for a cover up of the election.
40:28But sir, the fact is there are allegations with proof or alleged proof
40:31that the Congress says it has.
40:33Right?
40:34Which we have sent out reporters.
40:35We found credible amount, at least which tantamounts to a detailed investigation
40:40that needs to be carried out.
40:42So also on your point of why are we questioning the EC?
40:46See, there's nobody above questioning in this country.
40:48Sir, you yourself know we are a democracy and you wanted to know what survey.
40:51The CSDS Lokniti 2024 survey on the Election Commission
40:56detailed how the credibility of the EC is being eroded.
40:59I would reckon it's one of the most trustworthy surveys in the country.
41:02Sir, many times you quoted back to me.
41:04But I'll come back to you.
41:05I'm going to give all the other guests two, two minutes.
41:07Sujata, Paul, once again, I'll come down to that same question
41:09that I've asked you before.
41:10These are closing comments of all of you.
41:12You have two minutes.
41:13If you're so sure of your allegations, sign that affidavit.
41:17Push the EC for an investigation.
41:21The EC needs to push itself.
41:23And you've heard the BJP spokesperson.
41:25The only thing that they have in mind are the elections.
41:27And this time the Bihar elections.
41:29But the EC has cooked up this khichdi.
41:32And this khichdi is now for everyone to see.
41:34And the constitutional body should not be questioned.
41:38It's the only argument that the BJP has.
41:40And the fact of the matter is, in the SIR Bihar,
41:44we have seen that Donald Trump's name is there.
41:47Ram, son of Dashrat Kaushalya from Khagadiya is there.
41:51There is an animal also.
41:52So the questions will be raised as to how come this is happening.
41:55It is the responsibility of the EC.
41:57If it is the constitutional body responsible for conducting elections,
42:00it is they are bound to answer all questions to make the system transparent,
42:06which they are not doing.
42:07Another very important thing is this whatabout tree is not going to be answered.
42:11In the case of the questions raised by the media,
42:14form a media advisor to the Manipur government.
42:17Attack RG all you want.
42:18But the questions of RG need to be answered.
42:21You know, recently in Uttarakhand, we had the municipal elections.
42:24After that, the panchayat elections.
42:25Now, openly people are asking questions.
42:28The media is putting it up on social media.
42:30And saying, how come there are a whole lot of vehicles going to villages to vote.
42:34And we are realizing that there are floating voters who are moving from one place to another.
42:39And what Rahul Gandhi ji has said about the voter chori in Karnataka has credible proof.
42:45If it is not credible, let the election commission come forward and take action.
42:50What action does it want to take?
42:51Let them take it.
42:53Okay.
42:54Rajat Sethi, final comments.
42:55Preeti ji, this is how you basically pick constitutional institutions and pour acid at the roots of it to erode public trust onto it so that people stop believing in our election system.
43:07This is the most sinister thing that you can do while on one hand you are carrying the constitutional book in your hand and the other hand you are carrying a bottle of acid.
43:14This is what is happening.
43:15If you are serious, and by the way, the similar allegations happened in Madhya Pradesh as I was mentioning.
43:21They said that similar photographs of 36 people, same photograph is there.
43:25And the election commission said that you are looking at a privately downloaded list which has not been the accurate list.
43:30And this went all the way up and was settled therefore by the Supreme Court where the Supreme Court said, please be serious in your accusations.
43:36And this is all what the election commission is saying.
43:39Today, I will tell you, Preeti ji, if you, as a voter, if I have an epic ID and an epic number at one location, I have to, if I have to go and register for another voter ID at another location in the same assembly, I can do that.
43:51The assertion has to be made by me.
43:53I make an acknowledgement that, yes, I don't have an existing epic.
43:56This is the reason, in order to remove all of the confusion, you ought to link it with Aadhaar.
44:01Or some government document which can be digitally, you know, sort of secured and can be digitally established.
44:07There are no two IDs of one guy or one person shouldn't have two epic IDs.
44:12And I think this is where election commission should go.
44:14But you know who throttled this basic thing?
44:17It was Congress Party.
44:19Congress Party said that you cannot link voter ID and Aadhaar numbers.
44:22Why?
44:23Can they prove, can you explain the reasoning behind it?
44:25No, you cannot.
44:26You want to make allegations and today you want to say that, okay, I made the allegations and those are
44:31tantamount to truth.
44:32It doesn't happen like that.
44:33You need to go and take it to the reasonable levels.
44:36Even if you go make an assertion in the courts, you need to file affidavits.
44:39Otherwise, even court is not going to entertain your petitions.
44:42So go through the process.
44:44There is, there is, there are established paths to do it.
44:46You are not somebody special born with a silver spoon or the Maharaja of this country.
44:51If you will get a separate treatment, then what I am going to get?
44:54You are eating away my 10 seconds, Preeti Ji.
44:56I don't have the time, I know.
44:58I'm going to take 10 seconds off from Achutosh as well.
45:01But yeah, Achutosh, your time starts now.
45:0410 seconds less, sir.
45:05Go ahead.
45:09See, Preeti, the whole, whole affair is, is really very murky.
45:15And there are the serious reasons to doubt.
45:18Now let's go back a little bit in the past.
45:21Supreme Court asked election commission, Supreme Court asked election commission, Supreme Court
45:27asked government to change the law.
45:31That selection of the election commission should be on a different parameters.
45:36They want the Chief Justice of India into that selection process.
45:41Government comes out and changes that rules.
45:43High Court, High Court, Haryana High Court, ask that you provide footage, CCTV footage.
45:49Government comes and changes the law.
45:50Now the issue is, earlier the footage could be restored for a longer period of time.
45:55Now the government, now the EC is saying, we'll remove those in 45 days.
45:59Now why you need to do this?
46:00You know, open and free democracy, if people are asking for data, you provide data.
46:04We are living in an age of data.
46:06You provide those data.
46:07You provide those CCTV footage.
46:09You provide the footage so that the acquisitions which are made against election commission
46:13and the BJP should be proved whether these acquisitions are true or false.
46:17Now the issue is, Rahul Gandhi has raised an issue.
46:20You get an investigation done.
46:21If investigation done, Rahul Gandhi is proved wrong, his political career will be over.
46:26But if he's right, then what will happen?
46:29Okay.
46:30We're going to leave it at that.
46:30I appreciate all four of you for joining us.
46:32You've made your stand very clear on India playing Pakistan.
46:35You know, there is the Asia Cup coming in.
46:37What's your view on that?
46:38No, I said it in Parliament during the Operational Sindhu debate that when the Prime Minister himself
46:43had said many times that water and blood cannot flow, talks and terrorism cannot go together.
46:51And rightfully after Operation Sindhu, this government have stopped issuing visas.
46:59They have stopped trade, directly indirect trade.
47:02We had, this government has suspended rightfully the Indus Water Treaty.
47:10We can, you know, we have stopped 80% of, according to the treaty, 80% water belongs to Pakistan.
47:16We have stopped, we have kept it in abeyance.
47:18When all such measures have been taken, how can you jump and play a cricket match?
47:25You see, when people say, oh, what, when you play other sports?
47:28So cricket is, it is not a sport in India.
47:30Yes.
47:31You know, it's football, hockey, volleyball, kabaddi.
47:36These are, you know, I'm sorry to use their sport, but here it's like an obsession.
47:41Yeah, you're right.
47:42You know, everything comes to a standstill.
47:44And like, for example, the last day of that cricket match, I was sitting in my home.
47:52I had a parliament to go, but I wanted.
47:53You didn't go.
47:54I went to parliament and I rushed back.
47:57So when, fortunately, the parliament was, it was not working.
48:01I rushed back and I had put my cell phone on silent and I was watching, okay, now what's
48:07going to happen?
48:09You see, so cricket is like that.
48:11And then, and then there's so much of money in cricket, which is not there in other sports.
48:16So, I don't know.
48:18I'm surprised and shocked that we are playing a cricket match in Dubai with Pakistan.
48:27But anyways, I will not watch it.
48:29You won't watch it?
48:30I'll not watch it.
48:31Why wouldn't?
48:32Because of Operation Sindhu.
48:33Yeah, because, not Operation Sindhu, but because of, you know, that shocking incident of
48:40Pehlgaam, it is too horrific that someone can be shot in front of their small children,
48:46wives, mothers, what it is, you know, it's like, you're watching, you, you know, your
48:52wife is watching her husband being shot in her, in his head.
48:56You know, that is, that is very painful.
48:59You know, we, we, unfortunately, in our country, we forget the victims.
49:04That is what it is.
49:04That's true.
49:05When people die, either a natural disaster or a bomb blast, you tend to forget.
49:10But, you know, we, of course, everyone will have to carry on life.
49:14But, but we also forget that 21 civilians lost in Pakistan shelling, you know, we lost many
49:21things.
49:22So, so suddenly, it's like, whoa, then why do we have, why do, why are we not issuing
49:29visas?
49:30Why are we, why have we called back our diplom, diplomats?
49:33We have many minimal presence in, now, Islamabad.
49:37We have sent back many of these Pakistani officers who are indulging in some spying or
49:4319 national activities.
49:46We have suspended indirect trade.
49:49Hwaga border is closed.
49:52So, how does it make, I don't know, it, to me, it doesn't make sense.
49:56So, Mr. Rashaduddin OEC is going to boycott the India, Pakistan match?
49:59No, I do, I do not watch it.
50:00I do not use boycott and, and give any respect to Pakistan.
50:04I do not watch it.
50:05Why do you think we are going ahead with this match?
50:07What do you think, what, what are our compulsions?
50:09I do not know, I do not know, I do not know, this is for the BCCI to answer, this is for
50:15the office bearers of BCCI to answer, this is for the government of India to answer, why
50:20have they given permission?
50:21It is for them to answer, because, you know, if you can, if you are playing and you say it's
50:29a bilateral, the World Bank treaty is also bilateral.
50:34You know, many of these pharmaceutical companies send their products to Dubai, from Dubai it
50:40goes to Pakistan, they are also losing on it.
50:44You have Jalandhar is the centre for, you know, you know, readymade garments, they are losing
50:50on it.
50:51So, it does not make sense.
50:52I do not know, I do not know why, but this is my, this is, this is my personal decision,
50:57I do not want to work that much, simple as that.
51:00.
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