- 5 months ago
This episode of To The Point discusses two significant political developments. The first focusses on the escalating confrontation between the opposition and the Election Commission of India (ECI) following an August 17 press conference and the opposition's August 18 counter.
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00:00An escalating face-off
00:12The Opposition vs. Election Commission
00:20Faced with opposition ire on allegations of voter fraud
00:32and conducting a contentious voter revision exercise in Bihar.
00:36The Election Commission is not on the BJP.
00:40The Election Commission is working for the Samvidhan.
00:43The Election Commission of India
00:51finally held a press conference on the 17th August.
01:09The gloves are off, the daggers are drawn.
01:13A constitutional body now openly challenged by the Opposition.
01:21On 18th, the Opposition countered the Election Commission.
01:28This is ludicrous.
01:29It is not the job of the Chief Election Commissioners to attack the Opposition.
01:32Your job, sir, is to go into great detail
01:35as to what the valid queries raised by the Opposition was.
01:39As per sources, the Opposition is considering moving an impeachment motion
01:51against the Chief Election Commissioner.
01:53As per sources, the Opposition is considering moving an impeachment motion
02:04against the Chief Election Commissioner.
02:07The all-out blow-up now playing live
02:19as Rahul Gandhi and Tejasvi embark on a voter adhikar yatra in Bihar.
02:38Good evening, viewers. You're watching To The Point.
02:47I'm Preeti Chaudhary.
02:48Our big debate this evening is on the Election Commission's response,
02:52which happened yesterday.
02:54Convincing or adding to the confusion?
02:57All of that discussed over the course of the next 45 minutes.
03:00Allow me to take you through the headlines.
03:06War of words over new NDA Vice President candidate Rajanath dials opposition Netas
03:11to support NDA's Vice President pick.
03:14New VP candidate CP Radha Krishnadeen Delhi to meet the Prime Minister.
03:18Opposition may move to impeach CEC Gyanesh Kumar after CEC sought proof of or apology from Rahul Gandhi.
03:30Opposition may lack numbers to oust CEC, but seemingly adamant to put up the optics.
03:43Discussion on shooks disrupted in Parliament.
03:46BJP, it's out at the opposition, calls it insult to India's space hero.
03:52Shook's likely to meet Prime Minister today.
03:54Anytime now.
03:59Heavy rains bring Mumbai to a standstill.
04:01Orange alert in Mumbai, red in Thane.
04:03Streets, waterlogged, traffic snarls, cops issue advisory over heavy rains.
04:07Exposed Pakistan, Operation Sindhu retreat at sea.
04:16First time on television, how Pakistan Navy collapsed Indian warships, proud Pakistan voters.
04:25Zelensky Trump meet again, this time on Peace at 10pm tonight.
04:30European leaders to also attend meet.
04:32Back Zelensky.
04:33Zelensky says want peace with Russia.
04:35All right viewers, so most of us did hear the press conference that the Election Commission held yesterday,
04:52taking about 40 to 50 questions.
04:54Whether the Election Commission was successful in clearing the confusion
04:58or it only resulted in adding to the confusion.
05:02Well, let's take us, you know, our viewers, quickly through some of the questions that were raised
05:07and some that were answered, some that remain unanswered.
05:10Let's go through the unanswered questions first.
05:12After Rahul Gandhi's press conference, there are many complaints coming from different states,
05:16including Kerala.
05:17Will you initiate an inquiry into allegations from all these states?
05:20This was a question that was posed to the Election Commission of India.
05:24What is the need to do SIR in haste in Bihar when there are flash floods in Bihar and very limited time?
05:32What is the haste?
05:33Why tie the SIR to the elections which will take place in just about two months from now,
05:39or rather nearly, just a month and a half from now?
05:42That question remained unanswered by the Election Commission of India.
05:46The Supreme Court ordered the Election Commission viewers, if you remember, in the last hearing,
05:51to give machine-readable names of 65 lakh people that were deleted.
05:57Why did you not give it earlier?
05:59Till now, the Election Commission is yet to publish the 65 lakh names.
06:03That question remained unanswered.
06:06BJP MP Anurag Thakur claimed to have concrete proof that issues raised by Rahul Gandhi also exist
06:13in Wayanad and Rai Bareilly and some other constituencies where the Congress won.
06:19Will the Election Commission investigate the matter highlighted by the political parties?
06:24And will the Election Commission also ask Anurag Thakur to sign an affidavit like it has asked Rahul Gandhi to sign?
06:33That question remained unanswered.
06:35In Aadhaar, where the biometric system ensures uniqueness for every individual,
06:40no such feature is there for EPIC.
06:42How will this be graded?
06:45No answer from the Election Commission.
06:477.24 crore elector forms have been received as of August 1st.
06:52How many of these have been submitted without documents?
06:55Mind you, if you remember, viewers, the Election Commission also started picking up the forms without documents.
07:00And if they're without documents, can they actually pass off as a legal voter?
07:05That question remained unanswered.
07:07The other question that was asked,
07:08Now that 15 days are over, how many more documents have been made for these electors?
07:13Unanswered.
07:14Why SIR is being done when a summary revision had already been conducted earlier this year?
07:19Unanswered.
07:20Now, viewers, those are just some, very few of the questions that were unanswered by the Election Commission yesterday.
07:25Let me now get you to the questions that the Election Commission, in fact, answered.
07:31Dismissed vote theft claims.
07:33Clearly, political parties have long demanded corrections in electoral roads is something that the Election Commission said.
07:40SIR being carried out to address exactly those concerns raised by these very political parties.
07:47Voters and 1.6 lakh BLAs have jointly prepared draft rule.
07:52Entire process is transferred.
07:55Multiple questions that the Election Commission also answered very clearly.
07:59Some points were rebutted of the allegations that Rahul Gandhi had made.
08:06So, we was at the back of this, certain questions that we're posing out there.
08:09Then we're going to cut across to our panelists this evening.
08:12So, the questions that I ask in this debate,
08:16Has the Election Commission cleared doubts or only escalated the confusion?
08:21Is the first question we ask.
08:22The second question, has the EC really done enough to uphold its neutral, transparent credentials?
08:28Did the EC hide more than it revealed?
08:31Is the other question that we are asking this evening.
08:34Whether the Election Commission hid more than it revealed?
08:37And ultimately, is it the bid of the opposition to discredit the Election Commission
08:43by planting seeds of doubt, taking on a constitutional body?
08:48Let's take all these questions to our panelists this evening.
08:50Joining me, JVL Narsama Rao, former member of Rajya Sabha and National Spokesperson Bharatiya Janata Parti.
08:57Thank you for joining us.
08:58Ghan Shaham Tiwari, Spokesperson Samajwadi Parti, Adil Singh Boparoy, National Spokesperson Congress, KC Tiaaghi,
09:05former MP Rajya Sabha and senior leader JDU.
09:09Tiaaghi ji, first of all, we'll start with you.
09:11All of you will get a two-minute time to put your point forward.
09:15Tiaaghi ji, you think that yesterday the Election Commission has a press conference in the press conference?
09:19Is there any confusion that has been increased or any clarity?
09:23Tiaaghi ji, because the opposition says that you are a BJP, like the CEC has a press conference in the press conference?
09:30Tiaaghi ji, I think that you are a press conference in the press conference.
09:37Tiaaghi ji, you know, I have a press conference.
09:46,
09:48जादो जी ने तो सैसन को इतना एक्यूज और एब्यूज किया था कि पगला सांड शब्द इस्तेमाल किया गया था चुनाव कमिशन के लिए सैसन वर्सिस दा नेशन चुनाव हो गया बियार में यह लालू प्रसाद जी ने कहा था दो 1995 में जब विदान सभा का चुना हुआ
10:18जुबा देंगे सैसन को इस तरह के आरूप लालू परसाद जी की पार्टी में लगाए थे लेकिन कॉंग्रेस पार्टी पचास साल तक देश में राज की है नहरू और सरदार पटेल की लीगेसी को ओन करती है तो उनसे में कॉंस्ट्यूशनल जो इंस्ट्यूशन्स हैं उ
10:48मैं च्छे बार लोकसभा का चुनाव लड़ा हूं और जब भी कॉंग्रेस के रूल में मैंने चुनाव लड़ा है मेरे भी कुछ ऑब्जेक्शन्स थे बट आई वाज रॉंग और इलेक्शन कमिशन वाज़ाइट हम लोग हमारे सपोर्टर करते हैं कि यह गलती होगी यह �
11:18पार्टी से उम्मीद नहीं करता वो चुनाव आयोक से अपनी शिकायते दर्ज करें उनको हल कराएं जब मेरा दुबारा नंबर आप देंगी बोलने के लिए तम मैं बताऊंगा कि उन्होंने जितने भी सवाल उठाए थे सारे सवालों का जबाब चुनाव आयोक की तरफ स
11:48हजार बें ले थे और जेडी के उन्होंने एक भी औबजेक्शन में रिज क्याओ सिंगिल बन अब कहने के लिए आप चुनाव का भइसकार करो दिक्कत क्या है जो मैं बहुत कंजूसी से चाहता हूं
12:022025
12:03में अपनी संभावित
12:05हार को देख करके
12:07वो पहले से ही वातवन बनाने में लग गए है
12:09कि चुना का भैसकार करो
12:11चुना में बेईमानी होगी
12:13चुना में गड़बर हो जाएगी
12:15वहाँ पे नितिश कुमार जी के नेत्रित में
12:18और लालु परसाजी के नितिश में चुना होता है
12:20और उसके बीच में
12:22जब भी जनता को चुना होता है
12:24वो नितिश पलस
12:25जो कट बंदा ने उसको चुनते है
12:27त्यागी जी, देखे, वक्त तो हो चला है
12:29और बिकुस आई
12:30नहीं, सर मैं आती हूँ, दो मिनट मैं आती हूँ आपके पास
12:33बात त्यागी जी, I'm going to remove the clock
12:35because I really hope all four of you
12:37will respect each other
12:39and abide by the rules of debate
12:41giving equal time to your panelists
12:43so I'm going to remove the clock and let's see how this goes
12:45बात त्यागी जी, there are
12:48और सवाल जो बहुत सारे नहीं आंसर की है
12:5045 days, जो 45 दिन का समय
12:52उसके जो CEC ने बोला
12:5545 दिन के पहले का प्रिविसी नहीं होती है, मैं आउंगी सर, मैं उस पे भी आउंगी
12:59और GVR जी से ये भी पूछूंगी
13:01के अफिडेविट अनुराग जी से क्यों नहीं मांग रहे हैं
13:04क्योंकि अनुराग जी ने भी वही
13:06बसक्त मैं आउंगी का जो रहुल गांदी जी ने रहे हैं
13:08But I want to bring in Aadil Singh Boparoy into this conversation
13:11Aadil Singh Boparoy, I want to ask you a question which it seems
13:14that the opposition is mulling and that's a very, very grave
13:17charge which is
13:19it seems and correct me if I'm wrong
13:21that the opposition is actually mulling
13:23an impeachment motion against the CEC
13:25is it true, sir?
13:27Preeti, all options are on the table
13:29I repeat, all options
13:31are on the table but of course the opposition
13:33bloc will take a decision at the opportune time after consulting all allies and partners.
13:40Number one. Number two, I think this is something which is very critical and your viewers must
13:45know that under our laws and under the constitution of India, the responsibility is entrusted to the
13:53election commission of India to prepare electoral rolls. They cannot delegate or pass on this
14:01responsibility to the political parties or to our agents, etc. Number two. Number three, let me
14:08debunk some of the assertions which were made by the chief election commissioner yesterday.
14:13In response to our specific demand in order to purify the electoral rolls that please hand over
14:21machine-readable electoral rolls for us to search because otherwise it is not humanly possible to
14:27go through the data. The chief election commissioner says the Supreme Court has told them not to hand
14:32over this data in a machine-readable format. This is absolutely incorrect. I challenge the
14:39election commission of India to show that paragraph from any Supreme Court judgment of 2019 where the
14:46Supreme Court has said that don't hand over machine-readable data because that violates privacy
14:52concerns. This is a bogus statement which has been made by the chief election commissioner. Number
14:59three. Number four, under the registration of electoral or electoral rules 1960, in terms of form six,
15:09whenever a new or a fresh voter wants to have himself included on the electoral rolls, it is mandatory for
15:16him to give proof of residence. So, therefore, he must specify what house number, what tahsil, what district.
15:24Now, please respond to this. How is it humanly possible that 40,000 electors or voters are registered
15:34at house number zero, double zero, triple zero, in the center of Mahadevpura?
15:40But on that account, the EC also said that many of them don't really have a home and that's why they have
15:46been registered under zero. The election commission did, you know, respond to that question, that specific
15:52question. It might not have responded to a lot of questions, but it did respond to that specific
15:57question saying that many of them don't really have a home. Therefore, you know, you put in an X number
16:04and by the virtue of the Congress insulting the homeless, you know, that's another question that
16:09was raised by the BJP. I'll come back to you, sir. I will. I'll come back to you. Allow me to bring in
16:14GVL, Narsimha Rao, into this conversation, sir. You know, the top question today comes in from multiple
16:20questions that remain unanswered by the election commission. Let's begin with one, sir. The sheer fact
16:25that the EC, with many thought was much bravado, asked Rahul Gandhi to sign an affidavit or apologize to the
16:30country. Why hasn't the same question been asked of Anurag Thakur, where he made exactly the same
16:37allegation on the seat of Rai Bareilly, on the seat of Vyanard No. 1. On the issue of 45 days,
16:44giving the CCTV footage, you had the election commission actually speak of the privacy of the
16:49mothers and daughters. Doesn't the same privacy exist 45 days earlier? Many other questions that
16:54still remain unanswered. Where the election commission goes, sir. Yeah. Good evening, Priti.
17:00to you and all the panelists and the viewers. You see, questions to the election commission,
17:06you should pose them to the election commission. I will not be in a position to answer.
17:09I'm glad you say that, sir. I'm glad you say that. You're the first BJP spokesperson who has
17:14come and said exactly this, that these are questions for the election commission. But go ahead,
17:18sir. Make your point. Sorry to interrupt. Yeah. So whatever questions you have or opposition may
17:22have, I think they should pose to the election commission and it's for them to respond or defend
17:28their position on them. But as I'm only responding to the charges made by Rahul Gandhi and I'll answer
17:34any other questions that you may have. The foundations of the press conference that Rahul Gandhi had held
17:41itself is bogus. I make this charge. If the Congress party dares, they should take me to court. Rahul Gandhi's,
17:50most of the statements that I'm going to narrate now were completely fake, false, and he used them
17:56to only sound very credible and credulous. Number one, he claimed that in the Bangalore
18:03central constituency, the BJP had led only in Mahadevpura assembly and apparently Congress
18:11party swept all other seven segments and yet the BJP had won. This was a fake statement by Rahul Gandhi,
18:19fake number one, because the BJP led in four out of eight assembly segments and not one out of eight,
18:26as he claimed. Second, the BJP also won in four out of eight assembly consciences of the same parliament
18:35consciences since last assembly election when Congress swept to power. We still won four out of
18:44these eight conscience assembly segments in the assembly election. Third, this is one Mahadevpura.
18:51It was formed only in 2008, post delimitation, and we won every single election. The Congress
18:58never won this seat. 2008, 2013, 2018, and 2023. And we won this parliament constituency, Bangalore
19:09central, in every election, 2008, 2013, 2018, and 2023. Therefore, Rahul Gandhi first should apologize
19:18to the constituents, to the people of Bangalore central constituency, to the member who got elected,
19:24member of parliament who got elected from there, because all his inferences were drawn from these
19:31fake facts. The third fake fact that Rahul Gandhi mentioned is the votes, number of votes went up by
19:371,250,000 votes in Mahadevpura assembly, which gave the BJP a very, which helped BJP to steal election.
19:45This is nothing but another bogus statement by Rahul Gandhi. Actual number of votes, this is by far the
19:52largest constituency, with more than three and a half lakh votes, more than six and a half lakh votes,
19:57and the number of votes went up by about 55,000, about 52,571. Not about, exactly. It went up from
20:08assembly election to Lok Sabha by 52,000. So where did he get this 1,250,000 from? Either Rahul Gandhi
20:15does not know his max, or he thinks he can fake anything and then get away and fool people and also
20:24blame the election commission. Let me come to the point that was raised by our Congress friend.
20:29It is the job of the election commission to prepare electoral rolls. Are we not unaware? Is my friend
20:35not unaware that the election commission of India has no employee whatsoever in any state? They only
20:43have their employees in the headquarters of the election commission of India. The preparation of
20:48electoral rolls is done by the both level officers and above them at various levels. There are district
20:56election officers and and CEO above them who oversee this functioning. They all are employees of the
21:02state government. If Rahul Gandhi has a problem with Mahadevpura or Bangalore central constituency,
21:08he must reveal whether there was a conspiracy by Sidhara Mahadev or D.K. Shokumar or Rahul Gandhi
21:16or his own government or his employees in the state government were complicit in this so-called bogus
21:22overtake. I think you cannot put this blame on the election commission. This is the job of the
21:27local administrators, local officers who are under the state government. I'll come back to you. I just want
21:34to tell our viewers Ghansham Tiwari from the Samajwadi party has had an emergency. He's had to log out. So we're
21:41going to give a little bit of extra time to Adil Singh Bhopurai to make the, you know, the pitch for a united
21:46India alliance. Tyagi ji,
21:48two questions, Rahul Gandhi, Rahul Gandhi, Rahul Gandhi, Anurag Thakur,
22:02not asking for charges. The charges are the same. The charges are the same.
22:17The other thing, when we talk about 45 days, CCTV footage, the mother-in-law reminds us of the privacy.
22:23I remember that the female modesty will not stay in the first 45 days connected to electoral voter transparency.
22:34The second thing, EC said that exercise was necessary,
22:38because the guspeti of foreign illegal immigrants were many in roles.
22:48So, it was not a number that was illegal.
22:54It was 22,000,000 people in January,
22:59it was said that it was the beginning of the year.
23:02Why did he not say that?
23:05foreign
23:19foreign
23:33Subhanshu Shukla ke saath joh abhi aay hai bas thode se tada darshakon ko dikha ke aapke paas abhi vaapesa aate hai.
23:38These are visuals we are coming in of Prime Minister Modi meeting our space hero Subhanshu Shukla.
23:44So Shukh is back in the country and there those visuals coming in of the Prime Minister meeting Subhanshu Shukla
23:51where of course clearly you can see Subhanshu Shukla taking the Prime Minister through
23:55on what his space odyssey was all about.
23:59Explaining to him, detailing, telling him on what his journey was
24:07well clearly a proud moment for the country and the Prime Minister
24:10solicitating Subhanshu Shukla.
24:15In the morning there was questions in the Parliament that you had the
24:20treasury benches raised that the opposition didn't quite want to debate
24:24However, these visuals now coming in of the Prime Minister meeting Subhanshu Shukla.
24:31Lovely visuals coming in of our space hero where you have Subhanshu Shukla
24:34detailing his space odyssey to the Prime Minister of the country.
24:39Let's go back now to the debate that we've been tracking very closely
24:42and joining me back is Kesi Tyaghi ji.
24:44Tyaghi ji bhout sare sawaal kiyathe.
24:46Didi ji ji utur.
24:50I wanted to say that Congress Party plus
24:52comes the time he's shakayate in the direction of Chinese
24:53Congress Party plus
24:58what even though she passed them
25:00so let me grant a chance for the political party
25:02and to give her permission.
25:05।
25:35district magistrate की website पर डाल दिया गया है तीसरा शिकायत ये
25:41important है शिकायत या पुरन निरिक्षन के लिए 15 दिन का समय दिया गया है
25:46ताकि यदि कोई व्यक्ति खुद को हटाए जाने पर आपतिजेता न चाहे तो वे उचित
25:52समय में कारवाई कर सके अब मैं आपसे कहना चाहता हूं कि 55,000
25:57BLA RJD के मौजूद थे मैं अपने कांग्रेस के मित्र से नहीं मैं तो RJD के
26:06कोई हो तित्रमन से पूछ था एक भी objection 55,000 लोगों ने नहीं किया है दूसरा
26:13नाम हटाने का कारण भी लिखा जाए तो अपने पोर्टल में उन्होंने नाम ये भी दिख दिया है
26:24which is in public domain now at the moment the moment I am talking to you कि इस वज़े से नाम हटाया गया
26:31और कोट ने कहा था कि हटाये गए लोग शिकायट कर सके अभी तक जो 56,000 लाग हैं उसमें से
26:39तीन हजार कुछ लोगों ने खाली complaint किया है अब मैं आपसे ये निविदन करना चाहता हूं कि मरत जो हुए हैं हटे जो हैं दो जगे जो हैं अब बियार की एक और थोड़ा में बताना चाहता हूं गंशाम जी नहीं है तो मैं चुके बियार से राजस्वा में रहा हूं थो
27:09लोग यहां माइगरेट कर गए तो दो दो जगे भी नाम हुए हैं और कुछ लोग मर गए हैं जिनको राहूल गांटीजी ने जिनके साथ चाए पी हैं कितने लोग हैं दो तीन चार पांच से साथ राट नो दस एक अब जो नहीं लिस्ट बनी है उसमें महिलाओं के नाम ज
27:39के नाम के नाम जादा कटे भी हैं महिलाओं के नाम क नाम जादा पूरोशों के पुर४िर इनका यह बहा था कि जो मुस्लिम डॉमिनीते अरियां वहां नाम जादे कटे हैं आपकी
27:59जानकारी के लिए पठना शहर जो मिडिल क्लास डॉमिनेटीड है रविशंकर प्रसाद जहां से MP हैं सबसे जादे नाम पठना में कटें 31,000 जो किसी
28:09सबस्क्राइब के सामने यह सारी चीजे रखी जाएंगी सुप्रीम कोट 22 को तो यह साथ होगा क्या कोई हमारी पार्टियों का इनका नहीं कोई भी अभी तक इन्होंने
28:3152 घंटे के बाद जो 55,000,000 लोग हैं इनहें कितने मृत हैं इनहें पता हिनी कितने माइग ने
28:39आपने नसे डिटिय्ल किया जो SIR के issues हैं आपने उसे डिटेल किया पर issues और भी है क्योंकि ये दो तर्क की बात हुए है जो कल
28:49election commission ने press conference की एक जो SIR special intensive role revision exercise काभी contentious है
28:55It's very contentious, which is taking place in the state of Bihar.
28:58That was just one issue.
29:00The other issue was the allegations of voter fraud and collusion,
29:04alleged collusion of the Election Commission as well as the BJP
29:08is something that the opposition had raised.
29:10So the Election Commission held a press conference on both the issues.
29:14Like I said, some questions were answered, but many remained unanswered as well.
29:18I want to bring back Adil Singh Bhoparoy into this conversation.
29:20Many questions, Adil.
29:21You've lost your ally in this debate, Ghansham Tiwari,
29:24but please go ahead.
29:25GVL, Rao had raised certain questions and so has Mr. Tiagi.
29:31Preeti, the BJP, their allies and the Election Commission of India
29:35cannot make a virtue out of necessity.
29:39Now, let me explain for the benefit of your viewers
29:42that the government and the Election Commission of India
29:45were stridently opposed to revealing the names of 65 lakh people
29:51and the reasons for their deletion before the Supreme Court.
29:55They had resisted this demand from the petitioners.
30:00It was the Supreme Court which directed nothing doing
30:04in the interest of fairness and transparency.
30:07You must reveal the names of all 65 lakh persons,
30:11the reasons for their deletion,
30:14and give it adequate publicity.
30:16So, please, the BJP should not make a virtue out of this, number one.
30:21Number two, it is not just about individuals or voters
30:25who are found at a particular house number zero or a double zero.
30:29It is also a case where there are invalid photographs
30:33or the photographs are not identifiable.
30:36This is how voter fraud takes place.
30:40In Mahadevpura, there are thousands of epic numbers and voters
30:45whose photographs are not discernible.
30:47Number two, number three, there are instances
30:51where close to 40 to 80 people are found at one address.
30:56How is it humanly possible that a small room of eight by eight
31:01has 40 to 60 people living in that small room?
31:05Number three, number four, in response to what you had put to me
31:09and what the EC had said,
31:11that, well, there are individuals who are homeless.
31:14Now, let me give some statistics for the benefit of your viewers.
31:17Mahadevpura, as a constituency, has a size of 6 lakhs.
31:22There were 14,000 voters who were registered
31:25at house number zero or double zero.
31:27Are you trying to say that approximately 8% of Mahadevpura
31:31are homeless?
31:32Who are we trying to fool here?
31:36Who is the election commission of India trying to fool here?
31:39Number four, if the BJP, the JDU, the ECI have nothing to hide,
31:46if they are indeed sincere and transparent,
31:50why are they reluctant to put out machine-readable data?
31:54At the end of the day, isn't the objective of all political parties
31:58to have a sacristant data which does not involve any kind of duplication?
32:05Why are they resisting this?
32:06Because there is no Supreme Court direction.
32:09Number five, which is one of the most critical parts here,
32:13please understand, it is the responsibility of the ECI
32:17to ensure the purity of the electoral rules.
32:20Mr. Tyagi was saying, why didn't the opposition parties raise this
32:24through their activists before the BNO?
32:27It is not our responsibility.
32:30They are constitutionally mandated.
32:33They cannot pass the buck on to us.
32:35They have to purify this.
32:37And lastly, Preeti, what has happened is brazen fabrication of electoral rules.
32:44Of course, this conspiracy runs very deep.
32:48And in due course, the conspiracy will be revealed.
32:51But what has happened is brazen forgery, fabrication of electoral records
32:57to give advantage to a certain political party.
33:00Okay, you know, I'm glad all of us are hearing each other around.
33:04This is the best debate I've had in a while.
33:06But GVL Narsuma Roussa, your turn.
33:08Make your point.
33:10I'm surprised.
33:12I called Rahul Gandhi.
33:14I called out his lies.
33:15I said he made several statements in the press conference
33:18which were completely bogus statements.
33:22And he rested all his case based on fake imaginary facts.
33:29And I'm surprised my Congress friend does not have anything to counter it.
33:33And I repeat my challenge.
33:35If whatever I said is not a fact,
33:38I think I invite Congress party to question me.
33:43Maybe friend Adil doesn't have the numbers with him,
33:46but they can do it through Twitter or through a legal case.
33:50But I'm calling Rahul Gandhi a liar
33:53because he rested his case entirely on fakeful imaginary information.
33:59Now, coming to the points that were raised by Mr. Adil,
34:03let me say this.
34:04ECA certainly, yesterday we all heard on Friday,
34:07Supreme Court ordering Election Commissioner of India
34:10to make the entire list of 65 lakh deleted voters publicized,
34:17make it a transparent process.
34:19And ECA has agreed immediately.
34:21They did not say we don't have this data,
34:23we will not be able to do it.
34:25They have all the data.
34:26For some reasons, you see across the world,
34:29this transparency versus privacy of electoral data
34:33is a subject of debate.
34:35And I'm surprised that nowhere in our national media
34:38we talked about this.
34:39We think it's everything can be put on age, name, sex.
34:43Everything can be put out in public forums.
34:47In many countries, the electoral lists are not made public.
34:53But they are given to the candidates and to the political parties
34:56in the run-up to the elections for their own internal use,
34:59not for any other purpose.
35:01But I certainly think the Supreme Court has done a lot of good
35:06to this debate on transparency by ordering.
35:08But how many has the Congress Party been able to detect?
35:12So far, 65 lakh votes have been revealed.
35:16The entire list is out.
35:17What has the Congress Party done today?
35:19All right, I'm running out of time.
35:20I'm going to allow just 20 seconds each to all our panelists.
35:23But, you know, Mr. Rao, there's also a fact,
35:26you know, you quoted other countries,
35:27but across the world,
35:28the maximum powers of an election commission
35:30actually lies in India.
35:32But I want to give 30 seconds,
35:3330 seconds, KCG.
35:35Tyagi ji, say, sir.
35:3630 seconds, final words, sir.
35:373.
35:41Preeti ji, Congress Party
35:43jaysi party say,
35:44I'm not going to move on.
35:45That I have no hope in the RGD,
35:47Jhar Khand Mokti Morchay jaysi party
35:49jaysi party yoiu ke sath rhae karke
35:51unparlimentary, unconstitutional
35:54tariqe akhtiar karay mahii ki jantar karayi katao,
35:57main jantadal me tha,
35:58Lalo ji ke sath,
36:00sarad yadav ke sath,
36:01ramilaz paswafan ke sath,
36:02military bilayay gati ti,
36:04biaar ke chunau ko conduct kanan nai ke liye,
36:06I am not aware of the past, but I do not know much.
36:12You are the one year ago.
36:15We are the one year old.
36:20We are the one year old.
36:23We are the one year old.
36:25That's what I was saying.
36:27But you are the one year old.
36:30Please.
36:31Make your point.
36:33We have to learn about this.
36:38In 1995, the first military organizations
36:42have been conducted in Bihar.
36:45They have been standing in Congress.
36:4830 seconds.
36:50Adil, you have 30 seconds to put your point forward.
36:53I think Tiaghi Sahib and Mr. Rao are missing a very fundamental point.
36:59This is not about the Congress.
37:01This is not about the JDO.
37:02This is not about the BJP.
37:04This is about strengthening our electoral system.
37:07This is about democracy.
37:09This is about the right to vote and about the sanctity of your vote.
37:14Let's not reduce this to a verbal duel.
37:18Let us all collectively work towards purifying the electoral roll and ensuring that no quarter is left out.
37:26I think this is about something far more important than political bickering.
37:32Adil, I need to cut you, sir.
37:33I need to go into a break.
37:35But quickly, Mr. Rao, your take, sir.
37:37Quick, 20 seconds, sir.
37:38You see, we all need to understand the Election Commission of India needs all state governments,
37:45the entire state machinery, all political parties, and all other actors in the democratic process to work with them,
37:52to make this a completely pure electoral rolls.
37:55You cannot say, because it's there in the Constitution, everything has to be done by the Election Commission.
38:00The photographs are not clearly legible.
38:03Certainly, we all, wherever you are in power, wherever BJP is in power, they all have to work towards ensuring that the voter rolls are perfect.
38:13Right.
38:14I agree.
38:15But making allegations against the Election Commission of India and trying to really impute motives,
38:22I think that is where the debate gets lost.
38:24You have to base your arguments on facts and not fiction, as Rahul Gandhi has done.
38:29All right.
38:30I'm going to leave it at that.
38:31We appreciate all three gentlemen for joining us.
38:33Thank you there.
38:34All right, let's quickly get into the latest news break that we are getting in.
38:37It's a big scoop coming in from the India bloc.
38:39All of this in the backdrop of the India bloc picking its vice president candidate.
38:46Sources tell us the DMK is also in favor of having a vice president candidate
38:50as there is an ideological war over BJP pitching CP Radhakrishnan as the VP candidate.
38:56Sources tell us that Mr. Karge has been entrusted now with the task of finalizing the name.
39:02Name of Padma Shree M. Anna Durai, eminent scientist, was also discussed in the meeting.
39:07The name was mentioned by Professor Ram Gupal Yadav.
39:10Sources say that one leader pitched that candidate should either be from Bihar because of the upcoming Vidhan Sabha polls and the entire SIR issue or from Tamil Nadu.
39:20Now, Mr. Karge, Malik Arjun Karge will speak to top brass of the India bloc this evening including Mamata Banerjee and finalize a name that will be acceptable to all and announced by tomorrow afternoon.
39:33I want to immediately cut across to my colleague Moshmi Singh.
39:37Moshmi, because of the NDA pick putting the DMK in a Catch-22 situation, the DMK very clear that they want a candidate from Tamil Nadu so at least it's a face saver they can support that candidate.
39:48That's one thought. One thought of course, pick somebody from Bihar, you have an election in order.
39:53There was a third thought as well Moshmi in all of this is pick somebody from Andhra Pradesh where you put TDP in a similar quandary as the NDA has put the DMK.
40:04Absolutely, Piti, you know one thing is very clear that the opposition including the DMK and the TMT are very clear that there should be a VP candidate of the opposition.
40:18So there is consensus on that. There is also consensus on the fact that you know it could be you know it could be from either Tamil Nadu or Bihar, preferably from Tamil Nadu.
40:31And even Bihar our leader said was the elections around the corner and the SIR issue was a burning issue so that could also be one dark horse.
40:42You know some leader from Bihar or some non-political entity for that matter as I said but I can tell you one thing that by tomorrow noon that name would be finalized Mr. Kargi.
40:54That name would be finalized Mr. Kargi would be speaking to the top brass of the India block later in the evening while discussing deliberating on some names and that could see the light of the day tomorrow.
41:06Alright Moshmi, thank you for joining us for that quick update viewers. It could be either of the three. Number one, DMK has its way. It's a face saver. There's an election in Tamil Nadu and the vice president pick of the NDA has put the DMK in a fix whether they should support a Tamil candidate.
41:22So the DMK wants its own candidate from the state of Tamil Nadu. Number one. Number two, many want somebody from the state of Bihar elections in order in two months time.
41:31The third train of thought, have somebody from Andhra Pradesh put the TDP in a similar situation that the NDA has put the DMK in.
41:41All of that in play viewers, if you look at sheer numbers, the NDA has the might. So in all probability, the vice president candidate pick of the NDA will be the one that will go to the chair of the vice president.
41:55But elections, 21st of this month is nomination and then 9th of September is D-Day, election day. But what has now the NDA done that has put the DMK in an uncomfortable spot?
42:09Let's take you through, decode the pick of the vice president by the NDA. Yesterday you had Mr. J.P. Nada who announced the name of C.P. Radhakrishnan.
42:19Now, number one, the big South India connect. The DMK has been cornered. It is a strategic political move by the NDA elections in one year time.
42:30The DMK constantly has been wanting representation of the millions when it comes down to the center. Will they be able to say no to this pick?
42:40Because this is a grassroot worker, a bona fide the million who, you know, knows the people in terms of even the DMK cadre because, you know, we was at one point of time when there was the BJP-DMK alliance.
42:55You had Mr. Radhakrishnan who played a very important role. So, number one, a clear razor sharp focus of the BJP where South India is concerned, especially Tamil Nadu there, political messaging given.
43:08The other box that it ticks, the choice, is an RSS imprint in the vice president pick. Very clear. From 16 years of age, Mr. C.P. Radhakrishnan has been a dedicated cadre of the RSS and was part of the Jansang.
43:22So, in that manner, that box also ticked. And when you talk about caste and community, he represents the OBC community.
43:31Let's take all the questions swirling around the vice president pick to our two panelists this evening, Mr. Neveja Choudhury, senior journalist and columnist, Sumansi Raman, political analyst.
43:42Mr. Raman, I want to come to you first. How much of a catch-22 situation or a tight spot does the choice of NDA's VP candidate put the DMK in?
43:53First of all, Preeti, I don't agree that it's put the DMK in a very difficult spot. It would have had their votes been the deciding factor between Mr. Radhakrishnan winning or losing.
44:05Now, that's not the case here. Mr. Radhakrishnan can be elected irrespective of whether the DMK votes for him or against him.
44:11So, I don't see this as a big, you know, it is a small embarrassment for the DMK, which is why I also don't agree that the DMK is pushing very hard at the India Block meeting asking for a candidate from Tamil Nadu.
44:25They may, it may make it easier for them, but I don't see that as a showstopper or DMK insisting that they must have a candidate from Tamil Nadu.
44:33The second part is, and I think that this has not been really discussed, I'm not terribly sure that Mr. Radhakrishnan would have been the first choice of Prime Minister Modi or Mr. Amit Shah.
44:44Mr. Radhakrishnan comes from the Vajpayee era. He has been sidelined by the Modi Shah dispensation until 2023, when he was made a governor.
44:57People who were junior to him, for instance, Dr. Tamirisai Sandharajan and, you know, of course, Mr. Ilaganesan was senior to him.
45:05But Dr. Tamirisai, for instance, was made a governor even before Mr. CP Radhakrishnan was made a governor.
45:11So, he has very strong RSS connect and I actually see this in some ways as a kind of a concession to the RSS more than trying to embarrass the DMK in a poll-bound state.
45:27And having known Mr. Radhakrishnan at his, you know, political career over these years, he is not the kind of person I would have expected Mr. Modi or Mr. Amit Shah to be.
45:39He's got a mind of his own. I remember he was the governor of Jarkhand, opposition-ruled state, dealing with Hemant Sorrel.
45:48And he never came into the limelight for all the wrong reasons, the way an Arif Mohammed Khan came to him or a Jagdeep Dankar came to life.
45:57Even his tenure in Maharashtra has been fairly non-controversial.
46:01Exactly. So, he is a person who is actually, you know, I mean, at the end of the day, he is also a very successful businessman and an industrialist and all of that.
46:12So, I don't, I mean, if you had asked me, would he have been the first name that Mr. Modi and Mr. Amit Shah would have picked?
46:19You'd say no.
46:20I would say no.
46:21So, I don't see this primarily as an embarrassment to DMK choice that the BJP has made.
46:26Basically, Mr. Ramanya, you're saying it's a move to possibly mend what many were reading in as souring of relationships with the RSS,
46:36then a move to basically give a strong political message to the South, especially to the DMK.
46:42I want to bring in Ms. Neerja Choudhury in this conversation.
46:45Ms. Choudhury, what should now, you know, the India Alliance do?
46:50There are three trains of thought that are running, is what we are picking up from our sources.
46:54Number one, pick another thamillion, the DMK gets a face saver.
46:58Number two, pick somebody from Bihar, elections coming in in two months.
47:02Number three, pick somebody from Andhra Pradesh, put the TDP in a similar spot that they've put the DMK in.
47:12Look, as said that Mr. Radhakrishnan ticks several boxes, three important ones.
47:19One, he's very low profile and the BJP leadership did not have an appetite for another Satyapal Malik,
47:27now no longer alive, or Jagdeep Gankar.
47:31They wanted to go for somebody low-key who will walk in step with the government and the party leadership
47:38and will not speak out of turn.
47:42Now, Mr. Radhakrishnan is an old hand, as you yourself said, from the age of 16.
47:48He's been with the RSS, twice MP of the Lok Sabha, state unit president of Tamil Nadu, the BJP, and governor of several states.
47:57And in Maharashtra, I agree with this, in the last year, he's not done, even though events in Maharashtra have been very turbulent,
48:06he's not done anything that has brought him into controversy, unlike his predecessor, Mr. Koshyari, who'd made many gaffes.
48:13Now, given that, that's one box tick.
48:16Secondly, it is a goodwill gesture to the RSS.
48:21And that shows that the tensions that have been there between the BJP and its mentor, the RSS,
48:28during the last year, after the Lok Sabha election, where the RSS was seen not to have put its best foot forward
48:35and brought the tally of the BJP down to 240.
48:38There have been tensions, there have been many parlays across the table between two sides,
48:43and it seems that things are now getting sorted out.
48:47The Prime Minister's words from the ramparts of Red Fort on Independence Day praising RSS was another indicator.
48:55The third box that he has ticked is Tamil Nadu.
49:00Tamil Nadu is the one state that remains a challenge for the BJP.
49:05They have not managed to crack through.
49:08Now, it's not that Mr. Radhakrishan's personality or politics has been of a kind that is going to make a huge difference.
49:16But there is a place for political symbolism.
49:19Because he's a chameleon, because of the caste he belongs to, OBC Gounders,
49:23which are very important in the Coimbatore area where the BJP has been strong.
49:28And I think also to put, I feel, even the DMK in a spot.
49:35Now, it will be difficult for the DMK given the factor that regional pride has always been.
49:43Remember, when Pranam Mukherjee was made president, the TMC as well as the left parties in West Bengal had opted for him.
49:51Remember when Kathiba Patil was made president, the Shiv Sena on the opposite side had voted for her.
49:58So it is going to pose a challenge for the DMK, but they may decide to abstain.
50:03What the India block will do, I think it will be very difficult for them to win, but they will certainly want to derive political mileage out of this whole exercise.
50:14Whether it is, you know, putting somebody from Andhra, whether it is Bihar, all those things are going to be weighing up tonight.
50:21I'm going to come down to that.
50:22Ms. Chaudhary, coming back to that, just one minute, I want to bring in Mr. Sumansi Raman, he wants to make a point.
50:27Mr. Raman, is it also somewhere down the line a consolation for AIDMK facing fair amounts of heat of aligning with the BJP?
50:34No, in fact, most of the rocking of the boat in that alliance has been done by the BJP, not by the AIDMK.
50:42The AIDMK has been a very good ally.
50:44In fact, they've been a model ally to the extent that they are being called slaves of the BJP.
50:48So it's the BJP leaders who have been rocking the boat, who have been sending contradictory signals, who have been sort of in some senses cozying up to the DMK.
50:56I think you have to understand that, you know, as far as this being him adding Mr. Adhakrishnan's choice, adding a huge electoral dividend to the AIDMK BJP combined, I don't see that.
51:07He comes from the Congo belt in and around Coimbatore, Sirupur.
51:11Yes, there it would have an impact.
51:13And there the AIDMK BJP combined is very, very strong.
51:17In fact, that's their strongest part of the state.
51:19So, you know, I don't see this having a pan Tamil Nadu impact his choice.
51:24And, you know, the Gounder community to which he belongs is actually over-represented.
51:31Mr. Yadapadi Padi Sami belongs to the same community.
51:34Mr. Annamalai belongs to the same community.
51:36So that is already over-represented on the AIDMK BJP combined.
51:39So I don't see these as very valid, you know, issues.
51:44And by the same token, I expect the DMK to vote against him and they can get away with it with minimal damage simply because he's likely to win anyway.
51:52And the DMK, mind you, opposed an icon like Dr. APJ Abdul Kalam.
51:57So opposing Mr. Radha Krishnan will not be a problem.
52:00Right.
52:01And APJ Abdul Kalam just for our viewers came from Rameshwaram, came from the state of Tamil Nadu.
52:05I want to bring in Neerja Chaudhary back.
52:07Neerja Chaudhary, one quick minute, if you'd like to reflect on what would be the smartest, most astute choice coming in from the India Alliance now.
52:15I think India Alliance will weigh up very carefully the impact in Bihar because, you know, with this voter yatra, voter adhikar yatra of Rahul Gandhi, they are making a bid to make that into a big election issue.
52:33And Bihar has high stakes for both sides and it is there very closely, you know, there's going to be a close contest from all accounts.
52:42So I think Bihar factor will play a big role.
52:46Right.
52:47Tamil Nadu factor also, as I said, Tamil Nadu is a challenge for the BJP.
52:52Therefore, the opposition is also going to make sure that they don't get a huge advantage as a result of it.
52:58I think both factors will be there in their minds as they make the final decision in the coming hours.
53:05Well, they need to make it very quickly. 21st is nomination.
53:08We're going to leave it at that. Thank you both of you for joining us and for your insights.
53:11Appreciate it.
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