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00:05Untertitelung im Auftrag des ZDF, 2020
00:30Untertitelung im Auftrag des ZDF, 2020
01:02Untertitelung im Auftrag des ZDF, 2020
01:29Untertitelung im Auftrag des ZDF, 2020
02:00Untertitelung im Auftrag des ZDF, 2020
02:07Untertitelung im Auftrag des ZDF, 2020
02:25Untertitelung im Auftrag des ZDF, 2020
02:51Untertitelung im Auftrag des ZDF, 2020
03:18As a salute, as a playing homage to him, it's called Never Can Say Goodbye.
03:26Why did you want to do this?
03:28Well, I wanted to do it for his fans and for the people that misunderstood him.
03:34And I just told the stories about him.
03:38Do you think he was misunderstood?
03:40Yes, I do.
03:41When I went through this book, this book is composed of so many personal family portraits that a lot of
03:47us haven't seen.
03:48But this one stuck out to me, because this is how I remember him.
03:56How do you most remember him when you think of your son, Michael Jackson?
04:01Is that the portrait that you see in your mind?
04:04I think of my son all through the day, all the time.
04:08And I don't like to talk about him, because I get all choked up.
04:11Mm-hmm.
04:15I...
04:20It's funny.
04:21Mm-hmm.
04:23From a baby in my arms, naming him with my mother.
04:29My mother named him.
04:30Mm-hmm.
04:31Until he got grown.
04:34And that comes to my mind every day.
04:37Really?
04:37Yes, it does.
04:39Mm-hmm.
04:41I asked that question, not ever having children of my own, as you know, wondering whether or not a mother
04:47holds in her heart a certain vision of her child.
04:51She do.
04:52Yeah, you do.
04:53She do.
04:53Yeah.
04:54And is that little boy's face, that's who you hold?
04:58That...yes.
04:58Yeah, that's the picture that you hold.
05:00Yes.
05:00That's your son.
05:01And sometimes, during the day, I can hear his laughter in my mind.
05:05Mm-hmm.
05:06The way he used to...and he always teased, and he would always laugh and have fun with his brothers.
05:12Mm-hmm.
05:12You know, when they were rehearsing or getting ready to leave town or things like that.
05:17Mm-hmm.
05:17Always playing jokes.
05:19Mm-hmm.
05:20He was a...
05:21A prankster.
05:22Yes.
05:24I remember when I interviewed him back in 1993, when I did the Michael Jackson Live Around the World, and
05:30I was so nervous, one of the...the only thing that he and I actually had some disagreements about is he
05:37didn't want me to put in pictures of himself as a teenager.
05:40Because he had started changing.
05:42He had started changing.
05:43Yes.
05:44And he said he didn't like himself, and he...
05:46As an adolescent.
05:47As an adolescent, he thought he was...he goes, I don't want that in because...and I said, why? You have to
05:52have those pictures.
05:52And he said, because I'm ugly.
05:54He thought of himself as ugly.
05:55He did.
05:56Yes.
05:56He did.
05:56He did.
05:57I felt so bad for him when he went through that change.
06:00Mm-hmm.
06:00Did he share any of that with you?
06:02All the time.
06:03All the time.
06:04What would he say?
06:04He would just say...he would say, I'm just so ugly.
06:07I don't want to go out there.
06:09I say, you're not...to a mother, all her children are always beautiful.
06:13Mm-hmm.
06:13And so one day he just decided, he got up, I'm going to get my nose done.
06:19It's too big.
06:20Mm-hmm.
06:21But one day he just made up his mind, he just left.
06:23Mm-hmm.
06:24And when I inquired about where he was, he had gone down to get his nose done.
06:29He thought I might try to talk him out of it, I think.
06:31Mm-hmm.
06:31So he went down and got it done.
06:33What did you think?
06:34When he...
06:35Well, is that what he wanted?
06:37Mm-hmm.
06:37That would make him happy because he was so unhappy.
06:40Mm-hmm.
06:40He thought he was so ugly.
06:43Mm-hmm.
06:43And he did.
06:44It's got to be hard for you as a mother when you're looking at him and think.
06:47Oh, yes.
06:47Very, very hard.
06:48Because he was a beautiful boy.
06:49Mm-hmm.
06:50So as he continued to have other operations and change the way he looked, did you feel like
06:59you could say something to him about that?
07:04Uh, when you said he had other operations on his nose, but any other thing, he didn't
07:09except, um, when he, his vitiligo that he had, he, uh, he didn't want to start looking
07:17like a spotted cow, he said.
07:19Mm-hmm.
07:19So he just had everything done.
07:21I don't know how he did that, but he had everything, but except under his clothes.
07:25They were still, you know, changing, his legs and things.
07:28Were spotted.
07:30Yes.
07:30Mm-hmm.
07:30But he got it, um, just part of his body and his arms and things.
07:35He, uh, he changed that.
07:37Mm-hmm.
07:37But what, I don't know what in the world he did to do that, to change it, but he did.
07:42Mm-hmm.
07:42But as his look, you know, as, as a person in the public, we saw him transform himself.
07:48Mm-hmm.
07:48And what it looked like to us is that he was continuing to have surgeries.
07:53And I think when I interviewed him, he told me he'd only had two.
07:56I think he said.
07:57He had two more than two.
07:58I know.
07:58I thought he had.
07:59He was just embarrassed.
08:00Yeah.
08:00To say how many.
08:01Mm-hmm.
08:02But as he continued to change his look and change his nose, and his nose got smaller and
08:07smaller and smaller.
08:07Too small, like a toothpick at one time.
08:09Really?
08:10Yes.
08:10I thought it was too small.
08:12Mm-hmm.
08:13Did you feel like you could say anything to any of your children, and especially him?
08:18Did you feel like if something was going on with him, and in this case, him changing his
08:23face and changing his looks, you could say, Michael, enough.
08:27Yes, but once they get addicted to it.
08:31I hear that people get addicted to that plastic surgery, and I think that's what happened to
08:36him.
08:36Really?
08:36Because I had told him, that's enough.
08:38Why do you keep going?
08:39And I even talked to the plastic surgeon and said, if he come there and he wants you to
08:45work on his nose, just tell him you did it, and, you know, do the same thing, and don't
08:50change it, and just tell him, okay, I'm finished, and that's it.
08:54So you had a talk with his plastic surgeon?
08:56Yes, I did.
08:57Yeah.
08:57But they didn't listen to you?
08:59No.
09:00Coming up, June 25th.
09:03The worst day of my life.
09:06And later, do you think he was afraid of you?
09:14Look out, Jersey Shore.
09:16Here comes the Fashionator.
09:18You look quite Santa Claus-cular.
09:20Carson Kresley strikes again.
09:22They say they're America's worst-dressed couples.
09:25Holy moly.
09:26Ready to see each other?
09:27Rock it.
09:29Cue the bagpipes.
09:31He hasn't worn pants in years.
09:34That is a makeover.
09:36Don't even think about borrowing that skirt.
09:38Don't miss the makeover magic.
09:41You look gorgeous.
09:42Wednesday.
09:48You know, I spoke to Lisa Marie Presley recently, who I thought, you know, it was a beautiful
09:53interview because I felt for the first time that she really, really loved him.
09:58She did.
09:59Really, really loved him.
10:01What did you think of that?
10:02I said to her, none of us in the world knew what to think of that marriage.
10:07What did you think when Michael told you he was marrying Lisa Marie Presley?
10:12It was a surprise to me.
10:13He called me after he had married her.
10:16He called me, and he said, well, I'm going to put her on the phone.
10:20And he put her on the phone.
10:21I said, that's not her.
10:22Yes, it is.
10:23Honest goodness, it's her, he said.
10:25It didn't sound like her.
10:27She has a heavy voice, and I didn't know that.
10:29And she sounded like a black girl.
10:31Sounded like a black girl.
10:33You can say that out loud.
10:35She sounded like a black girl.
10:37Yeah, when she was, but I said, that's not Lisa Marie.
10:40He said, oh, yes, it is.
10:41Had you met her before?
10:42No, I hadn't met Lisa before.
10:44I had seen her when she was a black girl.
10:45So he married her without bringing her home to mom?
10:47Yes, he did.
10:48Mm-hmm.
10:49One of the things that she shared with me is that his love for you was unconditional,
10:54and that there was nothing he wouldn't have done for you.
10:58Did you feel that, too?
10:59Yes, I did.
11:01And everybody I talked to that knew him would tell me the same thing.
11:05Mm-hmm.
11:05I felt it, too.
11:07And he truly, truly.
11:08And I truly loved him.
11:10Mm-hmm.
11:11And he's a boy who loved his mama.
11:13Yeah.
11:14Yes, I have to say so myself.
11:18So was it a shock to you, June 25th?
11:24Oh, gosh.
11:29Yes.
11:32Yes.
11:34The worst day of my life.
11:38On June 25th, 2009, a call to 911 is placed from this Los Angeles mansion.
11:44I need an ambulance as soon as possible.
11:46Inside, Michael Jackson is unconscious.
11:50We have a gentleman here that needs help, and he's not breathing.
11:53He's not breathing, and we need to, we're trying to pump him, but he's not.
11:57He's okay.
11:58According to a coroner's report, Michael's blood contained a deadly concentration of
12:03propofol, a powerful anesthetic, generally administered only in hospitals.
12:08Dr. Conrad Murray, perhaps the last person to see Michael alive, attempts to perform CPR.
12:14Did anybody see him?
12:16Yes, we have a personal doctor here with him, sir.
12:18Did anybody witness what happened?
12:21Uh, no, just the doctor, sir.
12:22The doctor's been the only one here.
12:24Camera crews scrambled to the scene.
12:28Michael Jackson.
12:29There are reports that he has been rushed to a hospital.
12:34Where were you?
12:37I was, I had gone out in field service that morning, and Joe had called me.
12:43Field service is?
12:45I'm a Jehovah's Witness.
12:46I know.
12:47Field service means you go door to door?
12:48Yes.
12:49Uh-huh.
12:49But that was earlier, so I...
12:51You still do that?
12:52Yes.
12:53Oh, my goodness.
12:56And then when I got home, I got a call to come to the hospital.
12:59But Joseph had called in between and told me that somebody left Michael's house in an amulance,
13:06and they had the whole body covered up.
13:10And I prayed all the way to the hospital.
13:15Uh-huh.
13:15And you know how I must have felt.
13:17My heart just dropped.
13:19Heart dropped.
13:20And, uh, and so they called me and said, come to the hospital.
13:26Michael's in the hospital.
13:28He was dead.
13:28This is short.
13:29He was dead.
13:29He was dead then, but they didn't tell me.
13:31And, um, I was going...
13:34I went down there, and, uh, my nephew kept telling me, pray, Aunt Kate.
13:41Just pray that everything's okay.
13:45Did you know?
13:46In your heart, did you know?
13:48I kind of felt it.
13:50Uh-huh.
13:52But I was wishing that it wouldn't be.
13:55And then when you hear, come to the hospital, it's Michael.
13:59You.
13:59Was sick.
14:01They didn't tell me he was dead.
14:02They wanted me to come to the hospital.
14:04Uh-huh.
14:05When you got to the hospital, who told you?
14:08Uh, they made the doctor tell me.
14:11We stayed there a long time before he came in to tell us.
14:14Really, I guess he didn't want to either.
14:16Uh-huh.
14:16But the doctor had to tell us.
14:18Dr. Murray.
14:20Dr. Murray told you?
14:22Uh-huh.
14:23Uh-huh.
14:23And he came out, and he was talking.
14:25It took him so long, and I said, well, what happened?
14:28And he kept saying, and I said, well, how is he?
14:32How is he?
14:33Did he make it, or how is it?
14:35And he said, no, he's gone.
14:37That's all I remember.
14:39Oh.
14:42Oh.
14:43Oh.
14:44I'm sorry.
14:44No, I'm sorry.
14:45I'm sorry.
14:47I'm sorry.
14:48That's all I remember.
14:50Who was with you at the time?
14:52My nephew.
14:53Your nephew.
14:54That's who was with me.
14:56Uh-huh.
14:56The children were there, his children, and, um, but they were in another room.
15:02Uh-huh.
15:02I didn't know they were there.
15:04Uh-huh.
15:04And, um, they brought the children in, and that was his worst.
15:10His children?
15:11His children.
15:11Prince and Paris?
15:13Prince and Paris and the baby.
15:14Uh-huh.
15:15And they were crying, and Paris was, I didn't think, I thought she was going to pass out.
15:21And she was just saying, Daddy, I can't make it without you.
15:24I want to be with you.
15:25I want to go with you.
15:26And, you know, I felt so bad for them.
15:28Uh-huh.
15:29Uh-huh.
15:30Who told the children?
15:31Someone had told the children.
15:32Somebody told the children when they were, when they came in, they were crying.
15:36Uh-huh.
15:36So.
15:37So somebody had told the children.
15:38Somebody had told them.
15:39Uh-huh.
15:42And Paris was saying, I want to be with you.
15:46I want to go with you.
15:47I don't want to live without you.
15:48She was saying all those things.
15:50That's very, very, very, very hard.
15:52It was so sad.
15:54Yeah.
15:54It's very, very hard.
15:57And so, then you try to put the pieces together, and you find out that it is, um, at the
16:06time,
16:06we were hearing alleged drug overdose.
16:10Were you shocked by hearing that it was drugs?
16:14No, I didn't hear that it was an overdose.
16:16You didn't hear that?
16:17I heard that it was prophethyl.
16:19Uh-huh.
16:20I guess it was overdose of prophethyl, whatever it was.
16:23Yeah, overdose of prophethyl, yes.
16:24It's, you know, it's for, uh, when you take operations, and they put you to sleep.
16:29It's an anesthetic.
16:29It's an anesthetic.
16:30Yeah.
16:31That's exactly what it is.
16:32Were you surprised?
16:33Was that the first time you had heard that he was taking that drug?
16:36Yes, very first time.
16:39So, were you aware, Mrs. Jackson, that he had been taking prescription drugs to help him sleep,
16:47or to, um, help him feel more balanced, or to get through the day?
16:53Were you aware of that at all?
16:55No, but remember when he got burnt in the head, and he had been taking those drugs?
17:01And, um, it was a long time before I knew he was addicted to them.
17:05Uh-huh.
17:06And, uh, I had heard that he had been addicted to them.
17:08So, he was addicted to, after the Pepsi burn, he was addicted to drugs, painkillers.
17:14Painkillers, that's exactly what it was.
17:16He was addicted to painkillers, but it was a long time before you knew that he was addicted
17:21to painkillers.
17:21Yes, he was.
17:22Now, when Janet was on, she said that there had been an attempt by the family to have an
17:28intervention with him.
17:30Uh-huh.
17:30Were you aware of that?
17:32Were you a part of that?
17:33Yeah, they had told me about that.
17:34Uh-huh.
17:35Children told me about it.
17:36That they were going to try to step in and...
17:38Just take him and, uh, put him in a rehab or something and tell, and kind of clean him up.
17:45Uh-huh.
17:46Had you ever spoken to him about his addiction?
17:53I spoke to him about them once, um, when I had heard it.
17:59Uh-huh.
18:00And he denied it.
18:01And he denied it to you?
18:02Uh-huh.
18:04I was telling him I didn't want to hear one day that he had overdosed.
18:09Uh-huh.
18:09Because it would break my heart.
18:11It would kill me, too.
18:12Uh-huh.
18:12And, but he kept saying he wasn't, wasn't on it.
18:17He said, Mother, you don't believe me.
18:19He kept saying that.
18:20My own mother don't believe me.
18:22Yeah.
18:22He kept saying that.
18:24But I had heard, too.
18:25They'd be in denial when they tell you that.
18:28Uh-huh.
18:28But...
18:29Was there a part of you that wanted to believe him, but you knew?
18:33Well, a part of me that wanted to believe him, but I didn't believe him.
18:37You didn't believe him.
18:38No, I didn't.
18:38Uh-huh.
18:39I didn't.
18:41Next, what, if anything, do you want to say to Dr. Conrad Murray?
18:47And then, a backyard visit with Michael Jackson's children.
19:03In 2005, Michael Jackson stood trial, accused of molesting a 13-year-old boy.
19:10After five months, Michael was found not guilty on all counts.
19:16So, what I think was remarkable is that during the trial in 2005, you were in that courtroom
19:24every single day.
19:26Yes.
19:27What was that like for you?
19:29Well, it wasn't hard for me because it was my baby that was going on trial, and I know
19:36he was innocent.
19:37And the hardest thing was, oh, the jury, would the jury believe it?
19:42Would they, would they send him to jail?
19:46That was so hard.
19:48And, um, and I prayed for the truth.
19:51I said, if they only knew the truth, he would walk out of that courthouse.
19:56And it happened.
19:57Uh-huh.
19:58But I can't talk.
20:00Isn't that awful how I, I can't talk about anything without crying because it was a trying
20:08time.
20:08It was a trying time.
20:09For him and his life, that's how I felt.
20:13All his life, he had to go through stuff like this, and they were just lying on him.
20:17Uh-huh.
20:19So, did you ever, for one instant, ever think that there was a possibility that he could be
20:30guilty of molesting a child?
20:32No, no, I never thought, because he, I knew he wouldn't.
20:37He loved children, and he was around children all the time, and that's the only way that
20:43these people, the ones out there that did it, they know who they are.
20:47I'm not calling any names.
20:48They know who they are.
20:49Uh-huh.
20:50That's the only way they can make people believe that he did something because he was around
20:54those children all the time.
20:55Uh-huh.
20:56And Michael would always say, Mother, why are they accusing me of something I love the
21:01most?
21:01I'd rather slit my own wrist than to hurt a child.
21:04Uh-huh.
21:04He would always say that.
21:06How was he during that time?
21:07When we look back at tapes of that time, he does seem, you know, at some point coming into
21:12the courtroom kind of out of it, like maybe he was on drugs, who knows whether he was
21:16on drugs.
21:17Uh-huh.
21:17You remember that day he came in what looked like his pajamas and all of that?
21:21Well, he came in his pajamas because he went to the hospital.
21:27He fell.
21:28He had fell because we got up before daybreak, and he fell, and so he had to be rushed to
21:33the
21:33hospital, and so we were going to be a little late.
21:36The judge said, if you don't get here within some time, that we're going to keep all the
21:41money that, I think it was like $3 million was his bail, and they were going to keep it
21:47all.
21:47He wasn't going to give it back to him, and so the lawyer called and told him, you get
21:51down here.
21:52So he came in his pajamas the way he went to that hospital.
21:56Uh-huh.
21:57Did that trial change him?
21:58Yes, it did.
21:59Tell me how.
22:01Because he used to trust people.
22:04Uh-huh.
22:05So his problem was he trust too much, and after that trial, he didn't trust anybody.
22:12Really?
22:12He would always tell me, Mother, I don't trust anybody.
22:14The only person I trust is you.
22:17Coming up, do you regret those strappings on your children?
22:24Michael's father, Joe Jackson, and later, Michael's children.
22:29What do you miss the most?
22:37She is a mom who married a killer behind bars for life.
22:43Life without parole for committing double murder.
22:47Will you ever have a conjugal visit?
22:49Hear from both the newlyweds.
22:51Do you expect Tracy to remain faithful to you?
22:54Oprah, I'm going to put my foot down and say...
22:57Then...
22:57Witness an astonishing wedding.
23:0013 nervous brides.
23:01Their groom, Jesus Christ.
23:04Tomorrow.
23:10What, if anything, do you want to say to Dr. Conrad Murray?
23:17I've thought of it thousands of times.
23:20What would I say to him?
23:25Why didn't he take care of my child?
23:28Why did he leave the room, he know?
23:31And why did he give that to him?
23:33And it's very dangerous.
23:34Why did you do it?
23:37Do you think he murdered your son?
23:45I can't accuse him of murder.
23:47I don't know if it was accidentally done or it was intentionally done.
23:54I don't want to get into that, but I have my thoughts, but I just don't want to say it.
24:01Here's the latest on Dr. Conrad Murray.
24:03He's charged with involuntary manslaughter.
24:06He has pled not guilty.
24:08His trial is scheduled to begin this month.
24:10If convicted, he could face up to four years in prison.
24:16You know, we've all heard the saying that time heals all wounds.
24:19Has that been true for you in the case of the loss of your son?
24:23No, not at all.
24:25I don't think it will.
24:26I don't think I will ever be healed.
24:31It will get better, but some days it's just like it just happened.
24:37Is that how it's been for you?
24:38Yes.
24:39Whenever I can't talk about Michael, I just tear up.
24:43It hurts.
24:44It really hurts.
24:47So now you are raising his children.
24:50Yes.
24:51How often did you see the children?
24:53Did you know the children well?
24:55I knew them.
24:56I can't say that I knew them real, real well, but I knew them well enough.
25:00And I would always go to visit them, just like Grandma visits.
25:06Grandma visits.
25:06What did you think of the way he was raising them?
25:09You know, all the world, all we knew of the way he was raising his children was the time
25:14Blanket was held out the window and the time we would see the children walking around with
25:20the veils on.
25:21What did you think of that?
25:24I didn't approve of that, but I didn't say anything to him about it.
25:28But then I heard their mother, their biological mother, she told me it was her idea, not Michael's.
25:35Really?
25:35Yes.
25:36To cover them?
25:36Yes.
25:38I'm assuming when you say that you didn't approve of it is because you thought that having them
25:44walk around with their faces covered would not be good for them or not good for him.
25:48It wasn't, it's what the people would think, you know, I know how people think and how
25:53they say ugly things about you.
25:55So tell me, if you can, what it was like, because the children were brought into this
26:01house immediately on the night of his death.
26:03Yes, they were.
26:04That had to be traumatic, traumatic because you're dealing with your grief and they're
26:12dealing with their grief and this whole house was grieving.
26:16What gave you the strength to get through that?
26:20Well, you know what broke my heart more than anything else in this world?
26:26When people at the hospital told us, you can leave now, and parents say, Grandma, where
26:34are we going?
26:35It tore my heart, tore me up.
26:38I said, you're going home with Grandma.
26:41Don't you want to do that?
26:42She said, yes, that's where we want to go.
26:45But she said, oh God, I couldn't take it.
26:50Grandma, where are we going?
26:52Yeah.
26:54So you brought them home.
26:56You already had some of Jermaine's children and some of Randy's children were living here
27:00in the house.
27:01And so, how were you able to integrate them?
27:06Was that just something that just happened?
27:09It just happened.
27:10It just happened.
27:10They just bonded.
27:12The minute they got here, the children bonded.
27:15They had a lot of fun and they did a lot of things that the kids hadn't done before.
27:21They wanted to, they called it going camping.
27:25And so we went and bought tents for them and they camped out on the yard.
27:29They did a lot of things together.
27:31And whatever they wanted to do at the time, I did for them because their father, their whole
27:37world was gone.
27:38They only knew Michael.
27:40And the whole world was jerked out from under them.
27:43I just, just tore my heart up.
27:48So, Mrs. Jackson, I think it's incredible that you have these children who have literally
27:56lived in their own Michael Jackson world.
28:01So was it you who decided that they should be integrated into regular school and not homeschool?
28:09Uh, yes.
28:10Well, they talked to me about it.
28:11We talked about that.
28:12And we talked to the children about it.
28:15And they, parents had said she didn't want to go.
28:18And Prince was the one that wanted to go.
28:21And then after Prince decided he wanted to go, then she went to see the school and she fell
28:28in love and she wanted to go.
28:30So we, now the youngest, which is blanket, he's never going.
28:35That's what he said.
28:36And now the kids come back and talk about what a good time they're having and all their
28:40friends and the friends come over.
28:42And now he wants to go.
28:43So maybe next year, he'll be going.
28:46What grade will he be in next year?
28:48Blanket.
28:49Blanket be in fourth next year.
28:50In fourth grade.
28:51Do you think it's time for him to go?
28:53Would you want him to go?
28:54I don't think it's time for him to go.
28:56Because he's still shy.
28:58Yeah.
28:59Very shy.
29:00Do you think it's good for the children to be out in public and not veiled?
29:04Do you think that's good?
29:05Yes, I do.
29:08I do.
29:09And I think, I think they appreciate that too.
29:11They never expressed it to me, but I think so.
29:14How would you say they are adjusting?
29:17Very well.
29:18Very well.
29:18Mm-hmm.
29:19Very well.
29:20Mm-hmm.
29:22Do they talk about missing their father?
29:25Are they able to share that with you?
29:27Sometimes.
29:28Or do they think it would make you too sad?
29:29Well, well, what they talk about is, um, Daddy would do this and Daddy would do that.
29:36And they always say, well, that's how Daddy did it.
29:40Harris, she's very emotional and she talks about him all the time.
29:44And she's a strong one.
29:46Mm-hmm.
29:47All the pictures on her walls in her bedroom are Michael.
29:50I don't see how she could look at him like that without crying.
29:54I can't, but, um...
29:57So, you title the book, Never Can Say Goodbye, the Katherine Jackson story.
30:03Do you think about him every day?
30:06Every day doesn't pass.
30:09Not once a day.
30:10Mm-hmm.
30:12And then sometimes I just say it.
30:13I just hate myself and just keep thinking about it.
30:16It's just something I can't help.
30:18Mm-hmm.
30:19Do you always think about it with sadness or are you able to think about it sometimes?
30:24I think about it with a smile sometimes.
30:26Do you think about it with a smile sometimes?
30:28I think of the things he used to do and when he was a little boy, what he did.
30:31Mm-hmm.
30:32Some of the jokes he used to tell and I just...
30:34But he always stay in my mind.
30:37Yeah.
30:38Do you feel that he's with you?
30:40Well, his memory.
30:41Mm-hmm.
30:42And all of that.
30:43Mm-hmm.
30:45But...
30:47And I have a lot of good memories.
30:49Mm-hmm.
30:49And so that's one thing they can't take away from you.
30:55Next.
30:56You know, the word in the world is that y'all are divorced.
31:01And Michael Jackson's children.
31:03What is your favorite memory of your father?
31:16You know, I'm really surprised to see you here, Mr. Jackson.
31:20Mm-hmm.
31:20Because, you know, the word in the world is that y'all are divorced.
31:25We're not divorced.
31:26There wasn't a filing for divorce?
31:28No.
31:30Never.
31:30Never?
31:31Uh-uh.
31:32Obviously, you seem very friendly.
31:34Mm-hmm.
31:34And we don't fight.
31:36Yeah, you don't fight.
31:37No.
31:37What are you most proud of about Mrs. Jackson?
31:42She's a wonderful person.
31:44You know, I think she's too easy with people, you know.
31:47She's just like Michael.
31:49What do you miss most about Michael not being here?
31:52I think about him every night.
31:55Mm-hmm.
31:55You know, it looks like us.
31:57I just keep pitching him gone.
31:59Mm-hmm.
31:59And it looks like every time I go into some police or a restaurant or a casino or something,
32:04there's music.
32:04There's music everywhere.
32:06It's playing.
32:06You can't get away from it.
32:07It brings back memories, you know, because I remember the songs.
32:11I was at every recording session we ever did.
32:15It just brings back memories.
32:16Do you think he was afraid of you?
32:19I don't think he was afraid of me.
32:21What was he was afraid of?
32:23You may do something wrong.
32:25And I'm chest tired if I'm not beating.
32:28I never beat it like the media tried to say.
32:31That never happened.
32:32Mm-hmm.
32:32But, uh...
32:33He told me, you know, I did that interview with him in 1993, and he told me that you beat
32:38him.
32:40Well, I'm glad that he was raised in such a way he was blacked all over the world.
32:47It could have been something like some of the other kids, either dead from Gary, either dead or doing a
32:53lot of drugs and in jail or something.
32:56So let's just establish this.
32:58You know, I was raised, I was beaten as a kid, because that was the culture.
33:02That was the way we were raised.
33:05And so was that the way you, you know, raised your children?
33:09Beat or whip?
33:11Same thing.
33:12It's the same thing when you have welts on your back?
33:14It's all sorry when you said beat.
33:15I know.
33:15So you're taking issue with the word beat, right?
33:18I'm taking issue with the word hip.
33:20With the word whip.
33:21So what would you say that you used to discipline your children?
33:26You might as well admit it.
33:28Yeah.
33:28That's the way black people raise their children.
33:30Yes.
33:30I'm just asking you.
33:32You can answer that for me, can't you?
33:34Whether or not he used...
33:36He used the strap.
33:37He used the strap.
33:38Yes, he did use the strap.
33:40So let me just ask you this.
33:42Knowing what you know now, would you do it differently?
33:44Do you think you would be a different kind of father?
33:47I would have punished them by whipping them with a strap or something when they did something.
33:50It would have kept them out of trouble, out of jail.
33:53My kids have never been in jail.
33:55Nine kids have never been in jail.
33:56That's a good...
33:57Hello.
33:57Yes, yes.
33:58Hello.
33:58That's good.
33:59And that's great.
34:00Do you regret those strappings on your children?
34:05No, I don't.
34:06You don't regret it?
34:07No.
34:07Because it kept them out of jail.
34:09Because it kept them out of jail.
34:10And it was good kids.
34:12All the way.
34:13Mm-hmm.
34:13Yes.
34:14When did you first know that Michael had something special?
34:18When he was very small.
34:19Mm-hmm.
34:20We had an old rickety washing machine.
34:23And, you know, the kind of...
34:25What do you call the agitator in the middle?
34:27Mm-hmm.
34:27And then...
34:28What do you know?
34:30So...
34:30So...
34:31So...
34:32Yeah.
34:32But anyway, it would make noises when it would wash.
34:35And also by it being rickety, along with the beat, it would make other noises.
34:40Right.
34:40It had a beat.
34:41And just a baby with a bottle in his mouth and can walk about, I'd say about a little over
34:45a year.
34:45Mm-hmm.
34:46And he would be there on the floor dancing to the beat of the washing machine.
34:50Wow.
34:51And I said, this kid is something else.
34:53Yes, he rocks.
35:01All the kids are coming.
35:03Hello.
35:04All right.
35:05Introduce yourselves.
35:06Hello.
35:06Prince.
35:07Prince.
35:07Prince Michael.
35:08Hi.
35:09Hi.
35:09I'm Paris.
35:09You're Paris.
35:10Hi.
35:11I'm Oprah.
35:12Randy.
35:12Randy.
35:13Nice to meet you.
35:13Randy.
35:14Hi.
35:15What is it?
35:15Jafar.
35:16Jafar.
35:17Okay.
35:17Nice to meet you.
35:18Jermajesty.
35:20Jermajesty?
35:20Yes.
35:21How do you spell that?
35:22J-E-R-M-A-J-E-S-T-Y.
35:24And so are we supposed to bow in your presence?
35:27No.
35:29Jermajesty.
35:29I feel like it deserves a Jermajesty.
35:32Okay.
35:32Hi.
35:33Dante.
35:33Dante.
35:34Nice to meet you.
35:35I'm Genevieve.
35:36Genevieve.
35:37Nice to meet you guys.
35:38We're missing Blanket.
35:41Hey, Blanket.
35:42Hi.
35:43Hi.
35:43I'm Oprah.
35:44Nice to meet you.
35:45Hi.
35:46So are you guys going to sit down and talk to me?
35:48Why not?
35:49Yes.
35:49Why not?
35:50Come on.
35:51Let's pull up chairs.
35:52Thank you.
35:53So all of you guys, does everybody live here?
35:56Yeah.
35:56Yep.
35:57Yeah.
35:57So tell me about yourself.
35:59What is it you love to do?
36:00Video games and sports.
36:02Video games and sports.
36:04Yeah.
36:05Tell her what you want to do when you go.
36:07What do you want to do?
36:07Produce movies and direct.
36:08You want to produce?
36:09Oh, okay.
36:12Jermajesty Jackson, you want to produce movies and direct.
36:15Yes.
36:16What do you want to be?
36:17I'd like to be an actress when I'm older.
36:19Really?
36:20Good.
36:21Are you going to, like, study it?
36:22Take it seriously?
36:23Yeah.
36:24I, um, sometimes do improvs.
36:26Oh, do you?
36:27Where?
36:28Well, I used to do it with my dad.
36:29Mm-hmm.
36:30I bet you're good at charades then, right?
36:32Mm-hmm.
36:32Yeah.
36:32Good at charades.
36:33She does it all the time.
36:34Really?
36:35You guys do?
36:36Now, are all of you going to be, is everybody following the whole Jackson family tradition?
36:42Everybody's in show business?
36:44Mm-hmm.
36:44Yes.
36:44Yes, and you do?
36:45Sing.
36:46I sing.
36:46You sing?
36:47Yes.
36:47Your majesty.
36:49Hello?
36:49What do you do?
36:51I sing, too.
36:51You sing, too?
36:52I sing.
36:53So, okay, everybody's singing.
36:55Yeah, singing, acting.
36:56Singing and acting.
36:57First year of college.
36:58First year of college.
36:59Did you guys, I mean, obviously you have, but I would like to know, do you remember the
37:03first time you looked at tapes of your family as the Jackson 5, like you saw them on the
37:10Ed Sullivan Show?
37:11I grew up watching all of that.
37:12You grew up watching all of it?
37:14All the time.
37:14Okay, and what were your impressions the first time?
37:17I guess my first recollection was, I think I was like three.
37:20Whose child are you?
37:22Three of these.
37:22Okay, so your first impression was?
37:24It was just a concert going on tour.
37:27That was my first memory of what this family does.
37:32It's kind of interesting.
37:33Yeah.
37:34Yeah.
37:34And then you realize, our family is not like other families.
37:39Our family is a little different.
37:43Yeah.
37:44Do you grow up feeling normal, or is this normal to you?
37:48This is normal.
37:50So when you go to school, everybody, do they, you know?
37:53Yeah.
37:54Yeah.
37:55Of course it changes everybody's perceptions of us.
37:57Yeah.
37:58So is this your first year entering regular school?
38:02Yeah.
38:02And what was that like?
38:04I guess I was just nervous.
38:06About?
38:07Everything.
38:08What they would say.
38:09Yeah.
38:10Would you fit in?
38:12Were you introduced?
38:12Did you show up in class?
38:14And then they say, we have another student with us today.
38:16They just said, who's new, raise your hand.
38:19Uh-huh.
38:20And then a lot of kids raised their hands.
38:22And then you feel better.
38:23Didn't you feel better?
38:24Yeah.
38:24Yeah?
38:25Do kids react to who you are?
38:26My friend, she didn't know who I was until we went on Outdoor Ed.
38:33And then what happens?
38:35What happens when people discover who you are?
38:37She didn't care.
38:38She didn't care?
38:39Don't you like that?
38:40People treat you the same.
38:42So, Blanket, are you still homeschooled?
38:44Yes.
38:45Yes.
38:46Has it been hard for you guys, because you all lived, from all that we all know, from
38:51what I can gather, a very sheltered, kind of literally veiled life.
38:56There was a time when you were literally behind the veil.
38:59Do you remember that time?
39:00Yeah.
39:00Do you?
39:01Did you know at the time why you were putting on the mask?
39:04Yeah.
39:04Why?
39:05Because when we did go out without our dad, then nobody would really recognize us.
39:10He tried to raise us without knowing who he was, but that didn't really go so well.
39:15It didn't really go so well.
39:17Did you appreciate or like being behind the veil or mask at the time?
39:22I appreciated it.
39:23Yeah.
39:23Did you understand that it was to?
39:25It wasn't always comfortable, but yeah.
39:27It was to protect you?
39:29Yeah.
39:29Yeah.
39:30It was to protect you.
39:39You know, we all heard you speaking at the funeral, and everybody was so moved by that.
39:44Daddy has been the best father you could ever imagine.
39:51What is your favorite memory of your father?
39:57That's really hard.
39:59I'll let you think about it while I ask you the same question.
40:03Your favorite memory.
40:05When we were on Bahrain, we used to wake up early and walk the beach.
40:08When you were in Bahrain?
40:09Yeah.
40:10Yeah.
40:10Coca-Cola and Skittles or Snickers.
40:14Waking up and walking the beach?
40:17Yeah.
40:17That's a good one.
40:19I just have to say spending some quality time away from the two, just me and him.
40:23Mm-hmm.
40:24One time we went on the roof when we were in Las Vegas of our house, and we just saw
40:29the
40:29Luxor lights.
40:30We just saw the city of the lights.
40:32We were eating Snickers, and we had some soda.
40:38What kind of dad was he?
40:39Was he a strict disciplinarian, or could you get away with anything with him?
40:44He was strict.
40:45He could get away with it.
40:46He could get away with it, huh?
40:48Uh-huh.
40:49He could get away with it?
40:51You couldn't get away with it?
40:52No?
40:53And so, when you would have quality time, what would you do besides eat Snickers?
40:58Sometimes he would take me to an art museum, because we both loved art.
41:03Uh-huh.
41:03And we would do, like, a lot.
41:05We would, um, as a family, we would play tag outside.
41:08Uh-huh.
41:09And, um, he got us Kenya four years ago.
41:13Kenya the dog, the lab?
41:15Mm-hmm.
41:15Come here.
41:15Kenya.
41:17It's your cue, Kenya.
41:19Come here.
41:19It's a little baby.
41:20So, when you were living with your father, did you think that, you know, the rest of the
41:24world doesn't know, but did you feel that that was sort of a normal, was that normal to you?
41:30Yeah, I kind of felt like no one would understand what a good father he was.
41:34Mm-hmm.
41:34Like, he was, like, I'd say he was the best cook ever.
41:37A cook?
41:38Really?
41:39Everyone's all a cook, like, they're surprised to hear it.
41:42Yes, I am.
41:43He was just a normal dad, except for he was, I'd say, the best dad ever.
41:46Well, that's part of the reason why I wanted to do this, and really happy that you all
41:50talked to me, because I think the world doesn't, certainly doesn't know anything about him
41:54as a father.
41:55And I think even just a few words that you spoke at his funeral allowed people to have just
41:59a little bit of insight into the kind of father he was.
42:03Like, I'm shocked to hear that he was a cook.
42:05What could he cook?
42:07He made the best French toast in the world.
42:10Dipped in eggs, right?
42:12Yeah.
42:13He just made the best breakfasts in the world.
42:15Mm-hmm.
42:17Would he cook for you guys a lot?
42:18Yeah.
42:20What do you miss the most?
42:23Everything.
42:24Everything.
42:27Well, thanks for talking to me.
42:29Really, I appreciate you sharing that.
42:31Really do.
42:32What do you miss?
42:33I will go for a minute.
42:41Bye-bye.
42:43Bye-bye.
42:44Bye-bye.
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