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In this edition of Political Stock Exchange, watch the findings of the CVoter survey on how people responded to this and other questions related to the examination system mess amid massive anger over NEET-UG leak, CBSE, CUET chaos.
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00:01Hello and welcome. Good evening. You're watching news today at 9pm and you're watching the political stock exchange, the most
00:07definitive data driven mood tracker of the country. This time around, we've done a deep dive into the mood of
00:15the country where it comes down to our education system. And trust me, you'd be a tad shocked with the
00:23results. All of that coming up. First up, allow me to take you through the headlines.
00:30Big India Today impact. Government transfers CBSC chairman and secretary over marking mess. One member panel formed to probe irregularities.
00:39Sources say officials removed after Prime Minister's intervention.
00:46Political war breaks out after government cracks the whip over CBSC mess. Opposition says not enough. Rahul Gandhi adamant on
00:53Dharmendra Pradhan's resignation.
00:58And the countdown begins to DK Shib Kumar's oath taking ceremony tomorrow. Sources say 13 ministers likely to take oath
01:06along with him.
01:07Ji Parameshwara in all probability to be the sole deputy CM.
01:14Anna Malai in the spotlight. After he meets BJP top brass in Delhi, sources say he has informed them about
01:22his decision to quit and has turned down the Rajya Sabha offer. BJP tells Anna Malai to wait as of
01:27now.
01:31Amidst exodus from TMC, Mamata Banerjee stages protest in Kolkata, says we'll continue to fight till I die.
01:39Only nine out of 78 MLAs join STIR, giving more fire to speculation over TMC implosion.
01:49At least six dead and 20 injured after two buses collide in Gujarat, Surat. One of the buses caught fire
01:55after incident.
01:56Prime Minister Modi expresses grief, announces extra share of two lakhs to the kin of deceased.
02:05Shocking incident comes to light from Keralam. Cops arrest stepfather after post-mortem reports of a one-and-a-half
02:12-year-old baby exposes dozens of injuries and cigarette burn marks.
02:21Trump blasts Netanyahu in a tense call over Israel's strike on Hezbollah.
02:26Reports say Trump accused Netanyahu of pushing Israel towards international isolation and jeopardizing U.S. diplomatic efforts with Iran.
02:40And 28-year-old Black Buck case continues to haunt Salman Khan.
02:45His legal team sends a notice to the makers of Kala Hiran, also seeks halt to film's release.
03:15Right, before we dive into the data of the political stock exchange, like I said, tracking the sentiment of the
03:24students, of the parents, especially with India's education system banged in the spotlight, getting into the latest news break that's
03:32coming in.
03:33The centre seemingly has cracked the whip.
03:36CBSC Chairperson Rahul Singh transferred.
03:40CBSC Secretary Imanshu Gupta shifted.
03:43Prashant Sitaram Lokhande to be new CBSC Chairman.
03:47One member panel to probe CBSC's OSM, on-screen marking contract.
03:52Capacity Building Commission Chief Radha Chauhan will head this panel.
03:55Panel to submit report in one month time.
03:59And word has it that Prime Minister himself weighed in and wanted the Secretary and the CBSC Chairman to be
04:07replaced with immediate effect.
04:09I want to cut across to my colleague, Aishwarya Paliwal.
04:12Aishwarya, the first heads have rolled where CBSC is concerned.
04:16There's CBSC, there's CEUT, there's NEET.
04:18Politically, the opposition says not enough.
04:21The Education Minister needs to go.
04:23But what are you picking up from your government sources?
04:27Well, you know, Preeti, the government has been very keenly looking at these things.
04:31And as you also rightly pointed out, it was the Prime Minister who himself was very keenly looking at both
04:35these issues.
04:36First, it was NEET and then it was CBSC.
04:39The government is very, very clear.
04:40They understand that there have been some people who have signed on the contract because of which this particular company,
04:46which unfortunately was blacklisted in the state of Telangana, was still given this contract.
04:52So who are those people?
04:53And if there is a chain, the idea is to get to the bottom of the chain.
04:56That's the reason why one month's time has now been given.
04:58And this will be personally monitored by the top government officials.
05:02They will be looking at the inquiry.
05:04They will be making sure that the inquiry gets done.
05:07And the report is out in the next one month.
05:09We will see the government cracking the whip.
05:11This, Preeti, from what I understand, is just the beginning.
05:13Heads have started rolling.
05:15But from what we understand, we will have more officials in the dock.
05:18And the government will also be making this as an example so that these kind of incidents, corruption incidences, do
05:24not come out in future.
05:25Preeti.
05:26All right.
05:26So the first heads have rolled where CBSC is concerned.
05:29Aishwarya pointing out of the government wants to make an example of this.
05:32What would be the second step of the government?
05:34Opposition heat is on.
05:35Rahul Gandhi has just released a social media post where he says this is not enough.
05:39The education minister has to go.
05:41But ultimately, viewers, politics aside, one needs to look at the students here.
05:47For CBSC, over 18 and a half lakh students, they are the ones who have been driving the narratives.
05:51They are the ones who are actually investigating, be it norms being bent to, especially where tenders were given to
05:59particular firms.
06:00All of that coming in from the students themselves.
06:03They are going to keep a keen eye on developments.
06:05Thank you, Aishwarya, for joining us.
06:07Let's now, viewers, dive deep into the data of seawater on how the country views the current controversy, be it
06:16NEET, be it CBSC, be it CEUT,
06:19where India's education system is in the spotlight and in a rather unflattering light, if one would say.
06:27I'm going to be joined this evening.
06:28Today, I'll introduce our guests to our viewers, Wajat Sethi, political analyst, Ashutosh, political analyst, Nikhil Pawa, founder and editor,
06:36Media Nama, Yashwant Deshmukh, founder, C-Voter.
06:40It was his team that conducted this snap poll.
06:42And trust us, the reports are shocking, something that the government clearly needs to pay heed to.
06:48We also have with us Dr. Shikha Darbari, former Joint Secretary, Parliamentary Standing Committee on Education,
06:54Chief Commissioner, IT Department, Government of India.
06:58Let's quickly cut across to our first set of data.
07:00What we've done, viewers, is we've simplified it.
07:03We're going to take you through three quick questions on what were asked of the respondents when it came to
07:09the current CBSC crisis.
07:11So question one that was posed to the respondents, should CBSC physically recheck all answer sheets?
07:18It's keeping in mind that the on-screen marking system is banged in the middle of this controversy.
07:23The question that was posed to our respondents, should CBSC physically now, manually, with teachers, recheck all answer sheets?
07:32And if you look at that, viewers, we've divided the respondents in categories of NDA voters, opposition voters, and others.
07:39And the results are on your television screen right here.
07:43Because if you look, NDA voters, those who have a propensity of voting the NDA, nearly 65.8% of
07:52them, these are NDA voters.
07:53And they feel, yes, CBSC needs to physically recheck all answer sheets.
07:58The opposition voters, 63.9%.
08:00Others, 66.7%.
08:04Because when you're going to look at the figures there, this happens very rarely.
08:08You know, in terms of even snap polls, this is a black swan moment of sorts, where you'll have NDA
08:14voters, opposition voters, and others practically polling in the same percentage.
08:18So one can really understand that overwhelmingly, overwhelmingly, parents, students, the citizens of this country feel that the OSM, the
08:29on-screen marking system, was done in a hurry.
08:32The students, especially in higher, you know, classes like 10th, 11th, 12th, were made guinea pigs.
08:38And you can see the numbers right there.
08:41Let's take you to the second question that was posed to our respondents.
08:44Has CBSC management improved or worsened?
08:47It was one direct question.
08:48Let's break it down in terms of NDA voters, opposition voters, others.
08:52Improved, 39.9%.
08:54Opposition says 38.2%.
08:56Others, 15.4%.
08:59Worsened, 28.5%.
09:0128.2%.
09:03Others, 46.8%.
09:04Let's go to the other question.
09:07And that's operative.
09:08Should 12th board examination system undergo major reforms?
09:13And this, if you look at these figures, because once again, unanimity, cutting across party lines.
09:20This is India speaking in one voice.
09:22Yes, urgently, 68.5%.
09:2668.5% NDA voters feel that the 12th board examination system needs to go through urgent educational reforms.
09:34Opposition voters, 72.9%.
09:37Others, 70%.
09:38Look at, no.
09:406.9% just of NDA voters feel that, no.
09:44All's well.
09:45No need to change anything.
09:4713% opposition voters and 13.2% others.
09:50I want to quickly cut across two panelists.
09:55And I want to go to Yashwant Deshmukh.
09:57Right off the bat, Yashwant, if you look at the figures and we've broken them down, you know, we are
10:03taking the questions posed on the CBSC fiasco first and the controversy and the crisis there.
10:07Rarely, I would reckon, Mr. Deshmukh, you would see this uniform unanimity where NDA voters, UPA, India opposition voters and
10:18others all come together and are practically saying the same thing, that our education system for 12th boards needs urgent
10:25reforms.
10:27Absolutely, Bhiti, this is one of those things which kind of cuts across the party line and I was going
10:34through your piece the other day and I totally agree with you that, you know, India, you know, it's like,
10:41it's like the great meritocracy, pro-meritocracy middle class of India largely,
10:48which believes that the kids given a full chance to study properly and, you know, work hard and go towards
10:55their future in a better way.
10:57And that is where, when, you know, these kind of things happen and those dreams kind of get shattered across
11:04the party and it has nothing to do with political positioning or ideological positioning anyway.
11:09So I think this is one of those things which has hurt really, really bad way in the collective psyche
11:17of the masses.
11:19And I wonder if the decision makers are realizing this with the urgency they should be realizing it or with
11:29the kind of gravity that they should be looking into this.
11:35If they are good for them, if not, then probably this is one of those non-political political movements, you
11:43know, which make or break a lot many things which don't really look very harming in the current situation at
11:53that point of time.
11:55But they really go a long way in making public opinion and, you know, disturbing public opinion in a very,
12:03very critical way.
12:04This country in the last 12 years has seen so many things up and down.
12:08We have seen CA and RC thing.
12:11We have seen the farmers thing, land acquisition.
12:13We have seen the COVID thing.
12:15And every time we have seen the kind of political divisions across.
12:19We have always pulled and, as you have correctly said, very few moments we see that there is a unanimity
12:26in people go beyond the political ways to say something.
12:31This is one of those rare and very serious movements, I would say, very serious, non-politically yet political, which
12:40if the people who will realize that how serious it is.
12:44Well, you know, thank you, Mr. Deshmukh, that you did read my piece.
12:48But I have to say it came in also from a conversation that you and I had earlier.
12:51So, you know, a part of that.
12:53But, yes, you are right that there needs to be a sense of urgency to address this because we have
12:59the narrative that we've seen built.
13:01You know, there might be a lot of political noise around it, but a lot of that narrative or rather
13:05nearly all of that narrative is driven by the students themselves.
13:08They are turning investigators, they are pointing out flaws, and you can't really deny them that.
13:14And that's what you see on your television screen by sheer strength of the numbers cutting across political divide.
13:19And Rajat, maybe that is what has made the Prime Minister now also weigh in, because word coming in, it
13:26was under his instructions that both the CBSC secretary and the chairperson were transferred and replaced.
13:33No, I think if there is one politician in this country who has ears as close to the ground as
13:39possible, it is Prime Minister Modi.
13:41So he has been reading that this might have a snowballing potential.
13:45He has come down.
13:46But I also feel that this disconnect between, you know, all our policymakers who are on an average above 60
13:54years old, and this country is very young with a median age of 26, 27.
13:59The aspirations of the youngsters who have very few chances of upward mobility socially and economically.
14:08That ladder is these exams, these class 12 exams.
14:12So under no circumstance can this be taken lightly.
14:16And this is why not just transferring, I mean transfer is no punishment.
14:19Most of these two bureaucrats who have been transferred will now go into any other department as if those departments
14:24are less important.
14:25I mean that is not a punishment.
14:27The biggest bane of this country is Article 311 of our constitution, which gives permanence to the Indian bureaucracy and
14:34Indian bureaucrats.
14:34If you do this kind of a mistake in any other private sector, you would be kicked out of the
14:38job and you will in your lifetime never have this job ever again.
14:41That's the kind of ruthlessness which is there in private sector.
14:45Why is this similar ruthlessness not there in public sector?
14:48Why does Article 311 prevent, I mean back in those days everything was dark and shoddy and you couldn't, there
14:53were political pressures and you wanted to safeguard the bureaucracy from those pressures.
14:57Today that does not exist.
14:58There has to be higher accountability.
15:01And there cannot be sweeping mandates at worst transfer.
15:05This is the deep disconnect that exists between the system on one side and the youngsters on the other side.
15:12And I think this corrosion of the examination has reached to a tipping point.
15:16And I believe government will not stop just here.
15:18They will take more decisive steps in the coming months.
15:22All right, you know, Rajat stay on with me, but is it fair to pin the entire blame on just
15:27the bureaucracy?
15:29Well, the opposition, now let's get into the politics of it, is asking for nothing else but the sacking of
15:33the education minister.
15:35And let's cut across to a data set which might explain the mood of the people a little better on
15:41this.
15:41And we are moving from CBSE to NEET.
15:43The question that was posed to our respondents by C voter was, who is to be blamed?
15:49And it's an important question, viewers. It will give you an insight on where the country stands on this.
15:55Who is to be blamed for NEET-UG 2026 paper leak?
15:59NDA voters, nearly 37.4% NDA voters say the education minister.
16:06Mr. Dharmendra Pradhan needs to shoulder the blame for the NEET-UG mess.
16:11Opposition, a tad bit more, which is 52.4%.
16:16Others, 51% of others squarely blame nobody else but the education minister.
16:22But if you look at the entire data set, National Testing Agency, only 12.4% of NDA voters blame
16:29the National Testing Agency.
16:31Coaching centers, only 7% blame the coaching centers.
16:35Students and parents, 6.9%.
16:38And I'm reading the NDA data set here.
16:40All of the above, 25.9% where NDA voters are concerned.
16:45Look at that entire data list there and viewers.
16:48Out of which, even for those who are voting today for the BJP.
16:53Even in that set, a majority of them hold the education minister responsible.
17:0037.4%.
17:02And Ashutosh, I'd like to bring you in on this because where does the buck stop?
17:07Heads have rolled, the CBSE chief has gone, the secretary has gone.
17:11But is that enough? Because that's just CBSE.
17:13What about NEET? Where does the buck stop?
17:16See, Priti, first of all, let's understand that transfer is no punishment.
17:20In the bureaucratic circle, in the bureaucracy, the transfer is not a punishment at all.
17:24So just transferring from one individual to another individual is basically a bureaucratic response to, in my sense, a political
17:31crisis.
17:32See, we are living in a democracy.
17:34In democracy, ultimately, the buck stops at the political leadership.
17:37And the political leadership, and because the political leadership has to face people.
17:41And if they realize that there is serious anger in people, so obviously it is the political leadership which has
17:51to pay for it.
17:51So obviously, the education minister should be responsible and the buck should stop at his table.
17:58Now the issue is very simple.
18:01Whether education minister will be made responsible for this, I'm not very sure about it.
18:06Because long before, Mr. Rajna Singh has said, our government is not in the government.
18:10So if your government is not in the government, then how the accountability to the people will be fixed?
18:15In a democracy, the minister, the collective leadership of the cabinet has to be responsible to the parliament and through
18:22parliament to the people.
18:23If anything has gone wrong, and it's not the first time, only the CBC, the thing has gone wrong.
18:30The NEET has gone wrong, the UGC has gone wrong, and then you remember NCRT chapter about the judiciary and
18:36how the Supreme Court has reacted on that.
18:38And in fact, almost finished the career of three experts.
18:41So there is a series of things which is happening in the education minister, and the education minister should explain.
18:46Is he so incompetent, or there is something wrong there?
18:51I don't want to question the intent of the minister. No.
18:54I'm not questioning the intent of the government.
18:57I'm only questioning the competence of the government.
18:59So the government has to respond. In a democracy, the accountability should be fixed.
19:03The bureaucracy transferring from one place to another place is absolutely nothing.
19:07It will not satisfy anybody, neither the opposition nor the people.
19:10Somebody should be told like what Rajat has said.
19:13In a private sector, anybody who is responsible for this, by now would have lost his career.
19:18With no hope in future.
19:21Okay.
19:21For any other career also.
19:22Like I said, it's much like Yashwan Deshmukh's snap poll, because rarely do Ashutosh and Rajat align on an issue.
19:31And for the first time, we've had both of, at least one of them quoting the other here on it.
19:35But I want to also now, you know, as I bring in Dr. Darbari, I want to give out the
19:40age-related data set to it.
19:41Because it's important for us to get a glimpse on what the youth of this country is thinking.
19:46They're much maligned, but they have an opinion, and they need to be spoken for.
19:50And there you have it.
19:50Let's move on from just the NDA voters, opposition voters, because we asked the same question.
19:56Who's to be blamed for NEET-UG 2026 paper leaks?
19:59And when you look at the data sets, where it comes down to the age-related data.
20:05Let's play that data set.
20:06In that, between 18 to 24 years, 51.1%.
20:12Let's get that data set going, and I'll get in Dr. Shikha Darbari there.
20:16Between 18.24%, 51.1% blame the education minister.
20:25These are the kids, most of them, who are actually sitting for the exam.
20:29Between 24 to 34%, 57%.
20:32And you can see how the youth is clearly jaded by the education system.
20:37And if you look at that entire data set, you'll know where the age groups stand.
20:42And whichever way you look at it, they want the head right at the top to roll.
20:48And that is the education minister.
20:50I want to bring in Dr. Shikha Darbari.
20:52Dr. Shikha Darbari, reform's immediate accountability now needs to be fixed.
20:59And it needs to be seen to be fixed.
21:02At least that's what the data seems to suggest.
21:05See, yes.
21:08Yes, certainly if I see on the moral grounds.
21:11It is always like that, that on moral grounds, the highest minister or the highest bureaucracy,
21:17they decide that yes, they have to take the moral responsibility.
21:21But if I see in this case, I'm really surprised to see this data.
21:26Because if you see that in the, you know, there is an education mafia, there is a coaching mafia.
21:33And why they are not bringing in coaching, coaching mafia in need 226 paper.
21:38And why they are not bringing in those parents.
21:41Whereas those parents who have purchased this paper for 25 lakhs.
21:46So this is a, you know, these are stakeholders.
21:48There are this coaching mafia, I would say who are selling this paper.
21:52These are these doctors who have their big nursing homes and they want their children to, you know, be the
21:59doctors.
22:00And since they want their children to be the doctors, they are purchasing these papers.
22:03If you see, this change has come, when this need paper has become mandatory.
22:10Earlier, what they were doing, they were going to the medical colleges and buying the seeds in one crore for
22:15their children.
22:16So this is where...
22:17Ma'am, you know, you hold on to that thought.
22:19I'll allow you to complete.
22:20I will allow you to complete, ma'am.
22:22But you talk about the coaching mafia, it's not that we haven't posed that question.
22:26And I'll give our producers just about a minute's time to pull that question out a little earlier on what
22:31is your opinion on coaching centers.
22:35This question was also asked of the respondents.
22:37The minute our producers have that, we're going to pull that data out first.
22:40But make your point, ma'am.
22:42See, in this...
22:43Okay, we've got that, we've got it going.
22:45And I just want to take our viewers...
22:47I'm sorry, I'm interrupting you again.
22:48I will take our viewers through that question that was asked to the respondents.
22:52What's your opinion on coaching centers, NDA voters?
22:56They are important.
22:5734.3% of NDA voters feel coaching centers are important.
23:03Opposition, exactly nearly the same.
23:0533.9% of them feel coaching centers are important.
23:10Others, 23.3%.
23:12Should be banned is just 8.5%, ma'am.
23:16You know, one can get into being alarmist about coaching centers, blame the coaching centers,
23:21but our education system is not strong enough to fill that gap in,
23:26which is today being occupied by these coaching centers, and that needs to be addressed.
23:30Should be regulated, yes.
23:3239.8% say NDA voters should be regulated.
23:37Opposition voters, 37.6% say should be regulated.
23:4251.1% say should be regulated.
23:44But to blame the coaching centers alone, ma'am, I wouldn't think is the solution.
23:50Because they have only taken the space that has been left by the lack of a robust Indian educational system.
23:59No, this is a whole nexus between the different stakeholders.
24:03You have the parents, you have the coaching centers, and then there are the people who get compromised in the
24:09system,
24:10in the bureaucracy, who are giving this paper.
24:12If you see, this is Mr. Kulkarni who has given this paper.
24:16So, the teacher himself has, who has prepared, who was the paper setter.
24:20He has been compromised in this case.
24:21But Dr. Darbari, that's, you know, nickel power, I want to bring you in.
24:25No, no, no, but Dr. Darbari, you can pinpoint on one particular teacher who was the last point in a
24:32clear chain that has led inside.
24:34See.
24:35You know, you can't blame the last person who had the paper in his hand who bought it from someone.
24:40See, in this case, we all know that Mr. Kulkarni has given this paper.
24:43Okay.
24:43And you think that's where the buck stops.
24:45In this case, Mr. Kulkarni, who was the paper setter, he himself has given this paper.
24:49So, if the teacher's morality has gone down so much, where is the...
24:54Can you blame the teachers alone, madam?
24:56Because they have the trust from the teachers.
24:57That's a very simplistic question.
24:58Okay, stay with me.
24:59No, no.
25:00It is the anti-A system.
25:03I would tell you one thing.
25:05Okay, Yashwag, everybody wants to come in.
25:06NTA should have seen the 360 degree checking of that teacher.
25:10So, NTA did not see it.
25:12Okay.
25:12And NTA has not seen it for the third year running.
25:15NTA should have checked the anti-cidance of the teacher.
25:19That it should be a kind of person, he should not have been compromised.
25:24Okay, I want to bring in Nikhil Pawar.
25:25Nikhil Pawar quickly.
25:26And 24, you have not given any kind of charge sheet to the...
25:31Madam, I will circle back to you.
25:33I will circle back to you.
25:34I will circle back to you.
25:34Allow us that time and grace.
25:36I appreciate it.
25:37Go ahead, Mr. Pawar.
25:38Yeah, look.
25:39The way I see this is that we have a crisis of leadership in the country.
25:43It's not about some bureaucrats getting fired.
25:46Frankly, I don't think the minister should resign.
25:48The minister should be fired.
25:50Look at the mess that this is creating for parents, for students.
25:54There are lives at stake.
25:55These transfers and commission setting are predictable, bureaucratic responses.
26:00There are face-saving measures by a bureaucracy and a government that seems to clearly lack leadership.
26:06I mean, where is the prime minister?
26:08He was there for Pariksha with Chacha.
26:10He did a Man Ki Baat talking about mangoes.
26:13There is a crisis here for students whose lives are at stake, right?
26:17In this moment, we need to hear from our leadership.
26:20He needs to give people confidence.
26:22Leaders stand up in crisis.
26:24They don't avoid.
26:26He should have spoken up days ago.
26:28Is this not a crisis?
26:29Are millions of lives not impacted?
26:31You can keep bickering about coaching centers and all that nonsense, but the fact is this
26:37issue needs to be dealt with.
26:38We don't want transfers and all of this nonsense.
26:41We want outcomes.
26:43What is the step that the government is going to take?
26:45What is the prime minister going to take to give students the assurance that their marks
26:50are going to get fixed?
26:52I mean, you look at the kind of scans that were done.
26:54There are pens.
26:55There are blocking papers.
26:56There are answer sheets with two different sets of answers, two different sets of handwriting
27:01across consecutive pages.
27:03This has clearly been botched up, and there is clearly a case for investigation of corruption
27:09here.
27:10But that aside, we need an immediate response from the government about what it is going to
27:15do.
27:16I have nieces who are going to be giving 12th post exams this year and next year.
27:21CBSE lacks credibility right now.
27:23I have zero faith in CBSE.
27:25See, I am beginning to regret that I put my child in a CBSE school.
27:29You can change heads, but the whole system seems to be rotten.
27:34This is why people are standing with their kids outside the country for studies.
27:38This is why people are moving to IB and other boards.
27:42Because CBSE is hollowed out.
27:44It is terrible what is going on over here.
27:46Okay.
27:47And also, look at it.
27:48Look at it.
27:49Now, I have one important point to make.
27:51Look, if you look at the way these systems were set up, passwords were hard coded for anyone
27:56to be able to access them.
27:58It wasn't very difficult for these very competent students to break down CBSE's website.
28:06What is the role of certain?
28:08What is our CBSE agency doing?
28:11Look at how can such, for a critical process, something be done in such a shoddy manner.
28:16No, we were speaking to one of the ethical hackers there, the young student.
28:21And he told us, it wasn't like breaking into a home.
28:24It was, the door was left open and the key was hanging even then.
28:27So, it was as easy as that.
28:29It is, this is a, this is not just a badly run process.
28:33This is a criminally run process.
28:35Okay, I want to bring in Yashwan.
28:36Someone should be in jail for this.
28:37Right.
28:37I want to bring in Yashwan Deshmukh into this conversation.
28:40Yashwan, you know, because some of the findings are disconcerting, shocking and a tad bit shameful,
28:46I would think, because this is what the opinion is of the people of this country.
28:50But do you think there will be satisfaction?
28:52Because now we've seen the CBSE chairperson being transferred, the secretary being transferred.
28:57There was angst, there was anger.
28:59It was building up.
29:00Do you think some of that pressure has been released?
29:04I don't really think so.
29:05I mean, more than pressure, people need solution.
29:08You see, the way, the way it has to be technical in a firefighting mode,
29:12have to be in multiple steps.
29:14I mean, I, I was going through some of the reports today that some,
29:18today the IIT JEE results came out, by the way, the entrance examination.
29:22And some of the kids who have cracked the JEE, they haven't met the,
29:27probably the minimum score that is required of their classroom examination.
29:31And now there is a disconnect.
29:33I mean, how do you explain that somebody who has scored 99th percentile on JEE,
29:38is not getting 60% on CBSE or something of that sort.
29:43So, I think the government should, first of all, immediately declare that anybody who has cracked the entrance exam of
29:50JEE or any other thing.
29:51And, you know, the criteria of these marks should be get away with.
29:56Because if the kid has cracked it and he has passed the CBSE, that should be good.
30:00That will give relief to a big number of students, I am telling you.
30:03Number two, as the numbers are suggesting, people just want right now that the CBSE mark sheet evaluation should be
30:14done physically.
30:15Going back till the point of time, you correct and ensure that you have a foolproof system in place.
30:22At least go back to your basic. This is what the firefighting mode, you know, at war footing that people
30:28need.
30:28I think, Priti, one question where we asked, do you personally know in your family or friend or anybody who
30:37has suffered from this one?
30:39That number is telling you. Every second Indian, every second Indian is almost telling that they are aware of somebody
30:46who is suffering.
30:47That will tell you the kind of intensity with this issue is impacting people.
30:54You know, they may not have a student in their own immediate household, but within their larger family and friend
31:01circle, they are aware of some kids.
31:04And that is where the panic is setting in. I think it has to be dealt on firefighting mode.
31:10I know that Rajat said that there are things which are to be managed in a routine way whenever they
31:16have to be managed.
31:17And then once you are in the firefighting mode, you have to first, you know, put up something to the
31:22immediate relief.
31:23I think that those sort of measures are required.
31:26Simply transferring a bureaucrat or saying that they are responsible, we have transferred, it's not going to help.
31:33But how is it going to help a kid? And you are right. If you have already cracked an examination
31:38like IITJE to give that leeway.
31:40But also, there are so many kids that we have been speaking to Mr. Deshmukh through the day.
31:44They haven't even received their mark sheets yet. And even though revaluation date has lapsed.
31:50So what about higher educational institutes? Shouldn't they also push their deadline ahead?
31:54Because these kids are going to lose them. Absolutely. Lose a full year. What about that?
31:58That's what they need. That's what the assurance that has to be given to the students, the lack of the
32:02students.
32:02You know, we play, we don't bother. We are there to help you.
32:06And this is not going to impact your career. This is not going to impact your future.
32:10Alright, you know, the data set that you spoke of, do you know anyone who's been impacted?
32:14We'll play it at the end, Mr. Deshmukh. I want to quickly go through the next three data sets that
32:19we have on NEET.
32:20This is viewers. When the respondents were asked by SeaVoter, is computer-based examination the solution for paper leaks?
32:28Something now that the government is finally considering for NEET.
32:3145.9% say yes who are NDA voters. Opposition voters 40.2%. Others 33.8%.
32:40So largely, if you look at that data set, mostly believe that yes, that there should be a need now
32:47of computer-based examination for paper leaks.
32:50The other question that was asked, should the government disband the NDA and go back to state-level tests?
32:56This has been debated so many times in television studios and outside.
33:02Should the government disband NDA and go back to state-level tests?
33:07A whopping 58.2% of NDA voters who vote for the BJP say yes. Disband the NDA.
33:13The state-level tests were better. They were more secure. They were seemingly more fair.
33:2068.1% opposition voters feel the same. 47.6% others.
33:26So you look at that data set and the writing is practically, technically on the wall right here, viewers.
33:31Where there is, at least, where the respondents here were concerned, made their point very clear.
33:39Disband NDA, let's go back to state-level examination.
33:42Should government disband and go back to state-level examination?
33:46We've turned the data points in terms of NDA and the opposition voters to the age level there.
33:55And you see it on the television screen where, what, 18% to 24%, 72%, 0.7% want to
34:03go back to state-level.
34:06I want to bring in Ashutosh and, what, Rajat, who wanted to come in.
34:10Rajat, you've been trying to make a point. Go ahead.
34:13Well, my simple point here is, on this data, NDA came out as a reform mandated by the Supreme Court.
34:20Because there were problems with the previous system as well.
34:24I mean, people will forget, you know, after a lot of exercise, a lot of efforts,
34:30and a lot of bureaucratic changes was this institution brought in.
34:34Of course, it was not efficient and we've seen that.
34:36But, you know, look at worldwide.
34:38How have people tried to evade the problem of paper leaks?
34:42Online examination is one such way.
34:44Back in those days, there were no telegram for mass-distributing answers,
34:48question papers across the whole country.
34:51Today, those tools invisibly exist, that entire dark web exists today,
34:55which was not there, say, even seven, eight to ten years back.
34:59So, blaming, you know, NDA alone and throwing a baby with the bathwater,
35:04it is not the panacea to the problems.
35:06The problems, if the examination has to be conducted, have a suitable entity to do it.
35:11My question here is, and this is a very important question, you tell me,
35:15how many smart engineers go and work for that EduTech, whatever that company's name is?
35:20Have you seen any smart engineer going in and working? No.
35:23So, it's garbage in, garbage out. Average people, average engineers are going in,
35:27their coding skills are average, their cryptographic skills are average,
35:31and they are creating average products.
35:32Will TCS solve the job or Infosys solve the job?
35:35The answer is no. We have seen how income tax tanks around each time when the returns have to be
35:40filed.
35:41Similarly, the Ministry of Corporate Affairs, the softwares don't work because of the peak load.
35:45Wherever this country has peak load, we have seen systems breaking apart.
35:48So, somehow, even these IT firms, I mean, you pick any firm for that matter,
35:53everybody is languishing and nobody has a solution.
35:56Average set of people are manning these companies.
35:58Now, how do you change the entire sort of society and try and get the right people
36:03who can cryptographically code these, so that, encrypt these papers,
36:08so that they cannot be decrypted along the way?
36:10There are ways. This is a solved problem.
36:12All that you need to do is...
36:13Let me bring in Nikhil Pawar on that.
36:15Okay. Ashutosh, I know you want to come in.
36:17Allow Nikhil Pawar to come in and I'll come back to Ashutosh.
36:19Nikhil Pawar, you've been wanting to make a point on this. Go ahead.
36:22No, look, you pay peanuts, you get monkeys, right?
36:25One of the problems is that all of these contracts are L1 contracts.
36:30Someone who bid higher and make more money off it
36:34will be able to put more competent people on the job.
36:36But look, a broader problem is, and I am questioning this,
36:41why do we need CBSE boards?
36:43For what purpose are they?
36:44If everyone's going to go and give entrance exams in the first place,
36:47why do you need CBSE boards?
36:49If there are limited sets of institutions that want it, let them have it.
36:54But this criteria, like Ashutosh, I think, or like Mr. Deshbuk mentioned earlier,
37:00do away with the CBSE or a board result criteria altogether.
37:03People want to prepare for a particular college, let them do it.
37:08Secondly, you also have to take in mind that we are dealing with a problem of scarcity.
37:12These exams become even more important because our education system hasn't grown enough to be able to deal with the
37:20population that needs to go to higher education.
37:25We need better colleges, we need more colleges.
37:28The problem of education in this country is significantly unresolved.
37:31We have too much scarcity of good colleges, good teachers.
37:36And where is that focus?
37:38I mean, really, you can keep digitizing all the processes you want,
37:43but you won't be addressing the key problem that is the scarcity of good colleges and good education in the
37:50country.
37:51That's why there is so much demand and so much competition for some colleges and some institutions.
37:56Fair point.
37:57Ashutosh, you wanted to make a point before I go to the next data set?
38:00Come in.
38:01See, I completely agree with Rajat on one point.
38:07See, we are born in the carbon copy age.
38:11Now the kids are dealing with the AI and the debate is that whether the robots will take over the
38:20humans.
38:21Now the disconnect is between these two.
38:23If somebody was born in the carbon copy age, if he has been tasked to do and deal with these
38:28kind of things,
38:29obviously you will not get the results.
38:32So the time has come when somebody who really understands technology,
38:38somebody who really understands how things could be done at such a mass scale,
38:43only then we can deal with these.
38:45But just imagine, when the whole world is talking about AI,
38:49we are not in a position even to upload these answer sheets which should be legible enough.
38:56How pedestrian we are.
38:58It's not because that the system is not there.
39:00It's because the system is managed by people who have no understanding of technology
39:05and who just think it's just a bureaucratic thing.
39:08And it could be done just by one person.
39:10But Ashutosh, you know, okay, one would say it's our education system is screaming for reforms,
39:16but the government can turn around and the education minister can turn around.
39:20We are doing exactly that.
39:21He'll say NEET is moving into computers.
39:23OSM was a reform that we bought in for the CBSE.
39:26We tried to implement a reform.
39:28It didn't work.
39:29We're taking it back.
39:30No, no, no, no, no.
39:31Preeti, the problem is, I'm telling you, the problem is the people who are managing this technology.
39:37Yes.
39:37Okay.
39:37I hear you.
39:38I hear you.
40:00Irony is, irony is that we also have success stories, but I don't know why we are not copying.
40:05For example, today's JE results.
40:08JE is done.
40:09I mean, the first round, second round, main round.
40:12Did anybody receive a single complaint about the way the JE is conducted?
40:17No.
40:18Civil services in the same country.
40:20Did anybody say how it is conducted and any problem in that?
40:23So why can't we just learn from the success stories, things which you have done?
40:29I mean, if you want to get the need done, give it to the JE people.
40:32Let them handle the need as well, along with JE.
40:35Let there be one SAT kind of examination, which would be, you know, on one part of the mathematics side,
40:41deal with the JE on the biology side with the need and interest examination,
40:45and let the chemistry and the physics be the common papers.
40:49Who is stopping you?
40:51You know, let there be, I mean, there is no problem in consolidating or making a one big exam.
40:56That's not a problem.
40:58The problem is that there are 10 different zillion times who said that nobody is learning from each other.
41:03There are success stories.
41:05JE is done the right way.
41:06It is on screen paper.
41:07That is how it should be done, without any problem.
41:10All right.
41:10But I don't know why it should be done the way it should be.
41:12I'll bring in Dr. Darbari and allow me to take the next set of questions.
41:15Because once again, this was regarding NEET.
41:17Because we posed this question earlier, that was regarding CBSE.
41:20The question that was posed by Sea Voter, who would you, or who should be held accountable?
41:25For these fiascos.
41:27And it's a number of fiascos, like we pointed out.
41:29There was CBSE, there's NEET, and there's CEUT now.
41:32Well, Borden testing agencies.
41:35NDA voters who vote the BJP, say 28%.
41:38Opposition, 27.9%.
41:40Others, 22.9%.
41:42The Education Minister.
41:44NDA voters, 29.7% of them hold the Education Minister.
41:50Mr. Dharmendra Prasad Pradhan responsible.
41:53Opposition voters, 36%.
41:55Others, 38.4%.
41:58Look at the numbers right there, viewers.
42:00Let's move on to the other data set.
42:03The same question, asked in terms of the age.
42:05We broke it up in the age bracket and demography as well.
42:08And you see rare, 18% to 24% blame Borden testing agencies, while 37.2% blame the Education
42:18Minister.
42:19So, look at it right there, viewers.
42:21You have it right on your television screens on what the young feel in terms of who needs to shoulder
42:29the blame.
42:30You see the youth, and then you see it gradually going over different age groups.
42:36Okay, I want to take you now to the other data set.
42:39Do you trust system and government to be fair to students?
42:43And this is an important question to ask, because till now we have believed that if you work hard, there's
42:49a sense of fairness.
42:50If you didn't work hard, then that's what you deserve.
42:53Do you trust? And trust has been the operating word.
42:58Because you had trust in the system.
43:01So, do the people today have trust in the system and government to be fair to students?
43:07Look at the numbers there.
43:09Even NDA voters feel, 44.3% of them, that no trust at all.
43:1727.1% of them feel that they're losing trust gradually.
43:21Leave alone the opposition voters.
43:23Let's suggest that they come from bias.
43:26Look at the NDA voters right there.
43:27And look at the others.
43:29That's, you know, if this doesn't lead to alarm bells ringing, then there's clearly something wrong in our system.
43:37Dr. Shikha Darbari, do you still blame the coaching centres?
43:43No, I will certainly say that the trust of students is going down.
43:47And overall responsibility certainly is of NTA because this is the examination conducting body.
43:54And examination conducting body, if you say the parliamentary committee, they have also said that we have little trust in
44:03the kind of system that NTA is giving.
44:05And in 2024 also, the needs, this exam was leaked and NTA did not do anything.
44:13And NTA and even the other government agencies, where are the culprits of 2024?
44:18So, if we are not, you know, giving any kind of punishment to those culprits, then all the trust factor
44:26is going down.
44:26And certainly NTA systems are somewhere compromised.
44:30Either by way of, you know, they are giving, they are not checking the antecedents of the persons.
44:36And if you see one common factor, both in NEAT and CBSE, what has happened that in the choice of
44:43vendors, they have not seen their antecedents.
44:47In the choice of vendors in CBSE, you have gone for a L1 person who was blacklisted, who has already
44:54done, you know, scams in Telangana in two years.
44:58And still we are choosing that person by, you know, compromising on the timeframe of blacklisted person by going down
45:06in the financial things.
45:07So, this is what some officer in NTA, in CBSE is doing.
45:12And similarly in NTA, if we see that the paper setter has been made a kind of person on which
45:19I can't trust.
45:20A teacher who has compromised his moral values.
45:23So, here it's a question of our whole society where a vendor, officer is taking a vendor who is not,
45:31who is a blacklisted vendor.
45:32So, he cannot provide you proper technical support.
45:35And there you are taking a teacher who is compromised, who has given, he is the paper setter and he
45:41has given the paper.
45:42Okay.
45:42So, overall, responsibility certainly lies with NTA that why they did, why they didn't lie.
45:48Dr. Darbar, you made your point, ma'am.
45:50Mr. Pawa is shaking his head.
45:52He doesn't seem to agree.
45:53Allow me to get a contrarian opinion.
45:54Mr. Pawa, go ahead.
45:56Look, I just have a clear set of requirements or demands that I am making right now.
46:00One, I'd like to hear the PM speak up about this issue and give assurance to people that action is
46:06going to be taken to provide solutions to students.
46:08We can bicker all we want about these other issues, but we need solutions right now.
46:12The education minister needs to be fired.
46:15We need to address this problem of CBS as a bottleneck and how it's hollowed out right now and stop
46:22these L1 contracts being given.
46:23Board examinations should only be needed for specific colleges that want to use them.
46:28Allow students to skip them.
46:29Why create that pressure?
46:30Let them study for what they actually want to do and create more supply.
46:35We have a clear situation where demand is far greater than supply.
46:38So open up to foreign universities.
46:40Let them come and let them compete.
46:42Okay.
46:43We need a market economy over here for competition that provides better education because clearly our system is failing beyond
46:52a handful of colleges and schools.
46:54Fair point.
46:55You're very right.
46:56I want to bring in Yashwan Deshmukh because Yashwan Deshmukh, I want to now take the same question and instead
47:01of political brackets of NDA opposition and others, break it down in terms of age group and what they had
47:10to say.
47:10And Yashwan, you know, one can get into a clickbait question on should the, you know, the education minister resign.
47:19You know, we can dwell on that through the show.
47:21But that's not really the question because the question is this.
47:24And I would think this is the core point of your snap poll or what we are discussing.
47:29And the operative word is trust.
47:31Do you trust the system and governments to be fair to students?
47:34And when students and the people start losing trust, then, you know, these are alarm bells that should be ringing
47:42very, very high.
47:43Because look at, you know, the numbers that have come in.
47:4618 to 24 percent.
47:4759.7 percent say no.
47:49We don't trust the system.
47:51The system is unfair to us.
47:54Losing trust gradually.
47:5524.8 percent.
47:57So nearly 80 percent, Mr. Deshmukh, between the age group of 18 to 24.
48:03We talk about youth as being our largest resource in India.
48:08And they are completely disillusioned by the system.
48:10They don't trust the system anymore.
48:12The number goes up when you look into the 24 to 35 segment, which is like the new entry to
48:18the job market of the youngsters.
48:19That number goes even up to two-thirds of them saying that.
48:23So, obviously, the critical element is the trust.
48:26I think that is something which is a collateral damage, I would say, in this entire fiasco.
48:35And that needs to be repaired.
48:37That needs to be repaired with a sense of urgency.
48:42That is almost like firefighting or war-fitting, whichever the word or adjective one might like to use.
48:48But that is something.
48:49Because at the end of the day, we all agree that all said and done, we are still a country
48:55with a society and the middle-class value which believes in meritocracy.
48:59Where we celebrate the success stories.
49:03Every time some board result comes in, we have the news story of some rickshaw puller's daughter topping the board.
49:08Some daily wage earners cracking the JEE.
49:11And we, as a society, end up celebrating those success stories.
49:15We celebrate them as our role models.
49:18And it is heartbreaking to see that when that kind of element goes down somewhere in the direction of uncertainty,
49:28in distrust, in mistrust, in a way that, okay, we don't really know if we are working hard whether we
49:34will be there.
49:35That's heartbreaking.
49:36I think this country drives on optimism and hope.
49:39This youth everlasting way of driving on optimism and hope.
49:46And this is not the direction which will help.
49:48I think it needs repairing.
49:50It needs repairing urgently right here, right now.
49:53And I think this trust deficit thing has to be plugged in right here, right now.
49:58Because unless that is plugged in right here, right now, you know, at the war footing,
50:03then it is only going to take it, erode it further next year to next year to next year.
50:08And that is where the danger is.
50:10From this meritocracy binding country or society of ours,
50:17losing our hope and optimism among that one, that's not going to help us in a long run.
50:22Or short run.
50:23You're right.
50:23You are right.
50:24Because when, you know, the country collectively smiles at a rickshaw puller's son topping IIT JEE,
50:29it's not individual triumph the country celebrates.
50:32They celebrate the win of meritocracy.
50:34They celebrate the win of trust.
50:35And that has been dented.
50:37Final comments.
50:38Ashutosh, go ahead, sir.
50:41See, I think the entire education system needs to be overhauled.
50:45And that is why I say these coaching center needs to be shut.
50:50I have no doubt in my mind.
50:52Right.
50:53Because why do you need coaching centers?
50:55Because schools are not equipped enough to train these kids to pass these exams.
51:02And that is why you are creating a parallel education system.
51:05And this parallel education system only focuses somehow to crack these exams.
51:10True.
51:11Because you are basically creating not students, but somebody who can crack the exam.
51:19And these people, when they go abroad, by any chance, they face the problem.
51:24So why our schools are not equipped enough?
51:26Why the quality education is not there?
51:28Why we are creating these parallel systems?
51:30Fair point.
51:31Less time.
51:33I want to go to Rajat.
51:34Rajat, sir.
51:35We don't have that much time.
51:36Just final comments.
51:36Rajat, quickly.
51:38On the political question, I leave it to the head of the state.
51:41Prime Minister will decide which way things have to go.
51:43But on the bureaucratic side, Prime Minister himself and his office will have to induct experts
51:49not worry about what will the IAS lobby think.
51:53They are the most corroded, useless set of people who cannot, do not have the ability
51:58to man technical institutions of this country.
52:01They cannot be manning NTA.
52:03They cannot be manning CVSC.
52:04There should be experts who can hold exams, whose morals are intact, and there is a public
52:11trust in those people.
52:12In bureaucracy, this country has had it enough for the past 60, 70 years.
52:17Now Prime Minister has to hear what the youngsters are saying.
52:20The system is crumbling, cracking.
52:22If you cannot put hard corrective measures right now, when everybody is literally screeching,
52:30we will see people spilling out on the streets, and it will become even more difficult.
52:34These safety walls that exist, exist for a reason, and merit should be seen, not just
52:39on papers, but also in execution.
52:41And I believe the Prime Minister will listen to it.
52:44And I think people who are going to protest on June the 6th should also give the government
52:49some window to actually course correctly and try and protect this academic year and the
52:55examinations that they have given, so that they can ensure that they can qualify.
52:59Well spoken, Rajat.
53:00And like I said, very rarely, and I think this also mirrors our snap poll there, do two
53:04sides of a political divide stand together?
53:06We've seen that happen in this particular debate.
53:09But Dr. Darbari, ma'am, 30 seconds, closing comments, please.
53:15Yeah, I would certainly say that our educational system, it leaves a transformation.
53:20And this transformation, we have got a new education policy.
53:23But again, the quality of teachers is so bad that these kind of coaching institutions
53:28are flourishing.
53:29So somewhere we have to improve the quality of our teachers, quality of our government schools.
53:34And this is a message to the education minister that where is the problem?
53:38Why can't we improve our government schools and why can't we improve our examination-taking
53:44agencies?
53:45So if you improve these things, there is no problem anywhere.
53:49Ma'am, in terms of improvement, the scope of improvement today is the importance.
53:52If re-evaluation happens in CBSE, all the teachers are on leave.
53:56Who is going to re-evaluate their papers?
53:59Half their papers they haven't even got?
54:02So if there is manual re-evaluation in CBSE, who is evaluating?
54:05See, in the CBSE also they committed a blunder that they didn't run a pilot project and they
54:11Ma'am, it's one blunder after another.
54:13That's the problem.
54:14And they took a hell one who didn't…
54:16Fair point.
54:16Ma'am, Mr. Power, can you come in, sir?
54:18Final comments.
54:20I have two simple points to make.
54:22One, I mean, she talked about the new education policy.
54:25The new education policy will not prepare this country for what's coming with AI.
54:30It is built for yesterday, not for tomorrow.
54:32It is actually quite terrible when I look at it.
54:35Secondly, one of the things that happens quite often is that you bring an IIT professor
54:40to head a commission or you to look into these things.
54:42I have seen enough IIT professors talking about tech that they don't understand and I think
54:48we really need to hire or bring someone in from the perspective of competence rather than
54:53a badge that they wear.
54:55I mean, I was in a meeting on AI agents and I was the only one in the room running
54:59an
54:59AI agent at that point in time and that was an IIT Madras paper that came out.
55:04They didn't know what AI agents are.
55:05So, we need to check for competence and not for badges because it's very easy for commissions,
55:10for groups to just say, let's bring an IIT person in even if he's not up to date with
55:15technology.
55:16Sir, we've run out of time.
55:17I apologize.
55:18I need to cut you short.
55:19But I think, Mr. Deshmukh, you know, we've done so many snap polls together but I would
55:23reckon that you reckon, I know you know, I know that this is one of the most constructive
55:29snap polls we've ever, ever done.
55:31And I really hope that the government takes note.
55:32So, thank you for that, Mr. Deshmukh.
55:34Thank you, all our guests who've joined us this evening.
55:36We really appreciate it.
55:37We're going to keep a keen eye on all developments.
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