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Grant & Danny debate 2 takes about the NFL's scheduling. Should football be just for Sundays?
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00:00Pick a take.
00:01We've got two comments from two different NFL analysts,
00:07and you've got to pick a side.
00:08They're on different sides of the aisle here.
00:10Jason Kelsey, longtime center Philadelphia Eagles.
00:13Chris Sims, former NFL quarterback.
00:15Kelsey on his own podcast with his brother,
00:18and Chris Sims on his Pro Football Talk television show with Mike Florio.
00:23What's being debated here is the NFL's saturation of the calendar, Danny.
00:30We now have standalone games on Sunday night, Monday night, Thursday night,
00:37football all day on Sunday.
00:39The league will also have games this year before and after Christmas and Thanksgiving,
00:45the days kind of leading up to and after.
00:47We also will have games, if you look at days of the week,
00:51that include Wednesday to kick off the season,
00:54that opening week Wednesday, Thursday, by the end of the year, Saturday and Sunday.
00:59And so the league just keeps kind of spreading its tentacles as far as it can,
01:03taking over more and more time from the consumer.
01:06Jason Kelsey's point is you're ruining Sunday fun day.
01:11The league used to own Sunday.
01:12Sunday was football day.
01:14Football all day on Sunday.
01:15It was a special thing because you had to wait all day for Sunday,
01:18and you might get to also enjoy Monday night football.
01:22But the NFL was synonymous with Sunday.
01:24Basically stole the day from the church, as they said in the movie Concussion.
01:28Chris Sims is on the other side of this where he says,
01:31this is actually great because you can't watch everything if it's all at the same time on Sunday.
01:37You normally, generally have to choose between one or two or three or four games or whatever.
01:42But if everything's getting played on the same day, as a football fan, you miss a lot.
01:47Even with NFL red zone, you're just not going to get to see all the stuff you want to see.
01:51So the more standalone games, the better.
01:53So I'm going to play these two clips, and then you're going to have to pick a take,
01:56pick a side here on Grant and Danny.
01:58So let's start with Jason Kelsey, who thinks Sunday fun day is being ruined.
02:03I don't think we're there yet.
02:07Sunday is the day of football, right?
02:09Outside of going to church in the morning, if you're still religious and you do that,
02:13Sunday is where so many games happen.
02:17And that's what you grow up in.
02:18You gear your entire week around watching football on Sunday.
02:22It's an institution at this point, the NFL playing games on Sunday.
02:25With every day that we keep adding in there, we're getting away from that just a little bit.
02:30And I worry that I think the game got big.
02:35One of the reasons it got so popular and big was because all of the game,
02:38it was an event, Sunday is the NFL, and everybody set their week apart to tune in to their games
02:45that were happening on Sunday.
02:45And you're watching kind of all of them now take place across the Sunday ticket, right?
02:50I worry that we're getting away from that just a little bit by building too many of this.
02:58That's Jason Kelsey.
03:00We're ruining how special Sunday was is the thesis of his statement.
03:05On the other side of that, you've got Chris Sims of NBC Sports suggesting that he loves how often we
03:13have games
03:13because you actually get to consume more football.
03:18I think it's awesome.
03:20I absolutely love it.
03:21I don't want seven games at 1 p.m.
03:24I can't watch it all.
03:25There's no way.
03:26It's stupid.
03:28Are you telling me people's Sundays are going to be ruined because they're gone?
03:32They're going to get home from church and go, oh, there's five games on at 1 p.m. instead of
03:377?
03:38Oh, s***.
03:39The day's ruined.
03:40It's ruined.
03:41I mean, I hate when there's four games at 425.
03:44I hate it.
03:45Or one's at 4 or 5.
03:47There's two at 4 or 5 and two at 425.
03:49I hate that.
03:50I can't watch it.
03:51I'd like to enjoy the games.
03:53So I'm one that's not going to be complaining about this.
03:58I like the stand-alone games.
03:59I enjoy being able to watch one at a time.
04:02And then on Sunday, there's nothing worse to me on a Sunday when the whole slate and you go, oh,
04:07my gosh, there's 13 games today on Sunday.
04:10There's no way I can keep track of it all and really talk about it all.
04:13And you know me.
04:14I'm sitting there writing notes trying to keep up and do all that.
04:17But I feel like this will be better for everybody to digest.
04:22Pick a take.
04:23That's the game we're playing on Grant and Danny.
04:25We'll open up the phones.
04:27800-636-1067.
04:29Whose side are you on?
04:31Jason Kelsey saying Sundays are becoming less special.
04:34The league's biting off a little bit more than it needs to.
04:37Or Chris Sims saying good.
04:39Stand-alone helps.
04:41Team Kelsey for me.
04:42And his reasoning is the same as mine.
04:45It's what I grew up with and it's what I know.
04:47It's what I'm comfortable with.
04:48Now, Chris Sims is speaking like someone who has to talk about football games, all of the football games, for
04:53a living.
04:54I understand his position.
04:56It's harder to make a valid point about that Jets-Falcons game that you didn't really watch because it was
05:02on Red Zone the same time as a bunch of other 1 o'clock games than if you were able
05:06to watch it as a standalone.
05:07It was on Wednesday, the new Tuesday night football brought to you by the NFL, etc.
05:12At a certain point, you have to have some deference.
05:15The NFL clearly hasn't any point.
05:17But you have to have some deference to the games themselves, a.k.a. the rest of the recovery of
05:22the players, the preparation that's needed, the game planning that's needed, all the things that go into making this incredible
05:26spectacle right.
05:27You can't just start doing Mondays, Tuesdays, Wednesdays, Thursdays, sometimes Fridays during the certain season when it's not conflicting with
05:33high school football, Saturday night when college football ends, and then Sundays, and then you're left with very little.
05:38Sunday's the special day.
05:40And it's cool to have a primetime game.
05:42Monday night football used to be really special.
05:44Now it's like the worst of the primetime games.
05:45We're close with Thursday night football.
05:47So, to me, Sunday's the special thing.
05:52I want the emphasis there.
05:53And it still is, as you know, as many primetime games as they've added.
05:57But to me, it's okay that I don't get the, you know, the, I'm just picking two teams at random,
06:02the Cleveland Raiders game in its entirety.
06:05I can have a couple of fantasy nuggets there.
06:08I can get my notes through red zone, etc.
06:11To be able to talk about it and so on.
06:13But because I don't have to major in it, I don't care as much as, you know, to have it
06:17be a standalone product.
06:19So, standalone doesn't always mean good.
06:21That's the other part of it, too, is a lot of primetime games you go, well, this is a stinker.
06:24I got no alternatives.
06:25I love having the alternatives on Sundays.
06:27So, you're team Kelsey.
06:28Yes.
06:28I am team Sims.
06:30I knew you would be.
06:30I am team Chris Sims, boys and girls.
06:33He is so correct.
06:34He's not always correct.
06:35But when he is, right now, I'm team Chris Sims.
06:39You get to see more football.
06:41That's what we should all want.
06:42That's what we should all be striving for.
06:45You mentioned that his point sounds like someone who covers the league.
06:48And that's because he covers the league.
06:50But that has nothing to do with wanting to see more football, necessarily.
06:53You don't have to cover the NFL to want to watch it.
06:56To want to see the most games possible.
06:59You don't have to do a show with Mike Florio to want to be informed the next time you're hanging
07:04out at the bar with your buddies.
07:05You know how many of our listeners spend a lot of money on their NFL addiction?
07:09On their NFL fandom?
07:11You know how many people are playing a bunch of fantasy teams?
07:14The more you get to see, the better you are at that.
07:17The amount of people that are betting on sports now.
07:19Some take it seriously.
07:20Some just throwing five bucks on a game because it's fun.
07:23The more you get to see, the more informed you are, the better you are.
07:27And people love, and in my case, are addicted to this league.
07:31They want all that they can get.
07:33So, I'm team standalone game because every time there's a game on, by itself, on a weeknight, it's one fewer
07:41game that is airing simultaneously with others on Sunday.
07:46To make the point that Chris Sims made, hopefully more clearly.
07:51One of my biggest aggravations on Sundays is the red zone one o'clock window when we've got nine games
08:00airing, and then at four o'clock on Sunday, there's three, let's say.
08:05And I'm always going, why in the hell are they doing 9-3 to make up the 12?
08:10Why isn't it 7-5 or 6-6?
08:13Nine games at one time on the same window on Sunday has never made sense to me.
08:19Then on Sunday, for red zone people watching or bouncing around, you're just going three games.
08:24If there was four or five and you lowered the one o'clock window, it would make more sense because
08:28you're missing less.
08:29That should be the league's goal.
08:30They don't really care that much about it.
08:32It's very much about TV and kind of making everything work.
08:36But the great way to do that is when there's a game on Sunday and a game on Monday and
08:40a game on Thursday.
08:41And God willing, Danny, if we could find a way to have a game on Wednesday, too, schedule-wise, I
08:47get it.
08:47Player health, figuring all that out, extra buys, however that needs to be done.
08:51That's a different conversation.
08:53But if we're just talking about the specialness of Sunday, I actually don't agree with Jason Kelsey's premise.
08:57He's 1,000% right that Sunday and the NFL go together like peanut butter and jelly.
09:02To me, that's, you know, Sydney, Sweeney, and Euphoria.
09:05You can't have one without the other.
09:06They've got to be the same, right?
09:09But I don't think Sundays are being ruined by other days mattering, too.
09:14Football day.
09:14What day is it, Danny?
09:15What day is the NFL on all day long?
09:16Sunday.
09:17Still.
09:18Monday didn't change that.
09:19Thursday didn't change that.
09:20Some Saturday night games in December aren't going to change that.
09:22The NFL has taken Sunday from the church, basically, as like, what are you doing Sunday?
09:29Well, we got the Chargers at four.
09:30We'll work around that.
09:31We'll have some people over.
09:32We'll make some snacks, depending on where you're at in the country.
09:34So, yeah, I just don't think the growth of standalone games has ruined Sundays being special.
09:45It has not yet.
09:46But Kelsey's point, I think, is you're going, we have it, and then you're giving it away
09:51slowly but surely when you start moving more and more inventory off of Sunday.
09:54So, you have Sunday special, and it becomes less special with every little chip away.
09:58It's still pretty special.
09:59But there's never going to be enough inventory moved off because there's just not enough days
10:02in the week.
10:02You wouldn't think.
10:03Sunday wouldn't have a 12-game slate.
10:06I mean, it's going to be more than that.
10:07But, like, that's going to be, like, on end of the year, as an example, when there's three
10:11games on Thanksgiving, when they do that bit, and then there's normally
10:15Two on Black Friday now, or one?
10:17I can't remember how many.
10:17There's one on Black Friday.
10:18So, now you have four games there.
10:20And I don't know that there'd be a Saturday game, but let's just throw one on there.
10:24Six, you know, with Saturday, let's say two teams have a bye or something.
10:27So, now we're down to 32 minus 14, 18.
10:30There's still, in that hypothetical we just came up with, it's crazy, there's still nine
10:34games on Sunday.
10:36You're going to be okay.
10:36Yeah, I'll be fine.
10:38So, one's at Sunday night, and then there's eight.
10:39There's five and three in the one and four o'clock window.
10:41My last appeal to sanity for Sunday is, it's still great when you're watching your game,
10:48because my game, most of the time, now, Jaden Daniels era notwithstanding, it's a one o'clock
10:53Sunday game.
10:54And in real time, that score bug flashes on the bottom line.
10:58Oh, my God, the Giants are losing.
11:00Oh, my God, the Cowboys are getting the doors blown off, or whatever.
11:03Those sorts of real-time moments while you're playing and thinking about the permutations are
11:08awesome and so much fun.
11:10I love that, and I understand it's not the era of, what about being able to watch every
11:15second of that?
11:15Yeah, you know, I suppose you still have the ability to do that after the fact, but if every
11:20game's a primetime game, you kind of lose that magic.
11:22And it's still, you know, I'm old enough to know, or remember, in the era before all the
11:27fantasy football, before all the gambling stuff, it was still, I love Washington and I
11:31hate their rivals.
11:32And it was awesome to see them kind of in real time going through it while you're playing,
11:36you're doing the same thing.
11:37Pick a take.
11:38Kelsey says, we are ruining the specialness of Sundays in the NFL by having so many other
11:44games on different days.
11:46NFL's biting off more than it can chew.
11:48Sim says, good.
11:49I get to watch more football.
11:51I want standalone games.
11:52Gary in Fredericksburg, pick a take.
11:55Hey, how you doing?
11:56Hey, my take is, I hate agreeing with the guy because I can't stand him, but I take Chris
12:02Sim's side.
12:03More football's better, I think.
12:05Man, any day during the week, I think that's just fun.
12:08Gives you a chance to see more games, like you said.
12:11And really, really, if you think about it, the vote should be really what the NFL, I have
12:16a beef about, is how come they have all these different streamings now on different nights,
12:20different channels of streaming?
12:22People don't have all of them.
12:24That should be the real vote because that just stinks.
12:28Well, that's a different conversation.
12:30But it's part of it to me.
12:32Not wrong.
12:32Yeah.
12:32I mean, the apps being included now, that's just an inevitable sign of the times, frankly.
12:38I don't know how much you can blame the league for that.
12:41The Nationals are now on, you know, nationals.tv, an app that you can pay for by the year because
12:47some cable providers don't have where their games are.
12:51I mean, frankly, the model that we're used to has changed.
12:55People don't have cable.
12:56In this studio right now, me, you, Strober, Daris, Kobe, does anyone other than Danny
13:02have actual cable?
13:04Nobody does, right?
13:05I mean, so it's one out of the five of us, 20% of the world.
13:08Go figure the old guy's got cable.
13:09Yeah.
13:10But think about that.
13:11Right?
13:11So that's not a league problem.
13:13That's a world problem.
13:15You know what I mean?
13:15Certainly.
13:16That guy wants to write checks and everyone's using debit cards.
13:19But his point, though, goes to the larger thing, whereas if...
13:22Now, again, I'm with you.
13:23I don't fault the league for making more money.
13:25That's something they'll try to continue to do.
13:27But it is, used to be Sunday, 4, 5, 7, 9 here locally.
13:31You got your games.
13:32Now you don't, right?
13:34And I get that.
13:35And you're right, sir.
13:36It costs.
13:37Somebody did the numbers, ran the numbers.
13:39I don't remember what they came out to, but I had this a couple weeks ago on the show.
13:42It was like $1,100 for the year if you want to watch every NFL game.
13:47Now, that's sickos like me who have Sunday ticket on YouTube TV with every app to watch all
13:53of the exclusive stuff.
13:54But still, over the course of those months for the season to have everything, it's over
13:58$1,000 now to watch football.
14:00One of the things, and this is, I'm curious to your guys' take on this.
14:04One of the reasons that I'm Team Kelsey on this, it's not necessarily the Sunday thing
14:08because there's still going to be games 1, 4, and Sunday Night Football, so there's no
14:12worry about me being able to watch multiple games.
14:14It's if you start taking over other nights of the week, you've already got me hook, line,
14:18and sinker.
14:18On Thursday night, I'm not doing anything with friends.
14:21I'm already hanging out watching football.
14:23On Monday night, I'm not doing anything with friends.
14:24On Sunday, not doing anything with friends.
14:26If you start trying to take over other nights of the week, then suddenly I get out of the
14:29habit of that.
14:30Suddenly on Wednesday, you have a game, well, I got other stuff going on.
14:34And suddenly, does that start to bleed over into Thursday?
14:37Does that start to bleed over into Monday where I can envision a life without football?
14:40I can't envision that right now.
14:41But if you start trying to take over seven days of the week, and I start getting out
14:45of the habit of every single day that football is on, it revolves around football, I wonder
14:51if you start to overexpose yourself a little bit and make yourself less valuable to the
14:59casual fan.
15:00Yeah, more of anything, there's a debate.
15:02I mean, if we're talking about your favorite food, Danny, you and I used to use the analogy
15:05of mac and cheese or something.
15:07If you have it once a month, mac and cheese is delicious.
15:10It's perfect.
15:11It's awesome.
15:11You look forward to it.
15:12It's amazing.
15:13Oh, it's mac and cheese day next week.
15:14If you have it Tuesday, Thursday, and Friday, it's just the next time you're eating the mac
15:19and cheese.
15:19It's a great philosophical debate.
15:22Currently in our house, it is just known that we don't do anything on Sundays.
15:28Like, that is just a thing in our home.
15:30When we get to an age where our kids are playing sports on Sundays or something, it's going
15:34to be weird, honestly.
15:35I don't, I, we, we may not do that.
15:37Like, if we have to play sports on a Sunday, we're probably not going to play that sport.
15:41I think as of right now, now, as my son's getting hooked on baseball or whatever, I
15:45don't know.
15:45Maybe come back to me in a year, we'll have changed our opinion.
15:47But I think that's kind of the mindset.
15:49Sunday shouldn't be a day you should be doing sports and public thing.
15:52Like, to me, that's a day with your family anyway.
15:54I'm kind of old school in that way.
15:55But that's a whole nother conversation for probably another radio station.
16:00But having said that, I think that, to Toby's point, I can't say, all right, Monday night,
16:08I can't do anything.
16:09Thursday night, I can't do anything.
16:11And all day Sunday, I can't do anything.
16:12At some point, the league doesn't get to just keep stealing calendar days.
16:15Yeah, it's like, right now, you've got four days.
16:17But, God, if it's five, now it's six.
16:19But to me, it all depends on what success is.
16:21And here's what I mean.
16:22If the metric for success for the NFL is, yep, it'll be the number one viewed show on
16:27Wednesday nights when they do Wednesday night football, then that's good enough.
16:31Name that network.
16:32When, I don't know, Paramount Plus or Bravo or whatever goes, we got Wednesday night football
16:37on Bravo.
16:38And it's something but Andy Cohen doing promos for sit-downs with the Real Housewives of Name
16:42that city in between for commercials, if, you know, 8 million, 10 million, 15 million
16:47people watch it because it's more successful than anything else, they're not as concerned.
16:51But, yes, it's watered down, but they're still winning, right?
16:54Even though you guys are both, it sounds like, then pro-Kelsea, neither of you agree with
16:58the premise, essentially, that we're on the brink of Sunday's not becoming special.
17:03Football is still dominant on that day.
17:05It is.
17:06And I think the only place where he and I would park company, I'm going, they've still got
17:09it.
17:10And his point is, the trend line is going in one direction.
17:12I agree with that.
17:14I do, too.
17:16I just don't think, it gets happening at a pace where it's like, if this continues in
17:222,908,042, we won't have any more desks.
17:29I'll cross that bridge when I get there.
17:30That's right.
17:30You know what I'm saying?
17:31I'm not about to go desk-free.
17:33Shane in Fairfax, what's going on?
17:34How are you, buddy?
17:35Pick a take.
17:36Amanda, Danny, Lieutenant Dan, how are you boys doing today?
17:39Good, buddy.
17:40Hey, look, I'm old school.
17:41Give me my Sundays for fun days.
17:43You know?
17:43And like, I don't have, like, I'll be at football every day, right?
17:47But I like on my Sundays, I like bringing out the smoker.
17:51I like sitting, having people over and opening the bar and sit there and enjoy my Sunday
17:56watching football fun.
17:57But Shane, let me ask you this.
17:58Because I'm 1,000% with you.
18:00And by the way, I'll invite myself.
18:02At some point this fall, I'd love to come over there with this.
18:04Hey, you guys know more than well.
18:05You guys know more than well.
18:06Actually, we got to do that.
18:07You guys need to do a show at my house one day, truly.
18:10I'd be psyched.
18:10Where do you live at?
18:12I live in Great Falls.
18:13All right.
18:14We got to figure something out to go over there and just smoke some.
18:17There's the show Road Trip to Shane's.
18:19I got one in Falls Church in Great Falls.
18:20That would be awesome.
18:21I'm down.
18:22So we'll get your info.
18:23But my point is, don't you think you can still do that on Sunday and the other stuff's just
18:29a bonus?
18:29I don't think one detracts from the other.
18:32It is.
18:33But here's the thing.
18:34Whenever your team is playing on a Sunday and we got a Thursday, and you know how that
18:38impacts our team, right?
18:40And the injuries and everything like that.
18:43You know what?
18:43I don't get psyched for Thursday night football like I used to.
18:46I just don't because I got other things I'm doing.
18:48And by the time I forget about it, it's on Amazon or Prime or wherever it is.
18:53But you know what?
18:54But one thing I did want to tell you, I want to jump off subject real quick.
18:57My buddy from Switzerland is actually going to that Knicks game.
19:00He's got courtside front seat kicks.
19:02Oh, my God.
19:02He's actually going to that game.
19:04And when he's spending those tickets for three tickets, it's unreal.
19:08Well, they're right now on the secondary market.
19:11They're over $100,000 apiece.
19:12So if he's got three, your buddy's doing all right.
19:15Adam and Culpepper, what's going on, buddy?
19:17How are you?
19:18Hey, fellas.
19:19It's been a while.
19:20Yeah, I'm kind of with my man that just called.
19:24I'm the same way, dude.
19:25For me, it's all about Sunday.
19:27And I'm really not even that big on Thursday.
19:30And I consume all the games.
19:32It's not just the skins.
19:33I watch them all.
19:35And I just, you know, you're going to show me the Titans and the Dolphins on a Tuesday.
19:40Like, I'm kind of good on that, man.
19:42Like, just let me have the Sunday slate, you know?
19:45The Titans and the Dolphins on a Tuesday.
19:47Yeah, and that's kind of my bit, is you get stuck with some of those Thursday stinkers.
19:50And, I mean, I'm going to watch it because, A, it's part of our gig, but also B, but it's
19:54not the passionate, glued, I-can't-move watch which Sunday is.
19:58Pick a take on Grant and Danny.
20:00Kelsey says, let's just keep Sundays special.
20:03Sims says, the more the merrier.
20:05I'm Team Sims.
20:06Danny's Team Kelsey.
20:07Fun sports hypotheticals.
20:09Making the rounds on the internet.
20:10Next on.
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