- 15 hours ago
The Horseracing Integrity and Safety Authority (HISA) was back in the news earlier this month when the HISA Board of Directors ruled that the there would be no change to the status quo when it came to the rules regarding Lasix. To discuss the Lasix decision, another drop in the number of fatalities, the controversies surrounding why so many pre-race vet reviews are leading to scratches, the HERF initiative and more, HISA CEO Lisa Lazarus dropped by this week's TDN Writers' Room.
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SportsTranscript
00:00:18and good morning everybody and welcome to another edition of the tdn writers room podcast this
00:00:23called this the previous edition and my name is bill finley i'm a correspondent with the
00:00:27thoroughbred daily news i also co-host the down the stretch radio show on sirius xm on saturdays i
00:00:34hope you tune us in every saturday at 10 o'clock and how are y'all doing yeah i'm randy
00:00:39moss with
00:00:40the nbc sports and the buyer associates the buyer speed figure team zoe cabman with first racing and
00:00:48first tv i'm doing great i don't know about you two but today is going to be a fabulous day
00:00:53well zoe we love how upbeat you always are and you are the ray of sunshine to the two grouchy
00:01:00guys
00:01:01on your left and right so and we do appreciate you for that um well it was a great preakness
00:01:08for a lot
00:01:09of people but randy moss belongs on that list and randy you on our show last week you you just
00:01:17like
00:01:17week four you didn't want to get pinned down with one pick but you talked a lot about napoleon solo
00:01:24and when you came on the nbc broadcast lo and behold you picked him now it was a horse i
00:01:29could
00:01:29see picking him i have no problem with that but there's also a horse that had a lot of kind
00:01:33of
00:01:33red flags standing in the way ultimately why did you pick him and um you know was there any one
00:01:39particular factor uh the only red flag that i could see was the potential distance limitation and he
00:01:46hadn't really proven that he couldn't get a distance like a mile and three sixteenths i didn't
00:01:51think that the wood memorial was a fair test for him so i at at whatever i think he was
00:01:5710 to 1 when
00:01:58i picked him he wound up going off seven or eight to one i thought it was definitely worth um
00:02:02worth
00:02:03that i thought he was the most talented horse in the race the fastest horse in the race i thought
00:02:06he'd get a good trip um so yeah i mean i it was a weak field obviously so that's i
00:02:15didn't think it
00:02:16was any great uh thank you any great achievement but uh i'll take it take it take it all you
00:02:22can
00:02:22so donna picked the winner of the derby who paid boxcars you picked the winner of the preakness we'll
00:02:27have to figure out who picks the winner of the belmont stakes on the nbc crew what was it like
00:02:33what was the feel like there randy with only 4 800 people you know um it felt like the day
00:02:43before
00:02:44for the black-eyed susan to tell you the truth with maybe just a few more people um you know
00:02:50i was
00:02:50surprised about a couple of things i had been told by a trainer um who is based at laurel uh
00:02:59i was asked
00:03:00you know when's the last time i was there i said 30 years ago i was actually in management at
00:03:04oakland
00:03:04park and i was recruiting horses there with bat poe almost exactly 30 years ago and he said well he
00:03:10said
00:03:10prepare yourself because laurel is a bleeping bleeping mess and so i i went in with very low
00:03:20expectations guys it is way nicer than pimlico was yeah not even close you know and and i'm talking
00:03:28about just the facility and you know that the location is in this nice sort of uh you know pastoral
00:03:35uh rural environment with bald eagles flying around and i really i really enjoyed it um it's
00:03:43a shame that no more than 4 800 people were there as it as it was explained to me and
00:03:47you could see
00:03:48it the apron is almost is almost non-existent it's minuscule and they say it's because the track is
00:03:54built for winter racing primarily and obviously nobody can be in the infield for various reasons so
00:04:00i can understand the limitations but you know i thought it was an enjoyable experience
00:04:07so i want to get another take from you i know you are a chad summers friend a friend and
00:04:13kind of a
00:04:14two-part story did he do something wrong leading up to the preakness and then because obviously the
00:04:21two starts as a three-year-old were not very good after the great champagne and did he do something
00:04:26right and if so what did he figure out about this horse that he got him back
00:04:30to run that race that was among the most impressive two-year-old racers run that last year but that's
00:04:36the last time he had really showed much of anything on the racetrack well let's face it third start off
00:04:41a layoff is a great handicapping angle that a lot of people like to use and that's what you're looking
00:04:47at he didn't run badly in either one of his two starts this year and it's not like he was
00:04:53coming off a
00:04:54layoff since the breeders cup either because he won the champagne and they opted for whatever reason
00:04:59to skip the breeders cup so it was a little bit more of a lengthy layoff he was coming off
00:05:05and i think brad thought that he would race him into shape rather than train him into shape he's a
00:05:10high energy horse you see him in the morning emily anlingwood who's a friend of mine does a great job
00:05:15with him he likes to rear up he likes to show his feet to everyone he's a big old show
00:05:20off so i think it's
00:05:22just a third start off the layoff angle and we mentioned last week that you know he wasn't a
00:05:28step it up kind of horse we already know he's a good horse it was just putting it all together
00:05:34and you know running back to that massive race in the champagne he's a horse who's capable of not just
00:05:40being a two-year-old because he's got a big growthy frame on him he's by liam's map liam map
00:05:46is having
00:05:46grade one winners all over the place so it was just a question of getting things right on the day
00:05:51and he ran a massive race he sat close to a fast pace and he drew off like a good
00:05:56horse
00:05:58go ahead randy now i thought his champagne was better than any race ted noffy ran last year as
00:06:05a two-year-old i thought his champagne was just incredible given the pace that he set uh which was
00:06:10you know supersonic for that day at aqueduct and then the fact that he just kicked away and drew off
00:06:16through the lane um we talked to chad at length because we televised fountain of youth and he told
00:06:23us leading up to that race that he was training napoleon solo trying to like bill mott trained
00:06:29sovereignty to race him into shape so that he would peak for the kentucky derby and i think and i
00:06:37think
00:06:37chad believes that he sort of undercooked him a little bit for the fountain of youth he kind of
00:06:42under did it and then he didn't break and then he was rushed up so i hate excuses i'm allergic
00:06:48to
00:06:48these excuses you hear them so often from trainers but i think you you literally can draw a line
00:06:53through the fountain of youth and then he bruised a heel he was going to run in the arkansas derby
00:06:58they
00:06:58had to scratch him because of the bruised heel he missed training they thought okay the only way we
00:07:03can get to the kentucky derby is get points we're going to try the wood memorial missed a key workout
00:07:08because of the bruised heel vanned into new york was involved in a speed duel with talk to me jimmy
00:07:14that made the wood memorial the hottest paced prep race for the kentucky derby he was still fighting
00:07:19for the lead at the eighth pole so i thought given the fact that he was not 100 that he
00:07:26ran a heck of
00:07:26a race in in defeat in the wood memorial and you may have noticed also i'm sorry if i'm going
00:07:32on and
00:07:32on here but the speed figures for the wood memorial uh regardless of what speed figure
00:07:39vendor you use uh buyers for example every horse that's run back out of the wood memorial has come
00:07:45back and run 12 13 14 points higher in their next start right now we're debating on what to do
00:07:52about
00:07:52that whether to go back and retroactively raise it but the wood memorial has turned out to be a much
00:07:58better race than the final time initially made it out to be right and then he works 110 for six
00:08:05furlongs
00:08:06111 and company he was ready to roll whether he was good enough or not whether he could get the
00:08:11distance or not that was the question so i am glad randy brought that up because i want to ask
00:08:15you that
00:08:15very question what was the pertinence of that just workout you just don't see 110 over the belmont
00:08:23training track what did chad have in mind and obviously work because boy that workout seemed
00:08:28to really wake that horse up yeah honestly i don't know i don't know who worked him i i assume
00:08:35it was
00:08:36emily because she works a lot of his horses and she's got a pretty good clock in her head she's
00:08:40not
00:08:41one to mess up a work and go too fast or chad's just like let him roll let him roll
00:08:47i want him to roll
00:08:48and we're going to be ready so i don't know if that was the case or maybe it was a
00:08:52mistake
00:08:52you know some horses can deceive you by going too fast but i doubt that emily's a pretty good hand
00:08:58and and it's got a good clock in her head okay so come breeders cup day or after the breeders
00:09:04cup
00:09:04are we talking about napoleon solo as one of the elite members of the three-year-old division a horse
00:09:10that maybe is just coming off a good breeders cup race and i'll take that one first i don't want
00:09:15to
00:09:15take anything away from him but i think we do have to keep in perspective he just won a race
00:09:19that
00:09:20you joey brandy myself and everybody else on the planet was just trashing so i have to see him do
00:09:28something more before i'm going to get excited about it al gold is a great handicapper and a jersey
00:09:33shore guy my kind of guy and he wants to win the haskell more than anything else in the world
00:09:38more
00:09:38than the kentucky derby us jersey guys understand that so uh that'll probably be his next start but
00:09:45before i say that he is a uh golden tempo or a uh renegade or or chief wallaby i want
00:09:53to see
00:09:54something else from him guys look we we see it every year we see horses outrun their distance
00:10:01limitations in the kentucky derby in the preakness and then later in the year as the other horses begin
00:10:06to mature and catch up suddenly those horses that could get a mile and a quarter in the kentucky derby
00:10:12and a mile and three sixteenths in the preakness can't compete as effectively at those distances
00:10:16later in the year and honestly i think that's what we're going to see with napoleon solo i think
00:10:22looking forward he would be he's much more likely to wind up in the breeders cup dirt mile than he
00:10:27is
00:10:28the breeders cup classic i think it was a perfect storm in the preakness he had a he had a
00:10:32what was
00:10:33probably a bit of a speed favoring racetrack he had a target in taj mahal uh he had a beautiful
00:10:39clean
00:10:39stalking trip we didn't know how well he would handle that but he handled it perfectly and as
00:10:44and he had a weak feel behind him and so as a result he's a classic winner but going forward
00:10:48is
00:10:49he as good as renegade you know golden tempo when golden tempo gets a pace set up i i doubt
00:10:55it at the
00:10:56longer distances but you can't take anything away from him he's a grade one winner at two one one of
00:11:03the premier grade one races the champagne and now he's a classic winner at three like he's anybody's
00:11:09dreams so we'll just have to see where he stacks up with the rest of them i mean the older
00:11:14horses are
00:11:15gonna have a massive advantage towards the end of the year as far as i'm concerned because you can't
00:11:20really stack anyone up against the likes of sovereignty right now how about wider barrio and
00:11:26wider barrio yes those you know the the older horses are far superior than the three-year-olds in my
00:11:32opinion i would agree with you on that well we're coming up on segment two it is our gains
00:11:38way guest of the week interview with lisa lazarus why don't you tune in on to that miss lazarus has
00:11:44many interesting things to say as she always does about the comings and goings of the horse racing
00:11:49integrity and safety authority stay with us we'll be right back you want to remind you that the tdn
00:11:56writers room is brought to you each and every week by keeneland big congratulations to al gold's gold
00:12:02square llc breeders john gunther and euro west bloodstock buyer and trainer chad summers and consigner
00:12:10glenwood farm on napoleon solo's preakness win huge congratulations to them you might remember they
00:12:16were also the breeders on justify napoleon solo was a steal as well just forty thousand dollars at the
00:12:23keeneland september yearling sale he's now earned in excess of 1.5 million dollars we'll be right back
00:12:30after this message from keeneland we do this so your granddaughter can work on a farm someday
00:12:38so the stands will still be packed in 50 years that's why we come to work every day
00:12:45obsess over every single detail
00:12:50because the story of racing is written one moment at a time and the future of our industry
00:12:57deserves nothing less keeneland every moment matters
00:13:03the fastest horse of the week brought to you by the fast sires at winstar farm now another kentucky
00:13:08derby has come and gone and guess what has stayed the same the 2023 kentucky derby figure
00:13:15of 105 by mage and winstar stallion two fills the runner-up remains the highest figures recorded in
00:13:23the kentucky derby over the past 18 years tied for the top two fills was also a winner of course
00:13:31of the
00:13:31ohio derby and the jeff ruby stakes both by more than five lengths and was the first three-year-old
00:13:37of
00:13:37his crop to record three consecutive buyers of 100 or higher look for two fills first yearlings at
00:13:45the sales of the summer and two fills stands at winstar farm for fee of just this is incredible
00:13:49seven thousand five hundred dollars past a source of the week ran on friday at laurel the race before
00:13:58the black-eyed susan the historic pemlico special his name navajo warrior and navajo warrior one for the
00:14:05six seven eighth time in his last 10 races in winning the pemlico special by two and three
00:14:12quarters lengths under flavian pratt with a buyer speed figure of 101 he did it in wire-to-wire
00:14:19fashion trained by the red hot sappy joseph owned by the conglomeration of bag racing stables miller
00:14:26racing dr derrick paul mathis stable paul braverman and timothy pinch congratulations to the connections
00:14:33of navajo warrior our fastest horse of the week
00:14:42welcome back and the gainsway guest of the week this week is lisa lazarus from heisa and she's going
00:14:48to talk about a lot that's been going on lately at heisa including the new news about what's going on
00:14:52with lasix in the future lisa thanks so much for joining us i know it's a busy time of year
00:14:56for
00:14:57you and uh but we'll be glad to hear all the latest developments out of heisa great well thank you
00:15:02so
00:15:02much for having me i i love this show and i listen to you guys all the time so it's
00:15:06an honor to be here
00:15:07so lisa as most people know when heisa took over we weren't sure what the rules for lasix would be
00:15:14going down five ten years etc down the road we were going to we knew we were going to try
00:15:20to keep
00:15:20the lasix for uh or actually get rid of lasix for all two-year-old races and all stakes races
00:15:27while keeping lasix in all other races but that was something that heisa didn't want to make a
00:15:32decision on until there were studies done studies were were done the results of the studies were
00:15:38turned over to your board of directors and a couple weeks ago they did make a decision and i must
00:15:45preface this by saying the decision had to be unanimous if just one person said no i want a
00:15:53total ban of lasix and 10 others said no we want to keep lasix the ban would have gone into
00:15:58effect
00:15:59it obviously did not go into effect so can you kind of just fill in the blanks what all happened
00:16:04here
00:16:05you know what was what did the science tell the board of directors and at the end of the day
00:16:10are you
00:16:11pleased surprised fill in the blanks about the decision sure well let me just back up a little
00:16:17bit just to just to clarify um at the time that the horse racing integrity and safety act was being
00:16:24written which was before my time um there was a lot of discussion around lasix and it was a difficult
00:16:29issue to resolve ahead of putting the bill forward to be passed and so ultimately there was a compromise
00:16:35that was reached between different industry groups to find some sort of resolution solution
00:16:41um and for the for both the present and the future and so the agreement was as you said to
00:16:47to ban lasix and
00:16:49three-year-olds and sorry and two-year-olds and um and stakes races and to allow it and everything
00:16:53else
00:16:54however it also required hyza in a three-year period to create a different in the exact advisory board that
00:17:02would then sort of oversee these various scientific studies and then to ultimately reach a decision
00:17:07about what to do with lasix going forward so um the way this started was that our first order business
00:17:14was to actually create the furosemide advisory committee um which was just a stellar committee of
00:17:21sort of all the best people that you that you know of in our industry when it comes to to
00:17:25science and
00:17:26when it comes to you know essentially working on that operational side on the veterinary operational side
00:17:32um and and they they really were committed to getting to the right answer you know one of the
00:17:38things that was so important when we actually appointed people to that committee was nobody had a political
00:17:42agenda um the the the goal was you know what is the right outcome for the industry and you know
00:17:50we've got to do these certain things that are laid out in the statute to answer these questions
00:17:53um so we're going to do our job and take it very seriously and they did take it very seriously
00:17:57um the science was really interesting we we started with um essentially putting together
00:18:03um a summary or a collection of all of the research that had been done prior
00:18:09to paisa engaging in this so that we sort of had a starting point and then what we did was
00:18:15there was a
00:18:15call for research proposals a number of different topics that had to be covered under the act and we had
00:18:21different research groups essentially proposing or pitching to have the funds to essentially conduct
00:18:27their study so in the end um we we had about five studies um looking at different issues um on
00:18:35the
00:18:35scientific side the ultimate conclusion was that pro smide was not performance enhancing um and that was
00:18:45the conclusion that the board of directors reached and the there was a lot of conversation about
00:18:51because one of the things that everyone needs to understand is that the law doesn't say whatever the
00:18:56science says that's what you have to do the law says science is one component but the best interest of
00:19:02racing is another component and the the business the social the social um license all of those things
00:19:09are things that have to be considered by the board so everyone took it extremely seriously as you can
00:19:15imagine um there was obviously a lot of concern within the industry that this would go away or wouldn't go
00:19:23away um and ultimately the board taking all of those factors into consideration felt that the system we
00:19:31had was working um and that there was no reason to disturb that system that had struck the right
00:19:37compromise in terms of protecting the breed and trying to to sort of down the road um breed more horses
00:19:42that don't need furosemide but at the same time um you know not preventing those horsemen who have
00:19:49horses who need to run and from from you know operating at all and so ultimately that i'm really
00:19:54pleased with the outcome um it wasn't my decision but it's where i believed we should land um and and
00:20:01i
00:20:01only made that decision in my own mind if you know after a couple of years of sort of seeing
00:20:05how it all
00:20:06operated um but one of the things you know at hyza that we feel very strongly about is we really
00:20:12do
00:20:12want to make the industry better you know we want to fulfill our responsibilities but in a way that is
00:20:19additive and that brings people forward and you know i always felt that sort of burning down the village to
00:20:24save it was probably not the right uh course of action um and so ultimately listen we're going to keep
00:20:30doing research especially on the two-year-olds we're going to keep looking at that um so there may be
00:20:35changes down the road if if there are if there are circumstances science and also um policy reasons
00:20:41why we need to rethink it or the board needs to reconsider it but for right now um you know
00:20:46i'm i'm
00:20:46very pleased with their decision because i think it's working and i think it's it's sort of everybody
00:20:50gets what they need but not what they want so lisa when it comes to the topic of medication uh
00:20:57veterinary
00:20:58examinations and the like i think you know all too well that the horsemen can be notoriously
00:21:02difficult to please not all of them but certainly some of them what have you heard from horsemen uh
00:21:09horsemen's groups in the aftermath of the lasix decision you know first of all most of them have
00:21:16been very um pleased with the outcome and very you know very gracious um there was obviously a lot of
00:21:22fear and concern that laces would be eliminated entirely um and so i believe that there was a
00:21:29perspective from horsemen that keeping things the same would be a big win for them especially
00:21:35because everybody was obviously very concerned about the 90 it's nine it's nine board members and
00:21:40they had to have all nine votes um in the same direction so that's mostly what i've heard from
00:21:45horsemen i mean i've heard a little bit of you know we should also be able to use it in
00:21:48two-year-olds
00:21:48but that's really on the periphery um you know in particular i wanted to uh to compliment somebody who
00:21:55don't compliment that often which is eric camelback um i i think he really did an excellent job
00:22:02leading his organization his stakeholders through this issue he engaged with haiza in the right way
00:22:09he um he had suggestions for the first red committee that were really excellent contributors
00:22:14um you know he understood obviously how important it was and i think he just he just did a really
00:22:19really good job and and that enabled the board to really understand the issue and to see the issue
00:22:25in an objective way and to make the right decision um as opposed to you know being contentious or or
00:22:32being or engaging in advocacy that's not really based in reality but putting the real issues the
00:22:38real science in front of the board this board is a fantastic board they always in my opinion do the
00:22:44right thing um they just need to have the right information and and the right and the right data
00:22:50and and they'll come to the right conclusion well the lasix was a good debate and i think you guys
00:22:56did
00:22:56the right thing but another hotbed of conversation leading up to the kentucky derby and a lot of major
00:23:02stakes races has been the regulatory vets and the power that they have to scratch horses i know that
00:23:10you've become involved in this what can you tell us moving forward so you know first of all it's
00:23:17obviously you know incredibly important we all agree there's nobody disagrees that we've got to do what's
00:23:22best for the horse we've also obviously got to balance that with common sense practical reality is
00:23:28continuing continuing for the game to continue um and it's very understandable why it's really upsetting
00:23:35for an owner or trainer when a horse is scratched um the way that the system works is hyza creates
00:23:43the rules
00:23:44but the regulatory veterinarians work for the state racing commissions and they apply the rules
00:23:49so i think one of the areas that's caused some concern that hyza can be helpful in
00:23:55is standardizing how that rule is implemented right you shouldn't be able to say it's so hard to get my
00:24:02horses
00:24:02off the vets list in state x so i'm going to go to state y and be able to get
00:24:06your horse off the
00:24:06vets list so in december of 2025 hyza launched we call our mapping project where we're essentially
00:24:13doing a survey of all of the racing commissions all the states that are under hyza and what that
00:24:18let that's those categories they have believe it or not you may or may not know this but
00:24:22there are like just loads of different vets list categories and they vary state to state
00:24:28and they have not been made uniform and that's something that we really really need to help with
00:24:33and really can do can make an impact um so we've been working with the states working with the
00:24:38stewards the regulatory vets to essentially collect that information and then work alongside those
00:24:44teams to develop standards that that are truly objective across the entire industry and where there
00:24:51are clear guidelines for regulatory vets to follow so that there's not that sense that it's a
00:24:56subjective decision being made um listen i think it's an incredibly hard job to be regulatory vet and
00:25:01i think they do a fantastic job for the most part um but the communication piece could be improved
00:25:07and i think that's where having you know very clear standards uh across the board would be valuable
00:25:15and lisa also you guys were able to put out a quarter report which once again had some good news
00:25:20with the uh fatality rate down to point nine five percent for one thousand starters um it's not going
00:25:28down rapidly but it's a slow steady decline and uh could you speak to why you think this is
00:25:34continuing the trend and i know i cannot get uh by uh sue finley podcast without asking you uh what
00:25:42difference herf the new organization that uh is contributing to this situation so first of all when
00:25:51it comes to um the fatality rate we always want to do better obviously and with time and i think
00:25:59technology and and better data analysis will be able to continue the trend um but you know the number
00:26:08of horses that we lose is not a massive percentage a very small percentage of the overall number of
00:26:14horses that raced so it's very hard at those numbers to bring the percentage down that dramatically
00:26:20um or consistently bring it down that dramatically so for me staying around one um is a really good
00:26:27benchmark we want to do better for sure but knowing that we're that we're hovering around that one
00:26:33you know quarter after quarter is what i really believe um demonstrates that there is success
00:26:39and listen it's it ties up for sure with some of our rules but it's really the whole industry like
00:26:44it's more about for me it's about the consciousness and the awareness around the importance of horse
00:26:52welfare and the importance of priorities and the horses and that that's really more of a cultural shift
00:26:58that it is a regulatory um function in my opinion and when it comes to her which is something that
00:27:04i'm
00:27:05really really proud of the team who runs her and certainly proud of sue who's on the board um because
00:27:11it's it's really it's capturing a gap in our system that that we recognize at hyza and saw as sort
00:27:20of a
00:27:20stumbling block between retiring from from racing and ultimately going to aftercare or second career
00:27:27and that's that you know horses are as we all know are athletes and most of them when they retire
00:27:33have some sort of injury or something that is going to kind of prevent them from being perfect from day
00:27:39one
00:27:39and so what we do at herf is we step in and we take control of that horse if the
00:27:45owner gives it to us
00:27:46voluntarily and the trainer and we we oversee that horse's surgery rehab whatever it may be
00:27:53the horse is then in a good position to go on to a second career so for example we have
00:28:00about 10
00:28:00horses now in the herf program seven of them would have been racing fatalities if um if in fact herf
00:28:06hadn't stepped in because they were you know sort of simple conjular fractures or simple sesamoids
00:28:12that have a 95 chance of you know positive recovery but the economics you know didn't make sense
00:28:19unfortunately to the to the ownership and and so something somebody needs to step in and be that
00:28:24safety net because once that horse heals and goes through its rehab period there are a lot of um a
00:28:30lot
00:28:30of aftercare organizations and second careers that are available to that horse like of all of the 10
00:28:35horses we have all 10 are doing extremely well um all 10 are heading towards second careers and it's
00:28:42important people realize that this this program is not about arthrodesis or complicated surgeries
00:28:47this is about very basic surgeries that often are are not chosen because the economics don't make
00:28:55sense or the trainer owner can't afford it and one of the things we've been really clear on at herf
00:28:59is
00:28:59and it's run by a separate board i was saying a separate staff um it's a 501c3 organization is that
00:29:05we are completely agnostic on the moral issues like we don't we don't have passed any moral judgment
00:29:10whatsoever on choices that trainers and owners make we don't know if that trainer or owner is opting to
00:29:16feed their family over their horse um i mean there are things that you know you just you don't know
00:29:20when you're in somebody's shoes and we also feel that building that trust and not being critical is
00:29:25going to allow us to save more horses obviously and so when we bring the horse into our program
00:29:29we give it a nickname that's different from the name that's registered with the jockey club so that
00:29:33there's not this like trying to find out the horses and then go back and and criticize the owners
00:29:37or trainers um and we're able to act very very quickly which has been a huge benefit
00:29:42because we're so networked with all the with all the regulatory vets we can get we can get a call
00:29:47within 10 minutes of you know a fracture or 10 minutes of an issue where there's a situation that
00:29:52there's a horse the reg vet thinks can be rehabbed and thinks can be saved and live a good pain
00:29:58-free
00:29:58life um and where the owner wants to euthanize and so we are able to like within an hour get
00:30:05a surgical
00:30:05consult because we have a surgeon on staff um and also and and make a decision you know from the
00:30:11standpoint of whether the horse is eligible and that we realize that's been one of the big big
00:30:15game changers is that there isn't a lot of time between when the owner is making that decision and
00:30:21the outcome and a lot of the other um after organizations they need like weeks or maybe a
00:30:26few days to figure out where they could place the horse um so we step in to do that we've
00:30:30been really
00:30:30fortunate that a number of farms have donated empty stalls um they've got denali farm and the dolphin
00:30:37a few others who have come on board and that also allows us to obviously not spend the money on
00:30:43on
00:30:43the on the rehab piece on the on the interim um stabling portion and so that's been like really
00:30:50fantastic and we've also had a lot number of vet clinics including rude and riddle um who have
00:30:54donated their surgical time so we just pay the costs which has been fantastic there have been some
00:30:59van companies that have come forward so there's been a lot of really good um sort of buy-in and
00:31:05it
00:31:05almost the way that i think of it it's like a garden hose that's twisted and we're like untwisting
00:31:10it so that the horses can flow better from um you know post-race injury that is not by any
00:31:17means fatal
00:31:18to a successful second career that's absolutely fantastic to me that's one of the most impressive
00:31:24things that heist has been able to accomplish so far that's just great thank you and it's run by
00:31:28mandy minger and she does a fantastic job and dr karen hassan is our surgeon um who who works on
00:31:35her
00:31:35and they've built great relationships with people on the ground um and it's really been terrific you
00:31:40know sometimes people that race in new york or california or kentucky they don't realize
00:31:46that there are racetracks where a simple conjular fracture becomes a case of case of euthanasia
00:31:53because of the economics involved and so this is something that we saw at hyza and we saw that it
00:31:59was
00:31:59really fixable um and so i'm i think it's i i really proud of the team and it's kind of
00:32:04a great
00:32:04great space to be involved in and i think it was a need we needed to plug so well lisa
00:32:09we want to
00:32:09thank you so much for your time and all the good work you've been doing lately and i do agree
00:32:14with
00:32:14you i think that this is one of the rare things in horse racing where pretty much everybody was on
00:32:19board with the way the basics thing turned out and that's a big thank you also to sue because uh
00:32:24she is definitely a passionate herf supporter and on our boards we're very fortunate um very
00:32:29fortunate for that our guest of the week is lisa lazarus brought to you courtesy of gainsaway farm
00:32:35home of the stallion mooth whose first foals continue to impress their breeders all across
00:32:41the bluegrass state here's a page full of some of those beautiful foals of mooth and why wouldn't
00:32:47they be pretty because their daddy was too when mooth topped the obs sale at two million dollars back
00:32:54in the day his consigner tori gladwell said that on a physical scale of one to ten mooth came in
00:32:59according to her as an 11 and mooth is the only son of good magic by the way to become
00:33:05a grade one
00:33:05winner at both two and three just like his sire he stands at gainsaway for a fee of thirty thousand
00:33:13dollars say hello the single most important factor in predicting sire success is those who have
00:33:23consistent high class form and it's even enhanced if they have that form as two-year-olds as well
00:33:29by our calculations mooth has the number one chance of sire success of any of the 30 or so sires
00:33:35who retired to kentucky in 2025 he has the credentials that we're looking for when we predict
00:33:42sire success with some of the fullest fields in the country and quality racing year-round
00:33:49there's never been a better time to reap the rewards of breeding and racing in kentucky
00:33:56purse money in kentucky is at an all-time high as his average purse per race outpacing california
00:34:02florida and new york kentucky breads breed them raise them race them we all win
00:34:14and where are preakness winners bred just like kentucky derby winners in any other grade one
00:34:20race they are bred in kentucky of course so congratulations are in order to napoleon solo
00:34:26the 2026 preakness winner as well as his owner al gold and his trainer chad summers and congratulations
00:34:32to his breeders john gunther and tanya gunther's euro west bloodstock also the breeders of course
00:34:39of triple crown winner justify on winning a 7 500 kentucky breeders incentive fund award
00:34:47for their victory in the preakness kentucky breads breed them raise them race them we all win
00:34:53well as everybody's watching the preakness we have another racing star on our hands and burnham square
00:34:59did it again saturday night at churchill downs as he won the louisville stakes it was the second
00:35:06straight blowout win in a mile and a half turf race the elkhorn stakes was the win before that
00:35:12and remember this source of one of the bluegrass last year on the dirt how often do you see bluegrass
00:35:17winners go into these marathon turf races at four um we haven't seen uh zoe in a long time a
00:35:24real
00:35:25star american grass horse usually when we do they're more milers mile and eighth types this guy right now
00:35:32looks to be at this you know that division the mile and three eighths mile and a half turf division
00:35:39has no equal and it'll be real exciting to see what ian wilkes can piece together for him this year
00:35:45he's going next in a race that honestly i didn't even know was a race um it is the churleywood
00:35:52stakes
00:35:52on june 13th at churchill downs then he's going to look at the arlington mile the kentucky turf club
00:35:58uh invitational and the breeder's cup turf zoe what do we have in our hands here in old burnham square
00:36:03he is a long-geared galopper is exactly what he is i know a lot of people have mentioned the
00:36:09melbourne
00:36:10cup because obviously in wilkes hails from australia and it's you know it's the race that stops the
00:36:16nation so a lot of people have been talking about that but knowing the type of horses that run in
00:36:23the
00:36:24melbourne cup is willing to wait out another year and not put him through that because it really is
00:36:30a test of a champion so i look forward to seeing him win more long distance turf events good for
00:36:37him
00:36:37because it's not often you see horses that kind of go through the three-year-old campaign try and get
00:36:44to the derby get you know drilled in all spots on the dirt that can actually have a second career
00:36:49or
00:36:49allowed a second career or are sound enough for a second career on the turf so it's just a testament
00:36:56to ian wilkes and his training regime and the fact that he's found a spot that this horse fits and
00:37:02excels in so when we covered him on nbc burnham square last year i'm looking at some notes here
00:37:10uh before the holy bull and the fountain of youth uh we talked to you know ian before both of
00:37:15those races
00:37:16and you know i remember one thing i asked him about or one thing i mentioned to him is that
00:37:19hey
00:37:19look what you've got in your hip pocket the dam of this horse linda was a very good turf horse
00:37:26and so this horse had a turf a really good turf pedigree and liam's map can go either way
00:37:31so he said you know he acknowledged it said yeah at some point you know when we get through this
00:37:35triple
00:37:35crown situation that might be something that we'll have to look at and he said here's a quote this is
00:37:40from this is right before the holy bull january the 30th this horse's biggest asset he never gets
00:37:46tired he said he he wasn't a horse with a flashy turn of foot and he's just a grinder who
00:37:54makes these
00:37:54prolonged runs and doesn't get tired and we that's that's a perfect asset for turf races going long we
00:38:02saw it in the elkhorn when he ran off the tv screen at keeneland and in the louisville and it's
00:38:07nice to
00:38:08have a really good older american turf horse to be able to talk about for change but that being
00:38:15said how will he stack up against the best that europe has to offer at the end of the year
00:38:20because
00:38:20he's a grinder he doesn't have that turn of foot no no probably not well right gotta give him a
00:38:25chance
00:38:26so he's an awful good horse but we we shall see hey i just want to add one more thing
00:38:30to what you
00:38:30said i did ask ian that specific question about the melbourne cup and you hit the nail on the head
00:38:36he's australian and it's you know like a kentuckian wanting to win the kentucky derby
00:38:40there's absolutely no way this year um probably not next year but remember he's a gelding
00:38:47and those older geldings that run at two miles that's just about when they're peaking when they're
00:38:52six years old he said he'd love to win the race but he's not going to send the horse over
00:38:57and tour until he's completely matured and he hasn't gotten there yet so that's the latest
00:39:03on whether or not um he will go over to the melbourne cup if he stays healthy i think he
00:39:09is going to go over there well there's some news off the track that none of us wanted to read
00:39:14last
00:39:14week and it involves the ortiz brothers once again and as you remember back in january there was a
00:39:21picture that surfaced that showed them apparently attending a cockfight in their native puerto rico
00:39:28um the story kind of didn't pick up a whole lot of traction was somewhat forgotten after a week or
00:39:34two it didn't get a lot of media attention either lo and behold the week between the um week before
00:39:40the derby usa today did a much more comprehensive story i mean much much more comprehensive story and
00:39:47if you read this story i guess you have to say things like alleged and had their day in court
00:39:52but it really left no doubt that um the ortiz brothers are heavily involved in cockfighting
00:39:58um they had pictures of them standing next to the roosters they had interviews in spanish
00:40:02um they had facebook posters that say they were going to appear at one of these big cockfights
00:40:08and i i think i got a couple things to say about this and i think first of all i
00:40:13think
00:40:13a lot of people are missing the point and one of the things that i've heard many many times is
00:40:19well cockfighting is legal in puerto rico it is not that's just not the case second thing that
00:40:26people will say well you have to understand the culture of puerto rico it's ingrained in their
00:40:30culture matter of fact it's so important to them that they even have filed some lawsuits against the
00:40:35united states government i guess of the government of the lower 48 states to try to get this ban
00:40:41rescinded so you know am i puerto rican of course not do i understand the cultural value
00:40:47of what it may bring to the country of course i don't but i don't care and here's why
00:40:54people who get pleasure or gamble on animals hurting other animals and then cockfighting
00:41:02oftentimes to the death i find that reprehensible i'm sorry i just do that doesn't mean the ortiz
00:41:09brothers have to agree with me it doesn't mean that 90 of the people in racing have to agree with
00:41:13me
00:41:13but that's still not the biggest point this sport of ours is suffering so much when it comes to the
00:41:22animal rights issues and what the public thinks about our sport and when two of our highest highest
00:41:27profile jockeys are featured in usa today of the week of the preakness talking about cockfighting
00:41:34that's one more terrible black eye that our sport certainly doesn't need
00:41:43go ahead randy no this is this i you know anyone who's raised in the united states and anyone who's
00:41:53an animal lover would find the notion of cockfighting reprehensible that's just all there is to it
00:42:02um it is part of the culture of puerto rico whether we like it or not just like bullfighting is
00:42:09part of
00:42:09the culture of spain and if you've ever been to a bullfight i haven't but i've seen videos that's
00:42:14something that most of us would find reprehensible as well but it's part of the fabric and bullfighters
00:42:19are celebrated in spain and i'm not you know trying to be apologetic for the ortiz brothers because
00:42:26what is happening what they did is illegal yes i think there are a lot of people in puerto rico
00:42:33who
00:42:34feel like uh that was forced upon them by the united states because puerto rico is a united states
00:42:39territory uh as you mentioned and they're trying to get that rescinded but the law is the law but if
00:42:46this were the nfl okay which has a commissioner and a player conduct policy um you wouldn't want
00:42:56the ortiz brothers on your fantasy football team for the upcoming season because the nfl not only will
00:43:02they wait to see if charges are filed in certain situations but they also have an investigative team
00:43:09that will do their own uh investigations and will sometimes uh you know issue suspensions
00:43:17above and beyond what the law comes down with and even if the law even if charges aren't filed
00:43:24you'll see suspension sometimes um so there is no commissioner obviously in thoroughbred racing and
00:43:32we have been waiting to see if any charges will be filed which is really about the only way the
00:43:38ortiz brothers will be reprimanded at all and as we sit here right now no charges have been filed
00:43:46yeah i mean you make lots of good points and listen i i don't like it and it's not a
00:43:50great look for the
00:43:51sport i'm vegetarian i don't like it at all but the simple facts of the matter and i think this
00:43:57is why
00:43:57it hasn't really blown up people eat chickens people if now if it was dog fighting the world will be
00:44:04up
00:44:04in arms because people don't eat dogs at least not over here in north america so if they were doing
00:44:10something like dog fighting the whole world will be up in arms but people eat chickens so they're just
00:44:15like i don't like it no but you know it happens in puerto rico it's not happening here and it's
00:44:23i hate to
00:44:24say it's not really any of my concern dog fighting you mentioned specifically and i mentioned the nfl we
00:44:30all know about michael vick quarterback who in 2007 uh pled guilty to being part of a dog fighting ring
00:44:38to raising dogs for the purpose of fighting served 21 months in federal prison and pretty much derailed
00:44:45his nfl career for good when that happened um so far nothing is you know there's been no indication
00:44:53that uh that the government of puerto rico or the government of the united states is going to come
00:44:57down on the ortiz brothers but we'll see what happens yeah i'd like to add one more thing to
00:45:02that and um i'm not uh not out there saying that they should be immediately suspended by
00:45:08kentucky racing commission new york gaming commission etc because i do um think that this is a law
00:45:14enforcement matter and i think law enforcement has to deal with it first but you can tell just by the
00:45:21way that they were doing this they were hiding out in the open that obviously they don't think they
00:45:27were doing anything wrong you can disagree with that but i i do think that they don't think they
00:45:32were doing anything wrong and obviously the puerto rican police state police authorities whatever
00:45:37completely look the other way and don't enforce these rules because i mean they all but but you know
00:45:43climbed up on the top of buildings and said hey at three o'clock these brothers are going to be
00:45:47involved in a cockfight i mean they they promoted these things and they were all over social media
00:45:53and whatnot so um and jose in a ride you're two of the greatest riders that ever lived you can
00:46:01do
00:46:01better i'll leave it at that okay the td and riders are also brought to you by the phba the
00:46:07pennsylvania horse breeders association we are just a little over one week from the richest day of the
00:46:12year at penn national race course and that is penn mile day it takes place friday november 29th
00:46:18with a 5 p.m start the centerpiece of the day of course the 400 000 grade three penn mile
00:46:24but
00:46:24the card also offers the 75 000 leafard steaks for pennsylvania bred fillies and mares as well
00:46:31as the 75 000 alphabet soup for three-year-olds and up both at a mile and a sixteenth on
00:46:37the turf again
00:46:38that is friday may 29th at penn national first post time 5 p.m eastern time and as always you
00:46:44can get
00:46:45more information about the pennsylvania bread program by going to www.pabread.com or by calling
00:46:52brian sanfortello area code 610-444-1050 the pennsylvania breeding program is the best program
00:47:01in the country the stallion awards the owner bonuses also the restrictive races and the stakes races for
00:47:08pennsylvania breads last year 321 pennsylvania breeders earned breeders awards
00:47:1422 pennsylvania breeders earned over 100 000 we have the best program in the country take
00:47:23advantage of the fantastic program that we have learn more at pabread.com on this week's edition
00:47:29of first things first our own millie ball caught up with the hulking jeff mullins
00:47:40queen maxima just exuding her class she is now nine for 16 lifetime and i have to say with the
00:47:48shipping that she's done recently i think she won on class would you agree oh for sure for sure that's
00:47:55the the guy interviewed me coming down the stairs and he says uh what do you got to say about
00:48:00her and
00:48:00says good horses do good things she has been remarkable for you just so consistent at different
00:48:06distances you've said all along that after this race you give her now a little bit of a break so
00:48:12what will be your plan with her next race um well we'll probably let her down for a week or
00:48:18two and
00:48:18then send her to the farm and then probably have her back in towards the latter end of del mar
00:48:23to get
00:48:23ready to come back here congratulations to you thanks very much for that millie and it has been
00:48:35reported by the tdn that queen maxima along with intrepido will head to the farm to kingfisher farm
00:48:41for a little respite and rejoin the barn probably mid del mar so good to hear that do want to
00:48:47remind
00:48:47you that racing does continue at santa anita friday saturday sunday and special holiday monday
00:48:54racing on saturday we get to celebrate the calbreds with the snow chief the mel air the thor's echo the
00:49:00crystal water and the franz valentine if you haven't got enough of the calbreds come on monday where we'll
00:49:06have the grade one gamely the hollywood gold cup looks to be a field of about seven and then the
00:49:11grade
00:49:11one shoemaker mile will be a field of 11 featuring the likes of formidable man and king of gosford it's
00:49:19all happening at the great race place come and join us welcome back to segment four of this week's tdn
00:49:26riders room podcast presented by keeneland some huge news made off the track some some very surprising
00:49:31news it was announced on friday uh by uh peter brandt uh dave grenning had the story in the daily
00:49:39racing form that brandt for i wouldn't say fired chad brown because he did leave 25 percent of his
00:49:45horses with him but was taking some of his biggest stars 75 percent of the barn and moving the horses
00:49:51to riley mott bill mott and miguel clement um it was had to be a blow to chad though i'm
00:49:58not going to go
00:49:59out and open up a go fund me page for him he still probably has 300 of the world's best
00:50:03horses um in his
00:50:05barn but this was hard to see coming for the very reason that um peter brandt was out of the
00:50:11business
00:50:11for an awful long time he decided to get back in matter of fact he was out from for uh
00:50:1717 years was
00:50:18it chad brown uh said i can do great things for you and boy did he ever 26 grade one
00:50:25wins uh three
00:50:26breeders cup champions three eclipse award winners and uh the they just keep kept going and going and going
00:50:34um you know if that's not good enough to keep your job what is and i will preface this by
00:50:40saying i'm not
00:50:41in the business of sticking up for chad brown but mr peter brandt you got to do better by this
00:50:48guy
00:50:48i i mean he did one of the best training jobs of any trainer over the last 25 years i
00:50:53know you gave
00:50:53him a lot of great horses to train but he certainly got the job done from the reporting that dave
00:51:00grenning
00:51:00did it looks like the defeat of gizora um in the uh race at churchill downs was maybe the last
00:51:07straw and
00:51:07i know it can't be fun for uh owners to watch their uh breeders cup winners go out there run
00:51:14their
00:51:14eyeballs out and finish second behind a stable mate that they don't own brand also mentioned the fact
00:51:21that he didn't like that gizora was carrying 128 123 pounds to 118 for everybody else but randy i'll start
00:51:29with you you have any um any more insights into what the heck happened here i mean i was very
00:51:34surprised i think like everybody else just because of the results uh that the stable uh that peter brandt
00:51:41sources had had trained by chad brown but i also think that there's probably almost certainly a lot more
00:51:47to the story than what we know and what that is i don't know but it some of it could
00:51:55be something as
00:51:55simple as a situation that we've seen repeat itself over and over in thoroughbred racing
00:52:00and that is uh owners that don't especially like competing with other owners in the same barn
00:52:10we know chad's got a murderer's row of turf horses under his shed row and we know that he sometimes
00:52:17runs
00:52:17two three four horses in these stakes races some of them are owned by peter brandt some of them are
00:52:23owned by seth klarman some of them are owned by you know other top owners and sometimes egos get in
00:52:31the way when an owner in a barn has to run against other top horses owned by other people maybe
00:52:37that
00:52:37has a little something to do with it as well but it's not like he's he's gonna have to run
00:52:42against
00:52:42them now anyway except they're trained by chad brown and he might have another trainer but uh that maybe
00:52:49that's got something to do with it as well but there's more there's more to it than i think we
00:52:54know i believe what we're probably looking at is the straw that broke the camel's back yeah her getting
00:53:01beat was the final straw and giving five pounds because that was mentioned over and over again so
00:53:08yes there has to be more to the story and no he hasn't taken all his horses because the horses
00:53:14in
00:53:14partnership with the likes of coolmore get to stay with chad brown so they're gonna have to still be
00:53:19on speaking terms um other than that i i don't know i'm sure those horses have been welcomed with
00:53:26open arms uh miguel clement riley mott bill mott who got gazora uh bill mott bill mott okay so yeah
00:53:36they'll be welcomed for sure so this will have to run against chad brown next time they run
00:53:41yeah uh this hit the news on thursday in the in the various publications such as tdn
00:53:48saturday afternoon a philly by the name of lost horizon won the serena song stakes at monmouth park
00:53:56by eight and a half lengths by far a career best for the daughter of into mischief out of wow
00:54:02cat
00:54:02who was a significant grade one winner for chad brown co-owned by peter brant and lost horizon the
00:54:09winner of that race owned solely by peter brant so two days after the announcement chad wins a big
00:54:16race for peter now whether that horse is going to stay with chad i don't know if the horses have
00:54:20already been moved i assume they have um but i thought that was interesting yeah we'll keep an eye
00:54:26on that um but it was not it was a minor stake at monmouth certainly not one of the 18
00:54:32from the chad
00:54:32brown um very deep deep bench so we promise each week that we'll try to get to some readers comments
00:54:39which has been great to see people reacting so well to our podcast on the youtube site with all we
00:54:45had
00:54:46to do last week with the preakness we didn't get to it but i did pick out two and i
00:54:49thought they were
00:54:50really good and i'll throw them down to our whole panel um this was from thomas steely it was refreshing
00:54:56to hear whit beckman's comments on ocelli he said he had run him back uh as he was acting like
00:55:03he
00:55:03wanted to run again he also said the horses could not run uh could run more frequently than they
00:55:09currently do he did he also said the horses could run more frequently than they currently do i wonder
00:55:14if it is the owners and breeders who are limiting the number of races and not the trainers and uh
00:55:20um tom i'll pass it over to randy and zoe but no i think it's the trainers um i think
00:55:25that the
00:55:25trainers are calling the shots these days and um they have got it into their head which i don't
00:55:30disagree with but i'm not going to tell sheree devoe and bill mont how to train a horse that would
00:55:35be ridiculous but i have my own ideas um but i do think it's the trainers are now uh kind
00:55:41of really
00:55:42in charge of the spacing and and and the campaigns for the horses and uh the owners uh listen to
00:55:47what
00:55:48they have to say and they've been saying over and over and over again give me seven eight weeks
00:55:52between races i mean i think i go ahead zoe go ahead i want to hear what it's i think
00:55:59mainly down
00:56:00to percentages people trainers want to keep a high percentage they don't want to just run a horse and
00:56:07have it run second or third they want to win each and every time and your best chance of winning
00:56:12is if
00:56:13you run a fresh horse um so that could be one thing the other thing they still have to pass
00:56:19all the
00:56:20vets anytime you might just have an ache or a pain running back in two or three weeks you got
00:56:25a better
00:56:26shot of passing all the vets if you're not feeling any aches or pains in five or six weeks as
00:56:31well so
00:56:32that has an awful lot to do with it things are a lot tighter and a lot tougher than they
00:56:37were
00:56:3710 15 years ago much more stringent you can't go out there with a bruise and be like oh he'll
00:56:44warm
00:56:44up out of it he'll be fine that doesn't fly anymore it just doesn't so you need to have your
00:56:49horse
00:56:50100 fit like they were when they ran that first race to run the second one and i think people
00:56:58are
00:56:58just trainers are just giving their horses ample time to recover i mean we saw this starting to
00:57:05happen as far back as 25 years ago trainers skipping the preakness with also rands from the derby and
00:57:11waiting for the belmont stakes you know wayne lucas did it with the editor's note for crying
00:57:16out loud we saw it happen kind of over and over but now i think it's really been exacerbated and
00:57:23in
00:57:23part because of the medication laws the medication rules that are so stringent in the past hey give
00:57:29them some butte give them some vanamine bring them back in two weeks you know we got no problem
00:57:35now you can't do that and so as you pointed out zoe i mean the aches and pains and all
00:57:40that i mean
00:57:41that's i think that's a that's a significant factor there i mean we would love to see the triple crown
00:57:47thriving as is three races in five weeks it's tradition you know why change it if you don't
00:57:53have to but unfortunately we're seeing you know we're seeing something otherwise how many times do
00:57:59you hear owners and trainers talking about how challenging the finances are now to own horses with
00:58:05all the expenses skyrocketing the cost of feed the cost of workers comp everything okay don't you
00:58:11think owners and trainers would love to be able to run their horses every two weeks with all that purse
00:58:17money at churchill downs and oak lawn and and oh yeah they make they make twice as much money three
00:58:23times as much money as they do now if they thought they could if they thought their horses would run
00:58:27as
00:58:27well why wouldn't they it's just sitting there because they don't think it's in the best interest of the
00:58:33horses all right so we have another question from sherry newberry this is bring back the five million
00:58:41dollar bonus the five million dollar bonus that'd be great crown you get in 2026 or any other year
00:58:47you get the five million dollars if you don't win the triple crown no bonus right now you have no
00:58:53incentive to run all three race in all three races in 2026 so how about the five million dollars i
00:58:59don't
00:58:59think it would work no no it's not enough money in this day and age a two million dollar preakness
00:59:05doesn't move the dial you have 20 million dollar saudi cup 12 million dollar um uh 12 million dollar
00:59:13dubai world cup five million dollar kentucky derby breeders cup make it 10 mark well that okay that would
00:59:20work better but then i said where's the money going to come from that just you know um hello hello
00:59:25mike
00:59:26mike mike micropoli hi there you go everybody wants micropoli to solve all of horses micropoli is just
00:59:33going to drag five ten million dollars off the the dog tree he has in his backyard in boca raton
00:59:39and i'll
00:59:40get back to my main point because we're still seeing a industry where it's all about making sires
00:59:47and you know if you're really going to be the next great sire at the end of the day five
00:59:52million
00:59:53dollars is not going to add a whole lot more to your bankroll and they want to make sure that
00:59:58these
00:59:58horses go to the stud barn with the best possible credentials and the best possible career and as randy
01:00:05said trainers believe the way to do that is to pass races like the freakness and to give horses six
01:00:10seven weeks off in between races i think we're getting close to a point where you're going to see
01:00:15the real triple crown i don't know if ever anybody's ever going to call it that is going to be
01:00:19the
01:00:19kentucky derby the belmont and the travers yeah don't even say that i think that might be within
01:00:24the back of naira's mind um okay so look horsemen don't hate the preakness the preakness is a classic
01:00:32horsemen love when they get a chance to run in the preakness stakes the hospitality is fantastic
01:00:37you know there's there's nothing that horsemen dislike about the preakness stakes except the fact that
01:00:43it's two weeks after the kentucky derby okay you could put up a five million dollar bonus you could
01:00:48put up a seven million dollar bonus and the same thing would apply that we just talked about the
01:00:54horses would be feeling aches and pains and might not pass the veterinary test might not pass veterinary
01:01:01scrutiny coming back in two weeks right and so what happens if you put up a seven million dollar bonus
01:01:07and you keep it at two weeks and god forbid uh a horse breaks down on the racetrack okay you
01:01:15can't
01:01:15look i mean maybe if you extend it one week to three weeks which i think would barely move the
01:01:23needle
01:01:23otherwise and you combine that with a robust bonus then maybe that might be worth trying
01:01:32uh i think personally it should be first of first saturday may first saturday in june first saturday
01:01:38in july naira doesn't believe that to be true uh but then you got to get then how are you
01:01:44going to
01:01:44pay for it okay in 2005 the last time we saw the triple crown bonus the three entities involved
01:01:50were bickering over how much of the insurance premium they would have to pay once they lost the
01:01:56corporate sponsor in visa first it was chrysler then it was visa they were all fighting with each other
01:02:01imagine that in thoroughbred racing imagine that yeah imagine that so there's a lot of you know
01:02:08potential plies in the ointment there but it in the right situation i think it could conceivably work
01:02:15if you could find a way to pay for it the ddn writers room work of the week is brought
01:02:21to you by
01:02:21first tv now we haven't seen desert gate at the races since his win in the march 26 hot spring
01:02:28stakes
01:02:28at oak lawn park but guess what he's been working steadily in preparation for his very next assignment
01:02:35turning in a five-fire long breeze here in 59 and three on saturday the second fastest of 63 workouts
01:02:42at the distance at santa anita desigate won the grade three best pal at two and was second in the
01:02:48grade one delmar faturity and the american pharaoh stakes he's trained by hall of famer bob baffert and
01:02:54his workmate his fellow baffert trainee cipriani made one start at two winning a maiden race to
01:03:00be named a tdn rising star she made one start at three finished second in the last virginess 15 months
01:03:07ago and she'll be headed to the entry box very soon indeed we'll be right back after this message from
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01:04:20three-year-old by the gritty name of grudge was fittingly determined in his breakthrough win at
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01:04:33grunge delivered in his third lifetime start for trainer miguel clement west point has also been
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01:04:52you'll probably find something that you like and might want to be involved in
01:04:56so that's going to be a wrap on this week's show i want to thank
01:04:59lisa lazarus our gamesway guests of the week i want to thank my partners randy moss and zoe cabin i
01:05:05also want to thank the people that work behind the scenes to make this show look as good as it
01:05:09does
01:05:09and that's sue finley anthony larocca alia larocca and katie patrulian we'll be back next week with
01:05:16another edition of the tdn writer's room podcast hope to see you again soon
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