- 11 minutes ago
Midwest-based trainer Ron Moquett was one of five people to put his name to a letter to the HISA board urging them to maintain the status quo regarding the use of the medication Lasix in advance of a May 22 vote by the HISA board as to Lasix's future in the U.S.
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SportsTranscript
00:00:18Welcome to another edition of the TDN Writer's Room.
00:00:21My name is Bill Finley.
00:00:22I'm a correspondent for the Thoroughbred Daily News and I co-host the Down the Stretch radio
00:00:26show every Saturday with the iconic announcer Dave Johnson on Channel 85 on Sirius.
00:00:32Hope you tune us in from 10 to 12 Eastern Time.
00:00:35And my name is Randy Moss, aka J. Randolph Moss, NBC Sports, Spire Speed Figures.
00:00:43Zoe, you like that one, huh?
00:00:44I did like that one, Randolph.
00:00:47Zoe Kadman here with First Racing and First TV.
00:00:50Delighted to be here on a beautiful, sunny and warm Monday in Southern California.
00:00:57Okay, so we have a lot to talk about with all the big races over the weekend.
00:01:00But before we get to that, I'm intrigued.
00:01:02What does the J stand for, Randy?
00:01:04Joe.
00:01:05That's why I just said J.
00:01:07You said by the initial J, correct?
00:01:09Initial J.
00:01:10It looks really good on like a plaque on a door, right?
00:01:14J. Randolph Moss.
00:01:15It sounds like a 1930s media magnate or something.
00:01:19There you go.
00:01:20You know, this sounds very Arkansas.
00:01:22Very Arkansas.
00:01:23You put a junior behind there.
00:01:25Put a junior behind there.
00:01:27You'll be good to go.
00:01:28Randy Joe Moss, Jr., the third.
00:01:32There you go.
00:01:33All right.
00:01:34A absolutely huge weekend of racing, including three preps for the Kentucky Derby.
00:01:39A couple preps as well for the Kentucky Oaks.
00:01:42Also, we have to talk about just a lightning electric performance from Knightsbridge in the Gulfstream Park Mile.
00:01:49Now, the Fountain of Youth was obviously the biggest race of the weekend.
00:01:52And as everyone knows, it was won by commandment, trained by Brad Cox.
00:01:57But what a good race it turned out to be.
00:01:59He won by a neck over Chief Wallaby.
00:02:01And I'm going to make a prediction.
00:02:03And I'll see if Randy and Zoe will agree with me.
00:02:06First of all, I think these are both very good horses.
00:02:09And both horses that are going to be serious players on the road to the Kentucky Derby.
00:02:13I think when it's all said and done, Chief Wallaby will turn out to be the better horse.
00:02:17Here's my reasons why.
00:02:19First of all, he did not have as good a trip as commandment, who snuck up on the rail and
00:02:24got a very good ride.
00:02:25It wasn't real wide, but commandment definitely got the better of him on the turn.
00:02:29And also having said that, remember this horse is trained by Bill Mott.
00:02:34Bill Mott was very reluctant to run in this race, coming off just a maiden race.
00:02:39Mott takes his time.
00:02:40I don't think we've seen the best of Chief Wallaby.
00:02:43And if he's good enough to run on second in the Fountain of Youth in his second lifetime start, boy,
00:02:49Bill Mott is loaded.
00:02:50And I think he's got another very good horse on his hands.
00:02:53Having said that, take nothing away from commandment.
00:02:55He was terrific, not so much for Napoleon Solo, who was fifth, or Jackson Hole, who was sixth.
00:03:01Zoe, take it away.
00:03:04I echo everything that you just said.
00:03:07Take nothing away from the winner.
00:03:08Commandment at a grade one winner, Sipkin Harbor.
00:03:11He was a very good two-year-old.
00:03:13Commandment, of course, trained by Brad Cox.
00:03:15He's buying into mischief.
00:03:17A good race.
00:03:18But the horse that I was looking at was the giant monster on the outside of him in Chief Wallaby.
00:03:24And it's really cool to see a homebred, you know, winning some of these bigger races.
00:03:30Kudos to Mike and KK Ball.
00:03:32This is a homebred for him.
00:03:34His dam was named Alla Lucy, named for a famed restaurant, which was absolutely magnificent in Lexington many moons ago.
00:03:43I know a lot of people listening will have dined at Alla Lucy at some point in their life.
00:03:48She was on race.
00:03:49She was a $1.1 million Keeneland September yearling.
00:03:52So there's definitely some good bloodlines there.
00:03:55He's by constitution.
00:03:57Ground loss, greenness, you know, he's going to be a very good horse.
00:04:02And listening to Junior Alvarado's comments, I don't know if sovereignty has kind of made him bullish over the past
00:04:09years.
00:04:10He simply said, they beat us today, but those horses won't beat us again.
00:04:14And that's all I needed to hear from Junior Alvarado.
00:04:19Yeah, I don't disagree with anything you guys say.
00:04:23I mean, right now, if you had to pick between the two horses, given all the reasons you both just
00:04:27talked about, I would take, I would definitely take the runner up, right?
00:04:32And not, and not commandment.
00:04:33I thought Chief Wallaby ran, ran a heck of a race in defeat.
00:04:36But, I mean, we'll get another look at these horses next time.
00:04:39And when we get to the Kentucky Derby, I think people will be paying more attention on what happened in
00:04:45the Florida Derby than what happened in the Fountain of Youth.
00:04:48But both horses now vault themselves right up to the top echelon.
00:04:54Before this race, most people would have Paladin, even though he was life and death, to beat, you know, a
00:05:02horse and chief honcho that's not exactly on the top list of most people for the Kentucky Derby.
00:05:08Paladin was up there primarily because of Sierra Leone.
00:05:11And sort of the same steps that that horse is taking that Chad Brown took with Sierra Leone.
00:05:17But he's obviously a very nice race horse, and nearly.
00:05:20And now you put these two horses, Commandment, as well as Chief Wallaby, right up there at the top.
00:05:26And we've got a nice little quartet right now as we head into some more of these rounds of Derby
00:05:31preps.
00:05:32Yeah, an absolutely terrific race.
00:05:34Let's turn our attention now to the Rebel at Oakland, which was run on Sunday.
00:05:38The winner was class president, trained by Todd Plutcher.
00:05:41He didn't have a good showing with Jackson Hole, but certainly made up for it in the Rebel.
00:05:46The race wasn't as strong as the Fountain of Youth.
00:05:48I think everybody would agree on that.
00:05:50What impressed me about class president was his gameness.
00:05:54Silent Tactic is a nice horse from the Mark Cassie barn.
00:05:58And boy, he had him beat.
00:06:00And class president dug in like a real racehorse and showed a lot of gameness and grit.
00:06:06So he's got that going for him, though.
00:06:09I think when he faces a little bit tougher, perhaps he could be up against it.
00:06:13The disappointment was litmus test from the Bob Baffert barn.
00:06:17He ran third beat in five and a quarter lengths.
00:06:20Not a great race for him.
00:06:21Randy, I'll let you kick this one off.
00:06:24Yeah, I was disappointed in litmus test as well.
00:06:26I think the pace was a little aggressive for him with his inside draw.
00:06:30They went to the lead, which surprised me just a little bit.
00:06:32But it's Baffert, and he likes to be in front.
00:06:34So I guess I shouldn't have been surprised that much.
00:06:37When Silent Tactic started bearing down at the eighth pole on class president,
00:06:42I thought the race was over, given the way Silent Tactic finished in the Southwest Stakes.
00:06:46But I agree, class president showed a lot of gameness.
00:06:49And I also agree that if the Kentucky Derby were coming up in a month's time,
00:06:55and this was the final prep for all these horses, class president and Silent Tactic would be 15 to 1
00:07:03in the Kentucky Derby.
00:07:0591 buyer speed figure as opposed to 101, a full 10 points faster for the two Fountain of Youth horses.
00:07:14You know, the Rebel was a solid race, but it wasn't a, you know, really top of the line Kentucky
00:07:20Derby prep, in my opinion.
00:07:22I echo your thoughts completely.
00:07:25And with regards to Bob, now this comes after the fact, after the race, Bob said he didn't want to
00:07:30be on the lead.
00:07:31He said Litmer's test was too close to a fast pace.
00:07:35He needs to just relax off the pace and come with one run.
00:07:40That's after the race.
00:07:41Now, I don't know what he said before the race.
00:07:43And I mean, it's not like Pratt really sent him out of the gate.
00:07:46And I'm never one to second guess anything that Flavian Pratt does.
00:07:50I think he's the best rider in the country.
00:07:52But the horse broke on top and he kind of maintained his position.
00:07:56But those were Bob's quotes after the race.
00:07:59And just one other note about Bob's horses.
00:08:02We'll talk a little bit more about the San Felipe coming up this weekend.
00:08:05But on Friday, Bob had a maiden at Santa Anita by the name of Cherokee Nation.
00:08:12Yeah.
00:08:13Who finally got out of the starting gate in a maiden race and won by a pole against a horse
00:08:18that Bob thought was better going into the race.
00:08:21Or it was called Winston Ave.
00:08:23And Cherokee Nation got a buyer of 100 that could have been a few points faster.
00:08:28And you know what's cool about that?
00:08:30So, I didn't like Winston Ave to begin with.
00:08:34I kind of liked Sadler's horse that was drawn on the rail.
00:08:37I was in the paddock before the race and Bob goes, hey, I got that guy Jaramillo on my horse.
00:08:42What kind of rider is he?
00:08:44I'm like, Bob, you know what kind of rider he is.
00:08:46He's going to send that guy.
00:08:48He's like, oh, no, I don't want him to send him.
00:08:51And I'm like, mm-hmm, okay, Bob.
00:08:53So, after the race, Bob actually called me after the race.
00:08:59And he said, I said, well, what did you tell that guy?
00:09:02He goes, I just told him, you know, he doesn't get out of the gate very well.
00:09:07He goes, Jaramillo looked right at me and said, he will get out of the gate today, boss.
00:09:13And man, he broke five on top and never looked back.
00:09:16And then one other thing Bob told me when he called me, he called me up and he goes, you
00:09:21know, when I stood in the winner's circle, I thought of Jeff Siegel, who, of course, we lost last year.
00:09:28Very good handicapper out here in Southern California.
00:09:30He said, that would be the type of horse that Jeff would have been all over.
00:09:35He would have called me right after that race and been like, hey, Bob, that horse is the real deal.
00:09:41He's the real deal.
00:09:42He's a good horse.
00:09:43That's how he needs to be ridden.
00:09:44So, I thought that was really cool.
00:09:46Well, he's running in the Santa Anita Derby in his next start.
00:09:49That's what they've got penciled in.
00:09:51So, there's a horse to watch as well from the Baffert Mart.
00:09:54He'll have a Miceo Jaramillo aboard him because he's never left the gate like that, ever.
00:10:01So, back at Aqueduct, the New York road to the Kentucky Derby is really struggling.
00:10:07The Gotham has not produced a Kentucky Derby winner since Secretariat in 1973.
00:10:13It's the only horse in the history of the race.
00:10:16The winner is Iron Honor trained by Chad Brown.
00:10:19I guess there's some good things to say and some bad things to say.
00:10:22First of all, for a horse to win, the Gotham in a second lifetime start.
00:10:26That in and of itself is impressive.
00:10:29But he didn't win particularly impressively.
00:10:32The horse he beat, who really gave him a battle, crowned the Buckeye, was coming off an eighth.
00:10:38I'm trying to read my notes.
00:10:40Maybe somebody can correct me if I'm wrong.
00:10:42But an eighth-place finish in the LeCompte.
00:10:44I don't think we'll be talking much about the Gotham stakes when Randy Moss and Jerry Bailey are on NBC
00:10:51on the first Saturday in May discussing the Kentucky Derby.
00:10:54Am I wrong, Randy?
00:10:56Nope.
00:10:56I think you're right.
00:10:58I mean, Chad's loaded, right?
00:11:01He's got Paladin.
00:11:02He's got Cantaletto, who we'll talk about a little bit later, as a real top prospect.
00:11:07But, you know, Iron Honor, right?
00:11:09Give him kudos, Zoe.
00:11:10He won a stakes race in his second lifetime start.
00:11:13But, yeah, I don't know how good he's – yeah.
00:11:16Showed some moxie as well.
00:11:18That's one thing that, you know, you can't buy is moxie.
00:11:22He definitely showed some grit.
00:11:23So we'll see where he goes next.
00:11:26All right.
00:11:27So let's get into the two races for the Phillies over the weekend, the Devona Dale.
00:11:31We had Todd Pletcher on last week, and he did talk a little bit about She's Be Smooth.
00:11:36I thought the – oh, boy.
00:11:39What was the name of the Brad Cox horse, Randy, that was the big favorite?
00:11:42Anybody help me out with that?
00:11:43On time, girl.
00:11:45I thought she was a cinch in there.
00:11:46But she just got run off her feet by She'd Be Smooth by Lexingtonian, a sire snowed by Calumet, as
00:11:54did everybody.
00:11:55The horse won by six, second lifetime start.
00:12:00Do I have this right, Randy?
00:12:01A 91 buyer I seem to scribble on.
00:12:03I scribble things all over the place, and I never know what is right.
00:12:07Has to prove that she can go around two turns.
00:12:10But I think Todd Pletcher has an interesting prospect here.
00:12:14She did it the right way.
00:12:16I loved watching her.
00:12:18Yeah, the speed figures came back low, but Pratt put a brilliant ride on her.
00:12:22And in listening to Todd on the interview, it was almost like, yeah, she's in there.
00:12:27You know, Calumet liked to swing for the fences, which they do, and quite rightly so.
00:12:31You've got to be in it to win it.
00:12:34So we'll see where she goes.
00:12:35She is predominantly by a sprinter in Lexingtonian.
00:12:38We'll see if she can carry that around two turns.
00:12:41But it was visually impressive the way that she did it, for sure.
00:12:45She certainly finished up very strongly.
00:12:47Of course, she was 10 lengths back early, so she was going to finish fairly strongly.
00:12:52She saved all that energy at the start.
00:12:54But, man, she looked good drawing away.
00:12:55Not the best field she beat behind her, but she did it the right way.
00:12:5991 buyer was solid.
00:13:01Lexingtonian, I did a little bit of research on him.
00:13:04He's a young stallion, obviously, Calumet.
00:13:07He was a sprinter, exclusively a sprinter.
00:13:10They only tried him around two turns twice, and it didn't win.
00:13:15His offspring, there had been a couple.
00:13:18He had one that was a two-year-old that won a six-race at Woodbine at a mile and
00:13:22an eighth.
00:13:23And, you know, the early numbers for Lexingtonian are not as bad as you would think for horses running around
00:13:31two turns.
00:13:32So my initial skepticism about Sheeby Smooth's distance pedigree was kind of soothed somewhat this morning
00:13:40when I went back and looked at some of the early Lexingtonian results.
00:13:45The Honey Bee Sunday also at Oaklawn Park.
00:13:48And Bob Baffert, surprise, surprise, he also has a major horse for the Kentucky Oaks,
00:13:54a rebounding performance for Explorer after she was beaten as a big favorite in her previous start.
00:13:59When she got involved in a speed duel, I thought that race was a lot better than it looked on
00:14:04paper.
00:14:04I was a little bit concerned about her ability to go two turns, whether or not she was just a
00:14:08sprinter.
00:14:09But Zoe, she came through, and Bob Baffert has us just like he always does.
00:14:15He's got major candidates for both the Kentucky Derby and the Kentucky Oaks.
00:14:19What did you think about Explorer?
00:14:20Very, very nice.
00:14:22She sat off the pace nicely under Pratt.
00:14:25J.J. Hernandez had days this weekend, but he can ride designated races.
00:14:30It was interesting that Bob opted not to ship him out there and stuck with Pratt, who rode her to
00:14:37perfection.
00:14:37Hey, she's by blame.
00:14:39Two turns, if she relaxes, is absolutely fine for her.
00:14:42I thought she looked terrific and drew off very nicely in the Honey Bee Stakes.
00:14:47Yeah, I mean, look, we talked about her race in the Las Virginas when Meaning ran her down in the
00:14:55final few strides and won by length and a half or whatever.
00:14:58But given the way that race set up, it looked like a two-horse race on paper between Explorer and
00:15:03Super Corridora.
00:15:04Super Corridora has to have the lead, the thinking is, to really run her best race.
00:15:09Explorer has speed if you want to use it.
00:15:11So they basically used Explorer early from an inside draw to go after Super Corridora, thinking that was the main
00:15:18horse they had to beat.
00:15:19And it turned out to be a speed duel, 45.98 for the half.
00:15:25And Explorer is better when she's got a target, like she had in the Honey Bee.
00:15:30You know, I mean, she's just in the mix.
00:15:32I don't think she would be in, you know, like the early Kentucky Oaks favorite.
00:15:36But she showed that, you know, she's capable when she is not, when she's ridden with a little bit more
00:15:44patience.
00:15:46Counting Stars, the runner-up, rebounded in a huge way as well.
00:15:51She was horrible in her most recent race.
00:15:53Just stopped to a walk for no apparent reason.
00:15:56And I actually texted Mark Cassie after that race, you know, and I said, what's the story?
00:16:01We may be talking about the Honey Bee on the podcast.
00:16:04What can I say about Counting Stars?
00:16:06What was the excuse?
00:16:07And he said, I have no idea.
00:16:08He was honest about it.
00:16:10He said, I do not know why.
00:16:11All I know is that she came back and worked exceptionally well.
00:16:15So we're going to press on with her and run her in the Honey Bee.
00:16:18And she was 11 to 1 as a result of that, you know, very poor performance in her previous start.
00:16:25And that was in the Martha Washington.
00:16:26She was beaten 60 lengths.
00:16:29She was eased in the stretch.
00:16:30But here she came and ran a heck of a race in defeat.
00:16:36The other race, and it has nothing to do with the Triple Crown preps, but we have to mention Knightsbridge
00:16:42win in the Gulfstream Park Mile.
00:16:44Of course, we talked about him a little bit beforehand.
00:16:47And this horse is a monster, an absolute freak.
00:16:53Until maybe sovereignty comes back, I would go so far to say he's the best horse in racing right now.
00:16:59And maybe that will continue to be the story throughout the year.
00:17:03He got a 112 buyer.
00:17:05We'll learn more about that when Randy talks about the fastest horse of the week.
00:17:08He won by 11 and a quarter lengths.
00:17:11Basically, Junior Alvarado made a move on the turn, put the race away, and he was in a just canter
00:17:17down the stretch.
00:17:18It's interesting.
00:17:19And Bill Mott, one thing that he did say after the race is he's not tempted to stretch him out
00:17:24to two turns.
00:17:25He's going to continue to run him as one turn.
00:17:28He mentioned the Churchill down stakes at Churchill as a possible start.
00:17:32But, Zoe, we talked last week about, and we're getting a little bit ahead of ourselves, and I think Randy
00:17:38opined that this horse will win the Met Mile.
00:17:41And I agree.
00:17:43Journalism or no journalism, if this horse stays sound, they're not beating him any time soon.
00:17:49That was fun to watch.
00:17:50I had to watch it back this morning just to be like, man, I could ride that horse.
00:17:55Bill could ride that.
00:17:55We could all ride him.
00:17:57That was fantastic.
00:17:58Those are the kind of races that I love to watch.
00:18:00Now, I don't know who's behind him.
00:18:02Who cares?
00:18:03It was fabulous.
00:18:06And, Randy, I gave you an assignment last week.
00:18:08Did you finish your homework?
00:18:10I did, really.
00:18:11I did, Zoe.
00:18:12And we actually touched on that a little bit on the NBC telecast.
00:18:17When Mott wins with a first-time starter, which, of course, he's not known for, their second start is very
00:18:26good, typically.
00:18:27He wins at about a 26% clip.
00:18:29He's a 16% trainer overall, historically.
00:18:34So, his horses actually do quite well after they win their debut when they come back second time out, as
00:18:40you would expect.
00:18:42You don't have any numbers for me?
00:18:4526.
00:18:4726%.
00:18:47Okay.
00:18:48Yeah.
00:18:48No names?
00:18:50And there have been some graded sticks winners involved there as well.
00:18:53Okay.
00:18:54They came back and ran well.
00:18:55Just FYI was one, right?
00:18:57But, you know, those are two-year-olds.
00:19:00And you see that a lot more often from trainers, obviously, from Maiden right into a graded sticks race as
00:19:07a two-year-old.
00:19:08It's much more unusual, very unusual for Mott to do it with a three-year-old like we saw with
00:19:15Cheap Wallaby.
00:19:15But it obviously worked pretty well with that one as well.
00:19:19I got a question for you.
00:19:20Since you're so tied in in Southern California, do you have any idea what the plan is going forward for
00:19:25Nysos?
00:19:27It's been sold to Coolmore.
00:19:28I know that much.
00:19:30Because the only, you know, if Nysos winds up running in the Met Mile.
00:19:36I mean, I would imagine he's going there, wouldn't you?
00:19:40The only problem with Nysos is his ability to string together races in a certain period of time.
00:19:50So, seems like, you know, thumbs up thus far for Nysos.
00:19:55It could be like the race of the year, could it not?
00:19:58I would think that at some point in the Met Mile, and again, we're getting way ahead of ourselves,
00:20:03but Nysos and Knight's Bridge would probably be eye to eye.
00:20:08And, I mean, let's face it, the horses Knight Bridge beat this past weekend are not going to be running
00:20:14in the Breeders' Cup Classic.
00:20:16No.
00:20:17And, you know, the gut check part of it is something that we haven't seen yet from Knight's Bridge,
00:20:23because he hasn't, because no one's been fast enough to get up next to him is the reason why.
00:20:28But if Nysos and Knight's Bridge hook up, that is going to be really interesting to see whether Knight's Bridge
00:20:36has as much in the intestinal fortitude department as he does in the overall quality,
00:20:42because that was an unbelievable race.
00:20:44Because Nysos has been tested.
00:20:46Yes.
00:20:47And he showed some moxie.
00:20:49Knight's Bridge is just, I'll just leave you behind.
00:20:52He's just amazing.
00:20:54Well, we're going to pay a couple bills here from some of our sponsors,
00:20:58and when we come back, we'll go to the Gainesway Guest of the Week, Ron Moquette,
00:21:01who has some very interesting things to say about whether or not LASIKs will eventually be banned in all races
00:21:06in this country.
00:21:07Stay with us here on the TDN Writers' Room Podcast.
00:21:11I do want to remind you that the TDN Writers' Room is brought to you by Keeneland.
00:21:15Now we're right in the thick of triple crown prep season.
00:21:18Seems like just yesterday we were talking about this.
00:21:20This weekend was a very good one for Keeneland's September graduate.
00:21:24Robert Commandman was a $500,000 September grad.
00:21:28He took down the Fountain of Youth,
00:21:30while the unbeaten Iron Honor, a January and September graduate,
00:21:34won the Gotham for trainer Chad Brown.
00:21:37In fact, the one, two, three finishes of the Gotham represented a Keeneland September trifecta.
00:21:45That's a tongue twister.
00:21:46We'll be right back after this message from Keeneland.
00:21:50We do this so your granddaughter can work on a farm someday.
00:21:55So the stands will still be packed in 50 years.
00:21:59That's why we come to work every day.
00:22:02Obsess over every single detail.
00:22:07Because the story of racing is written one moment at a time.
00:22:11And the future of our industry deserves nothing less.
00:22:16Keeneland.
00:22:17Every moment matters.
00:22:20The fastest horse of the week is brought to you by the Fast Sires at Windstar Farm.
00:22:24This week, let's talk about Heartland, a son of Justify and a half-brother to Classic Empire
00:22:30who is standing his second season at Stud.
00:22:33We all know how gorgeous Justify was.
00:22:35Heartland looks a lot like his sire.
00:22:38And his first foals are proving to be a good-looking bunch, too, over at Windstar.
00:22:42They like to say they're all heart.
00:22:45And here are a couple.
00:22:46A Windstar-bred filly out of Cram, born on January 22nd.
00:22:51And this colt, owned by the China Horse Club, out of Tactical Joke, who was born on the very same
00:22:58day.
00:22:59Heartland stands at Windstar for a fee of just $10,000.
00:23:05Knightsbridge, of course, was the fastest horse of the week.
00:23:07His 112 buyer speed figure, a full 10 points faster than Magnitude got, winning the Razorback Handicap.
00:23:14The buyer figure for Knightsbridge also was the fastest since his good-off and stable mate, Sovereignty.
00:23:19Got a 115 in his 10-length romp in the Traverse Stakes, which happens to be the last time we've
00:23:24seen Sovereignty race.
00:23:25So from Jan 1, 2025 to present, the fastest buyers go like this.
00:23:31Sovereignty 115, Knightsbridge 112.
00:23:33Then there's a quartet at 111, Forever Young and Sierra Leone in the Breeders' Cup Classic, Ways and Means, and
00:23:40Book'em Dano.
00:23:42I added this to the list just so we could work Book'em Dano into the podcast.
00:23:52The Gainsway Guest of the Week is trainer Ron Moquette.
00:23:56And the reason we're having Ron on is because there is a very thorny issue going on right now in
00:24:02horse racing as to whether or not Heisa will ban Lasix not only in two-year-old races and stakes
00:24:09races, but in all races altogether.
00:24:12And just to give our listeners and viewers some background, if they haven't been following the story, Heisa was given
00:24:18basically a three-year pass on whether or not to take action on the full Lasix ban.
00:24:24They're conducting studies in the meantime to look into the issue.
00:24:28But on May 22nd, the Board of Directors of Heisa will take a vote on whether or not there will
00:24:35be a full Lasix ban.
00:24:36And on top of that, unless the vote is unanimous of the nine members of the Board of Directors to
00:24:44keep Lasix, just one person says no, I want Lasix to go.
00:24:50So then, well, there are some other extenuating circumstances.
00:24:54Maybe they could come up with a different plan.
00:24:56But basically, the story is that Lasix would be banned in all races.
00:25:01Ron Moquette was among a group of very prominent trainers, including Bill Mott, Mark Cassie, and Chad Brown, that published
00:25:08an open letter sent out to the TDN and other outlets last week,
00:25:12basically saying this is a very bad idea and quite eloquently stating the reasons why they think that a full
00:25:22ban on Lasix is not going to be something good for the sport.
00:25:26So, Ron, I will start with the most basic of all questions.
00:25:29Why?
00:25:30Why do you and the others feel that if this were to happen, it would be a bad thing for
00:25:36racing, for the horses, field size, etc.?
00:25:40Take it away.
00:25:41Well, one of the things that I think the definition of a horseman is to do right by your horse,
00:25:49to take every possibility to minimize risk of anything bad happening.
00:25:55Every day, every morning, the horsemen that I know that have horses train them, they make sure that all the
00:26:01snaps are closed on the gates.
00:26:03They make sure that the nails are pushed in the stall.
00:26:06There's no shot that they could scratch it.
00:26:08We're constantly trying to minimize risk of anything bad happening to a horse.
00:26:15That's the whole job.
00:26:17Training horses 101.
00:26:18Take care of your horse.
00:26:20Do everything in your power to minimize the risk of something not good happening.
00:26:25And I think that this falls into that category.
00:26:30I'm not out here asking for race day meds such as, you know, pain maskers or performance enhancers or steroids
00:26:41or any of that business.
00:26:43Because I'm just allowing, I mean, I'm asking for some people to allow common sense for, there's been a smear
00:26:52campaign on Lasix and they put it in with every, you know, it's called dope for a long time.
00:26:59They called it performance enhancing and it's basically what the last evolution of it was before they started taking it
00:27:09away and into the current model that we have, which everybody has basically agreed that that's fine.
00:27:15The current model is, is that we should be adjusting the breed to where, to where eventually we could, you
00:27:23know, hopefully get stronger horses and hopefully get horses that don't have a lot of breeding for bleeding in their
00:27:31past performances.
00:27:32So I like the fact that two-year-olds don't have it.
00:27:35I'm okay with the fact that graded stakes horses don't have it, but the day-to-day horses that is
00:27:42competing, I think it's a safety tool that ought to be used.
00:27:48And, you know, there's people with differing opinions and I'm listening to all of them.
00:27:55I mean, I'm constantly evolving the way I look at things, but I think that the people that are so
00:28:02venomous,
00:28:02they're fundamentally opposed to it, they're, they're kind of closed off to what it actually is.
00:28:09And they're going with the fact that it's a, it's dope or it's a performance enhancing or whatever else it's
00:28:16been painted as to get us to where we are.
00:28:20Okay.
00:28:24I, I have no problem with status quo, just like you.
00:28:30And I'm glad, you know, I'm, I'm glad to hear you say that with the two-year-olds, the LASIK
00:28:35span for two-year-olds, LASIK span for stakes races, the improvement of the breed, maybe going forward, et cetera,
00:28:41et cetera.
00:28:42And I know when all this started, there were a lot of horse players that were having a lot of
00:28:49angst because they thought that the past performances of horses on LASIKs, off LASIKs, back and forth would be just
00:28:56indecipherable and performance would be up and down.
00:29:00And we haven't really seen that.
00:29:02I, I don't think it, it's been a huge deal for horse players, the current status quo.
00:29:09Okay.
00:29:10Uh, but let me, let me ask you this, and you're probably going to hear this if you haven't already.
00:29:14Uh, traditionally, traditionally horsemen have, HBPA has been in favor of more medication and not less.
00:29:25And when this first LASIKs rule started being tossed around, there were some horsemen and HBPA people that said, oh
00:29:33my gosh, there's going to be carnage.
00:29:35There's going to be horses bleeding all over the place.
00:29:37It's going to be a horrible look, you know, and that's by and large, that hasn't happened.
00:29:44And so there are going to be some people that say, we don't really need LASIKs.
00:29:48We haven't seen that sort of carnage on the racetrack that people predicted.
00:29:52How, how would you respond to that?
00:29:54Well, first and foremost, I would say that, uh, just because you haven't seen it, doesn't necessarily mean it hasn't
00:30:02happened.
00:30:03Uh, also, you know, the same reason I put on a seatbelt.
00:30:09Okay.
00:30:10I, I don't want my horse to ever experience bleeding.
00:30:15I don't.
00:30:16And if, and the same reason I do a seatbelt or, or the riders out there on the track use
00:30:22a helmet.
00:30:22But it's, it's something that could limit and minimize the risk of something bad happening to a horse that I
00:30:30see no, no reason why it shouldn't be allowed.
00:30:34It's administered by a regulatory veterinarian.
00:30:36It's not your vet.
00:30:38It's not my vet.
00:30:39It's the state vet does it.
00:30:41And basically, whenever it's done, you give them some minerals and water and we move on down the road.
00:30:47That is, seems like if the risk of the carnage, if the risk is there, why wouldn't we, as people
00:30:55who propose that we love animals and love our horses, why wouldn't we want to do a safe, inexpensive, you
00:31:03know, regulated treatment that could minimize that risk?
00:31:06And it's not about, you know, who's right or who's wrong.
00:31:11It's like, get it right.
00:31:12At the end of the day, I, I agree.
00:31:14Every decision we make in this industry should be about integrity, safety, and breeding a better horse.
00:31:24Every decision we do, I don't care what it is about.
00:31:28Those three things should be the main thing.
00:31:30And we constantly have reaction regulations, you know, regulatory forever before HISA, regulatory overreach.
00:31:42This happens, we automatically go from this ditch to the other ditch.
00:31:45And I just want common sense to be involved.
00:31:49And there can be a, a reason to think that just because it don't happen all the time, that doesn't
00:31:57mean we want it to ever happen.
00:32:00And if we can minimize that risk of it ever happening, what is the harm?
00:32:05If you told me that immediately after everybody quit using Lasix on performance horses in our industry, that all of
00:32:13a sudden that breakdowns ceased, well, fine.
00:32:17Okay, we can draw a line right to that and say, there we go.
00:32:20That's fine.
00:32:21Let it go.
00:32:23If you tell me that people, you know, quit betting because Lasix was administered, okay, I'll fall for that one
00:32:30as well.
00:32:31But if you're telling me that we just want to do it because we think we should, some people who
00:32:36aren't in the barn all the time, who don't see these.
00:32:40And when it does happen, although not as much as, as they think it was, or they think it could,
00:32:46when it does happen, it's not something that could be catastrophic or, or horrible.
00:32:51I mean, that should be enough reason right there to say, look, I mean, that's the reason I don't let
00:32:56horses run around on the street.
00:32:57They probably wouldn't get hit, but what if they did?
00:33:00Why wouldn't you just put them behind a safe, a safe, you know, enclosure that would help minimize that risk?
00:33:08Yeah, you're making very good points.
00:33:10And I'm myself quite happy with the status quo as well and not really quite sure why they want to
00:33:18mess with it.
00:33:18As we, we've seen studies prove there's no correlation between breakdowns and Lasix, but for the odd one or two
00:33:26people listening, can, can you explain what the difference is between the U S and Europe?
00:33:33I grew up without Lasix, no problem.
00:33:36They're still going without Lasix for somebody watching this and thinking, well, they do it in England.
00:33:40They do it in Ireland.
00:33:41Why have we got to have Lasix in America?
00:33:44Can you explain that?
00:33:45And then secondly, explain what Lasix actually does to a horse's system, how it actually helps them.
00:33:54So first off, I always like usually steer away from comparisons and, and I don't care whether we're comparing two
00:34:03horses that run on the same track, a different, different, you know, the earlier race, the later race, you can't
00:34:09get the same variables.
00:34:10So when you try to compare to come up with something first off at Churchill Downs, uh, and at Oakland,
00:34:19there are no green pastures.
00:34:21There's no trees.
00:34:23There's it's basically, we, we lovingly call Churchill Rikers Island because it's concrete pavement everywhere.
00:34:32Europe, Europe, Europe, it's, it's a little bit, you know, you don't have long meets.
00:34:37You have, uh, places for readily available for more turnout.
00:34:41Uh, there's a lot more time.
00:34:43I've watched some of the races where they get to warm up a long time before they run.
00:34:47There's so there's not nothing the same, really.
00:34:50I mean, there's more turf racing where you just gallop around and sprint home for the most part, where we're
00:34:56more speed and running on dirt.
00:34:58I mean, there's, you know, whenever they, it's always laughable to me whenever they compare, well, they don't do that
00:35:05there.
00:35:05Well, well, okay.
00:35:07So we're, we're different.
00:35:09That's how we are.
00:35:10We're different.
00:35:11We have a different set of circumstances completely here.
00:35:15And doesn't mean which one's right or which one's wrong.
00:35:17I would love to have, to have, uh, you know, a place to turn out every horse and, you know,
00:35:25to do that stuff.
00:35:25I mean, I think it'd be great, but we don't have that.
00:35:28So what do we do?
00:35:29Do we just quit or do we just try to come up with ways to make it as safe as
00:35:33possible?
00:35:36Ron, I want to add a couple of things.
00:35:37First, I want to, um, it's not my role necessarily to do this, but I want to give a couple
00:35:41opinions of my own.
00:35:42I'm, I'm not a Lasix guy.
00:35:44I started covering racing in New York with the last, last holdout, but I will say a couple of things.
00:35:49First of all, I was very impressed by the letter.
00:35:52And then I did a follow-up story in the thoroughbred daily news where I contacted some of the most
00:35:57prominent horsemen in the country, including Todd Pletcher, a grand motion who I was thought would be an anti-drug
00:36:04guy.
00:36:04And I, I absolutely respect their opinion.
00:36:07That's number one.
00:36:08Number two, um, I think there's a lot more important issues in this sport right now than this silly Lasix
00:36:16controversy.
00:36:16So I do think that, you know what, just, it's fine.
00:36:21Leave it alone.
00:36:22Okay.
00:36:22So that's me on my soapbox, but now I want to ask you another question.
00:36:26And this is something that, that, that also bothers me.
00:36:28So you have a nine person board.
00:36:30That's going to decide this.
00:36:33There are a few people on the board that I think will probably have pretty good knowledge of the issues.
00:36:39Bill Thomason, the former CEO of Keeneland, Joe DeFrancis is, is, is very up on top of this, but on
00:36:46top of this, there are four or five people on his board that I don't think know the, the, the
00:36:51first thing about horse racing.
00:36:53Do you have a problem?
00:36:55And I'm sure you do with people being able to make what is a, a decision that, that means a
00:37:04lot to you and, and, and other horsemen.
00:37:06Is that an issue?
00:37:07I deal with that quite a bit.
00:37:09It's, it's uncanny that in our sport, so many people who are in control positions of making decisions that affect
00:37:17us daily have very little idea of the actual sport.
00:37:21That is spooky to me.
00:37:23And it's not just on this issue, but it is, we're talking about this issue.
00:37:28So it, that's basically a, you know, an example of everything that I deal with is I'll come in and
00:37:35I'll explain to people why this is important.
00:37:39What is the negatives of this?
00:37:41What is the positives of this?
00:37:42And, and then I'm, Oh, by the way, I hope I've got you educated enough to make a good decision.
00:37:49And there's not enough people with real knowledge that are in, in positions of control in, in very, very few
00:37:57aspects of our sport.
00:37:59So yes, this is huge.
00:38:02It affects all of us.
00:38:04It's, it's a right or wrong.
00:38:06You're either going to run with it or against it and it affects everyone.
00:38:10But to go back to the other thing, you're exactly right about, about, you would like to have really seasoned,
00:38:18knowledgeable people that's, that's allowed to make the decisions, but that, that cats out.
00:38:25So you go back to the first thing he said is we have so many things that are so much
00:38:33more pressing right now in real time that should have our energy and focus.
00:38:40You know, there's, there's tons of ways that we can improve things and just leave this the way it is.
00:38:46You know, I think it was a knee jerk reaction when they pulled it.
00:38:50It was a, it was anecdotal.
00:38:52There was no science behind it really in America.
00:38:55There was some stuff on the other side of the pond that actually agreed with a lot of the horsemen.
00:39:00The reason the HPVA always meets things with adverse reaction to when someone outside the industry imposes regulations is that
00:39:12they don't, they're not ever condoning medication.
00:39:15They just don't want you taking tools away.
00:39:18That's their thing.
00:39:19It's like, you know, don't, don't take the horsemanship out of the game and, and replace it with a regulation
00:39:26because we've seen what the last 25 years of that does.
00:39:30The last 25 years, we've added regulations top to bottom more than any time in our history.
00:39:36And they've all been one way removing, removing, removing horseman's opinions of right or wrong and replacing it with a
00:39:45regulatory rule.
00:39:48Removing, you know, 2006 when we won the Stephen Foster.
00:39:53I remember I made a list of all the medications that was available and the different things.
00:40:00And I, and I'll just go through a couple of them with you.
00:40:03When Brass Hat, Perfect Drift, Cosmonaut, For the Love of Money, Seat Gold, and the list goes on and on.
00:40:11That was the one that was in that race.
00:40:12They could all, in 2006, run with a corticosteroid.
00:40:19They could run with Bantamine or Lace or Bantamine or Butte.
00:40:27They could run with, they could run on.
00:40:32I mean, there was no rules against milkshaking then.
00:40:35There was no pre-race examination by a vet.
00:40:40There was, you could actually run on Winstraw or Ecopoise.
00:40:45You could run on Ketofen the day before.
00:40:49All of those gone.
00:40:51Lasix, you could give split Lasix if you wanted to.
00:40:55Six hours out and two hours or four hours out.
00:40:59So, all of that has evolved, and I think, for the most part, to the good.
00:41:03But it's like, it's like there's never enough of them saying, we're removing all this and replacing regulations.
00:41:10I just give you the basic list of what you could have done in 2006 in a grade one race.
00:41:16And now, you got out-of-competition testing.
00:41:20I'm for it.
00:41:22You got pre-race inspection.
00:41:24Good.
00:41:24Blood gas.
00:41:25No more milkshaking.
00:41:26Great.
00:41:26Okay.
00:41:27No Winstraw, Ecopoise.
00:41:30Fine.
00:41:31All that stuff is good.
00:41:33No Butte, Vanamine, none of that.
00:41:36Fine.
00:41:36There's a, the day of the race, there's a group of vets comes by and jogs your horse.
00:41:42That wasn't out there.
00:41:43There's not as much scrutiny on the track, Dan, as there is now.
00:41:47Think about all the different regulations.
00:41:50The strike rule is, all of it's gone since 2006.
00:41:54That's fine.
00:41:55But now it's like, let me ask you this.
00:41:58Is the sport better now or is it better in 2006?
00:42:03Are horses running now more today or in 2006?
00:42:10All right.
00:42:11Well, look, don't you, I don't want people to come down on you for this.
00:42:20You're not saying that all those lists of medications that you went through, that it was a good thing that
00:42:28all that was happening in 2006.
00:42:30I am absolutely not saying that.
00:42:32I'm saying, I basically, I'm going to go, let's make it as clear as possible.
00:42:37I'm glad they're out.
00:42:38Okay.
00:42:39But I am saying that all of the regulations and all the rules we did, supposedly for the safety of
00:42:46the horse.
00:42:48I just wish that we could see more of an effect.
00:42:51I wish breakdowns wouldn't have went, would have went down with it.
00:42:55I wish the crop size would have went up.
00:42:58I wish we'd be on more national television channels and all the stuff that would make our story.
00:43:04Definitely.
00:43:05But that's what I'm saying is that sometimes the people in a room that come up with good ideas.
00:43:11And again, getting rid of race day medications is a good idea for the most part.
00:43:16I agree.
00:43:17Well, breakdowns have gone way down, wouldn't you say?
00:43:20But what did it?
00:43:22I mean, well, I would say this, breakdowns have went way down and that's something we want it to be
00:43:30zero, right?
00:43:31But I just think there's a lot of energy.
00:43:33The whole deal of my soapbox of that is that we've regulated the tar out of trainers for a while.
00:43:41Let's do some other stuff.
00:43:42Let's look at the breed a little bit.
00:43:44Maybe let's look at breeding first year sires 295 times when they only run six races.
00:43:51Maybe we could just do a little bit of something there.
00:43:55I get it.
00:43:56We want to do.
00:43:57But the people that are in charge have decided that first we've got to get all the trainers out of
00:44:03the game
00:44:03because we've reduced down to basically I think we're now a third of what we were in 2000.
00:44:12So we've just about regulated it to where it's not a thing for us.
00:44:17So let's start looking at ways we could actually help.
00:44:21We've done everything here.
00:44:23Let's leave that alone a little bit and start looking at breeding a sounder horse.
00:44:26Maybe imposing some of these nice regulations that we have on the breeders and the two-year-old training sales.
00:44:33Why is it that today you still, for me to work a horse in April at Churchill Downs,
00:44:42I have to be registered as a licensed HISA trainer.
00:44:46The vet has to be, that horse has to go through a pre-race examination or pre-workout examination,
00:44:52can't have any medication, has to be all this stuff.
00:44:55And yet a month later at, you know, the next two-year-old training sale, none of that has to
00:45:04happen.
00:45:05So basically we've established that we care for the horse as long as it's at a racetrack.
00:45:11If not, it's the wild, wild west.
00:45:14First of all, thank you so much for your insights.
00:45:18Really very well thought out.
00:45:20But let's switch gears now to you train one of the coolest horses that has run in this country over
00:45:27the last 20 years.
00:45:28Good old boy named Whitmore, who just was a wind machine.
00:45:32Fill us in on him.
00:45:33What's he been doing since his retirement?
00:45:35And how's the old boy doing?
00:45:37Well, he's got a lot of jobs.
00:45:39His main job is to keep my wife from therapy and to be a source of enjoyment.
00:45:48We basically, he lives with us at our farm in Shelbyville.
00:45:52And then when we travel to Arkansas, he comes with us here.
00:45:56And he's somewhat of a, I guess, an unofficial ambassador for retired racehorses.
00:46:03He did running as many years as he did and five years in the Breeders' Cup and, you know, four
00:46:11years or five years in all these stakes races at Oakland.
00:46:13He got some people that grew up with him and love him.
00:46:16And, you know, he's just, I guess his whole job is providing happiness.
00:46:21And that's what he does.
00:46:23And I assume that's him over your right shoulder?
00:46:25Yeah.
00:46:26That's one of the gentlemen that's, he's actually a pretty good story for us.
00:46:33The guy that took that picture with his phone had never, never been a fan of racing.
00:46:41And he is a casino manager.
00:46:46And he fell in love with Whitmore and, in turn, fell in love more with the sport.
00:46:54And he sent me this picture of the picture, a blew up picture that he took with his phone.
00:47:01And it's not, you know, it's not the greatest picture.
00:47:04I mean, there's a lot of pictures that look better for Whitmore.
00:47:06But what that picture represented was somebody, you know, as imperfect as Whitmore was.
00:47:14He didn't win all the time.
00:47:15He wasn't the smoothest, you know, character.
00:47:18He would act up and do all the stuff.
00:47:20As imperfect as he was, that's how that picture is.
00:47:23But it's also a representation that he did so much to bring people to the game.
00:47:29And horses like him, not just him.
00:47:31I love Wise Dan.
00:47:32And, you know, the horse of Greg Foley's that just retired, that's now standing stud in Indiana.
00:47:39What's his name?
00:47:40Bango.
00:47:40Bango.
00:47:41Bango.
00:47:42Yeah.
00:47:42You know, those are my hard horses.
00:47:45Those ones that stay around.
00:47:47And, you know, I had people that would say to me, you know, I saw at Saratoga Springs,
00:47:54there was a couple come up to me and said, you know, we used to schedule our trips around
00:47:58what day will Whitmore run every year.
00:48:02And, I mean, for a guy that is not Todd Pletcher, not Bob Baffert, not Graham Motion or Joe Sharp
00:48:09or whatever, for somebody to say that, that puts the emphasis back where it should be.
00:48:12It's on the horse.
00:48:13At the end of the day, we're out here doing things that's to promote the animal, the greatest
00:48:20animal that's ever lived, in my opinion.
00:48:22And whenever those kind of horses do that kind of stuff, it makes our job easier.
00:48:26Boy, we're out of time, but next time, let's give Honey Bunny a little love.
00:48:31Honey Bunny's sister friend.
00:48:35Ron has a miniature donkey that has the run of his living room.
00:48:41The donkey will come into the house and will lay down in front of the fireplace or lay on
00:48:46the couch or...
00:48:48This is a donkey we're talking about here.
00:48:50Honey Bunny.
00:48:51It's...
00:48:51She's a dandy.
00:48:54Honey Bunny.
00:48:56Very cool.
00:48:57Very good.
00:48:58Well, Ron, once again, thank you for your time.
00:49:00We'll stay tuned to what's going to happen with this LASIK decision.
00:49:04Let's pray that it's status quo.
00:49:06And let's pray that it's status quo.
00:49:09And to my knowledge, there hasn't been anything decided.
00:49:12I know that I'm on the HASS advisory board.
00:49:15I'll ask them again today, but I see no reason for anything to change.
00:49:20And let's focus our energy towards things that could have an effect positively on our
00:49:25sport.
00:49:26Well, I will add to that that I know that the study that they've conducted has not yet,
00:49:30as we speak, been given to the nine people on the board of directors and that the vote
00:49:34will be taken on May 22nd.
00:49:37But again, Ron, thanks so much.
00:49:39You were a great guest and really cool to talk about, among other things, going down
00:49:45memory lane with Whitmore.
00:49:46Thank you for being our Gainesway Guest of the Week.
00:49:48And maybe we'll touch base with you again after this whole LASIK thing is decided.
00:49:54You guys have a good day.
00:49:55You too, Ron.
00:49:56Our Guest of the Week, Ron Moquette, was brought to you courtesy of Gainesway, the home of Seize
00:50:02the Gray.
00:50:02We're now just beginning to see Seize the Gray's first foals on the racetrack.
00:50:07He was the highest earning son of Arrowgate, thanks to his victories in the 2024 Preakness
00:50:12and Pennsylvania Derby.
00:50:14And he actually was from Arrowgate's final crop at stud.
00:50:18Seize the Gray stands at Gainesway for a fee of $25,000.
00:50:30Seize the Gray wins convincingly.
00:50:34Seize the Gray.
00:50:36He's going to seize the day in the Pennsylvania Derby.
00:50:40Seize the Gray is still there.
00:50:43Seize the Gray wins the Preakness.
00:50:54In this week's edition of First Things First, not myself, but Santanita's own Michelle Yu caught
00:51:00up with the kind of small connections of the winner of the Buena Vista in thought process.
00:51:12Just got joined by Billy Koch right now, founder and managing partner of Little Red Feather Racing, but also with
00:51:17Ben and John.
00:51:18They were going to be deputies, so I'm going to talk to them first.
00:51:20Go ahead.
00:51:20How exciting was this win for you guys?
00:51:23I'm really excited.
00:51:24Wait, are you twins because you are?
00:51:27Yeah.
00:51:27Oh my gosh.
00:51:28You guys even have the twin thing going on.
00:51:30Where did you get your cool sunnies?
00:51:31I just found the shop over there.
00:51:33Just right here.
00:51:35Also, last time you guys were here for this filly, she won the Surfer Girl, and you got to ride
00:51:39the surfboard.
00:51:40What did they let you do today?
00:51:42Did you get to hold the trophy?
00:51:43Yeah.
00:51:43Yeah, we got to hold the trophy.
00:51:45Are you going to take it home?
00:51:46Yeah, we're going to take it home.
00:51:48Look, take this too.
00:51:49Here, take it and run.
00:51:50I'm going to get some of the breath.
00:51:51We'll send that later.
00:51:52All right.
00:51:53Congratulations, you guys.
00:51:54I'm going to talk to Billy now, and you guys are amazing.
00:51:57Yeah.
00:51:57Head up to the champagne room.
00:51:58It's right behind there.
00:51:59Get yourselves an ice cold soda.
00:52:01Billy, you and I are very good friends.
00:52:03I asked you a couple weeks ago, I need the horse that's going to win a graded stake right off
00:52:08her Little Red Feather for my fantasy horse racing stable, and you said thought process.
00:52:12Without even thinking, you said she's going to have a big year.
00:52:14I mean, were you ever right?
00:52:17It's nice to be right every once in a while.
00:52:19We were on a 1 for 29 streak right there, so getting a victory is really special, especially for our
00:52:25partners, all the Little Red Feather partners, and Madiket, and Brett Jones, and Airdrie.
00:52:30I know those guys are watching right now, so I know everybody's excited to the way she came back.
00:52:35Billy, you and Collected.
00:52:36I mean, that is a partnership that is going to go down in history.
00:52:39I don't know.
00:52:40Well, he's out here in California now, so it pays to own a cow bread.
00:52:43Go see Collected.
00:52:44I'm not even getting paid for that.
00:52:46You've gotten paid plenty.
00:52:48Great job by Phil D'Amato and his team.
00:52:50They're so good at what they do, and this Philly coming off that six-month layoff and being able to
00:52:55run against what I thought was a really good field today.
00:52:58I'm just very impressed.
00:52:59I'm really happy.
00:53:00You know, here is a mile, but she's gone further before.
00:53:02Do you have your summer plans mapped out for her already?
00:53:05You know what?
00:53:06We'll discuss it with Saul and Brett and Phil and the team, but ultimately, I mean, our goal has always
00:53:12been the gamely, which is here at home, so hopefully we can get there.
00:53:15All right.
00:53:16Congratulations.
00:53:16That was a huge win today for Thought Process.
00:53:18Thank you very much.
00:53:23Good to hear from Ben, John, and Billy Koch about Thought Process and where she is going to be going,
00:53:29but I just want to remind you where you could be going next weekend.
00:53:33Friday, Saturday, Sunday, racing at Santa Anita.
00:53:37Friday kicks off with a nine-race card.
00:53:39We do have a pick-six carryover of over $45,000 pool expected to be about $400,000 after all
00:53:47is said and done.
00:53:48On Saturday, we'll have Super Saturday at Santa Anita.
00:53:52The first racing tour does continue.
00:53:54Multiple graded stakes.
00:53:56We've got the Big Cap.
00:53:57We've got the Kilro Mile.
00:53:58The San Felipe is three-year-olds take center stage, along with the grade one Beholder Mile.
00:54:04Lots to talk about at Santa Anita this coming weekend.
00:54:08Well, Randy Moss's favorite racetrack.
00:54:10And, Randy, I want you to calm down this time because you got real worked up last time when we
00:54:15had this subject.
00:54:16But Hawthorne is back in the news, and they declared bankruptcy last week.
00:54:21Dan Ross from the TDN, my colleague, has been doing a terrific job covering this.
00:54:27These kind of bankruptcy things kind of go over my head a little bit.
00:54:31You know, this is obviously not my field of expertise, but they have filed for Chapter 11.
00:54:36Now, at first glance, I thought this was going to be very bad news for Hawthorne.
00:54:42But especially based on what some of the horsemen like Chris Block said, maybe that's not necessarily the case.
00:54:48It sounds like by declaring bankruptcy, they can kind of consolidate their debts.
00:54:54They can bring in a partner.
00:54:56And Chris Block held out some hope but didn't say definitely that the meet will begin on March 29th.
00:55:07So we'll see.
00:55:08Again, it's a continuing story.
00:55:10But Hawthorne put out a press release where they basically said this is the greatest thing since sliced bread, that
00:55:16we've declared bankruptcy.
00:55:17And it's going to mean a much better future for the Chicago race.
00:55:22And we hope they're right about this because this has been, as Randy pointed out, a cluster, you know what,
00:55:30since the day they got that casino license back in 2019 and basically have done absolutely nothing when, again, using
00:55:38Randy's words, they were given a license to print money.
00:55:42Randy, again, I'm not a bankruptcy guy.
00:55:44I don't know exactly what this means.
00:55:46What do you read into it?
00:55:47I'm not a bankruptcy guy either, but I know that having a casino license is a license to print money.
00:55:52And somehow they screwed that up royally at this point.
00:55:57Look, I think a lot of people out there, when they hear bankruptcy, they immediately think, okay, the company's going
00:56:04out of business.
00:56:05That's it.
00:56:06It's done.
00:56:07It's over.
00:56:07But this is Chapter 11 bankruptcy protection.
00:56:12It's like, you know, they have a lot of, obviously, a lot of creditors out there.
00:56:16They owe the horsemen a lot of money and unpaid purses going back since August.
00:56:20They have vendors that they owe a lot of money to as well.
00:56:23And this apparently sort of gets the wolves off the door for a while and enables Hawthorne to kind of
00:56:32take a deep breath and come up with a strategy.
00:56:36I haven't had one so far about casinos, but, you know, that can work for short-term and long-term.
00:56:43So there's optimism that they'll be able to run the thoroughbred meet that was expected to start in late March.
00:56:50It may be delayed a little bit, is what I've read in the Chicago newspapers.
00:56:54But it might turn out to be a good thing that they can take a deep breath and sort of
00:57:03regroup a little bit because of this.
00:57:05Because essentially it just nullifies all debt.
00:57:09Basically, that's what they're doing.
00:57:11I mean, you look over the years at all the companies and people that have claimed bankruptcy.
00:57:16They're just fine.
00:57:17So hopefully they can move on from this.
00:57:20They do keep mentioning an entity that is going to invest.
00:57:24So maybe once this is out of the way, we can kind of find out who it is and hopefully
00:57:31they can turn the page and sort out this cluster.
00:57:34Cluster.
00:57:35I mean, I think they'll still be expected to pay back their debts.
00:57:41But to a point.
00:57:42Yeah, but what the Careys mentioned, Tim Carey, what he mentioned in the news release is that they could immediately,
00:57:53as soon as possible, begin paying off horsemen first, that horsemen would be prioritized.
00:58:00But Tim Carey is not the one that's going to make that call.
00:58:03It's going to be the bankruptcy people that are appointed that will be handling that sort of thing.
00:58:09And they'll decide who gets paid first.
00:58:13But it looks like at least maybe there's some light at the end of the tunnel if they can just,
00:58:18you know, get the casino up and running.
00:58:22That's how I should have made a point of writing this down, but I didn't think about it.
00:58:27I just want to add one more thing.
00:58:29T.D. Thornton sent us over the actual bankruptcy filing.
00:58:33And Randy and Zoe, it is staggering the amount of money they owe to their creditors.
00:58:39It's $8 million to this, $5 million to this.
00:58:42I mean, it looks like they haven't paid bills in a long, long time and owe a lot of people.
00:58:48I mean, they basically owe every racetrack in the country money because they've been simulcasting their races and haven't been
00:58:53paying their fees.
00:58:54So let's hope that this is good news for Hawthorne and good news for Chicago Racing.
00:58:59So that's one thing that's very easy to root for, that there is going to be a future at Hawthorne
00:59:04and a future in horse racing.
00:59:05Okay, so we all know what's going on in the world right now.
00:59:08And all hell broke loose, of course, when the United States and Israel bombed Iran on Saturday.
00:59:15What does that have to do with horse racing?
00:59:16Well, it does have something to do with horse racing because there's a situation going on in Dubai.
00:59:21Whereas the Iranians are not just attacking Israel, they're attacking the air bases and the allies in the Persian Gulf
00:59:30of the United States of America.
00:59:32And actually, they raced Saturday at Maidan while they were literally sending drones into Dubai to inflict damage.
00:59:42I believe one of the hotels in Dubai was hit and damaged quite a bit.
00:59:48So this is an ongoing story.
00:59:50How is it going to affect whether or not they're going to have the Dubai World Cup?
00:59:53I think that's something that everybody has to wonder about.
00:59:58With the airport closed currently, we don't know how long that's going to be closed.
01:00:03How are people going to get in and out of Dubai?
01:00:05We're already hearing stories about that.
01:00:07By the way, if you haven't seen it already, Emma Berry in the TDN wrote a terrific story talking to
01:00:14several people that were in Dubai about what the hell that is going on over there.
01:00:19My man, Jay Brissione, who owns the co-owner of Bookum Dano, I checked in with him this morning.
01:00:26I haven't written a story yet, but I think I will work on that.
01:00:29And I think this is a popular sentiment.
01:00:31They were going to go over to the sprint race, the whatever the heck it's called.
01:00:36Golden Shaheen.
01:00:38And he said, absolutely not.
01:00:40Now, he said, considering the situation, how can you possibly go over there considering what's going on?
01:00:47He also brought up another another point that he said in order to go to Dubai, you have to pay
01:00:52insurance to protect yourself from all sorts of reasons why you need insurance.
01:00:58He says the insurance policy to ship over to race in basically what is a war zone is going to
01:01:06go up so high that it would be completely impractical to pay that insurance.
01:01:12I have not had a chance to talk to some of the other American connections that might be going over
01:01:16to Dubai.
01:01:17But at this point, as we are recording this on March 2nd, which is 27 days from the Dubai World
01:01:25Cup, I think the whole thing is certainly up in the air and we'll find out what's happening.
01:01:30But a very precarious situation over there.
01:01:34And again, Randy, we'll see what happens.
01:01:37But I'm not sure they're going to run the damn thing.
01:01:41Yeah, I mean, obviously, a lot can happen just every day.
01:01:45Seemingly, the news changes a little bit.
01:01:48So, I mean, it's crossed our fingers that things stabilize a little bit, especially as it pertains to just from
01:01:55a horse racing perspective, as it pertains to Dubai.
01:01:58I mean, a lot of people are kind of wondering, you know, why are the Arabs, you know, launching missiles
01:02:08at each other?
01:02:08Why is Iran sending missiles to Dubai and the UAE and all that?
01:02:15And it's not, you know, the whole thing doesn't involve just around religion.
01:02:19But we've all heard for decades and decades about the animosity between the Sunni and the Shiite wings of the
01:02:29Muslim religion.
01:02:30And Iran are Shiites and Saudi Arabia, the sheikhs in Dubai, the Maktoum family, are Sunnis.
01:02:40So there is an inherent difference between the two philosophically.
01:02:44There's no love lost at all between Saudi Arabia and the UAE and Iran.
01:02:51And so that really complicates matters.
01:02:55And that's why they're lobbing missiles at Dubai, which seemingly, you know, didn't have a dog in the hunt to
01:03:00most people looking at it from a distance.
01:03:02Hopefully, all this can be stabilized.
01:03:04Yeah, and we're recording this on Monday.
01:03:06I believe the airspace is closed until Tuesday, 3 p.m. time as of right now.
01:03:14I know a lot of people that are stuck there, including trainers that ran horses.
01:03:19Rishi Passat is stuck over there.
01:03:21They're being told to shelter in place.
01:03:24One of the biggest hotels in Dubai got firebombed and that went alight.
01:03:30As far as I know, there haven't been any direct casualties to that.
01:03:33But a scary situation.
01:03:34And a lot of people that were there were surprised that the races took place.
01:03:39Sheikh Mohammed was on hand for the races, of course, to watch his champ, Rebels Romance, win for the 21st
01:03:46time in 31 lifetime starts.
01:03:49And one thing that he did put out there was that anyone that was stuck and stuck in a hotel,
01:03:55he was going to pay for their hotel bills and their meals during the duration of the time they're stuck
01:04:02in Dubai.
01:04:03So that was coming right from Sheikh Mohammed, which I thought was pretty amazing.
01:04:07And I know somebody in Dubai who might have the money to help offset some of the insurance costs if
01:04:13it comes down to that.
01:04:14You know, I mean, we'll see.
01:04:17You do?
01:04:17Who?
01:04:19You do?
01:04:20Come on, Randy.
01:04:22Not personally.
01:04:25Come on.
01:04:25You have Sheikh Mohammed on your speed dial.
01:04:27We know you, man.
01:04:28We know how connected you are.
01:04:31Okay.
01:04:32All right.
01:04:33On that note, we're going to take another break.
01:04:34Mike, when you come back, we're going to talk about the major races to come this weekend.
01:04:38Stay with us here on the TDN Riders Room.
01:04:43And this podcast is also brought to you by the PHBA, the Pennsylvania Horse Breeders Association.
01:04:49This is the time of year when horsemen begin shopping at two-year-old sales.
01:04:53So consider this a potentially valuable reminder.
01:04:56Let's just say for the purposes of this discussion that you buy a Pennsylvania bred two-year-old and you
01:05:03decide to run in a maiden special weight race at Parks.
01:05:05The listed purse of $50,000 becomes $70,000 for your horse thanks to the Pennsylvania bred owner bonus.
01:05:15So that's a $42,000 winner's share for any Pennsylvania bred as opposed to the usual $30,000.
01:05:23And then, of course, there's all those Pennsylvania bred stakes races we told you about last week.
01:05:27So if you want to learn more about the Pennsylvania breeding program or the stakes schedule, visit www.pabred.com
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01:06:36With First TV.
01:06:40It is time for the First TV Work of the Week, brought to you by First TV.
01:06:44On the Work tab last Saturday, as he aims toward a start in Saturday's San Felipe, was in Trepido.
01:06:51The Jeff Mullins trainee was second in the Robert B. Lewis stakes on February the 7th in his three-year
01:06:57-old debut.
01:06:58Here he is drilling five furlongs in 102 and 2.
01:07:01Now, if you're watching this work, you're like, eh, eh.
01:07:04Does he look that great?
01:07:05This is him.
01:07:06He can turn it on.
01:07:07He can turn it off.
01:07:08He works solo here under jockey Hector Berrios.
01:07:11And I thought he looked really, really good.
01:07:14In Trepido last year won the Grade 1 American Pharoah at Santa Anita prior to a fifth-place finish in
01:07:21the Bruders' Cup Juvenile at Del Mar.
01:07:23Well, there's two major Kentucky Derby preps to be run this weekend, the San Felipe at Santa Anita and the
01:07:29Tampa Bay Derby at Tampa Bay Downs.
01:07:31Of course, there's a huge card at Santa Anita, which also includes the Santa Anita Handicap.
01:07:36I'm trying to do this without past performances being out for either race yet, which is not an easy thing
01:07:43to do.
01:07:43But we are recording this on Monday.
01:07:45So if we start touting a horse that has scratched or doesn't run, we have a built-in excuse.
01:07:51But the San Felipe looks loaded.
01:07:54So happy the winner of the San Vicente.
01:07:56Brant, third in the Breeders' Cup Juvenile, making his a three-year-old debut for Bob Baffert.
01:08:03Potente, another Baffert horse who broke his maiden last time out.
01:08:06And Intrepido, who has been very consistent for Jeff Mullins.
01:08:11Zoe, you always have your sources in Southern California and on top of these things.
01:08:17Tell us about the San Felipe.
01:08:19What are you expecting?
01:08:20And can you make an early pick in that race?
01:08:22You definitely named the top four in there.
01:08:26I was actually kind of interested to see Brant was going in this race.
01:08:32He'll likely be the speed of the speed for Hall of Famer Bob Baffert.
01:08:36So happy he's a good horse for Mark Glatt.
01:08:39Had a really good work just a couple of days ago with Hall of Famer Mike Smith aboard.
01:08:43Probably the best he's ever worked over the strip.
01:08:46And Potente, my good friend Moret Farrell, of course, she purchased him.
01:08:50So I'm just a tad bit biased.
01:08:51He'll get to stretch out for the first time around two turns, which is exactly what he wants to do.
01:08:57He kind of broke his maiden in workman-like fashion.
01:09:01And I know the team has high hopes for him going around two turns.
01:09:04So that's probably going to be the highlight for the San Felipe, for me at least.
01:09:09And Intrepido, we saw his work.
01:09:11He's just a cool dude who you could literally do anything with.
01:09:14I'm pretty sure you could put a three-year-old on his back if you wanted to.
01:09:18I want to turn our attention to the Tampa Bay Derby now.
01:09:21This is a really good race.
01:09:23I think this is one of the most underrated Kentucky Derby prep races that there are.
01:09:30And we have in here two very interesting horses, both of whom that could make a lot of noise on
01:09:36the road to the Kentucky Derby.
01:09:37And that's only mentioning two out of the field that's going to be pretty strong.
01:09:41We haven't heard from further ado since he won the Kentucky Jockey Club back in the fall, owned by Spencer
01:09:48Farm.
01:09:48Had that huge win where he ran off the screen to win by many, many lengths in a maiden race
01:09:54before that.
01:09:55He will be making his three-year-old debut in there.
01:09:57And how about Canaletto, the Chad Brown horse who broke his maiden by eight lengths and was extremely impressive in
01:10:06his first start.
01:10:07So, Randy, the Tampa Bay Derby looks like it's going to come up pretty strong.
01:10:12And, again, I'll throw it to you to see what you have to think about that.
01:10:15Yeah, it's not – unfortunately, it's not a 100-point race to the winner in terms of Derby points because
01:10:22it is one of the best Derby preps, I think, that we've seen so far.
01:10:26I think it comes down to Canaletto, who I mentioned earlier, along with Paladin, trained by Chad Brown.
01:10:33More on that a second because I left out a very important horse.
01:10:36It's going to come down to me between Canaletto and a maiden who is being entered in the Tampa Bay
01:10:43Derby by trainer Todd Pletcher by the name of Power Shift.
01:10:47Now, when we go back and we talk about the – I think it was the Sam Davis that was
01:10:54run at Tampa Bay Downs.
01:10:55And earlier on the Sam Davis card, there was a maiden race at a mile and 40 yards, and it
01:11:00was won by a horse named Emerging Market over Power Shift after an affirmed and Aladar-style stretch battle for
01:11:09the final quarter of a mile that took them, I think, 13 lengths ahead of the rest of the field.
01:11:15And the winning buyer for Emerging Market was conservatively put at 96, okay?
01:11:23Emerging Market is going to win the Louisiana Derby.
01:11:27That's going to be his next start.
01:11:29He might be better than Paladin or Canaletto.
01:11:33And he is a very good horse, and he might turn out to be Chad Brown's best derby contender.
01:11:39So Emerging Market is going to win the Louisiana Derby, and the horse he beat that's still a maiden Power
01:11:44Shift could very well win the Tampa Bay Derby.
01:11:48I think it's going to come down to those two.
01:11:51I like both of those better than I like further ado because his last race at Kentucky I thought was
01:11:58okay, but not nearly as good as his debut.
01:12:03Well, Mike Rapoli will be on hand because he owns Power Shift.
01:12:07Maybe we could get him on next week, guys, if he wins.
01:12:10How about that?
01:12:11I know Bill will be looking forward to that.
01:12:13Power Shift, yeah.
01:12:15He wasn't on my radar whatsoever, so I'll be looking forward to that.
01:12:20But then if we got Rapoli on, we'd have to give the Jockey Club equal time, and we'd have a
01:12:24seven-hour podcast.
01:12:25Let's do it.
01:12:26Let's do it.
01:12:27Okay.
01:12:28But anyways, and obviously Mike Rapoli always making news, and somebody who is-
01:12:36Hey, he's shaking it up.
01:12:37I love it.
01:12:38He is shaking it up.
01:12:39Yes, he is.
01:12:40He's good.
01:12:41Well, it's a subject for another day, but tone it down a little bit, Mike.
01:12:46He's got people talking.
01:12:47There's a lot going on right now, and it's all because Mike the disruptor started disrupting.
01:12:53Well, he is a disruptor.
01:12:56That's no doubt about that.
01:12:58Another of our fine sponsors is West Point Thoroughbreds, which enjoyed a breakthrough win at Gulf Stream Park Sunday with
01:13:04Sansone, a four-year-old Uncle Mo Colt that won his season debut by six and three-quarters lengths with
01:13:11an 88 buyer.
01:13:12Sansone is a half-brother to champion Midnight Bizou, trained by Shook McGehee, and he was ridden by Joel Rosario.
01:13:20Meanwhile, also on Sunday at Oakland, West Point's Counting Stars rebounded in a big way in the Honeybee Stakes for
01:13:27three-year-old Phillies.
01:13:28Counting Stars was bearing down on even-money favorite Explora through the stretch, but came up just three-quarters of
01:13:34a length short with a career-best 87 buyer's speed figure that puts her right in the hunt now on
01:13:41the road to the Kentucky Oaks.
01:13:42West Point and Bloodstock agent David Ngordo are the ones that picked out the multiple stakes winning Counting Stars for
01:13:49$150,000 last spring at OBS, and they'll be on the hunt again at next week's OBS March sale of
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01:14:07Experience the power of the partnership.
01:14:13Change your life, make new friends, and compete at the highest level of thoroughbred racing.
01:14:20West Point Thoroughbreds, the gold standard in racing partnerships.
01:14:24Visit westpointtv.com.
01:14:28So that's a wrap on this week's TDN Writer's Room podcast.
01:14:31I want to thank my co-hosts, Zoe Cabman, and Randy Moss.
01:14:35I want to thank our Gainsway Guest of the Week, Ron Moquette.
01:14:38And I want to thank our producers and directors who worked behind the scenes to make this podcast look so
01:14:43good when it comes out.
01:14:45That's Sue Finley, Katie Petruniak, Ante LaRocca, and Aaliyah LaRocca.
01:14:49Enjoy the San Felipe.
01:14:50Enjoy the Big Cap.
01:14:51Enjoy the Tampa Bay Derby.
01:14:53Should be another great week of racing as we get closer and closer to the big day of the Kentucky
01:14:59Derby.
01:15:00Thanks again for tuning in, for viewing us.
01:15:02We'll talk to you next week.
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