Donna Barton Brothers Talks Preakness on TDN Writers' Room

thoroughbreddailynews

The TDN Writers' Room crew sits down ahead of this weekend's GI Preakness Stakes to handicap the race, but also lament the quality of the field. Is the Triple Crown starting to lose its relevance? Later, Donna Barton Brothers joins the show on her last Triple Crown trail as an NBC racing analyst.

Transcript

00:00:17welcome to another edition of the tdn writers room podcast let's call this the preakness edition

00:00:23as obviously we'll be previewing what's coming up on saturday at laurel not pimico boy that still

00:00:29sounds strange once again we are going to be talking about the second leg of the triple crown

00:00:34and my name is bill finley i'm a correspondent for the thoroughbred daily news

00:00:40my name is randy moss with nbc sports and the buyer's speed figure team you don't have my usual

00:00:46uh kick-ass library background or dog background i'm in a different background just like zoe is

00:00:53this week i'm at a hotel room in baltimore getting ready for uh obviously for preakness

00:01:00zoe capman here with first racing and first tv i am also gearing up for preakness but i'm here

00:01:06at phasic tipton sales ground it is exactly 5 16 p.m and we just got done on day one

00:01:13of the breeze show

00:01:14the preview show the untimed show uh with our nine sets everything went spiffy uh it was a really good

00:01:22day thus far just long because they've shortened it to two days and by the time you see this you'll

00:01:28know all about it well just like we did for the derby we'll do a rundown horse for horse of

00:01:35uh who's

00:01:36running in the preakness we'll get some picks out of our team but before we get into that we have

00:01:41to

00:01:41talk about the story before the preakness and i don't want to pile on this race because that's

00:01:47what everybody's doing but you can't sugarcoat it this is not a very good horse race and that is

00:01:53being i think kind we found out after our podcast last week golden tempo the kentucky derby winner is

00:01:59not going to run that was absolutely no surprise uh whatsoever we were then hoping that um cruise

00:02:05velocity that very fast pat day mile winner might run bob baffert decided not to do that silently

00:02:11tactic he looked like he might be a top contender for the uh preakness he was taken out of the

00:02:16race

00:02:17so what we're left with is a field of four uh 14 in here um with no stars uh the

00:02:24morning line

00:02:24favored is the nine to two horse iron honor coming in for chad brown um we have only three horses

00:02:30coming

00:02:31out of the kentucky derby one of them will selly was 70 to one robusta was 70 to one he's

00:02:36coming back

00:02:36and incredible it was 23 to one but we could have seen this coming i don't think anybody is that

00:02:42surprised you've heard our team talk over the years about the problems with the triple crown how can it

00:02:47be fixed so i'll start with you randy what is going on with the triple crown and unfortunately

00:02:52are we starting to see this wonderful series that is is as meaningful as anything there is in horse

00:03:00racing maybe even more so than the kentucky derby itself is it starting to lose its relevance

00:03:06starting to lose it's been losing its relevance this is something that's been going on for quite

00:03:11a while it's nothing new it's nothing surprising i mean we've been talking about it for a long time

00:03:18it's broken triple crown's broken you know i mean i don't want to sound like a broken record because

00:03:23i go on and on and on and on about this like i have for literally believe it or not

00:03:2720 years i could

00:03:29see the handwriting on the wall i could see it coming but it wasn't just me it was pretty it

00:03:32was pretty

00:03:33easy to see bottom line and again i'm not going to go overboard on it the bottom line is that

00:03:39any business any sport that does not adapt to changing circumstances is doomed to fail

00:03:51any business and horse racing horse racing is no different baseball has look at all the changes

00:03:58baseball has made um when it looked like it might be losing a little bit of fan interest the nfl's

00:04:03constantly making changes and and sometimes not so minor changes this particular change in the triple crown

00:04:11in in the spacing of the races would be really honestly it would be a tweak it wouldn't be an

00:04:18overhaul

00:04:19it would be it it would be a tweak of the dates to you know to once again come up

00:04:26with a scenario

00:04:27where the very best three-year-olds run in all three of the triple crown races not just two

00:04:32which we haven't had now for quite some time if something's broke you got to fix it it's simple

00:04:39it's not complicated but for some reason i think we know what the reasons are uh thoroughbred racing has

00:04:46been very very slow not to recognize it but to act upon it everything he said and more it's not

00:04:57just

00:04:57broken it's been chewed up spit on spat out thrown up it's done it's absolutely done and actually a

00:05:07credit to the people at laurel this year's preakness is going to be a very very good race indeed it's

00:05:12going

00:05:12to be a good betting race it's a full field so full credit to them and kudos to three kentucky

00:05:19derby

00:05:19horses that ran in there for coming back to to run in it it's going to be a very good

00:05:23race but it is

00:05:24lacking the stars and the reason it's lacking the stars is purely because of the spacing it's just as

00:05:30simple as that the triple crown is not even broken it's just been dismembered it's done

00:05:40wow that's some frank talk from my uh panelists but i unfortunately uh agree with you and it just

00:05:46is we're all racing fans and saddens me so much but i i think the thing is and and randy

00:05:52already spoke

00:05:52about this so he spoke about it can be fixed this is not something that is beyond i mean the

00:05:58solution

00:05:58is so obvious i mean there's dave johnson who i've been working with for for 40 years

00:06:05even he has finally come around he was the last holdout that's really we're never really never

00:06:11going to change this nope after he saw what happened this year he's on board our team randy

00:06:16and this is one of the last few people that i know of in prominence in horse racing that was

00:06:21still

00:06:21saying you can't change the tradition so the answer is obvious space the races out much further than

00:06:28they're spaced out now some people say put four weeks between the races what i would do would be put

00:06:33run them on the first saturday in may the first saturday in june and the first saturday in july

00:06:37that would mean some years there would be as uh depending on the calendar there would be as many as

00:06:42nine weeks in between races all right zoe i'll start with you because randy picked it up do you see

00:06:47that

00:06:47happening and what needs to happen to make needs to get done to make that happen i see it happening

00:06:55for

00:06:55sure it has to happen i think everyone's in agreement it's just a question of who wants to give up

00:07:01their slice of the pie it's a question of having three different tracks and entities work together

00:07:08and we've seen time and time not just in horse racing but in any sport people hate to work together

00:07:12people want to keep their pie and keep it all to themselves you're not having any of mine

00:07:17people have to acquiesce they have to give up a slice of the pie for the greater good of the

00:07:22game

00:07:22and hopefully sheree devoe ducking the derby has done horse racing a favor bill mott ducking the derby

00:07:31was a big red light for everybody last year and a lot of people already have an asterisk by sovereignty

00:07:37shoulda coulda shoulda woulda won the triple crown we don't know about golden temper we never will

00:07:42but it it's just the people that people see as horsemen and horsewomen ducking the triple crown

00:07:49has all of a sudden brought a red light that something has to change so i hope everyone can

00:07:55agree to get along and get something figured out whether it's tv rights whatever it is just do it

00:08:02for the good of the sport think about the bigger picture

00:08:07yeah and that's she didn't come out and say it but that's addressed to new york

00:08:11to the new york racing association and i can understand they're the only ones

00:08:16they're the only reason why the triple crown spacing hasn't already been changed

00:08:21because they initially refused to do it um and i can understand why i'm a fan of the new york

00:08:28racing

00:08:29association i think david o'err does a fantastic job they've done an unbelievable job with saratoga

00:08:34saratoga uh they've they've really done so many good things and with martin panza they've

00:08:43orchestrated now a belmont stakes undercard belmont stakes weekend that to me is the best racing in

00:08:51america aside from the breeders cup weekend it's just phenomenal and they don't want to mess with that

00:08:58and then it also bleeds into saratoga you've got to change the saratoga stake schedule as well

00:09:03and so far i think that's been a bridge too far for naira they've talked about oh well maybe we'll

00:09:12move the preakness maybe we'll agree to move it one week to three weeks which i think we've talked

00:09:17about before won't really move the needle much at all it's got to be more than that but at some

00:09:23point

00:09:23as zoe pointed out you've got to show leadership and put the best interests of the sport ahead of your

00:09:32own best interests and it's not like it's not like the new york racing association would implode

00:09:37if they have to change their stake schedule i mean stake schedules are changed all the time it was

00:09:43changed to make it what it is today they can change it and tweak it and and make it just

00:09:48fine i mean

00:09:49they've got a lot to work with there but the triple crown is first and foremost it's the most

00:09:54important property in thoroughbred racing the triple crown and the breeders cup that's it

00:09:59and it's really the only two mega properties that their red racing has saratoga del mar places like

00:10:06that but events it's the triple crown and it's the breeders cup and you have to take care of them

00:10:12when they're broken you have to fix them so zoe if i had uh david or work on this podcast

00:10:18today and

00:10:19maybe we will get him on in the future i have had a series of questions that i from a

00:10:24reporting

00:10:24standpoint i'd like to have him asked there naira is usually really good about getting o'rourke and

00:10:29and he's not hiding or anything but i haven't been able to pin that down but here's what i would

00:10:32ask

00:10:33him if he were on this podcast david don't you realize that by what's going on right now

00:10:39the new york racing association is virtually giving up on all chance of having a horse going for the

00:10:45triple crown in the belmont stakes now randy's right they have done a fantastic job with the belmont

00:10:52card i agree next to the breeders cup it's the single best best card of racing in the sport

00:10:57but it is what it is it's a great day of racing it's not anywhere close to what happens when

00:11:04a

00:11:04horse goes for the triple crown that's when everybody and their brother is asking the other

00:11:09three of us who do you like in the belmont can the so-and-so win it again can he

00:11:13sweep the triple

00:11:14crown and you know the the race if it's won by the triple crown winner gets on sports illustrated

00:11:19the cover of sports illustrated shouldn't naira also start to realize this is just one person's

00:11:26opinion but i think they are also paying the price for this by and i think randy's right by their

00:11:32stubbornness to refuse to move the race and they've been through this once before if you remember way

00:11:39back a long time ago with the breeders cup before the breeders cup came in in 1984 naira's fall

00:11:46championship series was essentially he determined the chance the horse of the year almost every year

00:11:52the best horses from california from southern california would ship across country to run in

00:11:58the jockey club gold cup and some of those other major stakes races and then the breeders cup came along

00:12:03and sort of upended that and suddenly all those races that used to be championship races became

00:12:10for the most part breeders cup preps and i think you know naira would can sort of see that happening

00:12:17again and that may be part of the uh part of the reluctance i don't know well one of the

00:12:23things we

00:12:23don't know at this point is who is going to have the rights to the 2027 preakness the top candidates

00:12:29are the obvious ones nbc and uh fox network even talking about talking to netflix oh please don't make

00:12:36that be the new home of the preakness that that doesn't work for me at all but randy i mean

00:12:40obviously since you're a member of the uh you know the tv establishment and uh have your ear to the

00:12:46ground of what's going on can the tv rights however they are settled could that have an impact on the

00:12:52future of the triple crown spacing no i mean i look i i think it's pretty well known that the

00:13:00television

00:13:00rights that nbc holds right now are up after the 2026 running of the preakness and nbc wants to renew

00:13:09them badly fox wants to get the preakness badly just like it has the belmont stakes now and i think

00:13:16it's been out there in the media that uh as part of the negotiations naira has said we will move

00:13:25the

00:13:25belmont stakes to create more spacing only if fox is awarded the preakness otherwise we'll keep it

00:13:34where it is it's a negotiating ploy it's business now you can make the case that they're maybe playing

00:13:41games with the number one property in horse racing the triple crown that they shouldn't be doing that

00:13:47it depends on what your opinion is of that but you know whoever gets the tv rights whoever gets this

00:13:54this has got to be changed the spacing has to be changed it really should be irrelevant

00:14:00who's actually broadcasting the races um it's got to be done the tdn writer's room is brought to you

00:14:09by keeneland congratulations to keeneland september graduate growth equity winner of the grade three

00:14:15peter pan stakes at aqueduct on saturday cult was bred by stone farms and is owned by seth clareman

00:14:20trainer chad brown has expressed some reservations about tackling the belmont's mile and a quarter

00:14:25distance and may instead point the colt to the grade one haskell at monmouth park on july 18th

00:14:31we'll be right back after this message from keeneland we do this so your granddaughter can work on a farm

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00:15:06always by the fast sires at winstar farm such as nashville who had his first winner this week when

00:15:15tegrado took home a maiden special weight by five lengths you'll recall that nashville a brilliantly

00:15:22fast son of spitestown set that track record at keeneland that we've talked about six furlongs 107.89

00:15:29on breeders cup day in 2020 even faster than the breeders cup sprint the same day nearly a second

00:15:37faster than whitmore ran in that race his time was 108.61 nashville as fast as he is looks like

00:15:44his

00:15:44offspring are going to be fast too he stands at winstar farm for a fee twelve thousand five hundred

00:15:50dollars fastest horse of the week ran pretty darn fast on may the 5th tuesday at parks racing who was

00:15:59in an optional claiming allowance race in his name otter mischief making his 18th career start

00:16:05four-year-old colt by maximus mischief won that race by eight and three quarters lengths running a

00:16:12mile and a 16th and 143.73 over a track that wasn't very fast at all his previous high buyer

00:16:20was 95 so

00:16:21he tops that by 11 points otter mischief owned by silver trail stables trained by guadalupe preciato

00:16:28was ridden by paco lopez and his buyer speed figure 106 otter mischief our fastest horse of the week

00:16:43welcome in now our gainsway guests of the week and it's a familiar figure to anybody who's been

00:16:47watching the nbc coverage of the kentucky derby preakness and breeders cup over these last 26 years

00:16:53it's donna barton brothers and donna thanks so much for uh joining us on what will be your last

00:17:00ever appearance on nbc when you go out with the 2026 preakness now uh i had thought at first maybe

00:17:08the derby was going to be your last appearance and if so boy did you go out with a bang

00:17:12and i know we've

00:17:13got a lot of other things to cover but i want to get right to this first come on how'd

00:17:17you come up

00:17:17with golden tempo to be your pick and none of the other experts randy moss or any of the my

00:17:24god they got

00:17:24picks from about 18 19 different people only you donna how'd you do it okay well first of all i

00:17:30have to say i'm honored to be on it took me working for 26 years and then retiring to get

00:17:35on the tdn

00:17:36writer's room podcast so whatever it takes honored to be here i listen to you guys every single week so

00:17:42thanks for having me um and thank you for asking that bill because you know on nbc we get 10

00:17:48seconds

00:17:49to talk about who we like and why and i thought about it all day like what am i going

00:17:54to tell them

00:17:55about why i like this horse because the story was long and so given the walkover with sheree and the

00:18:01way that went randy can tell you um i don't maybe three days prior to that i had picked golden

00:18:06tempo as

00:18:07my horse in the meeting so but given the um climate of the walkover and how sheree was i decided

00:18:15to just

00:18:15say look i'm going to root for the female to win the kentucky derby i'm taking golden tempo but

00:18:20what had actually happened was that i saw him train on tuesday morning of derby week

00:18:25and i thought he looked a little heavy he was robust big beautiful good looking horse but i thought he

00:18:31might be just a touch heavy so i went by sheree's barn to confirm the walkover to see who was

00:18:37going to

00:18:37be walking with her and i got lucky and walked up on a conversation between her and dave grinning

00:18:41from the daily racing forum and dave was asking her how he had done in six weeks since the louisiana

00:18:47derby and she said you know i finally got a chance to tighten the screws on him a bit that

00:18:52all of his

00:18:53other races have been a month apart and i finally got six weeks between races and i've had some two

00:18:59really really good works in him a couple of maintenance works and so after dave grinning left i was like

00:19:05are you saying that he might have come up short in his last couple races and she said oh yeah

00:19:10that's what i'm saying and so we knew that the top buyer speed figures were 98 100 and 106 and

00:19:17i thought

00:19:18all three of those horses could regress that was commandment further ado and um renegade and he had

00:19:25paired 291 buyer speed figures and i thought if he jumps forward and these other three regress i think

00:19:31he has a chance to win this race so that's the real reason why i picked him but i couldn't

00:19:36say all that

00:19:37in 10 seconds on nbc

00:19:41well i'm glad to know you get 10 seconds i only get six or seven now i'm gonna have to

00:19:45use that to my

00:19:46advantage next time but um look i mean you did i mean you had a fantastic final derby show what's

00:19:54new

00:19:55we've been working together for 15 years and there's something i thought about that i there's

00:19:59probably a lot of things i don't know about you obviously but here's something that i i'm surprised

00:20:03it i don't know i know you were a jockey obviously i know you're in tv how'd you get from

00:20:09point a to

00:20:10point b oh that's a good question so um randy when i retired in 1998 obviously you know i married

00:20:18frank

00:20:18brothers and we were headed to new orleans for the winter uh for the fairgrounds meet and brian

00:20:24kranz the owner of the racetrack called and asked me if i would interview the winning connections of the

00:20:29stakes races just after the stakes races just the winning connections so just be a weekend thing and

00:20:35i was like sure how hard that could that be right i've been on tv i've done lots of interviews

00:20:39and so

00:20:40i remember the first time it was like time for me to interview somebody i was like wait a second

00:20:44i

00:20:44don't know how to ask questions i know how to answer questions right and so there was a little bit

00:20:50of a transition period and so i started to learn how to ask questions um i guess you had to

00:20:56start by

00:20:57knowing uh thinking that you knew the answer to these questions that you were asking right so like

00:21:02let's say i'm asking somebody when did you realize you had the race one and i watched the race i

00:21:06could

00:21:07tell they had it one at the quarter pole but then maybe they say something that surprised me even right

00:21:11like well i didn't know till i hit the finish line because this horse hangs a lot i didn't know

00:21:16that and

00:21:16so i started to learn how to ask questions and then when i came back to churchill downs for the

00:21:22spring

00:21:22meet john asher approached me because he had been promoted to vice president and he could no longer

00:21:28do the handicapping show with mike pataglia and so he asked me if i was interested in doing the on

00:21:33-air

00:21:34commentary and and handicapping from the paddock and so that's where i was in uh two was it yeah

00:21:402000 when mbc came to survey for the kentucky derby abc still had it that year so they were going

00:21:48to get

00:21:48the following year unbeknownst to me they needed a reporter on horseback and mike pataglia and tom

00:21:55hammond had told them to watch me and thank god mike pataglia and tom hammond didn't tell me that

00:22:01because i would have been crazy nervous but i just did what i always did and by the time they

00:22:07were

00:22:08getting ready to leave they asked me about their team so i was really just right place right time

00:22:15very very cool so sister from another mister randy you i can't tell you how many times i've been

00:22:21called donna which i'll take as a compliment maybe donna may not take it as a compliment

00:22:25sometimes if it's you know i might be holding a beer as a compliment every time

00:22:31i'm holding a beer in the afternoon and someone comes up and says hey donna how are you and i'm

00:22:36like

00:22:37oh no i'm not donna i put my beer down over here but um

00:22:40so donna it's great to have you on and you've really done a terrific job i'm so glad we could

00:22:47talk to you um what has been the most challenging thing about riding a horse and doing the interviews

00:22:53for nbc we'll get to the most challenging interviews a little bit later but what is the

00:22:58one most challenging thing that makes it so such a unique job first of all i'd say the easiest thing

00:23:05for me is to be on horseback and so from the beginning to do things from horseback because if

00:23:12i was standing there doing a hit i would think like oh wait i have the microphone here what do

00:23:19i do

00:23:19with this hand do i put it in my pocket do i like lean against the rail do i act

00:23:22cool like bob costas like

00:23:24i didn't know what to do with my other extremities if i wasn't on a horse and so when i

00:23:28was on a horse

00:23:29all that nervous energy was taken because i was riding horse but i would say the most challenging

00:23:35thing and people don't realize this is that you really do have to be able to ride and zoe i

00:23:40think

00:23:40you've done this before too and so the riding has to be second nature to you and you don't really

00:23:47think about that if you really do know how to ride but if you don't know how to ride it's

00:23:52gonna

00:23:54donna when i've talked to you over the years and julie crone linda rice and and so many of the

00:23:59female people in the sport who have done so well so many of them say the same thing we don't

00:24:04want to

00:24:04be known as good female jockeys or good female trainers we want to be known as good jockeys good

00:24:11trainers period and i imagine and you can correct me if you're wrong if that's maybe the same way you

00:24:16think but i want to know what your mother thinks about this as everybody knows she's still well

00:24:21and alive at age 81 and she was the person along with barbara joe rubin and so many others like

00:24:28diane crump who broke down the barrier so that you and zoe could have great careers as jockeys

00:24:34and so that female trainers and and jockeys in this sport are now not maybe as accepted as much as

00:24:41maybe

00:24:41some people would like but certainly do get their chances have you talked to her about this and you

00:24:46know what has she had to say about this well i'm going to tell you a story about my

00:24:51mother when she started riding in 1969 she was one of that first wave one of the first half dozen

00:24:56women to be licensed and the media had a tendency at that time to want to refer to the female

00:25:02jockeys

00:25:02as jockettes and my mother didn't like that at all um she said you know a kitchenette is a smaller

00:25:10less um practical or less you know grand version of a kitchen and jockettes are not smaller less grand

00:25:17versions of jockeys we are all jockeys and one reporter who was a female reporter continued

00:25:23to refer to her as a jockette and so she said i'm going to stop everybody now i would only

00:25:28like

00:25:28questions from the reporters the reporter ads can wait until later so she let it be known how she felt

00:25:39about that um so in any event she one of the things that she said to me in recent years

00:25:46bill is that

00:25:46she's really surprised there's not more female jockeys she's said i would have thought that every

00:25:52other jockey would be a female by now and i explained to her and i think i'm right about this

00:25:57but i might

00:25:58just be making it up that we don't really live in an agrarian society anymore and meanwhile there's a lot

00:26:04of latinos all around the world who grow up riding horses they've got phenomenal jockey schools in

00:26:10places like mexico and puerto rico for that matter even japan and we don't really have that here

00:26:16anymore so if you grow up riding horses here and you're a young female you probably come from a

00:26:22family with some money and your family is going to expect for you to get a college education before

00:26:26you go on to do whatever it is that you do and if you're smart you become a doctor or

00:26:32a lawyer and

00:26:32then you buy horses as pleasure horses and so mom is surprised by that but as far as sheree deboe

00:26:38winning

00:26:39the kentucky derby i think um so we're filming this on a tuesday so on monday of this week uh

00:26:46mayor

00:26:46craig greenberg invited sheree deboe and i to louisville to the the i guess it was city hall i'm not

00:26:53sure really where we were but um we were honored uh by mayor greenberg and my mother was there and

00:27:01so it i think it meant a lot to my mom to be there when mayor greenberg introduced me he

00:27:07said

00:27:07that i've won a little over 1100 races and so when it was my turn to go up and speak

00:27:12i said that

00:27:13while it's true that i won over 1100 races it is also true that my mother won over 1200 races

00:27:20and

00:27:20she's here and thank you mom and i think it meant a lot to her to be there to to

00:27:25see that uh to be

00:27:28acknowledged but also to see a female win the kentucky derby um i think she expected more progress

00:27:33sooner though bill to answer your question so you won 1100 races you have i think correct me if i'm

00:27:41wrong you're the only member of the nbc broadcast crew that has covered every kentucky derby that nbc

00:27:48has done why why now why are you hanging it up now you're you're clearly on top of your game

00:27:57so

00:28:00what was the determining factors involved there well thank you for that randy thinking i'm on top of my

00:28:06game i don't always feel that way um you know i know i don't look a day over 70 but

00:28:11i did turn 60 in

00:28:12april and um you know i was 42 years old when charlsey canny retired and she was 60 and i

00:28:19remember

00:28:19thinking um wow she retires she's still so good at what she does and people love her and then when

00:28:27i

00:28:27hit 52 i thought i don't think i can make it to 60 and then a couple years later i

00:28:33realized i don't have

00:28:33to if i don't want to um the fact is i love it and you know i love it randy

00:28:38we all love it but i think

00:28:40what people don't realize is that what they see us do is the one percent of what we do i've

00:28:45heard you

00:28:45say before that 80 of the stuff you know never makes the air and what they don't realize is the

00:28:52five to six hours a day we spend in front of the computer making sure that we're ready for those

00:28:58big

00:28:58races and since 2020 a lot of our shows went into the studio and i'm not in those shows that

00:29:05are in the

00:29:05studio and so i think it was in 2023 we lost the belmont stakes and we lost the kentucky three

00:29:11-day

00:29:11event and it took me down to three shows a year and that's just the way it is that's nobody's

00:29:16fault

00:29:17i mean nbc has been great to me and i've loved doing it but when it got to be the

00:29:22point where i felt

00:29:23like i was working a whole lot more than i was getting to do the shows that we love to

00:29:27do i started

00:29:28to think maybe it's time and also turning 60 made it feel like it was time and i think pretty

00:29:34much

00:29:34everybody listening to this podcast knows my husband and my husband's 19 and a half years

00:29:39older than i am and i want to have a nice retirement together i want us to be able to

00:29:45spend some really

00:29:46good quality time together and i think we're both still lucid and able to do that and it just felt

00:29:51like a good time to move on where are you gonna miss the most what are you yeah what are

00:29:56you gonna

00:29:56miss and what are you gonna do with your free time all right oh i'm gonna miss the people at

00:30:02the

00:30:02track you know i love going to the track derby week talking to everybody about their horses

00:30:06now if i go talk to people about their horses on derby week i'm just some nosy girl who used

00:30:11to be

00:30:11a reporter right so i'm gonna miss that um but i'll spend more time outside um you know the other

00:30:20day

00:30:20frankie and i went to the michael jackson movie and it's so good why didn't i ever it's so good

00:30:26and i thought why didn't i ever go see michael jackson in concert and then i realized it's

00:30:32because i was busy as a jockey at that time um i started riding in 1987 he hit his peak

00:30:37in the late

00:30:3880s early 90s and i was just busy nose to the grindstone i couldn't even think about going to

00:30:44see movies and i feel like i've been busy for the last 26 years covering horse racing and so i'm

00:30:50looking forward to not being busy and uh just getting centered in nature and spending time with

00:30:56my family who knows maybe i'll get bored in a week maybe i'll get bored in a month and if

00:31:00i need

00:31:00something to do i'm sure i'll find something to do but that'll be a nice problem for me to have

00:31:05can you can you talk a little bit about andy i i believe she's going to take over from you

00:31:11that's another thing that made me start to feel increasingly comfortable with it i think andy

00:31:16does a great job um i saw a post the other day that by the sports business journal and i

00:31:22think

00:31:22there were something like 459 comments and it was about andy being cone who would be stepping into that

00:31:28role and i didn't read all 459 comments but i scrolled through it and i didn't see one negative

00:31:34thing about andy everybody in there was so excited that this young lady would be taking that position so

00:31:40anybody who's seen her on fan duel tv knows she's passionate about the sport um she's you know

00:31:46the daughter of a horse trainer she knows how to ride she gallops horses in the morning

00:31:49she's engaged to keith asmussen steve asmussen's son uh i know steve asmussen loves her and steve

00:31:57steve doesn't love anybody right so he respects her as as both the horse horse woman and also

00:32:05is looking forward to having her as his um future daughter-in-law and i think she's going to be

00:32:11great

00:32:11and it's just time and you know people say donna everybody's going to miss you and my answer is

00:32:16you'll miss me for five minutes and then you'll see andy being cone and she'll do such a great job

00:32:21and next thing you know you'll be like andy just does a great job so donna two-part question for

00:32:28you first of all start by the easy one who have been some of your most favorite people to interview

00:32:34after big races well i would have to say one of my favorite interviews was interviewing mike smith

00:32:40after he won the triple crown on justify and the reason why i didn't say victor espinoza after he won

00:32:46the triple crown on american pharaoh was nothing against victor espinoza um and that was a great

00:32:53thing to be a part of to to witness you know the 37 year wait is over and to be

00:32:57there but to be fair

00:32:59victor espinoza's first answer to my first question was that he wanted to thank his sponsor

00:33:04and it was an energy drink and so that that answer to my question about this triple crown didn't come

00:33:11from his heart it came from his head and the whole entire point of me being there on horseback

00:33:16that quick after a race is to catch a jockey while they're still in their heart and mike smith

00:33:22speaks from the heart always and so um when i started riding it was 1987 when i started

00:33:29but when i got to canterbury in 1988 and had the bug mike smith was riding there and he became

00:33:35one

00:33:35of my mentors and and later a really good friend of mine and it was just so gratifying to be

00:33:44there for

00:33:44to to be there in that moment with him to see him get that triple crown win and to see

00:33:49what it meant to

00:33:50him so that's one of my favorites and one of everybody's favorites is calvin brell you know he's

00:33:55always gonna say that yeah just raw emotion when he won his first kentucky derby in 2007 i mean who

00:34:02couldn't who couldn't be a fan of calvin brell's after that but there have been so many bill i mean

00:34:07really too many to name okay all right so who has been some of your least favorite to interview and

00:34:13i'm gonna maybe i don't want to put words in your mouth but ryan moore is known to be a

00:34:19guy who

00:34:19basically is extremely taciturn he's won a zillion breeders cup races and you try so hard to get

00:34:28words out of him is that one of is has he been a big challenge for you um you know

00:34:34the best interview

00:34:35i did with ryan moore was when he won the breeders cup turf with um what's it augustine road is

00:34:42that the

00:34:42name randy august rodan yeah august rodan thank you um i knew i wasn't correct about that but

00:34:49in any event that win meant a lot to him and i had a i had a feeling of what

00:34:54that would mean to him

00:34:55going in and then um it was such a great ride i don't know if you all remember that but

00:35:00um it was

00:35:01such a great ride and he was i felt like as emotional as ryan moore can get after a race

00:35:07and

00:35:08he said you know this really meant a lot to us and so i don't really hate interviewing ryan moore

00:35:14because i know he is what he is he he just i you know for him he doesn't um it's

00:35:22all in his head

00:35:23he's just so tactical that rarely does he let any of those wins get into his heart they don't make

00:35:30him

00:35:30and they don't break him it's all you know it's always for the next one so i don't hate that

00:35:35um

00:35:35what's difficult for me and i'll give you a scenario that just happened last week is when

00:35:40it looked like denon bourbon was going to win the kentucky derby and the japanese runner doesn't speak

00:35:45english that's difficult because i'm like are you serious and at this point i'm praying are you

00:35:52serious god my last derby and i don't even get to interview the winning jockey and then we have next

00:35:59it looks like ocelli's gonna win and i'm like okay tyler gaff leon that's a good story i can work

00:36:03with

00:36:04that but still a maiden in the kentucky derby and then we got the finish that we got so the

00:36:09more

00:36:10difficult ones are the ones that either don't speak english or don't speak english well enough

00:36:15for our viewers to understand what they're saying and then i have to work sort of as an interpreter

00:36:19and sort of recap the answer they just gave me before i asked the next question

00:36:26so people that aren't aware of the nuts and bolts may want to know i mean you're you're there so

00:36:31quickly

00:36:31after a race is over where do you watch it from it depends on the race so for the kentucky

00:36:38derby i'm

00:36:38behind the starting gate and as those last couple of horses are loading i start to head the opposite

00:36:44direction and so when the latch opens and the horses take off i take off also but in the opposite

00:36:49direction and then i get over to the half mile pole and i stand there and i watch the horses

00:36:54go by so i get

00:36:55that one glimpse luckily we've got larry colmas in our ear and so i can hear so much of what's

00:37:00happening but i don't really see that much of what's happening uh for the preakness stakes it'll

00:37:05be a little different mile and 316s i'll probably be behind the starting gate and follow the horses

00:37:10away from the gate and just chase them sort of into the first turn and wait for them on the

00:37:14back side

00:37:15but um i don't really get to see much of the race and i used to see that as quite

00:37:20a handicap

00:37:20because i wasn't used to asking questions about a race i hadn't seen but then one day i realized that

00:37:27unless the the horse that won the race was in front the whole entire time 90 of our viewers don't

00:37:33know

00:37:33what happened where the horse came from where they made their move and so it actually put me in a

00:37:38position to ask the question that a lot of our viewers wanted to know like what was the decisive move

00:37:43uh when did you realize that you were going to get there were there ever any anxious moments

00:37:47things like that that i can't see from where i am so donna a lot of people think that mbc

00:37:55might own

00:37:56the horses you ride or you own the ponies you ride can you explain to people what goes into getting

00:38:04the right horse to ride because you have to find these horses and finagle them with people and

00:38:09sometimes you get good ones sometimes you get bad ones can you talk about how you get these horses

00:38:15and perhaps the best one you've ridden and perhaps the worst one

00:38:22um so that's a great question oh my gosh it's always uh you know now i've done it for 26

00:38:28years

00:38:29so i usually have contacts everywhere i go and in uh maryland there's a pony person that i use

00:38:34sharon greenberg she's got a big pony business half of the horse take horses taking the ponies i mean to

00:38:40the thoroughbreds to the starting gate are owned by sharon greenberg and so i usually reach out to

00:38:45sharon or she reaches out to me and lets me know if she has a horse or not sometimes it's

00:38:50um i've

00:38:51ridden bob bafford's pony steve asmussen's pony wayne lucas's pony um the horse that i just used for

00:38:56the derby this weekend was kelsey danner's pony but i have been riding sherman for the last eight years

00:39:03when we're in kentucky and he belongs to laura moquette and he's kind of become my favorite just

00:39:09because i've covered the derby on him for eight years and then the week of the kentucky derby you

00:39:15know all the vet scratches that we had with other horses well my horse sherman came up lame and and

00:39:22andy biancone was going to be on horseback and hang out with me just to kind of see how her

00:39:26horse

00:39:26came up lame so she ended up having to get steve asmussen's pony and i got kelsey danner's pony at

00:39:32the

00:39:32last minute but mbc does give me an allowance so to speak because the horse that i ride if i'm

00:39:39not

00:39:39riding it there's a pretty good chance it could be out on the racetrack making money and i don't

00:39:43want to take money out of somebody's pocket and so they give me enough money to compensate the groom

00:39:49who's got to take care of the horse the person who brings the horse over and back for me and

00:39:53holds

00:39:53it between races and then also the person who owns the horse because you don't want to just take a

00:39:58horse and just take money out of people's pocket who that's how they make a living but

00:40:02um yeah i've had a couple of sharon one year that the second year that i got a horse from

00:40:08sharon

00:40:09i got on the horse and he was acting so bad to begin with that i wouldn't even let him

00:40:15hold on to

00:40:15him while i got on him because i was afraid he was going to flip over so i get on

00:40:18him and i'm like

00:40:20where is sharon and they told me where she was so i gallop over there and i said sharon this

00:40:24horse

00:40:25isn't gonna work for covering the preakness stakes and she said okay well i'll get one of the other

00:40:31horses for you but then one of my pony riders will be in a bind because they won't have a

00:40:35horse

00:40:35to ride and i said let him ride this horse she said oh none of my riders can ride that

00:40:39horse

00:40:39and i said then why do you have me on him and she said because you're a good rider and

00:40:45i said sharon

00:40:46i'm not here to prove it today we need something that's bomb proof out here so she's taken good care

00:40:53hurt me ever since then all right so donna is it too early to pin you down yet this is

00:40:59tuesday for

00:41:00your preakness pick can you go two for two yeah it's too early so i didn't make my kentucky derby

00:41:06pick until week of i'll say this i'm not going to pick anybody from the 10 hole out because they're

00:41:11going to be disadvantaged at laurel um in the 10 hole out and it also um happens that the two

00:41:18horses

00:41:18i'm leaning toward right now are in the one hole in the six hole so let's let's root for another

00:41:23britney russell right for another female to win the preakness stakes she's got taj mahal in there

00:41:29who's undefeated and then steve asmussen has already won the preakness stakes twice and he had

00:41:34considered the kentucky derby with chip poncho and then decided to give him a little bit more time he

00:41:40breaks from the six hole so i'm probably going to pick one of those two but i haven't decided which

00:41:44one

00:41:45yet and you never know i mean i get there and i watch the horses train and then sometimes all

00:41:49that

00:41:49just goes out the window very good well donna congratulations on a great career in the saddle

00:41:55and also a great career uh in front of the microphone on top of horseback as you've covered

00:42:01the kentucky derby with such grace and such excellence and class all these many years it's

00:42:06great to know that andy b b and cone is going to come in and take your place but she's

00:42:10got big shoes

00:42:11to fill my friend thank you for that bill and i do want to say by the way my first

00:42:15live kentucky

00:42:16derby was in 1988 winning colors and my last live kentucky derby at least to date was sheree devos so

00:42:24i feel like i have some nice bookends right now so it's a good time very good so cool once

00:42:29again thank

00:42:30you so much dana for being the gainsway guest of the week thank you the guest of the week for

00:42:35the

00:42:35week leading up to the preakness stakes donna barton is presented by gainsway home to the

00:42:402024 preakness winner seize the gray trained by the late great hall of famer d wayne lucas

00:42:47seize the gray is the highest earning son of arrogate hailing from the hall of famer's final

00:42:51crop at stud a leading three-year-old of his generation the classic winner defeated both

00:42:57the 2020 24 derby and 2024 belmont stakes winners mystic dan and doork respectively in his career

00:43:07he earned more than 2.45 million dollars he stands for a fee of just 25 000 at gainsway

00:43:22seize the gray wins convincingly

00:43:27seize the gray he's going to seize the day in the pennsylvania derby

00:43:33seize the gray is still there seize the gray wins the greatness

00:43:47on this week's edition of first things first i caught up with trainer brian carna and jockey

00:43:52hall of fame jockey joel rosario to talk about the winner of the siren law states

00:44:03we watched boss sully take down the siren law here here with hall of famer joel rosario didn't

00:44:09take you long to get back to the winner's circle how are you feeling off of that win

00:44:12yeah very good you know it's not taking me long you know to have somebody like ryan you know to

00:44:15put

00:44:16me in the winner so thanks brian for that and yeah it's real good you know just nice to be

00:44:19back and

00:44:20uh yeah happy with black he went pretty quick did he surprise you the last eight of a mile when

00:44:26he

00:44:26still managed to stay and keep going yeah he should be host you know look like up there he was

00:44:30enjoying

00:44:31what he was doing you know looking around look like every time when i asked to go forward you know

00:44:35he he was there for me so i wasn't worried so i know he was going to keep moving forward

00:44:39well done joel okay thank you brian nice win terrific training job for you were you sure that

00:44:45he was spot on for today because we've not seen him since august of last year yeah he's been traveling

00:44:50really well and all his works have been pretty fun to watch and you can see after the way he's

00:44:54pulled

00:44:54up after his works and his attitude he's just been on the prowl for the last three weeks

00:44:58and i just called mersad which runs a lot of the syndicate that i trained for here um i said

00:45:04i think

00:45:04this is where we're gonna go he just horse wouldn't let me keep him in the barn any longer

00:45:08he was just doing good he hung up a 44 and four half mile did you have any worries when

00:45:13you saw

00:45:13that half mile split i had worries when they came to me at the top of the lane so quick

00:45:17i go is that

00:45:18it it's over and then he kicked on i went wow that's a good horse talk to me about joel

00:45:22rosario

00:45:23his move back to southern california because you've mounted him very well today all day long

00:45:27well armando yuzo had days and he came to town on the right day he came you know today's his

00:45:34first day

00:45:34here i talked to his agent billy and he said i think we're gonna be there and then he i

00:45:40said i

00:45:40have a horse i would need you to ride on the side of the lure he goes let me call

00:45:42you back in a half

00:45:43an hour i go oh no here we go and then he said we're good i was like whoo so

00:45:48that was it well done

00:45:49brian go and celebrate mother's day yeah thank you

00:45:56great to have joel rosario back in southern california he is represented by agent billy castle

00:46:02and i hope we see him having many more trips back to the winner's circle looks like he's here to

00:46:08stay

00:46:08and really a great addition to our jockey colony here at santa anita do i want to remind you that

00:46:14santa anita does continue friday saturday and sunday come watch the preakness with us the best place

00:46:20in the country to watch preakness is santa anita well as promised our team of experts none of us had

00:46:26the kentucky derby wonderful we'll try again why don't we go through the horses that are entered

00:46:31for the preakness stakes and we'll go one by one and give you some thoughts we'll talk more about

00:46:36the major contenders than the horses that are probably going to be 30 or 40 to one number one

00:46:40horse is taj mahal and i came very close to picking this horse um i think this is a very

00:46:48good

00:46:48horse britney russell and sheldon russell we all know what this horse uh what the combination does

00:46:53on the maryland circuit watch his last race it was fascinating he got so far out in front and

00:46:58sheldon russell gave him a breather you thought they were going to catch up to the horse and he had

00:47:02another gear and then normally i would say the federico tessio winner is going to be taking a huge jump

00:47:07up in class to win the preakness i'm not so sure that's the case this year with all the things

00:47:12we've

00:47:13had to say about how this is a weak field the thing that worries me a little bit is about

00:47:17the uh

00:47:17the rail draw um i think from that post sheldon uh russell probably doesn't have much choice but to

00:47:23go right to the front with him not really sure how this race is going to set up it looks

00:47:28like he's

00:47:28going to uh not going to get a real comfortable trip on the lead if that's their strategy but uh

00:47:33randy i make him a major contender oh yeah it'll look really good winning the uh winning the tessio

00:47:39my primary concern well there's a ton of speed in the race i mean that's the number one concern

00:47:46but it was also the way he won the tessio because the plan the pre-race plan was not to

00:47:53go to the lead

00:47:54but he had the tin he had the tin hole and sheldon russell the rider the husband of trainer britney

00:48:00russell uh zoe can talk more about this than me but you know wanted to get over from the tin

00:48:06post and

00:48:06sort of you know hustled him a little bit to to get out of there and get some position and

00:48:12and the horse

00:48:12ran off with him horse just took off like a scalded cat opened up 10 lengths on the field and

00:48:19the the

00:48:20pace wasn't particularly fast when you look at the times the fractional times but the track was pretty

00:48:25slow as well um so what's going to happen now if they hustle him a little bit from the one

00:48:31hole which

00:48:32they probably will have to do how's the horse going to react to that and with all the other speed

00:48:36in the

00:48:37race how's he going to handle that there he's talented but there are plenty of questions

00:48:42i love him i love him from the one hole he comes in with a very good work uh he's

00:48:48always been known

00:48:49as a good gate horse i think he is the horse to beat he is my pick in this race

00:48:54for trainer britney

00:48:55russell woman to win the derby perhaps we can have a woman to win the preakness stakes sheldon

00:49:01knows him very well rides him very well he's the speed of the speed in here for me by nyquist

00:49:06out of

00:49:06a quality road mare he was actually spent some time and several works out in southern california

00:49:11with bob baffert's string over at los alamitos now he's owned by sf racing starlight racing

00:49:18uh that same group he never made it over to santa anita it was deemed at that time i i

00:49:24don't know why

00:49:25but they opted to send him straight to britney russell so he did spend some time in southern

00:49:30california was shipped to britney russell and he's done nothing wrong ever since i think he's

00:49:35a good horse i really do the world's most famous maiden is ocelli who was six to one in the

00:49:44morning

00:49:44line seven career starts has not won yet has paid 609 000 and is clearly the top finisher and i

00:49:52think

00:49:53you could argue the top horse coming out of the kentucky derby um i'm not going to throw him out

00:49:58i give

00:49:58him a chance but uh zoe i want to see him do it again 70 to one um you know

00:50:05the horses in the derby

00:50:06that were at the back of the pack early were the ones that were all up front uh and and

00:50:12in the top

00:50:12placing positions um it it was a good trip for him um the the even though the pace wasn't all

00:50:20that fast

00:50:20it was still a pace where everybody who was up front early kind of collapsed um if he repeats that

00:50:27race he's got a chance a i don't see him repeating that race and b i don't see him getting

00:50:32that same

00:50:32sort of trip so i'm not real high on him oh i love him i really like him in this

00:50:39spot i do

00:50:40wait a minute you love taj mahal too he can't love everybody uh well i love these two i like

00:50:46taj

00:50:46mahal on top and i'm gonna use ocelli underneath for sure you know he's actually won a race i saw

00:50:53on twitter yesterday on x of abr of him winning a training race at aiken under trainer joe sharp so

00:51:02i

00:51:02called joe i'm like joe what's the deal why don't you train this horse like he's good buddies with

00:51:07travestor so he was going down with his kids and rosen and pravnik for the pony races they have

00:51:12on aiken trials day and a lot of people run their two-year-olds in these trial races and he

00:51:17called up

00:51:18travestor he goes hey you know joe wanted to be a jockey he's just too heavy and he loves it

00:51:23still

00:51:24gallops all his own horses he's a really good rider he goes do you have something live i can ride

00:51:28i want

00:51:29to be on something live he's like i've got just a horse for you gets up he wins by a

00:51:33neck the only

00:51:35race to date he has ever won was aiken under trainer joe sharp so i'm like joe can you do

00:51:41126

00:51:41maybe you need to ride him you have history together ocelli is one of the few horses as well

00:51:47that i got to see train at churchill downs that i thought looked great i saw him whiz by me

00:51:53one day

00:51:53and i'm like ocelli wasn't even on my radar i had to look him up like he's wearing a derby

00:51:59towel

00:51:59who's that horse i had no idea who he was i looked him up i'm like oh god that's a

00:52:04maiden he's got no

00:52:05shot and he looked good and he held weight so i can guarantee that he's going to hold that same

00:52:10kind of weight and look as good going into this race i totally agree with what with backman says he

00:52:17says i'm into the business of racing horses not training horses and this is a racehorse not a

00:52:24training horse and if he says this horse hasn't taken a backward step i believe him purely off of

00:52:29what i saw from his days training up it's a beautiful looking son of connect how they picked

00:52:34him off for 12 grand i'll never know randy you got a comment on ocelli not really not really donna

00:52:41i mean donna zoe pretty much said it all about ocelli i i you know it it i've i'm just

00:52:49now getting

00:52:49boots on the ground here in baltimore so i want to talk to whit backman about the horse

00:52:53because he was beaten six and three quarters lengths by incredible in the virginia derby

00:52:59he was beaten by albus who you couldn't find with the search warrant uh despite being you know having

00:53:05a advantageous running style in the kentucky derby so what made the big turnaround at the kentucky derby

00:53:14maybe it's it's just exactly what zoe said maybe he just blossomed and uh and this is getting to be

00:53:19his time of the year we'll see three horses crooper in here he got a win in your end by

00:53:25winning the

00:53:25bathhouse row stakes at oakland park where he ran a 80 buyer figure not only is that not going to

00:53:31get

00:53:31it done but he never cracked the 60s before that so uh randy uh i'll we can move on quickly

00:53:38i don't

00:53:38give him any chance no i mean that that race has a tie-in with the preakness so that the

00:53:44winner

00:53:44automatically gets a fees paid berth in the preakness stakes so that's why they're here

00:53:50and i would love to see donny von himmel win it his father don von himmel and donny

00:53:56uh i've known them for a long long time and they're consummate horsemen i would love to see him win

00:54:03but it's going to be uh awfully tall order zoe arkansas natives the owner by the way the owner

00:54:11was my eye doctor and go ahead no go ahead yeah eye doctor oh great the owner was my eye

00:54:19doctor in

00:54:19tulsa oklahoma yeah that's cool i think it's cropper um if you had to ask me the pronunciation i would

00:54:26say

00:54:27cropper a cropper is actually something that you put around a horse's tail usually used on fat ponies for

00:54:32stopping the saddle slipping forward i don't know if that's where the name came from but that's what

00:54:38i'm going with he's gonna have to step up a lot i'm i will be rooting for donny von hamel

00:54:44for sure

00:54:48robusta is next at 30 to one one of the three horses coming out of the kentucky derby

00:54:52had an odd run in the derby he was showing a lot of speed uh in his prior races and

00:54:58he got bumped

00:54:59around a little bit at the start from the outside post but not something too terribly and then

00:55:03christian torres didn't get anywhere close to the lead actually that might have worked out a little

00:55:07bit to his benefit because again the horses coming from the back uh were running the the best at the

00:55:13end but he's coming off two consecutive races where he got beat 17 lengths in the derby 16 lengths in

00:55:18the san anita derby um ran well in the san felipe before that but barring a uh running back to

00:55:24that race

00:55:25and i don't know where that's going to come from another horse that um randy i'm not real excited

00:55:30about no if i think this is a calumet farm play plain and simple sure uh brad kelly loves to

00:55:38have

00:55:38his horses in major stakes races and occasionally he wins at big prices and this would be a huge prize

00:55:44for most wins what he said okay all right talking we come in danny gargan uh is is a guy

00:55:55who's always

00:55:55very enthusiastic about his horses uh talking ran third last time out in the bluegrass got his doors

00:56:01blown off by further ado further ado as we all know didn't run real well in the um uh in

00:56:06the kentucky

00:56:07derby but i wouldn't hold that against talking but uh before that fifth in the tampa bay derby before

00:56:12that ninth in the remsen zoe i don't see anything in this horse's past performances to get me uh too

00:56:18excited about him he's a fresh horse coming in uh i've actually always liked this horse numbers wise

00:56:25he's a cut below the best of them maybe we'll see a different horse i know danny this horse might

00:56:31be

00:56:31named for danny talking uh is very high on him 47 and 4 a bullet work keeneland um you're getting

00:56:40eye rattled tees you're not without a shot here i would give him a shot to hit the board at

00:56:45some

00:56:45point i really would danny is super high on him and he always has been with good reason

00:56:52yeah he's he he definitely is talking talking up uh and he's convinced that the horse is going to

00:56:59run is going to run a significantly better race than he's been running and he's going to need to

00:57:05uh because not only does he have to step it up just on paper but if you go back and

00:57:09you watch

00:57:09his last three races all three of those races beautiful trips couldn't have gotten better trips

00:57:16in any of those three races and still was disappointing so i we're going to sound like

00:57:22a broken record here like kind of like talking about the triple crown spacing all these horses

00:57:27you got to step it up you're gonna have to step it up well they do because yes because there

00:57:35is um

00:57:35there is no second coming to justify our american pharaoh in this race is as we've made that

00:57:40abundantly clear a lot of people like chip honcho he's five to one in the morning line um steve

00:57:45asmussen knows his way to the winner's circle as in the pregness as he's won it with carlin and

00:57:49rachel alexandra two of the greatest horses of our lifetimes randy and zoe um he passed the

00:57:56kentucky derby because uh he didn't like the way the horse ran the louisiana derby the race before

00:58:01that was excellent the risen star beating a half length uh or is it yeah half length by paladin

00:58:07if he can run back to that race certainly he's a contender and i have a lot of faith in

00:58:12steve

00:58:12asmussen if he thought the right play was to bring the horse into the pregness and and not uh uh

00:58:18jam

00:58:18him down with uh anybody's throat in the derby um randy he had enough points to make the derby didn't

00:58:23he had when it was all said and done he did okay so um again not my pick but uh

00:58:28i have a lot of

00:58:29faith in steve asmussen he picks up jose ortiz of course the winner aboard golden tempo in the

00:58:34kentucky derby um wouldn't be least bit shocked if this guy won the race i mean a lot of faith

00:58:39in

00:58:39steve asmussen a lot of faith in jose ortiz as well as most all the jockeys that are riding

00:58:44in the preakness stakes uh my concern about chip ancho's big beautiful horse um zoe would know

00:58:53more about that than me but there's only one race on his past performances that to me says he can

00:58:59win

00:58:59the preakness and that was the risen star in which he made a very comfortable early lead and controlled

00:59:07the pace in an eight horse field and he didn't win he was second to paladin but that was a

00:59:12good race

00:59:13you know that would be good enough to win the preakness but i can't see him making an uncontested

00:59:19comfortable early lead in a race filled with this much early speed and when he hasn't made the lead

00:59:25like that he hasn't run very well at least not fast enough to win the preakness that's my concern

00:59:31he's got a couple good things in his favor he's trained by steve asperson checkpoint number one steve

00:59:38is pointed for this race checkpoint number two and you're getting jose ortiz and he's run right

00:59:44behind golden tempo twice so yes do i think he's gonna win no but i definitely would use him in

00:59:52my

00:59:53exotic wages all right we move on to the hell we did and uh randy moss it should be zoe's

01:00:00turn but i

01:00:01can't resist this is my favorite horse this is the second coming of senior buscador out of that

01:00:08remarkable mayor rose's desert yeah a half brother to senior buscador which is how they got the name

01:00:13right i mean we all know that story joe joe peacock senior didn't like the fact that his family members

01:00:19named the horse senior buscador and so when they told him what they named the horse he said the hell

01:00:26we did and that's and that's why they named this horse the hell we did uh he's gonna have to

01:00:32step it

01:00:32up how about that he was second in the lexington uh to trend the setter but he did beat corona

01:00:39de oro

01:00:40who was in this field uh before that he was a romping winner of an allowance race but that was

01:00:45at sunland

01:00:45park um so yeah i mean it would be cool to see the the peacocks win and todd fincher who

01:00:52was the todd

01:00:53pletcher of new mexico he's obviously a very good trainer but uh yeah what do you think zoe

01:01:00i think we got to play a drinking game on the replay of this show step it up drink that

01:01:06would be

01:01:06amazing yeah we'd all be trashed by now i'm wishing them the best of luck um homebred anytime you can

01:01:15get

01:01:15a homebred in a classic race that's pretty awesome so and a homebred in a classic race that's a half

01:01:22brother to a multi-million dollar earner good for them really good for them rooting for them

01:01:28all right so maybe instead of saying step it up we'll just start saying they've got to take the

01:01:32bull by the horns oh good segue to our next segment before we get to buy the horns however we're

01:01:39going

01:01:39to go to a couple commercial messages we're going to hear from the pennsylvania horse breeders

01:01:43association also find out what's going on at first tv and when we come back we will pick it up

01:01:48with the

01:01:48second half of the field starting with the aforementioned bull by the horns stay with us

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01:03:56and his second work back after his third place finish in the oakland handicap

01:04:00that's him on the outside working in 47.60 and company with broheim on the inside for trainer

01:04:06michael mccarthy mccarthy has said that the colt came out of the oakland race in good shape and that

01:04:11a starting spot in the grade one met mile at saratoga on june 6th should be up next in the

01:04:17cards

01:04:18or andy i think bull by the horns has to i'm not gonna say it i'm not gonna say it

01:04:23he needs to

01:04:25improve considerably to be a major factor in here the best thing you can say about him is safi joseph

01:04:32and we know how good he is but no this isn't happening is it no i don't i can't see

01:04:37it i mean the

01:04:38only reason he's in the race it was just because the race was coming up so weak i mean you

01:04:44could also

01:04:44say that about incredible you could say that about robusta um you know they were thrown into the race

01:04:51later than the other horses in the field because they looked at the preakness lineup and golden

01:04:55tempo drops out uh baffert's two horses drop out a silent tactic who would have been the favorite

01:05:02drops out and all of a sudden it's like what the heck i'm gonna throw bull in the bull by

01:05:06the horns

01:05:06in there i'm gonna throw robusta in there so that's why he's in the race but he's probably going to

01:05:11be 50

01:05:12to one oh me sorry you want to move on to iron honor you got anything to say about bull

01:05:17by the

01:05:17horns step it up okay all right so the morning line favorite is iron honor at nine to two chad

01:05:25brown

01:05:25flavian pratt and i can see why i think that the line maker made the right morning line favorite and

01:05:30the reason why is people are going to look at chad brown's history and he has twice taken horses out

01:05:36of the wood memorial past the kentucky derby and then won the preakness with him cloud computing in

01:05:412017 and early voting in 2022 the difference between those horses is they ran well in the

01:05:47wood memorial cloud computing was third early voting was second this horse didn't run particularly

01:05:53well in the wood memorial he ran a 76 buyer beaten four and a quarter lengths blinkers come off for

01:05:58now

01:05:58it's chad brown it's flavian pratt it's a weak field can he win of course he can but i think

01:06:04he's

01:06:04going to be over bet and he's not going to be on my ticket so he he's got to be

01:06:09on my ticket my my

01:06:11my super factor is going to have about six horses at this rate you get in the blinkers are off

01:06:16that's

01:06:17a good move for chad brown he wins at 20 you're getting pratt he will be over bet but listen

01:06:22he ran

01:06:23a 95 bit by a speed figure in his debut backed it up with the 90 not sure what happened

01:06:29in the wood

01:06:29memorial but he's certainly a horse with a lot of talent as sun and anquist yeah well in the wood

01:06:36memorial it was a little like the kentucky derby it was a pace meltdown uh napoleon solo charged out

01:06:44there um uh talk to me jimmy charged out there iron honor was too close to them he was right

01:06:51behind

01:06:52him and all the horses those those horses and a couple more that were up near the front just you

01:06:57know

01:06:57went into reverse in the final quarter mile and that's why you had albus and right to party and

01:07:03ocelli who ran like they did just like the kentucky derby the top three came from way way back in

01:07:08the

01:07:08pack now the question is there's a ton of speed in the preakness as well is it going to be

01:07:13another

01:07:13pace meltdown is iron honor with blinkers off obviously the intent is not to be able to not to

01:07:21rush out there like he did in the wood memorial but he doesn't show a race he's only had three

01:07:27races

01:07:27he doesn't show a race where he stalked from off the pace and won both of his good races both

01:07:34of his

01:07:34wins the maiden win and the gotham win were on the lead were up on the engine well he was

01:07:40a little off

01:07:40the pace sprinting at aqueduct but not much so is can he be as effective with a different running style

01:07:47we don't know chad brown doesn't know i don't think and i don't think flavian knows but if there's

01:07:53any jockey that could pull it off i guess it would be flavian napoleon solo happens to be the only

01:07:59grade

01:07:59one winner in the field as he won the champagne last year at belmont at aqueduct but his two starts

01:08:06this

01:08:06year things really haven't gone his way trainer chad summers has said before the fountain of youth he

01:08:10didn't think he really had the horse all that cranked up so he runs fifth then he comes back and

01:08:15runs

01:08:15fifth again in the wood memorial um zoe this looks to me like a horse and you see a lot

01:08:20of them that

01:08:20just was a really good two-year-old who didn't make that progression to three now if somehow chad

01:08:26summers can get him to run back to his champagne oh sure he's got a big chance but that's a

01:08:32big if if

01:08:32you ask me yeah it's a head scratcher for me because he showed so much promise in that champagne i'm

01:08:38not

01:08:39even going to say step it up because he's a horse who who can he really can that was a

01:08:45huge effort

01:08:46and i'm not going to say he's just a two-year-old either i'm not sure what's happened to him

01:08:50because

01:08:51when he won the champagne he won it like a good horse he won it like a horse that has

01:08:55talent that

01:08:55can move forward and step on to his three-year-old season we just haven't seen it so i don't

01:09:02know if he

01:09:02can pull one out of the hat i think it's in there i just i don't know what to think

01:09:07about napoleon solo

01:09:08i really don't i can make a long shot case for him and here would be my case as we

01:09:18know he ran a hell

01:09:20of a race in the champagne i mean he was considered one of the best two-year-olds in the

01:09:24country at the

01:09:25end of last year right just based on the race in the champagne uh then comes the layoff and they

01:09:32run

01:09:32him back in the fountain of youth and chad summers purposely left him a little short before the

01:09:39fountain of youth he said that beforehand he told us that beforehand because he was trying to mimic

01:09:44what bill mott did with sovereignty and sort of gradually get the horse to peak on kentucky derby

01:09:50day and all i can come up with is that he was shorter than chad thought he was okay and

01:09:58he also got

01:09:58sick after that race so now you come back in the wood memorial and he's close to the pace he's

01:10:05on the

01:10:06pace and as i just said it was a toxic pace in the wood memorial and he actually ran really

01:10:12well

01:10:13to be beaten only two and three quarters lengths uh he i mean he finished ahead of of iron honor

01:10:20um so i know i texted with chad this past week and he was he also had the one hole

01:10:30in the wood so

01:10:31his hands were forced as far as strategy he was hoping to draw an outside post position so he could

01:10:37stalk uh he's really cranked up the training look at the workouts 110 flat at belmont park 111 and 2

01:10:45before that also on the training track at belmont park so the horse is going to be plenty ready

01:10:51um if he can be as effective sitting just a little off the pace and stalking i could see him

01:10:58with a long shot chance in a pretty uh in a pretty weak preakness field if he could run back

01:11:03to his

01:11:03champagne for sure we turn our attention out to corona de oro 30 to 1 in the morning line for

01:11:10john

01:11:10velasquez and yeah on paper he doesn't look too good but we can't totally ignore the dallas stewart

01:11:18factor in 2015 dallas stewart ran second in this race with taylor herb at 28 to 1 in 2080 ran

01:11:26second

01:11:26with macho again at 39 to 1 dallas stewart certainly has a penchant for getting horses that you don't

01:11:33think have much of a chance to run huge races on some of the biggest days in the sport but

01:11:38boy uh the

01:11:39dallas stewart magic is really gonna have to come out of the uh he's gonna have to pull a rabbit

01:11:45out

01:11:45of his hat big time here randy um but again once again it is dallas stewart's i guess you never

01:11:50know

01:11:50uh women third in your tries how about that well if you like corona doro you probably gotta like the

01:11:56hell we did a little bit more than him uh or at least put them right together so uh yeah

01:12:02i can't

01:12:02really you know i don't think i can use them zoe can you i can't use them but i agree

01:12:08with what bill

01:12:09said about dallas stewart dallas has made a career out of running seemingly the wrong horses in the

01:12:16wrong races and them hitting the boards not only has he done it in the preakness he's run second

01:12:21in the derby he's done very very well with underrated horses

01:12:28so also there's one other thing we need to get into right here just briefly and and donna brothers

01:12:34touched on it one of the primary differences probably the number one difference between

01:12:40running this race at pimlico and running it at laurel is the run to the first turn it is

01:12:48significantly shorter at laurel because of the mile and an eighth circumference and where they start the

01:12:54race okay so you're only talking about 700 and something feet you know not even an eighth of a mile

01:13:01into the or a little more than an eighth of a mile into the uh into the first turn so

01:13:06the with the

01:13:0714 horse field it's going to be a disadvantage theoretically for horses breaking from the far

01:13:13outside post positions like corona doro and like incredible who we're going to be talking about right

01:13:18now just keep that in mind now it's a mile and eighth racetrack they start the race at the 16th

01:13:25pole

01:13:25and run it to the first wire laurel has two finished wires and they're going to run to the first

01:13:31wire so

01:13:32if we're talking about track circumferences and i kind of looked this up before we came on

01:13:39pimlico the distance of the stretch 1152 feet that is the final stretch the distance at laurel to the

01:13:48wire they're going to finish the preakness is 1189 feet the distance that churchill just in case you

01:13:55really want to know 1245 feet now pimlico is a very narrow racetrack it's 70 feet wide

01:14:04churchill is only 80 feet wide laurel is 95 feet wide it's kind of a fat wide racetrack with a

01:14:14short

01:14:14stretch with two wires they're going to go to that first wire which is only 1089 feet so it's crucial

01:14:20i

01:14:21think for horses to get good position because it's a short stretch at laurel park all right so move now

01:14:28to incredible uh the riley mott trainee who joined the party a little bit late uh the third horse coming

01:14:34out of kentucky derby i'm gonna like randy did last week i'm gonna reserve uh i'm gonna make my pick

01:14:41a

01:14:41little bit later and i have a little bit more time but i may pick this horse and here's why

01:14:46first i mean

01:14:46let's be honest i do i love anybody in this race no you you can't possibly but you know um

01:14:53we want

01:14:53to try to pick the winner in here and here's my theory in here i mean i granted he didn't

01:14:58beat

01:14:58you know great horses in the virginia derby but then riley mott and i'm not criticizing his decision

01:15:05he's a brilliant young trainer but rather than giving him one more prep he decided to give him the

01:15:09eight weeks off and go into the kentucky derby um even in this day and age when everybody wants to

01:15:15have

01:15:15eight nine weeks in between races maybe that was a little bit too much time off in between races

01:15:21i'm thinking maybe that race the derby was a tightener as crazy as that sounds you know nobody

01:15:27uses the derby as tightener but maybe this was the race he really needed to tighten the screws and

01:15:33have to improve by much to be a major factor in here so um i will take riley mott with

01:15:40incredible

01:15:41having a good shot in here andy what do you think so we want you to take him what do

01:15:45you think

01:15:47i'm not taking him i i'm good luck he's i think he's a good horse i think he's a good

01:15:53horse

01:15:54i'm looking to pick the winner i think the winner comes from the one hole

01:16:01i to me incredible race in the kentucky derby is a good advertisement for ocelli

01:16:12and here's why incredible had a good trip i i know you can look at the trouble line here altered

01:16:18bumped kept on he he had a he had a good trip he he did come out into renegade a

01:16:25little bit in the run

01:16:26through the stretch but it really bothered renegade more than it would bother incredible

01:16:30um but other than that he was behind the speed he was in a good spot he got the jump

01:16:36on renegade

01:16:37uh and ocelli blew by him so may okay to to your point bill maybe he wasn't 100 fit but

01:16:47for the

01:16:48kentucky derby you're not gonna i mean i i don't know so when you look at the buyer speed figures

01:16:54in

01:16:54the virginia derby he ran an 88 against lesser competition visually impressive in the kentucky

01:17:01derby he ran an 89 um that might tell me a little bit that even though it was seemingly a

01:17:11pace meltdown

01:17:12that these horses like ocelli might have just improved to run a 94 incredible was back in the

01:17:20back and runs the same number that he ran in the virginia derby so um to me it makes ocelli

01:17:28look

01:17:28better that incredible uh ran the way he did move now to i hope so to great white the horse

01:17:36that

01:17:37flipped before the big massive guy who flipped before the race and had to be scratched from the

01:17:40kentucky derby i didn't like him in the derby no reason why i would like him here um the first

01:17:46time

01:17:46he tried first and only time he tried dirt in the bluegrass he didn't run very well at all

01:17:50and uh uh zoe i don't see him um i know it's a great story because everybody gets a kick

01:17:56out of how

01:17:56big he is but um nope don't see him sorry i don't see him either but i'd love to give

01:18:03a shout out to

01:18:04the outrider who caught him obviously the rider was very very lucky alex ashad not to get landed on

01:18:12because literally he hit the deck and great white hit right next to him and then the outrider who

01:18:18just happened to be there lent over his pony and grabbed those reins because it could have been a

01:18:23whole different story and a massive delay and all kinds of kerfuffle if that horse had got loose and

01:18:29galloped around the racetrack with all those people there so i'm not sure which one of those guys i know

01:18:35it wasn't greg blasey it was it was somebody else caught that horse good job really good job

01:18:42i know they didn't want him on the early lead in the bluegrass stakes they were very surprised

01:18:47that alex ashard uh even from an inside post went to the lead it was a very contentious pace in

01:18:54the

01:18:54bluegrass um he went his last eighth of a mile in 14.92 seconds he walked home the final furlong

01:19:03yes i think he'll run better with a different running style but i certainly would have liked to

01:19:09have seen great white run better than that on dirt and his only career start on dirt so that's too

01:19:16much

01:19:16for me all right we get to our final horse here and you guys get ready to call me crazy

01:19:21i'm giving

01:19:23pretty boy mia a chance in here first of all one of my thoughts is don't you have to try

01:19:28to come up

01:19:29with a 25 to 1 shot in this race it's such a crazy race do you really want i mean

01:19:34do you really want

01:19:35to take you know the nine to two favorite the five to one okay he's never gone two turns he's

01:19:42never

01:19:43gone beyond a mile he's got a bad post but how about this randy moss who has uh the last

01:19:49race buyer

01:19:50figure who has the second best figure in the race well number one is ocelli at a 94 let me

01:19:57make sure i got

01:19:58that right uh ocelli ran a 94 pretty boy mia ran a 92 winning allowance race at aqueduct he's two

01:20:07for

01:20:07two since jeremiah englehart put the blinkers on him yes he's got early speed from the outside post

01:20:13position maybe ricardo santana jr can wrestle him from off the pace i'll throw a few dollars on this

01:20:20horse if they're going to give me 45 to one why is uh why the hell not the post is

01:20:26obviously really

01:20:28really tough to overcome with a short run to the first turn but he has speed he has tactical speed

01:20:33and again if he can willingly sit and he did for a little while in the race at aqueduct in

01:20:41his most

01:20:42recent race um not for long but he did for a little while then i look if you go back

01:20:48and watch the videos

01:20:49of his two races he looks good i i don't think it's a it's that big of a stretch at

01:20:5715 to one to toss

01:20:58him in uh your exotics despite his post position go back and watch his race two back when he broke

01:21:05his maiden at aqueduct he gets hooked up in a massive speed duel and he goes 44.73 going six

01:21:13and a half

01:21:13furlongs and there were a couple of horses named gordy and sir duke that were in that race and

01:21:21coming toward the top of the stretch they came flying right up to pretty boy maya he's named after

01:21:29jeremiah englehart the trainer and they were just going to blow by him there was no doubt watching

01:21:35that race that these two horses were just going to just motor on past him and so what did pretty

01:21:40boy

01:21:41maya do he basically rebroke and he opened up and after that pace and those stretch horses coming up

01:21:48to him he wins by six and a half he just takes off and leaves him behind i'm like wow

01:21:53this is a this is

01:21:54a good race so i i could see i could see him running pretty well in here despite the post

01:22:00position

01:22:02he's going to be a wise guy play for sure um i don't know what kind of sheet numbers he'll

01:22:07get but i

01:22:08guarantee he's got some pretty good numbers moving forward that are going to make him a sheets play

01:22:13he's got speed he's on the outside he'll be able to get up get over um a gelding name for

01:22:19the trainer

01:22:19great name by the way um yeah i can see him being in there i'm not sure you're going to

01:22:24get your 20 to

01:22:25one bill i'm sorry i don't want to rain on your parade but i don't think he's going to be

01:22:2920 to one

01:22:32td and writer's room also brought to you by west point thoroughbreds which went international this

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01:23:38well even though zoe cabman rained on my parade and said i'm not getting my price on pretty my pretty

01:23:43boy mia i want to thank her and randy moss for being our co-hosts on this week's cdn writers

01:23:48room

01:23:48podcast presented by keeneland especially want to thank donna barton brothers for being our games

01:23:54way guests of the week and and congratulations once again to her for the great career she's had

01:23:59both as a jockey and a broadcaster also want to thank the people who work behind the scenes sue

01:24:03finley katie petruniak anthony larock and alia larock but they're the real stars of the show they make it

01:24:08look so good uh each week as it comes out hope you all have the preakness winter not going to

01:24:13be

01:24:13easy we'll be talking more triple crown and the preakness next week on the tdn writer's room

01:24:19podcast hope to see you again

01:24:21podcast hope to see you again

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