The Life Threatening Dangers Of Gay Conversion Therapy | State Of Grace | Refinery29 - video Dailymotion

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Here on State Of Grace, our host Grace Baldridge explores what it means to identify as a Christian as well as a member of the LGBTQ community. She attends the Pride Parade in Atlanta to speak to people who believe this is impossible and those who have found balance identifying as both. Watch this video to see what it means to be a queer Christian in America today!  ABOUT SERIES State Of Grace is a series that explores the intersection of human rights, sexuality, and faith. Host Grace Baldridge dives into controversial societal realities that Americans face everyday and how to navigate the modern world while remaining faithful.   ABOUT REFINERY29  Refinery29 is a modern woman's destination for how to live a stylish, well-rounded life. http://refinery29.com/  RELATED CONTENT The Truth About Where Hair Extensions Come From https://youtube.com/watch?v=VlZ1SWLBfPE I Got 10 Hours Of Transgender Facial Surgery https://youtube.com/watch?v=6c-4A-gNqS0 I'm 30 & I Embalm Dead Bodies For A Living https://youtube.com/watch?v=ePQmd2phpDA  SEE MORE REFINERY29 VIDEOS http://refinery29.com/video  SUBSCRIBE TO REFINERY29 Subscribe to the Refinery29 channel: http://bit.ly/subscribe-to-r29 For the latest trends and videos, visit: http://refinery29.com Like Refinery29 on Facebook: https://facebook.com/refinery29 Follow Refinery29 on Twitter: https://twitter.com/refinery29 Heart Refinery29 on Instagram: https://instagram.com/refinery29/  TALENT Follow Grace Baldridge on Instagram: https://instagram.com/gracebaldridge/ Follow Unbothered on Instagram: https://instagram.com/r29unbothered/ Follow OnHerTurf on Instagram: https://instagram.com/onherturf/ Follow Refinery29 on Instagram: https://instagram.com/refinery29/

Transcript

00:00I would have to change who I am to be a member of your church.

00:05The language would be repentant.

00:06There needs to be some repentance here.

00:09For my marriage?

00:10Yeah.

00:10What the hell have I gotten myself into?

00:13Hi, I'm Grace Baldridge.

00:15I'm a lesbian, big shock.

00:17And I'm also a Christian.

00:19As the daughter of an Episcopal priest, I was raised in the rectory,

00:22and I built a strong connection to my faith.

00:24Although I eventually swapped out Christian rock for creepy folk music.

00:27Anyway, as a queer Christian, there is an undeniable tension between my faith and my community.

00:34In a time where it seems division is favored over discourse,

00:37Where are your parents? Where's your Bible?

00:39I want to start a dialogue.

00:41Good, bad, or downright sacrilegious.

00:45Fortunately, God gave me a curious mind and access to a film crew,

00:48so I'm going to reach across the aisle, or pew, I guess,

00:52to see if we can break bread or if we'll continue to throw stones.

01:02Atlanta, Georgia, is a metropolitan city located in the Bible Belt.

01:06It's the perfect intersection of faith and the queer community.

01:09Say the South is all bigotry, honey, but you know what?

01:11Sometimes we can switch it out.

01:13Sometimes they turn out.

01:14We're not all Southern charm.

01:16There are over a thousand places of worship in 132 square miles,

01:21and their annual Pride celebration has over 300,000 participants.

01:25Pride is a place to build love, hope, and inspiration.

01:30This is honestly the most makeup I've worn in years.

01:34But there is always someone there to rain on the parades.

01:37Pun intended.

01:41Who lied to you and told you it's okay to be Alasian?

01:45Why are you luring her? Why don't you read the Bible?

01:48I don't believe in God.

01:50We've become all too familiar with what this form of bigotry looks like.

01:54From funerals to Pride parades,

01:57these street preachers condemn entire communities in the name of God

02:01by way of megaphones and tacky signs.

02:06What other group has as much police protection around us?

02:10I will probably one direction.

02:13This is Ruben Israel.

02:15I recognized him because I've seen him at L.A. Pride over the last five years.

02:18He's probably somewhere over here, or there, or here.

02:24You get it.

02:25I am concerned about our country,

02:27and I'm concerned about where it's heading.

02:29We're the buzzing, irritating noise that you can't help but see.

02:34So do you feel that people on the other side of the barricade,

02:38when you're here picketing, feel love coming from your group?

02:42We have this terminology today called tough love.

02:46Why can't you at least file me in a box of tough love?

02:51In all my years of talking to people on the street,

02:54most people have heard God loves them.

02:56So he took a census,

02:58and what we found was that people do generally believe that God loves them,

03:02but often do not experience love from people who believe in him.

03:05My mom loves me.

03:07My sister loves me.

03:08My brother loves me.

03:09My friends loves me, regardless if I'm gay.

03:11So it doesn't matter.

03:14Willfully ignorant Christians like Ruben don't rock me anymore.

03:18But the impact of this kind of intolerance is undeniable.

03:29I'm in Piedmont Park, the home base for Atlanta Pride festivities,

03:32to meet with Peter Nunn.

03:34Peter is a hairstylist, husband, dog parent, and a conversion therapy survivor.

03:40I firmly believed that God didn't want me to be gay,

03:44and that he was all-powerful, and he could fix it.

03:48At the age of 15, unbeknownst to him,

03:51Peter was sent to a therapy center in Iowa by his parents.

03:54My dad took me on a trip, and he didn't tell me where we were going.

03:59And then I remember very well, we were in a layover in St. Louis,

04:05and he told me that he was taking me to a therapy center in Iowa

04:10to fix whatever weird sexual shit was going on with me.

04:14Then he told me that if that didn't work,

04:16that he was going to send me to a military school to try to make me a man.

04:21Conversion or reparative therapy is the practice of trying to change

04:24an individual's sexual orientation using psychological or spiritual interventions.

04:30Conversion therapy has been around since the 19th century,

04:33utilizing methods ranging from invasive questioning to electroshock.

04:37These practices have since been opposed by the American Medical Association,

04:42the American Psychiatric Association,

04:44the Pan American Health Organization, and more.

04:47What were some of the sort of lines of questioning

04:49that you remember particularly well?

04:51A lot of stuff about if I had ever been molested,

04:55if I had masturbated.

04:57One of the therapists asking the size of my penis.

05:00But then it went back to,

05:02you have to fight this, you have to be fixed.

05:04What was that five-year period like when you got back?

05:06I would spend every Sunday in church praying, crying,

05:10every night in bed praying and crying for these desires to go away.

05:15I was probably at an all-time low.

05:20After years of battling depression and trying to pray the gay away,

05:24it was Atlanta Pride that inspired Peter to finally commit to loving himself.

05:28During the parade, the PFLAG group marched by

05:32and they were holding signs that said,

05:37I love my lesbian daughter or I love my gay son.

05:44And I just, I wanted that so much.

05:50And not just from family or from friends,

05:53but I wanted to love myself that way.

05:57Peter is one of the 350,000 LGBTQ Americans

06:01to endure conversion therapy as an adolescent.

06:05Conversion therapy for minors remains legal in 36 states.

06:09Peter's journey to self-acceptance led him to explore and question his faith.

06:14And he's not alone in that.

06:15Many queer people wrestle with faith, myself included.

06:19And while I've arrived at a point of reconciliation,

06:22others take a very different road.

06:23So I am on my way to meet Jackie Hill Perry,

06:28which is a sentence I really did not think I would ever say.

06:35Jackie Hill Perry is a wife, mother, teacher, author, poet, and an ex-lesbian.

06:41This means that despite experiencing same-sex attraction,

06:45Jackie has chosen to commit to a heterosexual relationship with her husband, Preston.

06:49I've been watching Jackie's videos for years

06:52because I've always had a fascination with understanding people that I disagree with.

06:55You have already been deceived if you think that sex is not included

06:58in the discussion about what God is lord over.

07:01Jackie did not experience conversion therapy,

07:03but at the age of 19, she felt God speak to her and reveal the sin in her life,

07:08both holistically and with regards to her sexuality.

07:11You are in what I think a lot of people would view as a very conventionally heterosexual relationship.

07:16How do you define yourself, though?

07:18I define myself as Christian.

07:20I just feel like it's unhelpful to define my personhood

07:24by what I am attracted to or who I like, but rather, who do I serve?

07:27Do you still experience same-sex attraction?

07:31Yeah.

07:32Women are still pretty, and women are still beautiful,

07:34and I think there's still things about women that compel me to want to know them more

07:41than what I believe is okay.

07:45There's no secrecy.

07:46It's nothing but vulnerability.

07:47So he knows where I am.

07:48If I'm having a dream about my ex-girlfriend, he knows about it.

07:51To this day?

07:53Yeah.

07:54Really?

07:55I think it's definitely something that I can see myself wrestling with and wrestling through

08:00probably until the day I go to glory.

08:05I was struck by how open Jackie was with me about her struggles

08:08and how supportive a relationship she's built with Preston.

08:12But I was still struggling with the way that many churches prescribe Jackie's message

08:16as the only resolution to faith and sexuality.

08:19I wonder, what is your opinion of reparative therapy, conversion therapy?

08:24I'm not a fan just because I don't believe that God's heart is to change people's orientation.

08:30I don't see God calling people to be straight.

08:33I see him calling people to be holy.

08:34Do you think that you have more in common with me or with the protesters that I spoke with yesterday?

08:42I have nothing in common with them.

08:45The way it's presented is sinful.

08:47Some of the conclusions they come to about people and dignifying them is sinful.

08:51I think they tend to fall more on the Pharisee side than Jesus' side.

08:56Why do you think that you're grouped in with a lot of this really hateful rhetoric

09:00that we hear from the Christian community about the LGBT community and how do you feel about that?

09:05I think people have used testimony such as mine to weaponize people

09:08or be used as a weapon to abuse and to be harmful and to lack empathy.

09:13There isn't an affirming from me from some of the perspectives that you hold.

09:19But also, I think the love is I don't feel the need to constantly tell you that I disagree.

09:24In your view, is my marriage to my wife a cross of mine?

09:29If we were, I guess, to apply that to you, the marriage and the relationship is something to put on

09:38the cross.

09:39Yes.

09:40Oh.

09:41Yeah.

09:41So my marriage is like, no, you got a divorce?

09:51That's a lot of paperwork, Jackie.

09:53I don't know what kind of time you think I have.

09:56But even if I agreed with you, I don't have that sort of, I don't have the brainpower for a

10:01divorce.

10:02Jackie and I spoke for hours, and she had her own questions for me.

10:06She asked me what advice I would give to Christians like her.

10:09I've talked to a lot of people this weekend who have been, like, really, really hurt.

10:17That your way of dealing with things is closer to the side that is causing harm and that spike in

10:24suicide rates and a great deal of hurt than the side of Christianity that I associate with.

10:32I know that you do everything with love, and I believe that you believe everything that you say.

10:38And I believe you have a beautiful life.

10:40But I do think that there is a lot of pain being caused in the church right now.

10:49And it's sort of a problem that they don't want to deal with.

10:52And I don't think that they want to discuss Christians like me, that we exist.

11:02LGBTQ adolescents that experience conversion therapy or rejection from their families and faith communities are eight times more likely to

11:11attempt suicide than those from accepting environments.

11:15I've never been to a Baptist service before, I don't think.

11:23Yeah?

11:24Did I do that right?

11:27This trip is going—I'm doubting everything.

11:30I'm doubting my faith, my abilities to drive a car.

11:33Am I even gay?

11:36I am.

11:37I'm very gay.

11:37This part hasn't changed.

11:40This is Leah Allen, a seminary student and a parishioner at Park Avenue Baptist Church.

11:45That's right, folks.

11:47This is an affirming Baptist church, one of only a handful in the entire state of Georgia.

11:51I think it was a surreal moment for me when I realized that I found a place like this that

11:58was not just feeding me emotionally and making me feel loved and being surrounded by such a diverse and inclusive

12:06community,

12:06but feeding me spiritually.

12:09A recent study found that more than 40% of queer people identify as Christian, so to invalidate our existence

12:16is both damaging and misguided.

12:19The fact of the matter is, Christians like me do exist.

12:23Whether you're the L, the G, the B, the T, the I, the A, or any other, any other light

12:28-iron representation identity in this beautiful spectrum that we call your people, your creation.

12:34And we don't say that we have pride because of what we do in our ourselves.

12:38We have pride in the creation that you have made.

12:41I take pride in the fact that you call me your child.

12:44I take pride in the fact that I am here on a Sunday in a place that I thought was

12:49not made.

12:50God of light, God of love, be with us now and always.

12:54May we be a bigger representation of what it means to follow Jesus in this world.

12:58In our time, Lord, may we see justice. In our time, Lord, may we see reconciliation. In our time, Lord,

13:04may we see care of Jesus.

13:09The Park Avenue service not only exceeded my expectations, it torpedoed them, because these parishioners have found a place of

13:16restoration in a faith group that so often casts them out.

13:19It was an experience that I will never forget.

13:26She wasn't ready for the spirit.

13:30Same. I just thought I was coming to church.

13:33Honey, you are coming to church, honey. That's how it works.

13:37I told me, I was like, there's a good chance I'm going to cry.

13:41Second song in.

13:43There she goes.

13:45Listen, you can't control the Holy Ghost, honey.

13:49When she wants to come up and say that you're loved, you better just receive it.

13:52Receive it.

13:53In this unique Baptist church, people feel God's love regardless of who they are.

13:59But for Leah, raised a traditional Baptist, coming out led to divisions at church and among family members.

14:07She came in the room and shook me and was like, you're not gay.

14:11And she was crying over me and, you know, telling the demon to come out.

14:15And I wish you were, you know, dead rather than be gay.

14:19I was so shocked.

14:21And I was also disappointed in myself because I knew that this was a moment where, like, they weren't proud

14:28of me.

14:28In that moment, you felt disappointment?

14:30Yeah.

14:30A lot of shame.

14:32Yeah, I went through, over the next few years, from that moment, coming in and out of the closet and

14:40trying to convince myself and tell them, like, you're right, I'm not gay.

14:44I'm not gay anymore.

14:44I'm going to marry a man.

14:45I'm going to have kids.

14:46And mentally and emotionally, I went to a very, very dark place.

14:52Yeah.

14:57Leah's path was not an easy one, but it was their faith that led them to a life-affirming realization.

15:03There's no division in me of, like, being black and being non-binary and being attracted to women.

15:10The sacred, the secular, it's all one spirit that was divinely created.

15:14God intentionally designed me to be different.

15:18And how beautifully diverse is God's creation, you know?

15:23Unfortunately, people limit God and limit the possibilities of God when they do that.

15:29What was, was there, like, a particular turning point to you and how you got to who I'm meeting now?

15:35I find confidence in knowing that there's a God who is so much bigger than the judgmental and narrow-minded

15:45people, you know, try to make God out to be.

15:48I call God mother, woman.

15:50I think God must be a woman because...

15:52Ariana Grande did make that very clear.

15:55The prophet Ariana Grande, she did say...

16:04In the end, I came to a point where I decided that I wasn't a believer.

16:10Christianity has done a lot of harm to the LGBTQ community throughout history.

16:16If you are part of a belief system that has systemically done harm to people,

16:21are you in any way contributing toward that harm by attaching that name of Christian or believer or whatever it

16:31is to yourself?

16:36God is so vast and so expansive and so big and so mysterious that God can be called by many

16:44names.

16:45Just know God exists.

16:47God is who God is.

16:49I am that I am.

16:50And how powerful is that?

16:56I think that it's a lot easier to say, like, you are gay or you're Christian.

17:00You can't be both.

17:01The way we interpret scripture is so different that it isn't even an agree to disagree.

17:07It's just we disagree.

17:08Yeah.

17:09I think people with my position and people with your position, we need to be friends more often.

17:14And we need to talk and we need to understand each other's perspectives.

17:16And we need to dialogue and challenge each other on things.

17:20And I think that cannot happen unless we're willing to be uncomfortable.

17:23Being uncomfortable can be a good thing.

17:26I feel inspired to keep stepping outside of my comfort zone in the hopes of bridging these cultural,

17:30spiritual, and political divides.

17:32So, no pressure, Grace.

17:44I'll see you next time.

The Life Threatening Dangers Of Gay Conversion Therapy | State Of Grace | Refinery29

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