Why Anti-Abortion Supporters Are Pro-Death Penalty | State Of Grace | Refinery29 - video Dailymotion

Refinery29

This week on State Of Grace, our host, Grace Baldridge explores the contradictions that exist between the people that support the Pro-Life movement and the Death Penalty. She speaks with activists and women who have lived through both experiences. Watch this video to better understand the importance of the right to choose!  https://plannedparenthood.org/  ABOUT SERIES State Of Grace is a series that explores the intersection of human rights, sexuality, and faith. Host Grace Baldridge dives into controversial societal realities that Americans face everyday and how to navigate the modern world while remaining faithful.   ABOUT REFINERY29  Refinery29 is a modern woman's destination for how to live a stylish, well-rounded life. http://refinery29.com/  RELATED CONTENT The Life Threatening Dangers Of Gay Conversion Therapy https://youtube.com/watch?v=HL5ThApf0IA The Scary Reality Of Sex Education In Alabama https://youtube.com/watch?v=j3ej5JBa95E The Dark Reality Of Celebrity Endorsed Mega-Churches https://youtube.com/watch?v=KLuB7fvMlhc  SUBSCRIBE TO REFINERY29 Subscribe to the Refinery29 channel: http://bit.ly/subscribe-to-r29  TALENT Follow Grace Baldridge on Instagram: https://instagram.com/gracebaldridge/ Follow Unbothered on Instagram: https://instagram.com/r29unbothered/ Follow OnHerTurf on Instagram: https://instagram.com/onherturf/ Follow Refinery29 on Instagram: https://instagram.com/refinery29/

Transcript

00:00Hey! Whoa! Whoa!

00:02Robey Wade has got to go for life!

00:04Woo! Woo! Woo!

00:08Fuck the earth! Fuck the state!

00:10Everyone must decide our fate! Fuck the state!

00:13Currently in America, there is a lot of time, energy, and money

00:16being spent on legislating and advocating for innocent, unborn lives.

00:21There are endless conversations swirling around regarding the boundaries of when life begins

00:26and the morality behind deciding when it ends.

00:28All these different stages of cellular development.

00:31Texas introduced a bill that would have made it possible for a woman to receive the death penalty for having

00:35an abortion.

00:36As a Christian, the extreme juxtaposition of life and death really fucked me up.

00:43Sorry, Mom.

00:44So let's talk about this.

00:46How are we, and the systems and institutions we've created in this country, valuing lives?

00:52In the battle to protect the innocent unborn, are we losing the fight for humanity?

00:58Texas is the execution capital of America, executing 561 of America's nearly 1,500 state-sanctioned homicides

01:06since the death penalty's reinstatement in 1976.

01:10And yet, Texas is also one of the states restricting the most access and government funding to abortion and reproductive

01:17health care centers.

01:19You know, if you believe that life begins at conception, alright, cool.

01:23How can you dictate that for someone else?

01:26Do you know the meaning of life?

01:29Does anyone in this car know the meaning of life?

01:31Yes.

01:34It is dogs.

01:36It is finding a dog.

01:45After you.

01:46I will not know where I'm going.

01:48One of the first places that they would probably come in would be to meet with a health center assistant

01:56and come in and get their medical history taken, blood pressure.

02:01This looks like a normal doctor's office.

02:03Just a doctor's office.

02:04This is one of our largest in terms of the number of exam rooms and it sees the most patients.

02:09Okay.

02:10Also, while I'm here, I've been eating really well.

02:11I would just like to kind of...

02:16What?

02:18Like six feet?

02:19Yeah.

02:20That's right, yeah.

02:21Extremely tall and good looking.

02:23And accurate.

02:23That's what I said.

02:25It's very strange.

02:26Your wheels are turning.

02:26I can see.

02:27I know, I know.

02:27I think I had my own idea of what to sort of expect.

02:30I kind of thought it would be more like serious and sad.

02:34I don't think it's what people expect when they hear Planned Parenthood.

02:38You're not the first.

02:39I mean, people walk in and they're like, wow, it's like a doctor's office.

02:42I'm like, yes.

02:44We're a health care provider.

02:46You're like this idiot.

02:47We're a show.

02:50Scientifically, where do we often make the distinction of when life begins?

02:54Well, I don't know that that's a scientific concept, right?

02:58So I think if you're talking about life of cells, there are cells that are on our skin.

03:02Sperms are cells.

03:03Eggs are cells.

03:04Different things are cells.

03:05Some people consider that life.

03:06I think scientifically, whether that's life or not, we don't usually debate that.

03:11That's more of an ethical concept.

03:12No matter how you define when life begins, an autonomous person contemplating an abortion

03:17is inarguably alive.

03:20In Texas, motherhood is risky business.

03:23Despite the spike in Texas' maternal mortality rate, during the most recent legislative session,

03:29lawmakers refused to expand Medicaid coverage to people who had just given birth.

03:34There are so many contradictions, right?

03:36Whether it's Medicaid coverage, you start looking at the foster care system and the number

03:39of people that are in the foster care system, the value of life becomes very different once

03:43somebody gives birth.

03:44Sort of a lack of consistency.

03:47Absolutely.

03:47It's only once a person is pregnant that they care about that pregnancy.

03:52We have heard it said, perhaps it's not so much as pro-life as pro-birth.

03:56I would agree with that.

03:57The conversation surrounding abortion in America has predominantly been driven by religious

04:02beliefs.

04:03You don't have to look too far to learn about the overwhelming Christian perspective on abortion.

04:08Abortion is a murder.

04:11What is often left out of the conversation is that the majority of people who have abortions

04:16are already parents.

04:17For example, 59% of the women having abortions in 2014 had already given birth before.

04:24And 62% reported a religious affiliation.

04:27These facts told me it was time to step outside my presumptions and listen.

04:32I had an abortion and it wasn't based on God.

04:37It wasn't based on any of that because God wasn't helping me pay the bills.

04:40God wasn't helping me, you know, put her to bed every night.

04:43Stephanie is a Christian and a single mother who found herself facing a difficult decision

04:48when she became pregnant for a second time while on birth control.

04:51I mean, I went to church every Sunday.

04:53I've definitely went from being like a Catholic Republican to like, you know, a non-denominational,

04:58you know, Democrat.

05:00I just couldn't choose a child that I didn't know over the child that I already had.

05:07Was it murder?

05:08I don't know.

05:09It wasn't about murder.

05:11It wasn't about any of that.

05:12It was, I just don't, I just can't do it.

05:16And God be damned, basically.

05:20No one looks at the mothers afterwards.

05:23The mothers seem to be the forgotten shells.

05:25You know, we make the babies, but we are forgotten afterwards.

05:27The process is just very unforgiving in so many ways that like, you know, if you have the abortion, how

05:33dare you?

05:33If you need assistance after having a child, how dare you?

05:36If you take child support, oh, well, you're just greedy.

05:39Until you can like take your crown and put it down and like come and like experience what some other

05:44people are experiencing, you just don't know.

05:46We're all religious or we all have our ideas, our belief systems until you don't.

05:53Until you're put into a situation where you have to put that aside and just be okay with what you

05:57did.

05:59How often do we actively challenge our own belief systems and test the boundaries of our faith?

06:05As a queer Christian, I've tested my faith regarding sexuality time and time again.

06:10But selfishly, I had never taken the time to question the religious perspective on abortion.

06:14Because, well, honestly, it scares the crap out of me.

06:18I have to ask myself, if I'm terrified to have this conversation, how much more scared is a woman who

06:26has no sense that she can control her body?

06:30Reverend Keaton King is a Presbyterian pastor in Houston and has made it her lifelong mission to stand in support

06:36of a woman's right to choose.

06:38Her faith informs her that standing beside Planned Parenthood is what Jesus would do.

06:44There's this story traditionally known to the church as the Annunciation.

06:49It's when the angel Gabriel comes to tell Mary that she will become pregnant and that she will bear the

06:56Son of God.

06:57When the angel comes to her and makes this announcement, the angel could have departed immediately if the only goal

07:03of their interaction was to deliver this news.

07:07I'm going to be like, peace.

07:08Yeah. You're going to be pregnant. Bye.

07:10That's not what happened.

07:12Mary got the opportunity to ask questions, and the angel actually gives her an answer.

07:17She gets to ask questions about her body and her future and engage her maker with those questions.

07:22What happens next is amazing.

07:24She says, let it be with me, according to your word.

07:28Mary gives consent.

07:29To me, that says that God gave women choice and expects us to use it.

07:36I have never heard that before.

07:40Have you ever engaged with someone who disagrees with you on this issue from a similar faith perspective?

07:46And how did that conversation go?

07:48Their background assumption was that a woman seeking abortion was perhaps careless.

07:55Christians are so fond of quoting John 3, 16.

07:58But what John 3, 17, the very next verse says, is God did not send Jesus into the world to

08:04condemn the world.

08:06How does your faith inform your opinion on capital punishment?

08:10Jesus is not about our condemnation and is not interested in justice, which is retributive.

08:17No matter what someone has done, that does not cut them off from God's love.

08:23Retributive justice is based in suffering.

08:25It's the concept that if you do something wrong, you deserve to pay the price.

08:29But should the ultimate price be death?

08:32I guess in reflecting on the people we've spoken with on this trip and hearing where different people draw the

08:39lines on life and death,

08:44as informed by faith, science, politics, experience.

08:50I'm very mindful of how vague and difficult to define life is.

08:59But death is an absolute.

09:00How are you making that definitive decision on just the grand mystery of life that we're all going to spend

09:10our lifetimes trying to figure out?

09:16It feels like a really crazy thing to crazy and bold, very bold, and potentially, and as we're seeing, quite

09:26dangerous to govern in absolutes on something that is so mysterious.

09:34And not really care too much, it seems, for the consequences of things like capital punishment.

09:47Death is an absolute.

09:50I can't make sense of that.

09:52It became really evident to me that if we're going to enforce state-sanctioned birth, we also need to be

09:58talking about state-sanctioned death.

10:00I was driving down the street to go to a regular church meeting at night.

10:05And there was a group of people over here just on Main Street with signs.

10:11And I became curious about that.

10:14And sure enough, there was an execution going on.

10:18And so I thought, seriously, while I'm driving down the street just a few feet away, they are killing someone?

10:27And worse yet, they are killing that person in my name.

10:30It's on behalf of the residents of the state of Texas that this person is literally being taken from life

10:39to death.

10:41Rev. Cheryl Smith is currently a pastor at John Wesley United Methodist in Houston, Texas.

10:46But she spent years pastoring and standing vigil outside the execution center at the Huntsville Prison, the nation's busiest death

10:54chamber.

10:56Some people will draw on religious language and say, well, you know, in the Bible it talks about an eye

11:03for an eye and a tooth for a tooth.

11:05I also speak religious language, but that's not the religious language I speak.

11:10I follow a man who talked about a different kind of justice.

11:15And I believe we need to be doing a lot more about justice in this world.

11:21It is not justice when little children go to bed hungry.

11:26It is not justice when children do not get equal and good educations.

11:33It is not justice that children are not well served up to this point.

11:38And then we start punishing them and maybe even putting them to death.

11:42Do I get to change the rules about how I value and treat people based on what they've done?

11:50You could even value and treat another life.

11:54Another life, which is like the life I've been given.

11:58I didn't earn it. I got it. I was born with it.

12:02Everybody gets born with this gift of life.

12:05Do I get to decide based on somebody else's behavior how much dignity they're going to have?

12:12I don't think they become some other class of creation just because they made bad choices.

12:21As Christians, we're called to love all image bearers, knowing that sin is intrinsically built into our humanity.

12:27But what obligation does our country have in valuing the lives of those who have broken the law?

12:33There's a bit of a righteousness that people feel in supporting the death penalty that I think is quite strong.

12:38I used to feel it myself.

12:39As a self-proclaimed conservative, Hannah Cox was formerly a supporter of the death penalty.

12:45But through her policy work with the National Alliance on Mental Illness,

12:48Hannah became aware of the issues within the criminal justice system

12:52and is now the national manager for an organization called Conservatives Concerned About the Death Penalty.

12:58How often are we getting things wrong with regards to death penalty cases?

13:04So we know that at least one out of every ten people on death row,

13:07one person for every ten executions has been fully exonerated, which is another level of innocence.

13:13Are you serious?

13:13Yeah.

13:14On top of that, we know there's been over 800 exonerations for people who committed homicide but were not sentenced

13:19to death.

13:20One pushback I get a lot from people in the pro-life movement is that they only believe in protecting

13:25innocent life.

13:26And I have a lot of problems with that statement.

13:28One, even if that is how you're caging your support for the death penalty,

13:32that's not a valid argument because there is so much innocent life caught up in the death penalty.

13:36But secondly, again, I don't see anywhere in scripture where you get to only care about innocent life.

13:41And what is innocent life?

13:42We've all committed wrong.

13:43And if it were not for Jesus coming, we'd all be given a death sentence.

13:46So in all state studies that we've done, we see that in 96 percent of cases,

13:51there was evidence of racial bias against the defendant or the victim or both.

13:56And if you look right out the gate, who do we decide we pursue capital crimes against?

14:00It's for people who kill white people.

14:02We see a system that says some victims' lives matter more than others.

14:05It feels somewhat hypocritical that there's a major movement to criminalize abortion,

14:10to protect what is considered an innocent life.

14:13But the same energy is not given to saving that same life if they commit a crime.

14:18Is anything truly unforgivable in the eyes of God?

14:23I have a recording of his last interview before he was murdered by the state.

14:40Lee Greenwood is the mother of Joseph Nichols, a man convicted of murder and executed in Texas as a result

14:46of the Law of Parties.

14:48The Law of Parties states that a person can be criminally responsible for the actions of another in certain circumstances.

14:54This law seeks to punish criminal associations and impose harsh penalties for even being linked to a felony through a

15:01conspiracy or planned crime.

15:04This means that while Joseph's accomplice pled guilty and was executed for the killing,

15:08Joseph was eventually retried and suffered the same consequences as the man who was initially convicted of firing the fatal

15:15shot.

15:16Joseph was executed in Harris County, Texas on March 7, 2007, 25 years after his arrest.

15:25Do you recall a time that you or Joseph were ever hopeful?

15:29We were always hopeful. I was told by various attorneys, he may have done six months at California Youth Authority.

15:37Maybe he may have even gotten probation.

15:42But I soon learned that the thing about justice was a false.

15:52Especially in Harris County, Houston, Texas.

15:56I wonder what would you say to someone who is in support of the death penalty?

16:04I believe I wouldn't have anything to say to them simply because all the things that they have heard or

16:11read in recent years

16:12about persons being exonerated that were on death row, if that had not convinced them, I certainly can.

16:19And I would venture to say that most of those people probably sit in some church every Sunday.

16:26Do you consider yourself a person of faith?

16:28I do.

16:29How did the execution of your son impact your faith?

16:34I asked always that Joseph be free.

16:38Now, I didn't specify how he'd be free. I just wanted him free.

16:44So if you believe in God or whoever your higher power is, you have to believe and have to be

16:51willing to accept whatever the outcome is.

16:56Joseph said in the last days,

17:01Lady, stand on your faith and be at peace.

17:04I got this.

17:06If he could say that, who am I to dishonor him by falling on the floor, rolling and flailing and

17:13crying and all of that?

17:16The day that we went to visit Joseph for the last time, which was a Wednesday, we were turned toward

17:23a big window.

17:24And when they opened the curtains, they had already strapped him down on the gurney.

17:29They allowed us to hear his heartbeat until it was no more.

17:36If it makes one person not maybe change their idea or the way they look at the death penalty, if

17:46it just makes them start thinking.

17:49It won't bring Joseph back.

17:52But Joseph doesn't have to be brought back in the body.

17:55He's here and in his family and his friends mind and hearts every day.

18:00So as far as I'm concerned, Joseph will never mentally die.

18:05He's always in our minds.

18:08We all have to die.

18:12We were born to die.

18:14Not to be morbid, but Lee is right.

18:17We're all born to die.

18:18And the inevitability of death challenges me to examine how I live and how I can honor the lives around

18:24me.

18:25I strongly believe in the mystery of faith and impossible questions about life and death only reinforce this belief.

18:32But these impossible questions and strongly held opinions should not be used to divide us, but to encourage us to

18:39lean closer.

18:40Take a moment to listen, adjust our lens, and understand the lived experience of someone different than ourselves.

18:48Because when we're valuing each other, we're valuing life.

18:53Thank you so much for watching Refinery29.

18:56For more videos, click here.

18:57And to subscribe, click here.

Why Anti-Abortion Supporters Are Pro-Death Penalty | State Of Grace | Refinery29

Category

Transcript

Comments

Recommended