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This edition of News Today focusses on record voter turnout in West Bengal and Tamil Nadu assembly elections.
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00:00Good evening, hello and welcome. You're with the news today, your prime time destination,
00:04news without the noise. Let's tell you what we have for you on the show tonight, this Thursday
00:09night. The big talking point, what does the record high turnout in West Bengal and Tamil Nadu mean
00:15for the elections in the two big battleground states of 2026? What are the X factors that
00:21could decide that mandate? Also, our special focus, how one citizen's anger over streets
00:27blocked by a political rally in Mumbai has sparked a nationwide debate on the right to protest?
00:33Is it conditional or unchecked? What about the inconvenience faced by the public? Lots to
00:39talk about on the show, but first as always, it's time for the 9 headlines at 9.
00:45Record voter turnout in Bengal's Phase 1 polls and in Tamil Nadu since independence. 92% turnout
00:53in Bengal. Tamil Nadu records 85% voting. Chief Election Commissioner Gyanesh Kumar salutes the
01:00voters of the two states. Bengal phase 1 polls marred by stray incidents of violence, stone felting and
01:11vandalism in Murshidabad. A BJP candidate's attacked in Asan Sol Dinajpur. Whole body seeks a detailed report.
01:22Campaigning for the phase 2 polls in Bengal hits top gear. Prime Minister Modi hits out and
01:27Mamata over a Jalmuri Rao. Bengal Chief Minister accuses Home Minister Amit Chowk intimidating officials.
01:37A shocker in the national capital, chilling confession by an accused Rahul in an IRS officer's daughter's
01:44sexual assault and murder case. Says if Didi would have given me money, this wouldn't have happened.
01:52In an exclusive conversation with India today, former Army Chief General Naravune speaks out on his
02:00unpublished book, Controversy. Says government always had total faith in armed forces.
02:07A tragic accident report in Uttarakhand's Tehri Gadwal. Eight killed after a bus plunges into a gorge. Prime
02:15Minister Modi announces exgratia of rupees 2 lakhs for the kin of the accused of the deceased.
02:24Donald Trump now issues an order to shoot any boat suspected of laying mines in the Strait of Hormuz.
02:32Iran shows off its control over Hormuz by releasing a video of its commando storming a cargo ship.
02:42Damage controlled by the U.S. after Trump amplifies a podcast calling India and China a hellhole nation.
02:50U.S. Embassy spokesperson claims Trump calls India a great country. MEA takes note but says little else.
03:00A heat wave is gripping North India. Delhi sizzles above 42 degrees. Weather department says temperatures could
03:07soar further in the coming week.
03:24But the story that we are breaking right at the very top. The latest figures have come for the
03:29turnout in the two big battleground states that have gone to the polls today. West Bengal phase one and
03:34Tamil Nadu the entire state. 92.28% is the turnout reported from Bengal. 85.05% turnout in Tamil
03:44Nadu.
03:45Remember this is as of the latest figure. The Chief Election Commissioner Yanesh Kumar
03:50has pointed out that this is the highest turnout since independence and has congratulated the voters
03:57So clearly a very high voter turnout. Remember also partly because after the SIR exercise, the review of
04:05electoral rolls, a number of dead voters or those who had been moved out had been deleted. So those figures
04:11also need to be taken into account when we look at the turnout in these two states. But a lot
04:18of attention of
04:19course, today was first on the battleground for West Bengal, where there's plenty at stake, both for the
04:25ruling Trinamul Congress, seeking a fourth consecutive victory, as well as for the BJP, hoping to break into
04:32Mamata Banerjee's fortress. Elections in Bengal today were affected only by isolated instances of violence. A former
04:39TMC leader, Humayun Kabir, who has floated his own party, was attacked by angry mobs in
04:44Murshidabad. And two BJP candidates also claimed that they were targeted by the TMC. Here is a report
04:51on what happened in the first phase of voting, which saw, as I said, very high turnout, but stray
04:57instances of violence. Take a look. As phase one of polling was underway, the familiar specter of
05:04clashes and chaos returned to haunt the electoral battlefield. The biggest flashpoint, Murshidabad.
05:13Clashes intensified after a mob attacked AJ-UP chief and Nauda candidate Humayun Kabir's car,
05:20pushing the situation to the brink. Kabir came under attack during a sit-in protest.
05:25Dramatic visuals showed mobs some carrying TMC flags, chasing his vehicle,
05:31raising serious questions over law and order in this crucial district.
05:59The violence, he says, stemmed from the aftermath of a crude bomb attack in Nauda,
06:05on the eve of polling. In South Dinajpur's Kumar Ganj, BJP candidate Chubhendu Shorkar was allegedly
06:11assaulted at a polling booth after raising booth-jamming allegations. Police had to step in and
06:17rescue him and rescue him, and he was forced to flee the scene.
06:45In Asana, Seoul, BJP candidate Agni Mitra Polskar got attacked too.
06:50According to her, the incident occurred in Varanpur's Rahmat Nagar while she was inspecting
06:55polling booths. As she was leaving the area, a stone was allegedly hurled at her vehicle from
07:01behind, shattering the rear glass.
07:22High turnout, higher stakes, and an even higher pitch of political confrontation. As Bengal votes,
07:30the battle for power is unfolding, not just through ballots, but amid allegations, clashes,
07:36and a deepening war of narratives. Bureau Report, India Today.
07:42Let's turn from Bengal to the other big battleground state of Tamil Nadu, which witnessed its highest
07:47turnout ever. The X Factor here, of course, actor-turned-politician Vijay and his TVK, the newbie
07:54party. Huge excitement about the superstar amongst the youth and women voters. While, of course,
07:59a lot of the attention is on Vijay, there is also a chance for the DMK and MK's talent to
08:04do what
08:04even his father, Kalignar Karnanidhi, could not do, get re-elected after a five-year term. And AIDMK
08:11chief, E. Palani Sami, hoping to establish himself as the undisputed leader and the challenger
08:20leader of the AIDMK. There were protests over, in some parts, over vehicles that were being stopped. But by and
08:29large,
08:29Tamil Nadu's polling was extremely peaceful.
08:34So let's raise the big questions on this big polling day. What does the high turnout in West Bengal and
08:40Tamil Nadu mean
08:42for potentially the results in these states? Do women and youth hold the key to the final verdict?
08:49X-Factors, SIR in Bengal and Vijay in Tamil Nadu? Some of the questions I want to raise with top
08:56pollsters.
08:57Joining me now, Pradeep Gupta, Chairman and Managing Director, Access My India. Sanjay Kumar,
09:03Co-Director, Lokneeti CSDS. And joining me now, Yashwan Deshmukh of Cvota. Good to have all of you on the
09:10show today.
09:10Let me start with you, Pradeep. What do you make out of these big turnout numbers? Both in Tamil Nadu
09:17and
09:17West Bengal, we are seeing a record turnout. Does it indicate anti-incumbency? Are these high voter
09:24turnout suggesting that voters could be voting to remove a government? Can we draw such conclusions at all?
09:33Rajdeep, thank you for having me here. This conclusion of voter turnout versus it is favouring to the
09:39incumbent or the challenger is the olden days theory. It does not have any kind of empirical
09:46evidence in the recent past of last 20 years. Does higher voter turnout has favour or against any
09:53incumbent government? So let's not get into that, I would say at this point.
10:00Interesting. You're saying don't look at the turnout figures because remember, as we need to reiterate,
10:05these high voter turnouts also are partly because a number of dead voters have been deleted under SIR.
10:12So there were voter deletions. But what matters then more according to you, Pradeep? Is it gender
10:17breakup, particularly in states like West Bengal and Tamil Nadu, where women voters have often been
10:22seen to make a difference in this past? Should we say if it's a higher voter turnout,
10:26would you see that as the real significance more than actual overall voter turnout numbers?
10:34Let's keep the voter turnout outside this point of time. But I can tell you with my experience and
10:41study, whatever we have done so far, this is definitely not an exit point. But we are trying to
10:46understand the political dynamics playing in on the ground as on date. So when it comes to Tamil Nadu,
10:54this time two demography, two demography will be at play, which is the age and which is the gender,
11:02age and gender. This time cash doesn't matter. Most important and the X factor as we've been talking
11:10about is going to be definitely Vijay, the TVK. Only X factor in this election is going to be Vijay,
11:17the TVK. So this is the Tamil Nadu. Now coming to the Bengal,
11:22again in Bengal, gender is, has to be, has to play a very vital role, particularly when
11:27it comes to Mumtab energy, the male and female vote differently. Even in Bengal, we have seen in the
11:35recent past, if not very far, you know, historical, this thing. Now, the second and most important thing,
11:42this time is going to be, to be important to see is the, whether BJP is able to dent the
11:51precedency
11:52region, fort of Mumtab energy at the TMC, where 108 seat is there in that precedency, which is a sizable
12:01number. At best in 2019, if you see, BJP could secure the lead in 28 assembly segment,
12:10versus the 21 assembly election, only 14. So 14 versus 108, this is something very interesting to
12:18see. Medhnipur and Bardaban, BJP has done fairly good and of course in North Bengal, but Malda and
12:25Mursidabad, you know, the TMC and the very minority dominant area. So I would say at this point of time,
12:32the gender, how male and female voting pattern, and how presidency, which is going to vote in second
12:40phase. Okay. So what you're saying, Vijay factor, Vijay factor matters most in Tamil Nadu. Gender
12:47breakup and how the second phase, the presidency phase, which TMC has dominated in the past,
12:52where does that vote go? Yashwan Deshmukh, what's your takeaway from these high record voter turnouts?
13:00Could that suggest change? Pradeep Gupta says, there is no such formula left anymore.
13:05Do you, what is that key X factor according to you that will be decisive?
13:11Well, Rasteep, first of all, as you said earlier, that the baseline has become lower. So high turnout
13:18within the same universe should not become as a statistical surprise. You know, if last time
13:26100 voters voted and 80 out of 100 voted and those numbers have come down to 90 voters in universe,
13:34then obviously the same universe, same 80 would look like a 90. Having said that, I am not denying
13:39that the turnout has been higher. Let's wait for the absolute numbers to come out. But what has drawn
13:44my interest in the last two years is the female votes and female turnout. You know, arguably it has
13:52been the female turnout in all those elections since 2024 that we have seen surprising results. It was
13:59all driven by the female turnout. And I was just looking at the numbers in Bengal and in Tamil Nadu,
14:06both the female turnout so far that has been reported by election commission is more than the
14:14male turnout. Of course, it is not as big a gap as in case of Bihar that we had seen,
14:20but it is
14:21significant. When you look into the state specific numbers, it is significantly higher. The female
14:26turnout is significantly higher than the male turnout. And I was also looking into the history of male and
14:32female turnout and its impact. In both these states, I have found some earringly similar trends in that
14:39way. AIA, TMK and TMC have been a natural, you know, natural gainers. Whenever the female turnout has
14:52gone beyond the male turnout, significantly one or two points more or even more. But whenever the female
15:00turnout has gone down at par with the male turnout or male turnout has gone more, in those times,
15:06it's the DMK which has taken advantage in Tamil Nadu. And it is the BJP say, for example, in 2019
15:12Lok Sabha elections, when the female turnout was got below and it was at par with the male turnout. And
15:19BJP scores significantly in that. So, purely going from that, I would keep a keen eye on how
15:26the female turnouts are looking at it. And particularly in Tamil Nadu, where I am, I am told
15:32that the urban turnout is, this time has been at par with the rural turnout. That is a very significant
15:40scope of research form. That, okay, because that brings, of course, the, not just the women
15:46voter in play, but the youth factor, the Vijay factor in Tamil Nadu. Tamil Nadu, in that sense,
15:51has this new X factor, Vijay. Has he got a large section of the youth vote? Where have the women
15:57voted? In Jailalita's time, they used to usually go with the AIDM, Jailalita is no longer there. How
16:02does the gender ratio work in Tamil Nadu? But there's the SIR factor also, Sanjay Kumar Ji.
16:08Because in 90 lakh voters off the rolls, does that make a difference? Is that part of the problem that
16:15you will have in a state like West Bengal, particularly with marginal constituencies,
16:21where margins were low last time? How does SIR become an X factor, if at all?
16:28Yes, to some extent, it's because if the voters have been deleted, and disproportionately of different
16:36communities, and we know how different communities vote. So it will certainly be seen as an X factor,
16:42I will, we would certainly see as an X factor. But I would go along with what Pradeep Ji and
16:47Yashwan Ji has already mentioned, women turnout is going to be key in West Bengal. And elections
16:53after elections, we have seen women turnout high. And not only high, women have decisively voted in
16:59favour of Trinamool Congress. So if women turnout, that's going to be a real X factor along with other
17:05factors, one which we have already mentioned, the deletion of votes in different constituencies
17:09or in different districts. You know, you're mentioning the M factor, which is Mahila. What
17:16about the Y factor, Sanjay Kumar Ji, which is Yuva? You know, in Tamil Nadu, when I travelled,
17:21I saw the Yuva were gravitating towards Vijay. Is Vijay potentially just a vote cutter?
17:27If these numbers hold, could he be much more than that? And could he become the big surprise of 2026?
17:34So we are talking about M and Y, Mahila and Yuva. Mahila is going to be a bigger factor in
17:39West
17:40Bengal. And Yuva could be a bigger factor in Tamil Nadu. I'm not saying that Yuva will not be a
17:45factor
17:45in West Bengal. But in West Bengal, I get a sense that Yuva vote will be tilted in favour of
17:52BJP. But
17:53Yuva factor is going to be the young youth vote is going to be a big factor in Tamil Nadu.
17:59Yashwan Ji has
18:00already indicated that it seems urban turnout has been higher. So if urban turnout has been higher,
18:06I would suspect young voter to be turning out in slightly bigger numbers compared to the past
18:12election. And I think if we look at, if there are some trends, the young voter may have got shifted,
18:19tilted in favour of the Vijay. And he is going to play an important role. I can't say at this
18:25moment,
18:25how important role he is going to play in these elections. But yes, it is an election to watch.
18:32Voting has already taken place. We will get to know on 4th of May. But I think it is an
18:37interesting
18:37elections to watch in Tamil Nadu, interesting results to watch in Tamil Nadu now.
18:43You know, I'm fascinated by the Vijay factor. And Pradeep Gupta, it's interesting when I asked you
18:48initially, you said also look at the age factor. 40% of Tamil Nadu's population under the age of 39.
18:55And you seem to suggest, I repeat that that is where the Vijay vote could be coming for.
19:00Am I right that you're saying don't look at caste in Tamil Nadu this time as we traditionally did,
19:05did look at age. If in Bengal, we are looking closely at gender in Tamil Nadu, look at the age
19:11factor.
19:14Yes. And another factor adding to this and leading to this, the age and gender both. Traditionally,
19:22AI-DMK, because of Jay Jay Lalita, female always used to vote at least three to four percentage points
19:29more than the male in favor of AI-DMK. And when it comes to DMK, it is the younger generation
19:36they used
19:37to favor to DMK. So younger generation and the female, these are the two consistency where TVK
19:46is going to dent for sure. There is another final factor I want to look at, Yashwan, which is the
19:52migrant worker. A number of migrants have gone back to Bengal to vote. Now, many fear believe that they
19:59fear that their names otherwise would be struck off the roll. Is that a factor? How easy is it to
20:03measure
20:03that migrant voters moving, going back to Bengal? Could have sophologists pick up a trend like that?
20:10And which way those voting preferences will be? Well, we did pick up that factor in Bihar for sure.
20:17I mean, it was a similar kind of situation. And there was a fact, in fact, a significant chunk of
20:23Bihar voters who stayed back just to vote in Bihar, even though there was quite a significant gap between
20:29their vacations and the polling dates. But that we have seen. But in terms of deletions as well,
20:35Rajdeep, the anomaly was that the seats where the maximum number of votes got deleted
20:40were lost by BJP. It was the seats which RJD won, AIMIM won those seats. So deletion is equal to
20:50BJP's victory is not a straightforward equation that oversimplifying in a very, very oversimplifying
20:58way it has been analyzed in media. Bihar results disapprove of that, number one. Number two,
21:04migrants, yes, they have gone back largely because overwhelming majority of them belong to BPL class,
21:10lower income group, and they fear that their name would be chopped off from so many welfare schemes if
21:18they do not go out and vote. So there was a fear factor of sort of going through. So they
21:25have
21:25gone out and they have got and voted. But in order to understand where exactly they have voted, that
21:32is something which we will be able to gather only in the post-poll analysis. But by and large, similar
21:38anger was there among the migrant voters, but they did not seem to be voting against the JDU in Bihar.
21:46So the anger or problem with the process may or may not impact their political choice of political
21:52decisions. So it's fairly complicated. I take your point. I take your point. It's far more complex.
22:0030 seconds, Sanjay Kumar. If you were a betting man, and I know you're not, do these numbers give the
22:06incumbent hope or the opposition hope? Tonight, who will sleep better looking at these numbers in
22:13Tamil Nadu and West Bengal? The incumbent or the anti-incumbent?
22:17My own sense is that I'm not looking at these numbers, but I'm looking at the past electoral
22:22results. And if I look at the past electoral results, I think it should give the incumbent a
22:28better sleep compared to the party which is challenging the incumbent.
22:34Okay, that's as precise as you can get, Sanjay Kumar. I will leave it there. We'll all wait to see
22:39what
22:39happens on the 29th exit polls, not too far away. And then, of course, voting day on the 4th.
22:44Yashwan Deshmukh, Pradeep Gupta, Sanjay Kumar for joining me here on the news today. Thank you very much.
22:51Okay, let's turn from there to our special focus tonight, because in Mumbai, one video is going
22:58viral at the moment. The video that we highlighted only yesterday of a woman stuck in a massive traffic
23:04jam caused by a BJP-led protest on Nari Shakti in the heart of the city earlier this week. The
23:11woman
23:11who was seen on camera berating the police and the politicians and the ministers has caught the
23:16imagination of a city that has been often inconvenienced by rallies, protests and road shows.
23:22Today we want to discuss, is the right to protest unfettered or subject to reasonable restrictions?
23:29First, take a look at this report.
23:36Political rallies blocking roads is nothing new in India.
23:42Most citizens suffer silently. But one chose not to.
23:53On Tuesday, the BJP's Jan Akrosh rally to protest against the defeat of the Women's Quota Min Min Bill
23:59met with some serious akrosh from an angry citizen.
24:07A woman fed up waiting on the road, stuck in a jam during rush hour, confronted the police first.
24:30And then took on the state minister, Girish Mahajan, who was leading the rally.
24:35No, no, what is wrong with you? There are hundreds of people waiting. There is an empty ground there.
24:43There is an empty ground. Yes. Get out of here.
24:55Later, the minister admitted roadblocks affected people, but defended the protest,
25:01claiming it had got the required permissions.
25:13The police had got the right to get the right to get in the front.
25:15The police, which made that the traffic came to court,
25:16the police nicely ruined the people.
25:16The traffic also has been confirmed.
25:18But in this situation, you know, it is an essential word.
25:21You can tell someone who will also say something.
25:24You can tell someone who will say something.
25:25But the police have been demonized by taking over the streets.
25:29Even the police have been a bonnet water.
25:30The police have put in the Trump administration.
25:31They have put in the Trump administration.
25:35The police has now filed an FIR against the organisers of the rally.
25:43The incident sparked a debate on the internet.
25:46Right to protest versus public convenience.
25:51In the past, farmers' protest and anti-CAA protest have seen roads being blocked for
25:57months on end.
26:02Where do you stand?
26:04Is right to protest subject to restrictions or unfettered?
26:10EuroReport, India Today.
26:16Okay, so let's raise the big question.
26:18Has the time come to ban political roadshows and rallies on weekdays in the heart of our
26:24cities?
26:25Can these political protests be allowed to inconvenience citizens any longer?
26:31And the right to protest, is it unconditional or is it fettered and subject to reasonable
26:37restrictions?
26:38Those are the questions we'll raise now.
26:42Okay, my first guest on this contentious issue is Dr. Kiran Bedi, the country's first woman
26:48IPS officer, someone who's dealt with traffic among all the other issues over the years.
26:52Dr. Kiran Bedi, how do you see this right to protest?
26:55Should political parties be allowed in peak hours to do these protest rallies in the heart
27:00of a city like what happened in Mumbai or do you believe citizens have every right to
27:04object and say enough is enough?
27:07Dr. Kiran Bedi, they have every right to object as enough is enough.
27:10Because enough is becoming enough.
27:13Dr. Kiran Bedi, roads are not for rallies like these.
27:15Dr. Kiran Bedi, roads are not for them.
27:17So therefore, they should be declined when a permission, request permission comes to the deputy
27:23commissioner or the district magistrate or the superintendent of police.
27:26They must keep the public discomfort in mind and then regret it and instead give them another
27:33place to go and do a rally or a protest.
27:36The police can suggest another place and always remember these rallies are with restrictions
27:42and permissions and they ought not to be violated and if they violate, they are responsible.
27:50Dr. Kiran Bedi, how is the police going to lay this red line, ma'am, when it's the government
27:56in power?
27:56For example, in Maharashtra, this was a Nari Shakti rally organized by the BJP.
28:01We've seen it in Kolkata with the Thinamul Congress doing it.
28:04Parties in power often organize dharna's protests in the heart of a city.
28:08So which police officer is going to say no?
28:11How many police officers have the spine to say no to whichever party is in power that you
28:15cannot have this dharna or roadshow in the heart of a city?
28:19Well, that's the responsibility they have taken and they have to account for.
28:24So they have to regret it.
28:25The district magistrate, the district collector and the superintendent of police, both of them.
28:32It is their duty.
28:34They cannot pass it on.
28:35They cannot say people…
28:36You're saying it's a duty.
28:39Ma'am, you're saying it's a duty.
28:40But as I said, we've seen over the years, now you have religious processions one day,
28:45you have political processions the next, and all of them often go through the heart of
28:50the city, causing huge inconvenience.
28:52Can?
28:52Are you saying there should be a designated area, designated time, which is the way the
28:57police should function?
28:58Surely that's already there as a standard operating protocol.
29:01I don't even need to emphasize this.
29:02So why does it happen?
29:03Why in the heart of Mumbai was there this protest?
29:08The onus is on the superintendent of police.
29:10Don't the political parties know about it?
29:13Well, the point is the responsible people are the collector and the superintendent of police.
29:18They cannot be saying we were under pressure.
29:21No.
29:21Are they going to write it, saying we are permitting under pressure?
29:24This is their responsibility.
29:26Problem is that it's violation too often.
29:29Responsibility is theirs.
29:30They can make conditions.
29:32Supposing they allow, and they may be, they allow, then they put lots of regulations.
29:37They will not, they will choose only one fourth of the road, or they'll stick on pavements,
29:42etc.
29:42They can do the restrictions.
29:44But the onus is of the superintendent.
29:46They must realize it.
29:48This is what these positions are meant for.
29:52So you're saying the onus is on the police officer or the collector, not on the political party in power,
29:57shouldn't they be showing greater responsibility?
29:59They seem more and more entitled.
30:00They don't care what happens to a taxpaying citizen, because they've already got our votes.
30:05No, permission is not by the politician.
30:08Permission is recorded in writing by the area.
30:12In fact, it's the area.
30:14No, no, but the responsibility.
30:16Are you saying, are you saying the political, are you saying the government or political party
30:19has no responsibility at all?
30:21They will simply ask for permission, and if the police officer gets it, they don't really
30:25care what happens to citizens.
30:26Do the politicians have a responsibility, or it's only the officers?
30:30No, they will, they will say we were permitted.
30:33So why are you permitting them?
30:34They will get away by saying, well, we've been permitted.
30:37So why the superintendent or the deputy commissioner of the district?
30:41So they will say they've been permitted.
30:43So what do you do?
30:44Why are you permitting them?
30:46Don't permit them.
30:47Don't permit them.
30:49They cannot overrule you.
30:51It's because…
30:52They can violate you.
30:53They can violate you, but they cannot overrule.
30:56Sure.
30:57So, you know, my final question, is it because everyone knows the rules,
31:01there are Supreme Court orders also in this regard, is the problem really with the fact
31:07that the police today can no longer challenge the political executive.
31:11That is the reality on the ground.
31:12They feel, particularly if the protest is organized by the party in power,
31:17if the protest is organized by a civil society group or opposition,
31:20we find that the police can crack down, or often does crack down.
31:23But when it is the party in power that organizes it, like in Mumbai, the police seems powerless.
31:29No, police is not powerless.
31:32It's choosing to be powerless when it permits wrongly.
31:35And the discomfort of the public is overlooked.
31:38Responsibility towards public discomfort, law and order, traffic maintenance is of the area
31:44that the police and the collectors together.
31:47So, if they violate, if they are succumbing to pressure, the accountability is theirs, not anybody else's.
31:54Others are only violating if they don't permit.
31:58Okay.
31:59I'm going to leave it there.
32:00Dr. Kiran Bedi, for some plain speaking there, you're putting the entire onus in a way on the administrative machinery
32:05here.
32:06Thank you very much for joining me.
32:08You're welcome.
32:10Okay.
32:10Let's widen the debate at this point.
32:12Joining me now is author and columnist and Mumbaikar Shobha Deh joins me.
32:18Also joined by Shaina NC of the Shiv Sena and Anish Gawande of the NCP Sharad Pawar.
32:24Thank you all very much for joining us.
32:26Shobha Deh, do you empathize with the woman who stood up to the police and said,
32:31enough is enough, get out of the way, do not allow the traffic to be congested in this manner
32:37because of a political rally, the way she shouted and ranted at the police and the minister?
32:41Do you empathize with her?
32:45I completely empathize with her and she spoke on behalf of thousands of women in similar circumstances.
32:55The point is, a young mother's voice at a time like this has shaken up Mumbai, has shaken up India
33:03in a way
33:03because she spoke not just for herself, she spoke on behalf of anybody who is inconvenienced
33:10and the Mumbaikar is tested on a daily basis.
33:13Their endurance is tested on a daily basis.
33:16And here was this very courageous person, obviously at her wit's end, and she said enough.
33:24She did not resort to abuse.
33:26She just was aggressive and she had rage.
33:30And why not?
33:32I mean, when she said what she said, I'm not trying to make a hero out of her, but something
33:37snaps.
33:38For a lot of Mumbaikers, a lot of things snap, but they don't have the courage or the guts to
33:44take on a Neta who has appropriated a street, a public street, for heaven's sake.
33:50I mean, the public roads are not meant exclusively for the use of politicians.
33:54And as she rightly pointed out, there was a maidan right next door.
33:57I also disagree with what maybe someone else said earlier about the onus not being on the political party.
34:06It's very much on the political party taking advantage of the fact that the cops are not going to challenge
34:13whatever the political party decides,
34:16whichever route the political party wants to take, for whatever the protest might be, it's all the rule books are
34:23thrown out of the window.
34:24Which is why the police should have calmed the woman down and tried to bring about some order.
34:31But they were kowtowing to the Neta.
34:35And now, in retrospect, the Neta has a lot to say.
34:38And sorry, it's unacceptable.
34:41The Mumbaiker is fed up.
34:43They're challenged all the time.
34:46Mumbai does not stop for anyone.
34:48Every moment in Mumbai, it makes money.
34:51It means money.
34:52Not makes money, it means money.
34:54And why would they just keep quiet?
34:57But they do.
34:58Because the political system being what it is, who is going to dare challenge a Neta on a street?
35:04I'm very glad that she did it.
35:06And it wasn't her alone.
35:08There will be thousands of people who probably want to do exactly the same thing.
35:11Had I been there, I would have joined her too and said, enough is enough.
35:16Stop it and get out of that road.
35:19Go where you need to go.
35:21Go to a maidan and protest for all you want.
35:23Leave the streets to citizens.
35:25Her child was waiting for her.
35:27Is that not important?
35:29Her rights?
35:30Her right to free movement?
35:32Is that not important?
35:32Are you saying, are you saying, Shobhadeh?
35:34I'm so terrified of talking to Rupan.
35:38No, are you saying, Shobhadeh, that when Kiran Bedi says the onus is on the police to have not given
35:44permission to the rally,
35:45that's being disingenuous, that actually the police simply works under the instructions of their political masters?
35:54I completely disagree with what Kiran Bedi said.
35:58No, I'm sure that she's going completely as per the rule book.
36:02But it is the political party in power which can, like I said earlier, throw the rule book out of
36:09the window.
36:10Clearly, that's what happened.
36:12And that happens not just, it happens nonstop in Mumbai.
36:16And the Mumbaikar, resilient and wonderful as the Mumbaikars are, there is a limit.
36:24There is a tipping point.
36:26Clearly, this young mother reached that tipping point.
36:29And she did what a lot of people in her place would have wanted to do, but would not have
36:33had the gumption.
36:34She had the guts to do something which I'm sure thousands of young mothers waiting to pick up their child
36:41from school would empathize with her.
36:43I'm not trying to make some kind of a hero out of her.
36:48But the human principle was not respected.
36:51And they took their power to take over the street for granted and went right ahead with something which is
37:00unacceptable.
37:01It absolutely is unacceptable.
37:03I don't care what the rules say.
37:04Okay, I take your point.
37:06Mumbaikar should win in these situations.
37:09I take your point.
37:10I share your anger because I was stuck in that same...
37:14Apathy and indifference.
37:16I take your point and I was stuck in that same murcha.
37:19So I...
37:21Right.
37:22I take your point.
37:23I want to turn for a moment to you, Shaina NC.
37:27I'm just going to put your...
37:29I just want to turn to Shaina NC for a moment because Shaina NC, you're hearing Shobhadeh, echoing what many
37:34people are saying today on social media across, saying enough is enough.
37:38That here was a protest organized by the party in power on Nari Shakti, right at about 5 in the
37:45evening, on a weekday, through one of the most congested lanes of Mumbai in the heart of the city.
37:51And it's happening across the country.
37:52I mean, you...
37:53Don't you agree that politicians have got it badly wrong, this sense of entitlement that I can...
37:58The street is mine?
38:03I completely agree and I'm not going to dodge the question.
38:07Mumbaikar is being inconvenienced and for hours you have a traffic jam where she wants to get to her child
38:14or her grandmother or whatever be the case.
38:16I think this kind of inconvenience is most, most unfortunate.
38:20What is the takeaway from this Rahul?
38:22I mean, Rajdeep, sorry, slip of the tongue.
38:25But having said that, what is the takeaway?
38:28When you have political parties that want to agitate, it could be on multiple issues.
38:33And multiple issues which the public need to connect with.
38:36But I think that the police taking care of all the inconvenience caused to the Mumbaikar has to be looked
38:44as a priority.
38:45There are many maidans, whether it's Azad maidan or areas which really do not get this kind of a traffic
38:53jam.
38:53What we saw at Worley, I think it's not just unfortunate.
38:56You've had the Mumbai police and the Worley police, you know, getting into a complaint and a complaint against who
39:03the organizers.
39:04So, it's quite an ironical situation, so to say.
39:07Having said that, there have also been a lot of people who have voiced on social media how there should
39:13be designated areas for andolans.
39:16And when there is any kind of strike, agitation, no matter what the issue.
39:21I mean, of course, Nari Shakti Vandan, there were over 15,000 to 20,000 women, all of whom wanted
39:27to show that they wanted women's reservation passed.
39:30And they were not happy with what the opposition did.
39:32Ma'am, they all came in hired buses. I was there.
39:33But that be the case or not.
39:35Madam Shaina, NC, let me tell you, they all were brought in buses, busloads.
39:40I saw the busloads.
39:42My point is on the program, I'm glad you're saying on the program that there should be rules.
39:48But let me tell you, you know, the rule seems to be only meant for your political rivals.
39:54The rule doesn't seem to be meant for the political party in power.
39:57That's my worry, that all these people were brought in hired buses to do this, to state some kind of
40:02dramatic theatrical protest in the heart of the city.
40:05But Anish Gawande, the same rule applies to the opposition.
40:09You will recall the farmer protests in Delhi, supported by the opposition.
40:13You will recall Shaheen Baag, supported by the opposition.
40:16The Supreme Court, in fact, there said, under Article 19.1b, that the right to peaceful assembly must be balanced
40:23against a commuter's rights, cannot lead to indefinite or grave public inconvenience.
40:28So when it suits you, you will stage protests.
40:31When it doesn't, you will say that the public is being inconvenienced.
40:35Our political party is also being hypocritical.
40:38No.
40:39Rajdeep, to start off with, I am proud to come from a Mumbai that has been shaped by the likes
40:43of Comrade Dangay.
40:45That has been shaped by the likes of George Fernandes.
40:47That has been shaped by the likes of Jay Prakash Narayan.
40:50Protests has been and will continue to be a fundamental part of how Mumbai lives and breathes.
40:56But let's be honest, this was not a protest.
40:58This was a PR stunt.
40:59The women's reservation bill was exposed as a BJP preservation bill.
41:04And to save face, the BJP had to organize rallies across the country.
41:08And then Nari Shakti Janakrosh rally was met with an actual Nari's Janakrosh in Mumbai.
41:14So let us not fool ourselves into thinking that this was a groundswell protest.
41:19That was an expression of people's agitation for women's reservation.
41:22Ask half the women there.
41:23They didn't know why they were protesting or why they were brought there.
41:26Right?
41:26No.
41:27So are you saying that if it's a people's agitation, it's all very fine?
41:30No, no.
41:30Anish Gawande, are you saying if it's a popular agitation, it's all very fine?
41:33And if Maratha protesters come on an anti-kota stir to Mumbai, that's fine?
41:38Is that what you're saying?
41:39That who will decide that?
41:41That this protest is legitimate and another is not?
41:44No, no.
41:45Not at all.
41:46When the Maratha agitation happens, there are multiple conversations held with the police,
41:50multiple high court orders.
41:51When the ASHA workers are marching to Mumbai, they're being sent to Azad Maidan.
41:55When there is a farmer's long march held from Nashik to Mumbai, people are stopped on the
42:00roads and sent into Azad Maidan.
42:01When you're protesting on air pollution, FIRs are filed against you.
42:04When you're protesting for RA, FIRs are filed against you.
42:07When you're protesting for stray dogs, FIRs are filed against you.
42:10What is the hypocrisy?
42:11I mean, let's not equate the two.
42:14I think there is a certain way in which a government in power, which has the ability
42:19to organize a protest that will not inconvenience the people of Mumbai, has a much greater responsibility
42:24than those who are being vilified, who are being sort of targeted, and who are facing multiple
42:32forms of persecution for coming out onto the streets.
42:34So we have to acknowledge this for what it is.
42:37This is a complete sort of exposure or expose of the hypocrisy of the BJP.
42:43Some people are allowed to protest.
42:45The government is allowed to protest.
42:46But citizens are not allowed to protest.
42:50You know, China NC, it's interesting.
42:53Before I come to Shobhadeh for a concluding remark, I want to ask you, I mean, the government,
42:57who is it protesting?
42:58In Mumbai, you are in power.
43:01And you are taking to the streets to protest against what happened in Delhi in parliament.
43:06I mean, it's absurd.
43:09There's an element of absurdity.
43:14Well, I'm not the spokesperson of the BJP.
43:17So you may want to ask them that question, what the Jana, Krosh, Mojha was.
43:21They're your allies.
43:22But I can tell you as a woman, I too wanted, as a woman, as a woman, Nari Shakti Vandan
43:28was
43:29a big, big issue.
43:30And we were all disappointed across the board.
43:33Now, you talk about agitations.
43:36I only have a limited point.
43:38Now, if the police feels that the numbers are going to go out of hand or it's going to be
43:41inconvenience or it's going to be traffic, there are many places where you can agitate
43:46in Mumbai.
43:46It could be an Azad Maidan.
43:48There are so many options and there are so many options where you can continue to have
43:53the agitation and have a section which is cordoned off just for vehicular movement.
43:58I just feel it is very unfortunate if Mumbaikers who are part of our, forget treating anybody
44:04as a vote bank.
44:06But even as citizens, inconvenience today, it could be a health hazard.
44:09It could be fire.
44:10It could be anything.
44:11So, the takeaway from this entire agitation and the outrage, which I feel was rightly
44:17so, is that we have to adhere to all the guidelines.
44:20We cannot have Wurley police station, then say now we are going to look at the CCTV footage
44:24and we are going to find out what language was used and what she said, etc.
44:29Those are excuses.
44:30Because in that outrage, if your child is stuck somewhere, any mother would be outraged and
44:36that could take you to say what she chose to say.
44:39Which I may not have, but that being an argument.
44:42But for future Rajdeep, the political parties will agitate.
44:47There will be propaganda.
44:49There will be, people may choose to view it as propaganda.
44:52Somebody may say, no, it is an agitation and it is our right to express what our opinion
44:57is.
44:57It could be opposition.
44:58It could be the parties in power.
44:59But for the administration, to ensure that political parties adhere to all kinds of timelines,
45:07noise pollution, etc., inconvenience to individuals and citizens alike, there need to be stronger
45:14rules put in place.
45:16And not to say, we look at CCTV footage and then decipher.
45:19Yeah, well, the irony is the police often responds to their political masters.
45:23Which brings me, Shobha, there to a concluding remark from you.
45:26I've seen in this country ambulances being stuck in the middle of a morcha or a middle
45:30of a political road show during elections.
45:33Ambulances are often stuck.
45:35I mean, what kind of society have we become?
45:38And the fear is one day it's a religious procession, next day it's a political procession.
45:42And the police seemingly seems powerless.
45:45Do you believe any of this will actually change, that we are so caught up in this VVIP culture
45:50or a fear of those in power, that the police seem powerless, helpless?
45:55You think it will change?
45:58No, I hate to, no, Rajdeep, I hate to accept defeat as a feisty Mumbaiker and someone who
46:05cares about the city.
46:06I am not prepared to surrender the city to any political party.
46:11So it doesn't matter.
46:12We have to have the momentum ourselves as Mumbaikers and protest against these kind of protests.
46:20This is a meaningless kind of act.
46:23And yes, I don't know about, you know, political opinions on this being, whether or not it was
46:28propagandist.
46:29It certainly appears like that to citizens.
46:31And like Anish said, that there were women who were brought in trucks, hired crowds, nothing
46:37new.
46:37Mumbai has seen this and more and worse.
46:41But there is, this is a flashpoint.
46:44And if we don't recognize it for what it is and mobilize ourselves and make sure we can
46:51keep talking ad nauseum, passing the buck about, you know, the rule book, the rule book and the
46:56burly police and this administration and that administration.
46:59The point is that the netas use their entitlement at the expense of citizens.
47:06And that is cannot, cannot be tolerated any further.
47:10It's time we ourselves took charge of our city and told the netas where to get off and
47:17also make the police accountable because that accountability certainly is in our hands.
47:22And if we are passive, then there are going to be more such incidents.
47:27And let's not make this lady into a vamp.
47:29She was no vamp.
47:30She was speaking on behalf of millions.
47:32So hats off to her.
47:34And I hope this is the last of such appropriation of public streets, whether it's a BJP or Shaina's
47:41party or the party Anish represents.
47:44This is not a political debate.
47:45It's about the rights of ordinary Mumbaikers, citizens who pay taxes to make sure our city
47:52functions the way we want it to function, not at our expense, but for us, for our benefit.
47:59Okay.
48:00Let me leave it there.
48:01I hope that those words are loud and clear.
48:03I think most Mumbaikers will share your sentiment and we need to ensure certain rules in place.
48:10Enough is enough is what is being said.
48:13Anish, Shoba, Shaina, thank you very much.
48:15For joining me here on my Talking Point.
48:21You're watching the news today.
48:23Let's turn to a shocker that's coming in from the national capital, a gruesome murder.
48:27An IRS officer's daughter sexually assaulted and murdered at home by her domestic help who
48:35was recently sacked by her parents.
48:38The victim was an IIT graduate who was preparing to appear for her UPSC exams.
48:43The police alleged that the suspect, Rahul Meena, had raped another woman the previous night
48:49in Alwar.
48:50Take a look at this report.
48:54She was 22 years old with a dream, an engineering graduate and UPSC aspirant.
49:02On 21st April morning, when her parents were out for a routine walk and gym, she was studying
49:08for her competitive exams.
49:10She was alone at home.
49:13Please go there, I feel another group.
49:21Movistemeden.
49:21The drug is making even the policeнения.
49:32China is working.
49:34The cities and such have witnessed us.
49:37This gentleman on the side with a més ofarna Covid is meningitis.
49:41worked for her.
49:4623-year-old Rahul Meena worked in this house for eight months and he knew the layout of the house
49:54and was familiar with the routine of family members. Police sources said Meena went straight
50:01to the victim's rooftop study room. Reportedly, he told police that first he tried to overpower
50:09the victim by throttling her. When she resisted, Rahul attacked her with a lamp and another heavy
50:16object kept nearby. She lost consciousness. Police sources alleged that he then sexually assaulted her.
50:25Next, he dragged her through the stairs to the ground floor room where the biometric operated
50:31safe locker was kept.
50:33The girl's bad impression is that she tries to open the locker and open the locker.
50:40But the girl's condition was very bad. It was very bad.
50:44That's why the blood circulation didn't open the girl's right.
50:49That's why the locker didn't open the locker.
50:52It was very bad.
51:14It was very bad.
51:44When the victim's parents returned home at around 8am, they found her lying in a
51:50pool of blood, with belongings scattered across the house.
51:57When the girl reached, there was a danger in a hospital.
52:00It's like, in a long-term, the killer was started.
52:02That's why the people of all were here are killed.
52:06That's why you think the victim first of all were here?
52:11He was able to work.
52:12So, that person found her staying here.
52:13The person then was about to be living here as the house.
52:14From this person, he lived here from one year.
52:15What was the help of the guy where he could do this...
52:17Well, he was running out of work.
52:20I could also say, we could get a money from ...
52:22And he could get the help of his wife by doing that.
52:24Rahul is also accused of rape in his hometown, Alwar.
52:27Before coming to Delhi, the accused allegedly raped his neighbour's wife.
52:32Rahul Meena was produced in court on Thursday and was sent to police custody for four days.
52:40Pitar Vindogha, Bureau Report, India Today.
52:46Let's turn from there to tonight's Get Real India story,
52:49where a shocking case of blind faith and alleged brutality has come to light from Maharashtra's Akola district.
52:56In Nimba village, several self-styled godmen are accused of subjecting children to dangerous acts in the name of miracles.
53:06It's not the first such instance and it is now becoming a worrying trend.
53:11Take a look at tonight's Get Real India story.
53:23Another case of fraudulent godmen has emerged from Maharashtra.
53:28In Nimba village of Akola district,
53:31multiple self-styled godmen have been accused of performing dangerous and inhumane acts on children in the name of miracles.
53:39In a village of just around 1,000 people, there are reportedly four such babas.
53:47One of them is Chetan Sunil Mule, alias Gulal Chesh Maharaj,
53:52who allegedly ran a darbar promising miracles and cures.
54:01Videos of what he calls his court sessions are going rapidly viral across social media platforms.
54:15These viral videos show him lifting children by their teeth,
54:19sitting them upon beds of nails,
54:21swinging them by their clothes and other dangerous acts.
54:25Villagers are now speaking out against the sham.
54:57As soon as possible,
54:58Activists have demanded strict action, warning that such practices are on the rise.
55:05Police have summoned all the accused godmen and issued a stern warning to seize the activities immediately.
55:12We have called the Nimbabha village at the police station.
55:17We have given notice and completed their work.
55:22We are going to verify this video and we are going to do it on the investigation.
55:28As investigations continue, this case from Akola raises serious questions about superstition and blind faith.
55:36With Dhanan Jaisable, Bureau Report, India Today.
55:41That's all that we could pack in on the show tonight.
55:44Thanks very much for your company.
55:45Stay well, stay safe.
55:47Good night, Shukratri.
55:48Jai Hind, Namaskar.
55:49That was the news without the noise.
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