- 5 hours ago
During a Lok Sabha debate on the Delimitation Bill, the Leader of the Opposition Rahul Gandhi sparked an uproar by comparing the Prime Minister to a magician whose tactics have been exposed.
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00:00It's the D-Day for the delimitation bill in Parliament and now all eyes will be on Home Minister Amit
00:07Shah's speech, which is going to begin any moment now.
00:11After Rahul Gandhi's big magician of Operation Sindhuar Jai, union ministers seek his apology.
00:18Kiran Rijuju and Defence Minister Rajnath Singh have all spoken out on the floor, voting on three bills shortly.
00:26The headlines.
00:29Opposition ups the ante. It is government versus the leader of opposition.
00:35When he has used that jive, Rajnath Singh seeks an apology. Home Minister will address at 6 p.m.
00:43The magician of Balakot, the magician of demonetization, the magician of Sindhuar has suddenly got caught. Why?
00:53Because he was gone.
01:08Opposition ups the ante against the government, says government version doesn't really match the fine print.
01:16The DMK will move. Top court if delimitation bill is passed. Government rejects fear-mongering by opposition.
01:28The TCS conversion case.
01:31The TCS conversion case explodes. Complainant releases disturbing video.
01:44Donald Trump claims U.S. struck nuke deal with Iran, says Iran gave strong statement that they won't have nuke
01:52weapons even beyond 20 years, says may travel to Pakistan for Iran troops.
02:00We have a statement, very, very powerful statement that they will not have, beyond 20 years, that they will not
02:07have nuclear weapons, that's beyond, there's no 20 year limit.
02:34I know it's coming.
02:36Coming in that the Congress party, which was led by Rahul Gandhi today in the Lok Sabha with Rahul Gandhi
02:44essentially saying that Congress drops Epstein hint over Rahul Gandhi's 16 puzzle.
02:51In fact, Congress says 16 sounds a lot like Epstein. Rahul Gandhi keeps 16. That is the word that he
02:59had used, the alphabet.
03:01A number, should I say, used by the Congress leader and leader of opposition. He had used that suspense going
03:10after speech. Rahul Gandhi in Lok Sabha had said Prime Minister spoke on 16th with will expose the link.
03:18So what exactly is the 16 number? Let's listen into what Rahul Gandhi said.
03:29Yesterday I was watching the Prime Minister speak. Low energy. Broken. Nothing, nothing transmitting.
03:45And I suddenly noticed that yesterday was the 16th of April.
03:53No, I was, listen, please. I was watching. I was sitting here and he was talking and he was, he
03:59was not able to engage.
04:07He was not able to engage. Because, clearly, trying to pass this bill was a mistake because everybody knew there
04:20was no past panic reaction, as I said.
04:22So, what puzzleуем call? I said, the puzzle is and its number is 1. It is a sortplus. People solve
04:29the virus. What is seismically?
04:30It is a puzzle. I will tell you a single answer this one.
04:33Is it the solution that I'm an 되는데? Tell her what this is.
04:36So, what the puzzle used to solve? I said, I said, the puzzle is and its number is a whatever.
04:41It is the state's right является and the RPA. See the solution that I'm theerechtan Post and refer to Islam?
04:43Yes. What's the solution that I am Ming? I said, tell her what it is.
04:44It is a puzzle I will tell our answers it is.
04:46You can tell those there it is.
04:50Ask me for data to file and bookSS and respecto to a private sector and regulation leading upchargement confrontation can't
04:52stop this one.
04:52She spoke to Rahul Gandhi just a few minutes ago.
04:56Bosh me to your question.
04:59And Rahul Gandhi there saying,
05:01So what exactly is this number 16?
05:06So, Maria, you know, there was a lot of suspense when Rahul Gandhi said it there.
05:10We could see the faces of all the MPs who were quizzing and asking each other what that really meant.
05:17And Sharjah Kumari, in fact, went on to ask Rahul Gandhi what he meant by 16.
05:22But we spoke to Rahul Gandhi while he was exiting the parliament.
05:27And I asked him that whether off camera but on record.
05:31And he said that it's got nothing to do with Epstein.
05:33Because there was a lot of buzz about the Epstein files and the files being deleted.
05:38Perhaps Rahul Gandhi was indicating.
05:40Though he really clarified that it's not got to do with Epstein.
05:44So perhaps that could be an attack that he launched on Prime Minister Narendra Modi.
05:50And with his hydrogen bombs and his exposés that have come in the recent two, three years.
05:57We could see another exposé happening about what is this puzzle about.
06:02Okay, so we'll wait for that puzzle to be decoded by perhaps some Congress leader.
06:08I can see Aishwarya joining us as well.
06:10But before I bring in Aishwarya and I'll go back to Moshmi.
06:13Please continue to be with us.
06:15The ladies, you know, women journalists covering this delimitation bill very, very closely.
06:22And ahead of the delimitation and women's bill voting, opposition is showing confidence.
06:27In fact, their numbers will go up, is what sources are saying.
06:30Opposition strength likely to rise to 220.
06:34Malik Arjun Kharge has just now told Moshmi that there would be voting
06:39and the opposition will ensure that the bill is defeated.
06:42What is going to be the government's strategy?
06:44Aishwarya, what is the number that the government is looking at?
06:47That 360 is needed in this 540-member House.
06:53Well, you know, the number that the government at the moment is looking at is close to 303.
06:57But let me tell you, that is with the additional votes.
06:59Because if we just speak about the NDA, that number stands at 293.
07:05220, that however, is what the opposition is claiming.
07:08And we are seeing, Mhara, that the government has been very, very confident.
07:12In fact, there was an appeal of sorts that was made by Prime Minister Darinder Modi on the floor of
07:16the House.
07:16Today, the language of the tweet is also once again an appeal which is being made by Prime Minister Darinder
07:21Modi.
07:22And he is asking everyone to vote, to look deep within and to make sure that, you know,
07:28whatever decision you take, you need to look around.
07:30You need to look at your wives, your mothers, your sisters.
07:32So, an emotional appeal that is being made.
07:34What's really perplexing, Mhara, is the fact that, you know, if we just look at the straight maths,
07:39two-third majority, that is 360, is something that the BJP does not have.
07:44The opposition very, very confident that they will be able to stall the bill.
07:47But equally confident is the Bharatiya Janta Party.
07:50They have been speaking about the fact that they believe that they will be able to get the bill passed.
07:54So, we will have to see what exactly is happening.
07:57Is there some trick up the sleeve that, you know, we do not know at the moment?
08:00So, that's something that we will have to very keenly look at.
08:03But what's essential at the moment is the 6 p.m. speech that will be given by Home Minister Amit
08:08Shah.
08:09So, Moshmi, 220 is what sources are telling you, is the strength of the opposition parties.
08:13The government is also banking, perhaps, on certain abstentions.
08:17Let's look at the three big parties here.
08:2037 is Samajwadi Party.
08:22That is their strength.
08:2327, Mahmoud Abanerjee's party.
08:25And 24 is the DMK.
08:28If we look at these parties, are they all voting on the floor of the House?
08:33Do they have full strength?
08:35Or are some of these MPs in their respective states, you know, Bengal and Tamil Nadu, is in the middle
08:41of elections?
08:44Maria, you're right on that count, that some MPs would be missing because they are campaigning and they've taken permission.
08:51And the party leaders also understand that.
08:54But a team has been formed within the opposition and has got abstinence of every party who are manning their
09:05flogs.
09:06So, I am told that about 21 MPs of the TMC would be present.
09:10I just counted the figures of the Congress party.
09:13Apart from Prajit Bargolay, there'll be two other, who's gone to the BJP.
09:17There'll be two other MPs who won't be there because of territory reasons.
09:23Otherwise, the Congress's figure could go up to 97.
09:27So, 97 and 21, that comes to around 118.
09:34So, 118 is Namoor and Congress combined.
09:37And then you have the TMC, you have the SP, that could be around 30.
09:42So, if you count that, that could be 148 is the figure that we're looking at with the Samajwadi party
09:48and about 20 more MPs to add from the DMK.
09:53So, that figure could be about 170, 180.
09:56But the opposition feels that they could add up to over, across 220.
10:01So, 40 more is what they feel that other opposition parties, if they come together, they could score up to
10:09that.
10:09Actually, that's the number game very well explained there by Moshmi.
10:12I'm coming back to you, Ashwarya.
10:14But before that, let's listen in to what Rahul Gandhi said.
10:17Remember, leader of opposition in the Lok Sabha, Rahul Gandhi launched a scathing attack on the government during the delimitation
10:22and women's quota debate.
10:23Rahul Gandhi sparked a row after sarcastically calling Prime Minister Narendra Modi magician of Balakot, demonetization and Operation Sindhu.
10:31Speaking during the debate on the proposed amendments to the Women's Quota Bill and the formation of the Delimitation Commission,
10:37Rahul Gandhi termed the move a panic reaction, alleging that the bill, that the BJP knew that the bill will
10:43not be passed in the lower house.
10:46Rahul also said that the government's actions amount to nothing short of an anti-national act.
10:52And as expected, the magician jibe triggered sharp reactions from the BJP leaders.
10:57Defence Minister Rajnath Singh condemned the remarks as unacceptable and he demanded an apology.
11:02BJP has even called for Rahul Gandhi's expulsion over what it termed as a personal and unparliamentary comment.
11:10Listen in.
11:12Sir, the truth is the magician has been caught.
11:16The magician of Balakot, the magician of demonetization, the magician of Sindhuur has suddenly got caught.
11:26Why?
11:26Because he was wrong.
11:33The BJP knew, they knew very clearly, that this bill actually cannot be passed.
11:41They knew it.
11:43They're not stupid.
11:44They knew every opposition person would oppose it, this bill cannot be passed.
11:49This was a panic reaction.
11:53This was a panic reaction because the Prime Minister, at any cost, needed to send two messages.
12:00Number one, he needed to change the electoral map of India.
12:04And number two, he needed to send a message again that he is pro-women.
12:10Why he is doing that, I will leave to your imagination.
12:17But, I will leave it to your imagination, but the powers that be, know exactly, exactly, why he is doing
12:24it.
12:28And there are some truths that need to be told here today in this house.
12:35The first truth, is that this is not a women's bill.
12:42This is nothing to do with the empowerment of women.
12:48There is a women's bill.
12:51It was passed in 2023 in this house itself.
12:59And my friends and teachers in the BJP said that it will be implemented in 10 years' time.
13:10But, that is the women's bill.
13:14This is an attempt to change the electoral map of India.
13:22Using and hiding behind India's women.
13:30And actually, it is a shameful act.
13:35Because, instead of giving them women's reservation, which is very easy to do,
13:39and every single opposition person will support it right now,
13:44pass, bring that old bill back, right now,
13:48and we will help you pass it for the implementation from this second.
13:55Now, that is the women's bill.
13:59This is something else.
14:02And the truth needs to be told about what this is.
14:08This is a woman's bill.
14:20This is a woman's bill.
14:52Oh
14:57foreign
15:04foreign
15:23you need to learn from your party, MPI, what will they learn from you?
15:33Neta will do it again.
15:35In these rules, the keywords and expressions are unparliamentary.
15:41Even magician, even magician referred to the minister is also unparliamentary.
15:48This is a rule.
15:50A lot of fireworks there with Rahul Gandhi saying that Prime Minister Modi is the magician of balakot, demonetization and
15:59others.
16:00But let's try and understand the mathematics of the strength of both the sides from Aishwarya now.
16:07Aishwarya, there is confidence on the part of the government.
16:10There's confidence on the part of opposition.
16:12Somebody certainly has misplaced confidence.
16:15I want to understand which is this side which has misplaced confidence.
16:20On the floor of the House, the government doesn't have numbers for ensuring two-third for this bill.
16:25It's a constitutional amendment bill for raising the overall number of the strength of the House to 850.
16:31Well, you know, Maria, I will borrow one word that Rahul Gandhi spoke today.
16:35He spoke about magic and magician.
16:37So, you know, what everyone actually is looking at is that rabbit that will be pulled out of the hat.
16:43That hat which belongs to the Bharatiya Janta Party.
16:45Because there has to be some sort of magic.
16:47Because, you know, when we look at straight numbers, Maria, 293.
16:51So, that's the NDA strength.
16:52You know, even if you add 10 more to it, then you come to a rough figure of 303.
16:57Even if 100 MPs, and that's a huge number for MPs to actually abstain because all the parties have issued
17:03a whip.
17:03Samajwadi Party has issued a whip.
17:05TMC, in fact, has said that 21 MPs will be inside and 21, in fact, let me tell you, are
17:09inside.
17:10The Congress obviously has now issued a whip.
17:13And all those people who have been given this responsibility, all of them, let me tell you,
17:17over the past two hours have been frantically moving from one room to the other,
17:21be it the BJP, be it the opposition, making sure that their numbers are well stacked.
17:26So, we will have to wait and watch what is that magic trick that either the opposition or the ruling
17:31party will have to pull.
17:32But yes, it is extremely perplexing because the kind of confidence that we are seeing on both sides.
17:36You know, the opposition very, very confident.
17:39But, Maria, let us not forget the vice presidential elections.
17:42Yes.
17:43Because the opposition that time too was very, very confident.
17:45They did believe they have the numbers, but the result is out for everyone to see.
17:49Yes, absolutely.
17:49I think there is something which the government is certainly getting its numbers right.
17:54Something that they have calculated which doesn't meet the eye right now.
17:59And perhaps that will become clear when Home Minister Amit Shah speaks in some time from now.
18:03Union ministers pointed attack on Rahul Gandhi.
18:07In fact, Girirat Singh has said that Rahul Gandhi has spoken the language of Pakistan.
18:12Now, he has taken a jibe and has called Rahul Gandhi a joker.
18:24Now, when he started talking about L.O.P.
18:26When he started talking about L.O.P.
18:28Then I understood that L.O.P.
18:50this
18:52Japanese
18:52one
18:52very
18:52their
18:52stone
18:55as
19:01he
19:03Pakistan की भासा उनके जो बान से इकल रही थी सदन के अंदर, सदन में बोला हुआ, जो बात पाकिस्तान
19:15बोल रहा था, वही बात राहुल गांधी बोल रहे थे, मुझे तो बड़ी निरासा हुई, दूख हुआ, मैं उन्हें पीशी
19:30सरकार तो बोल भी पाया हूँ,
19:32लेकिन जो कर कह भी नहीं सकता, इतना बड़ा पद पे बैठा हुआ बैठती, सदन के अंदर, भारत की सेना
19:45को, भारत की सौर्ज को गाली देना, इससे बड़ा दुर्भागे पुर्णा और क्या हो,
19:50मुखता से भरी जुबान थी, और मर्यादित जुबान थी, मर्यादा नाम की कोई चीज नहीं थी,
20:02अगर उनमें मर्यादा होती, तो साइध ऐसे सब्दों का प्रियोग नहीं करते हैं.
20:36मुखता सब्सक्राइब करते हैं, तो एक आदमी जो 2023 में आके,
20:55इसी सदन में वह भाशन दिया, आज 2023 में आके एक ही भाशन दे रहे हैं, जबकि वह बिल पास
21:01हो गया है,
21:02बिल पास हो गया है, नोटिफाइ करना आप भूल गया है, कल रात को बारे बजे आप नोटिफाइ कर रहे
21:06हैं,
21:07क्योंकि आपको पता चला है कि आज वह एक बिल पर जिसका नोटिफिकेशन ही नहीं हुआ है,
21:11और वोटा भी डिसकासें कि अगर बैठेगा तो वो डिसाइड करेगा कितना सीच होगा, आप यहां बटके एक्जेट कर सकता
21:30है,
21:30और यह आप यह सदन स्टेट्स के जो शेयर 24% सो 20% हो जाएगा, सारी इसकार खाली आपका
21:35हिंदी हाट्लेंड कबढ़ेगा,
21:37तो इस इस अप्सुल्ट नॉंसेंस,
21:39आपको क्या लगता है, बीजेपी क्या करने की कोशिश कर रहे हैं,
21:41बीजेपी, बीजेपी, आम तो डड़ने वाले हैं नहीं,
21:45तो बीजेपी ये लोगों को समझा रहा है,
21:47और बीजेपी और एक चाल खेलना चाता है देश का लोगों को समझाने के लिए,
21:52कि देखिए देखिए इन लोग सब नारी विरोध है, इनका एगेंस में गया,
22:12This bill is in the middle of the city and in the middle of the city.
22:42Delimitation, how will it happen when the delimitation of the census after the commission is increased?
22:47My question is that this select committee or the JPC will be given, where all these things are thrash-out.
22:54The Women's Reservation Bill is already passed.
22:58The government will not change their needs.
23:01The government will not change their needs in 2019.
23:03You have not done it in 2024 when you can do it.
23:06If you do it in 2019, you will not do it.
23:08You will see your needs.
23:10The government will not change the number.
23:15The government will not change the number.
23:18How will the number change the number?
23:19You are saying that it is 816.
23:22It is a formula that 50% of the existing seats will increase the number.
23:29No one will lose.
23:31The difference will be in Kerala, there will be 30.
23:33The difference will be in the big state.
23:37In fact, in the big state, there will be more votes.
23:42There will be the same people.
23:44There will not be any damage.
23:46You will find a statement.
23:48The bill will not pass.
23:49But this will be tomorrow.
23:51I will make the number of members such as the other members,
23:56but the city will also be in the middle of the country.
24:00We will have to stop the number of members who will pass.
24:03Because I will request all this to you and I will make the number of members.
24:08If you don't know when the representatives of the members who will pass the number of members,
24:15I will also request them.
24:18foreign
24:26foreign
24:26foreign
24:27foreign
24:28foreign
24:35Thank you very much.
25:22He was such a headache to listen to him.
25:25He was going through his childhood traumas and then he went, he took us through the magic show
25:31and he was going through his childhood traumas.
25:36He was going through his childhood traumas.
25:44He was going through his childhood traumas.
26:34He was going through his childhood traumas.
26:35He was going through his childhood traumas.
27:05He was elected as a member of parliament from Raibareli.
27:08BJP leader Vinesh Shishe had filed this petition.
27:13So, now what we can tell that an FIR has been filed against Rahul Gandhi.
27:18Samar Shivastav is joining us on the phone line.
27:20Samar, give us a quick recap of this case.
27:24Samar Shivastav has filed against Rahul Gandhi over the citizenship case.
27:28In the dual citizenship case, Mr. Subhash, Shubhas Bench in the Lakhnu High Court issued this particular order.
27:35And we know that the matter was on since months.
27:38And Rahul Gandhi decided to answer for this particular hearing as well.
27:41But as we are getting from the information, Rahul Gandhi 12 citizenship was challenged after he was elected as an
27:47MP from Raibareli.
27:49And a petition has been filed to file an FIR against Rahul Gandhi.
27:53BJP leader Vinesh Shishir filed this particular petition.
27:57And I must tell you that Vinesh Shishir also took to the Twitter platform.
28:01And clearly, he says that it's a big relief for him as well because the petition was on.
28:07And he clearly says that in a landmark and historic judgment, the Honourable High Court at Lakhnu Bench has allowed
28:12his petition and ordered and directed
28:14for the Tuali Policitation of Raibareli, Ustav Pradesh registered a work information report against Rahul Gandhi, member of parliament, Lok
28:21Sabha.
28:22He further thanked the Honourable Allahabad High Court for the same.
28:25We know that the matter was on since months.
28:27And since months, Rahul Gandhi even visited the Lakhnu Bench a few times and also some times in the Kuntar
28:34Kusarpa district.
28:35But this is a landmark decision which has come for that particular Vinesh Shishir who was in this particular matter
28:40for long.
28:41And the correct update coming is that the FIR has been filed against Congresswoman Rahul Gandhi in the dual citizenship
28:47case.
28:47Back to you.
28:48All right. Thank you so much for joining us.
29:07And BJP forming up its strategy ahead of the voting which will take place in a couple of hours from
29:12now.
29:13There's a key meeting which is happening of the BJP leaders, BJP MPs.
29:19This meeting is being chaired by BJP chief Nitin Nabeen.
29:22Leaders include Vinod Tawdeh, Tarun Chogh, Mansukh Mandavia, Union Minister Tejasvi Surya, Rakhcha Khatse, among others.
29:31Deliberations are on for the future strategy regarding the women's reservation.
29:35Remember, women's reservation is now the law of the land. Let's be clear.
29:39What is there before the parliament even as we speak is essentially delimitation for the implementation of the women's reservation.
29:46Women's reservation as of today is the law of the land. It is waiting implementation.
29:51Now the process has to be decided whether it will be implemented with the strength of the House at 543
29:58or whether it will be at 850.
30:01So this strategy meeting is being chaired by BJP president Nitin Nabeen.
30:06Aishwarya Paliwal is joining us.
30:08So Aishwarya, BJP is confident that it has managed to navigate and get other parties to perhaps abstain or vote
30:16in its favour.
30:16And this meeting is certainly in that context. But there was another meeting, I believe, which happened between Kiran Rajuju
30:22and other union ministers.
30:29Well, Mario, you know, what we have seen at the moment is the fact that most of the top leadership
30:33of the Bharti-Chanpa Party,
30:35in fact, they are making sure that they speak with the top leadership.
30:38In fact, you know, if you've also seen the video in which we have seen the Parliamentary Affairs Minister Kiran
30:43Rajuju,
30:43in fact, walking up to Akhiresh Adhavar, you're seated in Lok Sabha to exchange a brief conversation.
30:49The conversation, in fact, lasted for almost 10 minutes. What to do next?
30:53How to make sure that everything is in order and how to make sure that the voting goes glitch-free.
30:58That is something that the Bharti-Chanpa Party at the moment very clearly is looking at.
31:02That's why on one side we have to have the top leadership of the BJP over the past 48 hours
31:07has been an intense habit.
31:09Let me tell you, Home Minister Amitra left the Parliament at 1.30 last night.
31:13There were spade of meetings that were taking place, the top leadership of the BJP, including Ashwini Vaishnav,
31:18and we've also seen Piyush Khoyal, you've seen the Law Minister Abhina Meghal, all of them standing,
31:24sitting with Home Minister Amitra, and detailed conversations have taken place with regards to what to do next.
31:29And what to do next is a very crucial question that every party at the moment is looking at.
31:34The smaller parties also have now aligned themselves.
31:37They are either with the Bharti-Chanpa Party or they have firmly joined the opposition bloc.
31:41So that will do something that's happening.
31:43And just minutes before Home Minister Amitra is all set to speak, we are to this very crucial meeting which
31:47is taking place.
31:48And in fact, after Raghuram Gandhi spoke, it was also a brief meeting that took place between Kiran Rajiju and
31:54the Prime Minister.
31:55What exactly happened on the floor of the Parliament, those details were being told by Kiran Rajiju,
32:00who's the Parliamentary Party Appeals Minister, to Prime Minister Naira Modi.
32:04All right, Ashwarya. Thank you for joining us.
32:06Meeta Shikarwati, spokesperson of the Congress Party, joins us.
32:09Kasturi Shankar, BJP spokesperson, joins me.
32:12I'm going to begin with you, Kasturi.
32:15What is giving BJP confidence?
32:16It certainly doesn't have the numbers to ensure that the Constitution Amendment Bill is passed.
32:24First of all, nobody in the Parliament, nobody, opposition or BJP or its ruling alliance,
32:33nobody is opposing the Women's Reservation Bill.
32:36Everybody is for promulgating the Women's Reservation Bill, 33%.
32:43So I don't think there's going to be an issue at all there.
32:46The issue and all doubts raised are about the delimitation and its nitty gritties.
32:51So as far as the details of that are concerned, it's not Rome was not built in a day.
32:57The delimitation exercise is not going to be started like right away.
33:02So I think the challenge is only in giving the opposition parties the confidence that this is not going to
33:09be anti-state or anti-federalism.
33:12It is going to be something that reflects the true nature of the country vis-a-vis its diversity, vis
33:20-a-vis its federalism as well as its population.
33:23I think it is going to be an empowering move either way.
33:28And therefore, I believe that states that believe in the power and the unity of the nation will definitely vote
33:37for this bill as is.
33:39Okay. Meeta Jagrabarti.
33:47You are putting a number at 222 MPs.
33:51Malik Arjun Kharge, Congress Chief and Leader of Opposition in the Rajya Sabha says that the bill will be voted
33:58and defeated.
33:59That the opposition will vote to defeat the bill.
34:04How does it really help your cause?
34:07Is that for me because the audio was disturbed?
34:10Yes, ma'am. Go ahead, Meeta.
34:11Okay. So first of all, the Women Reservation Bill has already been passed in 2023.
34:18Yes.
34:19Women in this country are looking for equal representation.
34:23They are not looking for a symbolic piece of legislation.
34:26They need immediate implementation of the Women Reservation Bill.
34:29Bear in mind that it was Rajiv Gandhi, our late Prime Minister, who had introduced this concept, who has got
34:3633% reservation done at the panchayat level.
34:39Then it was in 2010 during Monmouth Singh's UPA2 government that this bill was passed in Rajya Sabha.
34:45And even in Lok Sabha, this bill has already been passed. It's already a law of the land.
34:51What we need is an immediate implementation and not some ambiguous promise of this being implemented at some point in
34:57the future.
34:57Secondly, we have been asking for a caste census. We have been asking for OBC quota, a subquota within this
35:04quota for OBC women.
35:06And thirdly, this entire, this entire, this projection that this has to be done after delimitation and hence there has
35:18to be delimitation.
35:19Decision has to be taken by the delimitation commission. How can it be taken by the executives here?
35:25So when you need and you do need two third numbers, we do not have that numbers.
35:30So Meeta, the bill says that there will be a delimitation commission which will be formed.
35:36The redrawing of various constituencies will be done by the delimitation commission.
35:42Pua Gandhi, DMK spokesperson also joins us. So what really is the concern here?
35:47You want it to be implemented at the earliest. The BJP wants it to be implemented at the earliest.
35:52So this is the meeting of minds.
35:54Who is stopping them from implementing it straight away?
35:58Okay. All the parties, we support gender equality. We support women reservation bill.
36:03It was something that we have worked on over decades.
36:06We have a proven track record to prove our support.
36:09What is stopping them from implementing it today? The way it is.
36:14Okay. Kasturi, implement it in the present house.
36:18543 members present is the strength of the Lok Sabha. Implement it in the present numbers.
36:25Is the point that has been made by most India Bloc leaders.
36:29I would like to, I would like to ask the respected Congress spokesperson.
36:33What stopped them? She was so lucid about saying it was passed in 2003 and subsequently ratified.
36:39What stopped them from going out with it when they were in power?
36:44To come now and bring up, they have brought, even in this debate itself you heard there.
36:48They have brought up so many obstacles to it.
36:52Not least of all, they have brought up the angle of religion.
36:54They have brought up the angle of caste.
36:56What does caste census have to do with women madam?
37:01Women is itself a category and it is an overriding category.
37:06Where is the need to micromanage it?
37:10Let me tell you, you know as well as I do, that caste is not an obstacle when you are
37:16a woman.
37:17A woman is beyond caste. Patriarchy, it descends beyond caste.
37:23So let's first empower the women. Let's not sit here and say we need extra, extra details taken care of.
37:31Mwaz Gandhi, when HM Shah speaks in 20 minutes from now,
37:35lot of questions that the parties from southern part of India are asking will be answered.
37:43Do you think there will be a reconsideration after the assurances that are made?
37:48Or you want everything written in letter and spirit?
37:52First of all, what is assurance made by the Honorable Home Minister?
37:58As Rahul Gandhi spoke today, where is the Women's Reservation Bill?
38:02Today's subject is with respect to two bills.
38:05One is delimitation, that is to increase the number of constituencies from 543 to 815.
38:11And the other one is Constitutional Delegation Commission.
38:15Where comes the Women's Reservation Bill number one?
38:17Secondly, if at all, if it is with respect to Women's Reservation.
38:21In 2023, the government came up with a bill for Women's Reservation,
38:26wherein the government very clearly stated that the Women's Reservation will happen after the delimitation of census in 2027.
38:34Now, they are changing their goalposts and now they are saying that this delimitation has to happen immediately based on
38:42the 2011 census.
38:44What made them to change their stand?
38:48If they think the Women's Reservation has to be given immediately, why couldn't they pass this earlier Women's Reservation in
38:562023,
38:57saying that delimitation has to be on the basis of the 2011 census?
39:01And then that particular special session, which was conducted in 2023, itself has gone completely waste.
39:08So, these are the double standards of the government.
39:11The government is not serious about any Women's Reservation.
39:13If they are very serious about Women's Reservation, when Mr Modi became the Prime Minister, he could have cleared…
39:22No, no, let me bring in Kasturi on this. Kasturi, respond to this, that if you want to implement it,
39:29it can be implemented immediately.
39:32Sure, absolutely. If you want to implement it, we can implement it immediately. But who should want it?
39:39The opposition parties should cooperate. How can you implement it immediately without the bill actually being passed?
39:46And Mr Pugal Gandhi said, we have changed. The BJP is arbitrarily changing the census date. It was supposed to
39:54be in 2027.
39:55Sir, let me remind you, that was not frozen in stone. That was, again, a time-resting tactic implemented by
40:04you and your alliances. You and your ally partners.
40:07Madam, the re-imitation exercise has been constantly postponed as to the rabble-rousing of the opposition.
40:15Please, let me answer this question. The 2026 census was fixed by, watched by through the 84th Amendment in the
40:24year 2001.
40:26Not by Congress, not by DNK, not by any opposition party. Please understand that. Point number one.
40:31Point number two, if your leader, the 56-inch Prime Minister, is so serious about implementing Women's Reservation,
40:36what prevented him from implementing Women's Reservation from 2014? He's in power from 2014.
40:43And what prevented the Prime Minister from coming up with the Women's Reservation Bill in 2023,
40:51basing the census at 2011? Why your special second debate?
40:56This kind of what about me, this kind of what about me...
40:58What is what about me? Please answer.
41:01It's very tiring, sir.
41:02You are Prime Minister and your Home Minister is...
41:03I can ask you...
41:04You are Prime Minister and your Home Minister is...
41:06You are Prime Minister and your Home Minister is...
41:06...changing goalposts here and there.
41:08You said the PM is in power from 2014.
41:09For those special sessions.
41:09The special session of the Parliament does not have any relevance.
41:13As far as they are concerned, it is like having a cup of chai. That's it.
41:16Today they will have a special session. Tomorrow they will have another special session,
41:20saying that the census should be on the basis of 2011.
41:23The day after tomorrow they will say the census should be from the year 1971.
41:27What sanctity the special session has?
41:31Or what is the value of the words of the Prime Minister and the Home Minister?
41:36At least they are standing by their words.
41:39What words? Why can't they give the Women's Reservation today?
41:43Why can't they just dump the delimitation?
41:46Why can't they just dump the delimitation bill and just bring a pure Women's Reservation bill?
41:51Okay, let me give the last word to Kasturi because it's two versus one here.
41:57Kasturi, quickly respond.
41:59Yes. Number one, there are almost 305 seats being added and all of them are going to women.
42:05That's the underlying logic of expanding the Parliament seats, which is a long-due reform.
42:12As well as saying, you're marking, when we expand the Parliament, one-third is going to women.
42:20Mr. Pukar Gandhi keeps asking, why didn't Mr. Modi implement it earlier?
42:25I asked him, because you guys took your own time when you were in power and you wanted to put
42:31the blame on Modi ji.
42:32There have been so many things. We have seen Corona, we have seen Baghdad, we have seen Pulwana.
42:38You think Modi ji was sitting here doing nothing?
42:41All this happened during your tenure.
42:44Kasturi, Pawaz Gandhi and Meeta Chakravarti, really appreciate your time.
42:48Remember, one of the criticisms which has come in from the opposition is that the bill doesn't really explain in
42:55details what is being said by the government on the floor of the House.
42:57In fact, Congress MP from Tamil Nadu, Karthi Chidhamram, has said that this is almost like an insurance policy, someone
43:06who's a salesman of an insurance policy, who promises something and something it actually turns out to be.
43:12I had spoken to him earlier today. Listen in.
43:16You have just put out a tweet in which you are saying that the delimitation is a sales pitch by
43:21the government, is like that of an insurance salesman.
43:28They say one thing and the fine print says something else. What is in it, what have you read in
43:35the fine print is what the government is not saying, according to you?
43:38First of all, we have to, you know, delink the two issues. One is women's reservation. The other is delimitation.
43:47But the government is now mixing up both exactly like insurance salesmen who sell you a mutual fund investment plan
43:55along with an insurance policy.
43:57So that's what they do. And further, what they say on the floor of the House or through their, you
44:03know, press leaks and through their press statements is one thing.
44:09And what is there in the fine print is something else. Our position is that, yes, we are from women's
44:15reservation.
44:15Let's do it right away within the strength of the House of 543.
44:19We have serious objections to increasing the strength of the House when they say that, oh, we are only going
44:25to increase the strength of the House proportionately for everybody.
44:28But that's not what the bill says. The bill says that there's going to be a delimitation and a reorganization
44:35of seats even within, even among states based on the 2011 population.
44:40Which means the population of India at that time was 121 crores. If you are going to allot the 850
44:47parliamentary seats, it's about 14 lakhs per parliamentary seat.
44:51And if you redraw that, there are certain states who will have a big spike. Some states will remain flat.
44:57Some states will have a very marginal increase.
44:59So that's not fair. We believe that's not fair because, and even the proportionate, equal proportionate increase is also not
45:07fair because while the ratios remain the same, the absolute numbers become different.
45:13And we are in the first past the post or halfway mark majority government. So that delta becomes even greater
45:19to reach the halfway mark.
45:21Then how will it be implemented, Mr. Chidambra? My question is…
45:25It's implemented as it is. Just have 543 members. See, the United States Congress has remained at 400 odd for
45:33almost centuries now, maybe more than 100 years, even though the population of America has increased.
45:41You see, increasing the number of MPs doesn't make governance better. People are confusing.
45:46We are not… MPs are not administrative heads of their constituencies. We are only here… We are only in the
45:52legislature.
45:53And if you make a house of 850 people, there will hardly be any meaningful debate. I mean, the speaker
45:59hardly gives us time with a house of 543.
46:02I mean, he doesn't even… He can't remember most people's names. With 850 people, it will just become a big,
46:08you know, like a big convention hall.
46:11There won't be any meaningful debate. There won't be any time. A larger house does not mean a more effective
46:16house. More MPs does not mean better governance.
46:19I think we are fine with 543. We need to cap it at that. And we are absolutely fine in
46:25allocating one-third of the seats as it stands today to women.
46:29I mean, on whatever, maybe on a three-term rotational basis or whatever formula they want to come up with.
46:34I'm fine with that.
46:35But increasing the seats will be tremendously unfair to many, many states, particularly to Tamil Nadu.
46:40I'm the winner. I'll be a winner. And if I want to be a winner, he'll be a winner.
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