00:00Obviously, we're all going to the playoffs.
00:01We'll talk more Toronto.
00:02We'll talk more all of the path forward.
00:05As I was trying to summarize the regular season,
00:08all I have are mixed emotions.
00:09All I have are a lot of, well, those 30 games were great,
00:13or those 10 games were great, or this stretch was great.
00:16It's one of the more disjointed Cavs season
00:19in which then they've won 52 regular season games.
00:22Yeah, that's impressive, right?
00:24They finished, I think it was like four and a half shy
00:25of what Vegas had projected them with,
00:27and think about all the chaos that we had with it.
00:29Think about the 15 and 14 start you had to the season.
00:33It's just a lot happened.
00:34It's amazing because none of it will matter
00:36if they just flame out in the postseason,
00:38but there was a lot that happened this regular season.
00:40Yeah, that's like when Kenny there was talking about,
00:42oh, we're just so much better positioned now
00:45than we were pre-deadline, and I was like, we'll see.
00:48And I don't mean like we'll see and like I can't wait
00:51to twist my mustache and tell everybody how right I was.
00:53We'll see and like, well, that's kind of what this is about, no?
00:56Like, we'll see whether Keon Ellis can go ahead
00:59and be a huge part of a better perimeter defense
01:02in the postseason.
01:03We'll see what James Harden's role is,
01:05closer versus setup man for the bigs.
01:08We'll see what Jared Allen can do
01:10and what that does to Evan Mobley on the offensive
01:13and defensive side of the ball.
01:14There's just so much.
01:16I don't want to say the regular season was murky,
01:19but there was just, it felt like four different
01:22regular seasons all in 82 games to then get here
01:28where it's like, well, okay, what are the real Cavs?
01:31What's real?
01:31What's not?
01:32How much can they actually grow?
01:34How do you get healthier?
01:35Which you don't as the playoffs go.
01:37And so it's left me in a weird spot
01:39where I'm incredibly excited, right?
01:42And I also have no feel for where the Cavs are
01:45and who's truly going to stand out
01:48and who's maybe just not cut out for this moment.
01:50Sure.
01:51If we're thinking about like what we're going to remember
01:53the most out of this regular season, though,
01:55like I think it's pretty obvious to myself,
01:57like this is the regular season that they learned
01:59that they couldn't do this with Darius.
02:00And so like the on the fly, how do we shape this?
02:04How do we get this thing turned around?
02:06And then to see them start to be able to was impressive.
02:08Again, it doesn't matter at all
02:09if they flame out in the postseason,
02:11but the idea that they at least recognize
02:13you couldn't do it with Darius,
02:14that's a big step for them.
02:16216-474-0092.
02:18Was this regular season a success
02:21for the Cleveland Cavaliers?
02:23I feel like this has all been building towards me saying
02:26I can't give them a grade.
02:27Or it doesn't matter yet?
02:28Well, no, incomplete.
02:31Like again, like even the Evan Mobley stuff,
02:33it's funny to listen to some people talk about Evan Mobley
02:36and like six weeks ago.
02:38I'm telling you, even after the deadline,
02:40but like a couple weeks into the deadline,
02:44people are still talking about Evan as if he was DOA.
02:47And now the last like four weeks,
02:49there's been the narrative of,
02:51oh, Harden's really brought him along.
02:52Yeah.
02:53It's like people don't realize
02:54that's not what people were saying
02:56the first couple weeks after the trade deadline.
02:58Which it changed, yeah.
02:59Yeah.
02:59Well, no, but I think my point is like for 70% of the season,
03:05Evan was this massive failure.
03:06Evan was this.
03:07It was a walking diatribe.
03:08I even asked Atkinson on that.
03:10Atkinson was like, oh, because remember Atkinson credited Mobley's
03:13thought process and mindset, which is like insane.
03:16It's like just, I don't know, credit the guys around him
03:19and Harden and making them better and then credit whatever,
03:21but don't just credit a better mindset.
03:23Well, no, I mean, it was, it's a mindset.
03:25Yeah.
03:25It looks like a drastically different player,
03:27but okay, that's great.
03:28He just had to all of a sudden tell himself to be different.
03:30I think, so here are the, here are the grades,
03:33not grades, but here are the, like the passing grades
03:35I am willing to give out today.
03:36One is Donovan Mitchell.
03:38Year four, obviously he did use his power
03:41to shake up the roster.
03:43That is a TBD, but in terms of Donovan in the regular season,
03:47he really steadied this thing and got them to 52 wins.
03:51Yeah.
03:51I'm trying to think of another guard of his,
03:53ilk that if you had this kind of instability,
03:56Jarrett was hurt for part of the season.
03:58Evan was hurt for a good part of the early season.
04:01Darius was out and when he was in, he was ineffective.
04:04They had no struce, they had other injuries.
04:06And then you have this huge mid-season,
04:08you know, roster turnover.
04:11Like, I think, I, I think it really is a testament
04:14to Donovan's leadership and what a damn gamer he is
04:17that you were able to get to 52 games
04:18with all the nonsense that happened with his season.
04:21Yeah, I mean, well, the whole season's just been
04:22one big rollercoaster ride.
04:24That's all it is.
04:24And that's okay.
04:25That's fine.
04:26Now, they've gotten to a spot now
04:27where they've set themselves up
04:28for the first two rounds of the postseason
04:30about as well as you possibly could,
04:31all things considered.
04:32They are, I know it sounds funny to say,
04:34because I'm still worried about Jarrett's health,
04:36but like, they're as healthy as they've ever been.
04:38And they're actually in a spot
04:39where this team is going to have a chance
04:41to showcase what it can do
04:42in the first round of the postseason
04:44with about as close to as strength-filled
04:46as they can get.
04:47I'm going to give out one more absolute passing grade.
04:51Okay, then.
04:51Of like the big players for the Cavs.
04:54Okay.
04:54And it's got to be Kenny Atkinson.
04:56It's funny, like, Kenny Atkinson,
04:58I think, had more moving pieces
05:00and more to deal with.
05:02Plus, as the lead-up to the trade deadline
05:05was going on, it was very apparent
05:06that the Cavs were considering
05:08seriously shaking up this team,
05:10keeping them on target to get to 52 wins.
05:14And seeming like, and we'll see, you know,
05:16there's always stuff you find out after the fact.
05:18So, you know, we could get into July
05:20and it turns out this was a mess
05:22and Kenny was a mess or whatever.
05:23Yeah.
05:23But for them to kind of stay buoyant
05:26and to stay on mission
05:28and to try and rig their way,
05:30whichever which way they went,
05:32I think Kenny Atkinson and Donovan Mitchell
05:34deserve a significant passing grade
05:37for landing this plane,
05:39getting it to 52 and 30,
05:40getting it to a top four seed,
05:41and just not falling apart
05:43where I think a lesser coach
05:45or lesser star might have.
05:46Well, here's where I'll give them credit
05:47is that they did that balancing act
05:50at the end of the season
05:50in a way that I wouldn't have.
05:52I would have been way more obvious
05:53about trying to lose games
05:55and secure the four seed.
05:56They didn't do that.
05:57They won a lot of games down the stretch.
05:5911 out of their last 14.
06:00And to do that while keeping
06:02the basketball gods in favor of Donovan
06:05and not upsetting what the stars want to do
06:07in the process
06:08and keeping your four seed,
06:09that was hard.
06:10I wouldn't have been able to pull that off
06:11the way he did.
06:12Well, that's why I think,
06:13like, I tend to think that head coaches
06:15in the NBA tend to be middle management
06:18if middle management has less power
06:20than the front office
06:21or the star players.
06:23And so I'm going to assume
06:24the front office was saying,
06:26we got to get the four seed.
06:27We got to avoid Boston
06:28because that's more of a front office mindset.
06:30You're thinking globally.
06:32You're not thinking of today.
06:34And then I'm going to imagine Donovan
06:35was like, to hell with that.
06:36I'm going to go out there
06:37and try and win as many games.
06:39Because not a lot of coaches
06:40can't actually handle that push and pull
06:42and keeping Donovan.
06:43And he did it flawlessly.
06:44And honestly, I think it's,
06:45I think something that JB
06:46might have struggled with
06:48less than on the court stuff,
06:49less than anything else,
06:51was just as a go between
06:52the front office and Donovan.
06:54Well, he clearly failed in that, right?
06:55Like, because he was just doing
06:57whatever the front office wanted him to do.
06:58And then that pissed off Donovan.
06:59And then now all of a sudden,
07:00you're, hey,
07:01you get to be the coach of the Pistons.
07:02Yep.
07:02That's how that works.
07:03And so like I,
07:04the job that Atkinson did there,
07:06very, very impressive.
07:07Won't matter.
07:08You lose in the first round
07:09and nobody cares.
07:10And all of a sudden,
07:10Atkinson will probably be out of a job.
07:12But like that job,
07:13that was impressive.
07:14So I think I've answered
07:15the question here.
07:16Do you think the regular season
07:18was a success?
07:19I think it was a success
07:19based off of my initial answer.
07:20Yes.
07:21The idea that finding out
07:22that you couldn't win with Garland
07:23is what made this season a success.
07:24If you went to the postseason
07:26with Garland
07:26and the initial core four
07:28as constituted,
07:29I'd be worried about
07:30the Detroit series.
07:31Hell, I might even be worried
07:32about the Raptors series.
07:33I would not have confidence
07:34with this Cavs team
07:35if it was still
07:36the original core four.
07:37Finding out that you had
07:38to make those trades
07:39and you had to dump Garland
07:40the way that they did,
07:41that was,
07:42that's in and of itself,
07:43that made this part
07:44a success.
07:45I don't know that we can give
07:46the Cavs success for that
07:47because Darius just wasn't healthy.
07:49You know,
07:50like it's a little...
07:51I'm giving them success for that.
07:52Unless this is too much
07:53giving Kobe Altman success,
07:54but like...
08:05Well, no,
08:05I think it would have been
08:06a much harder decision
08:07if Darius had been playing well
08:08and healthy in the regular season.
08:10But they still made the decision.
08:11That's where they get
08:11the credit from me.
08:12They could have just been...
08:13Wasn't the decision made
08:13for them because of Darius' health?
08:15Darius, I mean,
08:16still played how many
08:17of the final whatever games
08:18for the Clippers?
08:19Like, he got back on the court
08:20and was able to actually play.
08:21So, like,
08:22you still had to make that decision.
08:24They could have just as easily said,
08:25let's ride it out
08:26and we don't love the options out there.
08:28We don't want to make
08:29a trade for Harden.
08:30We don't want to do everything
08:30that comes with that.
08:31And we're just going to ride through
08:32and then we'll evaluate
08:35LeBron.
08:36The idea that they didn't do that
08:37is why I give them
08:38a bunch of credit.
08:38It just feels like
08:40the decision was
08:41try and do something...
08:42I don't want to say
08:43go all in for this year
08:44because James Harden
08:45versus Darius
08:46was an interesting
08:47power dynamic swap.
08:49But, like,
08:50it did feel like,
08:51you know...
08:53Let me put it this way.
08:54I think it would have been
08:54a much more I give you credit for
08:56if Darius was balling out
08:57in the regular season
08:58healthy
08:59and you still make that trade.
09:01Like, because it wasn't
09:02an unpopular one.
09:03I think Cavs fans
09:04were looking for
09:05a fall guy
09:06at that point
09:07on why this team
09:08wasn't on a 65-win pace
09:10and I think
09:12the vibes
09:13were at an all-time low.
09:14Like, I think
09:14the trade they made
09:15at the time
09:16was a pretty easy one.
09:17And I know
09:18because I was the guy
09:18taking the crap-kicking
09:19every day for being like,
09:21I don't really want
09:21to trade Darius.
09:22But until they actually
09:23traded Darius,
09:24I think the vast majority
09:24of people thought
09:25Jared Allen was going
09:26to be the one
09:26that was out the door.
09:27Like, the vast majority
09:27of people didn't think
09:28it was going to be Darius
09:29at this deadline.
09:30The fact that they did that
09:31and made that move,
09:32like, there's some kudos
09:33attached to that.
09:34And again, it's all
09:35what they learned
09:35in the regular season.
09:36See, I think if,
09:37because this is where
09:38I think the group
09:40that was for trading
09:41James Harden,
09:42I've always felt like
09:43they try to put themselves
09:44in this,
09:45we won't really lose here.
09:46Because if Darius,
09:48you know,
09:49if James goes out there
09:50and doesn't get it done.
09:50Oh, it's not an attempt.
09:51I've told you this before.
09:52Yes.
09:52There is no lose out of that.
09:54Yes, there is.
09:55Absolutely.
09:56Because Darius was never
09:56going to accomplish anything.
09:57You don't know that.
09:58I do know that.
09:59No, no, no, you don't.
10:00I got years of evidence
10:01of the three years
10:02of the core four
10:03not accomplishing anything.
10:04Then why don't you say that
10:04about Donovan?
10:04Why don't you say that
10:05about Jarrett?
10:06Why don't you say that
10:06about Evan?
10:06No, it's the combo
10:07and the fit all together.
10:09Like, Darius is not enough
10:10of a player to put this team
10:11over the top.
10:12That was part of the evidence
10:13that is baked into this.
10:14James Harden's a top 20 player
10:15in the NBA.
10:16And look at how many teams
10:17he's gotten, guys,
10:18over the top again.
10:19He's a top 20 player
10:19in the NBA.
10:20Now he's not.
10:21Yes, he is.
10:22The ringer just did a ranking
10:23a week and a half ago.
10:24He was number 20.
10:25Well, that's scientific.
10:27Bill Simmons
10:28in a couple of news.
10:28Do you want to make him
10:29to 25 then?
10:30Like, I don't know.
10:31I don't know.
10:31You want to.
10:32We can quabble over it.
10:33But he's a really good player.
10:34The top 20 is insane.
10:35That's what they had.
10:36I don't know what to tell you.
10:37I don't care what the.
10:39It's a personal.
10:40It's a opinion piece.
10:41That's not like definitive.
10:43But like.
10:45I'm saying like stats now.
10:46But there's not like
10:47a definitive stat.
10:48If you say.
10:49Okay, then take it out.
10:50I don't know.
10:50What do you rank Harden as?
10:51What is your ranking for him?
10:5329.
10:53Exactly right.
10:54Like the point is.
10:55Fine.
10:5635th.
10:57Whatever you want.
10:57It's better than what
10:58Darius Garland's ranking
10:59is going to be.
11:00And you're on a significantly
11:01better team with Harden.
11:02He gives you a much better chance.
11:03The problem is.
11:04It's just an opportunistic
11:05moment to have that take.
11:07And part of me is really
11:08rooting for Darius and the
11:09Clippers to actually get into
11:11a seven game series.
11:13Because I guarantee you.
11:15If the Cavs fall out.
11:16Or if the Cavs and Clippers
11:17fall at the same time.
11:19And Darius all of a sudden
11:20surrounded by a different
11:21looking team.
11:21With maybe a little more
11:22size around him.
11:23Plays really well.
11:25It's going to be wild to see
11:26what the narrative is in
11:28roughly four weeks time.
11:29Okay.
11:29So but it still was a hard
11:31decision the Cavs had to make.
11:32And they made it.
11:33And I give them credit for
11:33making that.
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