- 14 hours ago
What if your biggest business growth problem is not strategy… but your story?
In this episode of the Workforce Alchemy Podcast, Mason Duchatschek sits down with Justin Ricklefs, founder of Guild Collective and author of Give a Damn, to reveal why storytelling is the most overlooked leadership advantage in modern business.
If your messaging feels unclear, your brand is blending in, or your team is not aligned, this conversation will fundamentally change how you think about leadership, brand clarity, company culture, and customer experience.
In today’s AI-driven, noise-saturated marketplace, one truth stands above the rest: Clarity wins. Confusion repels. As Justin explains, lack of clarity is unkind.
Why You Should Watch This Episode
If you are a business owner, CEO, executive, or team leader, this episode will help you:
- Build a clear, compelling brand story that attracts the right customers
- Align your internal culture with your external brand
- Increase customer loyalty, referrals, and word-of-mouth growth
- Cut through content overload and stand out in a crowded market
- Lead with authenticity, clarity, and purpose
In This Episode, You Will Learn:
- Why storytelling is a leadership discipline, not just marketing
- How unclear messaging silently drives away customers and employees
- The connection between company culture and brand success
- Why your customer must be the hero of your story
- How authentic leadership builds trust and long-term loyalty
- The fastest path to growth: delighting your current customers
-How to break through the noise in an AI-driven business landscape
Key Takeaways for Leaders:
-Clarity is not just communication. It is leadership responsibility.
-Culture shows up in every customer interaction.
-Authenticity is not optional. It is a growth strategy.
-Storytelling is one of the most powerful tools in business today.
About Justin Ricklefs
Justin Ricklefs is the founder of Guild Collective and author of Give a Damn, a book that challenges leaders to communicate clearly, care deeply, and lead with purpose in a distracted, fast-moving world.
Chapters
00:00 Introduction to Leadership and Brand Clarity
02:49 The Importance of Storytelling in Business
05:53 Understanding Internal Brand Clarity
08:25 The Role of Culture in Brand Identity
11:14 The Connection Between Brand and Customer Experience
14:06 Navigating Growth Challenges with Story and Identity
16:47 Marketing in the Age of AI
19:48 Breaking Through the Noise
22:33 Authentic Connection in Leadership
25:14 Delighting Customers for Growth
28:53 Leadership and Storytelling
29:48 Storytelling as Strategy
33:05 Feedback and Listening
35:10 The Purpose Behind Give a Damn
Grow Your Business with Workforce Alchemy
If you are ready to build a stronger team, clearer message, and more scalable business, connect with us:
Website: https://workforcealchemy.com/
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/ReverseRiskConsulting
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/workforcealchemy
In this episode of the Workforce Alchemy Podcast, Mason Duchatschek sits down with Justin Ricklefs, founder of Guild Collective and author of Give a Damn, to reveal why storytelling is the most overlooked leadership advantage in modern business.
If your messaging feels unclear, your brand is blending in, or your team is not aligned, this conversation will fundamentally change how you think about leadership, brand clarity, company culture, and customer experience.
In today’s AI-driven, noise-saturated marketplace, one truth stands above the rest: Clarity wins. Confusion repels. As Justin explains, lack of clarity is unkind.
Why You Should Watch This Episode
If you are a business owner, CEO, executive, or team leader, this episode will help you:
- Build a clear, compelling brand story that attracts the right customers
- Align your internal culture with your external brand
- Increase customer loyalty, referrals, and word-of-mouth growth
- Cut through content overload and stand out in a crowded market
- Lead with authenticity, clarity, and purpose
In This Episode, You Will Learn:
- Why storytelling is a leadership discipline, not just marketing
- How unclear messaging silently drives away customers and employees
- The connection between company culture and brand success
- Why your customer must be the hero of your story
- How authentic leadership builds trust and long-term loyalty
- The fastest path to growth: delighting your current customers
-How to break through the noise in an AI-driven business landscape
Key Takeaways for Leaders:
-Clarity is not just communication. It is leadership responsibility.
-Culture shows up in every customer interaction.
-Authenticity is not optional. It is a growth strategy.
-Storytelling is one of the most powerful tools in business today.
About Justin Ricklefs
Justin Ricklefs is the founder of Guild Collective and author of Give a Damn, a book that challenges leaders to communicate clearly, care deeply, and lead with purpose in a distracted, fast-moving world.
Chapters
00:00 Introduction to Leadership and Brand Clarity
02:49 The Importance of Storytelling in Business
05:53 Understanding Internal Brand Clarity
08:25 The Role of Culture in Brand Identity
11:14 The Connection Between Brand and Customer Experience
14:06 Navigating Growth Challenges with Story and Identity
16:47 Marketing in the Age of AI
19:48 Breaking Through the Noise
22:33 Authentic Connection in Leadership
25:14 Delighting Customers for Growth
28:53 Leadership and Storytelling
29:48 Storytelling as Strategy
33:05 Feedback and Listening
35:10 The Purpose Behind Give a Damn
Grow Your Business with Workforce Alchemy
If you are ready to build a stronger team, clearer message, and more scalable business, connect with us:
Website: https://workforcealchemy.com/
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/ReverseRiskConsulting
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/workforcealchemy
Category
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LifestyleTranscript
00:05Welcome to the Mason Dukachek Show.
00:07This episode is brought to you by Workforce Alchemy,
00:11helping leaders improve hiring, engagement, and retention
00:14while uncovering people-related profit leaks
00:16hidden in everyday operations.
00:19Today's guest works at the intersection
00:21of leadership brand and trust,
00:24where many business owners struggle
00:26to clearly articulate who they are
00:29and why anyone should care.
00:31Justin Rickliff is the founder of Guild Collective
00:35and the author of the new book, Give a Damn.
00:38Through his work, he helps organizations clarify their identity,
00:44sharpen their message, and build meaningful connections
00:47with customers, partners, and communities
00:49in a crowded and noisy world.
00:52His background includes creative leadership
00:55and relationship-driven work,
00:57including experience building partnerships
01:00in a professional sports organization
01:02where alignment and trust were non-negotiable.
01:07What makes Justin's perspective valuable for business owners and CEOs
01:11is that he understands how clarity of story
01:15and intention directly impacts growth,
01:19partnerships, and long-term relevance.
01:22This conversation is about how leaders show up,
01:24how they communicate,
01:26what they do, and why it matters,
01:29and how it shapes the results that they get.
01:32Justin, I'm so happy to have you on the show.
01:33Welcome.
01:35Man, Mason, it's like,
01:37yeah, that sounds interesting.
01:39I appreciate it, and I resonate with it,
01:41and I think it's a timely topic.
01:43I definitely don't have all the answers,
01:44but I love part of having this conversation
01:47because it is one that leaders,
01:48CEOs, business owners, marketing leads
01:51are having in the real world,
01:52and it's just a delight and a pleasure to be with you, man.
01:56I think story cuts through noise
02:00like a hot knife through butter,
02:01and there's so much noise out there.
02:03I think businesses are starving for ways
02:06to become radically relevant,
02:09to borrow a phrase from Bill Cates,
02:11who I had on a few weeks ago.
02:12Love that phrase.
02:13They're struggling for, how do you do that?
02:15So I am very invested in hearing what you have to say,
02:18and I hope everyone else is looking forward to it
02:20as much as I am.
02:22Yeah, well, look, I didn't invent story.
02:25I'm not the only one who talks about story.
02:27Our business at Guild is not the only ones
02:29who build frameworks around brand story.
02:32In fact, part of the reason I started Guild Collective
02:35back in the day was because of
02:37Donald Miller's work on StoryBrand,
02:39and in my job, my corporate job at the time,
02:42we were selling into mid-market to Fortune 50 companies,
02:48big businesses with big marketing budgets,
02:50and they kept coming back to the team in our group
02:54and asking for help to literally help us tell our story.
02:58And I was like, man, I don't understand.
03:00And I was like tinkering around on the internet,
03:02writing words about family and business and sales
03:05and just weird stuff personally,
03:07and telling stories.
03:09And there were these little fragments of community
03:11and connection that started to form,
03:13nothing significant.
03:15But I was watching what was taking place,
03:17you know, what I would call like in this story forum.
03:20And then I'm in this corporate forum
03:22where it's all like head.
03:23And I'm like, these businesses need to inject some heart
03:27into the stuff they're doing
03:28and quit talking about themselves as much.
03:31And fundamentally, I mean,
03:33story is the oldest sales trick in the book.
03:35And it's not a trick.
03:36It's a way.
03:37It's a practice.
03:39We don't sit around campfires
03:40and talk about facts and figures.
03:42We sit around campfires and we tell stories.
03:44And that's the bridge to human connection.
03:46So yeah, we've developed our own version
03:48of how to help a company clarify and connect
03:51and be creative in the way they tell that story.
03:53But ultimately, that strategic framing
03:56is the heartbeat of the business
03:58that the internal audience first believes
04:01and knows and feels and experiences and understands
04:03and ultimately gets manifested
04:06into the external experience where you build that,
04:08where the heart connects to the other heart of a human.
04:10So we call it human first brand building.
04:12And I can get super long-winded on it,
04:14but in a nutshell,
04:15that's how we see the world of branding and story.
04:18So you just spoke about internally
04:21knowing what the story is.
04:23A lot of businesses struggle,
04:24not because they lack capability,
04:26but because they lack clarity.
04:28From your perspective,
04:29where does that lack of clarity usually begin?
04:32Well, it's the number one piece of our step
04:36is to identify and diagnose
04:38internal brand health clarity.
04:41Because we all are storytellers,
04:44that it's just fascinating
04:46how many different businesses,
04:47our own included, it's hard work,
04:49but you survey or you build a mosaic
04:51of perspectives of an internal team
04:54and they don't know how to communicate what they do,
04:57who they do it for,
04:58why they exist,
04:59what the purpose is,
05:00what they're going after.
05:01And so you'll get a CEO that says one thing,
05:03a VP of product that says another thing,
05:05a VP of HR that says another thing,
05:07and the entry-level first person,
05:09you know, first job type person
05:11who has no idea what to say.
05:12And so everybody's just scrambling around,
05:15trying to figure out who is this place.
05:18And when there's confusion,
05:19Brene Brown talks about this,
05:21lack of clarity is kind.
05:23The lack of clarity is unkind.
05:25And so when a business doesn't have clarity,
05:28we call it their heartbeat,
05:29on their brand heartbeat,
05:30that if that pulse isn't clear and strong,
05:33everything else is just confusing.
05:34And it's not that it's bad or wrong or off,
05:38but it's confusing.
05:39And if we are confused as humans,
05:43we just tune it out.
05:44Not because we think you're bad or not interesting.
05:46We have so much else competing for our attention
05:49and our affection, I would say,
05:52that if the brand isn't clear,
05:56then we instantly are fighting a huge uphill battle
06:00for attention, affection, adoration.
06:03It's funny.
06:04I was in a conversation the other day
06:05with a person,
06:06and we were talking about the concept of identity.
06:08And she said,
06:09when you know who you are,
06:11you know what to do.
06:14Because that limits your universe of possibilities
06:17because you won't do things
06:19that are outside of your stated identity.
06:21They're just not options.
06:22So when you know who you are,
06:24you know what you'll do.
06:25And when you know what to do,
06:27then you can have what you want to have.
06:28And it made all the sense in the world.
06:31And I think you're really talking about that.
06:33And where our conversation was on personal development,
06:36you're really talking about that same thing for a company.
06:41Yeah.
06:41And I think they're both really related.
06:44I think when an organization can help its team,
06:49I think culture is a byproduct.
06:51It's just like,
06:52it's as overused of a word
06:53as authenticity or vulnerability these days.
06:56It's like,
06:56everybody's talking about like,
06:58create cultures.
06:59Well, culture is the result.
07:00It's the byproduct.
07:02It's the outcome.
07:03And clarity of connection,
07:07creativity,
07:07and story is the play.
07:10Again,
07:10that's not fix the QuickBooks, right?
07:13If there's some fundamental issues
07:15in the finance department
07:16or on the recruiting team or whatever else.
07:18This isn't,
07:18but it's this missing gap in the market.
07:22Lots of companies have really clear
07:24vision statements,
07:25mission statements,
07:26values.
07:27They've got stuff hanging on the wall.
07:28They've got an onboarding kit.
07:29And then they walk into the real world
07:31meetings with clients.
07:32They have no idea how to communicate
07:33about what they do,
07:34why they exist,
07:35who they exist for,
07:36what happens when you engage in that business.
07:38And so the energy is just disconnected.
07:41It doesn't beat clearly and strongly.
07:43And so,
07:44yeah,
07:44that piece for us is like,
07:46it does,
07:46it always,
07:47the businesses who are winning today
07:49have really clear and compelling
07:52energy sources inside the organization.
07:55You can't mark,
07:56not anymore.
07:56You can't market your way
07:57to a healthy business.
07:58You can't buy enough billboards,
08:00enough TV spots,
08:01enough SEO.
08:02If that internal clarity of story
08:05isn't strong and frankly simple,
08:07then it just disconnects
08:10and starts to start.
08:12So this is something,
08:15obviously there are leaders
08:16who know their business inside and out.
08:19Why do you think it's so difficult
08:20for some of them to come up
08:23with the clarity that is obviously needed?
08:25I mean,
08:26I think context matters,
08:27of course,
08:27there's a lot of variance to that,
08:29but the,
08:30I think we overemphasize complexity
08:33and we chase these,
08:35you know,
08:35things that make us either feel smart
08:37or look smart
08:38or sound hard.
08:41And so use a very obvious example.
08:43Chick-fil-A has built a business
08:44with a 16-year-old
08:46as their frontline team member,
08:48which is a risky business move.
08:49And they're only open
08:51six out of the seven days of the week.
08:52But you go to any Chick-fil-A
08:54across the country
08:55and if that 16-year-old
08:57doesn't approach you,
08:58ask for your name.
09:00And then after the exchange,
09:02after the transaction,
09:03if they don't,
09:03when the purchaser says,
09:06thank you,
09:07if they don't say my pleasure,
09:10you're instantly like,
09:11this person should get fired
09:13because they don't,
09:13they don't live into the brand heartbeat,
09:15right?
09:15It's a jarring,
09:17and that's a simple phrase.
09:19They didn't make up that phrase.
09:20They weren't the first ones
09:20to ever say it.
09:21But they took three years
09:23to build that fabric internally.
09:25That's their brand heartbeat.
09:26There's a bunch of other stories.
09:27I'll use one real example
09:29in kind of Main Street.
09:30We work in a company
09:31called Central Bank of Kansas City.
09:33And their brand heartbeat,
09:34after a lot of work,
09:35we got distilled down into,
09:37they are champions of possibility.
09:40That's their whole,
09:41and it's like,
09:42is that a vision statement or purpose?
09:43It's like,
09:44it doesn't matter.
09:44It's their heartbeat.
09:45It's the heartbeat
09:46of why they do what they do.
09:47And then they've built
09:48entire internal messaging programs
09:51around how do we become better
09:55at being champions of possibility?
09:57And for them,
09:58it's about people,
09:58purpose,
09:59and possibility.
10:00And so again,
10:01but that simple framing
10:03is difficult
10:04because you're always running so fast.
10:07You're chasing stuff
10:07and you're like,
10:08oh, this next thing
10:08or this EOS model
10:09or this whatever else,
10:11this will solve all the problems.
10:12And meanwhile,
10:13the team
10:13is just begging for like,
10:15who are we?
10:16Like at its most basic level,
10:17like who are we?
10:18Who do we serve?
10:19And why does this matter?
10:21And when that stuff starts to get clarified,
10:23it's not magic.
10:23It's not potion.
10:24But when it starts to get clarified
10:26and the heart does beat
10:27pretty regularly
10:28and strongly,
10:29it does set a standard.
10:30It elevates the energy.
10:32It gets,
10:32it gets people
10:33who aren't on that
10:34same wavelength,
10:35a very obvious distinction
10:36between like,
10:37eh.
10:37so leaders can start
10:38having tough conversations
10:39and root it back
10:41into a heartbeat principle,
10:42not like a,
10:42you know,
10:43shamey job performance thing.
10:44And so anyway,
10:45I just think the simplicity
10:48is actually very difficult.
10:50And,
10:51but that's what we crave
10:51because as storytellers,
10:53you want something
10:54that is going to be true
10:55if you're the accounting manager
10:56or if you're the HR person
10:57or if you're the CEO
10:58or better yet,
11:00if you're the client
11:01who's experiencing that thing.
11:02How much goodwill
11:03does Chick-fil-A get
11:04just because we talk
11:05about them all the time?
11:06Everybody does
11:06because it's like,
11:07it's a great client experience
11:08because it's rooted out
11:09of their brand heartbeat
11:11and how it,
11:11how it shows up
11:12from the inside out.
11:14I know there's people listening
11:15because I've thought this before
11:17and knee-jerk reaction
11:18like,
11:19ah,
11:19this is just a bunch
11:20of warm,
11:20fuzzy,
11:21corporate speak babble.
11:24That's right.
11:25And it isn't
11:26because when you get the,
11:28in your example,
11:29the Chick-fil-A,
11:29you've got a 16-year-old kid
11:31on the front line
11:34embodying
11:35the brand story.
11:36and embodying
11:37the brand image.
11:38When I come in contact
11:39with that 16-year-old,
11:41they are the company to me.
11:43I don't sit there
11:44and say,
11:45hey,
11:46this 16-year-old kid
11:47that worked at Chick-fil-A
11:48wasn't motivated
11:49or wasn't competent
11:51or was a jerk.
11:53Yep.
11:54I say,
11:55the company was.
11:57100%.
11:57The company,
11:59they're jerks.
12:00It's not the company.
12:01That one person
12:02is a reflection of that.
12:03That's the brand experience.
12:04Absolutely.
12:05And as a consumer,
12:06I will tell my friends
12:07and family
12:08and anyone on the internet
12:09who will listen
12:10what I think of that company
12:12when it isn't that company.
12:13It's that one individual
12:14who represents the company
12:15to me.
12:16So when there's congruence
12:17across the story
12:18and the identity,
12:20that matters a lot.
12:22And that's not just
12:22warm,
12:23fuzzy,
12:24fluffy,
12:24corporate babble.
12:26That's front-line
12:27business
12:29101.
12:30So I get it.
12:32Yes.
12:32And Mason,
12:33the inverse of that's true.
12:34Like the 97
12:36out of 100 experiences
12:37you have with Chick-fil-A
12:38front-line people
12:39leave you feeling
12:41a certain way
12:41and to the positive.
12:43You feel some,
12:44you don't say this,
12:45but your body feels
12:46love.
12:47It feels accepted.
12:47It feels good.
12:48It feels pleasant.
12:49It feels awesome,
12:51enjoyable.
12:51And you're happy
12:52to give them 14 bucks
12:53on Apple Pay
12:53for one single meal,
12:54right?
12:55And so it is
12:56dwarfing their
12:58competitive set
12:59and they're only open
13:00six days a week.
13:00They have higher
13:01per restaurant
13:02revenue,
13:03per restaurant
13:04profit,
13:05per restaurant
13:06team retention.
13:07It's like,
13:08it's a really smart
13:09business model.
13:10It's not just
13:11warm and fuzzy.
13:12Care is a competitive
13:12advantage.
13:13And I stole this line
13:14from John Hoffman
13:17who runs the Chick-fil-A
13:18in Liberty, Missouri.
13:19And he recounts the story.
13:20I don't know if we get
13:21the quote exactly right,
13:22but he was
13:22Truett Cathy,
13:23the founder of Chick-fil-A.
13:25Had some version
13:25of a story that said
13:26care and commerce
13:27can coexist.
13:29And it is,
13:29it is.
13:30Isn't that a story?
13:31Something I'll remember.
13:33Totally.
13:34Many CEOs
13:35default to tactics
13:36when growth slows.
13:37In your opinion,
13:38why is story
13:39and identity
13:40often the lever
13:41they overlook?
13:42Well,
13:42I think,
13:42and it's hard
13:43because I think
13:44we're,
13:44us included,
13:45you look for
13:47some,
13:48I don't know,
13:48easy or quick
13:49or non-difficult
13:51ways
13:52to grow.
13:54It's just human nature.
13:55We just slide into this
13:56like,
13:56well,
13:56can it be easy tomorrow?
13:58But the difficult work
14:00of,
14:00and the way
14:01I relate it
14:02to our own,
14:03you know,
14:04the brand heartbeat
14:04that we talk about.
14:06To have a healthy heart,
14:08my dad had heart surgery.
14:09He's healthy
14:10and he's 84
14:11and he's as ornery
14:12and vibrant
14:13as he's ever been.
14:14But he had heart surgery
14:14in 2016.
14:16But you don't go
14:17to the heart doctor
14:18because you think
14:19your pinky toe
14:21has fungus on it
14:23or you can't feel
14:24your elbow
14:26has some issues.
14:27And that's what I think
14:28a lot of the
14:28tactic conversations
14:30end up becoming.
14:31They can become
14:31these like
14:33disconnected
14:33from the heart
14:34conversations
14:35that you think
14:36will produce
14:38quick,
14:38meaningful,
14:39sustainable,
14:40huge growth.
14:40And it's like,
14:41that's not really
14:41how it works.
14:42Like,
14:43what works is
14:43you get clarity
14:45on your heartbeat.
14:46You get build connections
14:48to your internal audience
14:49and your external audience
14:50and then you creatively
14:51tell that story
14:52in a way that moves
14:53human emotion.
14:54And that work
14:56is heart level work
14:58and it's not quick
14:59but it does
15:00beat a strong heartbeat
15:01for a long period
15:02of time.
15:03And so I think
15:04when owners
15:06and CEOs,
15:07and again,
15:07I've been in deceit
15:08plenty,
15:09when you get afraid
15:10and you default
15:12to like quick fix,
15:13tactic,
15:13Band-Aid,
15:14emergency,
15:15you know,
15:16toe surgery
15:16as opposed to going
15:18deep breath.
15:19Who are we?
15:20Who do we serve?
15:21What are we building?
15:22And,
15:22and it,
15:23you know,
15:23I'm mixing metaphors here
15:24but in a lot of ways
15:25you got to till up the soil
15:27and then pray for rain.
15:28You can't ultimately
15:29control the rain
15:31and,
15:32but,
15:32but it is your responsibility
15:33to create those conditions
15:34as a leader
15:35where those seeds
15:36can take root
15:37when it does rain
15:38and I think
15:38we're just so quick
15:39to want
15:40these fix,
15:42like this kind of,
15:42you know,
15:43slot machine version
15:44of marketing
15:44that's like,
15:45yeah,
15:46can you,
15:46can you go buy your way
15:47to some Google ads
15:48that create some short-term leads?
15:50Absolutely.
15:51Does that mean though
15:52that you've built
15:53a healthy brand
15:54that is vibrant
15:55and growing
15:56and connected?
15:57Like,
15:58I would bet to say
15:59to keep using
16:00the Chick-fil-A example,
16:01they don't run discounts,
16:03they don't run sales,
16:04every once in a while
16:05they'll give you like
16:05a free cup of coffee
16:06in your app
16:06or whatever,
16:07but they don't,
16:08they don't market
16:09their way towards health.
16:11Do they do marketing
16:12and advertising?
16:13But that it all
16:14is flowing out
16:15of this connective tissue
16:16of the heartbeat,
16:17not this duct tape version
16:20of,
16:20hey,
16:20we got to scramble
16:21for customers tomorrow.
16:23One of the things
16:24that I think
16:24is so important
16:25about why
16:26this conversation matters
16:27is I remember
16:29when I'm totally
16:30dating myself,
16:31I sound like the old guy
16:32going,
16:32I remember back
16:32in the old day.
16:33Same.
16:33I feel like
16:34a progressive commercial
16:35almost every day.
16:37I remember
16:38when the big push
16:39was,
16:40well,
16:40if you want
16:41to get your business
16:42found,
16:42people don't go
16:43on the yellow pages
16:44anymore,
16:44they go to Google.
16:47And if you want
16:48to get your business
16:48found,
16:49you have to get found
16:50on the first page
16:50of Google.
16:51So everybody
16:52optimizes their messages
16:53and their keyword
16:54research to appear
16:56at the top of Google.
16:57Great.
16:58Yes.
16:58Now there is a shift
17:00to AI.
17:02And AI is not
17:03recommending 10
17:04of them in a category
17:05and search is way
17:06different.
17:06It's not like
17:07I'm looking for
17:08XYZ service
17:09in this town.
17:10That's right.
17:11People are asking
17:12very different things
17:13and AI may have
17:14one or two answers
17:15or one or two people
17:16they recommend
17:16or something like that.
17:18That's a whole
17:21much,
17:21that's a very
17:22different scenario
17:24instead of rules.
17:26And the target
17:27to be the one
17:29that AI talks about,
17:30that's a very,
17:31very small target
17:32and the target
17:33there's not room
17:33for everybody
17:34there.
17:36I mean,
17:36AI is not going
17:37to say,
17:37oh,
17:37here's 150
17:38different companies
17:38and here's one.
17:40It's not going
17:41to happen
17:41or at least
17:43I don't see it
17:43happen anytime soon.
17:45But what will
17:46people do
17:46if they remember
17:48your brand
17:48or they've heard
17:49your brand
17:49or they feel
17:50good about
17:50your brand,
17:51they will go
17:51look for that
17:52directly.
17:53That's right.
17:54Yes.
17:55Yes.
17:55That's the antidote
17:56if you ask me
17:57for the near future
18:00of marketing
18:01and I think
18:02that's why
18:02branding is so
18:03important
18:04and the story
18:05is so important
18:05because it tells
18:06people what to
18:07expect
18:07and gives them
18:08a sense of
18:08certainty
18:09and a feeling
18:09that you're
18:11going to deliver
18:11on that sense
18:12of certainty
18:12and that is
18:13something that
18:13will stick
18:14in their mind
18:14and that they
18:15will tell others
18:16and that people
18:16will look for
18:17directly.
18:17And I think
18:18that is the
18:21workaround
18:22by having
18:22your marketing
18:23shut down
18:24by AI
18:24who doesn't
18:25know you
18:25exist.
18:26Totally.
18:27It's just a
18:28flimsy proposition
18:29to base
18:30the growth
18:31of your company
18:31on whatever
18:32tactic is
18:33that moment
18:34in time's
18:35trend.
18:35AI has a
18:37huge seat
18:38at the table
18:39and we have
18:39to be mindful
18:40of it,
18:41we have to be
18:41aware of it,
18:41we have to be
18:42curious about it.
18:44And depending
18:44on who you are
18:45you need to
18:45embrace it or not.
18:46Okay,
18:46so that's not
18:47that debate.
18:47So we're not
18:48anti-AI in our
18:49business.
18:50not at all.
18:50We're pro-human
18:51connection.
18:52And the businesses
18:53that are building
18:54human connection
18:55with the people
18:56who work in
18:56their business,
18:57simple stuff.
18:59One of our
18:59biggest clients,
19:00they did this
19:00huge employee
19:01opinion survey,
19:02thousands of
19:03employees.
19:04The number
19:04one result,
19:05they surveyed
19:06every single
19:06one of their
19:07employees.
19:08The number
19:08one distilled
19:09result was I
19:10want my
19:11supervisor to
19:12know my
19:13first name.
19:14Period.
19:15Okay,
19:16okay,
19:16human first
19:18brand building
19:20is required
19:21work,
19:22I'd argue,
19:23especially if
19:24you're trying
19:24to not be
19:25in this
19:25noisy onslaught
19:26of like,
19:27well,
19:27we got to
19:28slide all of
19:28our Google
19:29dollars to
19:29AI now.
19:30It's like,
19:30yeah,
19:31you can buy
19:32your way to
19:33relevance there
19:33for sure.
19:35But does it
19:35fundamentally
19:37beat in a
19:38systematic,
19:39clear,
19:39healthy way
19:40that flows
19:41from the
19:42inside out?
19:42You can
19:43just tell
19:44a healthy
19:44human when
19:45you look at
19:46them.
19:46You don't
19:46talk about
19:47their heart,
19:47but you can
19:47see them.
19:48You went on
19:49a run today
19:49and it's like,
19:50yeah,
19:50bro,
19:50that heart
19:51was beating
19:52and you
19:52did work.
19:53It wasn't
19:53easy,
19:54but was it
19:55rewarding?
19:55Of course it
19:56was.
19:56And you're in
19:57Florida,
19:57so I'm
19:58slightly
19:58jealous.
20:00So what
20:01if you
20:01or your
20:02business
20:02has a
20:03great story
20:04and I
20:06know there
20:07are businesses
20:07out there
20:07that can
20:07relate to
20:08this,
20:08where you
20:09feel like
20:09you're
20:10screaming
20:10mute.
20:11You have
20:11all of
20:12this story
20:13to tell.
20:14It's an
20:14amazing
20:14story.
20:15It's
20:16value.
20:17It's all
20:17the stuff,
20:18but you
20:18can't get
20:18anyone to
20:19hear you.
20:19How do
20:20you break
20:20through?
20:21I think
20:21Mason,
20:22the easiest
20:23way to
20:23think about
20:24that is,
20:24and this
20:25is back
20:25to Donald
20:26Miller's
20:26story brand
20:27framework,
20:27is most
20:28businesses,
20:29and it's
20:30really not
20:31their fault
20:31because they're
20:32doing their
20:32best and they
20:33do have a
20:34story to
20:34tell,
20:34so they
20:35think the
20:35way to
20:36it is to
20:36scream louder
20:37for attention.
20:38But the
20:39signal in a
20:40super noisy
20:41world are
20:43the companies
20:44and leaders
20:45therefore,
20:47who aren't
20:48vying for
20:49attention by
20:50screaming,
20:51but they're
20:52really quietly
20:53and subtly
20:55positioning someone
20:56other than their
20:57brand as the
20:57hero of the
20:58story.
20:58Can you
20:59expand on
21:00that?
21:00Yeah,
21:01so like an
21:03example is,
21:03I bet if you
21:04looked at
21:06100 small
21:07business websites,
21:0893 will be
21:09littered with
21:10words that
21:11were written
21:12about the
21:13business who's
21:14selling the
21:15thing.
21:15We did this,
21:16we started
21:16here, my
21:17grandpa, I'm
21:18third generation
21:18company, we
21:19have all this
21:20stuff.
21:20We're like
21:21pushing products
21:22and services.
21:23But the
21:23prospect or the
21:24customer who's
21:25reading that
21:26website as one
21:27example,
21:27is never
21:29spoken to.
21:30It doesn't
21:31say we
21:32built this
21:32for you so
21:33that your
21:34life gets
21:34easier.
21:35And so
21:36this real
21:36simple, it's
21:37hard work
21:37because people
21:38don't do it
21:38very well,
21:39but the
21:40businesses use
21:41lots of
21:41language like
21:42we and
21:43us.
21:45they don't
21:46use much
21:47language of
21:47you and
21:49your.
21:50And it's
21:51quite simply
21:52like you
21:53have the
21:53business is
21:55the guide
21:56in the
21:56story.
21:57They're not
21:57the hero of
21:58the story.
21:58The customer
21:59is the hero
21:59in the
21:59story.
22:00And so
22:00if we
22:00don't
22:01fundamentally
22:01know what
22:03the customer
22:04wants and
22:05what pain
22:05they're
22:06experiencing
22:06before they
22:07encounter
22:07our thing,
22:08whether it's
22:08marketing or
22:09leadership or
22:10insurance or
22:11whatever,
22:11and then
22:12that
22:13transformational
22:13path we
22:14take them
22:14on so
22:15their life
22:16gets better
22:16and the
22:17pain goes
22:17down, that
22:18is the
22:19journey.
22:19And we
22:20as companies
22:20we just
22:21we get
22:21the we
22:22it's like
22:23I'm not a
22:23hunter, but
22:24if you're
22:24looking for
22:24a big buck
22:25in the woods
22:26through binoculars
22:27and it's
22:27almost like
22:28we're staring
22:28at these
22:29binoculars
22:29out the
22:30wrong way.
22:31I mean,
22:31you're like,
22:31where are
22:32the damn
22:32deer?
22:34And then
22:34someone comes
22:35and they flip
22:36the binoculars
22:36around and
22:37you're like,
22:37yo, there
22:37it is.
22:38Because we've
22:39been looking
22:39at the wrong
22:40side.
22:40And so
22:41no one
22:42shows up
22:42at a
22:42cocktail
22:43party.
22:44That's another
22:45good story,
22:45by the way.
22:46Just let
22:47you know
22:47that wasn't
22:48lost by me.
22:50Good.
22:51Nobody shows
22:51up at a
22:52cocktail party
22:52and just
22:53starts blabbing
22:54about themselves
22:54all the time.
22:55And if they
22:55do, you
22:56don't listen
22:56to them
22:56for very
22:57long because
22:57it's annoying.
22:59But the
22:59ones that
22:59show up
23:00and they're
23:00like, man,
23:01Mason, I
23:02saw your
23:02Garmin watch.
23:03Do you
23:03run her?
23:05And you're
23:05like, yeah,
23:06I ran today
23:06actually 4.3
23:07miles is my
23:08personal best.
23:09I'm trying
23:09to run
23:10a marathon,
23:11whatever.
23:11And then
23:12you start
23:12digging in.
23:13And as
23:14quote-unquote
23:15marketers,
23:16we're just
23:16terrible at
23:17that.
23:17We just
23:17show up
23:18and say,
23:18we built
23:18this thing.
23:19It's really
23:20kick-ass.
23:20You should
23:21buy it.
23:21And everybody
23:22on the other
23:22end of the
23:23thing is like,
23:23I don't
23:24know if I
23:24want to buy
23:25one of those
23:25things.
23:26Instead of
23:27going, hey,
23:27man, you've
23:28got this pain
23:29or this
23:29problem in
23:30your life.
23:32We understand
23:32it.
23:33We've been
23:34there too.
23:34And here's
23:35what clients
23:36like you
23:36have experienced
23:38when they
23:39walked this
23:39road.
23:40They, whatever,
23:41they lost
23:42weight, they
23:42made more
23:43money, their
23:43relationships got
23:44stronger, their
23:45life was easier.
23:46Those are the
23:46companies that are
23:47crushing it, are
23:48people who are
23:50overtly connected
23:51to the human
23:51experience.
23:53So I think
23:54you're getting
23:54right on some
23:55touchy subjects
23:56which I love
23:57because I have
23:58talked to people,
23:59it's a thing
24:01where they see
24:02competitors in
24:03their industry
24:04doing ridiculous
24:05stuff,
24:07embarrassing,
24:08what I would
24:08consider, some
24:08of them consider
24:09embarrassing stuff
24:10to get attention
24:11because they
24:12figure, well, if
24:12we can't get
24:13their prospect's
24:14attention, they're
24:14not going to
24:15listen to our
24:15story anyway.
24:17And the people
24:17that I know
24:18are like, I
24:19would never, nor
24:19would any of the
24:20people in my
24:21group do
24:21something so
24:22ridiculous or
24:23desperate as
24:23to do stuff
24:24like that to
24:25get attention.
24:28Yet, they're
24:29still frustrated
24:30because, again,
24:32their prospects
24:33and their
24:33customers are
24:34paying attention
24:34to that nonsense
24:36and then they
24:37really do
24:37struggle with
24:39how do we
24:40get attention
24:40for the right
24:41reasons?
24:42I mean, yes,
24:43once you got
24:43their attention
24:44you can hook
24:44them into a
24:45conversation and
24:46the things that
24:47you're talking
24:47about, but do
24:48you have any
24:48tips or guidance
24:49to someone who's
24:50sitting there like
24:50that saying,
24:51I'm not going
24:52to do any of
24:52that nonsense
24:53to get
24:53attention.
24:54I am true
24:55to my
24:55identity, to
24:56my core, to
24:57our values, and
24:58we don't act
24:59like that.
25:00That's not where
25:00we operate.
25:00We are focused
25:01on our
25:02customers and
25:03whatnot.
25:03But when
25:04they're mired
25:05in the muck
25:06of their
25:07industry and
25:08not getting
25:09noticed, what
25:12if any thoughts
25:12do you have
25:13for them?
25:14Well, Mason, I
25:15think it's a
25:15real life, like
25:16I think business
25:17owners are fighting
25:18this fight every
25:18day.
25:19And one of
25:19them is, do
25:20you know the
25:22honest answer to
25:23the question of
25:24do the people who
25:25work here love
25:26working here?
25:27I've got to
25:27start there.
25:28Because your
25:28team is the
25:30manifestation of
25:31the brand, no
25:31matter how you
25:32slice it, whatever
25:33technology you're
25:34involved in, whatever
25:34EOS plan you
25:35have.
25:35If your team
25:37does not love
25:38working there, if
25:39there's one person
25:40or a hundred
25:40people or a
25:41million people, it
25:42doesn't matter.
25:42If they don't
25:44energetically come
25:44to life working
25:45there, that's
25:47problem one.
25:48Problem two is
25:50sometimes we
25:51chase new
25:52customers while
25:54we haven't quite
25:57delighted the ones
25:58we have right
25:59now.
26:00And I think
26:00delight is this
26:02word we don't
26:02talk about a lot
26:03in the corporate
26:04sense.
26:06Back to the
26:06Chick-fil-A
26:07example, you
26:08don't drive
26:09through and say
26:10that was delightful.
26:12You don't say
26:13that, but that's
26:13what you feel.
26:14And so I think
26:15if we are on
26:16this crusade
26:17of, and
26:19this is, we
26:19got to take
26:20our own
26:20medicine here.
26:21We had some
26:21tough client
26:22feedback today and
26:23I'm like, good
26:23night.
26:24I'm so sorry
26:24that that
26:25experience for
26:26you didn't
26:27delight you.
26:28It was
26:28frustrating for
26:29you.
26:29And what
26:30happens as
26:30storytellers,
26:31back to
26:31story, is
26:32in the absence
26:33of clarity, the
26:35receiver of the
26:36story will fill
26:37in the gaps.
26:38And most likely
26:39it's not good
26:40stuff, right?
26:40So if I'm a
26:42client of Masons
26:43and I'm
26:44sending a
26:44moment right
26:45there, but
26:47it's true.
26:48It's true.
26:49And it's always
26:50bad news.
26:51Like we just
26:51tell ourselves
26:52bad, fearful
26:53stories because
26:53we're human,
26:54human beings.
26:55And we're like
26:56at our core,
26:56like trying to
26:57stay alive,
26:57right?
26:58We're trying to
26:58survive.
26:59And so if I'm
27:00emailing Mason
27:01and then I text
27:02him and then I
27:02like, and for
27:03three days, I don't
27:04hear back from
27:05him.
27:05I'm like, Mason
27:06hates us.
27:07It's just what
27:07happens.
27:08And Mason might
27:08be, Hey, I went
27:09through something
27:09really difficult.
27:10I've been
27:10unavailable.
27:11My cell phone
27:12fell in the
27:12ocean while I was
27:13running, whatever.
27:14Like there's a
27:14whole other side
27:15of the story.
27:15But as the
27:16customer, if I
27:17don't feel
27:19delight, then I
27:20start to fill in
27:21my own gaps of
27:22stories.
27:22And so that's
27:23why it's really
27:23important for the,
27:24again, nobody's
27:25going to be
27:25perfect on this
27:26stuff, but if
27:27the brand can be
27:28consistent and
27:30clear.
27:31So what I'm
27:33hearing as one
27:34of your answers to
27:34the question I
27:35ask is that
27:36instead of
27:37focusing on
27:38getting into the
27:39rat race with
27:39everyone else
27:40trying to
27:40compete for
27:41attention that
27:42isn't true to
27:43who you are and
27:44congruent with
27:44your brand
27:45identity and
27:45story, you're
27:46saying just go
27:47delight the
27:48customers you
27:48have and get
27:49them telling
27:50your story for
27:50you.
27:51Totally.
27:52It's our
27:52number one
27:53recommendation
27:53every single
27:54client engagement
27:55is, hey,
27:58stack ranked
27:58priorities for
27:59your growth
27:59strategy are
28:00delighting your
28:01current clients
28:03because they,
28:04in whatever
28:05industry it's
28:06in, they will
28:07be your best
28:07storytellers.
28:08Either way,
28:09actually, if
28:10they hate the
28:10experience or
28:11love the
28:11experience or
28:12whatever version
28:12in between,
28:13they're going to
28:14talk about it
28:15and they're going
28:16to tell their
28:16friends in the
28:17country club or
28:17at the grocery
28:18store or in the
28:19neighborhood check
28:20or picking up
28:20their kids from
28:21school, they're
28:21going to talk
28:22about this
28:22thing, this
28:23experience because
28:24we, we, we,
28:26that's what we
28:26do.
28:27We tell stories
28:27about the stuff
28:28we do and
28:29you're either
28:29going to be a
28:29holy smokes,
28:30this thing that
28:31I went to,
28:32this, you know,
28:33bootcamp,
28:34they're super
28:34connected people and
28:35the high energy
28:36is great and I
28:37feel better about
28:37my life where I
28:38showed up and I
28:39felt out of
28:40place and weird
28:40and people like
28:41me didn't go
28:42there and they
28:42took my money and
28:43I felt terrible
28:43about it.
28:44The customer is
28:45going to tell the
28:46story anyway so
28:46let's help them
28:47shape that and
28:48that concentric
28:50circle will, it
28:51always does, it
28:52ripples out one
28:52way or the
28:52other.
28:53So at the risk
28:54of using one of
28:55those overly used
28:56buzzwords lately,
28:57authenticity, what
28:59role does
28:59leadership authenticity
29:00play in whether a
29:01brand feels
29:02believable or
29:03whether it's
29:03performative?
29:04I don't know the
29:05way specifically to
29:06articulate this but
29:07you feel it.
29:09Fair enough.
29:10You just feel it.
29:11You just feel it.
29:12Like you feel the
29:13energy when you walk
29:14into a stuffy
29:15cubicle factory and
29:17you're just like,
29:17people don't like
29:18working here.
29:18You just feel it.
29:19Or if you go into
29:20a, I'm in a really
29:21cool client place
29:23right now, big
29:24business, lots of
29:25people and their
29:26energy feels different.
29:27They were warm,
29:29they were helpful,
29:30they were thoughtful,
29:30they were, they
29:31went to the client,
29:32they're asking
29:33questions, they're
29:33curious, they're
29:34caring and you
29:35just, you feel
29:36different about it
29:37when you experience
29:37a brand like that.
29:39So how do you,
29:41how do I want to
29:42phrase this question?
29:43How should leaders
29:44think about
29:44storytelling as a
29:46strategic discipline
29:47and not just a
29:48marketing function?
29:48I think if leaders
29:50don't embrace the
29:52art and the
29:53science of
29:53storytelling, the
29:54stories will get
29:55told for them.
29:56And so it is, it
29:58is a practice, it
29:59is a mindset, it
30:00is, it is
30:01discipline to get
30:03first of all
30:03clear, and
30:05then second of
30:06all, connected
30:06to the humans
30:07who work at
30:09the place and
30:09buy from the
30:10place.
30:11And it's not, of
30:11course, that
30:12simple or black
30:12and white.
30:13But that
30:14storytelling muscle
30:18is developable,
30:19if I can say it
30:20that way.
30:21And lots of
30:23our clients at
30:23least don't get
30:24into the thing
30:25they're building
30:26because they
30:26inherently wanted
30:27to tell the
30:28story about it.
30:29They had a
30:29specific thing
30:30they wanted to
30:31build, make,
30:32manufacture, etc.
30:34But now that's
30:35table stakes.
30:36To have an
30:37awesome product
30:38is now like
30:38base level, right?
30:40And so for the
30:40brands who are
30:42evangelizing those
30:43stories, those are
30:44the ones that are
30:45creating lots of
30:46good in the world
30:46and therefore lots
30:47of commercial
30:48benefit.
30:49So I'm going to
30:50throw something out
30:51for your feedback
30:51because it's an
30:52internal dilemma
30:53that I've weighed
30:54both sides of.
30:55I hear some
30:56people say
30:56prospects have
30:57the attention span
30:58of a gnat or
30:59customers have the
31:00attention span of a
31:01gnat.
31:01They're so
31:01distracted by so
31:02many things and
31:03they're overwhelmed
31:04and they are.
31:06How can you get
31:07people to listen
31:08to a whole bunch
31:09of stuff if you
31:11can't be super
31:12concise and dead
31:13on quickly?
31:15And I've asked
31:16people that question
31:17and the answer
31:18that they've given
31:19me is just don't
31:19write boring stuff.
31:21Don't create
31:21boring stories.
31:22Make sure it's
31:23worthy of their
31:24time because people
31:25will sit down and
31:25watch a two-hour
31:26movie if it's done
31:29well.
31:29Or a 16-hour
31:31Netflix series.
31:33We watch 20
31:35hours of Stranger
31:35Things in the
31:37fall with our
31:38family because we
31:39were...
31:40Yeah, it's like
31:41do better.
31:43That's my
31:43answer.
31:44Write better
31:45stories.
31:45That's kind of
31:46the conclusion I'm
31:46coming to is just
31:48don't be boring.
31:49Make it, for lack
31:51of a better word,
31:52authentic, real,
31:53interesting, and
31:54compelling.
31:55Yeah, and that's
31:56why for us it
31:57comes down to
31:57those three
31:58essentials, which
31:58is, is it
31:59clear, is it
32:00connected to the
32:01human who's
32:02receiving the
32:03story in one
32:05form or fashion,
32:06and is it
32:06creative?
32:07Is it actually,
32:08not creative in
32:09the is it cute
32:10sense, okay, a
32:10different conversation.
32:12Is it creative in
32:13an emotionally
32:14charged sense?
32:16Does it make
32:16something, does it
32:17make somebody feel
32:18a certain way?
32:19That's why brands
32:20who are building
32:21these three-minute
32:22commercials that
32:23are like an old
32:24Chevy Suburban going
32:26through some farm
32:26in Iowa, right?
32:27And it's like this
32:28big, long, it's
32:31evoking emotion in
32:32the heart.
32:33It's not, hey,
32:34we've built
32:35Suburbans for 60
32:36years, and here's
32:36all the ways that
32:37we've changed the
32:38model, and here's
32:38how the price has
32:39increased, and the
32:40cost of steel has
32:40gone up.
32:41It's not that.
32:42It's like, bring us
32:43into something that
32:44makes us feel.
32:45And the second,
32:46that's the signal.
32:47If the human feels
32:49something, they will
32:50start to care.
32:50But if they know
32:52you're performing
32:53for attention, or
32:54applause, or you're
32:55pushing some terrible
32:57sale down their
32:58throat, that's why
32:58they don't pay
32:59attention, because
32:59it's like, it
33:00doesn't connect to
33:01them.
33:02And it is hard work
33:03to connect to a
33:04human.
33:05No, it's 100%
33:06agreed.
33:08I know you've got a
33:09whole bunch of
33:10different advice you
33:10could offer, years
33:11of experience, but if
33:12you could only offer
33:13business owners one
33:14piece of advice, what's
33:16the most important
33:17piece of advice you
33:17could offer them?
33:19It's related.
33:20It's one coin, two
33:21sides.
33:21Okay, so first
33:22side of the coin
33:23would be to ask
33:24every single team
33:25member who works
33:27there, what do you
33:30love about this
33:30place?
33:31And then you
33:31could ask the
33:32follow-up of like,
33:33what don't you
33:33love?
33:34It's a brave,
33:34courageous stance,
33:35because they'll tell
33:36you the truth if they
33:37believe that you
33:38actually want to hear
33:39the truth.
33:39And then the flip
33:40of the coin, because
33:41of the heartbeat, the
33:42flip of the coin is
33:44asking your most
33:45loyal customers,
33:47clients, partners,
33:47what do you love
33:49about the experience
33:49working with us?
33:50And those are the
33:51clues to the story.
33:53Those are the
33:53semblance.
33:54Like, you can say
33:54whatever you want in
33:55a boardroom, but if
33:56you ask the real
33:57humans who make up
33:58these exchanges what
34:01the value is, they'll
34:02tell you.
34:03But lots of leaders
34:04don't want to know the
34:05truth, because they
34:06just want to like,
34:06ah, we have a
34:07strategic plan, and
34:08this is what it says
34:08we're going to do,
34:09and like, you're
34:11right.
34:11That's why it's
34:12like, well, we have
34:13an open-door policy
34:14here.
34:14Well, what's the
34:14problem?
34:15Nobody ever comes
34:15into the open door
34:16because they're
34:16terrified of you,
34:18because you actually
34:18don't want their
34:19feedback.
34:19You don't want
34:20their perspective.
34:21So I think the
34:22answers are, if I
34:24want your opinion,
34:25I'll give it to
34:25you.
34:26That's right.
34:27And that's what we
34:27tell every single
34:28client engagement.
34:30We, like, the
34:30answers are already
34:31within.
34:32They're already right
34:33there at the table.
34:34They already know.
34:35And yeah, we do the
34:36work to help them
34:37distill it and get
34:38clear and tight on it.
34:39But none of this is
34:41like made up.
34:41And that's why in the
34:42fact that it is
34:43authentic, because it's
34:44truly them, but they
34:45haven't had the
34:47framing or the
34:48expertise to help
34:49them clarify it in a
34:50way that's compelling
34:51and generative.
34:52Well, I have enjoyed
34:53every minute of our
34:54conversation.
34:55I hope people
34:56listening and watching
34:56have too.
34:57So tell those of
34:59us, people who are
35:00listening or watching
35:01that want to know
35:01more about you, the
35:02work you do, your
35:03new book, what's the
35:04best way for them to
35:05learn more about you,
35:07your company, your
35:07book, interact with
35:08you?
35:09How should they
35:09connect?
35:10Yeah, I mean, work
35:12wise, Guild
35:12Collective, you just
35:14Google that, you'll
35:15find our website.
35:16My most active
35:18place where I write
35:19things on the
35:20internet is LinkedIn.
35:20So you can just
35:21search my name on
35:22LinkedIn.
35:23I try to write four
35:24or five times a day,
35:25sometimes not a day,
35:26a week, not a day.
35:27That would be really
35:28annoying for everybody.
35:28That's a lot of
35:29story.
35:29Yeah.
35:30And then I did, I
35:31did write this 218
35:33page book called
35:35Give a Damn.
35:35Put it on the
35:36screen so everyone
35:36can see that.
35:38Yeah.
35:38The author's copy.
35:40There you go.
35:40The author's copy.
35:41So it's still, it's
35:42still getting marked up.
35:44We're at the final
35:44stages here, but it
35:46will be released on
35:48February 18th.
35:48And it is, it's a
35:49collection of stories
35:50and lived experience
35:51and it's a messy
35:52organic book that's
35:53rooted in my own
35:54journey where I
35:56believe that lead, I
35:58believe that at its
35:59core care can be a
36:00competitive advantage.
36:02And so we've used
36:03this phrase, give a
36:04damn.
36:04I've used it in my
36:05professional career and
36:06we've used it at Guild
36:06for a long time.
36:08And when pushed to
36:09give a definition to
36:10give a damn, to tell
36:11the story in a simple
36:12way, I was like, okay,
36:12ultimately it's how
36:14can a leader apply
36:15effort and attitude to
36:16two fuel sources, effort
36:17and attitude towards
36:19growing in their
36:21curiosity, clarity,
36:24compassion, and
36:25consistency.
36:25And again, is it a
36:26perfect formula?
36:27Is it like highly
36:28academic research?
36:29No, it's a real life
36:31collection of, of other
36:32builders and business
36:33owners who we've been
36:35in relationship with,
36:36who have used, because I
36:38think at its core, we
36:39each as leaders, we
36:40have like a match in
36:41our hand and there's a
36:42whole story about the
36:43match.
36:43And we have the
36:44ability to take that
36:45match and cause damage
36:47to another with that
36:49flame or do good and
36:51light someone else's
36:52match and help spread
36:53the fire and build the
36:55fire of good.
36:56And so, again, it's not
36:57always that black and
36:58white.
36:59And sometimes by the day
36:59I'm like, oh, damn, I
37:00just burned that dude
37:01with that feedback.
37:02I didn't do a great job
37:03of that.
37:03But the book is about
37:05this tribe of give-a-dammers
37:08who are out here trying
37:10to use care as a
37:11competitive advantage.
37:12Not so that it's just
37:13cute, but so that we
37:15grow healthy, strong
37:16businesses that lead to
37:17flourishing.
37:17I believe that.
37:18I believe that when
37:18business people are
37:20healthy, they have huge
37:22influence and they're
37:23able to create work,
37:25jobs, influence,
37:27connections, community
37:28that lead to people not
37:30waking up on Monday
37:31going, I hate this place.
37:33Who's your ideal audience?
37:35Who's it for?
37:36Who'd you write it for?
37:37Can I, can I, if we
37:38give me three seconds to
37:39focus on the page?
37:40Okay.
37:40I wrote it.
37:41Oh, dang it.
37:42This is a copy.
37:43This is the wrong copy.
37:44Give me, give me two
37:45seconds.
37:46The, the almost, there's
37:48a lot of what I find
37:49personally important in
37:50the book.
37:51The first is the
37:52dedication, which is to
37:53my wife because she, she
37:54is just the greatest of
37:56all time.
37:56So that's the two and
37:58you'll have to read that
37:59on your own.
37:59But the, the four, so
38:01the very first page
38:02talks about two brooks,
38:03and then the next page
38:05is four.
38:06And this is, this is the
38:06answer to your question,
38:07Mason.
38:08This is for the leaders
38:09who know that it costs
38:11zero dollars to give a
38:13damn, that it doesn't
38:14require a certain degree
38:15and it's not reserved for
38:17a certain title, office
38:19size, age, or experience.
38:21The world gets better when
38:23you give a damn.
38:24That's who it's for.
38:24It's for the leaders who,
38:25I believe leadership's not
38:27a title.
38:28It's a way, it's an
38:29invitation, it's a
38:30practice.
38:30And so I think, I think
38:32an 18 year old intern can
38:33be a leader.
38:34I think a 60 year old CEO
38:35can not be a leader.
38:36I think there's a lot of
38:38space for leadership and
38:40its definition to be, to
38:42be evolved into this.
38:44It's a, it's a practice.
38:45It's a mindset.
38:46It's a, it's not a
38:47position.
38:48I love it.
38:49And I, those are my
38:50favorite types of books
38:51anyway, because when
38:52people try to copy
38:52tactics, like, well, the
38:54author said this, so I'm
38:55going to do that exactly.
38:56I don't get that as much
38:57from it.
38:57I reflect one of my
39:00favorite books of all, I
39:00years ago, 2003, I did my
39:04first Ironman triathlon and
39:05I read a book that was
39:06referred, uh, referred to
39:08me called becoming an
39:09Ironman.
39:10And all it was, it was a
39:11collection of short
39:12stories from people who
39:15did their first Ironman.
39:17Some of them were
39:18professional triathletes.
39:19Some of them were
39:21overweight frat boys
39:22that were 50 pounds
39:26decided they wanted to
39:27change their life.
39:28And what was their race
39:29like?
39:30Some of them, people
39:31blew through it and had
39:32an amazing day and set
39:34PR.
39:34Some of them suffered and
39:36were miserable and gutted
39:38it out somehow.
39:41And when I, when I read
39:43that whole book, my
39:44takeaways weren't, Oh,
39:45here's how I need to do
39:46my nutrition or here's how
39:47I need to do pacing or
39:48here's the, it wasn't
39:50like that.
39:50I left with a sense of
39:52confidence that no matter
39:53what happens that as
39:56long as I can be, make
39:57relentless forward
39:58progress, I can finish.
40:00If I can, if I can walk,
40:01I can finish.
40:02And when I learned
40:03vicariously through all
40:04those other people's
40:05experience, then it gave
40:07me a sense of certainty
40:08that there's almost
40:09nothing that can happen
40:10that I can't get
40:12through.
40:13And I have some ideas
40:14on how to handle that,
40:15even though I wasn't
40:16that experienced that
40:17that book served
40:20safety years of hard
40:21work and perhaps
40:23even do not finish
40:25at some point in time
40:26because one of, one of
40:27my dad, I really did
40:28struggle.
40:28It was super hot and
40:30I had a rough, rough
40:31day, but I could
40:33reflect on the lessons
40:34I learned in that
40:35book where someone
40:36shared lived experience
40:37and that's what it
40:39took to get me
40:40through.
40:40So I'm certain that
40:41the book that you've
40:42written and the way
40:43you've written it is
40:44going to help some
40:46business owner somewhere
40:48that is doing
40:49everything they can
40:50and it's not enough.
40:51And I'm hoping that
40:52they can learn
40:53vicariously through
40:54the experiences that
40:55you were gutsy enough
40:57to share because I'm
40:58sure it's not all
40:59road sunshine.
41:00I'm sure there's some
41:01tough gut checking.
41:02I mean, there's a
41:03bunch of stories about
41:04me blowing it,
41:06including like early
41:07days, knowing I needed
41:09to fire a guy,
41:10tried to fire him on
41:11Friday.
41:11He essentially talked
41:12me into let him stay
41:13till Monday.
41:14And I was like, oh,
41:15yeah, okay.
41:16Like, I'm so sorry.
41:17Like I, oh, shoot.
41:18And then Monday come,
41:19it's terrible, horrible
41:20experience, horrible
41:21leadership.
41:22And yeah, the book
41:23is, it's not like a,
41:24you know, it's not a
41:25bash me book by any
41:27means, but it is a,
41:28it is a vulnerable
41:29view of like, this is
41:30what, this isn't some
41:31squeaky clean frame
41:32framework.
41:33This is a way that,
41:34that leaders are out
41:35there doing their
41:36damnedest.
41:37That's what I'm just
41:38so encouraged when we
41:39meet new clients,
41:41prospects, people in
41:42the community building
41:43stuff.
41:43Like it's, it's
41:45courageous, brave,
41:46crazy work to lead
41:47and build a thing.
41:48And they are there to
41:50be commended and
41:51celebrated.
41:52And what's true is
41:53they need help
41:54understanding the
41:55impact they have on
41:55others.
41:56Me included.
41:56I wrote this book
41:57every bit, every bit
41:58as much for me as
41:58anybody else.
41:59It's first of all,
42:00thank you for doing
42:00that.
42:01Second of all, I've
42:02become an Alex
42:03Hermosi fan.
42:04I know he, some
42:05people love him, some
42:05don't.
42:06I happen to think
42:07he's full of wisdom
42:07and I appreciate him
42:08sharing it.
42:09But when I've read
42:09his books, he always
42:10talks about get the
42:11lessons, not the
42:12scars.
42:14And that's one of
42:15the reasons I'm
42:15drawn to books like
42:16what you're describing
42:17is because when, when
42:18you can share the
42:19lessons so that those
42:20of us really don't
42:21have to get the
42:21scars to still get
42:22the wisdom, that's a
42:23fair deal.
42:24Yeah.
42:25Hour or two of my
42:26time versus what
42:27thousands of dollars
42:28of trial and error
42:29and years of hard
42:30work to figure out
42:31stuff that you've
42:32already learned that
42:33I could have learned
42:34if I would have
42:34just paid attention.
42:35Yeah.
42:36And what, what I,
42:36what, where I'd
42:37extend his thinking
42:38is because it's
42:39yes and for sure.
42:41It's, I
42:41actually think the
42:42scars tell the
42:43stories and, and
42:44when it's, it's a
42:45ridiculous thing that
42:46for 13 bucks or 15
42:48bucks or 12 bucks
42:49or whatever the
42:49amount of money is
42:50that you buy a
42:50book, you get to
42:52read somebody's
42:53scars because you're
42:54right.
42:54Those lessons that
42:55they endured are the
42:57teachers and books
42:58are just like, I
42:59hope books have this
43:00massive comeback
43:01because it's like,
43:02it's a damn shame
43:03that people don't
43:04read more books and
43:05you've written so
43:05many of them, which
43:06is amazing.
43:06I want to follow
43:07your footsteps, but
43:08it's, yes, kind of
43:09this articulated,
43:10crystallized thinking
43:11of, it's just one
43:12big scar that, that
43:13gets to tell a story
43:14so that someone else
43:15may prevent, may
43:16prevent some of
43:16those scars.
43:17I love how you
43:17frame that up.
43:18So, hey, thank you
43:20so much.
43:20I've enjoyed every
43:21minute and let's do
43:22this again sometime
43:22soon.
43:23I would love it,
43:24Mason.
43:25Thanks.
43:27Thanks.
43:27Have a great day.
43:31You
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