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00:00I am totally fine if I just end up being the, like, you're going to look at me at some
00:06point
00:06over the next couple months and say, I told you so. I was a little, not taken aback, but Ramona
00:12Shelburne joined us earlier and we asked her to sort of blend and compare and contrast the idea
00:19of the Warriors being in the lottery or being in the playoffs. And she didn't even hesitate.
00:24She's like, I would tank. Now, tanking is not available to the Warriors in any sort of a
00:30significant way. Like they're, they're, they're not going to be able to get out of the play in
00:38tournament. And so therefore, in order to get into the lottery, they need to be in that 10 spot and
00:44lose. And then, okay. And by the way, this may happen anyway. It may happen organically, but I
00:52just think that what we're actually talking about here is we're talking about an idea that is
00:59completely foreign to the entity about which we're talking. The Golden State Warriors come hell or high
01:07water, no matter smart, dumb, or anywhere in between. I just don't, I don't think they've got
01:13the stomach for that. Here's Ramona when we asked her about the idea of a playoff series versus the
01:20lottery.
01:21Man, I would tank. This draft is so good, man. I just think like the way to get better in
01:28this
01:28league is to get a player in a really high caliber draft class. Like you've seen this,
01:33to me, the Warriors and the Heat are in very similar categories. Like they don't,
01:37they never go play for the draft pick. They never give up because they always think they can pull
01:40something out. You know, if you want to get a really impact player and another, another guy who
01:45could be in that role that we thought Jonathan Kaminga was going to be in, you'd probably need
01:50a lottery pick. The way they're playing it, it reads to me like they're just trying to stay in it.
01:55They're going to be in the play-in obviously and hope Steph comes back and can create something.
02:00But what does that get you? First round with Oklahoma? First round with the Spurs? Is that really worth it?
02:05Um, yeah, absolutely. Well, and also if you think about what she said about it's a really deep
02:12draft, that to me makes it so you're less incentivized to actually tank because if it's
02:17a deep draft, then if you're not going to win the lottery and go up in the top four, if
02:22you're going
02:22to be 10, 11, 12, wherever you land, 15, 16, maybe 18 at the absolute worst, well, that's all
02:29relatively the same. If it's a deep draft and I believe that it is and we can go through some
02:35of
02:35the names as we get closer to Thursday in the sweet 16, because a lot of the guys who
02:39are going to be in that top half of the draft, you're going to get a chance to see them
02:43one
02:44more time, at least in the, uh, in the tournament. So if the draft is deep for me, you're less
02:50incentivized to try to get up and tank. They still get a good player where the Warriors are
02:53going to be. Here's the other thing. And we haven't talked about this yet. And I'm partially
02:58kidding, but y'all know exactly if this dream scenario were to play, Warriors end up in the
03:06lottery and then, uh, Grandy goes to tankathon.joy or wherever the hell he spent the afternoon
03:13and the Warriors get bumped up and they end up in the top four. You tell me what's the
03:20next thing that happens. What happens? Warriors have been awarded the third pick in the upcoming
03:27NBA draft. What discussion do you think starts, uh, about 10 minutes later? Exactly right.
03:34I was going to do my Willard impersonation, but trade it. Yep. Cause you want to trade the
03:39pick or, or you draft a guy and Steve Kerr, not going to play him. There you go. So you
03:45go ahead and draft to Bansa and what? This is not for me. Right. And I mean, would you play
03:52him, Steve? I highly doubt it. You're going to draft that pup and then somehow
03:56have that person aid Steph Curry and his final contractual year as he tries to go for a championship
04:04approaching age 39. And how will this fan base handle that? If the new kid doesn't get as many
04:13meaningful minutes as everybody believes, like do understand your dream scenario is also going to
04:22cause internal consternation. There's no question about it because immediately the organization would
04:30be thrust into trying to figure out what is its identity. If you were to get a top three pick
04:37the following season that starts this October, what's the goal? Is the goal still everything for Steph
04:44or are we developing AJ? And, and, and again, you could say, look, there's room for both of those
04:54things. And to a degree there might be, but I do think it's funny after what we've just experienced
05:01that people don't really think that that would be a problem this time. I mean, in a way it would
05:08almost be an even bigger problem. You'd have a coach who I think is probably going to come back
05:13on one year. You've got Steph and Draymond and Jimmy, and maybe even Chris stops all on one year.
05:20And then you're going to inject young fella. And it actually doesn't even matter if it's the third
05:25pick or the 15th pick, right? You're going to inject young fella into this and young fella is going to
05:30have some moments where he looks hot because by the way, he's a good prospect. Okay. And now what do
05:37you do
05:37with that? What do you do with that? Are we stunting growth and trying to win or are we pushing
05:45chips
05:45into the middle of the table for development while Steph Curry sits over there and stews?
05:51Well, you know, the answer. And the answer is you're going to try to go out there and win
05:55and find players to play around Steph. And that's where I think about all these guys. And you can look
06:01at Kingston, Flemings for Houston and Keaton Wagler for Illinois and all these other top,
06:07five top 10 prospects who are going to come into the association. You're going to ask them to come
06:12in and be a part of a team with a bunch of guys, 35 and over playing in a system
06:17that you didn't play
06:19in college. And if you're AJ DeBunsa at BYU, you were the system and he was really good at being
06:26the
06:26system. So if the Warriors get the number one pick and they choose to go in that direction,
06:30well now AJ, we're going to need you to play like pass and move and run around and spot up
06:36and do all
06:36these things that you've never really done in your career, which is one year because you were the system
06:42and the system was you go cook. So no matter what you do for the Warriors, there aren't that many
06:48guys
06:48who you could draft and say, yeah, I think that you could come in right away and not be a
06:53starter,
06:54not be a 30 minute guy, but you could come in and actually work and fit.
06:57So Ramona Shelburne wrote an article over the weekend that said the Warriors offer to the
07:02Milwaukee Bucks for Giannis did include four unprotected first round draft picks. And yes,
07:08obviously players were thrown in there too. By the way, she mentioned Draymond, not Jimmy Butler.
07:13Don't tell Mike Dunleavy that because he'll get furious with you.
07:16That's why I asked just to see if she would, you know, throw that in there as a, as a
07:20name.
07:20And she did. Yeah. Okay. So now, now that first round unpredicted draft pick in 2026. Now it has a,
07:30now it has a label. It's the number three overall pick. Now Milwaukee calls back.
07:39Uh, so about that offer. Yeah. I think we'd like to revisit that. Okay. Warriors. What do you say?
07:50What do you say? Depends on, uh, unprotected first round draft picks. The first one happens to be the
07:56number three overall pick in a loaded draft. Well, we're not giving you four unprotected. Now,
08:01if, if you're getting the number three pick in a loaded draft, well, now it's going to be down to
08:06three unprotected, uh, draft picks. No, we want four. Well then it's a no deal. Okay. That to me
08:12becomes a no, because if you do land at number three and you get a spot where it's a deep
08:17draft and
08:18all the rest of it, then that pick right there, it's one thing to give up future first. And you
08:24don't know what they're going to be right in the warriors. Eventually you're not going to be good.
08:28And if you're Milwaukee, you're kind of banking on some of those being lottery picks, but this first
08:34one being the number three overall, that changes the calculus on what I would give up if I'm the
08:39warriors for Giannis. So then Ramona writes another article the very next day. Warriors pass on
08:45Giannis as Steph Curry's clock ticks, right? How's that go over with everybody? Depends on who you
08:53get with the number three pick or if you pivot to somebody else. Yeah. But no matter who you get,
08:58he not going to, you know what I mean? It's not turnkey. You're not, you're not going to be able
09:03to get Giannis anyway, unless you trade Jimmy Butler or Draymond or like Chris Stapps, Chris
09:09Stapps and Draymond in a sign and trade sort of a situation to get the money. If all Milwaukee is
09:15really after is the pick, then there's ways to get to the money. There is. Yeah, I get that. But
09:20you know, then you're starting to really look at what are we doing? Like Steph's 38 and he's got
09:26runner's knee and you're going to bring in Giannis for one last hurrah. And you're going to ship out
09:31Draymond, which you said you never do and four unprotected picks. It seems to me like the time
09:37to do that, the moment to do that has passed. That's my opinion. Right. But Ramona also said
09:43to us, everybody who was interested in Giannis at the deadline will be right back on the phone this
09:48summer. I listen, I'm throwing this out there so that we can actually run the permutations of the
09:57things that we say, run them through their completion. It's so easy to be like, I want
10:03the pick. Do you? Do you? Because oh, by the way, what are you doing with that pick? Whether
10:11that pick becomes a person or just an asset or whatever, the Warriors philosophy at a certain
10:18point is going to get challenged. If they stick to their guns, then in many ways, they don't even
10:27want this pick. That's not what they want this summer. Depends on whom they use it. They want to
10:33win. They want everything for Steph. They want Giannis at Antetokounmpo. That's what they want.
10:39They're like, that's already been totally established. And unless you end up with number one overall,
10:45you don't even really know who you're going to get. And whoever you're going to get is not going
10:49to be Steph's wingman on a playoff run in his rookie year. That seems a bit wild. Wait, Willard,
10:57can I simplify this? So you would rather, let me, let me get this straight. I'm just asking questions
11:01now. Okay. Well, I want you to answer this question. You have two, you have two options.
11:07The Warriors make the first round of the playoffs and they come out of the plan and they take on
11:13likely
11:13OKC, but maybe San Antonio and that series plays out however it plays out and all likelihood
11:18they lose that series or they miss the playoffs. They move up to the top four in the lottery.
11:26What would you prefer? You rather like pick 15th, 16th, 17th, 18th, whatever it is, as you
11:32make the playoffs or have a top four pick.
11:37Um, I think I'd rather go to the playoffs, but the problem is, is like you're, you're asking
11:44that question and that like, now we're on the other side of the actual experience and
11:51I didn't get to experience the experience. Yeah. I want, I want to watch. You seem to be
11:56bringing up a lot of problems with, or questions that they have to answer themselves about being
12:00in the top four. And for me, it's just, I want whatever makes that asset as valuable
12:04as possible. And I'll cross that bridge when I get there.
12:06And that's totally fair. And that's the way I look at the playoffs. I want to get in the
12:10playoffs and I'll cross the bridge when we get there with regard to like, if they just
12:14get absolutely boat raced four times in a row or whatever, but I, I want that experience.
12:20And I don't think that having a top three or four pick, it doesn't really cement anything
12:27with regard to what that means going forward. No matter how you slice it, the Warriors remain
12:33in a very difficult spot in terms of both public relations and functionality. Like whatever this
12:41draft is, what does that really do for their stated goal? The stated goal, everything for Steph,
12:49everything is all about next year. This is what we've been told publicly, everything. Anthony
12:55Slater, two weeks ago, everything is, remember we're out of squash. Everything is about next
13:01year and Steph Curry. Okay. Well then would, who cares? Mr. Number four, overall pick. Why
13:07don't you actually take a gap year? Gap year. We'll pick you. We don't need you.
13:12But if you land at number four in the lottery, then that asset becomes more significant than
13:17if you're picking number 18. So if you want to get in the summer and really do something
13:23to help Steph, that asset becomes a more valuable asset by being in the lottery, getting lucky in
13:29the lottery and jumping up to number four. And so now if you want to talk about trading for Giannis
13:33or whomever, that asset now going into the draft becomes a real thing. No doubt. But in an odd way,
13:40the higher the draft pick is, the harder it's going to be to get rid of it because people will
13:45be
13:45emotionally attached to it and the idea and the, and the ha ha because whoever comes to number four
13:51is going to have some ha ha. And, and, and, and then we're going to do that whole rigmarole where
13:56we fall in love with someone when we don't even know if they're any good. And, and that is going
14:01to
14:01be banging its head up against whatever Steph's got going in his final year. Again, I'm not arguing
14:08against it right now. I'm simply pointing out that this is going to be a debate.
14:16Well, no matter what, it's going to be a debate and it's going to be difficult, difficult for the
14:20Warriors to navigate. It just depends on whether or not you have faith in Mike Dunleavy in the front
14:25office to get it right. If you wind up in the lottery, Mike Dunleavy's never had a chance to pick
14:30in the lottery and you can all look at pods at 19 and say they blew it. You and I've
14:35been through it.
14:36He probably goes in the bottom of the top 10 or maybe 11, whatever you want to do. If you
14:41want
14:41to redraft the pods draft, Mike Dunleavy's may have a chance to pick in the lottery. And if I'm him
14:47and you wind up at number four, I'm looking to trade the pick and move back in the first round.
14:53Because if you are a team that is really looking to rebuild, you would love to get one of these
14:5919
14:59year olds with the ha ha. And the Warriors don't want somebody who's 19 with the ha ha. They want
15:05somebody like, and I'm just looking at some of the names of Florida has a guy named Thomas Hawk,
15:10who's their big guy, six, nine. He's 22 years old. That to me is much more of the type of
15:16guy
15:16the Warriors, I think would look for it. You know, he's slated to go like 12 or 13 and,
15:22but he's at least an older player. Somebody who, if you are going to draft, you would much rather draft,
15:28I think a guy who is, is this type of player.
15:31But that's like, what if you're, your evaluation process says that whoever's available at three
15:35or four, that's the generational talent. Not really. Well, not generational.
15:39Maybe it is. Maybe that's your evaluation. It could be. But I think that if you're looking at these
15:43generational talents, like DeBonce is a good example. He's not going to be plug and play ready
15:49to go. I don't think, especially in this warrior offense.
15:52Yeah. Maybe, maybe not. I don't know. But like, what, what, what if I threw that at you?
15:58What if you got the number one pick? You got that pick and you're like, okay. And we start
16:06evaluating all these guys and Steph knocks on the door and goes, yeah, I'd like you to trade it
16:13for somebody who can help me now. Right. Well, what do you say? What do you do? You say,
16:18all right, Steph, let me, let me go to my Rolodex and let's go to the phones.
16:23Do you? Absolutely. You shop that thing. But, but you, again, you've got your own brain too.
16:29You've got your own evaluation. You may think that someone is the next damn big thing could
16:35carry the next 15 years of warrior basketball sitting there. All you got to do is send the
16:40paper into Adam Silver. That's it. But Steph's like, well, how's that help me next year?
16:46Well, it depends on how you feel about the number one overall in this draft. And, you know,
16:52you look backwards last year, Cooper flag was the absolute consensus. Number one, overall,
16:58is he a generational talent? He might be. He's a really good player. The year before it was
17:03Zachary Rishashay and he's a good player, but he's not Victor Wembanyama who was 2023. So if you're
17:11sitting in a draft like that and Wemby is going to be there, a seven foot three unicorn or seven
17:16five or whatever he is, yeah, it's a different story. This year, I do think that there's no
17:21consensus number one overall. And if you go from one to five, six to 12, 13 to 19, you might
17:28like a
17:29guy more than another team. And so for me, there is value in if you get a high pick draft
17:34or moving
17:34back and getting additional players or draft capital. I like, I'd be open to whatever.
17:40But this is why, like, there's so many ifs, ands, buts, candies, nuts, all of those things.
17:46And, and, and you're never, you're not going to know anytime soon if the person you picked
17:51is actually all that helpful, or if that's a generational talent, you're not going to know
17:57any of this stuff. Like, Randy, when you, when, when you guys ask, um, you know, the scenarios
18:03being the Warriors either move up and get a really good pick, or you could have the playoff
18:10series. It, that's sort of, and you lose, and you lose the playoff series in four or five
18:15games. Yeah, but I didn't get to see it. That's sort of like asking me, um, if right now, um,
18:23you've got a vacation plan for the summer, would you rather have the vacation or would
18:28you rather have the money that you're going to spend on the vacation? Well, how much fun
18:32am I going to have? Well, that's what I'm saying. I haven't had the experience yet and
18:37experiences cost. I, so that's my answer in this moment. I think I want to go have the
18:43experience because Steph Curry has a very, very large ticking clock right now on his entire
18:52career. And so to just roundly dismiss a playoff series, like that's not a thing. It might
18:59be the last one. It might. And the assumption is that they lose in four or five. And so,
19:04which, you know, for sake of this hypothetical. Yeah. And it's at the same time, if you do move
19:10up into the top four, you might take a player and think, you know what? We think this guy
19:15is going to be the sauce and he's going to be amazing. And he may not be that guy. And
19:20I'm just looking at all the number ones going backward. And there's a lot of guys who are
19:24absolute smash hits. Paolo Banqueiro, Cade Cunningham, Anthony Edwards. Then you get back
19:29to 2019. Without a doubt, every human being who follows basketball knew the number one
19:35pick would be Zion Williamson. And he was, he was phenomenal at Duke. He was a unique player
19:40at 6'10", 260, but moved like a guard. And his career has been, you know, kind of fits and
19:46starts with injury. And New Orleans has never been able to get the most out of him. And
19:50before that, it was DeAndre Ayton and Markel Fultz. Yep. So you can get the number one pick
19:55and you could be in a spot where. Thank you. 2016, Ben Simmons. Say it again. 2016, Ben
20:01Simmons. I mean, you could say it again, but you don't have to. 2016. You know who number
20:06one in 2014 was? Was that? Hi, this is Andrew Wiggins. Andrew Wiggins. And you know, Carl Anthony
20:12Towns in 15, Anthony Bennett in 2013. So it's not as easy as, yay, we win the lottery. We
20:18automatically get a life-changing player. Well, how many of them have led their team to a title?
20:22Of these guys? Even the good ones. Uh, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. They're the one seed,
20:29Cade Cunningham, this year. But that's still a no. And then going backward, I mean, you probably have to
20:35get to LeBron. Well, I got to Kyrie and he was kind of the Robin to LeBron's Batman. Yeah,
20:41but, but I mean, I'll count that. He was a very good player on a championship team. Anthony Davis
20:46was the same. Sure. Very good player on a championship team. Ish. Yeah. Uh, Greg Oden.
20:52I mean, Andrew Wiggins. Yeah. I mean, he wasn't, he wasn't a one or a two. Right. I guess he
20:58was
20:58two-ish that year, but he wasn't really the two. But anyway, go ahead. I went back to, uh, you
21:02got Bogut
21:03and then Howard and then oh three, LeBron James. Yeah. He would be the guy. Number one
21:08overall. You're the alpha. You led your team to a title a couple of different times. Yep.
21:13Yep. Andrea Bargnani. Bargnani. In oh six. Yeah. I, I mean. Recently, Anthony Edwards, consecutive
21:21Western conference finals appearances. Right. Yeah. And Cade Cunningham is, you know, maybe
21:25on the precipice, but has not won a title and does not want to be the face of the league.
21:32Well, well, these ones are so young. It's unfair to say they haven't won a title. Of
21:35course it's unfair. I'm not saying I don't want them on my team. And, and, and I'll be
21:39the first to say that not everything is all about a title. Like it's, it, if you have an
21:44identity and you have a great player around whom you can build that, of course that matters.
21:49Of course that matters.
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