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00:00All right that's going to do it for me for now but now it's time for the last word with
00:03the great Lawrence O'Donnell. Good evening Lawrence. Good evening Rachel. This is one of those nights where some very hard
00:10decisions have to be made of what can actually be fit into this hour of television and this is what
00:17I'm so grateful that you're on for an hour before I am because I'm going to be able to cover
00:22some ground that wasn't in your hour as we try to sort out this avalanche of news coming out.
00:30us over the weekend. Yeah I have left at least one guest sitting in a lit well lit room wearing
00:37makeup and not getting on television in the past hour as we have been covering breaking news over the course
00:42of this hour. Yeah it's it's. Which I'm very sorry. Well but it's it's one of the things that that
00:48everyone knows we have to deal with on especially during war coverage as we're in now. Yeah. Yeah. Thanks Lawrence.
00:55Appreciate it. Thanks Richard. Thank you.
00:58Well Donald Trump is demanding something he has never seen. Donald Trump is demanding something no president in his lifetime
01:05has ever achieved. Unconditional surrender. On Friday morning at 8 50 a.m. Donald Trump demanded Iran's unconditional surrender in
01:16a social media post.
01:18The last time the United States of America accepted an unconditional surrender. It took an atomic bomb to get it.
01:28In fact two of them. After President Harry Truman became the first and only person in world history to use
01:35nuclear weapons against Japan first in Hiroshima and three days later in Nagasaki Emperor Hirohito announced Japan's unconditional surrender.
01:44Harry Truman had already accepted Germany's unconditional surrender in World War II three months earlier. No American president has demanded
01:54or accepted an unconditional surrender at the end of an American war since the year before Donald Trump was born.
02:03Eighty one years ago.
02:05Eighty one years ago at the end of World War II.
02:08Anyone who has witnessed a war during Donald Trump's lifetime knows that the unconditional surrender of Iran is impossible.
02:17Everyone on Wall Street knew that over the weekend when markets began to adjust negatively to a an anticipated long
02:25-term Trump war in pursuit of the impossible.
02:31Unconditional surrender.
02:33And so, of course, oil prices skyrocketed, the stock market crashed, and Donald Trump
02:38today offered his unconditional surrender.
02:43Donald Trump is the first American wartime president ruled by the stock market and the
02:49oil market.
02:50In a phone call with a CBS News reporter today, Donald Trump said, I think the war is very
02:56complete.
02:58He said that during stock market trading in the hope of preventing a collapse, Donald
03:05Trump didn't mention unconditional surrender again today.
03:10And because it was Donald Trump who said unconditional surrender on Friday morning, we knew there
03:16was no chance of even Donald Trump holding on to the nonsensical demand of unconditional
03:23surrender.
03:25When President Franklin Delano Roosevelt announced publicly during World War II that the only
03:31peace terms that the United States of America would accept from Germany and Japan was unconditional
03:38surrender, the world knew that Franklin Roosevelt meant those two words.
03:45And everyone in the world, other than the German and Japanese regimes, knew that they could
03:52trust those presidential words as fact, as a prediction of what exactly was going to happen.
04:01The world knew from that moment on how World War II was going to end.
04:07They didn't know how long it was going to last, but they knew World War II was going to end
04:14in
04:14an unconditional surrender because the president of the United States said so.
04:20And now the world knows the words of the current president of the United States have no meaning
04:25at all.
04:2631 hours after Donald Trump demanded unconditional surrender, in another social media post, Donald
04:34the United States have already won, exclamation point, Donald Trump doesn't even pay attention
04:40to the words of Donald Trump.
04:42Unconditional surrender Friday morning.
04:44We've already won Saturday afternoon.
04:47No unconditional surrender.
04:50As oil prices were skyrocketing over the weekend, Donald Trump said that higher oil prices were, quote, a very small
04:58price to pay for USA.
05:00Well, it is certainly a smaller price to pay than the lives of the members of the American military that
05:08have been lost in Donald Trump's first days of Donald Trump's war.
05:14Donald Trump made no attempt to look presidential since he doesn't actually know what that looks like when he attended
05:21the
05:21dignified transfer of the bodies of the first six soldiers killed in his war.
05:28And he didn't remember those soldiers the next day when he wrote about what he called, quote, a very small
05:35price to pay
05:36for USA, Donald Trump ended his public day today by stepping up to a microphone at one of his golf
05:45resorts in
05:46Florida, the kind of place where no other president has ever set foot on the 10th day of a war.
05:54From the start, Donald Trump has refused to say how long his war would last.
05:59Donald Trump had to do that because he knew he might have to surrender at any time.
06:05And now that his surrender has come, he can claim that it's because his war is going so well that
06:12he can just end it. And that is, of course, exactly what he did today.
06:20We're ahead of our initial timeline by a lot. It's going to be ended soon.
06:24Are you thinking this week it will be over? Are you talking about days?
06:27No, but soon. I think so.
06:28OK, and with respect to...
06:29Very soon.
06:31Donald Trump's day began today with the news that Iran has a new supreme leader who was the
06:37son of the supreme leader who was killed on the first day of Donald Trump's war. So Donald Trump
06:41has traded an 86-year-old Ayatollah Khomeini for a 56-year-old Ayatollah Khomeini who is reported
06:50to be even more hardline than his father, which makes Donald Trump's Friday morning idea of unconditional
06:56surrender even more impossible. And when Donald Trump demanded unconditional surrender with an
07:02exclamation point on Friday morning, he also, in the same social media post, demanded the selection
07:08of a great and acceptable leader in Iran. Today, Donald Trump said he was disappointed
07:16in the choice of Iran's new supreme leader. That was his word. Disappointed. But Donald Trump did not
07:24dare to repeat his demand for unconditional surrender of that new supreme leader. Before stepping up to
07:31the microphone at his golf resort today, Donald Trump made phone calls to individual members of the media
07:36in a desperate attempt to communicate something positive to the stock market, the real bosses of
07:42Donald Trump's war. One of those calls was to Fox's Brian Kilmeade, who quoted Donald Trump on Fox and Friends
07:50this morning, telling him, quote, these ships should go through the Strait of Hormuz and show some guts. There's nothing
07:58to be afraid of. Show some guts. 20% of the world's oil shipments passed through the Strait of Hormuz,
08:06which has now
08:07become far too dangerous for safe passage. Shipping traffic has dropped by at least 90% in the Strait
08:15or more. And Donald Trump's solution to that is for everyone on those oil tankers to just be brave. You
08:23know,
08:24like him. Donald Trump wants the captains and crews of those ships to be brave and put themselves in the
08:31line
08:32of fire. Put themselves in harm's way. Just call their families at home around the world and tell them,
08:38wish me luck. We are bravely going through the Strait today because Donald Trump told us to show some guts.
08:45Donald Trump wants the noncombatants on commercial vessels to do something that no one in the Trump clan
08:53has ever done. Enter a war zone. Show some guts. How about 19-year-old Barron Trump, who is turning
09:0320
09:04in 11 days? As I reported on this program last week, all four of President Franklin Dillon Roosevelt's
09:11sons served in the military in World War II while their father served as commander-in-chief until his
09:16death in office weeks before Germany's unconditional surrender. It was unthinkable then for a president's
09:24son not to serve in that president's war. And World War II was not a war of Franklin Roosevelt's
09:31choosing. We entered World War II only after Japan declared war on the United States and then Germany
09:36declared war in the United States. But because World War II was already underway in Europe in 1939,
09:42John Kennedy decided not to go to Yale Law School after his Harvard graduation and instead joined the
09:52Navy months before the United States entered World War II. Jack Kennedy, the future brother,
10:00the future president's older brother, Joe Kennedy, dropped out of Harvard Law School to become a pilot
10:07in World War II. But in World War II, Joe Kennedy's plane went down and he was killed in action
10:13in Europe.
10:14Such was the call of duty in those days that the sons of presidents, the sons of cabinet members,
10:21the sons of ambassadors, the sons of generals, along with the sons of laborers and factory workers all
10:27showed some guts, as Donald Trump would put it, and rushed toward the sound of the guns. In fact,
10:32almost all Harvard students dropped out during World War II to serve in the military. So what about
10:39Barron Trump? Why hasn't he left college, like almost every Harvard student did during World War II,
10:46to fight in his father Donald Trump's war? And I mention Harvard specifically because that is the
10:52institution of higher learning in America that Donald Trump seems to hate the most. It is the institution
10:57that seems to fill him with a raging jealousy for reasons known only to his pathologically insecure
11:03psyche. Of the 1,000 students admitted to the Harvard class of 1944 before World War II started, only 19
11:16graduated in 1944. That's how much America's universities emptied out as students followed what
11:25they felt was their call of duty into war. No one, Donald Trump, no one in the Trump family has
11:35ever done
11:35anything like that in the entire history of the Klan. Not one Trump. Not one. No Trump has ever attended
11:44a military funeral of a family member. And now it's Barron Trump's turn to refuse to go to war while
11:51his
11:52father sends young men and women his age into that war. Why doesn't Barron Trump do what all those
12:01Harvard students did during World War II? Why doesn't he leave college now and go join his father's war?
12:09Why doesn't Barron Trump donate his services as a crew member on an oil tanker in the Strait of Hormuz?
12:16He doesn't even have to join the military for that. His father said there's nothing to be afraid of.
12:20Does his mother agree with that? Does she think there's nothing to be afraid of
12:24for her son on one of those oil tankers? Donald Trump said these ships should go through the
12:30Strait of Hormuz and show some guts there's nothing to be afraid of. Well, let's prove there's nothing
12:36to be afraid of by putting Barron on the deck of one of those ships, because we know the only
12:43place
12:43Donald Trump would allow Barron to go, the only place where Barron Trump's mother would ever allow
12:48him to go is a place where there's nothing to be afraid of.
12:52Donald Trump's other sons appear to be playing their part in their father's war by trying to become
12:59war profiteers. There was nothing more loathsome in the United States during World War II than war
13:06profiteering. Harry Truman became president of the United States because of his crusade against war
13:14profiteering. Senator Harry Truman studied war contracts more than any other senator searching
13:20for illegitimate profiteering. He eventually became the chairman of a special Senate committee
13:25to investigate war profiteering. Senator Truman's investigations were at first a minor irritant to
13:32President Franklin Roosevelt, who was worried about anything that might inhibit America's industrial
13:37giants like the auto industry, which was then converting their factories for the manufacture of aircraft
13:43and tanks. But soon, President Roosevelt came to appreciate Senator Truman's policing of the war contracts
13:51and Senator Truman's condemnations of any war profiteers that his investigations exposed. Imagine
13:58Donald Trump appreciating congressional investigations of potential corruption in the war contracts that he
14:07awards, he personally awards, he personally interferes with and delivers to the companies he wants to deliver
14:15those awards to. Franklin Roosevelt actually appreciated Harry Truman's investigations and condemnations of war
14:24profiteering for profiteering so much that President Roosevelt chose Harry Truman to run with him as his vice
14:32presidential nominee as President Roosevelt ran for his final re-election campaign during World War II. Harry Truman
14:41then became president after President Roosevelt died in office. Harry Truman would hate what the Wall Street
14:51Journal is now reporting about Donald Trump and his sons. The Wall Street Journal reports Eric Trump and Donald Trump
14:58Jr.,
14:58the president's sons, are backing a new drone company that is vying to meet fresh demand from the Pentagon and
15:04fill a hole left by the
15:06administration's ban on new Chinese drones in the U.S. Power Us, a drone roll-up company based in West
15:12Palm Beach,
15:13Florida, is merging with a publicly traded golf course holding company backed by the Trumps.
15:19Power Us executives said investors in the deal include one of the Trump's investment vehicles, American
15:26Ventures and Unusual Machines, a drone components company where Donald Trump Jr. is a shareholder and
15:33advisory board member. The deal brings deeper involvement by the Trump family into a multi-billion dollar sector that has
15:39new
15:40opportunities for growth following changes imposed by the Trump administration. Those include the
15:46Pentagon's emphasis on large-scale rapid adoption of small drones. When Donald Trump started his war,
15:54he called it a war. He called it a war multiple times and that is what it is. Donald Trump's
15:59secretary of
16:00defense also called it a war when the war began, which he especially loved doing since he falsely calls
16:08himself the secretary of war. But now that Donald Trump realizes that Americans don't like war and maybe
16:14being reminded that he campaigned against war when he was running for president, Donald Trump
16:19is twisting the language to avoid the word war. I mean, this was an excursion that a lot of people
16:29wouldn't have done. An excursion. That's his latest description of his war today. An excursion.
16:40Donald Trump finds new ways to dishonor the war dead. A silly hat and now an excursion.
16:50It's one thing to die in a war whose objective the president cannot explain. Americans have done that
16:57before and have done it since Vietnam. But to die in an excursion. To call it an excursion before the
17:09families have even had the funerals. To struggle to find language that demeans those soldiers sacrifice
17:18in service to his desperate political needs is a uniquely Trumpian moment in the American presidency.
17:28Donald Trump. Tonight, there was another dignified transfer at Dover Air Force Base for Army Sergeant
17:35Benjamin Pennington, 26 years old, of Glendale, Kentucky.
17:42Donald Trump wasn't there. Donald Trump did not attend. But he did attend a fundraiser for House Speaker
17:52of Mike Johnson today in Florida at Donald Trump's Golf Resort there. And if you're paging through the
18:02history books trying to find the president who went to a political fundraiser at a golf club on the 10th
18:08day of a war, you can stop right now. Only the guy who said, show some guts there's nothing to
18:15be afraid of,
18:16would show his guts by going to a fundraiser instead of the second dignified transfer of his war of choosing.
18:31Senator Sheldon Whitehouse will join us after this break.
18:39Today, global oil prices continue to surge as Donald Trump's war with Iran continues to disrupt energy
18:45markets and the global economy. Oil briefly spiked to nearly $120 a barrel overnight before coming back
18:52down during the day. The world's largest economies held an emergency meeting of the G7 today to discuss
18:58whether they may need to release emergency reserves to stabilize the oil and gas markets.
19:03CNBC reports about 20 percent of the world's oil supply is being disrupted by Donald Trump's war
19:09with traffic in the Strait of Hormuz just south of Iran at a standstill. Joining us now is Democratic
19:16Senator Sheldon Whitehouse of Rhode Island. He's a member of the Senate Judiciary Committee and the
19:19Senate Finance Committee. Senator, thank you very much for joining us tonight.
19:23You the the outcome with the oil markets was one of the predictable effects of this war. But Donald
19:34Trump seems to have been taken by surprise by it. Yeah. And the two big winners from this big surprise
19:43that he was the only person not to see are his big oil billionaire cronies who've seen the price of
19:53their product go through the roof. One of the things that's notable is that American oil producers who
19:59are selling oil to Americans raise their prices when foreign issues change the international oil market.
20:10Their cost of production hasn't changed so they're going to make a fortune. And of course the other big
20:17winner is Vladimir Putin who is winning not only because Trump released him from sanctions so that
20:24he can get more revenue. Oil prices are up so the spigot of money to keep his war machine against
20:30Ukraine
20:30going is flipped wide open. And the arms that we have been providing to Ukraine are now being spent
20:40in Iran. And that lowers the overall supply, throw in other needs. And I'm sure we'll shortly see
20:49Hegseth and others saying, well, we'd love to help Ukraine, but we simply don't have
20:53the war material any longer. So Putin's number one goal has been to succeed at annexing Ukraine by
21:03violence. And he's also the one person in the world to whom President Trump insists on showing submission,
21:12submissiveness, and not try to be the dominant person in the relationship. He's the submissive in this
21:21relationship. So there is pain all around economically from the decision Trump evidently didn't see
21:31the consequences of, except in those two corners of Trump allies.
21:39So Donald Trump spent some time on the phone with Vladimir Putin today. What could that possibly have
21:43been about?
21:44Yeah. Nothing good for Ukraine, just to begin with. And as you know, there is a long connection between
21:55Trump and Russia. Trump likes to call it the Trump Russia hoax. But as you know better than anyone,
22:02Lawrence, when Trump uses the word hoax, it's his verbal tell for something that is absolutely true.
22:10So Trump Russia has been a long, long standing thing. We do not fully understand it yet. There's also a
22:18Russia Epstein connection that we don't fully understand yet, which makes Trump Russia and
22:24Trump Epstein more of a complicated triangle of Trump Russia Epstein. But I would be very interested
22:31to know what took place in that conversation between him and President Putin. Nothing good for Ukraine,
22:38I'm sure.
22:39So Donald Trump never announced either an objective or a timeline at the beginning of his war, which seems
22:48to leave it open to him to decide exactly when his war ends, which might mean that the stock market
22:55will
22:56tell him when his war ends. Yeah, you know, I think it's become his style to try to play things
23:02fast and
23:02loose and keep everybody guessing, which is fine if you are, you know, running a casino or selling
23:11yourself as a TV host on an entertainment show. But when you've got the reputation of the United States,
23:19when you've got the lives of American service members, and when you've got massive economic
23:26consequences for American families, fall on the line, you'd like to think that he would have put
23:32the effort in to thinking it through a little bit. And as we go forward, Donald Trump's notion of
23:42unconditional surrender, I'm sure he'll never bring it up again. And it'll just be forgotten. But he
23:48obviously has no idea what that even looks like. But we're certainly not any closer to that impossible
23:56dream after the new leadership choice in Iran. No, in fact, you know, Iran has had an enormous
24:05amount of destruction wreaked on its traditional military apparatus. There's no doubt about that.
24:14But clearly, the spirit of the Iranian extremists has not been broken when they put the Ayatollahs even
24:22more aggressive and conservative son in as his replacement. There's no sign of looking unconditionally
24:29surrendering there. And they have operatives all around the world. They have drone technology that
24:38is very inexpensive. And believe it or not, there's been news reporting by the Washington Post
24:45that Vladimir Putin, the Russians, have been helping the Iranians target American service
24:53members. I wonder if that came up in the conversation between Trump and Putin, that Putin is actually
24:59helping Iran kill our service members. Ordinarily, that would be the kind of thing that would irritate
25:06an American president, maybe even anger him, maybe even put some real pressure on Putin to knock
25:11it off. But whatever he has on Putin, that has not happened. Senator Sheldon Whitehouse,
25:18thank you very much for starting off our discussions tonight. Thank you. Coming up,
25:23the Trump Justice Department has released more of the Epstein files as it's required to do under the law,
25:29passed by our next guest, Congressman Ro Khanna. That's next.
25:36Donald Trump's Justice Department released more of the Epstein files, including notes from FBI
25:43interviews with a woman who said she was sexually assaulted by Donald Trump when she was 13 years
25:49old. It is unclear how fully the FBI investigated her claims, and Donald Trump has denied any wrongdoing
25:58reporting linked to Epstein. According to an MSNOW analysis of the 20 newly released documents,
26:05which comprise fewer than 1,000 pages, notwithstanding the small size of the production
26:11and the Justice Department's repeated assurances that it would protect victim safety and privacy,
26:16MSNOW found the first and or last names of at least 21 known or suspected survivors. Some of these names
26:26were left unredacted multiple times. Epstein survivor Danielle Bensky said this on this network earlier
26:35today. We've had so many conversations with the Democrats, the Republicans. We're in offices and
26:43we're constantly saying how important the redaction process is and getting it right is. And you would
26:49think that after twice already, especially after the last release where, you know, our lawyers
26:55talk to them, everybody's, you know, there's been so much conversation around this topic.
27:00And then to see it yet again on Friday or Thursday, I believe it was, is just, it's really beyond,
27:07I mean, frustrating puts it so mildly. It's gutting.
27:11In a statement, House Oversight Committee Democrats said,
27:15let's be clear, this White House coverup is ongoing. Millions of pages still remain concealed
27:22from the public and our committee. We will get answers when Pam Bondi appears before our committee
27:28under oath. Joining us now is Democratic Congressman Roecona in California. He's a member of the House
27:33Oversight Committee. Let me begin with what we just heard from yet another survivor about the
27:40redactions problem. I don't even know what to call it, that this Trump Justice Department could
27:46continue to put out material that does not have their names redacted. It's heartless. And these
27:53survivors are reliving their trauma. They're being victimized a second time. And it's preventable.
28:00Bradley Edwards, who's been on your program, who you introduced, he has been offering to go to the
28:06DOJ to help set up the protocols. He said, let me get the other survivors' lawyers in there. And
28:13they are not involving them. I mean, yeah, they'll return an email, but it takes Bradley Edwards
28:19barraging the DOJ. And it just shows a total callousness. Meanwhile, they're covering up for
28:25the president. I mean, they're covering up in terms of at least his embarrassment and not releasing these
28:30three files that they were forced to release. And they're covering up for people who actually
28:34abused these girls. So millions of Epstein file documents still not released, which just,
28:41I assume, means your crusade on this continues. It continues because it's personal, because these
28:48survivors have sat in my office. They've sat in Thomas Massey's office. They were abused. They were
28:53raped. And they want justice. And the half of the files that are out proves to the country that what
28:59we
28:59were talking about was not a hoax, that some of the most powerful people are involved. And the worst
29:03stuff is still in these files, that the names of some of these people which have been scrubbed by
29:09Donald Trump's FBI. But look, here's why people shouldn't give up hope. Because when people cover
29:15it, when people, journalists, make a big deal of it, then suddenly Pambani relents and they would get
29:2110,000 more files, 40,000 more files. So we need to just be on this until we can get
29:27a judge to order
29:29the release of the rest of the files. And, of course, Donald Trump launches wars in Venezuela
29:33or Iran to try to deflect from this, among other reasons. The Pam Bondi testimony that I just referred
29:41to, I know people in the audience out there are thinking, oh, OK, so the attorney general is going
29:45to come to the committee and do her usual insult comedian bad act in front of your committee. Is that
29:52the way it's going to go? It won't. And it's so disrespectful seeing her do that when survivors are
29:56there. But this time she's not going to be able to go just insult me or insult Robert Garcia.
30:01She's going to be deposed and she's going to be. So a deposition is completely different from what
30:06people have grown accustomed to as a congressional hearing with the attorney general. Completely
30:11different because the people asking her the questions are going to be qualified lawyers.
30:16They're going to get an hour, not five minutes. She's going to have to answer those questions under
30:21oath, not just respond with barbs at members of Congress. And this is why it was so important
30:26what Nancy Mace, myself, Robert Garcia did. I mean, we got 24 to 19. We won that vote to subpoena
30:35Pam
30:35Bondi to be under oath. And she's going to have to explain why were these three files covered up
30:40that involved Donald Trump? Why are half the files still redacted and not being shown to the American
30:46people? Why was there the prison transfer for Ghislaine Maxwell? There's a lot she has to explain.
30:52And by the way, the next president can prosecute her. Now, maybe Trump preemptively pardons her,
30:56but Trump is not known to stick around with people who are political liabilities.
31:01Yeah. There's real legal liability for her in under oath testimony on this matter.
31:07And it's finally going to be forcing her to answer the questions. They ask her,
31:12why is the file still redacted? She says, well, Thomas Massey, you don't know what you're
31:17talking about. Now she's going to have to answer yes or no under oath. It is one of the most
31:21significant moments when we're going to get her under oath. Congressman Ro Khanna,
31:25thank you very much for joining us tonight. And coming up, we'll take a look at Donald Trump's
31:30new choice for secretary of Homeland Security after his first choice has gone wherever she's gone.
31:39That's next.
31:45Speaking of war profiteering, Donald Trump's choice to be the next secretary of the Department of
31:50Homeland Security, Republican Senator Mark Wayne Mullen of Oklahoma, has made some interesting stock
31:55trades this year. The Daily Beast reports five days before military action in Venezuela,
32:00Mullen purchased substantial positions in defense contractor RTX Corp and oil giants Chevron and
32:08ConocoPhillips, according to Capital Trades. Based on those federal disclosure filings and publicly
32:14available share price data, Mullen made up to $35,000 from the trio of positions by Monday. Senator Mullen
32:23is a member of the Senate Armed Services Committee with access to non-public information about U.S.
32:30military operations. After buying Chevron, Mark Wayne Mullen then publicly urged others to buy the stock he
32:37already bought without publicly disclosing that he bought that stock. Senator Mullen said this on CNBC.
32:48I mean, look at Chevron. We've had relationships in Venezuela for years. The problem was, is under
32:55Maduro, it really became uninvestable. Once that stabilizes, every major company is going to be
33:03buying to get involved in that area because there's a tremendous amount of opportunity for the company
33:09and for their shareholders. Senator Mullen's confirmation hearing will be in the Senate
33:16Homeland Security Committee, which is chaired by Republican Senator Rand Paul of Kentucky.
33:21The Daily Beast reports during a breakfast in Tulsa, Oklahoma last month, Mullen voiced his
33:26frustration with Senator Rand Paul. Rand Paul's a freaking snake, Mullen said. Joining us now is
33:33Garrett Graff, journalist and historian who covers federal law enforcement. Garrett, thank you very
33:38much for joining us tonight. So first of all, is Mark Wayne Mullen an upgrade from Kristi Noem?
33:48Not at all. And I think this is one of the things that it's easy to look past because I
33:53think the whole
33:54country is taking a deep breath of relief that Kristi Noem is out atop DHS. However, it's worth pointing
34:03out that Mark Wayne Mullen is not in any way qualified to actually be the secretary of the nation's third
34:13largest Cabinet Department. And in fact, not only is he unqualified, he is underqualified even in
34:21comparison to Kristi Noem or even Pete Hegseth at the Pentagon, that he is someone who has no government
34:29experience. He has no law enforcement experience. He has no military experience. He has no intelligence
34:36experience. And in fact, has never worked in the private sector outside of his own family businesses.
34:45And his government experience is just the United States Senate, where he gets to manage a Senate
34:51staff, which for the state of Oklahoma is not that big. It's less than 50 people.
34:57Exactly. And that even in the House, where he served several terms and then came to the Senate,
35:04he has never served on the Homeland Security Committee in either body. And I think, you know,
35:12in some ways it may seem old fashioned, even in the Trump administration, to be talking about
35:19competency or management experience. But I think it should still matter to us whether the people who
35:25are being nominated for these jobs have even the most basic set of qualifications necessary to do them.
35:32There are a bunch of ways to go in the Senate confirmation hearing, including looking back
35:38at the Kristi Noem operation there and all the various conflicts of interest and all the favorable
35:46contract deals that were given. The Democrats could focus on that in this confirmation hearing.
35:52But what is it? What is what are the range of ways to go in this confirmation hearing as you
35:59see it?
36:00Yeah, to me, I think there's obviously a lot of opportunity to look backward. But the thing that we should
36:06really try to stay focused on is what's still to come. And I think Americans are misunderstanding
36:14the scale of the immigration spending still to come that has come out of this Republican funding surge
36:23last summer. I had a piece in the recently about the construction and procurement budget
36:32for customs and border protection. It is a number around 50 to 54 billion dollars for this year,
36:43which is a number so large that it is actually larger than the entire annual defense budgets of all but
36:51five European countries. And the money that is still available to be spent in that budget right now
37:00is equal to the entire GDP of the country of Estonia.
37:06And that's for the operation of these warehouses where they expect to store thousands of people?
37:14That's that's an entirely other budget. That is all in ISIS detention budget, still tens of billions of
37:23dollars to spend there as well. And I think we should be paying real close attention and pushing
37:29Mark Wayne Mullen as the nominee about what oversight is going to be available and expected and what level
37:38of transparency about how that money is being spent is going to be available to members of Congress going
37:46forward. This is really, to me, one of the last major opportunities that Congress has to change the
37:53trajectory of our immigration spending. And we've seen committee chairman Rand Paul has said that he sees
37:59no legal justification for the shooting and killing of Renee Good or Alex Preddy in Minneapolis. So we can
38:08expect something from the chairman on that. Absolutely. And again, we're really just seeing the beginning of
38:18the effects of these new hires at ICE and CBP and the new construction budgets and the new detention facilities.
38:25To me, there's plenty more scandals still to come this year. And that's all going to end up on Mark
38:32Wayne Mullen's plate. Garrett Graff, thank you very much for joining us tonight. Anytime.
38:40Tonight's last word, a special last word, is next.
38:47In dramatic testimony, Alexander Butterfield revealed to the world that President Richard
38:53Nixon's criminal conspiracy inside the White House was all on tape.
39:01Butterfield, are you aware of the installation of any listening devices in the Oval Office of the President?
39:10I was aware of listening devices. Yes, sir.
39:15Mr. Butterfield, as far as you know from your own personal knowledge,
39:20from 1970 then until the present time, all of the President's conversations
39:25in the offices mentioned and on the telephones mentioned were recorded.
39:32As far as you know. That's correct. And as far as you know, those tapes are still available.
39:39As far as I know, but I've been away for four months, sir. I have no further question.
39:46Alexander Butterfield delivered that testimony in July 1973 to the Watergate Committee and changed the
39:52course of history. The President was recorded in his own voice committing crimes in the Oval Office.
39:59Richard Nixon resigned the presidency in disgrace and received a pardon from his successor, President
40:05Gerald Ford. As a result of the investigation of the President, 48 Nixon administration officials
40:12were found guilty of crimes. Alexander Butterfield joined this program in July 2022,
40:19after he watched former White House staffer Cassidy Hutchinson's testimony about the Trump White
40:26House given to the January 6th committee. Alexander Butterfield praised Cassidy Hutchinson and said this
40:34about his historic testimony. What nobody knew, I felt it was my responsibility and that I was the person
40:45who was told to put in the system. Alexander Butterfield died today at his home in San Diego. He leaves
40:55his wife,
40:56Kim, his two daughters, eight grandchildren and 13 great-grandchildren. Alexander Butterfield was 99 years old.
41:08That is tonight's last word. The 11th hour with Stephanie Ruhl starts now.
41:13Alexander Butterfield
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