- 11 minutes ago
Seth and Sean take a look at and assess the Texans' personnel along the offensive line and at running back after trading away OL Tytus Howard and OL Juice Scruggs and bringing in RB David Montgomery.
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00:00Yeah, we're typically taking the best players, I would say, as it pertains to the offensive line.
00:04I mean, honestly, it's probably one of the best years we had since I've been there.
00:07We played, you know, I think we gave up the least amount of sacks,
00:10or second in the history of the organization.
00:12We had the most improvement from sack production from one year to the next.
00:17I think it was us and the Bears.
00:18So, I mean, honestly, our offensive line actually played pretty good last year.
00:20So maybe I was looking at a different film, but, you know,
00:23we're going to look at who we feel are the best players that we think are going to help us
00:25and, you know, try to put together a good team.
00:27All right, that was Nick Casario at the Combine last week.
00:31So very, very complimentary of the offensive line.
00:36Since then, they've traded Titus Howard.
00:39He's also said they might be looking to upgrade center where Jake Andrews played last year,
00:43and they moved on from Juice Scruggs.
00:46He was a throw-in to the David Montgomery trade.
00:48I think that if there's one thing about Casario I think we've learned in the last couple years,
00:56is he's going to support the offensive line publicly, no matter how he might actually feel.
01:03And then, I mean, it was gut it.
01:05Yeah, I mean, in 2024, he said that it was a lazy narrative that the offensive line was an issue,
01:12and then he got rid of three of the starting offensive linemen from that year.
01:16You know, in saying that the offensive line played pretty well this last year,
01:23they didn't even know who their left guard was midway through the season,
01:28and they ultimately had to just do their same old thing where they moved Titus Howard down to left guard,
01:34and Trent Brown came in and did an admirable job given the circumstances at right tackle.
01:39But then they get rid of Titus Howard, the guy that kind of made the offensive line at least stabilize
01:44when they moved him to the left guard.
01:46So, yeah, I don't know exactly.
01:48I think I feel like he almost goes into any discussion about the O-line as just he's committed to
01:54saying all is well
01:57just because he doesn't want to pour anything more on the fire.
02:00Yeah.
02:01But it's frustrating in the moment.
02:03I think his actions are different than his words,
02:06and I would rather his actions be those of somebody that's trying to fix something.
02:11But when you hear the words, it's frustrating.
02:15What would you have wanted to hear from him right there?
02:18I think that I'm cool with hearing that the offensive line did make some improvement.
02:26Yeah.
02:27I think that's valid.
02:28I think that two years ago, the offensive line was allowing guys deep into the backfield regularly.
02:36Oh, yeah.
02:37There was so much penetration.
02:39There were so many tackles for a loss, and I'm just talking about in the run game.
02:42Sure.
02:43I'm not even talking about pass protection.
02:45I think this year, early on, we saw a lot of the same old issues of the O-line just
02:50not being able to handle games
02:51and stunts and movement by the defensive line.
02:55I thought they hemmed that up pretty well in the second half of the season.
02:58So maybe when he's saying the offense played pretty well, he's thinking specifically of the second half of the season.
03:04But I think, you know, with D'Amico, I think D'Amico was in a little bit of denial at
03:10the end of the season.
03:11This year at the combine, he basically just said there's going to be improvements on the O-line.
03:16Yeah.
03:16So I guess just within reason, you know what it is?
03:21And we'll bring this up.
03:21Let's bring this up with Nick on Thursday.
03:23There's a couple things that I've gotten written down that I wanted to bring up last time that I forgot
03:26about.
03:27Yeah.
03:27But just let's revisit saying that it was a lazy narrative that the offensive line in 2024 was an issue.
03:33Because since then, he's gotten rid of all the starters from that offensive line.
03:39Yeah, from the one two years ago.
03:41Right.
03:41So I feel like at the very least, can we acknowledge that it wasn't a lazy narrative that the offensive
03:46line needed some work?
03:477.15 Thursday morning, Nick Casario joins us on the show.
03:51So make a note of that.
03:52Here's the cut you were just talking about with D'Amico Ryans.
03:55This is D'Amico with Judy Batista of the NFL Network being very clear about where the Texans need to
04:01improve.
04:02Where are the areas that you're focused on in terms of maybe improving the roster?
04:07Yeah, for us, it's for the offensive side of the ball.
04:09We're looking to improve at the offensive line position.
04:13To start there, we're looking to improve our running back.
04:16Okay, so that being pretty clear, pretty concise, those two positions.
04:20Of those two, obviously, they've made an improvement to the running back room in the last 24 hours.
04:25Unless you feel like Titus Howard is an addition by subtraction situation, which I don't as a player.
04:31Now, the contract that he got from Cleveland makes it a more complicated discussion about Titus.
04:36But I think this is the first step to what is probably a very discussed and detailed plan about how
04:44they intend to improve this offensive line.
04:46Yeah, and look, I know that clip was really, really short.
04:49But the reason I did that was because he did, I wasn't trying to obscure anything.
04:53He just, he went on to speak in generalities about improving the team in general and everything.
04:58The notable thing was that he specifically started off talking about O-line and running back.
05:02And was not prompted to.
05:03Yeah, and they did, and boom, running back, addressed.
05:07Yeah.
05:07I expect, boom, O-line to be addressed.
05:10Now, probably drawn out over.
05:11You're talking about at least four positions where you don't know if you have the starter right now.
05:17I was just, we went through a little exercise during the break where I just kind of,
05:21we're talking about replacing Titus Howard and how that $22 million per year, I mean, you can find, at the
05:32very least,
05:33two of the more highly regarded guards in free agency.
05:37You know, Kevin Zeitler, for one, if you're okay with his age, he's still been playing at a higher level
05:42in some respects than Titus Howard.
05:44He's probably going to get less than $10 million per year.
05:48Right, right.
05:48You know, there's other veteran guards out there that are going to get $10 million or less per year
05:54that, if you want to be objective as possible, go by their PFF grades.
05:58They grade out higher than Titus Howard.
06:01They might be a little bit older, but they're not making $22 million per year.
06:05Yeah.
06:06Elijah Vera Tucker is going to make less.
06:08He's more of a premier offensive guard free agent.
06:11The former first rounder.
06:12Yeah, who's going to make less than $20 million per year.
06:15So, I just think, just by the sheer numbers, you can replace Titus with a couple of viable starters.
06:23The reasonably priced but bona fide starters.
06:27And that makes more sense.
06:29Yep.
06:29Yeah, I just don't, I don't think Titus has played well enough these last couple years to be a $22
06:34million per year player
06:36like the Browns think he is.
06:37Yeah, yeah.
06:38And that's an interesting, it's a really interesting move for the Browns because they're tearing their offensive line down to
06:44the studs.
06:45And their first move is to take a cast off from the Texans and give him big money.
06:50That's where, you listened to my hit on Cleveland radio yesterday.
06:54I did, I did.
06:54You did a great job.
06:55Well, except that that's the part of it where I'm trying to figure out how to frame it necessarily.
06:59The thing that makes that Titus Howard trade so weird is that they're both teams that need to rebuild their
07:07entire offensive line.
07:09And one of those teams is saying, okay, part of this rebuild is going to be this $22 million per
07:16year offensive tackle.
07:17The other team that now basically needs to rebuild its whole offensive line, partly because they're saying part of the
07:25rebuild can't be this $22 million per year offensive tackle.
07:28And I guess I was maybe being a little bit, I was trying to be polite, but I think from
07:33my perspective, it's that like, all right, well,
07:36if the Texans are taking a different approach to it than the other team in the trade partner route,
07:41I'm happy that the Browns are the one that are, they're taking the different route.
07:45So if this was another smarter football team, I would say, okay, all right, boy, what are the, what are
07:50the Rams know that we don't?
07:51Yeah.
07:52Or what are the Seahawks know that we don't?
07:54Totally.
07:55Totally.
07:55And I think, I think the reason for that, I think, I think you're onto something.
07:59I think the Browns probably have a decent idea of how they're viewed around the league.
08:03Beggars can't be choosers.
08:05They're there.
08:05It may be for the Browns that they realize they're the Browns.
08:09Free agents are probably not going to want to go there.
08:12I think the Texans are viewed as a much better organization.
08:14Certainly better positioned to win than the Browns are right now.
08:18And if that's important to free agents, especially aging free agents that are one-year veteran guys,
08:23I think the Browns probably know the available pool of players that would want to come there
08:27is a smaller pool of players than the Texans have.
08:30So Titus, so their, their list of solutions on their whiteboard, if they're being honest with themselves,
08:35is probably, is, is, is probably a shorter list than what the Texans feel like they've got available to them.
08:42And Titus Howard for the Browns is one of the better solutions on their board.
08:47I think the Texans quite honestly just feel like we've got better options out there than Titus Howard.
08:52The Browns probably don't feel that way.
08:54He, he, they, he may be one of the best options for them, especially if you're going to money whip
08:58him with three years,
08:5963 million, which I don't, I'm with you.
09:01I don't, I, if they gave, if the Texans gave Titus Howard that, what, what would we be saying?
09:06Forget, pretend there's not a Titus Howard trade.
09:09Pretend that the news yesterday was the Texans gave Titus Howard three years, 63 million.
09:13I'd be, I would not feel comfortable with that.
09:16I think that's the part there where I'm a little bit curious about some of the people that are now
09:20crying into their pillows about the loss of Titus Howard.
09:23I understand that.
09:24Yes.
09:25It's weird that you gave up for the second year in a row.
09:27You've given up your best offensive lineman on an offensive line that needs to be rebuilt.
09:31Yeah.
09:32And yet at the same time, I, I've always looked at Titus Howard as, Hey, he's a competent starting offensive
09:37tackle in the NFL.
09:38I, his value with the Texans is more that, okay, he's at least a viable competent starting offensive lineman when
09:47we still have other gaps to fill.
09:50But I never felt like he needs to be the bedrock of everything.
09:54Yeah.
09:55I mean, calling him your best offensive lineman is probably factual.
09:59It's definitely an opinion that's valid, I would say, but it's to me, like when you're trading Laramie Tunsil and
10:05saying we traded our best offensive lineman.
10:07Okay.
10:07That begins a discussion.
10:09This guy has made five pro bowls.
10:11I just can't, you know, like, yeah, he's the best offensive lineman on an offensive line that, that is, that
10:17was not been good the last couple of years.
10:19And I do think that over the last couple of years, this, this rebuild of the offensive line probably was
10:25always going to be a two-year process.
10:26Just looking at it in hindsight.
10:28And this is what I, this is what I suspected at the time, but I wanted to be, I just
10:32wished it was a one-year process.
10:34I think that there's a good chance that last year when they traded Laramie Tunsil, they were having thoughts or
10:39discussions about, well, can we just rip everything off right now, the whole Band-Aid?
10:44And that they probably looked at Laramie Tunsil, the combined package of Laramie Tunsil and Titus Howard making $50 million
10:50a year between the two of them.
10:52Yeah.
10:52As that's not money well spent for an offensive line that needs to be completely rebuilt.
10:57Yep.
10:58And that now this, if it's a two-year process, just this is when you got to go over the
11:04top and be, it just nail everything into place.
11:07Well, including getting some veteran players, instead of $50 million on those two players, if we spend $50 million on
11:13four players.
11:14On the line.
11:14Per year.
11:15Yeah.
11:15Yeah.
11:16That we get to be a much, some total better offensive line.
11:18Yep.
11:19Yep.
11:19Because Ursary's still got three years left on a rookie deal where he's only making a couple of million.
11:24They can, now look, if we're just level setting where everything is right now with these two rooms, the O
11:28-line room and the running back room, the O-line, they can barely field an offensive line right now.
11:34They've got a ton of work to do.
11:35There's a ton of pressure to get, at the very least, singles and doubles on the offensive line, if not
11:42home runs.
11:43I think the biggest ripple effect from trading Titus Howard and where they are right now, I think if people
11:49have been waiting for them to spend big on the offensive line, look, Nick, in that cut we played earlier
11:54in this segment, brought up the other offensive line that made great improvements at protecting their young quarterback.
11:59And that was the bears and the bears took a dramatically different, and I would submit a more effective approach
12:06to, uh, to build, to fixing the offensive line to wit.
12:11They're probably going to just run back the same five guys next year.
12:14The bears.
12:15Meanwhile, the Texans are going to have all new faces other than their left tackle in all likelihood on the
12:21starting offensive line.
12:22And so I think I, if you're, if you're a Texan fan who wants to look at the entirety of
12:28the free agency pool out there, including the expensive guys, I think you, we've arrived at your off season here.
12:33I think they're going to be, I think that they, there is, they're going to be money whipping at least
12:38one, if not more offensive linemen relative to what their values are in, in coming here.
12:44I don't think they're going to pay somebody top of market value who doesn't deserve it.
12:47But, but I think whatever the valuations that we've seen of players out there, Seth, um, I think that's where,
12:52that's the neighborhood they're going to be living in.
12:54Yeah.
12:54And I think that also the, the, the draft now that we're in free agency, it's funny before free agency
13:01comes, uh, all we talk about is a draft and we pretend like free agency doesn't even exist.
13:06Now that we're kind of, we're kind of in the free agency window now, now, because we have a couple
13:10of transactions.
13:12It's a good, it's a good reminder that, oh wait, oh yeah.
13:15When we go into the draft, we don't know exactly what it's going to look like.
13:17Right.
13:18I do think that the Texans might be thinking about spending more aggressively on interior offensive linemen and looking at
13:28the draft and saying that, man, there, it really looks like there might be a bunch of offensive tackles available
13:35in the back half of the first round.
13:37Now the danger, I guess, becomes at least on draft day, teams know that the Texans need offensive linemen.
13:46Yeah.
13:46They know that they need a tackle specifically.
13:49Yep.
13:49Who's trying to jump up in front of you once you get down into that sweet spot where maybe there's
13:54three offensive tackles available in the late teens and everybody's looking at the Texans and knowing that they're willing to
14:00take one of those guys.
14:01Are you able to actually get one of those guys? Texans tried to trade up into the late teens last
14:07year, maybe to get, maybe to get Graze Abel, the guard, who knows?
14:10Yeah.
14:10And they weren't able to do it.
14:11Nope.
14:12So that's, that's the dicey part of it.
14:15The running back room, meanwhile, is more fortified now with David Montgomery is a duo of David Montgomery and Woody
14:23Marks, an acceptable duo for you to attack this season.
14:28Is that, is that a good one and two for you?
14:30Yeah.
14:31As long as they've got an actually solid offensive line in front of them.
14:34Right.
14:34Yeah.
14:34I think that David, I think David Montgomery was, it was not a matter of him falling off or anything
14:42in Detroit.
14:43I just, I watched last year and behind a worse offensive line, because the Lions offensive line was not nearly
14:49as good as they typically are last year.
14:51Um, I still think the same guy is there now. He's a running back and he's in his upper twenties.
14:57That's always dicey, but it was a lot more about Jameer Gibbs just really coming into his own and the
15:03Lions acknowledging that.
15:04So is, is David Montgomery all of a sudden be as good as Jameer Gibbs? No, but like, but that's
15:10not, that's not the, it wasn't a huge revelation that that was the case last year.
15:16So I'm cool with the one, two punch of those guys. You've got an early down type of guy in
15:21David Montgomery. And then Woody marks, if he continues to develop, he can play all three downs, but man, get
15:26him more involved in the passing game.
15:28Yeah. Get him more. Cause they had to take, they had to, they had to put his development as a
15:32receiver on hiatus when he became the main guy. I think you get them out in space more. He stays
15:37healthier and it's, it's the perfect compliment.
15:39I think you traded for two guys yesterday. I think you traded for David Montgomery to be your first and
15:44second down guy. And I think in the process, you're getting a better version of Woody marks. You're getting a
15:49more suitable version of Woody marks. You're getting a version of Woody marks. It's going to be doing more of
15:54what he was brought in here to do, which you couldn't do last year. Cause he was, he was your
15:58David Montgomery last year, you know? And so I guess the bigger, the, maybe the more important question is, are
16:06you cool with right now?
16:08Now Jawar Jordan and British Brooks being your depth at running back. Cause that's what you have right now. Right.
16:14That's if you, one of these guys gets hurt, all of a sudden Jawar Jordan and British Brooks are in
16:18the mix.
16:18Those guys in Cleveland kind of caught me off guard. Cause they said, well, what do you expect to happen
16:22with Nick Chubb? And I, I have to confess, I haven't really thought a whole lot about him.
16:27You were being too nice in that answer. I thought was I, yeah, you were, yeah, you, it felt like
16:31you didn't want to, if Nick Chubb is royalty in Cleveland, this is what I thought when I heard your
16:35answer is they asked you about that.
16:37And my feeling is like, I think he's gone. I don't think they're bringing him back.
16:41Well, I don't, would they bring him back on the same contract?
16:43Would Nick Chubb play for that? Does he want to come back and play for two million a year?
16:47If that's what the option is for him out there, if they could get him on, if they get him
16:50for less than $5 million a year on a one year contract, I'm cool with that.
16:55Yeah. I just don't know what, I don't know what he, he hopes or expects. He never says anything. Yeah.
17:00You know, to his credit, he's just, he's got zero ego about him. I just don't know what he expects.
17:04No, I didn't think your answer was inaccurate, but I'm listening to you. I'm like, I would like, in my
17:09mind, I'm like, I think he's gone. I don't think he's going to be a Texan.
17:13And you were, you were leaving open. I felt like you were leaving the door open in part because they,
17:18they think of Nick Chubb much differently.
17:21And I think Texan fans, I didn't, well, honestly, I had not thought about it a single bit. I felt
17:27exposed a little bit because he hasn't been in the conversation.
17:31I was trying to give them a genuine answer and I don't, I don't, I didn't have them in it.
17:36I didn't have an answer to give.
17:37And I, and I felt like, man, this is bad on me that I really haven't considered Nick Chubb and
17:41just exactly what we should be thinking about with him.
17:44I don't, I don't think Nick Chubb is a guy you make a decision on until after the draft.
17:48You're right. Right. Like that's, that's the thing.
17:50Yes. That's a good way to put it. He shouldn't prevent you from making moves you want to make.
17:54Yeah. Yeah. He was a, he was great in the Steelers game.
17:57He was, he was, yeah. And you made that point. And I thought that was a really good point.
18:00He was awesome in the Steelers game. He was anything he showed as the season went on.
18:04It looked a little bit more like he had a little bit more of that burst.
18:08But yeah, but I was, I was softening it a little bit just because I knew that he's, you're being,
18:12you're being respectful.
18:13I thought they got a little, they didn't know what exactly what to make of my joke at the very
18:17end.
18:18When I had said, well, if you put a gun to my head and I had to decide then, you
18:23know, I guess I, I think CJ gets an extension next off season.
18:25Right. And they said, we'd never put a gun to your head.
18:28And I said, sometimes I wish you would. And in silence, I think they might've called on, I think they
18:36might've called Odyssey HR.
18:39They were still talking about it after you hung up.
18:41They were. Yeah. Yeah. They were like, Oh, that got really dark at the end right there.
18:46That was the first thing they said after they hung up with you was the very end. And I thought
18:51of me and I thought of Ben and I'm like, this is just a, this is a David ends in
18:54why on this show, man.
18:55Don't die. Everybody. Thank you. Thank you.
18:59Yeah. It's the kind of thing. Uh, people, uh, yeah, apparently that happened with somebody that we know.
19:04They made a kind of a joke like that and I ended up having to go to mandated counseling because
19:11somebody reported it, which I get it.
19:13Good on that person for not messing around with it or anything.
19:16Oh my God.
19:17But I felt like I had to, I was going to call their producer and be like, Hey man, just
19:20like, just so you know, that's a, that's a, that's my version of humor.
19:23Sorry. Please don't call HR. Okay.
19:26I don't know. Strange numbers calling and leaving, leaving messages. Like, are you all right?
19:30Are you calling to ask for my shoelaces?
19:32Yes.
19:34Oh man. It was a good hit. You did a nice job on there, man.
19:37Uh, with the, with the fellas yesterday.
19:39I did better in Jacksonville. Jacksonville called me up yesterday.
19:42Oh, they did.
19:42I was out with my old teammate, you know, the, Oh, you know what people love?
19:46I can't tell it around here anymore.
19:48They love the terror, terror, tear the offensive line down to the studs and then build a new,
19:52and then it, it, they didn't build.
19:54And it felt like we're living in a FEMA trailer.
19:56Oh, they like the FEMA trailer joke.
19:58Kills.
19:59It kills.
20:00It's gold, Jerry.
20:03Anywhere.
20:04I use that one in Jacksonville because they're familiar with storm events.
20:07With FEMA.
20:08Yeah.
20:09We have more FEMA trailers in the Gulf coast and Southeast.
20:12Seth, he's tailoring his jokes geographically on these hits that he's doing.
20:16That's a pro right there, man.
20:18People, I'll tell you what, man, people get, they get pissy when you make jokes about the,
20:23the polluted Lake Erie and the lake set of being on fire.
20:27Oh, in Cleveland.
20:27Yeah.
20:28Yeah.
20:28That's the, they, they take that very personally up there.
20:31Uh, Reggie at a tool is listening to the show.
20:34Uh, you can hear him 10 to 2 PM on, uh, sports radio, 610 on in the loop.
20:38Um, this is a good question about the Nick Chubb thing.
20:41Is Chubb playing special teams?
20:42Cause he's probably going to be your third running back.
20:45And the deeper you get on the depth chart guys.
20:47Oh yeah.
20:47Good call.
20:48Reginald has probably got to play on special teams.
20:50And the answers at Reggie, I would say the answer is no.
20:52And you know why I say that?
20:53Cause I didn't see him play one snap on special teams last season.
20:57I'd be happy to see him.
20:57And then I'd be happy to see him.
20:57I'd be happy to see him.
20:57I'd be happy to see him.
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