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00:00All right, we've got a very special show for you this week,
00:03not because Joel Sherman isn't here,
00:05vacationing in Amish country in Pennsylvania.
00:08We do have Mark Malousis, a great New York sports writer
00:11and one of my favorites.
00:13He's at SNY now.
00:15He is at WFAN on Sunday mornings, does a football show.
00:18I've been on with him, not talking football.
00:20I know nothing about it.
00:22But it's great to have Mark.
00:23And, Mark, we're going to have Ron Darling,
00:25who is my pitching expert and Mets expert.
00:30And there's a lot to talk about with Ron and the Mets
00:32and what's going on lately.
00:34Yeah, no doubt.
00:35Met fan is upset about the state of this team
00:36and where the organization is going, obviously.
00:39And Ron, part of the best, I mean, let's be honest.
00:42Listen, there are a lot of great baseball booths in Major League Baseball,
00:45but Ron, Keith, and Gary are absolutely fantastic.
00:48And it's always going to get the great perspective of Ron Darling,
00:51give you a feel about Nolan McClain, state of the Mets,
00:53and David Stearns in terms of as pitchers and catchers,
00:56we're about a month away.
00:58I'm with you.
00:58Lots to talk about and looking forward to doing it all with you, Mark.
01:02And Ron Darling coming up next on the show,
01:05if you stick with me and with Mark Malousis,
01:09a great New York sportscaster, we'll be back.
01:17All right, Mark, I'm excited to get into this with you.
01:20There's a lot going on and maybe not going on with one of our teams.
01:24I'm concerned.
01:25Let's tackle the Mets first.
01:27That's the team I'm really concerned about.
01:29What do you think is going on?
01:31Obviously, they lost Diaz.
01:32They lost Alonzo.
01:34They're working on Tucker now.
01:36I'm not sure he fits.
01:37Obviously, he's a great player.
01:39I've got questions about their plan,
01:43that they're now going to have another $50 million right fielder
01:47who bats left-handed.
01:48Wouldn't it have been easier just to bring back Alonzo
01:51and bring back Diaz?
01:53I mean, they weren't even close on Alonzo,
01:55so that's kind of a pipe for him to even think of that.
01:57But, I mean, how do you let Diaz go, too?
01:59Yeah, the Diaz one.
02:00I mean, John, the Diaz one makes little to no sense.
02:03I mean, to begin that negotiating tactic
02:05when you have the richest singular owner in all of Major League Baseball
02:08and then that insult to injury ends up with the Los Angeles Dodgers
02:11who've won back-to-back World Series
02:13who had a dying need for a back-end to the reliever,
02:17and they get one of the best in the game,
02:18if not at his best, at his peak, is the best in the game.
02:22Yeah, I'm concerned about the Mets.
02:24And, John, you hear it.
02:25I hear it in terms of the Met fan as well,
02:28that they're concerned about where this organization is going
02:31and the direction of this team.
02:32And I really think the failure of the Mets on the field in 2025
02:35opened the door for the president, David Stearns,
02:38to kind of mold this team as he sees fit.
02:41And the Alonzo stuff, yes, I don't disagree.
02:44It's going to be strange seeing Pete in a Baltimore Oriole uniform
02:47this upcoming season after, you know,
02:49what he has accomplished here in New York with the Mets.
02:51But, you know, if they weren't all in a year ago,
02:54now another year older,
02:55I don't think Alonzo was ever going to get that long-term deal,
02:58and I'm glad Alonzo was able to get that.
03:00Good guy, really productive, plays all the time,
03:03and now lands in a very hitter-friendly ballpark
03:07down in Camden Yards.
03:08As far as the Mets now is,
03:10I think Stearns has painted himself into a corner.
03:12So, you know, they're in on Tucker with the, you know,
03:15AAV right around $50 million.
03:17They need bats.
03:18They need offensive.
03:19They could talk about going out there
03:21and being a run prevention team.
03:23Well, they're starting rotation,
03:24you can call into question as well,
03:26and just how defensive-minded is this team going to be?
03:28So we went from a lineup a year ago
03:30that was going to be the driving force,
03:32and they were kind of defined by inability
03:34to get the clutch hit at a big moment.
03:36You know, Lindor, Soto, maybe some chemistry issues.
03:39Nimmo, you look at Alonzo,
03:40was better last year than he was in 2024
03:43during the regular season.
03:45But now if you're going to go,
03:47okay, we're going to be a defensive-minded team,
03:49that's great.
03:50Well, the starting rotation,
03:52you've got questions there as well.
03:53So I think the interest in Tucker
03:55is trying to get a short-term deal,
03:57high AAV.
03:59You've got the owner in Steve Cohen
04:00that's willing to financially back you,
04:02but there's still more work to be done here
04:04for David Stearns,
04:05and they are far away away
04:07from the class of the National League
04:08and really the class of Major League Baseball
04:10when you look at the Dodgers.
04:11I'm glad you mentioned Tucker.
04:12I mean, that's really the story.
04:13As we do this here on January 14th,
04:16it has now come out
04:17that they've offered $50 million per year
04:20on a short-term deal.
04:21We know the Dodgers and the Blue Jays are in.
04:24I mean, is this a good idea
04:26just because we need great players on this team?
04:29Or, I mean, am I crazy?
04:31I don't see that.
04:32Was this their plan
04:34to get another $50 million left-handed?
04:36If they get him,
04:38they now have three left-handed
04:39hitting outfielders starting.
04:40I'm assuming Benj, who's a phenom,
04:42is going to be the center fielder.
04:43They're certainly hinting that way.
04:46Beatty is left-handed.
04:48Lindor is better left-handed.
04:50To me, the team tilts left-handed.
04:54And to add $50 million in this way
04:55when you have so many pitching holes,
04:58I mean, it feels like they have
04:59half a bullpen to me.
05:00So many questions.
05:01I feel great about Nolan McClain.
05:04Peterson is solid.
05:06But right now,
05:07there's a lot of questions
05:08on that pitching staff.
05:09And there are pitchers available.
05:11I mean, is this the right direction?
05:13I know fans think,
05:14oh, he's got $25 billion.
05:17He can run the thing up.
05:18He's not going to take it
05:19where he's going to lose $500 million a year.
05:21There's a limit to this, right?
05:23No, there is a limit.
05:24No, you ask the question,
05:25do I think this was his plan from the get-go?
05:27No.
05:27I mean, if I had to venture a guess, John,
05:29I would probably say that no,
05:31getting in on Tucker here is not.
05:32And Tucker's got the options.
05:34If he wants the long-term deal,
05:35it's the Toronto Blue Jays.
05:37The short-term deal,
05:38it seems to be a battle
05:38between the Mets and the Dodgers, right?
05:40So if you're the Mets
05:41and you're in the battle
05:42with the Los Angeles Dodgers
05:43in terms of a short-term deal,
05:45a high AAV,
05:46well, then you might have to
05:48blow Kyle Tucker out of the water
05:49with that AAV
05:50as compared to the Los Angeles Dodgers.
05:52Are they doing that?
05:52Yeah.
05:53With $60 million?
05:53I would imagine, right,
05:55I would imagine.
05:56I hope that's blowing them out of the water.
05:57That could be $60 million, are they?
05:58Yeah, John,
05:59I would imagine it is, right?
06:00But you've got to go out there
06:01and play that game
06:02because the Dodgers are right now
06:03the class of Major League Baseball.
06:04Do I think
06:05he probably had a more creative way
06:07to replicate the production
06:09in the aggregate
06:10after, you know,
06:11trading away Nimmo,
06:12losing Alonzo,
06:13trading away McNeil?
06:14Yeah, I think he probably did
06:15and maybe those plans fell apart
06:17when you're looking at David Stern.
06:18So now you have a player
06:19of the caliber of Tucker
06:21that's sitting out there
06:21and I don't disagree with you.
06:23Listen, he would be a perfect fit
06:24if he was a right-handed bat.
06:26He's not, right?
06:27But are you going to say to yourself,
06:29okay, well,
06:29he's still a quality Major Leaguer.
06:31I think, you know,
06:32the concern you'd have about Tucker
06:34is the one thing
06:35you give Alonzo credit for.
06:36He was always available, right?
06:38He always played, right?
06:40He didn't miss games.
06:41The issue with Kyle Tucker is
06:42Kyle Tucker historically,
06:44whether it be with Houston
06:45or whether it be Chicago,
06:47Kyle Tucker misses games.
06:48And that's the other issue
06:50you have with Tucker as well.
06:51Yeah, the last couple of years
06:52he definitely did miss games.
06:56My other issue with him
06:57is there's a big market, right?
06:59We don't know.
06:59We don't know him.
07:00He was in Houston.
07:02It's not a small market,
07:03but it's not New York.
07:04It was in Chicago.
07:05I mean, the Cubs
07:07weren't going to spend
07:08the kind of money
07:08to bring him back anyway.
07:09So I don't want to draw
07:10too many conclusions,
07:11but they didn't really try
07:12to bring him back.
07:15You know, he's still out there.
07:16They're not trying.
07:17They signed Bregman.
07:17That's going to be
07:18their big signing.
07:20You know, yeah,
07:21I don't think this is their plan.
07:22Do you think this is Steve's plan?
07:24I mean, we're guessing.
07:24We don't know.
07:25They're not confiding in us,
07:26but it feels like
07:27he was letting David run it
07:28and now it's maybe Steve's plan
07:30because, you know,
07:32the fans are not happy.
07:33I know the fans are with you.
07:35Tucker is great
07:36and they'd like to see
07:38Tucker sign now.
07:39And I get it if you're a fan.
07:41But, you know,
07:42do you think Steve is now,
07:44and we're guessing
07:46based on the history here,
07:47we don't know for sure,
07:48but this does not seem
07:50like David Stearns' plan
07:52at all, ever.
07:53No, no, it doesn't.
07:55No, no, it doesn't, right?
07:56But that's the kind of the,
07:57I mean, John,
07:58and you've talked about this,
07:59like when you look at
08:00the combination of,
08:01you know, David Stearns
08:02and what he was able to do
08:03with a lot with a little out of Milwaukee
08:04and then bringing him here to New York
08:06and then obviously now,
08:08you know, he gets to,
08:09you know, he's got Scrooge McDuck
08:10that owns the team, right?
08:11He's got an unbelievable amount of money
08:13when you look at Steve Cohen.
08:14I say that in glowing terms, right?
08:15And who wasn't a fan of DuckTales
08:17when they were growing up, right?
08:18So you look at it
08:19and I think now,
08:22you know, Steve called out,
08:23the owner of the Mets
08:24called out the Met fan
08:25the previous year in 2024.
08:27The Met fan showed out
08:28in droves in 25.
08:29He knows he needs to have
08:30a competitive team on the field,
08:32you know, for the fans
08:33to show up at Citi Field, right?
08:35He's already going to build around it.
08:36We all know that.
08:37I don't think that,
08:38and Steve wants to win.
08:40I mean, when you look at it,
08:41he bought this team,
08:41he wants to win.
08:42I have no driving force.
08:44He's won at life.
08:45So you look at Tucker,
08:46the one benefit would be
08:48that I would say that
08:49of him coming to New York
08:50is he's not going to be
08:51the biggest star on the team.
08:53That is going to be Soto
08:54and as long as Lindor is still here.
08:56So he gets to fly
08:57under the radar a little bit,
08:58similar to the way
08:59he was able to fly
08:59under the radar
09:00down in Houston, right?
09:01Because that was Altuve's team, right?
09:03And it was Springer's team
09:04and it was Correa's team, right?
09:06So it was never really his team.
09:08He can, even if with the high AV,
09:10say he signs with the Mets,
09:11he's making $50 million a year.
09:12He's still not going to be Juan Soto
09:14and he's still not going to be
09:15Francisco Lindor and not going to be
09:17the mouthpiece to the New York Mets.
09:19So that might help him a little bit
09:21if he signs that short-term deal,
09:23high AV coming in here
09:25to provide the offense
09:26that really, honestly, John,
09:27when you look at this lineup,
09:28they really need.
09:29I mean, they do.
09:31I mean, you know,
09:31Vientos is a question mark.
09:33Beatty is a question mark.
09:34You look at it,
09:35Alvarez behind home plate,
09:36what version of Alvarez
09:37are you going to get?
09:38A lot of offenses left the room
09:40and consistent offense
09:41when you look at it.
09:42So even though they want to be
09:43a run prevention team
09:45and more defensive-minded,
09:47you still need to score runs
09:49and Kyle Tucker can certainly
09:50help the Mets do that.
09:52Fair enough.
09:52Maybe you're convincing me.
09:54They definitely need offense as well.
09:56I just think it feels like
09:57they have half of a bullpen
09:59and the rotation has got
10:01even more questions
10:02than the lineup.
10:05Anything in your mind,
10:06you know, the free agents
10:07who are out there,
10:08you know, the pitching guys,
10:09trade guys who are out there,
10:10whether it be Scooble or Peralta
10:12or Gore, free agency.
10:15They're Frambois Valdez
10:16who's got a long history.
10:17I know they're suggesting
10:19he's like just like Max Freed,
10:21but, you know,
10:21it's getting late.
10:22I don't know, you know,
10:23if anyone's getting $218 million
10:25from the pitching standpoint
10:26at this point.
10:27You've got Ranger Suarez
10:29who's been really good
10:30in the playoffs,
10:31as has Frambois for the Astros.
10:34Yeah.
10:34Suarez for the Phillies
10:35is Zach Allen.
10:36There are a lot of guys out there.
10:37Where would you go?
10:39And, you know,
10:40if you sign Tucker
10:40and then we start naming
10:42all these guys
10:42that they're going to get,
10:43they're going to end up
10:45being over $400 million again.
10:47I know he gave them a budget
10:48of around $340 to $350,
10:49and it's clear
10:51that he's ready
10:52to blow right through it.
10:54Yeah, true.
10:55I mean, number one,
10:57if, okay,
10:57so say they get Tucker.
10:59If I'm looking
11:00at the pitching market
11:01and, you know,
11:02the reports out of Milwaukee,
11:03John,
11:03are that, you know,
11:04they want to, you know,
11:05establish ready
11:06or everyday, you know,
11:07guys that can help
11:09the Milwaukee Brewers
11:10in the here and now
11:10in 2026.
11:11Well, I think I've got that
11:13if I'm the Mets, right?
11:14If I build up my farm system,
11:16you know,
11:16and I'm looking to try and win,
11:17then I'm willing to deal
11:18from that farm system.
11:19Just look at the Los Angeles Dodgers.
11:21They deal from their farm system
11:22every single year.
11:23They have no issue with it
11:24because they're trying to win, right?
11:25So it's okay to have,
11:27it's okay to have prospects
11:28and fans love prospects,
11:30but more often than not,
11:3270%, 60% of the time,
11:33the prospects don't end up
11:34turning out to be
11:35what you envision them being
11:36when they're coming up
11:37through the farm system.
11:38So Peralta would be
11:40at the top of my list
11:41in terms of guys that,
11:42you know,
11:42are in free agency right now.
11:44You know,
11:44I'd wait on Scooble
11:45to see when he hits free agency
11:47a year from now.
11:48You know,
11:48if we have baseball
11:49a year from now,
11:50given the uncertainty
11:51and the new CBA
11:53and negotiations
11:53between the Players Association
11:55and the owners.
11:56In terms of guys
11:57that are sitting out there,
11:58a ranger Suarez
11:58and would be
12:00at the top of my list.
12:01You know,
12:02I'm familiar with him.
12:04Obviously,
12:04he's pitched in big games.
12:06I don't know
12:06if it's necessarily
12:07going to cost me
12:07an arm and a leg.
12:08Frambois Valdez
12:09would be another one
12:10that would be intriguing,
12:11but I'd pursue
12:12making a trade with Milwaukee
12:14and trying to get Peralta
12:15from the Brewers.
12:16Well,
12:17you're not going to give
12:17him McLean, right?
12:19No,
12:19it's not going to be McLean.
12:20Would you give him Tong?
12:21I would give him Tong.
12:23Yeah, I would.
12:24And listen,
12:24I understand that Jonah
12:25was probably called up
12:27last year
12:27for more a case
12:28because they were desperate
12:31and they needed him
12:32rather than he fully developed
12:33down in the minor leagues.
12:34But, John,
12:35you've got to give to get.
12:36You really do.
12:38This is not a case
12:39where you're going to
12:39give up a little
12:40and get a lot.
12:40If you're looking
12:41to try and win
12:42and compete with the big boys,
12:43well,
12:43you understand what that is
12:45and where that direction is
12:46and you're trying to compete
12:47with the Los Angeles Dodgers.
12:48Just in the National League alone,
12:51yeah,
12:51I'd give up Jonah Tong.
12:53I would not give up McLean.
12:54McLean, to me,
12:54is untouchable
12:55based on what we saw
12:56a year ago.
12:58He looks like
12:58he is going to be
12:59an absolute superstar
13:01and a top-end
13:02to the rotation star.
13:03No, you can't.
13:04No, not for one year.
13:05He's untouchable.
13:06I'm with him on that.
13:07He's untouchable.
13:08They say Benj is untouchable.
13:10I'll take their word for it.
13:11We haven't seen Benj yet,
13:12but apparently he's a phenom.
13:14I'm with you.
13:15I mean, I like Tong.
13:16I think he's going to be very good.
13:19That's a lot.
13:20But I would probably do that, too.
13:22Peralta,
13:23plus he's only making $8 million.
13:24I don't know if Steve cares about that,
13:26but probably a plus.
13:28Let's turn it over
13:29to the other team right now.
13:30I'm not as concerned about them.
13:31I see people on social media
13:33killing them, too.
13:34That's what people do
13:35on social media.
13:36I mean, the Yankees
13:37did win 94 games.
13:39They are talking to Bellinger.
13:40They've done a lot of little things
13:42around the margins.
13:43They just brought in David Weathers,
13:44so they got another starter,
13:45a lefty.
13:47You know,
13:47I'm not that concerned about them.
13:50What are your thoughts on them?
13:50The Bellinger numbers
13:51are kind of out there, right?
13:52We know it's a five-year offer,
13:54around 31 a year,
13:56maybe 32 a year.
13:57They're willing to do
13:59some things around it.
14:00Oh, you're right.
14:03Ryan Weathers.
14:03My Tommy Hogan mentioned,
14:06I guess,
14:06did I call him David Weathers?
14:08David Weathers.
14:08I love David Weathers
14:09as a reliever.
14:09He's good.
14:10I know.
14:11I can do that with Mark Leiter
14:13and Mark Leiter Jr.
14:14I can't do that with,
14:15thank you, Tommy.
14:17Anyway,
14:17they got a picture.
14:18They've done some things
14:19around the margins.
14:20They haven't done a ton
14:23at this point.
14:24We know what's going on
14:25with Bellinger.
14:26Would you bring Bellinger back?
14:27And is that enough?
14:28I think the fans are going to say
14:29it's the same team.
14:30How can they,
14:31I mean,
14:31it was a good team.
14:32They didn't perform
14:33when they got against Toronto.
14:34They did win 94 games.
14:36You'd like to see them
14:37do something a little different,
14:39probably, too.
14:41What would you do?
14:42Well,
14:42where,
14:42like,
14:43yeah,
14:43it's like rolling it back
14:45and expecting a similar result.
14:46Look at that.
14:47I would never give Bellinger
14:48seven-year contract
14:50and, like,
14:50five years,
14:51okay,
14:52like,
14:52and he was a really,
14:53he was really good
14:54as a Yankee a year ago,
14:55John.
14:55I mean,
14:55he had 29 home runs,
14:5698 RBIs,
14:58hit for an average,
14:59was a plus defender.
15:00You could stick him
15:00into a lot of positions.
15:02I think the throw
15:03against the Mets
15:04was a turning point,
15:05you know,
15:06out at Citi Field
15:07during the course
15:07of the regular season
15:08where he doubled
15:09the guy off first base.
15:10I mean,
15:10he was just,
15:11he's a great player
15:12and fit the Yankees
15:14to an absolute T
15:14and I think that's
15:16the right player,
15:17right ballpark,
15:17left-handed power,
15:19you know,
15:19and it's always
15:20going to play,
15:21whether it be
15:21the old stadium
15:22or whether it's
15:22going to be
15:22the new stadium.
15:24I think that works.
15:25I really do,
15:26but the mindset
15:27of the Yankees
15:27has also got to change too.
15:29Yes,
15:29they've won 94 games.
15:30Yes,
15:30I know there are people
15:31going to be,
15:32well,
15:32there are teams
15:32that don't make
15:33the playoffs
15:33every single year,
15:34so Yankees used
15:36to be defined
15:36by championships.
15:37Now they equate
15:38success a little bit
15:39differently from
15:39an organizational perspective,
15:40which is fine,
15:41but you look at this group,
15:43are they all of a sudden
15:44going to be better
15:45situationally?
15:46Are they all of a sudden
15:46going to be better
15:47defensively?
15:47Are they going to be
15:48better on the base pass?
15:49You can get rid of
15:50the base running coach
15:51all you want,
15:52but are they going to
15:52play smart,
15:53heady baseball?
15:54Because at times
15:54last year,
15:55you didn't necessarily
15:56see that from the Yankees.
15:57Like, you know,
15:58you guys interviewed,
15:59you and Joel interviewed
15:59Buck Martinez
16:00during the regular season,
16:01right?
16:01Toronto ended up
16:02getting the last laugh.
16:03The Yankees don't
16:04generate a lot of offense
16:05if they don't hit the ball
16:06over the fence,
16:07right?
16:07That's also got to change.
16:08And I get we're in
16:09today's day and age
16:10of baseball where it's
16:11all about velocity
16:12and relievers
16:13and you're not going
16:14through a lineup
16:14for a third time
16:17something to be said
16:18about being a good
16:19situational hitting team
16:20as well.
16:21And the Yankees
16:21necessarily weren't that
16:22as a team in 2025,
16:25even with them winning
16:2694 games in the regular
16:27season,
16:27like that mindset
16:28needs to change.
16:29So if you're a Yankee
16:30fan that goes out
16:31to the stadium
16:32time and time again,
16:33John,
16:33you wanted to see
16:34some kind of like
16:35kind of,
16:35you know,
16:35this has got to change.
16:37This has got to,
16:37you know,
16:38it's got to be better
16:38kind of a moment
16:39and you haven't seen it yet.
16:41You haven't seen much
16:42this offseason
16:43from Major League Baseball
16:44in terms of movement,
16:45but you certainly
16:45haven't seen that
16:46from the Yankees
16:46they need to do
16:47something.
16:48Bellinger has got to
16:49be back
16:49and he's got to
16:50be a part of it.
16:51I mean,
16:51because if they end
16:52up losing him,
16:52which I don't think
16:53they end up will,
16:54but if they end up
16:55losing him,
16:56I mean,
16:56that is a massive gap
16:58that they have to
16:59close in that
16:59everyday lineup
17:00because they've got
17:01a lot of guys
17:01on that team,
17:02whether it be
17:02Stanton,
17:02whether it be
17:03Rice,
17:03obviously Jason
17:04Dominguez
17:05that are better
17:05suited as DHs
17:07than everyday
17:08position players.
17:09Yeah,
17:10I mean,
17:11it feels like
17:12they're making
17:13some progress
17:13with Bellinger,
17:14but of course
17:14it felt that way
17:15with Bregman
17:16and the Red Sox
17:17and he ended up
17:17getting a better
17:18deal elsewhere.
17:19So in free agency,
17:20you just never know
17:22what's going to happen.
17:23It feels like
17:24it probably will go
17:25back to the Yankees,
17:26but not,
17:27you know,
17:27there's certainly
17:28no guarantee.
17:29Is there anything
17:30else you'd think
17:31maybe they could do
17:32because even if
17:33they bring him back,
17:34it's virtually the same
17:35team.
17:36They did add
17:36Ryan Weathers.
17:37I'm going to get
17:37the name right.
17:38I'm going to say it
17:38now to get it right.
17:40But they bring back
17:41Rosario.
17:42They signed other guys.
17:43They brought back
17:44Hill for the bullpen.
17:46You know,
17:47I think they're a little
17:48short in the bullpen.
17:50I'd like to see
17:51another.
17:51It feels like their
17:51location is in
17:52pretty good shape now,
17:54but I mean,
17:55we still got guys
17:56like Suarez and Gallin
17:57and Fran Bervaldez
18:00who are out there.
18:02You know,
18:02I don't know
18:03that they're going
18:03to really run up
18:04the tab.
18:05That's a little
18:06different with the
18:07Yankees.
18:07They talk a lot more
18:08about the budget
18:10than they do
18:11with the Mets.
18:12You know,
18:13what do you think?
18:13Is there something
18:14else you'd like to see
18:15them do?
18:15Listen,
18:16I thought Diaz
18:18would have,
18:18and now it's kind
18:19of water under
18:19the bridge.
18:20I thought Diaz
18:20would have been
18:21a perfect fit
18:21for the Yankees,
18:22the Dodgers.
18:24How many team
18:24I'm signing Diaz?
18:25Yeah,
18:26I'm with you.
18:26The Braves were in.
18:27Yeah,
18:28I mean,
18:28Diaz is sitting out
18:29there and when
18:30he's at his best,
18:31he's the best
18:31reliever in the game
18:32and he's sitting
18:33out there.
18:33He ends up
18:33with the Los Angeles
18:34Dodgers.
18:35And John,
18:35there wasn't that
18:36long ago where
18:36the Yankees used
18:37to stack former
18:38closers in the
18:39back end of their
18:40bullpen where,
18:40you know,
18:416th,
18:417th,
18:428th,
18:42and 9th inning,
18:43you had guys
18:44that were throwing
18:44in.
18:44They used to be
18:45closers on other
18:46teams and you're
18:46not getting that
18:47now when you're
18:48looking at the
18:49Yankees.
18:50And Diaz,
18:50to me,
18:51would have been a
18:51guy that would
18:52have been a
18:52home run signing.
18:54Oh, man.
18:55Yeah,
18:55I don't know.
18:55Are the Yankees
18:56polite?
18:56I don't know.
18:57They lost Soto to
18:57the Mets.
18:58They didn't have
18:58to be so polite.
18:59I'm with you.
19:00That's a great idea.
19:01It's a little late.
19:02No, it's a little
19:03late.
19:03I didn't think of it
19:04then, but it's
19:06playing a million a
19:07year.
19:08You know,
19:08I don't know if
19:09maybe he's a little
19:10more interested in
19:11the Dodgers.
19:12He's still
19:12National League.
19:13They've won the
19:13World Series the
19:14last two years.
19:15But I don't know.
19:17I thought Diaz is
19:19fantastic, you know,
19:20and it's certainly
19:21entertaining.
19:22And it would have
19:23been really, you
19:24know, I don't know,
19:25have Timmy Trumpet
19:26playing against the
19:27Mets in a Subway
19:29Series game.
19:31I don't know.
19:31The Yankees are
19:32very nice, polite.
19:34I mean, one thing
19:34about Howell is he's
19:35a lot more polite
19:36than George is.
19:38But I mean, they
19:38haven't won for,
19:39it's been a decade
19:40and a half since
19:40they won.
19:41I'd like to see
19:42them step on the
19:43gas a little bit.
19:44Well, I would
19:45agree with you.
19:45I'm doing Bellinger
19:46and we're going to
19:47sign Valdez or
19:48and we're going to
19:49sign Suarez or
19:50or Bichette.
19:51I mean, you throw
19:52him out there as
19:53well.
19:53I mean, like,
19:54yeah, I mean
19:54something right.
19:56And I'm with you
19:56on the bullpen
19:57that one of the
19:58underrated great
19:59parts of those
20:00championship teams
20:01of the 90s was
20:02that bullpen.
20:03Certainly when you
20:04had Wetland and
20:04Rivera, but other
20:06years you have
20:07Stanton and Nelson
20:08and they were all
20:10great.
20:10Their bullpens
20:11were the best.
20:12Of course, they
20:12also had, you
20:13know, Clemens,
20:14Pettit, Cohn,
20:15you know, El Duque.
20:17They had the best
20:18rotation as well.
20:19And you had Derek
20:19Jeter, which is a
20:20huge plus.
20:22To me, an
20:23underrated great
20:25player.
20:26But to me, the
20:28bullpen, you've got
20:29certain guys who I
20:30know that the
20:31bullpen is tricky
20:32and there aren't
20:33guys that do it
20:34year after year.
20:35Diaz is one of
20:36those guys.
20:36So I love that
20:37idea by you.
20:38Well, yeah, Diaz
20:39would have been
20:39great back end.
20:40I mean, you hit
20:41upon it.
20:41I mean, I think
20:41the back end of
20:42the bullpens needs
20:43to be addressed if
20:44you're Brian Cashman.
20:45I mean, I do.
20:46And listen, I'd
20:47still continue to
20:48kind of flirt with
20:49Bichette.
20:50I really would.
20:51And, you know,
20:52it's been, you
20:53know, you've
20:53reported many
20:54people have, you
20:54know, talked
20:55about the fact
20:55of floating out
20:56the idea of
20:56moving on from
20:57Jazz Chisholm,
20:58even though he
20:59presents something
21:00the Yankees don't
21:00have coming off a
21:0130-30 season a
21:02year ago with the
21:04athleticism and
21:04obviously the
21:05ability to go out
21:06there and steal a
21:06base.
21:07But if you don't
21:08want to sign him to
21:09a contract extension
21:10or whatever it
21:11might be, or you
21:11think that might be
21:12an issue in that
21:13Yankee clubhouse,
21:14then, you know,
21:14Bichette would be a
21:15guy who is obviously
21:16defensively no longer
21:17a shortstop, would
21:18be, you know, very
21:19open to the idea of
21:20playing second base.
21:22You know, but you
21:22still get the same
21:23questions, right?
21:24You got the
21:24questions, McMahon,
21:25wonderful defensive
21:26third baseman.
21:27What exactly are you
21:28going to get from
21:28him offensively?
21:29What exactly is
21:30Anthony Volpe as an
21:31everyday player?
21:32Jason Dominguez
21:33looks like more of a
21:34DH than anything
21:35else, and clearly
21:35he's not the same,
21:37you know, better one
21:37side of the plate than
21:38the other, but not
21:39nearly the offensive
21:40player that you
21:41thought he was going
21:41to be when he was
21:42a prospect coming
21:43up through the
21:43Yankee farm system.
21:44Grisham ran to
21:45signing that
21:46arbitration deal
21:47when the Yankees
21:48offered him arbitration.
21:48I can't blame him.
21:49Yeah, I don't
21:49blame him.
21:50You know, I was
21:53out there saying
21:53don't give it to
21:55him, don't take a
21:56chance.
21:57You know, to me
21:58it would have been
21:58more obvious to
21:59make sure to bring
22:00Bellinger back, but
22:02now I guess in a way
22:03they're a little
22:03covered.
22:04He did it the most
22:04home runs of any
22:05center fielder last
22:06year, but, you
22:07know, $22 million,
22:10he was making five.
22:11That's a 400%
22:13raise.
22:14Right.
22:14That is a huge
22:15jump.
22:16That is a huge
22:16raise.
22:17No doubt.
22:18We'd all like that
22:19kind of raise.
22:20Okay, 4%.
22:21Forget the 440.
22:23All right.
22:23Right.
22:24Mark, it's great
22:25talking to you, Mets,
22:26Yankees, everything.
22:28We're going to have a
22:28great Mets and a great
22:30analyst who's going to
22:31analyze everything for
22:32us, mostly the Mets
22:34though.
22:34They're the ones who
22:35need the analysis
22:36right now more than
22:36anything.
22:37Ron Darling, one of
22:39our most frequent
22:39and favorite guests
22:41coming up next on
22:43the show with John
22:44Heyman and special
22:45co-host Mark
22:46Belousis.
22:51All right.
22:52Now we're going to
22:53welcome in Ron
22:54Darling, who is, if
22:55not the best baseball
22:56analyst going, certainly
22:58one of the best, part
22:59of the Gary, Keith
23:00and Ron trio.
23:02That's one of the
23:02best booths.
23:03I'm sorry, Michael, one
23:05of our featured frequent
23:08guests, but it's the
23:10truth.
23:10It is a fantastic booth
23:12that they have with the
23:13Mets, and he was a
23:14terrific pitcher in the
23:16Mets Hall of Fame.
23:17Ron Darling, welcome
23:18in.
23:18We have Mark Belousis
23:19here to join us to
23:21figure out what's going
23:22on with the Mets,
23:24particularly the Mets
23:24and also the Yankees.
23:26But welcome, Ron.
23:27Hi, guys.
23:28How are you?
23:28I'm so happy that Mark's
23:29here.
23:30Where's Joel?
23:31Joel on the road.
23:31You know what?
23:34Joel told me he's in
23:35Lancaster.
23:36I don't know if he's
23:36joining the Amish or
23:38what he's doing out
23:38there, but he told me
23:39he's vacationing.
23:40It sounds like vacation
23:41in Lancaster.
23:42I think he was on a
23:43horse and buggy.
23:44I don't know.
23:45Maybe he's giving this
23:46up.
23:46I don't know.
23:47If so, we'll have
23:48Mark full-time, but
23:49he's here for today, and
23:51I'm thrilled to have
23:52him.
23:53I mean, Joel is...
23:54You've been on many
23:55times, and we really
23:56appreciate all the
23:57insight that you do
23:58bring.
23:59I've got to start with
24:00the Mets.
24:01It's out there.
24:02They're offering Kyle
24:04Tucker $50 million.
24:05I'm on record.
24:06I think he's a great
24:07player.
24:09You know, not the
24:10second-best player in
24:11baseball, as this
24:12contract would suggest,
24:13but a great player.
24:14But they already have a
24:16$50 million right fielder.
24:17I don't know.
24:18Can they find room for
24:20Kyle Tucker on the
24:20Mets?
24:21Well, certainly they can
24:22find room whenever
24:23you're that kind of
24:24player.
24:25You know, when I think
24:27of Tucker, there's not
24:28much, not many places
24:30you can find negatives,
24:31okay?
24:32He's a 30-30 guy.
24:34I think last year he
24:35had a north of 140 OPS
24:37plus as a player in a
24:40season that wasn't
24:41perfect for him.
24:42It was kind of up and
24:43down.
24:44So it tells you the kind
24:45of player he is.
24:46The only thing that
24:48would alarm me is that
24:50he's only played,
24:52what, 214 out of the
24:54last 324 games?
24:57That's something.
24:58I know a lot of the
24:58injuries are just kind
24:59of those injuries that
25:02you don't count on.
25:04You know, they're not
25:04debilitating shoulder or
25:06knees or something like
25:07that.
25:08But still, you know,
25:10you're paying the guy
25:11$50 million.
25:12You're hoping for 150
25:13games.
25:14So he would fit their
25:16lineup.
25:16They certainly could use
25:17a right-handed bat as
25:19well.
25:19But, you know, it's
25:21getting late in the
25:22season.
25:23And are you going to
25:26make a move for an
25:27established major league
25:28player?
25:29Or are you going to
25:30count on some young
25:31people that have been
25:33rated high in the
25:36minor leagues?
25:37So that's the fence I
25:39think David Cerns is
25:40trying to figure out.
25:42You know, Rob, when you
25:43look at the way that
25:44this offseason has gone
25:45for the Mets, the
25:46concern that you've
25:47heard from Mets fans
25:49and I know the
25:50offseason, even
25:50though, as you
25:51mentioned, it's
25:51getting late, it's
25:52not over yet.
25:53Do you think the Mets
25:54fan has every right to
25:55be concerned about the
25:56direction of where this
25:57team is going right now?
25:58You know, I think
26:00they're very sensitive
26:00and raw, you know, and
26:02the reason I say that,
26:04you know, you don't
26:05lose an Alonzo, Diaz,
26:09McNeil, and Nimmo.
26:10I know around the league
26:12maybe that doesn't feel
26:14like a huge hit, but
26:17for Mets fans who come
26:19to watch the games
26:19every day, those are
26:21four of their real
26:22favorite players.
26:24And, you know, that's
26:25what fans are all
26:26about.
26:27Yes, they want the
26:28team to win.
26:29They want them to win
26:30the World Series and
26:30all of those things.
26:31Every fan base wants
26:32that.
26:33But they also want
26:34likable players that
26:35they can root for.
26:35And that certainly was
26:38the case.
26:39I had to do a show
26:40the other night on
26:41Major League Baseball
26:42Network, and a lot of
26:43Mets fans were upset at
26:46me because I said on
26:47the show, kiddingly,
26:49obviously I'm not
26:50for humor, that I
26:51wasn't going to talk
26:52about the Mets.
26:53I meant that because
26:54every show I do here,
26:55I've become the
26:56authority on the Mets.
26:57And can I tell you,
26:58I know very little
27:00about the Mets in the
27:01postseason.
27:02I find it's my job to
27:04worry from April to
27:06the end of September.
27:07That's my job.
27:08So I don't worry
27:10about it as much.
27:11But I do know for
27:12fans, which makes them
27:14sensitive and raw, is
27:15when they lose players
27:16that they've rooted for
27:17for a long period of
27:18time.
27:19And that doesn't just
27:20go away right away.
27:21You mentioned the
27:22Mets in the postseason.
27:23They weren't in the
27:24postseason last year,
27:25as you know, winning
27:2583 games, tying with
27:27the Reds, a very
27:28disappointing season.
27:30I know that they think
27:31their team is as good
27:33or better now, and
27:34they point to their
27:35numbers that suggest
27:36they have an 87-win
27:37team, I guess, which
27:38probably gets you in
27:39the playoffs.
27:41Do you see hope here?
27:43Do you feel like this
27:44team is better, or is
27:45it better because they're
27:46going to go sign a
27:48bunch of guys?
27:49Yeah, I don't think
27:50personally, in my
27:51opinion, I don't think
27:51they're better right now,
27:52John.
27:53You know, what day are
27:54we, 11th or 12th of
27:55January, or whatever day
27:56we're at?
27:57What team?
27:58They're a better team
28:00than they were last
28:02season.
28:02And I don't know how
28:02you can make that
28:03argument, you know,
28:04losing a steady
28:05Nimmo, a versatile
28:08McNeil.
28:10Maybe you can make
28:11the argument the best
28:11closer in baseball in
28:12Diaz and Alonso with
28:14his 45-plus home run.
28:15So I certainly don't
28:16think they're better.
28:17That being said, there
28:18is still time to make
28:22some significant moves.
28:23I mean, literally, if
28:24you signed a big free
28:26agent, whether it's
28:27Bellinger or Tucker, you
28:28traded for a Freddy
28:30Peralta, let's say, if
28:32you added two of those
28:34three players, I think
28:36Mets them would be very
28:37happy.
28:38Ron, when chemistry has
28:40been talked about a lot
28:41in terms of looking back
28:43on last year, right?
28:44And you could also look
28:45at the starting pitching,
28:46right?
28:46There wasn't enough,
28:47right?
28:48And we saw that.
28:48And they've gotten rid
28:49of coaches and Mendoza
28:50remains, but a lot of
28:52people have made issues
28:53in terms of the chemistry
28:54in that clubhouse.
28:56How big of an issue was
28:58that?
28:58Or do you think it's a
28:59case of, you know, they
29:00didn't win enough, that
29:02doesn't bring people
29:03together, the pitching
29:04wasn't there, you know,
29:05how big of an issue do
29:06you think chemistry was
29:07in 2025?
29:09You know, Mark, I think
29:09it's all of those
29:10reasons.
29:10And I think one of the
29:11big problems was 2024
29:14was a magical season for
29:18that kind of clubhouse
29:20fun.
29:24You know, they just had
29:25one of those years where
29:26everything went right,
29:27right, the players on the
29:29team really got together.
29:31They had a couple of
29:31players on the team that
29:32ended up becoming kind of
29:34de facto coaches for the
29:36team.
29:37And by the end, every time
29:40they needed a big hit from
29:41a major or minor player on
29:43the team, they always got
29:44it.
29:45So it was one of those
29:45things when you juxtapose it
29:47to what happened last season,
29:49they feel like, boy, we took
29:51a real step backwards as far
29:53as that's concerned.
29:54But very rare that those
29:562024 seasons happen where
30:00everyone just gets along so
30:02well and, you know, the team
30:03is dancing on the field after
30:05a game by one of their
30:07players.
30:08That just does not happen.
30:10So I think 2025 really had to
30:13do more with performance on
30:14the field.
30:16You know, I know that the
30:18people that run the baseball
30:20operations with the Mets want
30:22to really limit runs.
30:25And the best way to limit
30:25runs, of course, is with
30:26really good pitching.
30:28Last year, they used, what,
30:2948 or 49 different pitchers
30:32over the course of the season.
30:33I don't know how that works.
30:35And they need the guys who are
30:38good pitchers to pitch up to
30:39their capabilities.
30:42And, you know, Sean Minaya,
30:43probably with his contract,
30:45probably leads that list.
30:46You know, he's got to be a guy
30:47that gives you 200 solid
30:50innings over the course of the
30:51year.
30:52And there's other guys as well.
30:54So the best way to prevent
30:55runs is the pitch better.
30:57And I think there was a time
30:58you guys watch the games as
31:00well.
31:01There was a time that each and
31:03every day a reliever was in
31:05in the fourth with them down
31:07for two guys on and trying to
31:10escape trouble.
31:10That game became Groundhog Day
31:14for the Mets each and every day.
31:16And they're going to have to
31:17find a way not to relive that.
31:20You mentioned de facto coaches.
31:22I think you referred to the
31:23songwriter Iglesias.
31:25I think he's another name as a
31:26songwriter.
31:27I don't recall what it was, but
31:28he was a lot of fun.
31:30And obviously, J.D.
31:30Martinez, I think, knows as much
31:33about hitting as almost any
31:34recent current player.
31:37And certainly, I think, helped
31:38with Vientos.
31:39And hopefully they'll get Vientos
31:40back going.
31:43You know, I know we're going to
31:44talk future here.
31:45And they do have some great
31:45young players.
31:46But I can't get out of my mind
31:48the Diaz situation.
31:50You know, I know people are
31:51going to say that I've complained
31:52more about Alonzo.
31:53That's not true.
31:54Diaz is the one.
31:55I do not get it.
31:56It's peanuts to me.
31:58I mean, it's not my money.
31:59Easy for me to say.
32:01He went for a three-year deal.
32:03You know, he was looking for
32:04five.
32:04They were offering three.
32:06It feels like they let him
32:07slip away.
32:08I don't think they wanted him to
32:09go.
32:09I mean, were they just playing
32:12too much hardball?
32:13Should they have tried at the
32:15very end?
32:16Did they have a shot at the
32:17very end?
32:17What do you think went on there
32:19with Diaz?
32:20Yeah, it's hard because, you
32:22know, we're not in the rooms
32:23trying to make those decisions,
32:24Sean.
32:24But I will tell you that I do
32:26think that's the one they wish
32:27they'd have back, that they
32:29mulliganed with.
32:30And the reason I say that is
32:31because there's not many great
32:33closers out there that can go
32:35multiple innings, as Diaz can, if
32:37you need it, can be unhittable
32:40at times.
32:41You want your relievers to come
32:43in and the ball not to be in
32:44play.
32:45No one's better than him at
32:47doing that.
32:48I think what happens, John, in
32:51this game today, we have so much
32:52information that we can really
32:55put a price tag on what we want
32:58to pay players, how long we want
33:00to pay it.
33:01But the factor is always going to
33:03be thus.
33:04If it's a free agent, those things
33:06change.
33:07They change by the second, they
33:08change by the minute.
33:10And I think what happens with
33:11Diaz is that I don't think
33:13they're wrong with a three-year
33:14contract for a closer, but it
33:16became a four-year situation.
33:18And, you know, I think if they
33:21had that to do back, to bring
33:24back, they certainly would have
33:25brought Diaz back.
33:27You know, I think that David
33:30Stearns and the Mets front office
33:32felt like Alonso was a kind of
33:35player, maybe not their kind of
33:37player.
33:37That's great.
33:38You know, this is the hard
33:39business of baseball.
33:40But Diaz is any teams closer.
33:44There's 30 teams that would have
33:45loved him.
33:45And also, at some point, trying to
33:49win the whole thing, right?
33:50So if you're trying to win the
33:52whole thing, then you have to beat
33:55the Dodgers.
33:55You've got to be better than the
33:57Dodgers.
33:57And for them to steal one of your
33:59big weapons, I think that's a,
34:01you'd hate to see that play out in
34:04late October.
34:05You know, Rob, I want to ask you
34:07about one of the starters that
34:08everyone's excited about, and that
34:09is Nolan McClain.
34:10You know, having been over at S&Y,
34:12talk baseball with you, be able to
34:14talk baseball with Bobby, pitching
34:15with Bobby Ojeda over the years.
34:18Like, you guys always talk about,
34:20yeah, velocity's good.
34:22It's all about movement.
34:23Um, and, and his pitch selection
34:25and the repertoire that he has
34:27and the movement that he has.
34:29Talk a little bit about, I can't
34:30wait to watch him for 30 plus
34:32starts in 2026 when you look at
34:34Nolan McClain.
34:35Yeah, you know, there's a, um,
34:36there's so much to like about
34:38Nolan.
34:38Um, first, the name, I mean, the
34:42second bite at the apple for the
34:44Mets with a guy named Nolan.
34:45So hopefully this lasts longer than
34:47the other one.
34:48Second, um, there's a toughness to
34:50that kid.
34:51You know, um, when I was
34:53when I see him walk around, he's
34:55serious.
34:55It's all business.
34:57And, um, you'd like to see that
34:59from, from your young athletes.
35:01Uh, third, when you see him in the
35:03locker room and he's got a t-shirt
35:05and shorts on and he's going out to
35:07do his running or whatever he's
35:08going to do, he doesn't look like a
35:09pitcher.
35:10He looks like a first baseman or, or,
35:13or a left fielder.
35:14He, he looks like an athlete and
35:16being an athlete, and we saw this
35:17with DeGrom, can go a long way in,
35:19in how you pitch, how you feel the
35:22pitches, how you, um, recuperate, how
35:25you are able to make an adjustment
35:27in one pitch.
35:29Um, all of that is great.
35:31And when I watch him pitch, and I
35:33know on today's game, uh, they really
35:36want their pitchers to have five or
35:38six amazing pitches.
35:40Most pitchers have three, uh, some
35:42have two, uh, but McLean really does
35:45have five or six different pitches
35:47that are all effective.
35:48And he reminds me a lot because
35:50he's not overly tall.
35:52I don't know how tall he is.
35:53Maybe I shorter than me.
35:54So, and I'm six four, so maybe six
35:56one or six two.
35:58Uh, but he reminds me a little of
36:00Coney when I first saw David
36:01come and David didn't have all the
36:04pitches that McLean have.
36:05But remember Coney through side
36:06arm, he had a couple, you know, a
36:08fastball and a slider from the side
36:10to go along with all his other
36:12pitches.
36:12So David was the most accomplished
36:15pitcher I ever saw at a young age
36:18with the ability to throw a lot of
36:19pitches for strikes until Nolan
36:21McLean.
36:23Ron, you are a great athlete as well.
36:25Great fielder.
36:26It does make a difference.
36:27Absolutely.
36:28And you would be a great, uh,
36:30pitching coach.
36:30Although I don't think you want to
36:32work 24 hours a day at this stage,
36:34uh, probably for less money.
36:36Uh, but as long as we have you
36:38talking about pitching, I'm, I'm
36:39very glad that he asked you about
36:40Nolan.
36:41Uh, what about Tom?
36:43I mean, he was basically unhittable
36:45at triple a it's triple a doesn't
36:47seem that far away from the majors.
36:49And then something different
36:51happened when he got to the majors.
36:53Some scouts are suggesting maybe
36:55needs more breaking ball and he's
36:57too much change up.
36:58I don't know.
36:58What is, what are your thoughts on
37:00him?
37:00And, and also, uh, they had
37:02Sprode as well, who looks like a
37:04fairly promising pitcher too.
37:06Well, the thing I hear from, uh,
37:08major league coaches and managers
37:10throughout the league is the same
37:13thing.
37:13The biggest jump in baseball is
37:16from triple a to the major leagues.
37:18So if we're going to use that as
37:20the F of the math equation, the
37:22given, right.
37:23Um, then you're going to have some
37:25guys that make the jump that kind
37:28of gets stalled a bit.
37:29Uh, Sprode, I thought was great.
37:31Um, he is a, uh, kind of a, a
37:34mini version of McLean in the sense
37:36that he's got a lot of pictures as
37:38well.
37:39Um, I don't think they're as
37:40overpowering as Nolan McLean's are,
37:43but, uh, I think he has a real
37:45promising future.
37:46Now for Tong, he's a guy that, um,
37:50jumped a couple of levels, um, was
37:52only a triple a for a short time.
37:54So never really had a, uh, the, the
37:56league didn't have a chance to maybe
37:58try to catch up to him.
37:59And he was brought to the major
38:00leagues, not because he was ready.
38:02He's brought to the major leagues
38:03because the Mets needed another arm
38:06to pitch late in the season.
38:07I think if they had their druthers,
38:09if they were a better team, he
38:11wouldn't have seen, uh, the big
38:12leagues and he would have had an
38:14outstanding minor league, um, season
38:16and able to work off that.
38:18But maybe there was a blessing in
38:20this.
38:20And the blessing is, is that there
38:23are some pictures that are so good.
38:25Spencer Strider, um, comes to mind,
38:28uh, where they can throw fastball
38:30and another pitch.
38:32And it's so good that they can be
38:34an effective pitcher.
38:35Those guys are few and far between.
38:37So I think with, you know, the, the
38:40split finger change up and the great
38:42fastball from Tong and the way he
38:44throws it, Tim Lincecum like, um, that
38:47really baffled the minor league hitters.
38:49But what happens at the major league
38:51level is that until you can prove you
38:54throw that change up for a strike,
38:55they will not swing at it.
38:57So all of those swing and misses that
38:58he got in the minor leagues, he got
39:00less of them in the major leagues.
39:01That's certainly always going to
39:02happen.
39:03But if you have an effective breaking
39:04ball, not even a great breaking ball,
39:06I think if he has an effective one,
39:08he's a good guy.
39:10He's going to take the next step next
39:12year, but you know, you have to get
39:14an effective breaking ball and his
39:16mechanics kind of a catch 22.
39:19If this makes any sense, he's so
39:21deceptive because of his mechanics, but
39:24his mechanics are going to get in the
39:27way of not in the way they're going to
39:30be, um, a more difficult hurdle for him
39:33as far as establishing a breaking
39:35pitch.
39:35Does that make sense?
39:36Yeah, it makes sense.
39:37Yeah.
39:37So, you know, to be able to throw a
39:39fastball and a split finger change up
39:41the grip of the change up, you're
39:43throwing it as hard as you can fastball
39:44as hard as you can change up the grip
39:46or reduce the speed and it has this
39:49movement, but the slider is more of a
39:51field pitch.
39:52It's a pitch where you have to
39:53mechanically get out front and release
39:56it after your foot hits all of those
39:58little tiny things that guys work on
40:00all the time.
40:01I don't doubt that Jonathan will figure
40:03it out, but it'll be, um, not easy.
40:07Ron, I want to ask you, uh, John
40:09mentioned Vientos before, um, you know,
40:112024, he was, he was magical and he
40:15was also great against quality
40:17pitching in big moments in October,
40:20which you thought set him up for a
40:22kind of superstardom.
40:23It looked like a young power hitter
40:25that was going to be a cornerstone
40:27piece.
40:27And then when we saw a disappointing
40:292025, I think he's a key for the
40:31Mets replacing the production that has
40:33left the room.
40:34What do you, what do you envision
40:35Vientos in terms of for the Mets in
40:372026?
40:38Mark, I think you hit the nail right
40:40on the head.
40:40Um, you know, he's a guy that, you
40:45know, the season prior you mentioned
40:47in 2024, he did everything you could
40:49ever ask a young player to do in the
40:51middle of that lineup.
40:52And it's one of the reasons they went
40:54to the post season and, and played in
40:56the championship series.
40:57But, you know, last year it seemed like
41:00he got off to a slow start and then in
41:02trying to chase numbers, I ended up
41:04chasing pitches out of the strike zone.
41:06So, you know, the best line I've ever
41:08heard about hitting is that he can only
41:10be as good as the pitches you swing
41:12at.
41:13So if he can get a little better, uh,
41:14with choosing what pitches to swing
41:16at, because in the zone, uh, he covers
41:19almost everything, um, chasing pitches.
41:22Very few guys, maybe Jacob Wilson in
41:23Oakland can chase pitches and get
41:25hits, uh, maybe Guerrero up in
41:27Toronto.
41:28So, um, he's got a lot of work to do,
41:31but he should take resolve in knowing
41:34he has done it.
41:35He did it for a season or three
41:37quarters of a season.
41:38So he's got that in him and, uh, you
41:41don't know the psyche or the
41:43confidence of a young player, but if
41:45he's able to get that confidence
41:46back, I, I, I don't doubt that he
41:49will be one of the best hitters the
41:51Mets have in their lineup.
41:52That being said, where do you play
41:54him?
41:54And, uh, you know, that's another
41:56factor, um, in run prevention, you
41:59know, and, you know, is he going to
42:01make himself into a good enough
42:03first baseman or a tandem with a
42:07Beatty at the third base, which is
42:09going to mitigate his at-bats?
42:11I don't know.
42:12I don't know.
42:12But I knew, I do know that if I were
42:15him, I would look at a lot of at-bats
42:17from 2024, try to concentrate on using
42:20the whole field.
42:21Uh, don't become pull conscious or pull
42:23happy or high ball or fly ball happy.
42:26Just be a good hitter because, uh, he
42:28has what's really hard to judge.
42:30You know, he's got real power and, um,
42:33they don't have a lot of that and
42:35they're young Mets players.
42:38Yeah.
42:38You know what I want to ask you since
42:39we have you and you are the pitching
42:41expert as Senga, you know, I don't
42:43think I've ever seen a guy lead the
42:45league in ERA through six weeks, uh,
42:47get hurt, come back and then be a
42:49minor leaguer.
42:50Uh, you know, this is a guy with a,
42:52it was terrific in 2023.
42:55Obviously he was hurt the next year.
42:57What do you, I mean, I was told that
42:59they had a good pitching, they had a
43:00good market for trading him.
43:01Apparently that wasn't as great as we
43:03thought it was, but do we have hopes
43:06for him?
43:07What, what could have happened to him
43:08that he became, uh, went from, you
43:11know, the best in the league or close
43:13to the best to minor leagues?
43:15Yeah, we certainly have hopes for him.
43:17Uh, John, I thought that in the first
43:20month and a half, two months of the
43:22season, he might've been one of the
43:23best pitchers in the national league.
43:25Um, he had a start in Oakland.
43:26And I think, uh, I don't know, it's
43:29eight or nine inning, whatever it
43:31was, it was as good a start as I've
43:33ever seen, uh, with a limit of
43:35pitches.
43:35And he just, he, he just looked on top
43:38of his game.
43:39I remember remarking, you know, if he
43:41stays healthy, this could be better
43:42than his rookie season.
43:44Well, that wasn't to be, you know, the
43:46covering first and an errant throw, um,
43:49blew out his hamstring and he never
43:50quite recovered from there.
43:53Um, it's a league that has now seen
43:56that, uh, ghost fork a lot.
43:58Um, I think he's going to have to
44:00figure out, um, you know, how to get
44:03to that ghost fork and in a weird way,
44:05how to use it less.
44:06Does that make sense?
44:08Um, you know, a lot of the times you
44:10have a great pitch and the more they
44:11see it, the more they're able to either
44:13hit it or lay off it.
44:14The, um, the less he uses it, the more
44:17effective it will be, which means the
44:19other pitches have to be more
44:20effective and in the strike zone.
44:21So, um, Senga, you looked at last year
44:25as maybe your second, uh, guy in
44:28the rotation behind Minaya before
44:29Minaya came back, but now you might
44:32look, be looking at him at a, as a
44:34three, four, five guy looking at him
44:36that way.
44:37Like I can't see why he wouldn't
44:38bounce back.
44:39Well, and, and Ron, I thought it was
44:41when I thought Mendoza at the end of
44:43the season was kind of open and honest
44:45when talking about Senga as well, where
44:47he talked about the fact that he was
44:48non-competitive in the strike zone as a,
44:51as a former pitcher, you know, you
44:54know, for those that have never done
44:55it, what a, what, when a manager says
44:58that, how alarming of a statement is
44:59that?
45:00That's an alarming statement.
45:01I think it's more alarming on today's
45:03game because, um, you know, they, they
45:06constitute everything around swing and
45:09miss stuff.
45:10You need to have stuff where the
45:12hitters swing and miss.
45:13We count the swing and misses in a
45:15game.
45:15Like it's gospel, you know, I pitched
45:17in a time where we chased outs, we
45:19chased contact, uh, players today chase
45:21velocity.
45:22They chase zero contact.
45:24So, um, in today's game, you don't want
45:26to hear that as a pitcher.
45:28Uh, that really is saying that, you
45:30know, you might have trouble pitching,
45:31um, in today's game.
45:34You don't want to hear that.
45:35So, um, early in the season, he had
45:39swing and miss stuff.
45:40So it's still in there.
45:42I just think that, uh, we kind of
45:44forgot that he came from Japan a
45:46little later in his career.
45:48He's got a lot of innings.
45:50Um, we'll see at this age, if he can
45:53rebound, but healthy, like I said, in
45:55the first part of the year, I thought
45:56he's one of the best, best pitchers
45:57in the national league.
45:59You know, you kind of, this will be
46:00our, my last question.
46:01I really appreciate all the time that
46:02you've given us, Ron.
46:03Just terrific.
46:04Um, uh, you've hinted at the earlier
46:07potential possibilities, thoughts of
46:10what the, where, where, what would you
46:11do right now with this team?
46:13Uh, you know, it looks like they're
46:14missing an outfielder.
46:15Uh, I don't think they're completely
46:17covered at first.
46:18Uh, and that pitching staff, I mean,
46:20they talk about run prevention.
46:21Isn't that what we're talking about?
46:23I mean, is, is fielding now more
46:24important than the pitching staff?
46:26I don't know.
46:27What, where would you go?
46:28I mean, you know, some of the players
46:30who are available still, anything in
46:32particular you would look at for the
46:34Mets?
46:34Yeah.
46:35I, I mean, I was just thinking, you
46:37know, in the last 24 hours, um, the
46:40Arizona Diamondbacks, uh, seemed to be
46:42in play for Alex Bregman.
46:44Alex Bregman signed with the Cubs.
46:45They pivoted to Nolan Arenado.
46:48I thought that was a brilliant move.
46:49I don't know how you guys feel about
46:50that.
46:50I think that was a, a nice pivot for
46:53them for a player that has been so
46:55good, has struggled the last couple of
46:57years, but I still think there's a
46:59lot of good in there.
47:00So I thought that was a great pivot
47:01for them.
47:02So maybe that's where the Mets look
47:04to do some damage, uh, do some
47:06pivoting and maybe, um, uh, getting a
47:09player that no one really has thought
47:11of, uh, in a trade to maybe bolster
47:13their team.
47:13Another way to go about it is maybe
47:17some of the guys that are still on
47:18the market, uh, going back to the
47:20Diamondbacks, their free agent, Zach
47:22Gallon, a pitcher like that, who has
47:25proven that last year definitely was an
47:27uneven year.
47:28He took a step back.
47:30Um, um, but you know, free agents is a
47:33tough year, John, you know, that, uh, for
47:35every unbelievable year, like Juan Soto
47:37had in 2024, you have a lot of players
47:40that struggle in free agency.
47:41It's a hard thing to go through where
47:43you're trying to put in a team sport
47:45numbers on the board to make sure you
47:46get that big contract.
47:48So maybe Zach Gallon is the guy that
47:50you pivot from and, and maybe that
47:52doesn't cost you that big long-term
47:54contract.
47:54Maybe Zach's at a point now where he
47:56takes a, uh, a two-year high AAV with
48:00an opt-out.
48:01So you get him in the rotation.
48:02And if you look at his track record, he
48:04makes 30 plus starts every year.
48:05That's what I would kind of look at if
48:08I were the best.
48:10Ron, I just had, I just, I'm sorry.
48:12Just one last one for you.
48:13And that is, and that is Devin
48:15Williams, because we mentioned about
48:17Diaz earlier on Williams now steps in
48:20replacing a very popular player after
48:23what was a below average year for him
48:25based on what he was in Milwaukee with
48:27the Yankees a year ago.
48:28What do you expect from Devin this
48:30year in terms of his ability to bounce
48:32back?
48:32Obviously great familiarity with David
48:34Stearns.
48:35Well, I think it's going to really help
48:36him having that one year, uh, in New
48:38York under his belt.
48:39Uh, certainly if you look at his season
48:41last year, um, getting, uh,
48:43off to the start, he did, uh, he could
48:46never really, uh, recover the numbers.
48:49Right.
48:49But if you look how he pitched by the
48:51end of the year, he was quite good.
48:53So I would expect him to be great.
48:55He was great for all the Stearns teams
48:57in Milwaukee.
48:58Uh, he certainly, I'm sure it will be
48:59great, uh, with the Mets.
49:01Um, I don't know if he could reach
49:03where Diaz has done the last couple of
49:05seasons, but anything close with the
49:07addition of Luke Weaver, uh, should
49:09really help.
49:10And, um, like I said, the Mets went
49:13through 48 or 49 pitchers last year.
49:16Let's keep it under 40.
49:21Very good.
49:22Very good.
49:23Yeah.
49:24You know, Williams is very talented.
49:26Uh, I could see him really coming
49:27through.
49:28I personally am going to miss Diaz.
49:30I thought it was great on the field,
49:32the grade in the clubhouse.
49:33I'm going to miss Timmy trumpet.
49:34I thought he was, uh, uh, added, uh,
49:37an extra level of entertainment.
49:39I don't know.
49:40Uh, you know, obviously I think they're
49:41just focused on winning and they feel
49:43like if they win, uh, everything's going
49:45to be great no matter who we have on the
49:48field, no matter who our players are.
49:50Um, so I'm not, I don't know, but I, I love
49:52your gallon suggestion.
49:54Uh, so Suarez still out there.
49:57There's still plenty of pitchers out there.
49:59You mentioned Peralta earlier, Ron.
50:00I think, I mean, he makes only 8 million,
50:03not that the Mets need to be one saving
50:05money, but I mean, he was a top five
50:07Cy Young guy last year.
50:09So there's still plenty of pitchers out
50:11there to get.
50:11And for me, run prevention means pitching
50:14more than anything.
50:15I get that their defense needed to improve
50:17and, uh, maybe it will.
50:20We'll see if they sign Tucker.
50:21He is a good defender.
50:22I think he can play left.
50:23So, uh, we shall see, but I really think
50:25you've added, uh, so much to the show.
50:28I really appreciate you coming here.
50:29I think one of our two most frequent
50:31guests along with, uh, uh, Michael K, uh,
50:34Ron.
50:34So we really appreciate you coming on and,
50:36uh, adding that extra level of expertise
50:39because nobody knows more about pitching
50:41than you and probably no, no one knows
50:43more about a baseball analysis than you.
50:46So I want to really thank you, Ron, again,
50:48for coming on once again.
50:49That's great, John.
50:50Uh, Mark, great talking to you and, uh,
50:52you as well.
50:53And Michael K and I probably the only two
50:55that always answer the phone.
50:56That's the problem.
50:58You're very good about it.
50:59I gotta say, I mean, you know,
51:01you answer my phone.
51:02It doesn't have to be Steve Cone calling
51:04or, uh, you know, looking for help.
51:06You know, I, I appreciate it.
51:08You're a great teammate too.
51:09I should say, you're great on MLB network
51:12and TN, uh, Turner and everything else.
51:15I, I, yeah, one of the things I really
51:19enjoyed as a player is that it was a
51:21different relationship that players had
51:23with, with sports writing in those days.
51:25I remember they used to ride on the plane.
51:27I used to get to sit next to the New York
51:29Times, Joe Durso.
51:30And he'd tell me about fighter planes in
51:32World War II.
51:34Um, you know, it just was, uh, you kind
51:37of understood, you know, they needed us,
51:39we needed them and that's the place I come
51:42from.
51:42It's a different place now.
51:43Certainly it's changed and how players
51:46kind of view the media, but whether I like
51:48it or not, I haven't played in 30 years.
51:50I'm a media guy.
51:51So anytime you call, I'm ready to go.
51:53All right.
51:54That is terrific.
51:55And it's great to hear.
51:55I know that the writers were on the plane.
51:57It's great to hear that you actually sat with
51:59the writer from the times, but you are a
52:01Yale man yourself.
52:03So, uh, you know, you're not, I can
52:05remember when I covered the angels, I
52:06used to make fun of Kirk McCaskill as the
52:08intellectual because he read Esquire, but
52:10you actually went to Yale.
52:11So that's a little bit of a step above
52:13reading a fancy magazine.
52:15So anyway, we really appreciate you coming
52:17on, Ron.
52:18You're just terrific.
52:19All right, guys.
52:19Take care and have a great new year.
52:21Okay.
52:22You too, Ron.
52:28All right.
52:29We've come to the part of the show where
52:30we give either a hit or an error.
52:32And I know that, uh, my friend Mark
52:35Malousis is prepared hit or error.
52:37What you say, uh, I, I'd go an error for
52:41the Arizona diamondbacks making the trade
52:43to go get at Nolan Arenado from the St.
52:45Louis Cardinals.
52:46Um, you look at it, listen, Arenado
52:48sitting here right now and, you know, up
52:50there in age at one point in time, he was
52:52elite level offensive and defensive player
52:54with the Colorado Rockies, especially at
52:56third base.
52:56And listen, John, I still think he can go
52:59out there and pick it, but in terms of
53:01what he is there right now as an offensive
53:03player, it was OPS a year ago, six, six,
53:05six, he had two 37, 12 home runs, 52 RBIs.
53:09If you go back to last off season, he was
53:11a guy that there were Yankee fans thinking
53:13that maybe he could come in and be the
53:15third base solution.
53:15Remember that?
53:16Um, and Cashman said, thanks, but no
53:18thanks.
53:19And he ended up to me, I get the idea of
53:23Arizona needed to pivot.
53:24Uh, I don't know how much Nolan Arenado
53:27really has that much left in him in terms
53:29of being that kind of baseball player.
53:31If you limit the expectations, maybe it
53:33works for Arizona, but I think it's more
53:35of an error than anything else, given the
53:37state of where his game is right now at
53:38this age.
53:39Yeah.
53:40I mean, it's been a very, I was going to
53:41say average offensive player, but six, six,
53:43six, that's, that's an ugly number.
53:45Uh, however you look at it, uh, so maybe
53:47your below average, uh, offensive player, I
53:50I'm with you can still pick it.
53:52One thing I will say about it is he is
53:53cheap, uh, for 11 million for two years.
53:56I mean, you know, I mean, that's not a
53:58sports writer salary, but that's not a
54:00superstar salary for a guy.
54:02He'll be paid by the Cardinals.
54:04So no, nobody, we don't need to take up a
54:06collection for Nolan Arenado, but, uh, they
54:09did get them cheap.
54:10I will say that it is interesting.
54:11You bring up the Yankees and Arenado, he
54:13rejected the Astros thinking he was
54:15potentially going to go to a big team,
54:17including the Yankees.
54:18He wanted to come to the Yankees.
54:20I think the Yankees, Boston Dodgers, he
54:23had a very, uh, exalted list of teams he
54:27wanted to come to, but I do recall that he
54:29was hoping that, uh, Goldschmidt and
54:31LeMay, who is two buddies from one from
54:33St. Louis, one from Colorado, we're going
54:35to help them, uh, grease the skids to get
54:37up to the Yankees.
54:38Didn't work out.
54:39He's a hall of famer.
54:40He led the league at home runs multiple
54:42times.
54:43He's one of the greatest defensive third
54:45baseman ever, but I understand where you're
54:47coming from on that.
54:48I, I'm going to do a make good, which is a
54:49hit for the Cubs.
54:51I kill them all the time for not spending a
54:53dime.
54:54And he spent more than a dime.
54:55They spend millions of dimes, uh, for Alex
54:59Bregman.
54:59They beat out the Red Sox.
55:01I couldn't give it, make it an error in the
55:02Red Sox.
55:03I don't know why they didn't give the no
55:04trade.
55:05I mean, how hard is that to give the no
55:06trade for a guy who's the clubhouse
55:08leader?
55:09I don't know why they did that.
55:10I'm sure that stuck in his craw and he ended
55:13up driving him to the Cubs.
55:15I like generally what they do in Boston, but
55:18they didn't spend the money with Devers.
55:20I don't know what they're doing with it.
55:21They also made a billion dollars selling the
55:23Pittsburgh Penguins.
55:24So they got a lot of money.
55:26Uh, but I, I'm not giving an error.
55:28I'm giving a hit to the Cubs because Bregman
55:32is a incredible enhancement.
55:34And it's a particular hit.
55:35If they hold on to Nico Horner, if they trade
55:37Nico Horner, not such a great hit anymore
55:40because Nico Horner, as I'm told by a player
55:42on that team, he's the lifeblood of the
55:44team.
55:44So don't trade Nico, send Shaw down, play
55:47Bregman.
55:48He's great.
55:50Uh, give the Cubs credit.
55:52Great luck by the Cubs.
55:53Well, and John, how about the night in
55:54Chicago?
55:55I mean, you think about that.
55:56What a weekend it was in Chicago.
55:58Number one, Bregman signs with the Cubs.
56:00And in the same night, the Chicago Bears come back
56:03from 21, three down against the Green Bay Packers
56:06scored 25 points.
56:08I know we do in baseball here, but 25 points in
56:11the fourth quarter to knock off the Green Bay Packers
56:13and advance to the divisional round.
56:14That's a night for the city of Chicago.
56:17Yeah.
56:17I mean, I can't say too much positive in case my
56:20family's listening.
56:21My in-laws are from Milwaukee.
56:23They weren't that thrilled with that outcome, but give
56:25the Bears credit.
56:26I know it is a baseball show.
56:27It is amazing how much they've come back, how
56:30often they've come back.
56:31Sorry, bad, bad grammar for a Northwestern graduate.
56:34Uh, how often they've come back.
56:36Caleb Williams has been great.
56:38And, uh, yeah, then we saw Alex Bregman with a
56:41Blackhawk in a Blackhawk Jersey, or I guess they
56:43call that sweater in hockey, right?
56:45Yeah.
56:45Sitting at the game.
56:46I mean, he's been a Blackhawk fan for life.
56:48Apparently.
56:49I don't know for probably for one day, but anyway,
56:51great move by the Cubs.
56:53Give them credit.
56:54I liked your error.
56:55That's good.
56:55That's good.
56:56I like your error.
56:57You're like Joel with the error.
56:58That's good.
56:58You wanted to keep the theme going.
57:00Cause you knew probably does a lot of errors.
57:02Anyway, it's been great having you.
57:03You've been terrific, Mark.
57:05Uh, you're great on SNY.
57:07You're great on FAN.
57:09You're always great.
57:10You're a great New York sportscaster.
57:12Uh, it's great having Ron Darling on,
57:14our favorite and frequent, a favorite and frequent guest.
57:18Thanks to Tommy Hogan, who does a great job as the producer.
57:22We had a little technical difficulty early.
57:24Nobody saw it.
57:25Thankfully for that, but delayed us a bit.
57:27And he always helps out with that.
57:29And, uh, it's been a great show.
57:30I really appreciate all of it.
57:31And I hope everybody keeps watching, listening,
57:34go to the New York post sports YouTube page to watch us.
57:38And certainly if you get your podcast on Apple or Spotify,
57:42do it that way as well.
57:44And next week we're going to have a special theme where we're going to
57:47answer, uh, some listeners and watchers, uh, questions and comments.
57:52So send them in via Twitter, send them into the sports YouTube page,
57:57New York post sports YouTube page.
57:59And Joel will be back next week.
58:01He's out vacationing, uh, in Lancaster, Pennsylvania.
58:04I don't think he's becoming Amish.
58:06Can you convert?
58:06I don't know.
58:07Uh, he is in Lancaster, Pennsylvania, uh, but he will be back next week.
58:11And we're going to tackle all, well, not, I shouldn't say all questions,
58:15at least five questions from the viewers, fans and, and such.
58:20And that should be fun as well.
58:22Anyway, I had a lot of fun today.
58:23We'll be back at you next week.
58:25Thanks again, Mark.
58:26Thank you, Ron.
58:27Thank you, John.
58:27Thank you, Tom.
58:29Thank you, Tom.
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