- 10 minutes ago
Days after a deadly fire at Arpora club claimed 25 lives in Goa, civic authorities on Tuesday demolished a portion of the Romeo Lane restaurant located in the Vagator area.
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00:00Okay, let's raise the big questions tonight.
00:02How are these club owners able to flee the country so easily within five hours of the fire?
00:07Demolition of the club, is it simply too little, too late, just optics and tokenism?
00:12Will Chief Minister Samad, who's also Home Minister,
00:15and his government now takes some accountability and some of the blame for what's happened?
00:19Viriato Fernandes, Congress MP now joins me from Goa.
00:22Miran Chadda Borwankar, former IPS officer.
00:25Yatish Naik, spokesperson BJP.
00:27And Mukesh Kumar Meena, former DGP of Goa, is also with us.
00:32I appreciate all of you joining us here on the show tonight.
00:35I want to come to you Miran Chadda Borwankar first.
00:38Do you believe it's that simple?
00:40You might have heard what the DIG said.
00:42Look, we had to first go and investigate what had happened at the particular area where this happened.
00:48Five hours later, the owners flee because they might have got a tip-off from someone within the nightclub.
00:53Is that a plausible explanation?
00:55Could this have been stopped?
00:56Could they have been stopped from fleeing the country?
00:59Rajdeep, I think the young DIG is very correct in saying that their first response was
01:06to handle the very unfortunate incident to save lives.
01:11And I don't believe that they could have been faster than that.
01:16Because I feel Luthor brothers are absolutely foolish in leaving the country.
01:21And if I were handling, even my reaction would have been to first be on the spot and then to think that the owners can leave the country.
01:33But I want to flag the issue that since many local citizens had been raising the point about this particular and many other bars crossing the CRZ limit, then not following the fire norms,
01:47we should encourage the local people to speak up and take them into confidence and if they are raising some queries, questions and taking action under RTI,
01:58we should respect that and take immediate action rather than waiting for a tragedy which India seems to be in the mood to wait for a tragedy and then act.
02:08So you are saying this could have been preemptive action.
02:11Mukesh Kumar Meena, former DGP Goa joins us.
02:14The reputation of the Goa police is taking a huge hit because there are now reports coming in how IPS officers allegedly knew what was happening.
02:23Local police officers had flagged it off, but they were overruled.
02:26So therefore, do you believe that the Goa police also has much to answer for, not just the politicians?
02:32How was this place allowed to function for so long despite the illegalities?
02:38It is not only Goa police, it is failure of district administration and other authorities who have not acted properly
02:45because when they knew that it is operating illegally and without permission, it should have been demolished earlier and they should have stopped their operation.
02:57But what happens, we can't blame any officer, we can't blame police because it is a matter of inquiry.
03:04Who was responsible, who was protecting it, only when government is already, they have already ordered inquiry.
03:10When inquiry report comes, then only we can comment who was responsible for protecting them.
03:17But certainly, when they are...
03:19When you were DGP police, had you heard about the Hafta culture where a certain amount of money had to be paid right down the line
03:27to allow such illegal constructions to carry on?
03:30Had you heard about the Hafta culture or not, sir, in Goa?
03:32Yeah, this was prevalent because there are some mischievous people who are involved in illegal construction.
03:38And whenever it comes to notice of authority and anybody goes to court and anybody complains,
03:45then government is taking action also.
03:47But some mischievous people, because Goa, it was very peaceful, Goan people are also very good.
03:55But persons who have gone for business purpose, outsiders,
03:59and they are doing those activities like other places, they are involved in illegal activities.
04:06Likewise, they are doing in Goa also.
04:08Because...
04:09Sir, just a minute.
04:11I want to take this to Yatish Naik because Yatish Naik,
04:14suddenly the Goa government has got hyperactive demolishing another property which they are saying is illegal.
04:19For God's sake, for several years, you knew these properties were illegal.
04:23Two local police units, Anjuna Police Station Crime Branch had issued notices to the owner of the club
04:29to submit the documents and permissions that allowed him to operate.
04:32And yet, despite the lack of permissions, it was allowed to continue.
04:38Do you accept the Goa government now has the blood on its hands of 25 people who died?
04:44No, it is very unfortunate that this incident has happened.
04:47There is no doubt.
04:48But you should please appreciate the fact that the government is very sincere in ensuring
04:53that these kind of illegalities don't happen.
04:56And let me take you to this...
04:57For God's sake, Mr. Naik, what is the sincerity when for years this was carrying on
05:00and you didn't do anything?
05:02You are sincere after the fire?
05:03I will tell you.
05:04No, the very fact that notices were issued to these people
05:07shows very clearly that the government does not allow anybody to operate illegally.
05:12But if these people have hoodwinked the authorities,
05:15then the government is going to come down very heavily on these people
05:19and it is in the process.
05:21If you have seen the actions the government has taken...
05:22Why did you only demolish this second club only today?
05:27Suddenly you woke up to the illegality?
05:28What were you all doing all these years?
05:31If you see the magistral inquiry that has been constituted,
05:34one of the terms of reference is to fix accountability,
05:37is to ensure not only this pub but anybody who is doing illegal business of this nature...
05:43What about the accountability of the politicians, sir, the home minister?
05:46Sir, what about the accountability of your government,
05:48of the home minister who is also the chief minister?
05:50He has no accountability?
05:52You will catch only the staffers and some local police officers?
05:55No, that is not correct to say because the blue-collar notice has been issued.
06:00The LOC was issued earlier.
06:02Their passports, the procedure to impound their passports have been initiated.
06:06The government has acted swiftly.
06:08They have moved out of the country by 5.30 a.m. flight on the same day morning.
06:14It shows that within maybe a few, one or two hours, they have moved out.
06:19And that itself shows their intention, these accused's intention to flee the country.
06:25Sir, all I am asking you, sir, is that if there was...
06:30Your own MLA had raised this issue in the Goa Assembly in August.
06:34The illegalities were there for years.
06:36They got...
06:37There were demolition notices.
06:39Now you are telling me government is acting sincerely.
06:42Why were you not acting sincerely earlier?
06:44Did it require a fire for you all to discover sincerity?
06:47Government has zero tolerance to these kind of illegalities.
06:51Notices were issued because government is very sincere.
06:54Authorities are sincere.
06:55But these kind of people, if they are hoodooing the authorities,
06:59if they have sort of, you know, tried to put the wrong thing before the authorities,
07:05then the authorities are going to act.
07:07100% the authorities will not leave them.
07:10Okay, I want to bring in at this moment Viriato Fernandez, Congress MP.
07:14Mr. Fernandez, you've heard what Yatish Naik is saying.
07:16He is saying government is acting sincerely.
07:18They have issued blue corner notices.
07:20They are demolishing now another property owned by the Luthras.
07:24What more do you expect government to do?
07:25Your response.
07:27Yeah.
07:27Thank you for inviting me, Mr. Rajdeep.
07:30There are a few points before I tell the technical failures.
07:34One is what Mr. Meena, the former DIG, said about outsiders coming.
07:39Now, that has happened to be the norm in Goa.
07:43Anybody can come into Goa, pay a bribe, act with impunity.
07:47Now, in this case, there were no licenses.
07:50There were no permissions.
07:51There were no safety norms followed.
07:53Now, all these three things, whether excise, whether licenses or fire hazard violations,
08:01are all under the chief minister.
08:03He is the home minister.
08:04So, naturally, he has to own up.
08:06I come from a military background and you can recollect Admiral Mullah who went down
08:12when he said the buck stops at the captains.
08:15Now, chief minister should have owned up.
08:17Secondly, when the DIG said that the police…
08:20So, you are saying the chief minister is accountable for whatever happens in Goa?
08:27Absolutely.
08:27All these illegalities have been going on for years.
08:31Years.
08:32Because I will tell you of an incident where I myself went on 14th August 2024 in solidarity
08:39where senior citizens took out a candlelight march at 10 o'clock in the night.
08:44Because for years, the senior citizens in the coastal villages have been getting sleepless
08:51night because of the loud music.
08:54It is in violation of the court orders.
08:57Nobody listens.
08:58Nobody cares.
08:59So, 48 hours for police not sleeping is a very small thing compared to years and years
09:04of senior citizens losing sleep.
09:07Children cannot study for their exams.
09:09So, this is the norm in the coastal villages.
09:11Secondly, when the spokesperson of BJP said they have issued notices, it's simple.
09:19You issue notices to frighten the culprits, the violators, and then you take the bribe.
09:24Issue settled.
09:25And that is why today these two brothers have fled.
09:29You are making a very serious allegation.
09:31No, no, one minute.
09:32You are telling me that the notices are issued so that a bribe can be taken.
09:36You are telling me that the Luthras were bribing the government of Goa?
09:39So, I will tell you a simple example.
09:42That's…
09:43When the panchayat had given a demolition notice, why didn't they demolish?
09:48Why did the director of panchayat bring a stay?
09:51She has to be held accountable.
09:53Just suspending her doesn't mean anything.
09:55No, but are you holding her responsible?
09:57You are also holding the chief minister responsible.
09:59Who is responsible?
10:00Director panchayat, the chief minister, the officials, or the government?
10:03The chief minister, the chief minister is the home minister.
10:07There's law and order failure.
10:08The chief minister, under him, the exercise department comes.
10:12There were no exercise licensees.
10:14Viriato, let…
10:16You have made a very serious allegation.
10:18Let Yatish Naik respond.
10:19Yatish Naik is coming back to the hafta culture.
10:21That you give a show call notice and then you settle it.
10:25Maybe, maybe, maybe, Mr. Viriato is speaking of the Congress culture during the Congress days.
10:34This is not the way this government functions.
10:36Once notices are issued, notices are issued to ensure the execution of the law.
10:41Notices are not issued…
10:43Come on, come on, Yatish Naik.
10:44Come on, Yatish Naik.
10:45No, no, I'm making a statement.
10:46I'm making a statement.
10:47In Goa, everybody's eating.
10:49No, no, I'm…
10:50Everybody's eating.
10:52No, I will make it very clear that when notices are issued, it is to ensure compliance.
10:58If you read the terms of reference of the magistral inquiry, the whole purpose is to fix accountability and go to the root of it.
11:05Not only the magistral inquiry or safety audit committee has been constituted.
11:09You will fix it on some officer.
11:11Does the chief minister of Goa have any responsibility or not?
11:14Let me make it clear that the government is going to go to the root of it.
11:18Whoever is responsible.
11:20If you see the terms of reference, whoever is responsible will be taken to task.
11:26And that is the reason of the committee's existence.
11:30Viriato, are you willing to give the government benefit of doubt?
11:32What this government says is all politics.
11:34Are you willing to give it your…
11:35They are saying you are playing politics, Viriato.
11:38Peace politics.
11:40When Mr. Yatish said this is the Congress culture, I'm very new to politics.
11:43I come from a military background.
11:45But Mr. Yatish Naik has been in the Congress for ages.
11:49You know, so…
11:51No, no.
11:51What is this man talking?
11:53What is this man talking?
11:54One minute, Yatish.
11:55Yatish, Yatish, one minute.
11:56Yatish, one minute.
11:57One minute.
11:58Yatish, one minute.
11:59Yatish, one minute.
12:01Yatish Naik was in the Congress at one time.
12:02Now in the BJP.
12:02Yatish Naik, please.
12:03Okay, let him respond, Yatish.
12:06He's not talking about the Congress culture.
12:07He is politicizing.
12:08Okay, no, no.
12:08Viriato, are you…
12:10Just a minute, Yatish.
12:13Viriato, are you willing to give benefit of doubt?
12:16Let the inquiry be complete.
12:18Then you can make the accusation that monies were being paid.
12:21Are you willing to give any benefit of doubt?
12:23Absolutely no.
12:24No benefit of doubt.
12:25Because there are a whole lot of complaints filed against, whole lot of illegalities along
12:31the entire North Goa coast.
12:35There you have a drug culture.
12:37There was a Sanban festival where a hundred crore defamation was filed against me.
12:41The court threw it out because unfortunately, what I was saying came true.
12:45Unfortunately, because there were lives lost of young men who came there.
12:50Now, one is drug culture, one is this pop culture, one is the loud noise which is happening.
12:58There's law and order failure.
12:59The very fact that this and many other premises and meat clubs are serving liquor without license.
13:07Why am I saying without license?
13:08Because the exercise comes under the Chief Minister.
13:11Sir, you made that point earlier.
13:12I want to bring in…
13:13Just a minute.
13:14Away from the noise.
13:15You know, Miran Chadda Borwanka, you're listening patiently.
13:17What seems to have happened in Goa is that there seems to be a growing collusion.
13:21That's the belief between those who have come from outside.
13:25The so-called delification of Goa, owners with big money, buying over nightclubs, bribing
13:30people from panchayat level right to the top.
13:33Do you believe the police can do anything in such situation?
13:36Does Goa really have space for a Singham-like officer?
13:38No, Singham's don't exist.
13:44And, in fact, they should not.
13:45We should rather build the institutions.
13:48And instead of taking action, either police officers are braw-bitten to keep quiet, to look
13:53the other way, or to join the gang.
13:56And if Mr. Naik says that hafta culture does not exist now, it existed in Congress, let me
14:02tell you all the listeners today, hafta culture existed in the past, and it exists today also,
14:10irrespective of the government in power.
14:12So, therefore, we have to build the institution.
14:14We should spend 10 hours in the parliament talking of corruption, and not of the national
14:19anthem, which we all respect from our heart.
14:23So, sir, please, let's talk of this hafta culture, accept it, admit it, and then try
14:29to dismantle it.
14:31Okay, let me try and get an admission.
14:32Yatish Naik, are you willing to admit that the hafta culture has existed both in Congress
14:37rule and BJP rule?
14:38See, I will make it very clear.
14:41See, let's not talk politics and extraneous things.
14:44I don't want to toe the line of Mr. Viriato.
14:47You see what the government has done.
14:48The government has instituted a safety audit.
14:51After the incident, Mr. Naik, what were you all doing before?
14:56No, no, no.
14:56Before also, the government has not spared anybody who has violated the law.
15:01Now that these kind of instances have come up and have happened, which are very unfortunate.
15:06Every restaurant owner, Mr. Naik, I have spoken to in the last two days, says that it is
15:10normalized to give hafta.
15:12They are too scared to speak on camera.
15:14That's the tragedy of go-off.
15:16That's not right.
15:17That's not the way in which governments function, and this government functions.
15:21This government is wedded to the rule of law.
15:23Well, we'll wait and see whether this government is wedded to the rule of law or not.
15:27We'll wait and see, sir.
15:28I will continue to ask the question.
15:30I am a going car.
15:31I feel strongly about this.
15:32This could happen in any part of India.
15:34But the fact is, there is this nexus.
15:36As Miran Borwankar said, it is time now that parliament, instead of discussing what happened
15:41150 years ago or 75 years ago, should discuss what is happening today.
15:45Stop this corruption and the loot that's taking place in some parts of the country, including
15:50the pristine land of Go.
15:52I appreciate it.
15:53Yeah, 30 seconds, sir.
15:5630 seconds, Viryat only.
15:57Rajdeep, somebody made in passing about Achai Gupta.
16:00He's the third partner.
16:01Why are they not apprehending him?
16:04He is there as a registered partner of the company.
16:07Achai Gupta.
16:08Why is he not being apprehended?
16:10Who is protecting him?
16:12Okay.
16:12Who is protecting some of the...
16:14Okay.
16:15Let's leave it there.
16:16I will wait and see.
16:17When these fugitives come back, Yatish Naik, this government has a long list.
16:21Even at the center of people who have fled the country, never returned.
16:23I hope at least the Luthra brothers are brought back and don't escape into some nice Caribbean
16:29island.
16:30But thank you all very much for joining me on my talking point tonight.
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